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Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in US?

*#1 PEASANT* 26 Feb 10 - 08:10 PM
oldhippie 26 Feb 10 - 09:11 PM
Padre 26 Feb 10 - 09:29 PM
*#1 PEASANT* 26 Feb 10 - 09:50 PM
GUEST,leeneia 27 Feb 10 - 09:22 AM
oldhippie 27 Feb 10 - 06:47 PM
Jim Dixon 05 Mar 10 - 01:25 PM
GUEST,mg 05 Mar 10 - 01:37 PM
Joe Offer 05 Mar 10 - 03:39 PM
oldhippie 05 Mar 10 - 07:19 PM
Joe Offer 05 Mar 10 - 07:23 PM
oldhippie 05 Mar 10 - 07:38 PM
GUEST,mg 05 Mar 10 - 07:47 PM
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Subject: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in Us?
From: *#1 PEASANT*
Date: 26 Feb 10 - 08:10 PM

A friend is researching the thanksgiving song-

We Gather Together.

It has a long past coming from the dutch original to german nationalistic version.

the interest is in finding out how it came to the USA most likely via.

Dutch Folk-Songs with piano accompaniment. Compiled & edited by C. V. Bos [Import] (Unknown Binding)
~ Coenraad V Bos (Author)

Which is cited as being the first English translation.

Other names include-

Wir treten zum Beten (german version)


"Dankgebet"

"Altniederländisches Dankgebet

We gather together

Thanksgiving Prayer

Kremser (name of tune after scholar who discovered and popularised it)

So essentially the question is -

When did it become popular in the USA

Your kind assistance with this research will be greatly appreciated

Contact me at
cbladey@verizon.net

Conrad


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in Us?
From: oldhippie
Date: 26 Feb 10 - 09:11 PM

Is this the "We Gather Together" words by: Dorothy Caiger Senghas (1928- ) & Robert E. Senghas (1928- )copyright 1992 UUA? [Music: Valerius's "Nederlandtsch Ggedenckclanck" 1626, arr. by Edward Kremser (1838-1914)]

Starts "We gather together in joyful thanksgiving....."


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in Us?
From: Padre
Date: 26 Feb 10 - 09:29 PM

We Gather Together to Ask the Lord's Blessing.

The tune was written by an unknown author in celebration of Dutch freedom from Spanish sovereignty at the end of the 16th century. It was first published in the 1626 edition of Adrian Valerius' 'Neder-landisch Gedencklanck'. At the end of the 19th century, it was popularized through the edition of Edward Kremser of 'Sechs Altniederlandische Volkslieder' (Six Old Dutch Folk Songs). An American edition was published in Milwaukee in 1895. The English Translation, by Theodore Baker, first appeared in Coenrad V. Bos' 'Dutch Folk-songs, in 1917.

(Source: The Hymnal 1940 Companion)

Padre


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in Us?
From: *#1 PEASANT*
Date: 26 Feb 10 - 09:50 PM

old hippie- the same yes....

padre- yes

I am trying to track down Dutch Folk Songs of 1917.

Told my friend there was one on sale at amazon cheap enough but not in Loc and only as close as indiana via worldcat

anyone have a copy at hand....

Conrad


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in Us?
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 09:22 AM

This page:

http://ingeb.org/spiritua/wirtretz.html

gives the Dutch, German, Latin and English translations side by side, with dates.

A few months ago there was a thread on this song. As someone stated upthread, the song was written to celebrate a Dutch victory over Spanish conquerors. The German words look like a faithful translation on that theme. I don't see any connection to 'German nationalism.'


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in Us?
From: oldhippie
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 06:47 PM

The lyrics I referred to above, to the version in "Singing The Living Tradition":

We gather together in joyful thanksgiving,
acclaiming creation, whose bounty we share;
both sorrow and gladness we find now in our living,
we sing a hymn of praise to the life that we bear

We gather together to join in the journey
confirming, committing our passage to be
a true affirmation, in joy and tribulation,
when bound to human care and hope then we are free.


