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BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Stilly River Sage Date: 26 Sep 11 - 09:20 PM Isn't it nice to be talking about living gardens again? Even if they're in the "struggling back" stage, it's good to be out there in the dirt and compost. Thanks for the recommendation, Janie. That's exactly the type of endorsement I was hoping for. I'm looking forward to putting this greenhouse to good use. It's small, it's plastic, but it's a big step up from how I've started plants before, if I didn't plant directly into the ground. I went out the side door late this afternoon and my next door neighbor was in the garden picking okra. As I've invited -almost insisted- that she do when she wants. I'd picked around noon and thought I'd gotten most of it but she came up with another dozen a few hours later. We're both starting a bowl in the fridge, building up to big meals with fried okra. :) She sometimes comes home for lunch and will pick a bowl and take it in and boil it to go with her meal. When we know their grandkids are coming for the weekend we stockpile several days worth and it still vanishes before it has barely had time to cool (they have a lot of grandkids). And because I put in several more plants this year than last, we'll both end up with a sizable amount in our freezers for over the winter. Good gardens make good neighbors! SRS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Janie Date: 26 Sep 11 - 08:14 PM In spite of having been completely ignored, unfertilized, unwatered and virtually decimated by cabbage loopers and cabbage whites earlier in the year, then nibbled by deer, my Red Russian kale has soaked up the rain and the more moderate temperatures of the past few weeks and regenerated itself nicely. The single apricot mums are in bud. Autumn Joy sedum is blooming -but doesn't get enough sun so is a bit scraggly appearing. I moved the Ginger lillies very early this spring, so am not surprised they didn't bloom. They are still looking for good homes if anyone is interested. Question for Bobert or other hydrangea growers. I did cut back my smooth hydrangeas to 8-12 inches, but did it late - early to mid April, and the leaf buds were about half opened and 2-4 inches long. I got lots of new wood, slowly, but no flowers. Am I correct to assume that day length is a factor in production of flower buds, and the new branches did not have the opportunity to grow enough and develop flower buds before the days got too long (or too hot?) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Janie Date: 26 Sep 11 - 07:48 PM Maggie, Johnny's Selected Seeds has been my most preferred seed supplier for many years. Good product, good selection with many organic selections, great customer service, and their catalog provides just about all the information you might want regarding starting and cultivation as well as comparisons among varieties of their different attributes. Johnny's caters to small market growers and home gardeners. In addition to veggie seeds, they have a very good selection of culinary and medicinal herb seeds as well as flower seeds (flower seeds are definitely tailored to small commercial cut flower and bedding plant growers.) In addition to the above, their reviews of their gardening tools, aids, seed-starting equipment are good and honest. Some of the more common products such as assorted row covers are probably available at lower cost elsewhere, but I rarely bought without first reading what Johnny's had to say, and often paid their higher price as compensation for the good information. Not sure a product is right for you? Call 'em up. Their CSR's are knowledgeable or will have some one who is get back to you, and they won't try to talk you into a product that isn't right for your needs. Bet you can't tell what a fan I am, huh? johnnyseeds.com http://www.seedsofchange.com/ is an excellent company also. Their selection is more limited and their catalog is not nearly as informative. I don't think I have ever ordered from them, but have bought and planted their seeds for years from my local food coop. Their offerings are all, or nearly all, organic, open pollinated varieties. Have always found the germination rates for both Johnny's and Seeds of Change to be excellent. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Q (Frank Staplin) Date: 26 Sep 11 - 04:08 PM Leaves are beginning to turn. Fall cleanup soon (Calgary). |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Stilly River Sage Date: 26 Sep 11 - 01:58 PM We finally have cooler weather, and we had a couple of nice rainfall amounts a week or two ago. But it is still severe drought here. The fall weather has helped some things perk up - I'm swimming through the dense okra this year (last year it was taller, more spread out, but I also started it much earlier). Eggplant are happy now that it is cooler and has rained. I see a few small tomatoes starting, but so far the Super Fantastic that should produce tennis ball-sized fruits is turning out cherry-sized fruits. Early in the spring I got a few normal sized fruits, so it's an interesting result of drought but I hope they go back to bigger 'maters. I haven't dug the sweet potatoes