Lyrics & Knowledge Personal Pages Record Shop Auction Links Radio & Media Kids Membership Help
The Mudcat Cafemuddy

Post to this Thread - Sort Descending - Printer Friendly - Home


Politically incorrect songs

TerBlacker 26 Jan 11 - 01:16 PM
MGM∑Lion 26 Jan 11 - 01:30 PM
Mark Ross 26 Jan 11 - 01:33 PM
Dave the Gnome 26 Jan 11 - 01:34 PM
Midchuck 26 Jan 11 - 02:05 PM
EBarnacle 26 Jan 11 - 02:37 PM
Mrrzy 26 Jan 11 - 02:43 PM
DebC 26 Jan 11 - 02:54 PM
GUEST 26 Jan 11 - 03:00 PM
John P 26 Jan 11 - 03:07 PM
TerBlacker 26 Jan 11 - 03:15 PM
GUEST,Alan Whittle 26 Jan 11 - 03:31 PM
fat B****rd 26 Jan 11 - 03:37 PM
fat B****rd 26 Jan 11 - 03:37 PM
TerBlacker 26 Jan 11 - 03:49 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 26 Jan 11 - 04:01 PM
Acorn4 26 Jan 11 - 04:17 PM
Mark Clark 26 Jan 11 - 04:35 PM
zozimus 26 Jan 11 - 07:21 PM
Leadfingers 26 Jan 11 - 07:39 PM
bobad 26 Jan 11 - 07:51 PM
Taconicus 26 Jan 11 - 07:52 PM
Taconicus 26 Jan 11 - 08:48 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 26 Jan 11 - 10:40 PM
Bert 26 Jan 11 - 11:11 PM
MGM∑Lion 27 Jan 11 - 12:56 AM
alanabit 27 Jan 11 - 02:34 AM
Gibb Sahib 27 Jan 11 - 03:46 AM
GUEST,BobL 27 Jan 11 - 04:55 AM
Paul Davenport 27 Jan 11 - 05:12 AM
GUEST,Desi C 27 Jan 11 - 07:34 AM
Marje 27 Jan 11 - 07:44 AM
MGM∑Lion 27 Jan 11 - 07:57 AM
GUEST,Peter Laban 27 Jan 11 - 08:18 AM
JJ 27 Jan 11 - 08:40 AM
John_Carrington 27 Jan 11 - 08:49 AM
Midchuck 27 Jan 11 - 09:12 AM
GUEST,John from Kemsing 27 Jan 11 - 09:30 AM
Taconicus 27 Jan 11 - 10:50 AM
GUEST,PeterC 27 Jan 11 - 11:11 AM
GUEST,Suibhne Astray 27 Jan 11 - 11:37 AM
Dave Sutherland 27 Jan 11 - 11:42 AM
GUEST,Alan Whittle 27 Jan 11 - 01:02 PM
TerBlacker 27 Jan 11 - 01:07 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 27 Jan 11 - 01:26 PM
Taconicus 27 Jan 11 - 02:04 PM
dick greenhaus 27 Jan 11 - 02:22 PM
DonMeixner 27 Jan 11 - 02:36 PM
Dave Sutherland 27 Jan 11 - 04:47 PM
Taconicus 27 Jan 11 - 06:07 PM
GUEST,Guest Betsy 27 Jan 11 - 08:11 PM
Diva 28 Jan 11 - 11:58 AM
GUEST 28 Jan 11 - 03:09 PM
fat B****rd 28 Jan 11 - 03:16 PM
Charmion 28 Jan 11 - 05:55 PM
TerBlacker 30 Jan 11 - 08:12 AM
Ed T 30 Jan 11 - 09:56 AM
GUEST,Doc John 30 Jan 11 - 02:24 PM
PHJim 30 Jan 11 - 04:02 PM
GUEST,Alan Whittle 30 Jan 11 - 04:22 PM
GUEST,H2O 30 Jan 11 - 10:35 PM
MorwenEdhelwen1 05 Jun 11 - 02:06 AM
MorwenEdhelwen1 05 Jun 11 - 03:52 AM
GUEST,MC Fat 05 Jun 11 - 06:41 AM
GUEST,Paul Burke 05 Jun 11 - 08:04 AM
GUEST,Suibhne Astray 05 Jun 11 - 08:22 AM
GUEST,Marianne S. 05 Jun 11 - 09:13 AM
GUEST,Suibhne Astray 05 Jun 11 - 12:56 PM
Musket 05 Jun 11 - 01:35 PM
Fred McCormick 05 Jun 11 - 03:30 PM
MGM∑Lion 05 Jun 11 - 03:45 PM
Fred McCormick 05 Jun 11 - 03:46 PM
MGM∑Lion 05 Jun 11 - 03:56 PM
MGM∑Lion 05 Jun 11 - 04:05 PM
MorwenEdhelwen1 05 Jun 11 - 05:32 PM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 05 Jun 11 - 06:47 PM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 05 Jun 11 - 07:05 PM
Fred McCormick 05 Jun 11 - 07:11 PM
Joe_F 05 Jun 11 - 08:20 PM
MorwenEdhelwen1 06 Jun 11 - 01:56 AM
SammySkillet 06 Jun 11 - 10:39 AM
GUEST,Gabe 06 Jun 11 - 11:18 AM
GUEST,Dave in Michigan 06 Jun 11 - 01:22 PM
GUEST,Tich 06 Jun 11 - 01:27 PM
Elmore 06 Jun 11 - 01:49 PM
GUEST,Dave in Michigan 06 Jun 11 - 02:39 PM
Jim McLean 06 Jun 11 - 03:15 PM
MorwenEdhelwen1 06 Jun 11 - 06:02 PM
GUEST,Coyote Breath, no cookie 06 Jun 11 - 10:36 PM
MGM∑Lion 07 Jun 11 - 03:37 AM
GUEST,Suibhne Astray 07 Jun 11 - 04:16 AM
Rob Naylor 07 Jun 11 - 04:46 AM
Bonnie Shaljean 07 Jun 11 - 04:48 AM
Bonnie Shaljean 07 Jun 11 - 07:56 AM
GUEST,Dave in Michigan 07 Jun 11 - 12:02 PM
Jim McLean 07 Jun 11 - 12:26 PM
GUEST,Tich 07 Jun 11 - 08:35 PM
HuwG 07 Jun 11 - 09:10 PM
Joe_F 07 Jun 11 - 09:19 PM
Jim McLean 08 Jun 11 - 04:06 AM
GUEST,Suibhne Astray 08 Jun 11 - 04:38 AM
MGM∑Lion 08 Jun 11 - 05:14 AM
MGM∑Lion 08 Jun 11 - 05:15 AM
Musket 08 Jun 11 - 06:04 AM
GUEST,Graham 10 Jan 13 - 01:06 PM
Stringsinger 10 Jan 13 - 02:27 PM
ollaimh 10 Jan 13 - 09:21 PM
ollaimh 10 Jan 13 - 09:32 PM
GUEST,Don Wise 11 Jan 13 - 03:32 AM
Tattie Bogle 11 Jan 13 - 04:46 AM
PHJim 11 Jan 13 - 08:50 PM
PHJim 11 Jan 13 - 08:59 PM
ollaimh 11 Jan 13 - 10:57 PM
Share Thread
more
Lyrics & Knowledge Search [Advanced]
DT  Forum
Sort (Forum) by:relevance date
DT Lyrics:






Subject: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: TerBlacker
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 01:16 PM

I am preparing a radio series about tolerance, intolerance and political incorrectness in music over the past 100 or so years. The kind of songs I have in mind are Don't Bite the Hand That's Feeding You (First World War), The Dumber They Come The Better I like 'em (1920s),Smoke That Cigarette (1940s), Teacher's Pet (1950s), He Hit Me, It Felt Like A Kiss (1960s), Jewish Princess (1970s) and so on.

