BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,Girl Friday
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 06:48 PM

Just listened to the show. Jez lowe has written some great songs, but none more powerful than "The Judas Bus." Shame it's not yet available.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 07 Mar 10 - 01:52 AM

Having listened closely to all the Radio Ballads (The new ones), I'm sure that the technique used was to record the songs in one go, but with carefully timed (to the second probably!) instrumental interludes.
All the music would then have been mixed together, thus making a music "bed" over which the speech inserts (already selected and pre timed) could be overlaid. A relatively simple process using digital editors. When I was working on Radio 1/2 docs in the 70s and 80s...It was loads of reels of tape, that you normally kept losing!

If you just released the basic music "backing" as used on the programme it would sound quite odd I'm sure!!!
Mind you, as you say there are some fine songs there, and I'm sure that more conventionally structured versions will find there way onto the artists next projects in due course.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,padgett
Date: 07 Mar 10 - 03:55 AM

O dear

This has got a bit out of kilta

As Joe suggests Geoff the Duck maybe could clarify what he has said as Dennis has slightly misunderstood what he said!!

Arthur Scargill represented miners in tribunals and similar for very many years and really did know his stuff and saved jobs and families

Acountants and similar traditionally had/have no union as such so I can sympathies with Bonzo above

Unions work very well and tirelessly where there are many employed and have strength on their side

The miners were underpaid, worked in apalling conditions and risked their lives daily and over many decades. Their retirements were badly paid and short lived

Uncaring unknowing educated with little idea of physical work and industrial wealth creation at grass roots elected as MPs by a majority of the population who similarly know little of industry!!

Ray

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 07 Mar 10 - 04:12 AM

We will all forget how truly evil the Tories are when in power

L in C

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: Kampervan
Date: 07 Mar 10 - 05:07 AM

Call me cynical. but I don't think that there are many politicians who join a party out of conviction these days.
They join the party that they think will get them elected and in a position to do themselves the most most good.

Labour are just as dishonest and self-serving as the Tories and the honest members of both parties could be counted on the fingers of two hands.
Then they wonder why no-one bothers to vote.

Put an 'abstention' option on the ballot paper if you really want to get a feel for what the public thinks.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 07 Mar 10 - 05:39 AM

Perhaps you are right Mr Campervan although I wonder on what hard evidence you base your conclusion?

The 'popular press' are important opinion formers and they are much, much more corrupt than politicians. Did you follow the News of the World practice of breaking into people's e-mail and mobile systems? What was probably worse was the way the rest of the press kept quiet.

I dont think 10 MPs are the only honest ones - as you imply. Part of the problem is keeping Governments accountable between elections.

It's odd isn't it that Labour may/will loose because of the war, expenses and the banking colapse to a party that was at least as keen on the war, probably did better out of expenses and is full of *ankers and their friends

Best wishes L in C

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: Kampervan
Date: 07 Mar 10 - 05:59 AM

Oh, I agree that getting the Tories out was a very good thing, but I just don't feel that the Labour party has done a very good job of replacing them. The question now is , who could do any better? And the scary thing is - I don't know the answer

And yes, all I have to go on is what is broadcast in the papers and on television and the radio.

As for the number of honest politicians, well maybe I underestimated, but who would you put on the list -

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 07 Mar 10 - 06:27 AM

Acountants and similar traditionally had/have no union as such so I can sympathies with Bonzo above

Thank you Guest Padgett

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 07 Mar 10 - 08:10 AM

"It's odd isn't it that Labour may/will loose because of the war, expenses and the banking colapse to a party that was at least as keen on the war, probably did better out of expenses and is full of *ankers and their friends"

How very, very true, Les! But I have long believed that the Left, in this country, is/was hopeless. Too obsessed with ideological purity and too full of smug self-righteousness and self-importance to bother with proper strategy or tactics. And when they get their chance, what do they do? Swing to the Right, start an illegal war and devote themselves to slavishly promoting the 'free market' and the financial industry (which has dropped us all in the shit) - thanks Labour - you f*cking useless, hypocritical tossers!

