The role of the CD Reviewer?

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: Jeri
Date: 28 Apr 11 - 05:49 PM

Reviews alert me that a recording has come out. Other than that, I read the reviews but they very often don't make much of a difference, other than telling me about content. The reviews I've read that were about quality usually haven't had much of an effect on me. The one time I bought a recording based on a review was one that had been thoroughly trashed. Some of the criticisms were right, and some seemed trivial enough to indicate the reviewers feeling of betrayal. As in "You're gonna make me sit through this, I'm gonna git you as many ways as I can."

The reviews that talk about quality often sound to me as if they're more about the reviewer and their personal preferences than the material being reviewed.

The best thing a review can do is let me know a recording has come out and tell me a bit about what's on it. Trying to tell me I should or shouldn't buy it isn't effective.

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 28 Apr 11 - 10:39 PM

Joe, SO reviews only seem to find flaws in the reordings of traditional singers; othrwise they're almost universally rah-rah! As far as" A good review should inform, not merely express the opinions of the reviewer", it's a noble sentiment, but I don't think you can find such a review in the real world. They're all opinions. It's not like judging figure skating (though there are lot on personal opinions sneaking in there)where you get goodie points for how well you conform to a generally-accepted standard.

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: GUEST,Jerry Simon
Date: 03 May 11 - 08:42 PM

"I`d still like to know how many people buy CDs based on reviews."

Fifteen.

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: GUEST,Spleen Cringe
Date: 04 May 11 - 12:51 PM

I've bought CDs based on reviews - usually by reviewers whose taste and judgement I trust reasonably well. I want reviews to be opinionated and lively and tell me how the music made the reviewer feel and respond. A bunch of information neutrally put out there isn't a review - it's an encyclopedia entry. And we have to remember it's all subjective, and that musical taste is a very personal thing.

When I put out Oak Ash Thorn, I obviously hoped it would get some brilliant reviews, but I knew it wouldn't be everyone's cup of tea. So while we've had some great responses from fRoots, Uncut, R2, Living Tradition, The Observer and others, there have been some reviewers who the album simply didn't work for - interestingly, even on this thread there are contributions from one reviewer who thought OAT was one of the best albums of the year so far and another who really didn't like it. But do you know what? That's okay! If we all thought exactly the same about everything, the world (and music magazines in particular) would be a pretty boring place.

And to reiterate Paul Slade above, the reviewer's duty is to the reader, not to me as a record company micromogul or to any of the artists whose wonderful music I release. My duty is to bring out the best records I can, which for me has to be very subjective - unless they are the sort of records that would have pride of place in my own record collection I'm not interested in them. I'm old and ugly enough to understand not only that everyone's record collection is different, but also that some people might think my taste is appalling.

That's not to say I won't have a quiet grumble, though ;-)

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: The Sandman
Date: 04 May 11 - 01:17 PM

I seem to have made permanent enemies of two people, because I criticised a review that pretended it had a connection to a well known Roots magazine, this review[imo ] was a hatchet job.
However, I do think that reviews should try and be objective as possible, they should also inform the consumer as to the material and style of the music, the reality is that sometimes reviews tell the potential buyer more about the reviewer than the item thatthe reviwer is supposed to be reviewing.
personalLy I dont give a toss whether i get a bad or good review, Because I think most sales are based on live performance,or hearing samples on a website, reviewers are becoming an irrelevance, let the public make their own judgements, and consign the w###### who are too fond of their purple prose to the dustbin, may they quickly become extinct like the dodo and the dinosaur.
http://www.dickmiles.com

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 04 May 11 - 01:47 PM

With sveral thousand new releasess each month, I, for one, need reviews as a guide to what I might buy.Puff piecss are worthless, IMO. And serious criticism, though it may be unfair at times, is something that the folk field has been lacking for decades. As I said before, if you know the previous work of the reviewer, you can decide how best to use the review. (I recll tht, when Judith Crist was reviewing movies, I found her reviws valuable--if shepanneda movie, I tended to like it.