Ideas anyone? The more obsure the better. Songs that are intentionally offensive interest me less than ones which have a sort of weird innocence of their time (eg Love is Like a Cigarette).


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: MGM∑Lion
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 01:30 PM

From the DT ~~
====
JOHNNY COME DOWN TO HILO

Never see de like since I been born
When a big buck nigger wid his sea boots on,
chorus:
Says: "Johnny come down to Hilo,...

From American Ballads and Folk Songs, Lomax
====

How much more Un-PC could you get? But I wonder how many more such will be found in the DT, as relics of less PC ages?

~Michael~


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: Mark Ross
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 01:33 PM

FIGHT FOR LIBERATION from Pat Sky's SONGS THAT MADE AMERICA FAMOUS. In fact the whole album was politically incorrect. I thought it should have been subtitled "Something to offend everybody."


Mark Ross


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 01:34 PM

'Farewell my lovely Nancy' contains the line

"Your pretty little hands couldn't handle our tackle"

Not sure what it means but is that the sort of thing?

:D


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: Midchuck
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 02:05 PM

I have read that there was an actual published pop song in the '20s or '30s, entitled "If the Man in the Moon was a Coon," but I've never heard it or seen the actual lyrics.

Peter


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: EBarnacle
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 02:37 PM

Maid of Amsterdam, when done in the unexpurgated version is sure to offend a large part of your audience.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: Mrrzy
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 02:43 PM

Mongoloid, he was a mongoloid...


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: DebC
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 02:54 PM

Gotta echoe my buddy Mark Ross's suggestion of Pat Sky's recording. A record store actually paid me $5 to get it out of the store about 25 years ago.

Debra Cowan


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 03:00 PM

Poster identified as Grishka
May I remind all of you what "political correctness" originally meant: using language to defend certain groups of persons against (alleged) discrimination, even at the expense of "ordinary" correctness, in order to win/keep them as political allies. The word "political" was used as a qualifier, analogous to "socialist" in "socialist freedom", "socialist competition", etc. Insulting ones alleged opponents such as "whiteys", perceived fascists/capitalists, or religious persons was considered perfectly PC.

Respectful and non-offensive language is quite a different thing. Sensitivity changes and depends on the historical context. We had lots of relevant threads (e.g. this one and this one).


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: John P
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 03:07 PM

You've Got Me on a String by Janis Ian

"If my man beats me, robs me blind,
Long as he don't leave me, I don't mind.
I would beg and I would crawl,
Though it does no good at all.
My man been gone so long,
And I keep holding on."


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: TerBlacker
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 03:15 PM

Great stuff. One of the wisest things said on thes thread is Guest's comment 'Sensitivity changes and depends on the historical context', Boy, is that true - we're not as evolved today as we like to think.

Midchuck: If The Man in the Moon Was a Coon was written in 1905 and sold THREE MILLION copies in sheet-music. I have the lyrics, as it happens. D'you want them? They're pretty shocking by today's standards.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Alan Whittle
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 03:31 PM

One lady took me to task at the Tolpuddle Festival last year, because she said my song George Joseph Smith trivialised violence to women. She told me i should never sing it again, and I was to count myself lucky she hadn't complained to the organisers of the event.

I can't tell you how much it has disturbed me. To be honest I am very lukewarm about singing my own songs ever since. You think - well maybe my time has passed. Perhaps I am an anachronism - singing songs with values that aren't acceptable any more - if they ever were!

http://www.bigalwhittle.co.uk/id22.html


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: fat B****rd
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 03:37 PM

"All Coons Look The Same To Me" 1899 USA by Arthur Collins (You Tube)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: fat B****rd
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 03:37 PM

Sorry, should be 'look alike'


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: TerBlacker
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 03:49 PM

Big Al, that's a great song, and the idea that there are some songs which should not be sung because someone somewhere might take offense is dangerous and repressive. Please continue to write songs that reflect the world as you see it.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 04:01 PM

If your radio show is about tolerance, respectful language and comparison of yesterday's and todays standards, of course some of your material should include songs that reflect that.
Your problem is with the attitude and intelligence of the station program manager.

Midchuck, there are dozens of 'coon' songs in collections on the internet. In books about popular music of the past 150 years, there will usually be chapters about coon songs. They can't be ignored; they are part of popular music history.

Enter 'coon' in Library of Congress, American Memory, music, and a list several pages long will appear (and this is a small part of those published).


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: Acorn4
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 04:17 PM

The Comedian Benny Hill wrote some very good comedy songs apart from the well known ones like "Ernie" - worth exploring his output. A bit of non politically correct seventies innocence.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: Mark Clark
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 04:35 PM

Merle Travis' Smoke, Smoke, Smoke that Cigarette is a humorous look at smokers but I'm not sure it's ever been politically incorrect. Merle had some that are, however. Consider: Fat Gal (Thom Bresh on YouTube) and maybe So Round, So Firm, So Fully Packed a tune composed of product slogans strung together.

      - Mark


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: zozimus
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 07:21 PM

The arguement above by Q, "they can't be ignored, they are part of popular music history" is a load of crap. Of course they can be ignored. The whole idea of becoming "politically correct" is to grow up and show respect for your fellow man, regardless of colour or creed. These songs were popular when it was acceptable to murder, rape, and torture slaves who were denied there civil rights, and were sung as if to justify in such abuses. "Popular music history " of that era is totally unpopular today


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Folklore: Politically incorrect songs
From: Leadfingers
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 07:39 PM

It is SO easy to offend SOME people - but I DO lke songs like Shel Silversteins Whisky and Women - Give me Old whisky and Young Women , every will be fine !
And Tucker Zimmerman's Handfull of Rain - "One man's woman is another man's pain in the ass"


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: bobad
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 07:51 PM

Frank Zappa "Bobby Brown Goes Down" on YouTube.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Taconicus
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 07:52 PM

Too bad you're not interested in songs that are intentionally offensive, because they're much easier to find: they include a large chunk of what has passed for "folk music" since the 1960s. Of course, the people who sing them usually don't think of them as offensive, just "factual" and or "speaking truth to power."

By innocently politically incorrect, do you want to include words that have changed meanings, such as the line from Pack up Your Troubles ("While you've a lucifer to light your fag")?

Then there's the Loo Song which as originally written I believe starts out, I was born in Arkansas, my mammy was a squaw.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: Lyr Add: SLAP HER DOWN AGAIN PAW (from A Godfrey)
From: Taconicus
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 08:48 PM

Oh wait, here's a good one:

SLAP 'ER DOWN AGAIN, PAW
As sung by Arthur Godfrey

Come here, gol-dern you!

Take that (*) and that (*) and that (* *)!

That's right...

CHORUS: Slap 'er down again, Pa; slap 'er down again.
Make 'er tell us more, Pa; tell us where she's been.
We don't want our neighbors talkin' 'bout our kin.
Slap 'er down again, Pa; slap 'er down again.

1. Well Pa and Ma were so dern sore they woke me up one night.
There was some awful cussin' and Ma said Pa was right.
They was awaitin' sister Bess who never kept her word.
The sun came up as Bess came in and this is what I heard:

CHORUS

2. Now poor old Bess got so dern mad she ran away one day
To meet that travelin' salesman with city-slickin' ways.
We ran and stood beside the road with shotguns by our side.
Me and Deke and Pa and Ma who yelled as they came by:

Why don't you... (CHORUS)

3. Now Ma and Pa, they planned for Bess to marry Deacon Brown
And not that travelin' salesman who always came around.
They made poor Bessie go to church; her face was mighty red.
The deacon took one look at her and this is what he said:

Oh... (CHORUS)

Doe-si-doe!

