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Do folk people like the Bodhran?

GUEST,FraggleRock 18 Apr 10 - 10:21 AM
Rob Naylor 18 Apr 10 - 10:59 AM
Rob Naylor 18 Apr 10 - 11:02 AM
Crane Driver 18 Apr 10 - 11:06 AM
Leadfingers 18 Apr 10 - 12:09 PM
GUEST,guest - Jim Younger 18 Apr 10 - 12:25 PM
Dave Hanson 18 Apr 10 - 12:28 PM
Fred McCormick 18 Apr 10 - 12:31 PM
bubblyrat 18 Apr 10 - 12:43 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 10 - 01:17 PM
greg stephens 18 Apr 10 - 01:41 PM
Darowyn 18 Apr 10 - 01:44 PM
Mo the caller 18 Apr 10 - 01:57 PM
GUEST,Shimrod 18 Apr 10 - 02:12 PM
JHW 18 Apr 10 - 03:04 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 10 - 03:09 PM
Howard Jones 18 Apr 10 - 03:44 PM
skarpi 18 Apr 10 - 03:53 PM
buddhuu 18 Apr 10 - 05:21 PM
Tangledwood 18 Apr 10 - 06:06 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Apr 10 - 06:09 PM
Bat Goddess 18 Apr 10 - 06:24 PM
Steve Shaw 18 Apr 10 - 06:25 PM
buddhuu 18 Apr 10 - 06:27 PM
MartinRyan 18 Apr 10 - 06:31 PM
Richard Bridge 18 Apr 10 - 07:57 PM
Steve Shaw 18 Apr 10 - 08:30 PM
GUEST,Learaí na Láibe 18 Apr 10 - 08:46 PM
Soldier boy 18 Apr 10 - 08:58 PM
GUEST,Sceptic 18 Apr 10 - 11:29 PM
Rob Naylor 19 Apr 10 - 02:40 AM
GUEST,Fragglerock 19 Apr 10 - 03:07 AM
SteveMansfield 19 Apr 10 - 03:18 AM
OlgaJ 19 Apr 10 - 03:53 AM
katlaughing 19 Apr 10 - 04:08 AM
GUEST,Steamin' Willie 19 Apr 10 - 04:46 AM
Ralphie 19 Apr 10 - 05:14 AM
Dave Hanson 19 Apr 10 - 05:39 AM
Howard Jones 19 Apr 10 - 05:50 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Apr 10 - 05:54 AM
Morris-ey 19 Apr 10 - 06:03 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Apr 10 - 06:25 AM
skarpi 19 Apr 10 - 06:40 AM
kendall 19 Apr 10 - 06:46 AM
Tim Leaning 19 Apr 10 - 06:49 AM
Mo the caller 19 Apr 10 - 07:20 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Apr 10 - 07:39 AM
Tim Leaning 19 Apr 10 - 08:18 AM
Zen 19 Apr 10 - 08:24 AM
*#1 PEASANT* 19 Apr 10 - 08:45 AM
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Subject: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: GUEST,FraggleRock
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 10:21 AM

I'm thinking of learning the Bodhran, but I'm wondering how it will be received.

I mainly mix in English folk circles, and don't want to be criticised every time I get an Irish instrument out.

So, my question basically is: Would it be welcomed or frowned upon?


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Rob Naylor
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 10:59 AM

I don't think anyone would bitch about it being an Irish instrument in an English folk setting. I don't think, in tgeneral, that we're that parochial!

It's not *that* different to a tabor, after all.

I think what upsets people is the bodhran being plpayed *badly* , as it often is. When it's over-intrusive, or not following the music (the bodhran should follow the music, not give the beat to it)then it can ruin a song or tue very quickly.

So I reckon it would be welcome...IF you learn to play it properly in private before trying it out in public!!!


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Rob Naylor
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 11:02 AM

Apooologies fer the appaulling speeling abuve!


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Crane Driver
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 11:06 AM

Depends how well you play it. The fact that you are 'thinking of learning to play' is a good sign - too many people seem to think you don't need to learn, you just hit it.

