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BS: Language Pet Peeves

leeneia 10 Oct 20 - 10:20 AM
Jos 10 Oct 20 - 10:28 AM
JennieG 10 Oct 20 - 06:28 PM
Mrrzy 10 Oct 20 - 06:37 PM
JennieG 10 Oct 20 - 09:10 PM
meself 11 Oct 20 - 01:21 AM
Mrrzy 11 Oct 20 - 09:12 AM
Mrrzy 11 Oct 20 - 12:35 PM
Steve Shaw 12 Oct 20 - 10:51 AM
Joe_F 13 Oct 20 - 06:00 PM
Nigel Parsons 13 Oct 20 - 08:14 PM
Mrrzy 14 Oct 20 - 12:05 AM
Mrrzy 29 Oct 20 - 10:18 AM
meself 29 Oct 20 - 10:33 AM
meself 29 Oct 20 - 10:35 AM
leeneia 29 Oct 20 - 12:44 PM
Joe_F 29 Oct 20 - 05:59 PM
Steve Shaw 29 Oct 20 - 06:53 PM
Jos 30 Oct 20 - 02:39 AM
Mrrzy 30 Oct 20 - 11:40 AM
Joe_F 30 Oct 20 - 06:32 PM
Mrrzy 31 Oct 20 - 12:29 AM
Joe_F 31 Oct 20 - 09:13 PM
leeneia 01 Nov 20 - 10:24 AM
Nigel Parsons 01 Nov 20 - 10:54 AM
Steve Shaw 01 Nov 20 - 11:23 AM
Nigel Parsons 01 Nov 20 - 12:27 PM
Senoufou 01 Nov 20 - 01:11 PM
Steve Shaw 01 Nov 20 - 01:30 PM
Mrrzy 01 Nov 20 - 01:55 PM
Jos 01 Nov 20 - 02:36 PM
Joe_F 01 Nov 20 - 05:47 PM
Lighter 02 Nov 20 - 07:43 AM
Mrrzy 02 Nov 20 - 10:09 AM
Nigel Parsons 02 Nov 20 - 11:47 AM
GUEST 02 Nov 20 - 06:17 PM
Joe_F 02 Nov 20 - 08:28 PM
meself 02 Nov 20 - 10:04 PM
Gibb Sahib 03 Nov 20 - 02:33 AM
Steve Shaw 03 Nov 20 - 05:30 AM
Jos 03 Nov 20 - 06:16 AM
Joe_F 03 Nov 20 - 06:39 PM
Mrrzy 04 Nov 20 - 02:48 PM
The Sandman 05 Nov 20 - 02:21 AM
Jos 05 Nov 20 - 05:20 AM
JennieG 05 Nov 20 - 03:42 PM
Jos 05 Nov 20 - 04:09 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Nov 20 - 05:41 PM
meself 05 Nov 20 - 07:57 PM
BobL 06 Nov 20 - 03:46 AM

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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: leeneia
Date: 10 Oct 20 - 10:20 AM

That's interesting, Lighter.

I have read a good many books on the English language (420's in the library), and some scholars talk about "drift", which are strong tendencies, perhaps unconscious, for us to talk a certain way. With the word "mischievious", we see drift which says that fancy adjectives ought to end in -ious, such as

obvious
devious
furious
curious
impecunious

The only other adjective I can think of right now which doesn't have the i is "larcenous."

I remember hearing a teacher in grade school telling us that the word is "mischievous." I believed her, but I thought it awkward.
==========
Re: impecunious. If I am pecunious, what am I like?


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Jos
Date: 10 Oct 20 - 10:28 AM

All those five words are related to another word using 'i' or 'y' -

obviate
deviate
fury
curiosity
pecuniary


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: JennieG
Date: 10 Oct 20 - 06:28 PM

Mrzzy.......that extra "i" in aluminium is alive and well, and living in Oz.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 10 Oct 20 - 06:37 PM

Oh yeah it is just the Murricans that say aluminum.

