Folk Rap?

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: GUEST,Billy
Date: 28 Mar 10 - 08:26 PM

DeG
LJ has four CDs but this piece isn't on any of them. All four are great CDs tho.
You might be able to contact him via his web site http://www.ljbooth.com/ here

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: michaelr
Date: 28 Mar 10 - 09:37 PM

Sharon Shannon's "Libertango" album begins with a tune called "The Whitestrand Sling" and closes with the same tune overlaid by a (very positive) rap called "What You Make It". You can sample both here.

http://www.legalsounds.com/download-mp3/sharon-shannon/libertango/the-whitestrand-sling/song_1414088

That said, I think that while folk is undoubtedly music, rap qualifies not so much, because it lacks that defining element - a melody.

Cheers,
Michael

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 04:15 AM

because it lacks that defining element - a melody.

Not realy true, Michael. There is often a very strong melody underlining the words and beat. Have a listen to the Shallow Brown Rap Greg pointed to earlier. I know it is not all the same and an 'unaccompanied' Rap would not have what you would call a melody but I think that would qualify more as poetry than music anyway.

Cheers

Dave

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: mattkeen
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 05:26 AM

roots music from anywhere is more often than not, at its core,

words + rhythm

or

rhythm


To say a type of expression is not really music because of the lack of variation in melody is absurd. You don't have to like it

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: matt milton
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 05:55 AM

I don't think melody is "the" defining element of music, so much as one among a number of defining factors. For me, music's anything I choose to listen to as music.

But even in purely conventional terms, to foreground melody is to forget about percussion-led music. A drum solo is music, even if it's not pitched notes. (Though of course drum hits do have a pitch of sorts - as rendered explicit by drumers of the calibre of Max Roach.)

Most hip-hop does have some kind of tune behind it, especially the commercial chart stuff. But even the hardcore, minimal stuff that's little more than drum hits, a bit of bass and a 'spoken' vocal is still undoubtedly music. To suggest otherwise is like saying a samba troupe isn't music, or that a tabla player isn't playing music.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: mattkeen
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 06:22 AM

I ment to say what mattmilton jusr said

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 06:32 AM

The Streets' A Grand Don't Come For Free: White, working-class rap concept album. A thing of brilliance. And contemporary folk music, as far as I'm concerned.





"Off on a slight tangent - I've sometimes thought that Beatboxing could work really well on some folk songs/tunes. Anyone know any examples?"

Check out recent work by the Demon Barber Road Show.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Banjiman
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 07:00 AM

"Off on a slight tangent - I've sometimes thought that Beatboxing could work really well on some folk songs/tunes. Anyone know any examples?"


Carolina Chocalate Drops....... they have it down to a tee.

Hit 'Em Up Style by CCD

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Banjiman
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 07:04 AM

I can actually spell Chocolate!

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Mr Fox
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 09:38 AM

Tickled Pink rap a couple of verses of 'When the King Enjoys His Own Again' on their first album.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Mavis Enderby
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 04:16 PM

Banjiman - thanks for the CCD link - can't get enough! ;-)

Ruth - looking forward to seeing the Demon Barbers at Southwell FF this year. There's enough of a taster on this promo vid (about a minute in) to whet my appetite!

Cheers,

Pete.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 05:32 PM

Pete,

CCDs are great, Genuine Negro Jig is a fine, fine album, buy it!

Have you found the CCD "Jack of Diamonds" video on You Tube yet? (Nothing to do with Folk Rap, just a great Old Time Blues Drinking song!). I know you'll like it.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: GUEST,Billy
Date: 30 Mar 10 - 12:34 AM

As a three piece band that did a lot of a-capella stuff, we were challenged to take on a piece called "Geograhical Fugue" by Ernst Toch whih would qualify as early rap. (For speaking chorus ger. "Gesprochene Musik"). It is in four parts but I reduced it down to three for us. It took about six months of practice before we were ever able to perform it live and never without the 12 pages of sheet music.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: olddude
Date: 31 Mar 10 - 06:14 PM

Ok, I swear this just happened to me, It is really nice today, so after I ate supper I went over the park and was sitting on a bench playing my guitar. Four young kids came over and was listening and one of them said did you write that song, I said yes it is called Chasing the Wind, they asked if they could sing along, I said sure and did it again. The two black guys had made a rap CD and write rap music ... in between verses to my song they were rapping lines like "and your breaking my heart, breaking my mind etc while I was picking the song on the guitar... I have to tell you it was the coolest thing I have heard in a long time ... I am on record for not liking rap but this was just fun and it was cool

Go figure, I loved the sound ... I did .... maybe there is something to it ...