Don't try to play along with everything. And don't join in when there is already lots of percussion - I saw one festival 'session' with one fiddler and six bodhrans - not a good mix.

Of course there will be banter and insults - the bodhran is one of the instruments that is traditionally maligned, like the banjo and accordion. Played well, they can really lift the music - played badly, they can swamp it.

So it's not an English folk instrument? Neither is the guitar. It's what you do with it that counts.

Andrew


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Leadfingers
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 12:09 PM

Surely the Bodhran , like the Bazouki has only recently become an Irish instrument !


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: GUEST,guest - Jim Younger
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 12:25 PM

No particular feelings one way or another - but I once heard a bodhran player start to join in with three women singing Babes in the Wood. At the time I thought the idea crass (and the singers soon gave him "the look") but now ... well, it's a very broad church out in folkspace, and such a combo might be thought of as innovative. Which reminds me of the Geiger Brothers (anyone remember them?) Gary on lead bodhran, Garth on rhythm bodhran, Glenn on bass bodhran and Jonathan Ague on drums. Their 'Shadows Walk" as priceless.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 12:28 PM

Frame drums have been used all over the world for a long time.

It's the bad players who make people dislike it, in the right hands it's a pretty good instrument.

Dave H


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 12:31 PM

Leadfingers. No, the bodhrán seems to go way back, but its use was mainly and mercifully confined to parties of wren boys until Sean O' Riada incorporated it into Ceoltóirí Chualann in the 1960s. Indeed, I may be wrong, but I think the first real public airing it got was in the sountrack of the film Playboy of the Western World, for which O' Riada arranged the music.

Crane driver. Wise words. The reason most people, me included, have come to detest the bodhrán is simply that it's all too often seen as an easy option by people who aren't capable of playing anything else. The result is that bodhráns are typically too loud, badly played and far too numerous.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: bubblyrat
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 12:43 PM

Always wanted to play one,but couldn't quite get the hang of it !! So I now play Cajon instead,and am loving it !!


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 01:17 PM

Yes, as long as they are not played in sessions.
Mine looks great hanging on the wall.
Suggest you look out Con 'Fada' O'Drisceoil's song, 'The Spoons Murder' and apply the sentiments to the bodhran.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: greg stephens
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 01:41 PM

They make a great tray for carrying a round of drinks for the musicians.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Darowyn
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 01:44 PM

Do folk people like the bodhran?
Of course they don't!
You will always find someone in the folk world who hates anything.
Whether it's a guitar, spoons, something electric, a banjo, a bouzouki, accompanied ballads, unaccompanied ballads, Irish songs, American songs, brass instruments... anything at all.
The reason is always the same though.
They say it's not what they call Folk.
Cheers
Dave


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Mo the caller
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 01:57 PM

We used to dance to a band that had an excellent one-handed Bodhran player. A real asset.
Now we go to a session that has several bodhran players, some of whom can keep time. Its interesting the different sounds they can get by using a brush thingy instead of a beater sometimes.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 02:12 PM

"I'm thinking of learning the Bodhran, but I'm wondering how it will be received."

What do you mean, "learning it"? Surely you just bang it with a little stick, don't you?


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: JHW
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 03:04 PM

Mostly I would say folk people don't like the bodhran for very reason that your regular bodhran user believes "Surely you just bang it with a little stick, don't you?"
Wonderful to hear as a solo instrument played by one who can.
Bodhran players yes. Bodhran users no thanks.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 03:09 PM

"They say it's not what they call Folk."
No we don't - we hate it because it's an intrusive racket 'played' by people who haven't been able to learn a proper instrument.
Don't make statements on behalf of others.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Howard Jones
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 03:44 PM

The frame drum, with and without jingles, has a place in English dance music. However if you're going to use it for English music, learn to play English rhythms - they have a different pulse from Irish rhythms. To play for English music, don't play it like an Irish bodhran.