yet, the vines were looking pretty awful with the heat, but now it's cool they're are happy again so I'll let them grow till we get closer to the first frost. I have some small acorn squash (first time I've grown those, and these are from some seeds I saved.) Chard is beginning to grow. I have a greenhouse now, rescued from a friend's house that has been foreclosed. It's a plastic building that I dismantled, moved, and rebuilt in my back yard. I'm looking forward to a more organized way to start my bedding plants, and I'll go to the trouble to order the seeds I want instead of hoping they might turn up in the feed store, or having to buy bedding plants and then hope they're healthy. Any seed sites or catalogs you want to recommend? SRS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Stilly River Sage Date: 23 Aug 11 - 10:12 AM Hand watered this morning, and I have one infestation of mealy bugs to treat. The plant may be too wet in the ground at that point, I'll see if I can reposition the soaker hose. No rain in sight in the long-range forecast. SRS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Bobert Date: 22 Aug 11 - 08:32 PM Thanks, Janie... It came out real nice... One major bed down one to go... Well, I hope it's just one more major one... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Stilly River Sage Date: 22 Aug 11 - 07:56 PM I've used BT successfully for years, but it is never something to broadcast. You use it carefully on just what you want to treat. Dipel contains BT. Products coming to market these days are found to have a concentration of BT in the plants because of how it has been used in some commercial agriculture, so I suspect it will become a hot topic in organic gardening circles. I often pick the hornworms and toss them into the woods across the road or relocate them to something I don't care about. They can eat all of the datura (jimson weed) they want, I have a fair amount of that. They love it. The hornworms become a great pollinator, the sphinx moth (ironically, it is the tobacco hornworm that attacks my tomatoes, not the tomato hornworm. I've seen other hornworm varieties also, in a yaupon holly). There are a couple of particular predators for the hornworms, a wasp, and the tachinid fly. Here's a blog entry I wrote after finding and photographing one in the garden a couple of years ago. I kind of like these Pillsbury dough boys of the garden - I've written about and photographed them several times. On the gardening front today, after 56 days over 100 this summer, all it took was one day (Saturday, August 13) of a gentle rain and lower temperatures for several tomatoes to get pollinated in my garden. They may not end up very big, but they're out there! Ordinarily if it isn't below 80o at night they won't pollinate. We've proved that to be true this year. They won't even respond to the Q-tip approach. SRS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: GUEST,Jon Date: 20 Aug 11 - 12:33 PM Cabbage moth larva have always been the beasties I have had to combat. Cabbage white butterflies are a menace here too. We did try some cheap fruit cages but they didn't last long and I would up making some using alluminium box and EasyFit connectors and covered them with netting. The odd butterfly does somehow manage to find a way in but they mostly solved the yearly battle with them. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Janie Date: 19 Aug 11 - 11:01 PM Congrats on that garden bed Bobert! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Janie Date: 19 Aug 11 - 10:49 PM Handpicking of tomato hornworms is the best option if one has the time, and predator insects are a good back-up, but probably won't substitute for hand-picking. I agree, pdq, that bt should be used with discretion, but I don't read evidence that bt is the primary culprit for the decrease in butterfly populations over all. I'm not particularly well informed, though, and don't always know how to evaluate the research. Would appreciate links or leads to research that strongly supports your statement. I've never used bt, but that is mostly because I never got around to it. The moth larva that threaten most home garden crops are far from endangered species, and the application of bt by home gardeners is mostly likely to be done in a very selective manner, and only on targeted crop plants. I can certainly understand concern if bt is used in large commercial fields and applied in a manner that leads to widespread overspray onto non-commercial food plants for species such as the Monarch. I know there are concerns about the effects of bt corn on the Monarch population. The USDA cites research that indicates the pollen from bt corn does not get spread in sufficient concentration to threaten Monarchs, but I think the jury is still out on that because those studies are single issue studies, and do not take into account that when there are a number of factors contributing to the decline of a species, no single one of them may be individually significant, but taken all together, all of them are significant. There are also many different strains of bt that target different species in their larval stages. The only time I seriously considered using bt was when I