Mind you I also think that the Tories get in again and again and again because of the innate snobbishness of the British people. The Tories know that all they have to do is to promise to 'punish' those perceived to be of a 'lower social status' (the 'working class', the 'poor', 'benefit scroungers' 'immigrants' etc., etc., etc.). God help us - a plague on both your houses!!

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 07 Mar 10 - 10:36 AM

Perhaps the mob should change into proper clothes from their tracksuits and trainers and vote Cameron in then!

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: akenaton
Date: 08 Mar 10 - 03:26 AM

The population has been persuaded that money equals happiness.

Until that mindset is shown for what it is, we are fucked.

Nothing will ever be changed until we wake up to a world full of wonder and beauty.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 08 Mar 10 - 04:29 AM

The Strike was about the unequal distribution of power and wealth. That inequality remains and is much more extreme in other parts of the world. It stops people from having the time and opportunity to a enjoy "world full of wonder and beauty".

just a thought
L in C

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: akenaton
Date: 09 Mar 10 - 03:33 AM

"It stops people from having the time and opportunity to a enjoy "world full of wonder and beauty".

I would agree with that Les, if you meant to apply it to "Capitalism"

All the stuff about inequality is meaningless in a global sense.

The people of the thrird world are probably more equal than we are, but do you want that sort of equality?

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 09 Mar 10 - 12:00 PM

"All the stuff about inequality is meaningless in a global sense."

No it isn't, it's just very complicated

"The people of the thrird world are probably more equal than we are,"

The people who own and control wealth in much of the world are probably based 'off-shore' and have little loyalty to any place.

"but do you want that sort of equality?"

What do you think.

It seems to me that I cannot tune a banjo properly so don't ask me to explain injustice on a world scale. But I think I know it's there and it's wrong.

Best wishes
L in C

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: r.padgett
Date: 21 Jun 20 - 01:45 AM

And having listened to some of the hour long Ballad of the Miners' Strike from 2010 I found the thread ~ thanks for the words of "It will all be over in a fortnight" Dennis ~ John Tams song

So 2020 10 years ago and US Of A and Trump at War with himself and African Americans, and women ~and we thought inequalities would have been sorted out better over last 10 years ~ not a chance and Covid 19 spares no one

Ray

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 21 Jun 20 - 03:44 AM

3 days ago; Great Britain's record coal-free run is over, after 67 days, 22 hours and 55 minutes, following a coal unit running tests after essential maintenance. This had been the longest run without coal for Britain since 1882.

BBC 10 June; Renewables were responsible for 37% of electricity supplied to the network versus 35% for fossil fuels. Nuclear accounted for about 18% and imports for the remaining 10% or so.

"So far this year, renewables have generated more electricity than fossil fuels and that's never happened before," says Dr Simon Evans of Carbon Brief.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,crumbly
Date: 21 Jun 20 - 05:12 AM

funny how these favourable statistics refer to GB- England's performance is pretty poor compared to Scotland's so can we have the figures for England please?
As for the horrors of 1984, be in no doubt this government is quite capable of doing it all again, and probably will.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: Joe G
Date: 21 Jun 20 - 05:31 AM

Last night Joe Solo livestreamed a performance of the whole of his excellent 'Never Be Defeated' album which describes the experiences of miners in South Yorkshire during the strike. It was a tour de force performance (as Joe's always are) and you can find it via his Facebook page

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 21 Jun 20 - 05:58 AM

Crumbly; electricity figures refer to the National Grid, which serves Great Britain but not Northern Ireland.

There are about 100 hydro-electric schemes of various size in Scotland, and half a dozen in Wales. Rheidol is the largest hydro-power station of its kind outside Scotland. Dinorwig is an important pumped storage scheme.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: The Sandman
Date: 21 Jun 20 - 07:50 AM

guest crumbly
they would have to find a union leader like joe gormley , gormley[along with ray buckton] reported back to mi5 on union leaders meetings during the 1973 miners strike and then signed productivity deals so that mrs thatcher was able to stock pile, coal to defeat the miners.
crumbly, where were you in 1984?.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,crumbly
Date: 21 Jun 20 - 01:12 PM

That's the point, henryp- the figures are for GB- if there were figures for England alone, its own renewable production would be substantially less than 37pc!

