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BS: What has happened to London?

GUEST,Eliza 22 Sep 11 - 07:27 AM
Jim Martin 22 Sep 11 - 07:34 AM
Bert 22 Sep 11 - 07:55 AM
Richard Bridge 22 Sep 11 - 08:01 AM
GUEST,Steamin' Willie 22 Sep 11 - 08:21 AM
Keith A of Hertford 22 Sep 11 - 08:45 AM
Dave MacKenzie 22 Sep 11 - 08:53 AM
Bonzo3legs 22 Sep 11 - 09:16 AM
MikeL2 22 Sep 11 - 09:17 AM
Wesley S 22 Sep 11 - 09:48 AM
Musket 22 Sep 11 - 10:10 AM
GUEST,Shimrod 22 Sep 11 - 10:35 AM
VirginiaTam 22 Sep 11 - 11:14 AM
Backwoodsman 22 Sep 11 - 11:27 AM
theleveller 22 Sep 11 - 11:49 AM
GUEST,Eliza 22 Sep 11 - 12:25 PM
Paul Burke 22 Sep 11 - 12:54 PM
John MacKenzie 22 Sep 11 - 01:01 PM
GRex 22 Sep 11 - 02:04 PM
Big Al Whittle 22 Sep 11 - 02:07 PM
GUEST,Eliza 22 Sep 11 - 02:14 PM
John MacKenzie 22 Sep 11 - 02:19 PM
akenaton 22 Sep 11 - 03:39 PM
McGrath of Harlow 22 Sep 11 - 07:21 PM
GUEST,ChanteyLass 22 Sep 11 - 10:17 PM
MGM·Lion 23 Sep 11 - 01:24 AM
theleveller 23 Sep 11 - 03:15 AM
John MacKenzie 23 Sep 11 - 04:14 AM
GUEST,Paul Slade 23 Sep 11 - 06:28 AM
JHW 23 Sep 11 - 06:30 AM
GUEST,Eliza 23 Sep 11 - 08:57 AM
SPB-Cooperator 23 Sep 11 - 11:12 AM
MGM·Lion 23 Sep 11 - 11:17 AM
Arthur_itus 23 Sep 11 - 11:23 AM
MGM·Lion 23 Sep 11 - 11:56 AM
theleveller 23 Sep 11 - 12:13 PM
GUEST,Eliza 23 Sep 11 - 01:27 PM
Rapparee 23 Sep 11 - 03:09 PM
Stringsinger 23 Sep 11 - 05:25 PM
GUEST,roderick warner 23 Sep 11 - 06:26 PM
MGM·Lion 23 Sep 11 - 11:35 PM
McGrath of Harlow 24 Sep 11 - 07:12 AM
GUEST,Guest - Lindy 01 Oct 11 - 02:44 AM
Bonzo3legs 01 Oct 11 - 03:38 AM
Will Fly 01 Oct 11 - 04:21 AM
MGM·Lion 02 Oct 11 - 02:39 AM
Edthefolkie 02 Oct 11 - 11:16 AM
ollaimh 02 Oct 11 - 09:42 PM
ollaimh 06 Oct 11 - 11:07 AM
Will Fly 06 Oct 11 - 12:17 PM
Richard Bridge 06 Oct 11 - 01:31 PM
Richard Bridge 06 Oct 11 - 01:32 PM
BTNG 06 Oct 11 - 02:43 PM
GUEST 06 Oct 11 - 04:40 PM
GUEST,Patsy 07 Oct 11 - 05:24 AM
GUEST,Eliza 07 Oct 11 - 01:51 PM
MGM·Lion 07 Oct 11 - 02:00 PM
Bonzo3legs 07 Oct 11 - 02:01 PM
GUEST,Eliza 07 Oct 11 - 02:04 PM
MGM·Lion 07 Oct 11 - 02:09 PM
GUEST,Eliza 07 Oct 11 - 03:00 PM

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Subject: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 07:27 AM

Went to London for the first time in over twenty years. Good grief! The traffic was endless and practically stationary. The buildings were ghastly, great slabs of glass and steel, each one uglier than the last and none built with any consideration as to style or surroundings. Beautiful Wren churches swamped by monstrosities. Scaffolding everywhere. I was ashamed watching tourists wandering about, whatever must they have thought? It all looked scruffy, ugly and crammed with bad design. (Went on a coach trip to Buckingham Palace to see Kate's wedding dress and the State Rooms)
Am I alone in my dismay?


