BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Naemanson
Date: 24 Dec 10 - 04:12 AM

Well, to tell you the truth I AM the poster child for cynicism.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: GUEST,cs
Date: 23 Dec 10 - 12:29 PM

is that really milton?? Sounds just like js mill.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Brian May
Date: 23 Dec 10 - 11:29 AM

Well said Naemanson.

There is no PROOF (available to we common folk) to say he damaged anything more than the US Government's reputation. They are now shown up for staggering levels of hypocrisy. 'Land of the Free' . . . not.

I have no doubt that this would apply to any other government too though.

It's just that their 'holier than thou' attitude has been shown for the scam it is. We all knew anecdotally but it's so good to have proof.

I knew I didn't like politicians and so-called diplomats.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Naemanson
Date: 23 Dec 10 - 01:54 AM

It occurs to me to point out that the USA is an ongoing experiment in empowering the population. Remember out Bill of Rights? We are unlike any other nation on Earth in the miracle of our birthing. England, France, Spain, Japan, etc., all are free countries but only the USA included personal freedom in our making.

To be free we need to be fully informed in what is happening in the world. It is a necessary requirement of being a United Statesian.

Thus, Assange, foreign born and citizen of the world as he is, has done us a favor.

His reasons are not important. What is getting lost is that our government is just a bunch of petty humans doing what petty humans do.

Disclaimer: If anything he disclosed endangered anyone's life then he has gone too far. Did he out any of our agents like Plame was outed?

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 22 Dec 10 - 04:15 PM

Serendipity ...

The CIA task force assessing damage from leaked U.S. diplomatic documents, the WikiLeaks Task Force, has the same abbreviation as a popular online saying, WTF.

WTF: WikiLeaks Task Force

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 11 Dec 10 - 04:41 AM

I am remembering and reviewing my Milton studies.

Give me the liberty to know, to utter, and to argue freely according to conscience, above all liberties. [Milton]

To "know" is key. Because we cannot form true conscience without truth. IMO, ff truth is withheld from us, we are incomplete.

Though all the winds of doctrine were let loose to play upon the earth, so Truth be in the field, we do injuriously, by licensing and prohibiting, to misdoubt her strength. Let her and Falsehood grapple; who ever knew Truth put to the worse, in a free and open encounter? [Milton]

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 11 Dec 10 - 04:24 AM

A man may be a heretic in the truth, and if he believe things only because his pastor says so, or the assembly so determines, without knowing other reason, though his belief be true, yet the very truth he holds becomes his heresy. John Milton

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: GUEST,999
Date: 10 Dec 10 - 11:18 AM

`Mostly, it's the people who think every single thing ought to be available to the public.`

That could be, Jeri, but recall that the public has had its business delved into by banks, governments and various agencies for decades. They are reaping the whirlwind of tit for tat.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 10 Dec 10 - 03:25 AM

Rudd (Oz ex-PM and now Foreign Minister, himself the 'victiom' of some of these leaks) made very public statement that the only place to put blame is the USA.

The Wikileaks sex files: How two one-night stands sparked a worldwide hunt for Julian Assange
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1336291/Wikileaks-Julian-Assanges-2-night-stands-spark-worldwide-hunt.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Naemanson
Date: 10 Dec 10 - 12:10 AM

Jeri has a good point. And the others are right, it is NOT a black and white issue.

BUT!

Because the government has given us no reason to trust them and because they will use the classification of items to hide wrongdoing they have given up the right to have secrets.

Would we have ever known about torture of prisoners at Abu Grabh if we'd allowed the government to keep its secrets? What national benefit came out of torturing those poor bastards?

Nixon tried to keep his crimes secret using this same defense. Where would we be if Watergate hadn't proven to us that the government is full of self-seeking crooks?

If you have the power to keep secrets you have the responsibility to use that power wisely, not to anyone's personal benefit.

But then, I'm too naive to manage in today's "civilization".

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: SINSULL
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 10:06 PM

Jeri, I agree. Plastering these "secret" documents all over the internet is a disaster. But why go after the site? Who gave them the info? And why wasn't it secure?
Plus it was Obama not Bush who denied knowledge of the Ukraine/Sudan arms supply.
My bad.
Mary

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 08:10 PM

That is the point, Jeri.