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: olddude
Date: 31 Mar 10 - 06:40 PM

I will say this, they played me one of their rap song on their Ipod, I didn't care for it at all , it was way too close to gansta rap ... but it was fun what they did on my song. Wish I had a recorder so you could have heard that ... very interesting indeed ...

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Mavis Enderby
Date: 01 Apr 10 - 02:27 AM

Olddude - sounds fantastic, and reminds me I need to get out playing more instead of reading Mudcat!

Guest (Banjiman?): "a great Old Time Blues Drinking song"

Well I'll have to look that up, three of my favorite things in one!

Pete.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Mavis Enderby
Date: 01 Apr 10 - 02:29 AM

...and on the subject of beatboxing, it strikes me as not a million miles from eephing, which was discussed here last year.

Pete.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: GUEST,Ralf Weihrauch
Date: 01 Apr 10 - 04:13 AM

Hello Folk and Rap works.

This is from my Album Hole in One!

Ralf Weihrauch & Dr. Ring Ding The Unfortunate Tailor

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: GUEST,Neil D
Date: 02 Apr 10 - 09:16 AM

Ralf, I liked that a lot. Reminds me of the way Shaggy would interweave his West Indian vocalizing into pop songs.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: autoharpbob
Date: 03 Apr 10 - 07:06 AM

Loved the CCD!
Strange nobody has mentioned Benjamin Zephaniah on "The Imagined Village" retelling the story of Tam Lyn. Personally I always skip this track though, so it doesn't work for me!

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Phil Cooper
Date: 03 Apr 10 - 10:03 AM

The song Crocodile Man by Dave Carter. You can see youtube version's that he and Tracy Grammer did or a good one done by Chris Smither.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Ron Davies
Date: 03 Apr 10 - 11:00 AM

That Carolina Chocolate Drops song is just dynamite. Gotta see them--even if she sang, not rapped, the song.

Other possibilities--definition of "folk" is wide open as far as I'm concerned:



"Cash for the merchandise...." --(opening piece from "Music Man")--definitely not sung

Country-blues related stuff like "Hot Rod Lincoln" and its predecessors, songs by "Arkie Shipley" about car races

Piece by a local DC group, the Pheremones, about 30 years ago, resurrected by me and my wife:   "Cicada Serenade"--a rap about cicadas.   We've gotten a huge amount of mileage out of it--even got a "Nigel" in the MIddle Bar.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: GUEST,unfitforit
Date: 03 Dec 10 - 10:16 PM

what about astronautalis "you and your good ideas" album?

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: GUEST,Desi C
Date: 04 Dec 10 - 10:27 AM

For me it's not Folk, yet anyway. I imagine in the 60's Folkies wouldn't have believed The Beatles woulld be in Folk clubs, b ut I've heard 3 Beatles numbers in the last week in the clubs. Whether Rap should be termed 'music' though is questionable. I find much of it not musical at all, more a form of speed poetry. And with only a few exceptions, most Rappers have very poor diction often burying the Microphone (and lyrics) in their mouths, and Folk music is largely about the Words. But who knows in 20 years time you might hear it in Folk Clubs, there's little else in the 'pop' field worth remembering

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: GUEST, CRAZY
Date: 05 Nov 11 - 05:04 PM

WHEN I DIE SHOW NO PITTY SEND MY SON TO GANSTA CITY DIG A HOLE 6 FEET DEEP LAY 2 SHOT GUNS ACROSS MY CHEST AND TELL MY FOLKS I DID MY BEST

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: GUEST,Paul Slade
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 07:33 AM

Nu-folk's Jeffrey Lewis has a fun little bonus track called Mosquito Rap on his latest album "A Turn In The Dream Songs". He raps the tale fast and fluently over a very simple drum backing, punching home the rhythm of all its key syllables just as a black rapper would.

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Acorn4
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 08:13 AM

Try listening to the latest songs of Pete Morton - he describes it as "frapping" and it's well worth a listen if you can get to one of his gigs.

If "folk rapping" = frapping, whay then is country rapping?

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 08 Nov 11 - 07:52 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvNLv5NEmM0

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: GUEST,CatAlyst
Date: 08 Jan 13 - 09:27 AM

Whilst not traditional American folk music/ rap, there's a French group called Manau who've released 2 albums that combine French folk tunes with modern scratches and rap over the music. One example's Qui est la Balette? which samples a Bretagne folk song called 'La Jument de Michao'. The lyrics refer to the original's lyrics.

Also maybe Rybak/Opptur's 'Fela igjen' counts?

Subject: RE: Folk Rap?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Jan 13 - 10:21 AM

Nice to see this thread resurrected and I would have liked to have seen the French Folk / Rap but the link doesn't work :-( Any chance of checking it for us CatAlyst?

Cheers

DtG