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Subject: Lyr Add: WE GATHER TOGETHER
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 05 Mar 10 - 01:25 PM

The oldest printing I can find with Google Books is in Chautauqua Hymnal and Liturgy "with an introduction by" John Heyl Vincent (New York: Novello, Ewer & Co., 1903), page 95 (hymn number 88).

The copyright page says:
    NOTE

    This Hymnal was compiled for the Chautauqua Institute with the hope that it would be generally used by Chautauqua Assemblies.

    The assistance of Mr. Alfred Hallam, Musical Director, in selecting the music, is gratefully acknowledged.
The lyrics are nearly the same as those already posted here, but in case anyone is interested, here they are with the differences in boldface:
    88. A PRAYER OF THANKSGIVING.
    NETHERLANDS.                                                                        E. Kremser.

    1. We gather together to ask the Lord's blessing.
    He chastens and hastens His will to make known.
    The wicked oppressing cease them from distressing.
    Sing praises to His Name. He forgets not His own.

    2. Beside us to guide us, our God with us joining,
    Ordaining, maintaining His Kingdom divine,
    So from the beginning the fight we were winning.
    Thou, Lord, wast at our side. The glory be Thine!

    3. We all do extol Thee, Thou Leader in battle,
    And pray that Thou still our Defender wilt be.
    Let Thy congregation escape tribulation.
    Thy name be ever prais'd! O Lord, make us free!

    By permission of G. Schirmer.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in Us?
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 05 Mar 10 - 01:37 PM

I think this is a stunningly beautiful hymn..done with the right words of course, which are as above (right as defined by yours truly, who knows them when she sees them). I don't know where the Living tradition words came from...a Unitarian hymnal perhaps? They are not widely sung (thank heavens..no offense if anyone is fond of them..) This is a serious song with a pretty tune but terribly primal words..may we escape the trials of war...the firebombings..the concentration camps..the starvation. We sang it in the Vietnam war knowing exactly what tribulations were. It is not for the faint of heart. mg


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in US?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 05 Mar 10 - 03:39 PM

Singing the Living Tradition was published by the Unitarian Universalist Association in the United States in 1993. In many ways, it's an excellent collection of hymns, songs and spiritual writings. HOWEVER, I have some question about what they do with traditional hymns.

The Unitarians provide a welcoming home for progressive-thinking people who come from a huge variety of traditions, and they bend over backwards to be inclusive. To such an end, they're careful not to sing hymns that would be offensive or off-putting to anyone. But it bugs the hell out of me when they change traditional hymns. Actually, I can't say I mind the way they've changed "We Gather Together" because they've rewritten the entire song, and I think they did a pretty good job of it. What bugs me is when they change a word here or there to make a traditional song "politically correct."

I've found I can't use Singing the Living Tradition as a reliable resource for the authentic texts of hymns, because it has too many songs that have been altered, and you never can be sure if you're getting the correct text.

I think Mudcatter Dan Schatz, a Unitarian minister, would agree with me.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in US?
From: oldhippie
Date: 05 Mar 10 - 07:19 PM

True, Joe. The preface of "Singing The Living Tradition" makes note of this. In part, it states: "Goverened by our charge to produce an inclusive hymnbook.....inspired by various liberation philosophies, cross-cultural perspectives, and ecological awareness, we sought to express a full range of spiritual imagery. Most notable is our use of feminine imagery for the divine. We applied similar inclusive insights to carols and some familiar hymns.....". So, yes, occasionally only a word or two is changed. And, I don't think it's an appropriate "resource for authentic text". I offered the words as a comparison to what others may have in their songbooks. If the book in question wasn't a hymnal, I believe it would be called the "folk process" at work.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in US?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 05 Mar 10 - 07:23 PM

...and I think we agree that we both like "We gather together in joyful thanksgiving."

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in US?
From: oldhippie
Date: 05 Mar 10 - 07:38 PM

Yes, certainly.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: We Gather Together - first sung in US?
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 05 Mar 10 - 07:47 PM

I know which version I'd sing if the Huns were at the gate (no offense to Huns if any are here or their relatives etc.) mg


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