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 04 May 11 - 02:29 PM

There have been several instances here in the U.S. of restaurants suing reviewers and/or their newspapers because of unfavourable reviews, and
the resultant loss of revenue, damaged reputation, etc.

And apparently some papers are becoming gun-shy (please excuse the mixed-metaphor) about publishing restaurant reviews.
The legal fees alone make them tend to settle out-of-court, so the restaurant gets a publicity boost equivalent to a good review when a settlement is reached.

Now this tactic could also extend to movies, plays, books, concerts, CDs, etc.
So musical Mudcatters, whattaya say?; next time one of us gets an unfavourable review, or even a lukewarm one, let's sue the shit out of the reviewer and the publication!

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 04 May 11 - 02:43 PM

My sincere apologies Seammus, but that sounds very stupid. Most performers beg reviewers to do their CD, and hope they will think they are brilliant. As we all know, that can never be. Reviewers are not there to pamper to the jumped up artist who thinks they are the best thing since sliced bread.
I suggest that reviewers bring a clause in that makes the artist's agree that they cannot sue the reviewer under any circumstances. If they don't sign, no review.

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: Colin Randall
Date: 04 May 11 - 03:23 PM

I am sure Seamus is being ironic since no one would actually believe in such an attack on freedom of expression... but then I'm indulging in irony now.

I had to read the post twice to confirm that he was talking about the land of the free, where I thought someone bringing a defamation action had to prove malice. Hence the libel tourists who head for the more litigant-friendly judicial climate of the UK to collect their windfalls or block free expression, or both.

There was a case from Northern Ireland of a Belfast jury awarding libel damages to a restaurateur who objected to a harsh review. It seemed preposterous at the time but I am not sure what happened on appeal. And didn't the winegrowers of Beaujolais bring a successful "class' action against a respected wine expert who said something highly uncomplimentary about one year's output?

Human nature being what it is, I realise some Mudcatters, in common with many other people, would applaud such events. The people vs the press and all that.

But you need only think about it for half a second to see how intellectually rotten it is. Unless, that is, you truly want a descent into something resembling fascism.

OK, as a working journalist, I have an axe or two to grind. But I approach such issues with as open a mind as I can: I would certainly grant automatic right of reply to aggrieved parties, even musicians attracting poor reviews. The detail of how such replies would be handled would need a lot of thought. I would also have some equivalent of the small claims courts so that all people, and not just the rich who can afford to risk heavy costs in the unlikely event of defeat, could bring actions where real damage - as opposed to annoyance - could be shown (and again as a journalist, I'd add the "with malice" proviso).

Or let's just settle for a bland, regimented society where no one, however well qualified or however entertaining a writer or speaker, may criticise anyone or anything except on pain of draconian punishment.

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 04 May 11 - 03:30 PM

You might be right Colin and apologoes to Seamus if that is the case.
I am so against people suing everybody. We are getting so stupid.

We can't fart anymore.

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: Colin Randall
Date: 04 May 11 - 03:33 PM

Not if people get wind of what you've done!

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 04 May 11 - 03:43 PM

LOL

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: Tyke
Date: 04 May 11 - 04:41 PM

I am not anybodies enemy however I reserve the right to air my own views regarding things I consider to be out of order. As I think people have a right to use a Mudcat name but not to hide anything were their opinion might suspect because it hides a financial or other self-interest.

A declaration of members interests so that your views are taken in context of his or her own interests especially when that member seeks to gain from his or her views.

Dave Kidman has already made a fine attempt at an apology and I was hoping he had learned his lesson. Not everyone will be aware that he is a prolific reviewer of Albums in fact the last time I read a copy of Folk Roundabout all reviews were by Dave Kidman unless stated otherwise. Now I am and never have had any right or the skill, I am Dyslexic, to have any issue with content of his reviews. If they were poor then the editor should not have published them. However as the same reviews then find there way to every other Folk Publication I do think that the opinions of others should appear. How many times do I want to pay to read the same review?

