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Tech: IE8 Crash

Barbara Shaw 02 Dec 10 - 10:50 PM
JohnInKansas 03 Dec 10 - 01:20 AM
The Fooles Troupe 03 Dec 10 - 05:05 AM
JohnInKansas 03 Dec 10 - 07:44 AM
Barbara Shaw 03 Dec 10 - 09:52 AM
The Fooles Troupe 04 Dec 10 - 12:34 AM
JohnInKansas 04 Dec 10 - 04:49 AM
GUEST,Jim Martin 04 Dec 10 - 06:45 AM
Barbara Shaw 04 Dec 10 - 09:53 AM
Acme 04 Dec 10 - 10:31 AM
MoorleyMan 04 Dec 10 - 10:41 AM
Barbara Shaw 04 Dec 10 - 01:53 PM
The Fooles Troupe 05 Dec 10 - 03:56 AM
JohnInKansas 05 Dec 10 - 05:19 AM
Barbara Shaw 05 Dec 10 - 12:05 PM
Acme 05 Dec 10 - 12:16 PM
Barbara Shaw 05 Dec 10 - 12:56 PM
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Subject: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: Barbara Shaw
Date: 02 Dec 10 - 10:50 PM

When I start up IE8 (using Win XP) to get to my yahoo home page it crashes, asks me to send an error report, closes down and continues to crash, open, crash, etc. This happens on both my desktop and laptop! So I used Safari as my browser and have no problem.

Anyone else having this problem? Is it me? Is it IE? Is it Yahoo? Is it the holiday traffic?


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 03 Dec 10 - 01:20 AM

Initial releases of IE8 were not really compatible with WinXP, and special methods, apparently too exotic for Microsoft to explain, were required to install on WinXP.

It appears that there are now "OS Specific Downloads" available, including one for WinXP. Using a "generic" IE8 download is likely to fail.

The Microsoft site that I found for downloading IE8 for WinXP is at http://www.microsoft.com/windows/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=341c2ad5-8c3d-4347-8c03-08cdecd8852b.

If you used an IE8 from somewhere else, you might get better results with that one. Note that the "system requirements" at the download page demand WinXP SP2 for 32 bit WinXP, and several non-Microsoft sites recommend updating to latest WinXP patches before attempting to install IE8.

The web seems to be full of complaints about websites that are simply not (yet) compatible with IE8, and Microsoft says that IE8 must be run in "IE7 Compatibility Mode" for these sites. It's not clear whether IE8 on all versions of WinXP are able to use the compatibility mode, but Microsoft claims to provide "compatibility lists" that you can download from the security update site that will automatically tell IE8 to switch to "Compatibility Mode" for sites known to be incompatible with IE8. I'm unable to find those lists, but I don't have IE8 installed and that may be a requirement for them to appear at the Microsoft Update sites.

It may be IE8, and Yahoo is notorious for "non-compliant" features so it may be Yahoo. Microsoft likely will tell you that it's WinXP since they'd like for you to up(?)grade to Vista or Win7, but they do appear to have produced an XP version of IE8. IE8 clearly was NOT INTENDED FOR USE WITH WINXP at its first releases.

Having resisted IE8 on my Vista machines, I can't speak from experience, but what I've seen on the web doesn't encourage me to switch.

John


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 03 Dec 10 - 05:05 AM

My Win 7 came with IE8, but I use Firefox. If someone can tell me what and where this 'compatibility list' is, I'll dig it out...


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 03 Dec 10 - 07:44 AM

Foolestroupe -

The best I can make of it is that you need to go to the regular Microsoft Update or Windows Update site where you get security patches. If you do an "automatic update" you only get "critical patches," but there should be an option to look for "optional updates." The compatibility lists are apparently sort of like the virus signature files you'd get from an AV vendor, but instead of killing anything in the list they knock IE8 back into "IE7 Compatibility" mode for any site on the list.

Only "popular sites" are likely to be listed, and since people in different places have different popular sites, the lists are likely to depend on where you are when/if you get them.