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Jim Martin
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 07:34 AM

No, you're not! I've always thought the same and it just gets worse & worse. I stay away from the place!


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Bert
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 07:55 AM

It is not just London. Bad architecture is everywhere. It seems nowadays "If you can draw a shoebox, you can be an architect"


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 08:01 AM

And, what's more, if you are actually trying to do anything, the place is chockful of meandering tourists intent on consuming kitsch, getting in the bloody way, cluttering up the tube, and dithering. I hate going there on business now. And if your meeting is in a hotel, the better hotels are full of people intent on ostentatious displays of wealth and conspicuous consumption.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Steamin' Willie
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 08:21 AM

Hi M'Unlearned friend!

Didn't know you went to the same hotels as me. I find the rolex to be the best way of letting people know you are important and worth respecting. Not being a conveyencer like you, I need such baubles to let people know I have a right to be in the capital and that tourists are getting in my way rather than enjoying their time as they are entitled to do.

London is a wonderful place and the architecture, whilst varying from wonderful Wren to amazing 21st century confidence (ironic at present but buildings are for the long term) I agree there is some '60s and '70s dross to be dealt with.

I love London. Always have and always will.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 08:45 AM

Don't blame London.
It's population has been allowed to soar uncontrolled, beyond the capacity of the infrastructure and services.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 08:53 AM

'Maybe it's because I'm a masochist that I love London town'.

London has its good points, though I got out of it 15 years ago as I felt I was too old. Ok for visiting, but not living in or driving. When my daughter was living in Brick Lane, I remember telling my wife that (because it was just as stressful being a passenger as driving) that next time, if she insisted on taking the car, I'd take the train and meet her there. I used to miss a lot of shows, exhibitions and games in London because you feel that they'll always be there, and it's too much hassle just now making another cross-town trip! I only ever got to the National Gallery once I'd left. I hated working in Westminster, though the City was a lot friendlier.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 09:16 AM

People look so scruffy in London especially the ladies with their hideous leggings outfit chickening along the road!!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: MikeL2
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 09:17 AM

Hi

I lived and worked in London for about 3 years. I enjoyed the experience and the ability to explore all the many architectural buildings etc. Of course it has tourists - what city doesn't ???

I went there only a couple of months ago - stayed in Greenwich. Apart from the more modernistic buildings that are stating to spring up, I didn't notice any real changes - except perhaps for an apparent much faster style of life there.

If you think London is full of tourists who get in the way, try Edinburgh. I was there during the Tattoo and the Festival. Now that is busy !!!

I enjoyed the whole experience, but then I was a tourist too !!

Cheers

MikeL2


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Wesley S
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 09:48 AM

I loved London when we visited a few years ago. Sure it's a big city and spots are crowded - but that's true of any big city.

As a tourist I'm sorry if I was in the way.

But people see what they want to see. If you can't find the beauty and charm of London it's not because it wasn't there. It's because you didn't want to find it.

A young student was asked by his teacher what was the color of the sky. It was raining that day so the student said - "The sky is gray". "Wrong" replyed the teacher. "The sky is blue - it will always be blue. But you have chosen to see the gray clouds instead."


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Musket
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 10:10 AM

I spend a bit of time at our office in EC1. It's a bit different to my "other" life in North Lincolnshire!

When you are tired of London you are tired of life, wrote Dr Johnson. And Brick Lane was still fields then!

Possibly the most cosmopolitan city in the world. I have never fully lived there, but at one time spent more time in my London flat than back oop north.

So, nothing has happened to London. I suspect things happen to us which change our perspective. (I used to drive down, now I get the train as I can't be arsed to spend all day in jams, whereas I used to accept them as part of life.)