Don't go getting upset Dave I also think that the owner of B Sky B has too much influence as he also owns most of the News papers. I'm also very wary of Richard Branson (who has just sold Virgin TV to B Sky B) and as he made his money selling record out of the back of a Mini Van until Tubular Bells made him more money than Mike Oldfield allegedly.

I use the Mudcat Name Tyke because it is what people are called who are from Yorkshire! Not because I have anything to do with the Folk Magazine Tykes News although I was and described myself as the paper boy distributing Tykes News for over twenty years. I could have used the name given to me by a certain Gordon Tyrral The Radio Ham referring to my work for the BBC Radio's Folk Network. I do nether of the above mention things now, which make me a lot happier when it comes to being asked to MC at a Festival or take a booking. Why because the reason I have been asked is because of those talents and not for any other perceived reason.

Don't get upset Dave this was prompted by another post to this thread just use your name to show which hat you have on that's all.

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 04 May 11 - 06:03 PM

Colin, thanks for getting the irony, and Arthur - no apology needed.

Unfortunately, the very threat of a lawsuit could make some credible reviewers/publishers a little leery.
On the other hand, it might make some vindictive or biased reviewers think twice about what they write.

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: The Sandman
Date: 04 May 11 - 06:57 PM

some reviewers can dish out the criticism, but cannot take it.

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: GUEST,Joe G
Date: 04 May 11 - 07:20 PM

Tyke brings up the issue of conflict of interest and I must say that, as well as the muse deserting me, my other reason for giving up writing is my own feeling of conflict of interest as I now book artists for a folk club. Although I have been involved in booking artists for festivals previously the numbers involved were small so it was relatively easy to avoid that conflict. With around 40 artists a year to book it is more difficult - though I see nothing wrong in mentioning that an artist is visiting a local club (even if I have booked them!) if I am reviewing the CD near the time.

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: Tyke
Date: 04 May 11 - 10:01 PM

Well Joe I definatly not against the promotion of Live Music and as long as you are awear, as you seem to be, that you would only be damaging your own credibility if you personal were viewed by others as doing things for your own self interest.

I think that a rule of the Magazen editor handing out Albums to people who he or she knows like that type of Music is best. If then the reviewer gives a negative review the Album in question should be given to someone else to review and only if the second reviewer delivers a negative review should the editer decide to publish the First review.

All reviewers should listen to the whole Album and again on difertent day. As his or her mood or mindset can lead him or her to a different conclsion.As some one has already said a lot of blood sweat an tears goes into producing an Album not to mention money.

The internet will make all would be reviewers of Albums redundent as many artists let you sample the tracks before you download it might be marmite to a reviewer but a lot of peoples like marmite. I'm backing Betamax it is the Future!

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: GUEST,Joe G
Date: 05 May 11 - 08:47 AM

Never done anything for my own self interest - I think I should start now!!

Whenever I reviewed a CD I would say I probably listened to it at least 10 times, often more, in different situations - on the hi fi, on the mp3 player walking to or from work and on the car radio.

There are a very small number of CDs that don't get played that much and those are the ones that really make me cringe and think 'life is too short'!

The only downside is that after such intensive listening, no matter how good the CD is, it is often a while before you want to listen to it again - though there have been some that have been so wonderful they have permanent residence on the mp3 player - to name a few Jon Boden's Songs from the Floodplain, Katriona & Jamie's Shadows & Half Light, Gerry McNiece's Small Town Boy and, recent favourite, Rebekah Findlay's 'Northern Skies' oh and of course Tom Bliss's 'Island Stories'!

Subject: RE: The role of the CD Reviewer?
From: Tyke
Date: 05 May 11 - 09:16 AM

Hi Joe you can go here to Gemm
to value all your Albums. Some feach very High Prices and some don't. You can work just why some reach a very High Price Yourself!