Interestingly enough, the original nomenclature had no I. The Brits changed the spelling to make it be like other elements, but the US uses the original, correct, spelling.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: JennieG
Date: 10 Oct 20 - 09:10 PM

The Canadians use the US pronunciation, as we have found out on our visits.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: meself
Date: 11 Oct 20 - 01:21 AM

In fact, we Canadians prefer to say that the Americans use the Canadian pronunciation.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 11 Oct 20 - 09:12 AM

Canadians spell Canada with three letters: C eh? N eh? D eh?


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 11 Oct 20 - 12:35 PM

Ok forgot to get asparagus so there I was with my crab, and no crab and asparagus soup on this cold and rainy day. So farmers' market lettuce and tomatoes, crab, half an avocado, a handful of almonds and my vinaigrette made a great salad. But I am still cold, and it is still rainy. Poor Charmion.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Oct 20 - 10:51 AM

"Sometimes I think that all contractions should be disallowed for awhile..."

Er, Ebbie... is that American?


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Joe_F
Date: 13 Oct 20 - 06:00 PM

It's a long-lost cause, but in my book "mayhem" does not mean disorder. It means the crime of depriving someone of the use of a body part.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 13 Oct 20 - 08:14 PM

Canadians spell Canada with three letters: C eh? N eh? D eh?

Maybe that is why the group is called the BeeGees. When I was learning to read B G would be pronounced 'bugger' ;)


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 14 Oct 20 - 12:05 AM

My Greek Table just said Mykonos has nightlife 24/7. That takes some doing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 10:18 AM

Both from cnn this morning:

Remains of 59 bodies found in clandestine graves in Mexico - how about either 59 bodies, or remains of 59 individuals?

Newly discovered Triassic lizard could float underwater to pick off prey ... Well, if it is floating, it is not *under*water, now, is it?


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: meself
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 10:33 AM

Well - the bodies are presumably not complete, so what you've got is what remains of what were once whole bodies, so, the 'remains of the bodies' - but it is awkward wording, because the term 'remains' is generally taken to mean 'all that remains' of that individual who we were chatting with the other day but whose soul has since gone on to Glory, while the body remains here below.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: meself
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 10:35 AM

How about, in reference to a couple, "They/We are pregnant!" I've heard that one a few times lately. I've lived too long.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: leeneia
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:44 PM

I like the "They are pregnant" usage. In a society where thousands of newborns go unacknowledged by their fathers, the usage gives the father credit for being involved with and caring for his child.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Joe_F
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 05:59 PM

Another (very) long-lost cause: The feeling you have for something you want that somebody else has is *envy*. *Jealousy* is the feeling you have for something you have that might be taken away from you.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 06:53 PM

Apropos of pregnancy, two expressions that seriously get on me tits are "She fell pregnant" and "She was heavily pregnant".


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Jos
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 02:39 AM

Towards the end, a pregnancy can feel very heavy if you are the one lugging it around wherever you go.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 11:40 AM

Oh and I am so old I didn't know that Pride is now, apparently, exclusively an LGBTQ word. I feel like some old curmudgeon asking why people are using gay to mean homosexual when they [the curmudgeon] are gay themselves but in the sense of Happy.

What happened was my undergraduate institution had online Homecoming so I signed for several things including Tufts Pride on opening day which I thought was going to be about pride *in* Tufts but was Pride *at* Tufts... Oh well. Being nonbinary puts me at Q so I was not at the wrong party, I just wasn't at the party I *thought* I was going to. But a good time was had by all.

Which is an expression I had trouble with in college, when I ran into someone senior year that I had been to a really fun party with freshman year but who had forgotten where we'd met, and I said at Roots and Growth, we had a good time, and he took several shocked steps backwards as I had apparently told him we'd had sex. Which we hadn't.

