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Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)

GUEST,Gill 29 May 11 - 02:35 PM
Joe Offer 29 May 11 - 09:41 PM
Brian Peters 30 May 11 - 06:27 AM
MGM·Lion 30 May 11 - 06:37 AM
GUEST,Gill 30 May 11 - 07:48 AM
GUEST,Alan Whittle 30 May 11 - 08:13 AM
Greg B 30 May 11 - 08:31 AM
MGM·Lion 30 May 11 - 08:31 AM
MoorleyMan 30 May 11 - 06:32 PM
Joe Offer 31 May 11 - 03:14 AM
MGM·Lion 31 May 11 - 03:51 AM
Brian Peters 31 May 11 - 05:13 AM
GUEST,Alan whittle 31 May 11 - 05:54 AM
GUEST,Suibhne Astray 31 May 11 - 05:56 AM
Jim Dixon 02 Jun 11 - 07:40 PM
Joe Offer 02 Jun 11 - 07:57 PM
MGM·Lion 03 Jun 11 - 01:01 AM
Jim Dixon 03 Jun 11 - 11:03 AM
MGM·Lion 03 Jun 11 - 04:08 PM
MGM·Lion 03 Jun 11 - 04:56 PM
Joe Offer 03 Jun 11 - 05:45 PM
Bill D 03 Jun 11 - 07:11 PM
LesB 03 Jun 11 - 08:09 PM
GUEST,banjo boy 04 Jun 11 - 06:27 AM
GUEST 21 Nov 15 - 07:46 AM
Brian Peters 25 Nov 15 - 10:24 AM
The Sandman 25 Nov 15 - 12:48 PM
GUEST,CupOfTea, no cookies 25 Nov 15 - 04:09 PM
Joe Offer 25 Nov 15 - 04:33 PM
GUEST,Valerie 30 Jun 16 - 06:52 AM
GUEST 18 Mar 18 - 11:52 AM
GUEST,Mick Pearce (MCP) 18 Mar 18 - 01:27 PM
GUEST,Mick Pearce (MCP) 18 Mar 18 - 02:08 PM
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Subject: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish
From: GUEST,Gill
Date: 29 May 11 - 02:35 PM

Anyone got the words for this Brian Peters song? Please.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (Brian Peters)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 29 May 11 - 09:41 PM

The notes for this YouTube Video say the song is an "Old music hall song learned by Brian from Tom Hirst of Glossop, Derbyshire." I can't understand enough to transcribe. Anybody want to make an attempt?

Now, although I can't come up with the lyrics, and CAN provide a very entertaining recipe.

-Joe-


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Subject: Lyr Add: CHIPS AND FISH (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: Brian Peters
Date: 30 May 11 - 06:27 AM

Happy to oblige. Tom Hirst was a regular at the folk club that used to meet at the Crown in Glossop around twenty-five years ago. A retired watchmaker who had appeared on variety stages with a piano accordion as a young man, he's long gone but fondly remembered. Tom didn't remember where he got the song, and I've never been able to find out more about it, though Derek Schofield did send me a transcript of the chorus from a midlands newspaper some years ago.

Tom only remembered the first verse and chorus, which didn't stop the rest of us from requesting the song every time he came to the club. Veres two and three are my own attempts to capture the spirit of the original.

CHIPS AND FISH

Some people in Yorkshire, they like Yorkshire puddings
People in Paris like frogs
When I went to Blackpool for my holidays
I met with the shawls and the clogs
A Lancashire lass as I happened to pass
Took a fancy to me on the spot
A-courting we went, I says "You smell of scent;
Is it lilac?" she says: "No it's not, it's...."

[chorus]
Chips and fish, chips and fish
Ee by gum what a champion dish
Oh what a smell when you fry 'em
Just take a penn'orth and try 'em
Put some salt and vinegar on
As much as ever you wish
You can do, do, do with out supper if you've
Got a bob'sworth of chips and fish

We walked hand in hand down the edge of the strand
And we kissed by the silvery sea
We spent half an hour on top of the tower
Had cod and five penn'orth for tea
The time came to part, I was sick to my heart
To the station we had to make haste
She boarded the train, and we kissed once again
And oh, how I savoured the taste, of........