Boy that's hot stuff, ain't it?

4. Well, the moral of this story, girls, is don't stay out too late
Unless you take your shoes off outside your pappy's gate.
If Ma don't hear you comin' in, she won't lay down the law,
And you won't have to worry 'cause you won't sing out to Pa.

Oh... (CHORUS)

Take that (*) and that (*) and that (* *)!

[* = Sound of a slap.]


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 10:40 PM

There is a thread on "Slap her down again.... "

Ignoring our history is the province of the ignorant.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: Lyr Add: PAIN IN MY ASS (Billy Connolly)
From: Bert
Date: 26 Jan 11 - 11:11 PM

PAIN IN MY ASS
(Billy Connolly)

You're the dogend in my beer can
You're the stone in my left shoe
And when I think of great disasters
You know I always think of you
You're the snowdrift on my motorway
The snake in my grass
But most of all baby you're a pain in my ass

I took you out for dinner to a fancy restaurant
It took you half and hour to tell the waiter what you want
And when he brought the soup you let it fall down on your knee
And when he brought another one you spilled it over me

You're the dogend in my beer can
You're the stone in my left shoe
And when I think of great disasters
You know I always think of you
You're the snowdrift on my motorway
The snake in my grass
But most of all baby you're a pain in my ass

Oh I took you on an airplane and as we soared through the clouds
You scared all the other passengers when you said your prayers out loud
But the worst was still to come before we'd even touched the ground
As a present to the pilot you passed your hat around

You're the dogend in my beer can
You're the stone in my left shoe
And when I think of great disasters
You know I always think of you
You're the snowdrift on my motorway
The snake in my grass
But most of all baby you're a pain in my ass

You were an hour late for the wedding I thought you'd left me in the lurch
Oh you really shocked the guests there when you smoked your pipe in church
And in the middle of the service I was stunned to say the least
When you answered all the questions wrong and I got married to the priest

You're the dogend in my beer can
You're the stone in my left shoe
And when I think of great disasters
You know I always think of you
You're the snowdrift on my motorway
The snake in my grass
But most of all baby you're a pain in my ass


Sleepy Dumpling Music Ltd


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MGM∑Lion
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 12:56 AM

One needs also, in this context, to think of the singers, not just of the songs themselves: so that, e.g. 'Mammy' becomes non-PC when you think that Jolson will invariably have sung it IN BLACKFACE. Or 'Lily of Laguna' sung by that long-lasting English music-hall performer whom I recall well, G H Elliott, who performed under the sobriquet of 'The Chocolate-Coloured Coon' - which appears on his much revered gravestone, of which a picture can be found in Wikipedia: he recorded right up to 1960! And the Black & White Minstrels, one of most popular ever of British tv progs which ran also for years at the Victoria Palace Theatre, ran on telly for 20 years until 1978. These were of course all working in the tradition whereby a 1920s Punch cartoon would caption one of the speakers as "Nigger:"; which meant in context, not a black person, but a performer in an end-of-pier "minstrel" show.

All these were of course performing in the C19 US tradition established by Dan Emmett {'Dixie', founder of the 'minstrel show'}, Henry Clay Work {'Year of Jubilo': "Oh Darkies did you see the massa?"}, Stephen C Foster {passim; "I jumped on a nigger cos I thought he was a hoss"}.

No good, Zozimus, pretending these things didn't happen. One must learn to live with the knowledge; just as with the existence in their time of torture & hanging-drawing-quartering, almost incredible to our age ~~ till one looks at what still goes on in some parts of the world!

~Michael~


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: alanabit
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 02:34 AM

Originally the term "politically correct" was used as self-irony by people, who thought they might be sounding pompous. It took on its new meaning as a dogma after an article in the New Yorker at some time in the nineties, which posed the question, "Are you politically correct?"
Personally, probably like most people here, I loathe the casual use of words which carry the idea that some people are somehow less than human. Indeed, when I first read "Huckleberry Finn" at the age of eleven or twelve, it took me some time to realise that the word "Nigger" actually referred to some of my fellow human beings. The effect of recording that usage of the word however, caused me to think a lot about the context in which it was used. I believe that was Mark Twain's intent.
I can certainly make cultural errors and inadvertantly upset people. Most people though can tell the difference between a faux pas and a deliberately rude use of language. For this reason I can have a lot of fun with the sort of songs, which the original poster here is asking for. There is no catch all prescription, which will prevent people ever giving offence to others again, which is why I think the modern concept of "political correctness" is absurd. There will also be a number of people who seek to take offence at anything (like the woman mentioned by Big Al above). They deserve to be targets!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Gibb Sahib
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 03:46 AM

The Heptones (reggae group), "I've Got the Handle". Very charming song...romantic mood...but when you listen to the lyrics: awkward! I've seen all sorts of non-Jamaican boys and girls dancing to this song...I don't think the lyrics were registering with them:

"I've got the handle
You've got the blade
Don't try to fight me girl
Cause you'll need first aid"

It goes on to say "When I get up in the morning, fix me some orange/ When I come home in the evening, just put yourself to use"!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,BobL
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 04:55 AM

Please don't forget that the offensiveness of particular words changes over time. I myself can remember "nigger" and even "coon" being, in the UK at least, considered no more derogatory, or at least not *necessarily* so, than is "black" nowadays.

It works both ways: 100 years ago another name had to be found for Sharp's re-interpretation of the 17th-century country dance "Cuckolds All a Row".


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Paul Davenport
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 05:12 AM

No one seems to have commented on 'Little Sir Hugh'. (Child 155) Now I've heard this anti-semite song a lot recently just because it is so politically incorrect. The point that the modern singers make is that the song, the story of which was used to inflame hatred and which directly resulted in the deaths of a minority during the middle ages, is still highly relevant today. We live in a time where religious minorities in some parts of the world are balanced on a knife edge. Colin Cater sings a full rendition whilst Sam Lee just recorded a re-modelled version accompanied on the 'jew's harp'. (Is that politically incorrect?)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Desi C
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 07:34 AM

Given the original aims or 'political correctness' it surely has become the most corrupted and in itself one of the most socially abusive idioms ever to be forced upon us!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Marje
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 07:44 AM

From Michael, above: "Stephen C Foster {passim; "I jumped on a nigger cos I thought he was a hoss"}."

To be fair to Foster, I don't think that line (from Polly Wolly Doodle) can be attributed to him. He did use the word "nigger" but in his time it was no more derogatory than "negro" or "black", and I don't think he'd have indulged in the casual racism of the line quoted.

Marje


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MGM∑Lion
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 07:57 AM

Not sure, Marje: the point is that it is supposed to be a negro singing the words, so that there should be a sort of ironic 'disinfectant' effect. The attribution of the song appears to be disputed; but I remember when I was at school 30s-40s it was always taught as a Foster song. It has never till now occurred to me to query it. I find a children's site online which renders this verse as "I jumped upon a 'gator...". Hmmm!

~M~


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Peter Laban
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 08:18 AM

Jams N. Healy's 'Irish Ballands and Songs of the Sea', in a 1976 reprint gives the following verse for Haul away Joe heading the chapter about shanties:

Once I had an Irish girl
she was fat and lazy.
Now I have a nigger one,
she almost drives me crazy


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: JJ
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 08:40 AM

"It's Hard to Find a Barber When Caruso Comes to Town"

"St. Patrick's Day's a Bad Day for Coons"

"When Mose with his Nose Leads the Band"

This last is from a CD of recent years called "Jewface," which includes a number of like ditties.