If you're going to play percussion, then you should do so for the right reasons. Many people seem to think it's the easy option, because they want to join in but don't want to make the effort to learn a "proper" instrument. In fact, percussion is very difficult to get right and requires just as much effort to learn as other instruments. The effect on a session when a percussionist gets it wrong is far greater than when other instrumentalists make a mistake, which is why poor players of the bodhran and other percussion receive so much criticism.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: skarpi
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 03:53 PM

I play guitars ,bass and drums and a Bodhrán in my band ...
are you playing solo , or in the band or in session´s , you have to learn it all some don´t like some does .

like in session , if you start playing in first part of a tune
its not likely to be taken well , if you start after the first then
its okei but you also have to know how to play .

all the best Skarpi


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: buddhuu
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 05:21 PM

If you're going to play bodhran you're going to have to put up with the same relentless stream of old, unimaginitive bodhran "jokes" from clueless wankers that the rest of us have had to put up with for years.

Many years ago, the legendary piper Seamus Ennis quipped that the best way to play a bodhran was with a penknife. As Ennis was a towering figure in trad music, it obviously became fashionable to affect dislike for the instrument. Many of those who slag it off don't even know why they are not supposed to like it. LOL.

The comments about people who don't bother learning to play properly before inflicting their efforts on people are fair enough, and often justified. There is, however, nothing wrong with the bodhran itself.

If you want to learn it go ahead, but please learn it.

Tell the piss-takers to feck off. Half of them are crap on their instruments too.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Tangledwood
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 06:06 PM

At a friends house-warming party a couple of years ago a solo male singer was accompanied by three bodhrans, no other instruments. I'm not sure now if they used very light tippers or brushes, or just finger tips but the overall effect made me think of the patter of rain on the roof. It was wonderful and ever since I've longed to hear it again.

Disregarding instrument types or music genres, most people will welcome an instrument played well and cringe at one played badly.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 06:09 PM

"Tell the piss-takers to feck off. Half of them are crap on their instruments too."
No, tell the no-brainers who think that adding percussion to linear music (usually uninvited) improves it, and to go off and learn some manners (and a little musical sensitivity).
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 06:24 PM

It's like the old joke -- Q - "What do you call people who hang out with musicians?" A - "Drummers."

As long as you're not interfering, no one will object. If you have ANY question as to whether the bodhran (or any other instrument, rhythm or otherwise) is appropriate, don't play. Or play so quietly it can't be heard as interfering. If you don't feel you're "good enough" yet, don't stop coming to sessions, just play along VERY quietly. You can't get good if you're not playing with other musicians.

The most important lesson to learn is to learn when NOT to play.

And don't play along with a singer unless the singer wants you to.

Linn


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 06:25 PM

The best bodhran "player" in the world could turn up to any decent Irish session and be completely unable to add anything at all to the tunes. All the rhythmic and percussive drive needed to play this music is already present in the tunes. This is a point completely misunderstood by bodhran owners. You spend five minutes learning to bash the skin instead of scuffing it, you get the bodhran video and you think you're going to be an asset to a session in a trice. Get real. The people playing the tunes have spent hours, days, weeks, months, years learning their instruments and more years learning tunes, and here you are are bashing a frickin' goat skin on tunes you don't know for all its worth after a few short-cut hours. Do yourself a favour. Leave the drum at home and learn to play an instrument.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: buddhuu
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 06:27 PM

Not all bodhran players are like that, but we all have to put up with the bullshit.

Why generalise? Some of us play many other instruments too and are well aware of which contexts call for the drum and which don't.

Tell the no-brainers if you want, and I'll support you, but don't display ignorance by tarting all with the same brush.

The instrument is fine.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: MartinRyan
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 06:31 PM

"Do folk people like the ----?"

Fill in the gaps to taste - the answer will alway be the same - NO!

The point is that, as a race, we're pathologically individual. Even when we do agree on something, the condition is temporary - that's why we survive from generation to generation.

Regards


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 07:57 PM

FFS! It is very simple in concept. Some versions of some songs (and many tunes if not slow airs) are done in rhythm. A such thing done in rhythm is augmented by a rhythm section that is in the right place in relation to the beat - and then it is the job of the melody people to hit the beat or be wrong.

OTOH some are not so done. Then it is the job of any drum or percussion or other "rhythm section" instrument to guess in advance where the accent is coming next, or whether silence is golden.