Now travels I've had, Hong Kong, Trinidad,
I've partaken of every cuisine
Italian spaghetti my stomach upset, ee
By gum, and those curries are mean
You get nasty diseases from eating French cheeses
And German frankfurters are worst
And though I like to eat stewed tripe and pigs' feet
There's one dish'll always come first, its...


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 30 May 11 - 06:37 AM

Many thanks, Brian: I linked & was doing my best, but you have now rendered further effort avoidable. Phew!

Must point out that the chips shown on the plate in the "amusing recipe" clip linked by Joe are NOT chips, as understood here in the

Land Of The Fish & Chips

~~ they are what you in USA call 'chips', but we call "[potato] crisps": our "CHIPS" are what you call "fries"; & those are what are served here with battered cod or plaice as FISH & CHIPS.

A MOST VITAL DISTINCTION·······!

~Michael~


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: GUEST,Gill
Date: 30 May 11 - 07:48 AM

Thank you so much, especially to Brian. I'm even more of a fan now! x


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: GUEST,Alan Whittle
Date: 30 May 11 - 08:13 AM

Not really shawls and clogs in Blackpool nowadays ....more thongs and tattoos.

You could put instead of:-

I met with the shawls and the clogs
A Lancashire lass as I happened to pass
Took a fancy to me on the spot

Women with tattoos and thongs
A lancashire lass i happened to meet
And i thought, i can't go wrong!

Just an idea. its raining outside!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: Greg B
Date: 30 May 11 - 08:31 AM

Wurst idea you've had all day.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 30 May 11 - 08:31 AM

A complete irrelevance: but my dear Emma has just given me lunch: & what should it have been but fried fish and chips {& I mean CHIPS & not those other things!} & mushy peas.

Luvverly!!!

~M~


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: MoorleyMan
Date: 30 May 11 - 06:32 PM

Authorship unknown...?
Well, not confirmed, but I do have a note somewhere of a brief conversation I had with Dave Sealey (ex-Cosmotheka) at a gig atg Pete Coe's club three or four years ago (after I'd sung Brian's version there that night). He said he knew the song and would check the information he had on file at home and get back in touch, but I've not heard again since and I don't have his contact details. Sorry I can't be more helpful, Brian...


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 31 May 11 - 03:14 AM

Thanks a lot for posting the song, Brian. It's a keeper.

Michael, the potato chips are part of what made the fish & chips cooking video amusing to me. In the U.S., "chips" are potato chips - what is it you call them in England?

HOWEVER, the "chips" you get with fish & chips in the US are always french fries.

And I have to say that I've never seen the word order "Chips and Fish" until I saw this thread.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 31 May 11 - 03:51 AM

Indeed, Joe, 'chips & fish' is unidiomatic ~~ I think this was deliberately the intention of the original author, to make the song memorable by a semantic & syntactical departure from normal expectations.

What you call 'chips', as I thought I had said above, are called "potato crisps" [or just "crisps"] here; 'chips' to us can only mean your '[French] fries'. To add to the confusion [teehee!], I have occasionally heard "French fries" used here to mean pommes sautés.

~M~


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: Brian Peters
Date: 31 May 11 - 05:13 AM

> 'chips & fish' is unidiomatic ~~ I think this was deliberately the intention of the original author, to make the song memorable by a semantic & syntactical departure from normal expectations. <

Also, it rhymes better with 'dish'!

When in the USA I've been known to introduce the song by explaining that what we call 'chips' are what they call 'Freedom Fries' - but perhaps they've stopped doing that, now that Sarkozy has proved himself a hawk over Libya.

Re the 'shawls and clogs', they do represent a sepia photograph these days, but it's a nostalgic picture that I rather like - and an opportunity to explain a little about the leisure habits of workers in the Lancashire cotton industry. Nice idea, though, Al.

Must talk to Dave Sealey about this sometime.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: GUEST,Alan whittle
Date: 31 May 11 - 05:54 AM

Give dave my sincere regards, i did a gig with him at the Willington Club a few years back. used to love Cosmothka.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 31 May 11 - 05:56 AM

Here's an esential piece of Crisp-Lore replete with various layers of vernacular folk-friendly nostalgia, albeit NE rather than NW:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPOzzI5E0F8


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 02 Jun 11 - 07:40 PM

WorldCat.org says that the British Library has the sheet music.