You might even include the original lyrics to Irving Berlin's "Puttin' On the Ritz," which mock:

Spangled gowns upon the bevy
Of high browns from down the levee
All misfits


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: John_Carrington
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 08:49 AM

A lot of sea shanties about girls in blue dresses, here's one I sing that my wife wishes I didn't

There's a girl asleep with a blue dress on
She's waiting there for Uncle Tom

CH:
Shake her Johnny Shake her
Shake her and we'll wake her

This girl she did look up to me
For I have been ten months at sea

She's a Windward girl with a Windward style
For a dollar a time it's all worthwhile

So roust and shake her is the cry
This bloody topmast she must try

The big wind comes from the West 'nor West
This girl ain't gonna get no rest

So roust her up from down below
And haul away for your Uncle Jo

Wake up ye bitch and let us in
Wake up ye bitch we want some Gin

This girl she is a a high brown lass
A high brown lass in a flash blue dress

Roust her up be quick I say
And make your port and take your pay


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Midchuck
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 09:12 AM

Goin' down town and get me a line,
I'm gonna whup that woman 'till she change her mind...

Goin' down town and get me a rope,
I'm gonna whup that woman 'till she buzzard-lope...


- recorded by Tom Rush on one of his early albums - mid-sixties.

P.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,John from Kemsing
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 09:30 AM

Here`s one for the archives.
"A Merry, Merry Life"!

http://www.soundclick.com/johnhills


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Taconicus
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 10:50 AM

Re the discussion above about the use of the n-word (I can't even write it) in the time of Huckleberry Finn...

It's true that originally it wasn't used derogatorily, although by the time of Clemens it was derogatory, though not as much as today. On the contrary, originally it was a "polite" word used as a substitute for a word that was considered very derogatory, namely the work black. "Enlightened" gentry in the South, most of whom knew Latin, and others, adopted the Latin word niger, which means black, as a more polite word (just as a century later the Spanish word negro, which also means black, would be used as a polite substitute). The n-word is merely the English phonetic spelling of the Latin word niger, since in classical Latin the letter g is always pronounced hard, and the i in niger is short, hence the igg in the English spelling of the word, due to the rules of English phonics.

Interesting that an enlightened person of the 18'th Century might find our referring to human beings as blacks just as offensive as we find their having used the n-word back then, because we're ignorant of the temporal context. Also interesting that although using the totally unrelated word niggardly will get you called a racist, no one finds offensive the name of the African country Niger, though it means exactly the same thing and was named that for the same reason, because due to English phonics we pronounce it nigh-jer.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,PeterC
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 11:11 AM

There was a complaint on the Radio 3 bulletin boards after LJ broadcast Bob Copper singing "Good Ale" regarding the verse "and if me wife should me despise, its soon I'd give her two black eyes"

Of course none of us who have seen how Bob delivered those lines in person would think tiwce about it.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 11:37 AM

Big Al Whittle: a cunning master of his cunning craft who can embed a hook in your brain for the rest of the day after but a single listen!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Dave Sutherland
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 11:42 AM

There is the widely known traditional song "Ball o'Yarn" in which at no time does the young lady consent to having sex with the man telling the tale. However at one point prior to the act she does impart the information that on occasions she is willing to oblige her friends when they have sufficient funds.
So we all join in the chorus celebrating the rape of a prostitute.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Alan Whittle
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 01:02 PM

in the version of ball of twine I learned, as a mere slip of a boy (the boy being my father)

Oh then she gave her consent
And behind the fence we went
i promised her that I would do no harm


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: TerBlacker
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 01:07 PM

It's interesting that so many of these are have women and race as their targets. Are there un-PC songs about men, straight or gay? And can anyone think of songs that were considered shockingly incorrect in their day but are just fine now? I heard that Sandie Shaw's Girl Don't Come was banned, but I can't believe that's true.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 01:26 PM

This is about as 'politically incorrect' as they come...these days....(amazing we 'got' there!)


Sung by Lisa Kelly

...and other friends...

GfS


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Taconicus
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 02:04 PM

How about the one that has the chorus...
Some men like the ladies,
Some men like the boys,
My love's warm and beautiful,
And makes the baaaain' noise.
I figure it must be a Welsh folksong. ;-)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 02:22 PM

Chck DigiTrad for such gems as "The Pickled Jew" and "Sambo's Right to be Kilt"
Look...if you want to conform to today's sensibilities, maybe folk music isn't the place for you.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: DonMeixner
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 02:36 PM

The Waxie's Dargle probably falls in to this list.

Whether a song is politically correct or not doesn't fit into my consideration when I choose a song. Whether or not I can survive the singing of it does.

Don


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Dave Sutherland
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 04:47 PM

From a gentleman like yourself Al I wouldn't expect anything less. However the version(s) that I know go:-

"Oh no kind sir she said we are strangers you and I,
While to other girls you may possess some charm,
Myself I've friends at home and when they've money bright in store,
It is then I let them wind my ball o' yarn.

I put my arm around her waist and I gently laid her down,
I didn't mean to do her any harm,
As the blackbird and the thrush they cried out from in the bush,
Keep your hand upon your little ball o'yarn"

No sign of consent there


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Taconicus
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 06:07 PM

Alas for her, Dave. Ball of yarn indeed!
Come all you fair and ladies young and fair,
All you who flourish in your prime,
Beware, take care, and keep your garden fair.
Let no man steal away your thyme,


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Guest Betsy
Date: 27 Jan 11 - 08:11 PM

Fuck 'em all - sing what must be sung !!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Diva
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 11:58 AM

Anything from Burns' The Merry Muses


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 03:09 PM

This is my first Mudcat thread and I've been amazed by the erudition and knowledge - thanks so much for the ideas. One thing ios clear - this topis is definitely worth a couple of radio programmes.

I disagree fundamentally with Zozimus. Knowing about the prejudice of the past isn't condoning it. In fact, the more we know about musical - or any other - history, the less likely we are to make the same mistakes. Repression of knowledge and thought is always dangerous.

My wincingly un-PC songs of the moment are Dave van Ronk's Talkin' Cancer Blues and that old bluegrass/gospel favourite Jesus Hits Like an Atom Bomb.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: fat B****rd
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 03:16 PM

"If you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife. Go for my personal point of view, pick an ugly girl to marry you" Jimmy Soul


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: Lyr Add: SISTER JENNY'S TURN TO THROW THE BOMB
From: Charmion
Date: 28 Jan 11 - 05:55 PM

A ditty I learned from my mother, politically incorrect in quite a different way:

In an anarchistic garret, so lowly and so mean,
Smell the pungent odor of nitroglycerine;
They're busy twisting fuses and filling cans with nails
While the little Slavic children send up their mournful wail:
(Chorus)
It's Sister Jenny's turn to throw the bomb!
The last one it was thrown by Brother Tom,
Mother's aim is bad, and the copskis all know Dad,
So it's Sister Jenny's turn to throw the bomb.

Sister Jenny took the bomb and started off.
Mother said, "Remember dear, go blow up Tempelhof."
And so the party waited, in the darkness and the rain,
While the little Slavic children sent up their sad refrain:
(Chorus)
Oh, it's Cousin Ivan's turn to throw the bomb,
'Cause Sister Jenny's planning went all wrong!
Mother's aim is bad and the copskis all know Dad,
So it's Cousin Ivan's turn to throw the bomb!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: TerBlacker
Date: 30 Jan 11 - 08:12 AM

Taconicus, d'you the title of that touching sheep love-song?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: Lyr Add: SQUAWS ALONG THE YUKON (Hank Thompson)
From: Ed T
Date: 30 Jan 11 - 09:56 AM

""The squaws along the Yukon are good enough for me""?