It all sounds a bit like a bandaid for the sore arm you got from the splint you had to put on when the crutch bent and dumped you in the shit pile, but maybe if you find the files there will be an intelligible explanation for them.

Some comments imply that you can set IE8 to compatibility mode manually for individual sites that you visit that aren't in the lists, but I don't/won't have IE8 at present so I don't know what those "features" look like.

John


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: Barbara Shaw
Date: 03 Dec 10 - 09:52 AM

I've had IE8 installed for quite awhile without problem, except for the virus siege a few weeks ago... When I tried downloading a new copy of IE8 from download.cnet.com (which I have used often without problems), the install tried to uninstall the existing version and hung the computer.

It was an interesting few moments when I tried to install Safari on the laptop via an IE8 that kept crashing. During the seconds when Yahoo (my home page) on IE8 was crashing, I kept clicking another bookmark tab, until finally I was able to get away from the Yahoo page to another site. From there I could navigate to a download site for Safari. Which makes me agree with John that it's a combination of IE8 and Yahoo causing the problem.

Just curious that it just started after having worked for months. But then, Yahoo keeps changing the page to include constant interactive updates, ads and other unwanted features.

By the way, Yahoo and Safari seem to be OK for the moment. And I learned the lesson that there should always be more than one browser available on a computer!


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 04 Dec 10 - 12:34 AM

JiK - I regularly go to the manual Update Button.


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 04 Dec 10 - 04:49 AM

the install tried to uninstall the existing version and hung the computer

I don't know whether the problem still exists, but when beta copies of IE8 were out I recall seeing a Microsoft instruction on "How to Uninstall Internet Explorer 8" that was significantly more complex than a usual uninstall. It appeared that the installation of IE8 replaced some files used by earlier versions without saving the old ones, and when the new files were removed the older version the system fell back to wouldn't run.

Since Windows won't run without some version of IE onboard* if the uninstall crashes the fallback IE it could blow the whole system, or at least parts of it that support browser functions(?).

* By agreement with some EU governments, the IE parts integral to Windows are "hidden" in some Windows distributions, so the browser isn't fully functional until "accepted and installed," but the critical pieces are still part of Windows. Since those functions normally get security patches via IE update, it's probably a good idea to turn it on and just not use it if that's your choice, even if you're in a place where it's officially "not there."

John


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: GUEST,Jim Martin
Date: 04 Dec 10 - 06:45 AM

Am I imagining things, but is the internet beginning to tie itself up in knots, or is it an on-going process that's always been there and is only going to get worse with every new application that's added & with all the viru/anti-virus problems?


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: Barbara Shaw
Date: 04 Dec 10 - 09:53 AM

I didn't realize Windows needed some version of IE! Also had a problem trying to install Netscape on the laptop, and it flashed some message about running via IE, which I was trying to bypass because of IE hanging. Yep, tying itself up in knots...

Safari is running OK now, but I prefer one thing about IE: the ability to hover over a link and see what the URL is before clicking on it. That doesn't seem to happen in Safari.


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: Acme
Date: 04 Dec 10 - 10:31 AM

Is Netscape still out there? I thought it went away ages ago when Firefox arose from it's ashes.

Have you tried installing some of the Google products? I like the Chrome browser, though it doesn't install the Google toolbar (some of those functions are built into the browser, but I like the tidiness of the toolbar, and the popup blocker tool).

Safari advertises that it is the fastest browser, a lot of them "prefetch" stuff you use a lot so they don't need to keep downloading images fresh (but this is something they've been doing for a while, it may simply work a little differently than the old cache method).

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: MoorleyMan
Date: 04 Dec 10 - 10:41 AM

This is all really confusing, even for a reasonably tech-savvy user!
I run Windows XP, with IE7, and have resisted all entreaties to install IE8. I don't have an alternative browser running - and am not even sure I can do this and how? Doesn't it interfere?