Getting it right in context is always a separate question.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 08:30 PM

It isn't no-brainers, bullshit or generalising. There are those of us, existing in droves, who have played traditional music for decades, been blighted by enthusiastic but completely bloody useless bodhranistas who think they're the dog's danglies and who, in all that time, have not once come upon one who is even half competent, let alone an asset. Bodhran players who claim to be good at it are like dog owners who claim that their dogs never shit.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: GUEST,Learaí na Láibe
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 08:46 PM

The Bodhrán was first introduced to a large Irish audience, well before Seán O Riada set up Ceoltóirí Chualainn. The drama "Sive" by the Kerry playwright John B. Keane was first produced in early 1959 and went on to become a popular success. The bodhrán was used to great effect to accompany a song which was sung in seperate parts throughout the play. Perhaps Seán Ó Riada, who at that time was exploring traditional music saw that play. Of course Ó Riada's endorsement of the instrument helped greatly in the spread of its popularity.

Kohn B. Keane was from Listowel where the bodhrán was used by the Wran Boys. The Wran Boy tradition is still strong in the area.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Soldier boy
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 08:58 PM

I've heard the Bodhran played wonderfully by very skilled players where it was so good it made my hair stand on end.

Unfortunately however this is a very rare experience.

I have heard so many stories from people who are perfectly skilled at playing the guitar,violin,mandolin,accordian etc etc who then get hitched to a wife/husband/partner who wants to then learn to play an instrument so they can join them in sessions and not feel left out.
And too often (unfortunately) when they ask what they could possibly learn to play they are directed towards learning to play the Bodhran because they think that it is easy to play and also not too expensive.

Unfortunately (again), from my experience, they are usually terrible and only about 5% of Bodhran players are any good.
The rest are bordering on inept and useless and can easily completely destroy/disrupt/desecrate a session in absolute happy ignorance/oblivion/blindness to the damage they are doing.
Their ability to fail to keep and hold the correct tempo and rhythm never fails to surprise and amuse me.

So, GUEST Fragglerock, unless you put the time in to learn to play the Bodhran really really well and have an innate sense of rhythm and beat don't even think about learning the Bodhran unlesss you, like the majority of Bodhran players, want to make a complete fool of yourself!


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: GUEST,Sceptic
Date: 18 Apr 10 - 11:29 PM

Did anyone consider the possibility that Herr Fraggle Rock was a troll? Seems like this thread was started to provoke the predictably indignant response.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Rob Naylor
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 02:40 AM

But it hasn't provoked an "indignant response".

It's "provoked" a set of perfectly reasonable responses highlighing that the bodhran itself isn't disliked in folk circles, but that inept, intrusive playing of it is.

If (s)he was hoping to provoke some kind of spluttering blanket condemnation it didn't work, did it?


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: GUEST,Fragglerock
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 03:07 AM

Thanks for all your answers. I take it all on board! Bought one anyway and will have fun, but whether it ever goes outside my door remains to be seen.

The only thing I play well at a session at the moment is the 568ml glass recepticle...


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: SteveMansfield
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 03:18 AM

John Jo Kelly playing bodhran in Flook or the Michael McGoldrick band, a brilliant and appropriate contribution.

Acutely dysrhythmic egomaniac, over-enthusiastically belabouring a £99 bodhran in a variable-speed approximation of the off-beat whilst someone's trying to play a slow air .... not so good.

There isn't a musical instrument in the world that can't be played extraordinarily badly and/or in the wrong place at the wrong time. It's just that a noticeable proportion of bodhran owners seem to think that the previous statement doesn't apply to them.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: OlgaJ
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 03:53 AM

I've been running occasional bodhran workshops (by invitation so I assume some people at least like my playing)for around 15 years and have taught people ranging from those who genuinely want to learn to play the bodhran as an instrument to those who want something to do for an hour or two as they can no longer keep up with dance workshops. I always emphasise the need to play sensitively and if you can't hear the instrument next to you you are probably playing too loud.