Squaws Along The Yukon
Hank Thompson

There's a salmon-colored girl who sets my heart awhirl
Who lives along the Yukon far away
Where the Northern Lights they shine she rubs her nose to mine
She cuddles close and I can hear her say

Ooga ooga mooska which means that I love you
If you'll be my baby I'll ooga ooga mooska you
Then I take her hand in mine and set her on my knee
The squaws along the Yukon are good enough for me

She makes her underwear from hides of grizzly bear
And bathes in ice cold water every day
Her skin I love to touch but I just can't touch it much
Because her fur lined parka's in the way
Ooga ooga mooska...
[ guitar ]
She has the Air Corps down the Sourdoughs hang around
Chechakos try to date her night and day
With a landing gear that's fine and a fuselage divine
And a smile that you can see a mile away
Ooga ooga mooska...
Carry me back to old Alaska
The squaws along the Yukon are good enough for me


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Doc John
Date: 30 Jan 11 - 02:24 PM

As has been alluded to above on several occasions, what is considered offensive now was not necessarily considered offensive in the past; we might also assume that what is considered quite innocuous at the moment, may very well be considered offensive in the future. A good reason as any for not applying the blue pencil but just accepting what was or we'll receive a very skewed version of history. I remember from childhood 'black' being an offensive term while 'negro' was considered a polite reference to race.
Work, by the way, was against slavery and used the dialect in his songs which he heard the slaves using so considered it quite proper.
I don't know about non pc songs but how's this for a non pc singer:
'Trench Blues' sung by John 'Big Nig' Bray, recorded for the Library of Congress.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: PHJim
Date: 30 Jan 11 - 04:02 PM

Has anyone mentioned Money For Nothing?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Alan Whittle
Date: 30 Jan 11 - 04:22 PM

Well i can't get much worked up about Knopfler. He does pretty well. If anyone seriously considers him to be racist or sexist - it just shows how out of touch they are. His personality and good works are well known.

What really bugs me is my own songs being censored. i think the thing that really really pisses me off, is people getting worked up and wantiong to ban me - so as not to offend a third party - some unknown person, who hasn't as yet said a dicky bird.

I had this trouble with my song 'The Day Delaney's Donkey had Sex with The Pope.' - which I can't recollect offending any Roman Catholics - but several times I have been told that it might offend catholics,


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,H2O
Date: 30 Jan 11 - 10:35 PM

anything by Dick Twang Band http://dicktwang.com


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 02:06 AM

"Cat O"Nine Tails", a calypso by Lord Invader (an update of his 1946 "Old-Time Cat O'Nine") advocates the beating of juvenile delinquents.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: Lyr Add: CAT-O- NINE TAILS (Lord Invader)
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 03:52 AM

Cut and pasted from the "Old-Time Cat o' Nine" thread:

CAT-O-NINE TAILS
(Lord Invader)


The only thing to stop those Teddy Boys,
From causing panic in Great Britain,
The only thing to stop those hooligans,
From causing panic in England,
Well I hope that the Government,
See they need another kind of punishment,
I say one thing to cool down this crime,
Is to bring back the old time cat-o-nine.

CHORUS:
So the old time cat-o-nine beat them bad,
And they bound to change their mind,
Is to send them to Dartmoor with licks like fire,
And they bound to surrender.

In the days of Judge Hitchins, as you know,
Nothing never happen so,
Any man pass under his hand,
Can tell you of the rod of correction,
He used to treat them meek and mild,
He never spare the rod to spoil the child,
I say one thing to cool down this crime,
Is to bring back the old time cat-o-nine.

CHORUS:
So the old time cat-o-nine, bring it back,
And they bound to change their mind,
is to send them Dartmoor with licks like fire,
And they bound to surrender.

The police is working harder and harder,
To see this thing go no further,
Every night they on duty,
To safeguard us from violence and robbery,
But they would not stop at all,
Peter is going to pay for Paul,
I say the cat is the only time bomb to drop,
And this "Robustness" must stop

CHORUS:
So the old time cat-o-nine, lash them hard,
And they bound change their mind,
send them Dartmoor with licks like fire,
And they bound to surrender.

You see that 'though these Teddy Boys haven't got no reason,
Attacking innocent people,
Every night they walking about in a band,
With a razor in their hand,
But the judge and the juries, can settle this thing easily,
I say one thing to cool down this crime,
Just beat them with the old time cat-o-nine.

CHORUS:
So the old time cat-o-nine, beat them bad,
And they bound change their mind,
is to send them to Dartmoor with licks like fire,
And they bound to surrender.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,MC Fat
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 06:41 AM

No one has mentioned the great Kinky Friedman with such classics as 'They Aint Making Jews Like Jesus Anymore' or 'Get Your Bicuits in the Oven and Your Buns in my Bed'


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Paul Burke
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 08:04 AM

Leon Rosselson's "Vile Violation", written about the Russians squealing about the U-2 incident in 1960, is not sung much these days, pehaps because of its sustained metaphor of rape:

As I flew out one morning on a trip to reconnointre
Through wind and weather carelessly I flew,
I spied a pleasing prospect that tempted me to loiter,
And moved in closer for a better view.

It's a vile violation of my airspace,
And I warn the intruder to withdraw,
It's a vile violation of my airspace,
Such aggrssive acts can only lead to war.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 08:22 AM

I've got no problem with old songs of poaching, whaling etc. BUT any racism, sexual violence, or homophobia I will not sing, sing along with or tolerate in any context. Murder Ballads - for sure, but it's the insidious nature of racism and homophobia in folk that particularly that annoy me, likewise the anti-PC line. And still you get random Morris Dancers backening their faces in the name of some non-existent Tradition, as if that's any excuse.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Marianne S.
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 09:13 AM

Non-existant tradition? You mean the long established tradition of disguising your identity with the only substances at hand - burnt cork or boot polish?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 12:56 PM

That's right, Marianne - a non-existent piece of fakeloric fantasising by which such noxious endeavours are first revived, re-invented, perpetuated and justified (excused) thereafter as being Traditional in the sort of terms you use above. Replace Tradition with fakeloric folk fashion and you're nearer the mark.

I love Morris Dancing, but it's not a Tradition - it's a re-invented minority hobbyist past-time like Folk Singing which comes complete with its own mythology and orthodoxy. I see blokes (and women) with blacked up faces and I realise why the BNP love folk so much.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Musket
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 01:35 PM

A couple of Bernard Wrigley songs spring to mind as fitting this thread. I used to sing them both, although for the life of me I can't remember all the words now.

You're the Teabag in my Coffee

My Dear Own Yorkshire Lass

Both are from the album featuring "Robin Hood and the Bogey Rolling Contest."

"Her bust is a good hundred inches, the same as her lovely round hips,
But if she gets on top when we get into bed, I'll come through the mattress like chips."

etc


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 03:30 PM

There's an anti-racist song from the 1920s (I think) which, by modern standards at any rate has an unintentionally non-pc title. It's called Picaninny Rose.

There's also a song from a somewhat earlier era called Lydia The Tattooed Lady.

Again, there's a song, the title of which I can't bring to mind at the moment, about a bloke who courted a very fat woman. She was so fat in fact that when they had sex he had to take a tape measure and leave chalkmarks so that he could find his way back. It had something along the lines of "one day while I was a-chalking and a-measuring, I met a guy with a piece of chalk coming around the other side".

Those three are non-malicious and to me are still reasonably acceptable, with a pinch of salt. However, the American country music industry had a very distasteful arm which peddled all kinds of racist muck, and which stretched way back to the earliest days of country music recording. For instance, there was a character who called himself Johnny Rebel who had quite a career in the 1960s with songs like "Nigger Hating Me" and "Some Niggers Never Die (They Just Smell That Way)". I am also reliably informed, although I've never come across it, that there was one from a bit further back called "All Coons Look The Same To Me".