Got into trouble in French with Sortir Avec, which I thought meant Go Out With but apparently meant have sex with, so an odd conversation occurred with somebody who had had sex with a Marine in the pool once, but was denying Going Out with them.

Ah, youth.

And I'm not even going into my strenuous objections to claiming pride in anything you didn't actually *accomplish* - mom, holocaust survivor, refugee, could be *proud* to be American, it was a personal feat. I on the other hand was *born* American, so proud does not compute. I feel bloody lucky [present times excepted], sure, but never Proud. One cannot imosho claim *pride* in one's skin color, sexual orientation or gender identity, or birthright nationality.

You *can* be proud of getting out of a closet, though. Applies to atheists too, that last.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Joe_F
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 06:32 PM

"... changed everything."

Nothing changes everything.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 31 Oct 20 - 12:29 AM

All the ramifications too, or rather neither, JoeF.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Joe_F
Date: 31 Oct 20 - 09:13 PM

"Blockbuster"
should make people imagine digging corpses out of rubble.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: leeneia
Date: 01 Nov 20 - 10:24 AM

You're right, Joe. What block is it that blockbusters bust?
==============
Here's a peeve of mine, but it's not actually language. It's when somebody is leaving, and they point a finger at me and lower the thumb as if shooting me with a gun. Fortunately this fad seems to be over, but maybe it's not over. Maybe since I retired I have managed to exclude people like that from my world.

It was always done by people who live in neighborhoods where a sudden loud noise does not lead to saying "Was that a gunshot?"

Literary note: I remembered this gesture because it was in a detective novel about Spenser and Hawk.
================
Mrrzy:   Good points. What does imosho mean? Sounds Japanese.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 01 Nov 20 - 10:54 AM


Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
. . .
Newly discovered Triassic lizard could float underwater to pick off prey ... Well, if it is floating, it is not *under*water, now, is it?


Well, actually, they can be 'floating'. It just means that they do not need to regulate the depth of their dive. Floating is being in a state of suspension due to the upthrust of the medium one is in matching the downthrust of ones weight/mass. Or, as our physics teacher had us memorise:
"When a body is wholly or partially immersed in a liquid or fluid it receives an upthrust equal in force to the mass of liquid or fluid displaced."
Hope I got that right, it's 50 years ago now, and a quote (in translation) of Archimedes.
Divers use weighted belts to offset the floatation effect of the sea-water surrounding them.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 01 Nov 20 - 11:23 AM

I think that should be the weight of fluid displaced, Nigel.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 01 Nov 20 - 12:27 PM

Yes, it should, as we're talking forces rather than their components.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Senoufou
Date: 01 Nov 20 - 01:11 PM

Would IMOSHO be 'in my oh-so humble opinion'?


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 01 Nov 20 - 01:30 PM

"In m'humble" does it for me.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 01 Nov 20 - 01:55 PM

Sen got it on the nose.

On NPR today (NPR!) on a science show (a *science* show!), something was "part and partial" of whatever they were talking about...


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Jos
Date: 01 Nov 20 - 02:36 PM

With half an ear on Countryfile this evening, I definitely heard one of the presenters say of some view or location that it "never fails to disappoint".
I really don't think that was what she meant.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Joe_F
Date: 01 Nov 20 - 05:47 PM

"Impact"
saves the trouble of deciding whether to say "affect", "effect", or "influence". An app that would respond to "impact" with "BANG" would automatically make fun of semiliterates.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Lighter
Date: 02 Nov 20 - 07:43 AM

So someone is a "semiliterate" for using "impact."

Fascinating.

My friend was clerk of the state supreme court for many years. The clerk's job (for those unfamiliar with the judicial system) is, essentially, to study the case, write a decision, and pass the decision on to the judge for approval or revision.

My friend had to revise just one decision in his career. He frequently uses "impact." And "irregardless," too.

Does that make him (and others who use these words) semiliterates?