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 10:35 AM

I went into Manchester city centre yesterday. It too is full of horrible, souless, architectural monstrosities. Of course it's absolutely ESSENTIAL to our present and future economic prosperity that we allow f**king property developers to build anything they f**king like!


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 11:14 AM

I am too tired and too much pain to go to London for fun anymore.

But I remember my first visit there. Shocked by the grottiness everywhere. Didn't mind juxtatposition of gleaming modern against quaint old pubs etc. But the dirt, grime, gum, discarded fast food, broken glass, peeling paint, gang tags, spray painted obscenities and boarded up shops and houses really put me off.

London feels like it has been abandoned.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 11:27 AM

You should try Brussels. Now there is a truly awful dump, alongside which London is a paradise.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: theleveller
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 11:49 AM

London full of people? Well, there's a surprise! Actually I still get a buzz when I visit, but probably because I know that I'll be going home to the wilds of my native East Yorkshire.

I don't think the new buildings are particularly offensive, with the exception of the British Library, which had the decency to hide behind a high fence for many years.

I've always said that I'd never want to go back and live there, but on Location, Location, Location last night, they were in Chiswick and I suddenly got small pangs of home-sickness even though I left in 1976.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 12:25 PM

Well I used to go 'up' to London from Middlesex every school holiday with my friends, sightseeing. I adored London, and was proud of it, the atmosphere, architecture, shops, churches etc etc. I knew it very well, most areas. It's not the tourists or the workers, it seems to be the traffic, which in spite of the congestion charge, is totally out of control IMO. I also heard yesterday that the Palace cleaners have removed KILOS of chewing gum from the Queen's carpets, so gum is now banned!! (Can you imagine spitting out chewing gum onto a carpet??) Some of the new buildings I saw yesterday were interesting, eg the 'gherkin', the London Eye, and a few more. But sticking glass boxes beside, in front of and behind our precious historical heritage is MAD. There was also a scruffy 'Peace Camp' of bivouacs planted in Trafalgar Square, with hand-made tatty placards all about. What an eyesore! And Covent Garden! That used to be a very interesting area of craft and other stalls, with street performers etc. Now it's absolute tat and rip-off cafes. Oh dear!! Paris is a million times better.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 12:54 PM

What has happened to London? The Free Market.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 01:01 PM

Fair chance the gum on the carpet arrived on people's feet, not in their mouths.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GRex
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 02:04 PM

I moved my family away from London in 1968 and have never had the slightest desire to go back, not even for a visit. Alas, the London of my younger days no loner exists.

       Ex cockney

             GRex


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 02:07 PM

I bet its never even occurred to Boris Johnson to put up signs:-

DO NOT GOB ON THE QUEEN'S CARPET!

I see we're all getting in patriotic mood for the Olympics.....


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 02:14 PM

Well the gum must have been in someone's mouth before it ended up on the carpets. We're going back in mid-October on a trip to the Tower of London. I hope the Crown Jewels aren't covered in chewing gum too.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 02:19 PM

The last time I was in central London, the graffitti apart from being absolutely everywhere, was mostly not in English. Those that were in English, may as well have been in a foreign language. Grammar isn't the strong point of your average graffitti artist apparently.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: akenaton
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 03:39 PM

I went on holiday in 1964.
Little backstreet pubs with snug bars for the old ladies...The Post Office Tower...just opened. Red Rover buses. Euston station, Picadilly and a visit to a STRIP CLUB in Soho.
My mate and I thought we were in heaven!!


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 07:21 PM

The point about London has always been that it's good in bits. As the good bits get ruined other bits briefly flourish and then get ruined.

I grew up there in the decades after the war. It seemed a lot better then than when I visit it these days, but that's largely because I'm a visitor.

OK for visiting, but not living in or driving. Actually I think that's probably the wrong way round, so far as "living in" is concerned. ("Driving", you'd need to be a sadomasochist..) Living in London you find ways of enjoying it, visiting, it's liable to just seem a mess, because you'll be spending time in the parts that have been ruined worst.