Finally, there was an appalling stinker, which originated in 1950s/60s Britain, which parodied Island In The Sun, and which consisted of attacks on black immigrants.

If you're thinking of using anything like those, for God's sake hang a big disclaimer over it.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MGM∑Lion
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 03:45 PM

Lydia The Tattooed Lady in fact 1st appeared in At The Circus, 1939, sung by Groucho Marx. See Wikipedia entry. A witty song by Yip Harburg & Harold Arlen, not particularly un-PC to my recollection.

~M~


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 03:46 PM

Here's another one. The calypso singer Lord Invader recorded a song called Old Time Cat o' Nine, in 1945 (I think) about an upsurge of violent gangs which had proliferated in Trinidad some years earlier.

Another calypso singer, I can't remember who, recorded a cover version of the same song in 1950s' London, this time about the teddy boys and flick knife gangs of that period of British history.

Both recordings had the same theme. Bring back the cat of nine tails and order will be restored (I don't think!). But both were sung in typical upbeat calypso style, so that the effect is not just bizarre. It's positively weird.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MGM∑Lion
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 03:56 PM

Glancing again thru this thread, I am reminded that when I was at school in N London in the mid-1940s, the school choir was invited to sing on the BBC Home Service's programme for schools, Singing Together [about which I seem to remember a thread running not long since]. They sang folksongs like Turpin Hero & so on ~~ & among them, I recall, without any sort of comment or self-consciousness, Johnny Go Down To Hilo, in precisely that version about who was wearing the seaboots which I quoted above from DT, as first response on this thread to the OP...

Couldn't happen now, I daresay,

~M~


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MGM∑Lion
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 04:05 PM

Re ~ Old Cat o'Nine: I don't think the later version was exactly a cover, Fred, but a reworking by the original singer Lord Invader. You will find it already on this thread about 9 before your last post, repro'd from her previous thread by the young Chinese-Australian woman who recently OP'd & maintained a thread on the song, its history, the seriousness or ambivalence of its attitudes, &c. Did you not follow that?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 05:32 PM

I am the OP of the "Cat O'Nine Tails" thread, and i hate to admit it but whenever I so much as listen to that song, I start singing along. A classic case of "you don't have to believe what you sing."


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: Lyr Add: TRUE BRIT
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 06:47 PM

If I may put forward something of my own, the following is my totally unPC upset the whole audience song.

If it is of interest, I will record it and supply an MP3 of the words and music.

TRUE BRIT.

The almighty set out with the best of goodwill,
Mankind, in his image, to make,
And, with the result, he'd be satisfied still,
Had he not made one minor mistake.
        
Four races there were, with peculiar traits,
They're the reason why God rarely smiles,
He put them together, well out of the way,
In a place that he called British Isles.

Now, complete isolation has had it's effect,
If you look at them now, you will find,
That, apart from the fact that they all walk erect,
They're different from most of mankind.

The Welsh all have voices, most certain to please,
At song, the perennial purists,
At Chapel, on Sunday, they pray on their knees,
And on weekdays, they prey on the tourists.

The Scots all wear skirts, and their knees turn bright blue,
In cold weather, their lives must be drab,
But they all keep the Sabbath, they keep the faith too,
And anything else they can grab.

The Irish back horses, drink Guinness and such,
Till they're drunk, and they never regret it,
They don't know what they want, but that don't matter much,
They'll still fight like the devil to get it.

The Englishman, always, must lead the parade,
His self confidence beggars belief,
When he says "I'm successful because I'm self made",
God heaves a great sigh of relief.

Now you might think that God had a very bad day,
And after this lapse of attention
it seems that the whole thing went further downhill,
'Cos next he created the Frenchman.



” Don Thompson   Oct 1988


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 07:05 PM

Actually, the tune is that old favourite Abdul the Bul Bul Emir.

I've never actually had a complaint from any audience member when I've sung that, though I have to admit I can't recall anybody who sounded or appeared French on those occasions.

Don T.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 07:11 PM

Re the Cat O' Nine. Sorry folks. I hadn't seen the earlier correspondence relating to this song.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Joe_F
Date: 05 Jun 11 - 08:20 PM

A fair number of bawdy songs are overtly sadistic -- e.g., The (Big Red) Wheel & a lot of the versions in the rugby tradition.

I suppose Stan Rogers's "The Idiot" might be taken as politically incorrect, or at least right-wing (man forsakes God's country to get a job rather than go on the dole at home).


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 06 Jun 11 - 01:56 AM

Fred, here it is: http://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=137757.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: SammySkillet
Date: 06 Jun 11 - 10:39 AM

Sing Song Girl

my sing song girl
my little yellow cinderella
could there ever be a chinamans chance for me...

my sing song girl
all though i know you'd pull a feller
you wouldnt do a thing like that to young sam lee..

sometimes sing song lady
puff a little smoke and sleep
i come fetch her up lately
and to my shop well creep

and youll be mine
ill bet you all the tea in china
sing a little love song sing song girl for me...


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Gabe
Date: 06 Jun 11 - 11:18 AM

How About "Slap Her Down Again Paw". This tune was performed by Arthur Godfrey and I believe, Tennessee Ernie Ford.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Dave in Michigan
Date: 06 Jun 11 - 01:22 PM

"The British, the British, the British are Best! I wouldn't give tuppence for all of the rest" - Flanders and Swann

but at least, that was intended as a joke.

More disturbing, in several senses of the word is the song "Fanny Blair", which states that it's about a man condemned to death because of a false accusation of rape. I'm mostly interested in it for its tune, which is very unusual. In the past decade, I've had several people tell me that they consider it too politically incorrect to be sung (and FWIW, I was asking them about the song, not singing it myself). Funny, but the young woman I learned it from several decades ago considered herself very progressive, and had no problem with it.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Tich
Date: 06 Jun 11 - 01:27 PM

The song which has caused me most trouble over the last few years is certainly Crawford Howard's parody on Bogle's "No Man's Land". Some folk don't see that it's a hit at bad singers and take it at face value.
I gave up singing it after several threats of violence. I don't know if anyone has been brave enough to record it. Of course, if you want to upset some people in parts of Ireland or Scotland "God Save The Queen" is a sure thing.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Elmore
Date: 06 Jun 11 - 01:49 PM

I really like " Dublin, in the Rare Old Times" but cringe when I hear the verse, " I lost her to a student chap with skin as black as coal, When he took her off to Birmingham, He took away my soul. I've read some convincing justifications for the verse, but it still troubles me.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Dave in Michigan
Date: 06 Jun 11 - 02:39 PM

[Aargh! Mustn't hit Enter in From: box, or it posts an empty message!]

I imagine that the line in Dick Darby the Cobbler:

My wife, she's the Devil, she's black

is nowadays taken to refer to a historically-disadvantage minority group :-) instead of to the black (-haired) Irish ...

[How do I know that this really refers to hair color? Well, I don't for certain, but it seems a close analog of expressions like "The Yellow Tinker" (a tune title), which I don't think refers to tinkers of Eastern Ancestry, because of phrases like "the yellow- headed tinkers with their wares" in Tommy Makem's "Rambles of Spring". Of course both the words "tinker" and "oriental" (my original choice to describe the tinkers' non-ancestry) are themselves considered politically incorrect.]