But I have also noticed that after a long time of running without significant problems, on a number of annoying occasions in the past few weeks (perhaps since installing AVG2010, but that may be just a coincidence) the Yahoo site (which hosts my internet connection and email servers) and some other sites have suddenly disconnected IE (and/or sometimes prompted an error report and/or crashed and/or hung the pc entirely), weirdly just after my trying to refresh or back-space a website.
If anyone has any answers or advice I'd be interested to hear - although I realise this may not be entirely relevant to the IE8 thread title...


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: Barbara Shaw
Date: 04 Dec 10 - 01:53 PM

MoorleyMan, you can install another browser on your computer but don't start it up unless you need it, in which case you would start that one instead of the other one to get to the internet. I do a lot of downloads from download.cnet.com (can't remember the exact name, and I'm on Safari which doesn't let me open another window, at least as far as I can tell right now - one of the things I miss about IE). Go there and search for Safari or other browser and download it to your machine.

I think the problem is IE, because I run Yahoo with Safari and don't have a problem, but IE and Yahoo crash. So apparently it happens with both IE7 and IE8. Or maybe it's a virus infecting IE.


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 05 Dec 10 - 03:56 AM

"Safari which doesn't let me open another window"

Firefox does let you do that


"the ability to hover over a link and see what the URL is before clicking on it"

You can get an addon for Firefox that lets you do that.



"I need to scratch my bum"

Firefox doesn't currently have an addon for that, but then it won't stop you doing that either...

I'll get me hat...


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 05 Dec 10 - 05:19 AM

There are "special requirements" for uninstalling IE8 on WinXP.

If installing another browser attempted to remove IE8 it probably also tried to remove IE7, and it quite possibly trashed the IE version that WinXP is supposed to fall back to if IE7/IE8 is removed.

Instructions for uninstalling IE8 are at How do I uninstall or remove IE8 AT MICROSOFT.

The essential information is that if WinXP SP3 is installed after IE7 or IE8 is installed, neither of the IE versions will appear in the "uninstall programs" list in Control Panel, and other attempts at removal/uninstall are likely to trash IE internet functions. You must REMOVE SP3 before you can get a clean uninstall of IE8, after which you may need to reinstall IE7 (if that's what you want) or IE8.

Most people who keep up to date probably will have SP3 installed before attempting to install IE8, so it should appear as "removable," but removing IE8 removes components required by IE7, so reinstallation of IE7 may be needed, especially if SP3 was installed after IE7.

Additional information on uninstalling (and reinstalling) SP3 are at You cannot uninstall IE8 or IE7 after you install WinXP SP3. This article includes links to detailed instructions for several of the steps you may need.

While cnet.com is generally a reliable site, in some cases it really is best to get your updates directly from Microsoft. This may be one of those cases, or not; but since there have been problems I'd suggest using the Microsoft Update button on your Start menu to go direct to Microsoft for any IE downloads necessary to fix your current problem.

John


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: Barbara Shaw
Date: 05 Dec 10 - 12:05 PM

Thanks, John in Kansas. As always, you have much valuable information and share it often on mudcat.

Regarding opening another window and hovering over a link in Safari, I figured out how to do it. Showing or hiding the status bar (option top right drop down for Safari settings) lets me hover.   New window option (option top right drop down menu for current page) lets me open another window. Apparently it's all there except scratching Foolestroupe's bum. Good luck with that.
;>)


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: Acme
Date: 05 Dec 10 - 12:16 PM

Sounds like it's time to upgrade to Win7. I'm using Win7 Ultimate (the most robust version, like Win20000 Pro, XP-Pro, etc.) and am so glad I waited until they got Vista out of their system. Like Millennium Edition, it was a bad idea.

Win7 doesn't play nicely with some old versions of software and devices. I've had to abandon or reassign a few devices. I spoke with our Library IT head last week and observed that in his office he still has an old PC with Win2000 running for a few programs that he can't put on any newer computers. He also has four monitors in front of him and a switch so he can toggle between the systems.

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: IE8 Crash
From: Barbara Shaw
Date: 05 Dec 10 - 12:56 PM

Is there a way or a site somewhere to check compatibility of software products with an operating system before installing?


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