It is NOT a b&w issue, it's very much a shade of gray, which shade depending on what angle you look at it from.

In WWII, dropping the body of a dead man with fake information is a secret that must be preserved during the War, but why would one want to hide it forever?

At the same time, Vietnam, Contra, Nixon, and many other things displayed that the concealing of some secrets seriously damages society, and allows certain scum to delude us that they are wonderful creatures. Mostly they never feel any remorse that they did anythi9ng 'wrong'.

It's always a value judgment, and not everybody will agree on the results of others judgments.

If it is a b&w issue to some people, then those people can get very dangerous to the rest of us (Pol pot, a certain Austrian Corporal comes to mind, among many other examples).

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Jeri
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 07:59 PM

I'm having a difficult time with this.
Mostly, it's the people who think every single thing ought to be available to the public. They think these leaks are good things, UNQUESTIONABLY good things. They think it was great that Valerie Plame was exposed, and for all I know, they think that people's medical records should be available to everyone. I think it's more likely they believe there's some point where it's none of everyone's business, but where is that point?

Me, I had a security clearance, and you're pretty much telling me that not divulging classified information that could have damaged the security of the US was wrong. You're telling me that signing non-disclosure agreements for my job and abiding by them is wrong. I don't believe classified information should include that which protects criminal activity, but I do believe it should be respected when its disclosure would do more harm than good. So think about what the cutoff point is. When is secrecy a good thing, and when is it bad? Is it worth risking your career or even your life to make the judgment yourself and divulge secrets? Would you risk the lives of others why might be hurt by your actions?

I think what is bothering me, the Bottom Line, is that people seem to think it's a black and white issue. Secrets always bad/telling secrets always good. I think it's 100% grey. I think that people who can't blindly trust and respect the government ought not to blindly trust and respect anyone, including those who leak, and I don't believe anyone involved in this is very admirable.

When it comes to this, I don't believe anyone is righteous. While I don't think anyone is flat-out evil, extremists on both sides seem to be trying hard to make themselves appear evil. Stop it, extremists!

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 07:26 PM

Amazon Explains Why It's OK to Sell Books About the #WikiLeaks Stuff It Won't Host

http://bit.ly/hxsZig

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 07:23 PM

"World War III will be a global information war with no division between civilian & military participation."

Marshall McLuhan

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Brian May
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 03:14 PM

Well gnu:

It would appear that another thread on Wikileaks wasn't that unpopular after all.

I totally disagree it's been 'done to death'. When you read some of the stuff in it I think we're only scratching the surface.

Funny, I thought 'we' supported 'freedom of speech' , isn't that what Wikileaks is all about?

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: SINSULL
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 10:23 AM

Just musing here - why are they going after Wikileaks and not the guy who leaked the documents? Did some Private irst Class have access to this stuff? Isn't the US and any country responsible for keeping watch on secret documents? What am I missing?

Thanks, Brett. So I am still on Planet Earth.

and rather enjoying some of these leaks. Pirates grabbed a Ukrainian freighter and found it full of arms for Sudan. Ukraine first denied there were arms on board, then said they were for Kenya.(I may have that wrong but this is like trying to figure out The Usual Suspects) The US knew about the shipments but tried to save face with Bush protesting to both the Ukraine and Kenya when he knew they were for Sudan. Have I got this right?

I hope they finally disclose where those Weapons of Mass Destruction are hidden. I think they may be in Washington DC disguised as politicians.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: SINSULL
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 08:57 AM

And while hundreds of other viciously brutal rapes in Sweden are ignored, thisd one gets international attention.
What a mess.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 08:30 AM

Yes it is a coincidence and personally I think the women were offered good money to make the allegations. I get as outraged as anyone else regarding sexual or physical abuse but it all seems a bit odd. It was allegedly supposed to have happened while the women were sleeping he might be everything else but a snarling brute, nah! And another thing no-one who in their right mind (arguably) would risk committing an offence like that if trying to keep a low profile?

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 08:02 AM

http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2010/s3089449.htm

it appears Mr Assange is gaining some unlikely allies in his fight against the allegations of sexual misconduct.

Katrin Axelsson from the group Women Against Rape has written a letter to Britain's Guardian Newspaper questioning the nature of the charges.

Prominent American feminist Naomi Wolf has also questioned the motives of the women who have accused Julian Assange of sexual misconduct.