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Jim McLean
Date: 06 Jun 11 - 03:15 PM

Dave in Michigan, the Flanders and Swan song is "The English, the English, the English are the best", do you know the difference?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 06 Jun 11 - 06:02 PM

Gabe, someone already posted "Slap Her Down Again, Paw". There is also a thread on that song.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Coyote Breath, no cookie
Date: 06 Jun 11 - 10:36 PM

Roy Berkeley is purported to be responsible for a very funny broadside (of sorts) Called "The Bosses' Songbook - songs to stifle the flames of discontent" Which has Fight for Liberation in it as well as a nasty swipe at a fellow called 'Pete'. Its a parody of course, of the IWW's "Little Red Songbook - songs to fan the flames of discontent" which has a great anit-war poem (song) called 'The Red Feast'. I sang it at anti-war and anti-nuke rallies back in the 60's. It is uncompromising and people are usually surprised that it was written to protest Labor's involvement in WWI!

"Prohibition is a Failure" had racist elements in it. The verse; "I'm going down to Georgia to join the drinking clan" was actually "I'm going down to Georgia to join the Ku Klux Klan" and it wasn't "a man's killed every night" in that same verse either.

But the purpose of such music usually isn't to promote racism. The music is a reflection of the racism of the times.

We think that we are evolving away from such attitudes but I don't think it is anywhere as fast as it could be much less as it should be.

Here in the St.Louis area, the local media dwell long on crimes committed in the black community. Yes it IS news and it is important that the people of that community be made aware of events that might jeopardize their safety and security but outside of St. Louis, where I live, a mere 65 - 70 miles the effect is to frighten people whose local culture doesn't include drive-by mayhem. I hear people say they wouldn't go to St. Louis because it is too dangerous.

The other day I made a comment about something that had gone well by saying "just like downtown" and one fellow said "yeah but not as many XXXXXXs"

While I fear that we are never going to abandon our racist attitudes, I hope that we can at least repress the urge to utter them.

Your program idea is a good one. The best of luck producing it. I would like to hear it, or at least bits if not all of it. Would you be able to provide a link?

CB


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MGM∑Lion
Date: 07 Jun 11 - 03:37 AM

Don't recall any mentions above of The Old Maid In A Garret; the only song BTW directly mentioned in her mature work by that greatest, but probably least folky, of novelists Jane Austen, who has a character in Northanger Abbey mention "the old song about one wedding bringing on another".

~Michael~

Much greater by the way than that boring fool V S Naipaul who recently had the gall vaingloriously to exalt himself above her as a novelist. Cheeky ass!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 07 Jun 11 - 04:16 AM

I recently sang Lord Thomas and Fair Eleander in a folk club and was questioned by an Asian couple as to what was meant by The Brown Girl. For non-racial precedence I sang them a verse from Buy Broom Buzzems : "..be she green or grey, be she brown or fair, let her be a woman and I shall seek nar mair.."

Rude songs I have no problem with at all; I have a book of Bawdy Music Hall ballads some of which are so deliciously fithy I could never imagine singing them to any Folk Audience no matter now proudly non-PC they might proclaim themselves. Enough, indeed, to make even a Blacked-Up Morris Dancer blush.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Rob Naylor
Date: 07 Jun 11 - 04:46 AM

The Levellers' "Another Man's Cause" has twice, to my knowledge, caused people to either walk out of a pub or heckle the singer:

Gunshots shatter in the peace of night
It's just another fire fight
For the people of this little town
But for the dying soldier
Well he's feeling ten years older
As he's lying face down on the ground
All the words that are in his head
And all the words his mother said
As she would put him to bed back home

Your daddy well he died in the Falklands
Fighting for another man's cause
And your brother he was killed in the Last War
And your mother well she's lying home alone

Every day she sees your face
On the picture on the fireplace
With your brother as he was leaving school
Then a day came five years ago
You said, "Mother, I need to know"
And you spoke the words your brother spoke before
"I seen the things my Daddy done
And I've seen the medals that he won
And I know that this is what he would have wanted for me."

But, your daddy well he died in the Falklands
Fighting for another man's cause
And your brother he was killed in the Last War
And your mother well she's lying home alone

Now she wonders at it all
Just in his name to be brave and heroes fall
And how many more are going to answer that call
They're going to fight and die in another country's war
They're going die for a religion they don't believe in at all
They're die in a place they should never been at all
Oh, never been at all

Cos, your daddy well he died in the Falklands
Fighting for another man's cause
And your brother he was killed in the Last War
And your mother well she's lying home alone

And your daddy well he died in the Falklands
Fighting for another man's cause
And your brother he was killed in the Last War
And your mother well she's lying home alone


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 07 Jun 11 - 04:48 AM

There's an old American song called "Mr. Banjo" which used to get anthologised in those your-favourite-golden-fireside-songs sort of books, with a nice bouncy melody but truly regrettable words. All about an uppity mulatto who is criticised for getting above himself by dressing in fashionable clothes.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 07 Jun 11 - 07:56 AM

Hadn't even thought about this song since school, but it occurs to me that - if memory serves - its entire theme is to ridicule the banjo player for his fine clothes, which the narrator doesn't think he deserves. Not a word about his music, though that's the only thing actually happening in this song, and he's probably a far more skillful player than whoever's listening (if anyone is).

It's all the more pernicious because it's told in a first-person present-tense style ("See the mulatto playing the banjo, doesn't he put on airs?") which invites "us" to join in the denigration of "him". A real alienation tactic. And devaluing or denying what he has to offer - his music - by not mentioning it. Probably not even noticing it. This sort of subtletly can pack more of a wallop that outright insults and nasty names because it can sneak past the brain-censors the first time around.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Dave in Michigan
Date: 07 Jun 11 - 12:02 PM

Jom (McLean) -

Yes, I know the difference - I just can't remember (and don't sing) the song :-)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Jim McLean
Date: 07 Jun 11 - 12:26 PM

Here are words to remind you, Dave.


The English, the English, the English are best
I wouldn't give tuppence for all of the rest.

The rottenest bits of these islands of ours
We've left in the hands of three unfriendly powers
Examine the Irishman, Welshman or Scot
You'll find he's a stinker, as likely as not.

Och aye, awa' wi' yon Edinburgh Festival

The Scotsman is mean, as we're all well aware
And bony and blotchy and covered with hair
He eats salty porridge, he works all the day
And he hasn't got bishops to show him the way!

The English, the English, the English are best
I wouldn't give tuppence for all of the rest.

Ah hit me old mother over the head with a shillelagh

The Irishman now out contempt is beneath
He sleeps in his boots and he lies through his teeth
He blows up policemen, or so I have heard
And blames it on Cromwell and William the Third!

The English are noble, the English are nice,
And worth any other at double the price

Ah, iechyd da

The Welshman's dishonest and cheats when he can
And little and dark, more like monkey than man
He works underground with a lamp in his hat
And he sings far too loud, far too often, and flat!

And crossing the Channel, one cannot say much
Of French and the Spanish, the Danish or Dutch
The Germans are German, the Russians are red,
And the Greeks and Italians eat garlic in bed!

The English are moral, the English are good
And clever and modest and misunderstood.

And all the world over, each nation's the same
They've simply no notion of playing the game
They argue with umpires, they cheer when they've won
And they practice beforehand which ruins the fun!

The English, the English, the English are best
So up with the English and down with the rest.

It's not that they're wicked or natuarally bad
It's knowing they're foreign that makes them so mad!

For the English are all that a nation should be,
And the flower of the English are Donald (Michael)
Donald (Michael) and Me!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Tich
Date: 07 Jun 11 - 08:35 PM

Then there was the time I was playing in a lovely wee Civic Theatre in Spain. In the front row were local dignitaries, fiesta queen etc. On came the local ex-pat choir who proceeded to sing "The Spaniard Who Blighted My Life". Hi Jim Howzitgaun. Tich


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: HuwG
Date: 07 Jun 11 - 09:10 PM

A favourite at a session I regularly attend: Big Bill Broonzy's "She's a heavy, heavy woman!"