When I was in high school, we were warned never to use "contact" as a verb, because it meant we were too lazy or tongue-tied to use "call," "phone," write," etc.

You can see how far that got.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 02 Nov 20 - 10:09 AM

What happened to the word Widow? I keep wincing at headlines about Sean Connery's, but they all say Wife.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 02 Nov 20 - 11:47 AM

"Impact"
saves the trouble of deciding whether to say "affect", "effect",


Yes, always a difficult choice. A writing guide used in HMRC stated that the correct usage should be easy, as "affect is a verb and effect is a noun".

Unfortunately that isn't always the case.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Nov 20 - 06:17 PM

Right, Nigel. Psychologists use affect as a noun to mean emotion.

Also, I can effect a change.

What's wrong with contact as a verb when I don't wish to specify the method? If I tell my assistant to contact a vendor, s/he may write, telephone, text, fax, send an e-mail or visit the firm.
==========
It's my own fault, but I can never remember what a meme or a trope is.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Joe_F
Date: 02 Nov 20 - 08:28 PM

"Incredibly" is no longer just an exaggeration for "surprisingly". It may mean "very" or nothing at all.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: meself
Date: 02 Nov 20 - 10:04 PM

Well, if we're going to get into that - how about "awesome"?

Waitress: Would you like some more coffee?

Me: Sure.

Waitress: Awesome!


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Gibb Sahib
Date: 03 Nov 20 - 02:33 AM

"What block is it that blockbusters bust?"

The block where the movie is screening, where the theatre is located.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Nov 20 - 05:30 AM

When we visited Perth (the Aussie one) we were tickled by how frequently we heard assistants in shops, cafes, etc., replying to each and every step in the transaction with "no worries!"


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Jos
Date: 03 Nov 20 - 06:16 AM

'awesome' - reminds me of the television coverage of the Jubilee celebrations a few years back. I remember thinking "What large crowds, what small vocabularies."
Almost everyone asked what they thought of it said either "It's amazing" or "It's a once-in-a-lifetime-opper'uni'y."


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Joe_F
Date: 03 Nov 20 - 06:39 PM

There is usually an aisle in a (U.S.) supermarket labeled "International". In fact, most of the offerings in that aisle came from the U.S., and many of the other commodities in the rest of the place were imported. It is stupid to use "international" to mean "foreign", and stupid stupid to use either to mean "ethnic".


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 04 Nov 20 - 02:48 PM

And all those sugary crap things shelved under Nutrition. Shudder.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: The Sandman
Date: 05 Nov 20 - 02:21 AM

theivery instead of theft, some illiterate republican politician


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Jos
Date: 05 Nov 20 - 05:20 AM

There seems to be widespread confusion between 'reticence' and 'reluctance'.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: JennieG
Date: 05 Nov 20 - 03:42 PM

Steve - "no worries" is an Ozzie-ism that has been around for many years. Back in the day when I was a Sweet Young Thing people - always blokes, women weren't supposed to know such things - would sometimes say "no wucking forries".

Another dating back a very long time, and still in use today, is "she'll be right". It can also be combined with "no worries" to make the compound phrase "no worries, mate, she'll be right".

Once again, a bloke thing. Women have their own Womenspeak. There is also Familyspeak.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Jos
Date: 05 Nov 20 - 04:09 PM

I've noticed recently that when people are talking about numbers, instead of saying there has been an increase they often say there has been an 'uptick'. Is this because so many statistics these days are bad news?
A tick is a positive sign so this could be an attempt to make the larger numbers seem less unwelcome.


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Nov 20 - 05:41 PM

It was a delight, Jennie, so no worries!


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: meself
Date: 05 Nov 20 - 07:57 PM

Back in the day, I never heard anyone say, 'Back in the day' - then all of a sudden everyone was saying it - how come?


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Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: BobL
Date: 06 Nov 20 - 03:46 AM

A tick is a positive sign - but it puts a different slant on "uptick" if it's the parasitic sort.


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