And in what could be good news for Mr Assange, reports are emerging from Sweden that one of his female accusers has stopped cooperating with authorities there.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 05:58 AM

"America is today the leader of a world--wide anti--revolutionary movement in the defense of vested interests. She now stands for what Rome stood for. Rome consistently supported the rich against the poor in all foreign communities that fell under her sway; and, since the poor, so far, have always and everywhere been far more numerous than the rich, Rome's policy made for inequality, for injustice, and for the least happiness of the greatest number."

-- Arnold Toynbee, historian, 1961

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 05:53 AM

"They're going to try to extradite Assange, despite the fact that they don't currently have a law under which to prosecute him"

They're babbling about CHANGING the law - so they can screw him over on a BACKDATED LAW!

I thought the Barons were pissed off at King John about that sort of thing and tried to put a stop to it....


Rudd has now stood up and said that Julian is not in the least responsible for the original leak and that the blame can only be put on the slack security measures of the USA who let it happen in the first place. He's also promised consular support - which was not given at first, and was NOT given in Sweden - and was totally refused to Hicks!

He's smiling now because Mark Arbib (had something to do with kicking him out of office!) is now revealed as a US sucker upper! Spy, even! But isn't a Labor Party Hardhead Power Broker SUPPOSED to be a two faced back stabbing sucker up to Uncle Same? :-)

So now Rudd gets cred for kicking Uncle Sam in the nuts, where as Julia Blabbed (without Parliamentary Privelege!) that Julian was a Criminal - there is talk of defamation.


Geoffrey Robertson QC is now apparently on his defence team! :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: andrew e
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 04:42 AM

Take a look at this website for some interesting articles.

More things each day.


http://whatreallyhappened.com/

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: mandotim
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 03:17 AM

We're seeing the dog days of capitalism here; the more times this sort of 'leak' happens, the more people will realise the power they actually hold. Over the last 40 years or so the democratic and judicial processes have been gradually eroded, leaving power in the hands of some politicians and a lot of large corporations. The internet changes all that; what we have is the democratisation of information; in other words, it's really hard to keep things secret any more. Why do you think there is a concerted move to restrict the internet by governments and corporations alike? Before anybody asks, yes, the US government pays lip service to openness of information; but only when it doesn't apply to them. They're going to try to extradite Assange, despite the fact that they don't currently have a law under which to prosecute him. Watch the State Department comments; no-one has specified the statute under which a trial might take place. Perhaps they just want to waterboard him and then kill him? Sarah Palin seems to think this would be a good idea.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 09 Dec 10 - 02:40 AM

LOL at Mandotim... Love it and

Happy that Visa/Mastercard and Paypal have been suffering mass interruptions in service, not that it hurts their bottom line. It just pisses off the customers using them.

But hey it is a start at striking at the heart of corporate/capitalist complex.

Love that there are groups supporting internet democracy by exercising some internet anarchy.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: mandotim
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 07:01 PM

'Freedom of speech...priceless. For everything else, there's Mastercard...'

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 05:53 PM

Kevin Rudd has finally been quoted by the media as saying that it was only the USA itself to blame for the leak. He laughed off the comments about himself as water off a ducks back. He says he was proud of the comments that revealed that he was not considered a stupid idiot who do anything the Yanks told him to.

A top Aussie Labor party MP Mark Arbib is cited by the US as a major source of info - funny but the stuff he was feeding could be read in any newspaper - shows just how bloated and incompetent the USA system is.

Mastercard has backed off shutting down WL donations due to backlash against itself! Yea for the little man!

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Stu
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 03:48 PM

This is worth a read:

Reuters article on the charges levelled against Assange by the Swedish authorities

If this is truly the case then I suspect the coppers will be out trying to nick a sizeable proportion of the UK's youth population on a Friday night around turfing out time.

The Swedes of course, were quite happy to allow the CIA to use it's airports for the stopovers of rendition flights. Nice.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: bobad
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 03:18 PM

Irony

On the same day that British authorities arrested WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange on an Interpol warrant, the US State Department announced it would be hosting the United Nation's "World Press Freedom Day" next year.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Stu
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 03:16 PM

At least it's shown us all the hypocrites who pledge to uphold the first amendment then start railing against a journalist publishing leaked information. This is a sorry display of the elite who like to keep their little secrets from those who bankroll them trying to cling on to their old ways of doing things when the world is changing.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 02:59 PM

To render the oppressors out of the USA?