What really annoys me is musicians (ones who can play a 'proper' instrument) who insist on bring along a bodhran to 'accompany'tunes and songs they don't know. They then proceed to bash the hell out of the skin and completely spoil someone else's turn. To an extent this also applies to cajons which seem to be creeping into sessions in considerable numbers. Like the bodhran it is a great instument in the right hands but can be ruined by over-enthusiasm. If there seems to be a lot of loud percussion I now make a point of putting my drum down so that people don't think its me!!

In response to one of the above I am the partner of a proper musician who encouraged me when I decided to learn to play the bodhran many years ago. If I was no good at it he certainly wouldn't let me play in his band- and I certainly wouldn't have been complemented on my playing in sessions in Ireland!


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: katlaughing
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 04:08 AM

Love them, esp. when well-played: AS in this!:-)


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: GUEST,Steamin' Willie
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 04:46 AM

First of all, what is a folk person?

I'm one and Jim Carroll obviously isn't...

Or is he, and I'm not?

Or what about tree huggers and burnt out hippies? Or aged boozers using folk clubs as an excuse for a drink? Or sensitive people who see it as the most appropriate medium in song to express their feelings?

I reckon threads like this can only be answered once the "what is folk" thread has been addressed.

And in order to do that, we may have to be prepared to shoot some people......

Ok, the bodhran. I play one. Badly, but I play it. I play it to linear music (whatever that means, and I am supposed to be "classically trained.")   I have a mate who plays it wonderfully.

The difference? Err.. not much really. if you want to hear anything played really well, either go to a concert where you are aware of who is playing, or take pot luck that a good musician is doing a floor turn at a folk club.

But whatever you, do, don't get sucked in by those who have to put labels on everything, who judge the quality of spontaneous fun. After all, they are about as accurate as the iTunes genre label....


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Ralphie
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 05:14 AM

For playing Frame Drum in English music, look no further than Martin Brinsford (Old Swan Band and Brass Monkey). Plays frame drum and harmonica simultaneously. So, yes it can work, if you can play it.
(Don't get me started on shaky eggs though!


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 05:39 AM

The trouble stems from players who do not know when NOT to play, this applies to all bad musicians but is particularly prevalent with bodhran and shaky egg players, Raglan Road doesn't need a bodhran accompaniement, but the local twathead bodhran player thinks it does.

Dave H


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Howard Jones
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 05:50 AM

There is nothing wrong with "spontaneous fun". However some people like to play music well, and hear it played well. It is perfectly possible to do this in a session, but problems arise when the two approaches try to combine in the same session.

Good percussionists can add to the music. Unfortunately they are vastly outnumbered by those who just see it as a way of joining in. Far too often good percussionists are forced to stop playing when the thumpers and bashers join in, because they can no longer make a contribution to the music.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 05:54 AM

It really isn't anything to do with good and bad players - it is the limitations of the instrument itself.
As well as it might be played, its very nature makes it intrusive in a session of good musicians and it turns an average session into muzak.
It has been around for a long time, yet it wasn't absorbed into the music in Ireland until Sean O'Riarda (a classical musician) deliberately introduced it. It was an instrument played at rituals such as 'The Wran'; the old musicians were clear on this when they were asked about it. Ennis wasn't the only one to despise it, most musicians I've talked to regard it as irriating as spoons or coins banged on tables or glasses.
See the long article on it in Fintan Vallely's 'Companion to Irish Music' (somewhere on another bodhran thread).
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Morris-ey
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 06:03 AM

De Danann had no problem with Johnny "Ringo" McDonagh...


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 06:25 AM

"De Danann had no problem with Johnny "Ringo" McDonagh... "
De-Danann were concert performers doing something else with the music and not session musicians, as are The Chieftains (brainchildren of O'Riarda).
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: skarpi
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 06:40 AM

I went to N-Ireland in County down -Newcastle in a bar
called Mha hara inn ? words may not be right :O)
and I took my drum out and there was an old man playing
bodhrán and I watch him for some tunes...and then he said now you
play ? witch I did ..and there a flute player also as fiddle player
and they told how the session was build up and how I would come into tunes when they would play ...I learned alot there , they where friendly
and liked the drumm ...but as the old said play it from your heart
and your feelings for the song , listen to chieftains , De Danann
listen to other s on cd ..learn from them ...go to sessions
ask before you play ...let them tell you if something is wrong
if you don´t do that you never can fix if somethings are not working right . and don´t listen to those good people who don´t like bodhrán
if they have a problem , then its their propblem not yours . :O)
all the best Skarpi Iceland .