I know nothing about Wales' contribution, but it sounds like the additional exclusion of Wales would result in even lower English figures.

Sandman, you're quite right about the corrupt NUM led by Gormley, but the strikes WON by the miners were in 1972 and 1974- I don't understand why you wonder where I was in 1984??

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Jun 20 - 03:23 PM

"That's the point, henryp- the figures are for GB- if there were figures for England alone, its own renewable production would be substantially less than 37pc! I know nothing about Wales' contribution, but it sounds like the additional exclusion of Wales would result in even lower English figures."

Would they really? I'm not sure what that would prove, but I'd be interested to see your figures.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,crumbly
Date: 22 Jun 20 - 08:48 AM

It has to be obvious that the Scottish Government has a much more active policy on renewable than Westminster, who have to be dragged kicking and screaming in any sensible direction.
The Scottish policy is not popular everywhere in Scotland, but Holyrood's aim is to be 100pc renewable THIS YEAR! It's probably happened already, due to Covid.
Illogically, Scotland does not use all of its power- a large amount is sent to England, which is why I made the point that, like many other things in UK, UK/GB/NATIONAL figures don't tell the full story!

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,Rob Mad Jock Wright
Date: 22 Jun 20 - 08:58 AM

The Oyster band did a great version of Coal Not Dole by Kayak Sutcliffe. Another great version is by Angie Wright and is on her Captive Heart available on Spotify.
So a bit of blatant publicity there. ..

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 22 Jun 20 - 11:12 AM

John Tams was the musical director of the Radio 2 Ballads. Jim Boyes had recorded Coal not Dole with Swan Arcade in April 1990 for the Hokey Pokey charity compilation Circle Dance. John Tams suggested setting it to the tune of the carol See, amid the Winter's Snow.

So Jim Boyes recorded it again in 1993 with Coope Boyes and Simpson. This 'striking' version appeared on the miners' benefit compilation Undefeated (listed as sung by Boyes Coope and Simpson) and on their breath-taking first album Funny Old World too.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 22 Jun 20 - 12:09 PM

"Great Britain's record coal-free run is over."

Crumbly, the point I was making is that coal, the real enemy, is being steadily defeated, and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is relying less and less on fossil fuel.

There is good progress towards renewable fuel in Scotland, I'm sure, but the thermal power stations - whether coal-fired or nuclear - have been closed independently of the Scottish Parliament. The SNP, of course, campaigned for Scotland to be an independent state whose wealth would be founded on the extraction of oil from the North Sea.

For the record, renewable capacity at the end of 2019 was; England 30.1GW, Scotland 11.8GW.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,Rob Mad Jock Wright
Date: 23 Jun 20 - 03:08 AM

KAYAK ...... don't know how that happened should have been KAY Sutcliffe.

Oh blasted thing tried to do it again!

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,crumbly
Date: 23 Jun 20 - 05:36 AM

times have changed, henryp- my annoyance was that GB figures are used when it favours England, a frequent deception by Westminster over the years.

To summarise- good English figures= English figures..... bad English figures= British figures!!!

   I think we agree it's good that coal is being phased out & that Holyrood has to base its future independence on something other than oil.
However both governments have still to find a proper replacement for the total loss of heavy industrrial jobs, the root of most of our present troubles.
On the subject of the thread, have you heard the Ed Pickford song 'The Tshirts and the blood' about the 84 strike- a fine version by Jim Sharp of Newcastle.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 23 Jun 20 - 06:56 AM

crumbly; times have changed, henryp- my annoyance was that GB figures are used when it favours England, a frequent deception by Westminster over the years.

Yes, Scotland does have the advantage of its own national parliament and an electoral system based on proportional representation. Think yourself lucky.

Subject: RE: BBC Radio 2 Ballad of the Miners Strike
From: GUEST,crumbly
Date: 23 Jun 20 - 07:37 AM

Oh I do- believe me!