You don't need a rendition team to retrieve Assange from the UK - B.Liar signed us into poodle status in the treaty.

But I note your preference for the illegal way to operate and your denial of the presumption of innocence.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 01:40 PM

Rendition team needed.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Brian May
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 01:22 PM

Best of luck to them.

I don't support him IF, repeat IF he's guilty of crimes against the person (their appearance at this time seems a little bit coincidental).

However, I support his stance against the low life, paranoid invertebrates who are only in power because they wish to 'serve the people'.

I hope they squirm. 'In God We Trust', but for the rest there's always coercion.

Shameful in the self-professed 'Land of the Free'. No wonder they want it hushed up and are leaning on their own people not to inquire.

Reminiscent of the Thatcher government at the time Spy Catcher was published by Peter Wright.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Stringsinger
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 12:34 PM

The actual free press is always outrageous because it dares to question the authority and views of the ruling class....(the oligarchs who now run the U.S. government). This is historically true and we see the pattern working again today.
The state department supports dictators throughout the world and claims that their allies are legitimate. At the same time they denigrate and demonize a champion of true democracy.

I will say in defense of real democracy and Jefferson's admonitions about the importance of a free press that is more important than governments that "I Am Wikileaks".

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 09:27 AM

Stephens, Mark         Partner (Stephens Finer Innocent)
T: [phone]
E: [e-mail]

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Richie Black (misused acct, bad email)
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 06:39 AM

"Mark Stevens, although a little odd, has paid his dues as a lawyer and is rather good. I never liked having him against me. "

If you had Mark Stevens against you it certainly wasn't in a court room !

lmfao

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 06:14 AM

Our wonderful two face Opposition has not only condemned the leaks, but attacked the Government because the leaks are factual and prove how bad the government is ...

As commentators are saying here in Oz, it's just schoolyard stuff, sounds like a transcript of 2 Aussies talking at the pub ... damaging toda perhaps, gone tomorrow - control freak, well they're everywhere...

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 06:04 AM

Re my previous

QUOTE
...says that doesn't make sense when much of the information is already freely available from newspapers such as The New York Times and The Guardian.

Aftergood says that the classified cables on wikileaks are not primarily a scientific resource, but they do contain social and geographical data that is of interest to some researchers, he says. Those most likely to be affected by the bans are foreign policy researchers and analysts.
UNQUOTE

And since we know just how poorly informed the USA is about foreign affairs anyway, this stupidity will help in what way?

The Yanks in their secret cables apparently did even KNOW that the Aussie company allegedly 'making antivenin critical to US security' hasn't DONE SO for a decade.... :-)

So when the US nutters in charge hunker down in their bunkers after pushing The Big Red Button, will they realize that the lowest paid workers who were supposed to make their underground toilets work .... I'll let your imaginations work for a while ....

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 05:55 AM

The Great Beyond: US declares Wikileaks off-limits to government researchers

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 05:50 AM

Mark Stevens, although a little odd, has paid his dues as a lawyer and is rather good. I never liked having him against me.

I was under the impression that extradition from Sweden to the USA was rather less likely than from the UK to the USA under the wholly outrageously biassed UK/US extradition treaty, so it might have been smart to go to Sweden before the US request.

The most puzzling thing at the moment to me is:

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."


Should this now have added to it "save in respect of foreigners whose rights may be restricted upon any whim, and save insofar as the industrial-military-complex requires".



The barring of money due to Assange and the blocking of means to give money to him is frankly sinister, and unpardonable in the light of the way the USA happily funneled money to Irish terrorists.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 05:38 AM

Assange: Australian of the year?