All the information I was able to get was:

CHIPS AND FISH
Author: F. Austin.
©1920.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 02 Jun 11 - 07:57 PM

Say, you Brits need to understand that we Americans understand the term "Fish and Chips" exactly the same way you do - but it is the only occasion where we refer to french fries as "chips."

I've known the term "fish and chips" since I was five years old and living in Detroit - French fries and deep-fried fish (usually cod). If you had asked me what "chips" were, I would have said they were potato chips, and it also refers to tortilla chips here in California.

But I really don't think you need to explain the term "fish and chips" anywhere in the United States. We understand it exactly the same way you do.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 03 Jun 11 - 01:01 AM

Indeed, Joe. I remember around the Va/Maryland/DC area where I stayed for a while in August 1971 a chain of outlets called "Colonel* [Somebody's] English Fish & Chips". Each had this inscribed on a hanging sign outside, suspended from a rolled umbrella and topped by a bowler ('derby') hat ~~ which are, indeed, dress required of Brigade Of Guards officers 'walking out' in mufti.

How long did this chain last? Was it to be found elsewhere thru USA [I visited NY, Indiana & Chicago also during the same trip but don't recall it anywhere else]. Anyone recall it or have any more info?

~Michael~

*IIRC ~ might have been Major or Captain...


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 03 Jun 11 - 11:03 AM

MtheGM: I wonder if what you saw wasn't Arthur Treacher's Fish and Chips?

Arthur Treacher was an English actor who was famous in America for playing the butler in several Shirley Temple films, among others. I don't know if he ever used a bowler hat and umbrella in his films, but he certainly did in this album-cover photo.

It wouldn't surprise me if the restaurant chain used the bowler and brolly as symbols, since the whole point of its name and décor was to emphasize the Englishness of the recipe.

As I recall, the fish & chips were served in wax paper that was printed to look like an English newspaper, probably The Times.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 03 Jun 11 - 04:08 PM

Thank you Jim. My recollection is of a military rank; but possibly I am somehow mentally conflating with Colonel Sanders!   I remember Arthur Treacher in 1930-40s Shirley temple films; but this was 30-40 years later. I never actually bought any of the comestible concerned; just remember being driven past by our Damascus, Md, hosts & being much intrigued by the frontage. But, whichever it was, I find your description of serving in greaseproof paper to look like an English newspaper {as F & C were traditionally served in England at one time, as newsprint made good heat-preserving insulation, tho generally with a layer of greaseproof right inside} a most tellingly careful piece of good marketing & striving for authenticity.

~M~


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 03 Jun 11 - 04:56 PM

I followed the Wiki links you provided; there was also a Captain D's: but none of them seemed to mention that distinctive sign hanging from a rolled umbrella, which was the touch which most struck me & has remained with me. Anyone else remember seeing any such?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 03 Jun 11 - 05:45 PM

We had "Bet & Jesse's Fish and Chips" down the street at Fielding and Grand River when I was a kid in Detroit. I imagine it was the one and only "Bet & Jesse's," and their fish and chips were a trip to heaven. I left Detroit at the age of nine, but I still remember those fish and chips as a real tread. I went back to my old neighborhood last summer, and the only existing business I remember from my childhood was the Danish bakery. Everything else had changes - supermarkets, car dealers, everything except for public buildings, some churches, and that bakery. Oh, it looks like Bet & Jessie's is still in business, but just moved a couple miles west on Grand River.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: Bill D
Date: 03 Jun 11 - 07:11 PM

Of course, in the US, 'chips', even when meaning chunks/slices of real potato, can vary tremendously. They can be tiny, thin things or sturdy wedges or anything in between....and cooking technique varies with each size. So many of ours are eaten with hamburgers that the standard- except when served with fish- is on the smaller end of the scale.