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Joe_F
Date: 07 Jun 11 - 09:19 PM

GUEST,Suibhne Astray says:

> I recently sang Lord Thomas and Fair Eleander in a folk club and was
> questioned by an Asian couple as to what was meant by The Brown
> Girl. For non-racial precedence I sang them a verse from Buy Broom
> Buzzems : "..be she green or grey, be she brown or fair, let her be
> a woman and I shall seek nar mair.."

It would be anachronistic to call it racism, but clearly, in the sexual esthetic of the Child ballads, pale skin is highly prized in both sexes. When transplanted to racially mixed societies, such songs inevitably take on a racial tinge. Within my lifetime, in America, the phrase "lily-white", which occurs often in the ballads, was commonly applied to occupations, organizations, etc., to mean "rigidly excluding blacks".

In Chapter Two of Jean Ritchie's marvelous autobiography _Singing Family of the Cumberlands_, we hear her family singing "Fair Ellender" and seducing little Jean into fantasy. Then in Chapter Ten we see her, on Christmas Day, lose her temper at her grandmother for putting a brown doll in her stocking & thus giving her mean brother Willmer a chance to tease her for getting a "nigger doll". Get the book & read the rest of the story; I can't even think of it without crying. It is a good reminder, to us non- & anti-Christians, that Christianity, particularly in America, has done a Godly service in helping to demoralize racism.

--- Joe Fineman    joe_f@verizon.net

||: The business of politicians is not leadership but    :||
||: compromise. Leadership is the business of martyrs. :||


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Jim McLean
Date: 08 Jun 11 - 04:06 AM

I especially like to hear a crowd of Scottish football/rugby players singing in an English pub 'And send them homewards, tae think again'.
Hi Tich, did you know I sent the master of The Bitter Withy LP to Lesley about a year before she passed away. She never ackowledged receipt.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 08 Jun 11 - 04:38 AM

In any case BROWN in the context of the Fair Eleander ballad is a reference to COLOURING and not ETHNICITY. How Americans choose interpret that is another matter; and a lot of right-wing red-neck racists are also passionate Christians...


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MGM∑Lion
Date: 08 Jun 11 - 05:14 AM

Possibly also worth noting that in US that ballad, Child #73, is usually called The Brown Girl, rather than Lord Thomas And Fair Annet/Elinor, even though this can cause great confusion as there is another Child Ballad, #295, which is called The Brown Girl. Why, I have often wondered, will they do that?

~M~


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: MGM∑Lion
Date: 08 Jun 11 - 05:15 AM

[Please disregard the apeshit underlining


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Musket
Date: 08 Jun 11 - 06:04 AM

I had another rattling in my head earlier but couldn't pin it down. I remember it now, but don't get too excited, it isn't that bad, although I would love to sing it when the ethnic skirt brigade are out in force.. (Politically incorrect thought too....)

As a lad I had "Big Bad John" by Jimmy Dean as a single. I used to play the B side a lot too.. "I won't go hunting with you Jake, but I'll go chasing women."


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Graham
Date: 10 Jan 13 - 01:06 PM

Huggin' & Chalkin' is by Hoagie Charmichael, & Lydia the Tattoed Lady is Groucho Marx. Viva political incorrectness. As Bette Midler said after singing 'Hitler has only got one ball ...'etc to a Berlin audience: Fuck 'em if they can't take a joke!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Stringsinger
Date: 10 Jan 13 - 02:27 PM

Don't forget Tom Lehrer's "Folk Song Army".


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: ollaimh
Date: 10 Jan 13 - 09:21 PM

dear al whitle, i can't imagine any one being offended by "the day davey delaney's mule had sex with the pope". just good clean fun. after all the pope can't have sex with a human.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: ollaimh
Date: 10 Jan 13 - 09:32 PM

ps when i was foolish enough to attend the vancpouver folk ss, they were all upset by rape songs.

under the rubric of rape songs were:

bogies bonny belle,(no one asks her opinion)
the blacksmith,(she's been lied to by a cad to have sex)
lilly of the west(stalking and murder of a f rival)

and don't ever dare sing delia's gone by johnny cash.

much as i love ytah phillips i hate his song "rock salt and nails", even i get offended that he's loading his shotgun to shoot his ex and her new beau,but i mostly think traditional songs should be preserved and sung--within reason


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: GUEST,Don Wise
Date: 11 Jan 13 - 03:32 AM

Bogies Bonny Belle and rape??

"Down by the falls of Cairnie
So many's the time we've been
And there we've told our tales of love
Upon that mossy green"

.......sounds more like mutual consent to me.......but then again, some people are very quick to see offence etc. where none exists.

On the other hand:

Earl Brand (Child #?) featuring a scarcely 15 years old 'Lolita' is not necessarily 'pc'for some people.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: Tattie Bogle
Date: 11 Jan 13 - 04:46 AM

Quite a few from the pen of the late Jake Thackray!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: PHJim
Date: 11 Jan 13 - 08:50 PM

It's A Shame To Whip Your Wife On A Sunday (When you've got Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday...

Sal's Got A Meatskin            

These I learned from the New Lost City Ramblers and once thought they were funny, but would never sing them today.

A song I still love to listen to is Billie Holiday's version of The Man I Love, but wince every time I come to the line,"I'd rather my man would hit me, Than for him to up and quit me."


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: PHJim
Date: 11 Jan 13 - 08:59 PM

Sorry, that's not The Man I Love, but Ain't Nobody's Business If I Do that the Billie Holiday quote came from. It also contained the lines,
"I swear I won't call no copper,
If I'm beat up by my papa
Ain't nobody's business if I do."


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Politically incorrect songs
From: ollaimh
Date: 11 Jan 13 - 10:57 PM

yeah the vancouver folk song ss had a different view than ahem, THE REST OF THE WORLD.

the other one that used to pisss off the nice middle class anglos was the old new foundland song "thank you very much "(tune red haired boy)


when i was just a young man at the start of married life
i asked me loving father to how to treat me darling wife
never hit a woman me little darling man
never hit a woman with a hatchet in her hand

thank you very much for the very nice advice
i used it once or twice when i was on thin ice


and
never steal a nickel my little darling man
never steal a nickel lunless its over fifty grand

etc

they went balistic to the cape breton song "the heavy water plant"
(to a tune almost what do you do with a drunken sailor)
(the heavy water plant was a make work project that failed)

i left me home at quarter to ten
i headed for the heavy water plant
haven't worked since heaven knows when
singing a song of cape breton

i picked me poggie up on george street(poggie is our dole)
i headed for the bank on the corner
new life seems to come to me feet
singing a song of cape breton

the poggie cashed right into my hand
i headed for the nearest tavern
jesus by christ i'm the king of the land
singing a song of capre breton

i found a table down at the back
i ordered two by christ i was thirsty
finished them off at the very first crack
singing a song of cape breton

in comes macneil from margaree
he must have got his poggie yesterday
he's so drunk he can hardly see
singing a song of cape breton

its four o'clock and much to my sorrow
i shoulda tried the heavy water plant
ah ta hell i'll go tommorrow
singing a song of cape breton

i think the old band kiltarlity wrote that gem

the nice bourgeoise were stunned that working class guy drink when they should be looking for work. it is horrifying.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate
  Share Thread:
More...

Reply to Thread
Subject:  Help
From:
Preview   Automatic Linebreaks   Make a link ("blue clicky")


Mudcat time: 24 February 2:10 PM EST

[ Home ]

All original material is copyright © 1998 by the Mudcat Cafť Music Foundation, Inc. All photos, music, images, etc. are copyright © by their rightful owners. Every effort is taken to attribute appropriate copyright to images, content, music, etc. We are not a copyright resource.