The best article yet written on this subject - there are a lot Aussie specific local things mentioned - ask if you want clarification.

~~~
Assange: Australian of the year?

Bob Ellis

How would Mick Young have handled the Julian Assange affair? Famous for defusing difficult subjects with a mild, commonsense one-liner, Mick would have said, "Well, we'll have to arrest Laurie Oakes too. And David Marr. And Bob Woodward".

Hard to find the argument against this. Marr told how his prime minister called the Chinese 'rat-fuckers', Assange let it be known how he proposed to bomb them for being difficult. Oakes once published a budget speech before it was given, thus imperilling for a while our economy. Woodward pretty much hobbled the US presidency by showing its burglaries, bad language, and hate campaigns.

And Assange has done similar things, albeit a thousandfold, and prominent Americans including presidential candidates and vice-presidential candidates think he should be killed for it. In this they go against the First Amendment - Congress shall make no law abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances - thoughan opposite mode of thought has been Fox Newspeak lately: no-one but Hannity, Beck and O'Reilly, it yells, can say anything at all. They should be waterboarded if they do.

Assange is shaping up as Australia's Dreyfus and the Prime Minister by throwing him to America's assassination-mongers has lost, oh, half a million Labor voters to the Greens overnight, the way she does. She said on September 7 we should 'let the sun shine in'; but when Assange did she put on the cloak of the Princess of Darkness and called his deeds 'illegal'.

Should Julian Assange hang, or fry, or be injected with poison for telling the truth? Should his fellow WikiLeaks hackers die beside him? Should he do four years for it? Should he do two weeks? All our better angels briskly murmur 'no'. Let him who would say 'yes' not hold his peace.

Yet it's likely he'll be killed soon, and hung like a stinking mouldy albatross called 'Julian' round Julia's neck, and a film as interesting as The Social Network made about him, with David Wenham playing Assange, Geoffrey Robertson playing himself, Amanda Bishop as Julia Gillard kicking the furniture and Brian Dawe as Robert McClelland wincing.

Do the people have a right to know? Seems not. Should David Marr hang too? Looks like it. (Hullo David)

I wrote last week of Australians' dissimilarity to Americans. Not even Andrew Bolt would call for Assange's assassination. Not even Piers Akerman, fond of scoops himself, would recommend he get five years. Not even Alan Jones would call him (or Marr) a traitor. If he did he'd have to target Andrew Wilkie, MP, as well: the indiscreet officer who rightly said there were no WMD and was called by John Howard 'emotionally unstable'.

No, Australians differ from Americans in many, many ways. We do not carry handguns. We do not leave half-witted young men on Death Row for 20 years. We do not have a Death Row. We do not have the word 'God' on our coins. We do not send in pilotless aircraft to blow up families whose religion we do not like. We are better than that. The most famous Australians - Greer, Hughes, James, Humphries, White, Murray, Pilger, Carey, Robertson, Blanchett, Crowe - are all truth-revealers, and this I think is no accident. They are Australians all. And we Australians like to tell it how it is. Rupert's father Keith revealed Gallipoli. Hawke, Keating, Beazley and Evans told all in Labor In Power. Sir Ron Wilson, Spitfire pilot, unveiled the Stolen Children. And so on.

And Julian Assange is one of us, as worthy at least of our protection as Chapelle Corby. He has broken no law and has greatly enlarged the amusement of nations. He has done more solemnly what Stewart and Colbert do every night. He is a kind of Chaser and some of us love him for it. And nearly all the Left revere him and would like to see him Australian of the Year. He has changed the world for the better. Who can deny it?

But has he endangered lives? Well, maybe. Let's wait a bit and see. If 10,000 killings in the next year can be plausibly blamed on him, he may well have behaved irresponsibly. But a million wartime deaths can with equal force be blamed on Tony Blair, and three million ruptured Iraqi lives, and he has not yet been hanged or even waterboarded for it.

It is time our Prime Minister sat in on some ethics classes in a school in New South Wales. She would learn there that revealing wrong is not a crime, or a sin. She would learn that doing wrong is. And that protecting wrongdoers is a crime - as in sheltering serial killers on the run, or shielding priestly pederasts from investigation. She would learn it is not 'illegal', as she quaintly puts it, to report a planned act of illegal war, as Assange did Rudd's and Wilkie did Howard's, but a proper thing to do. Even a patriotic thing to do. As was the Stolen Children Report, and the Voyager Enquiry, and the several James Hardie asbestos-mesothelioma court cases. And the many, many trials of Lindy Chamberlain. And Breaker Morant.

Wrongdoing should be exposed, as a rule. It should not be kept secret. And we should let the sun shine in, as the Prime Minister lately recommended, biting her tongue.