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: kendall
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 06:46 AM

An Irish instrument? Someone should tell the Corries.

Old Maine saying: "I'd rather hear a fiddler's diddling than a diddlers fiddling."


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Tim Leaning
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 06:49 AM

"The best bodhran "player" in the world could turn up to any decent Irish session and be completely unable to add anything at all to the tunes. All the rhythmic and percussive drive needed to play this music is already present in the tunes. This is a point completely misunderstood by bodhran owners. You spend five minutes learning to bash the skin instead of scuffing it, you get the bodhran video and you think you're going to be an asset to a session in a trice. Get real. The people playing the tunes have spent hours, days, weeks, months, years learning their instruments and more years learning tunes, and here you are are bashing a frickin' goat skin on tunes you don't know for all its worth after a few short-cut hours. Do yourself a favour. Leave the drum at home and learn to play an instrument."

Apply the above to all instruments
A lot of sessions are peopled by mediocre twats who think they are gods gift to whatever instrument they happen to have chosen to play.
They dont want anyone to join them because they want to carry on doing exactly what it is they are doing.
Nothing wrong with that and there are many exceptions.
Get your drum find some fiddlers guitarists bassoonists etc who are of a like mind,and pick a dozen tunes to play.
Play them in your own way every session for years. enjoy the craic and be obnoxious to any who dare to wish to join in unless they fit the group socially.
Thats how sessions are made and spread have fun.

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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Mo the caller
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 07:20 AM

Olga said
"I've been running occasional bodhran workshops (by invitation so I assume some people at least like my playing)for around 15 years and have taught people ranging from those who genuinely want to learn to play the bodhran as an instrument to those who want something to do for an hour or two as they can no longer keep up with dance workshops."
That sounds like Whitby; the chance to sample something completely unexpected when legs and brain are surfeited with dancing. I found myself with a set of pipes under my arm once, and I'd only gone into the pub to make sure I was early enough for a session.
All good fun, and a glimpse of taster of all sorts.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 07:39 AM

"Thats how sessions are made and spread have fun"
May be the way sessions are made, but its no way to make listenable music.
I have seen more sessions around here naused up by bodhran players than any other 'instrument' (giving it the benefit of the doubt). It's always the visitors; we have hundreds of good musicians living around here (a good percentage of them youngsters), but none of them 'play' bodhrans.
The problem is that an inexperienced fiddle player will work to improve - goat-abusers seem to think they have come into the world fully formed, so they don't bother.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Tim Leaning
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 08:18 AM

SO Jim you must be the inexperienced fiddle player you speak of?
Maybe not so perhaps you have personal experience of Bodhran playing?
I guess you must have spent hours learning to play one or the other to become such a wise and wonderful arbiter on the merits of each as and instrument.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: Zen
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 08:24 AM

As well as it might be played, its very nature makes it intrusive in a session of good musicians and it turns an average session into muzak.

"The best bodhran "player" in the world could turn up to any decent Irish session and be completely unable to add anything at all to the tunes.

These are opinions, not facts. I've been playing in sessions for over 40 years and, while a bad player (or worse multiple bad players) can cause problems, a good bodhran player can add a lot to a session.

I'm primarily a tune player and session organiser by the way... not a bodhran player.


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Subject: RE: Do folk people like the Bodhran?
From: *#1 PEASANT*
Date: 19 Apr 10 - 08:45 AM

Here is something I did in way back 1995

http://www.ceolas.org/instruments/bodhran/cheesecake.shtml

bodhran cheesecake

When one day a bodhrani was playing very fast his thumb started to bleed
blood shot out......

The crowd yelled out......

TIPPER GORE!

(the name of the then vice president al gore's wife)

Conrad


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