Then, in one of the most famous US restaurants Bryant's BBQ in Kansas City, the fries/chips are intentionally made soggy with cooking oil. They are well-done and ....ummm... tasty, but I think there should be a cholesterol warning on the wall!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: LesB
Date: 03 Jun 11 - 08:09 PM

I'm pretty sure this is the same song that Barbara Snape sings (I don't know where she got it from),The Snapes They do a few music hall songs


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: GUEST,banjo boy
Date: 04 Jun 11 - 06:27 AM

I'll ask her tonight - we're doing a gig together


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Nov 15 - 07:46 AM

I remember me Dad singing this when I was very little.I seem to recall the 1st verse being;

Now the people in Yorkshire
They like Yorkshire Pudding,
And the people in France
They like frogs.
But I went to Lancashire some time ago,
To mix with the shawls and the clogs.
I was looking for grub,
I was passing a pub
So I asked this old bloke passing by,
Can you recommend
Something tasty my friend,
He pulled out his pipe and says Aye

Cos there's Fish and Chips,
Fish and Chips
Eee by Gum what a champion dish.
Oh what a smell when the fry em
Get six penneth and try em
Put some salt and vinegar on
Just as much as you wish.
You can do,do,do without supper when you've
Had a bobs worth of Fish and Chips


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: Brian Peters
Date: 25 Nov 15 - 10:24 AM

Thanks for that, 'Guest' - it's very similar to what Tom Hirst sang, but with a few different lines (ah, that old Folk Process!). Still only one verse to go with the chorus, though.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: The Sandman
Date: 25 Nov 15 - 12:48 PM

Fish and chips in my humble opinion is best if the chips are freshly chipped and cooked in lard, and then I am rather partial to Whitng of haddock, mackerel can be good if the fish is cooked as soon as it is caught.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: GUEST,CupOfTea, no cookies
Date: 25 Nov 15 - 04:09 PM

I'd encourage anyone who is interested in this song to acquire the delightful album of Brian's it is on: Anglophila. I took it home after the first time hearing him perform, because of the Anglo concertina flavor of the album, along with the ballad albums that would fill the cravings for some great traditional stuff, as highly recommended by Phil Cooper, who knows a fair few things about good trad performers, an' all.

Delightful. yep. that's the right word, by gum!

Joanne in Cleveland


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 25 Nov 15 - 04:33 PM

Here's a delightful video of Brian Peters performing the song:

Hey, Brian, c'mon over to California and do some house concerts!

I like this performance, too, by a group called "Shake a Leg":
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: GUEST,Valerie
Date: 30 Jun 16 - 06:52 AM

Chips and fish, chips and fish,
Ee by gum what a champion dish.
Oh what a smell when you fry 'em
Let's have two pen'eth and try 'em
Put some salt and vinegar on
As much as ever you wish,
You can do,do,do,do without supper
As long as you get some chips and fish.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Mar 18 - 11:52 AM

I have been making oral history recordings for the Cardall Collection of Southam, Warwickshire. The late Renee Cardall who was in charge of the collection of historical items sang the chorus of this song and her recording is now an item in the Southam Heritage Collection which will soon be moving into a new venue in Southam's Tithe Place. Renee remembered it from hearing it sung by a local entertainer in the early 20th century.It would be interesting to find out who the original composer was.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: GUEST,Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 18 Mar 18 - 01:27 PM

According to Kilgarriff it was in the repertoire of music hall entertainer Ernie Mayne (1871 - 1937), but no information on author.

According to wikipedia Mayne weighed about 20 stones (you can see him on youtube). Maybe because of this he seems to have been fond of food songs. The track listing of the cd of his "Fried Fruit Fritters" contains several food-related songs (My Meatless Day, Fried Fruit Fritters, Eggs and Bacon, The Roast Beef of Old England, No We Don't Keep Fish Only Kippers, A N'Egg And Some N'Ham And A N'Onion, I've Never Wronged An Onion). Sadly not the one of interest!

He recorded in on record The Winner 3432 (you can find a listing on ebay) but the label gives no information except Ernie Mayne.The record was released in 1920.

As Jim pointed out above the BL catalogue has nothing but the single entry giving F Austin as author ca1920.

Mick


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chips and Fish (as sung by Brian Peters)
From: GUEST,Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 18 Mar 18 - 02:08 PM

F.Austin is probably Fred Austin who appears in another thread here: Lyr Req: I'm Going Back to Himazas (Fred Austin (this was also 1920 I think).

There's a bit of information about him online, including a list of a handful of popular songs he wrote, but not mentioning Chips and Fish so I can't confirm his as the author,   

Mick


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