It is impossible anyway in the social network age to keep it out. Not only information, but response to that information, is instantaneous now. And to say it takes weeks to discover if an act is illegal is nonsense; you can look it up. You can text another Julian, Burnside, and ask him.

Once again an Australian citizen, like Hicks, is being neurotically targeted for baseless punishment by crazed Americans, who are into furious revenge these days, even murderous revenge, and once again an Australian Prime Minister is cravenly doing nothing to stop it. If Assange has done international wrong, let him stand trial in The Hague. If he has not, let him come home to Parkville, drink coffee with Barry Jones, and yarn about the past, as Australians do.

Is there a third alternative? I don't think so.

Or perhaps you, ho ho, disagree.

Bob Ellis's last two books on Australian politics, One Hundred Days of Summer and Suddenly, Last Winter, are in bookshops now.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 05:28 AM

Nevermind there is a lovely wedding coming up soon and we can forget all about it, hey!?

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Naemanson
Date: 07 Dec 10 - 05:59 PM

Sins: Remind me - what planet am I living on?

Same one that brought you all the idiocy you've seen in the past.

USA, the country that brought you VietNam and followed that up with Afghanistan, now brings you spurious claims of criminal activity to try to shut up another clear view of how governments work.

It's easier to stop up the leaks than to clean up your systems.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 07 Dec 10 - 05:49 PM

someone is watching

I want a programme that sends the following back to whoever is watching what I read on line

             
            _
           / \
          |\_/|
          |---|
          |   |
          |   |
        _ |=-=| _
    _  / \|   |/ \
   / \|   |   |   ||\
  |   |   |   |   | \>
  |   |   |   |   |   \
  | -   -   -   - |)   )
  |                   /
   \                 /
    \               /
     \             /
      \           /
       |         |
 




	

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Richie Black (misused acct, bad email)
Date: 07 Dec 10 - 05:18 PM

It cannot be denied that he is being "unfairly" treated. It is just too convenient a charge- the Americans appear to continue with their arrogant assumption that the rest of the world is as stupid as they are if they expect this to go down this easily. This man deserves our protection and not to grant him bail with the support that has been offered is a plain joke.


Julian Assange has created a system where courageous people can divulge information in a safe manner. By doing this, he has allowed Journalism, in particular political journalism, to do what its meant to. Our western derivative of democracy denotes that a free press is not only a legal entity, but is also a valid and ethical checking mechanism on the power held within executive branches of government. These leaks give us access to decisions that, in effect, we are responsible for - as our votes put these governments in place.

As representatives of the society they serve, western politicians should welcome such leaks, as they provide us, the electorate, with a means of seeing what we actually vote for. An elected government is accountable to each and every one of its citizens - the work of Wikileaks has empowered the voter in the pursuit of such accountability. If you think this is theoretical bull, then think again - our whole system hinges on accountability, Wikileaks underscores it.

Seems to me Uncle Sam is once again exerting his influence in our Government and as always, getting everything he wants. When is this country going to stand up for itself ?

If it is not Brussles interfearing and trying to rule us, is is the clowns from the Colony's telling us how to run our country !

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: SINSULL
Date: 07 Dec 10 - 03:33 PM

Scarier still:
US to federal workers: If you read WikiLeaks, you're breaking the law
From the Christian Science Monitor.
So... while we rail at China about opening up the internet, here at home it is a crime to read any of these links published online or mentioned in a newspaper article. In addition, universities are being warned to tell students interested in a career with the state dept NOT to read any of this stuff on line - someone is watching.
Remind me - what planet am I living on?

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 07 Dec 10 - 03:26 PM

Unlike the child rapist movie producer, Leakypee will be extradited to face trial.
His trove of stolen paper will soon be forgotten.

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Brian May
Date: 07 Dec 10 - 01:40 PM

Gnu:

Brian... the point is that the rule of thumb at The Mudcat Café is to centralize discussion, not to start multiple threads on the same topic. The rule is a rule because it's a good rule. The statement I quoted makes no sense at all. Equally so for your "reply."

I shall stand myself in the corner and have a stern talk to me.

Then I shall probably totally ignore it as it really won't stop the sun coming up in the morning.

Cheer up, it might never happen (unless it just did)

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 07 Dec 10 - 11:23 AM

They didn't catch him ... He turned himself in.

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: Outrageous Wikileaks!!
From: Mrrzy
Date: 07 Dec 10 - 11:11 AM

They've caught him, though!