was growing flowers for market, and considered treating my lawn with a strain to control japanese beetles. It didn't take much research to realize that unless everyone in the neighborhood did the same, I was wasting my time. I ended up using my roses (which really aren't a viable flower crop for a local farmer's market for many reasons,) as a trap crop, and focused on keeping the roses well-tended and well fed to produce lots of blooms from which I handpicked the beetles, minimizing damage to other, more prolific and more durable blooms, especially zinnias and dahlias. I have never had any significant problem with tomato hornworm. (Maybe, in part, because I live in tobacco country, and monoculture pest control practices to control tobacco horn worm have also reduced the tomato horn worm population.) Cabbage moth larva have always been the beasties I have had to combat. My veggie garden has usually been small enough that I could use row cover to protect plants from most of the damage. I suppose it comes down to this; the large scale use of any pesticide or herbicide in commercial practice can pose a significant environmental threat, regardless of whether the control is organic, natural, or not. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Bobert Date: 19 Aug 11 - 10:27 PM It is organic, Q... But being so it is also a bacteria and can make you very sick or, if not treated, can kill you... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Q (Frank Staplin) Date: 19 Aug 11 - 10:05 PM This fellow suggests dipel, which he says is organic. http://expectus.hubpages.com/hub/Tomato-Plant-Pest-Hornworm We don't seem to have hornworms, but only the most optimistic try to grow tomatoes here. Mostly a greenhouse effort here. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Bobert Date: 19 Aug 11 - 09:23 PM I won't use BTs again... Last time I did it I had a mask and still ended up with bacterial phenomena... BTW, I found that link interesting, maeve... We did find one with the wasp eggs all over it (maybe 50 or so) and those eggs were sucking so much out of the worm that it could no longer ravage the plant... The P-Vine knew they were wasp eggs so we left it alone... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: GUEST,Jon Date: 19 Aug 11 - 08:05 PM Just looked hornworm up. It's not something we have in the UK. Late blight is the thing I most dread over here. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: maeve Date: 19 Aug 11 - 07:52 PM I don't use it; we hand pick them. Bobert asked for information. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: pdq Date: 19 Aug 11 - 07:44 PM Please don't use Bacillus thuringiensis to control hornworms or any other insect. The spores of BT are carried into the environment and continue to kill our native species for generation after generation. We have lost 99% of the butterfly population in some area in the last 50 years, BT is the most obviouus culprit, even more responsible than habitat loss. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: maeve Date: 19 Aug 11 - 07:31 PM Bobert, try this link: http://organicgardening.about.com/od/pestcontrol/p/tomatohornworm.htm |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Bobert Date: 19 Aug 11 - 07:15 PM BTW, anyone know what to use for tomato horn worms that is organic??? Other than picking them off and throwing them in the pond, that is... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Bobert Date: 19 Aug 11 - 07:14 PM A big ol' ***HOOOO-RAYYY*** from here in "Win-git", NC... The P-VCine and I finished out first major bed... It has ferns, acubas, azaleas, sarcacocca, a nice boxwood vestigiata (columnal) and three of our large rocks from Virgina... It's about 60 X 20 and we've had help from the 18 year old boy who used to live here so the three of us spread 3 yards of mulch over it toady and raked in front of it and it looks great... One down... Whew... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: GUEST,Jon Date: 19 Aug 11 - 07:04 PM Greengage crumble today :-) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: GUEST,Jon Date: 19 Aug 11 - 05:28 AM Yep, the plums one was me. We've got a damson tree too and it's fruit are nearly ripe. The other plum, an Oulins gage didn't do anything but it was only planted last year and looks healthy so maybe next year. It is supposed to be a lot more reliable and heavier cropping than the "old" greengage type. Staying with trees. The pear tree has also done well as have most of the apples. Scrumptious is ready and the Bramley is about there. Our "unknown" is a bit of a disappointment in that for some reason the only section I can get to easily has not fruited. I'll still be able to pick some though and as usual will be juicing what we have, probably mid to late September. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Black belt caterpillar wrestler Date: 19 Aug 11 - 05:06 AM The foxes are starting to become a nuisance now. When I got out of bed this morning there was a noise from downstairs. I discovered that one of the local trio of growing cubs had nosed his way into the porch and knocked over a broom, which fell against the door trapping him inside. I had to unlock the inner door and slowly reach out and remove the offending obstruction so that the outer door could be opened for him to escape. He didn't seem to worried by my presence once he realised that he couldn't get out without help but he did knock over a couple of plant pots first! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: maeve Date: 18 Aug 11 - 07:22 PM The plums post would be from Jon. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: GUEST Date: 18 Aug 11 - 05:00 PM Picked the greengage tree yesterday. It's the first time we've harvested a crop from it (the fruit split one year and the tree has done nothing other years). Pip's made 12 1/2 pounds of jam and there's about the same again stewed up although she's still pondering about what to do with it. Victoria plum tree next. That's got rather more fruit than the greengage had. I think Pip will be sick of the sight of plums soon. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Q (Frank Staplin) Date: 18 Aug 11 - 03:10 PM Down to 5 C in Calgary a couple of nights ago, 1 C at Millerville 30 miles away and freezing in low-lying areas. Time to think about winter preparations. Jack rabbits (hares) are common in Calgary in winter. They may dig out shallow depressions in which to rest. Some people complain about this, but any damage in my yard has been minimal, usually a couple of spots near tree bases. In winter, they are white. They seem to subsist on the dead plant matter in winter, and I have not heard of them damaging dormant shrubs. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Black belt caterpillar wrestler Date: 18 Aug 11 - 03:15 AM I decided to try a new ploy to deter the rabbits. I've put up a black painted plywood cut-out of a dog on the lawn (it's informally been christened Nodrog in homage to John Kirkpatrick's "Nodrog's woofing waltz"). I've not had a rabbit on the lawn since, but we've also had a fox invasion so the results are inconclusive. Now I have to find a way to deter foxes! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Bobert Date: 14 Aug 11 - 12:32 PM I like the New Ginni (sp) impatiens... Plus, you can bring 'um in in the winter and have 'um all year 'round... We continue to get decent rain here in south-central North Carolina... Hope you're getting some, too, Janie... We're taking a few days off gardening because the P-Vine's sister is here to help unpack boxes and help the P-Vine in ordering me around... lol... They got the idea that all four of the bathroom faucet sets had to go and new ones put in... I've installed three and have one to go but it's tough on the back getting in those positions... BTW, I lost my "monkey puzzle" criptomeria but was lucky enough to find another at "clear 'um 'out" prices... Yeah... Love that plant... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Janie Date: 14 Aug 11 - 11:33 AM Had not heard of Amanda Marshall before, gnu. Thanks for the link. We got some of that beautiful rain yesterday also, and expecting more today. Major break in the temps with 2 days so far in the mid 80's. Sweet! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: gnu Date: 13 Aug 11 - 03:41 PM SRS.... GLAD to hear of your rain. Let it rain! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: GUEST,Jon Date: 13 Aug 11 - 02:26 PM Just eaten a greengage. The trees only fruited twice since we planted it and last time the fruit all split. They are OK this time. Will pick them and the Victoria plums tomorrow. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Stilly River Sage Date: 13 Aug 11 - 12:10 PM Today we have lovely, heavenly gentle rain. The first in months, and it has been raining for several hours. I am beside myself with gardening joy, even knowing that the smell of compost will meet me later as all of the dead stuff starts to rot. SRS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Janie Date: 12 Aug 11 - 07:12 PM It is a fact of gardening life that different colors of the same variety of a plant do not always perform equally well. You have not only learned something yourself, you have passed along that knowledge to the rest of us. Thankee kindly, gnu. And thanks, Jon. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: gnu Date: 12 Aug 11 - 06:44 PM Thanks Janie... but, the deal is the Burgundy, which I have had for years are doing the same as always. The "new" strains suck. It looks okay as I have a pattern that I plant them in in the front yard flower boxes... it looks as if "I meant to do that" but it just doesn't look as nice. And the hanging pot is a real disappointment as it's mid August and no blooms on the new strains. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Janie Date: 12 Aug 11 - 06:26 PM I dunno much about impatiens, gnu. I only planted the doubles once or twice and never did as well with them. Have trees grown so there is more or more dense shade? They like shade, but like bright shade and do need sufficient light. Are you having a cool summer? They like warm soil. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: GUEST,Jon Date: 12 Aug 11 - 06:23 PM That's our (UK) common ragwort, Janie. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Janie Date: 12 Aug 11 - 06:20 PM Is this it? Senecio jacobaea L.? on googling, I see references to this species on googling to horse poisoning in the UK. Doesn't grow in the southeast USA, according to the distribution map, but is found in the northeast, northwest, and Canada. Here, it's common name is apparently stinking willie in the east and tansy ragwort in the west. It is in the same genus as the assorted plants in these parts that are known as ragworts. Sounds like all of them have toxicity to some degree or another. (Some are used for cancer treatments.) Apparently livestock tend to avoid grazing it but once dried, the plants lose their unpalatable taste. The greatest risk to livestock, it seems, is when ragworts invade hay fields and get baled in with the hay. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Janie Date: 12 Aug 11 - 05:40 PM Bbcw, can you provide a latin name for the "ragwort?" I don't think it is the same plant, and possibly not the same family as what we call ragworts in the Eastern USA, but would like to check. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: gnu Date: 12 Aug 11 - 12:13 PM My double impatiens... bought a whack of em. The only ones that I bought that were the "same" as last year were the Burgundy. Thre others were all "new" varities which grew very slowly and were late to bloom. They are still only half the size of the Burgundy and a few are not blooming well. I always buy a three spares and put them in a hanging pot. The Burgundy is fine but the other are smaller abd STILL have not bloomed... what can I do to make them bloom? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Black belt caterpillar wrestler Date: 12 Aug 11 - 07:35 AM The local radio is raising concerns about the amount of ragwort (poisonous to cattle and horses) around in Lancashire. I pulled a plant up last week but can't see any more on our ground. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Sooz Date: 12 Aug 11 - 03:47 AM I have an amazing sunflower plant. One plant with 40 flowers - growing amongst my pink fir apple potatoes. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Stilly River Sage Date: 11 Aug 11 - 07:27 PM Yeah. The asparagus is still with me! :) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Bobert Date: 11 Aug 11 - 10:41 AM Yeah, watering grass is downright retarded... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Stilly River Sage Date: 11 Aug 11 - 10:28 AM So far I think I have all of the trees alive, but I've lost some major shrubs that had a long-standing presence in the yard. You drive down the street here and look up and see the tops of even the native wild-seeded trees brown, crisp from the bright sun and hot days. People need to stop pouring drinking water on grass. There are other things that are much harder and more expensive to replace, that are more critical to cooling our houses (trees) that should be watered, but ditch the turf. SRS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Bobert Date: 10 Aug 11 - 08:37 PM We're a 100 miles south of Janie but we have been fortunate in getting decent rain all summer... Knock on wood... We're still trying to get everything planted and beds created but at least have some help... The son of the guy we bought the house from works for us 6-8 hours a week... That is really helpful... We are also getting some veggies: zucchini, yellow squash, cukes and a few tomatoes... But it has been very hot & humid and we're not used to the humidity... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Janie Date: 10 Aug 11 - 08:25 PM The combination of heat and drought is proving deadly even to some well-established and drought tolerant plants. I've irrigated as much as I can afford, but have had to let some beds live or die on their own. Much as love my hydrangeas and Japanese anemones, I am seriously considering taking them out, and perhaps the ginger lilies also. The amount of water I have to put on the hydrangeas each week would probably be sufficient to keep two or three other beds going with enough water to survive, if not thrive, for 3 or 4 weeks. Even the day lilies are in dire straights. The drought is not nearly as prolonged or as yet severe as was the case a few years ago, but most zone 7 garden plants are not "built" for an entire late spring and summer of temps consistently in the mid-90's to low 100's. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: Stilly River Sage Date: 01 Aug 11 - 01:32 PM Get out the blow torch, maeve, and burn those suckers to the ground! My garden exists, but except for eggplant and cantaloupe, not much is producing. We're just hoping things survive till fall when it NORMALLY cools off and the garden produces another crop. Who knows this year. The last three weeks of "spring" were like the heart of summer, so who knows how long it will take for autumn to finally arrive. SRS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: maeve Date: 01 Aug 11 - 12:14 PM Update on Giant Hogweed: It's in Maine! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: maeve Date: 22 Jul 11 - 12:09 PM It's SO hot.... ...the ground in Portland is currently 130 F. ...the roosters have stopped crowing. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Gardeners report - 2011 From: gnu Date: 22 Jul 11 - 11:55 AM How hot is it? |