I'd never advise a tourist to waste much of their visit to England in London. And stay well clear of it for the Olympics, which will be a nightmare.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,ChanteyLass
Date: 22 Sep 11 - 10:17 PM

London is an amazing city. I visited it around 1969 and 2004. The new architecture was, er, interesting, but that is how I describe a lot of modern art. The rebuilt Globe Theatre was fun to visit, though. While you (and I) might wish for more familiar architectural styles, at least the city has not stagnated. As for the tourists, I'm sure they are inconvenient. Maybe we should spend our money elsewhere.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 01:24 AM

I was born & grew up in London: lived there till 1963. Much better in many ways now than in my youth. I used to think buildings like St Martin's in the Fields, the National Gallery, and structures like Nelson's Column, were actually made of black stone. They are all cleaned up now, and the Clean Air Acts ensure they stay that way and the real colour of the marble and stonework can be seen. So it's in that way a pleasure to go back from time to time. By coach, tho; it's not just the driving around that's impossible, it's the parking. And to think I used to drive to work from Hampstead to Peckham, round Marble Arch every morning!

~Michael~


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: theleveller
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 03:15 AM

"I hope the Crown Jewels aren't covered in chewing gum too."

There's nowt worse than chewing gum on yer crown jewels - it's a bugger to get off!


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 04:14 AM

PITA Leveller?


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Paul Slade
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 06:28 AM

The good and bad points of London (or any other big city) are always two sides of the same coin.

It's the fact that there are so many people crammed into the city that create the traffic and litter problems we all bemoan. But it's that same concentration of people who make possible the city's vibrant arts life: not just the West End, but dozens of tiny little pub theatres doing good work too; not just the South Bank, but hundreds of live music venues offering every genre under the sun; not just the multiplex, but every neighbourhood's thriving independent cinema offering imaginative programmes of their own; not just the heritage architecture we all admire, but exciting and innovative new skyscrapres too; Not just the HMV megastore, but dozens of tiny specialist record shops energetically pushing their own enthusisams.

London's crime, rubbish and traffic problems are the price we pay for the astonishing vitality this city has to offer. New York is London's only real competitor, and there the move towards making it a safer and more controlled city has also made it a far duller one. If you can show me a place to live that has the gentle ambiance of country life, AND the cultural vibrancy of London, I'd move there tomorrow, but you can't have the good stuff without the bad.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: JHW
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 06:30 AM

I think it was George Bernard Shaw who recommended visiting London every !7 years. Last encounter was 3 years ago so I can relax for the next fourteen.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 08:57 AM

We go back again on October 15th. I've always loved the Tower, and my husband's never seen it. Perhaps London won't be quite so busy in mid-October!


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 11:12 AM

"I'd never advise a tourist to waste much of their visit to England in London. And stay well clear of it for the Olympics, which will be a nightmare. "

I am envisaging tourists paying through the nose to stay in London to attend the olympics, and Londoners like myself paying through the nose to find somewhere to stay to get away from London.........


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 11:17 AM

Why not just stay at home, or within whatever suburb or quarter you live in, SPB? Bet you don't actually live in Stratford.

~M~


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 11:23 AM

I lived in London for 6 months and enjoyed the stay. What I didn't like, was everytime I blew my nose, it was always black from all the pollution tehre.

I prefer to go to places like Amsterdam, Brugge, York.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 11:56 AM

All those are cities I love also, Arthur: but I have never observed them to be significantly less polluted than London. And, as I said in a post a bit back, the pollution there is as nought to what it was in my memories of the place before I moved out 48 years ago, having spent the first 31 years of my life there without even realising that every building wasn't built originally of black stone ~ a misapprehension now remedied by the Clean Air Acts.

~M~


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: theleveller
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 12:13 PM

"I prefer to go to places like Amsterdam, Brugge, York."!

I try not to go to York in the summer - now that really is crowded - and parking is a nightmare. I prefer to go to Beverley if I need particular things I can only get in town.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 01:27 PM

Yes, Arthuritis, we felt the air was rather polluted. Our skin was gritty and my hair dirty. We were v. tired when we got home to the village late at night, but we showered and got clean before sleeping!
I too remember when all the buildings were black with pollution. It did give them an air of antiquity. We passed the Tower on our way to the Palace, and it was shiny clean. I must say, we're doubly grateful and glad we live in this peaceful, green and unpolluted place. Our village has many historic buildings, and no eyesores!


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Rapparee
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 03:09 PM

What? Is it missing?


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Stringsinger
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 05:25 PM

Old Blighty has become Americanized. One gone with coal, the other on it's way out with oil.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,roderick warner
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 06:26 PM

Someone's nightmare - another's paradise. I lived in London for many years as a transplanted provincial, left to go to continental pastures new via Belfast and Dublin. Living in the sticks back in the UK, now I go down there about every month/six weeks for music (Cafe Oto in Dalston - best club in town) and art galleries/walking about- and just the vibe of a bustling city. Gun to my head: I would take Berlin as it's cheaper and more laid back, possibly edges it on the music/art front - but every time I hit St Pancras I get the old buzz. I think you either like cities or you hate them. So if you prefer the village/small town life that's your choice...


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 23 Sep 11 - 11:35 PM

London not really so 'incomparable' with every city but NY, as some have claimed above. I can get much buzz from Barcelona, Paris, Rome - &, in different way, Las Vegas, kitsch capital of the world {no absolute necessity to lose money: Valerie & I once spent several days there without even inserting a single quarter in a single machine, but just feasting our eyes}. SF good too, but probably my unfave place is LA. My fave, all-in-all, has to be NY: has a unique unmissable energy all its own.

~M~


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 Sep 11 - 07:12 AM

The comment attributed to various officers in respect of either the Great War or World War II is perhaps relevant - "My dear, the noise, and the people."


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Guest - Lindy
Date: 01 Oct 11 - 02:44 AM

Last time I was in London was 1987. I used to go to London several times throughout the 1980's and 1970's.

Mostly stayed at B & B's in Paddington, Bayswater, Kensington High Street, West Kensington and once in Holland Park area. I used to go somewhat off season (at least not in the summer months anyway), so would go in May/early June or mid to late Sept. and October. Of course still crowded most places.

I found Oxford Street always busy (not just on Saturday) but every day,Camden Town, Kensington High St. and Brents Cross busy. I did not drive in London, instead used buses and The Tube. I remember some areas like Shepherd's Bush and Paddington very busy, not too clean on the streets (some areas worse then others)like Bayswater.
Did enjoy Oxford St sometimes as I like Selfridges and found a lot record shops.

However, my favourite time was when I used to go to the folk clubs at night. I would buy Time Out and Folk London guides to find out what was going on. I did have a good time and enjoyed the coffeebars and some of the better Indian restaurants.

Also enjoyed the pub food for lunch or some of the restaurants in the dept. stores. (usually reasonable prices) although I did encounter a lot of expensive restaurants even in the late 80's.

I imagine though that from what I have been reading that London is very different today then from 20, 24 years ago.

Can anyone tell me what the biggest changes one would find in London today versus from the late 1980's? (other then traffic).

I didn't drive there so since I was on the Tube mostly or buses I didn't have to deal with traffic and still would use public tranportation if I visited today.

So mostly I was wondering about other major differences to expect?

I live in the U.S.A.

Thanks


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 01 Oct 11 - 03:38 AM

No comparison with Buenos Aires - the ladies there dress with class, very few "chickens"!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Will Fly
Date: 01 Oct 11 - 04:21 AM

London, like every large city, is a collection of villages and, if you live there, you get to know some of them - and yours in particular. When I lived there - late '60s to mid '70s - I lived in a bedsit in W2 (Bayswater). Every morning, unless the weather was foul, I used to walk up through the squares to Lancaster Gate, over the Bayswater Road into Kensington Gardens, down through the Gardens and Hyde Park to Hyde Park Corner. Then back over the road to Seymour Street, into Wigmore Street - and then up to Portland Place and into Broadcasting House.

I don't go up to London much these days, except for occasional mornings up to the Borough Market or the theatre, but a few weeks ago I decided to retrace my daily walk to work and back to see if the buzz was still there - which it was. Autumn was particularly good for that walk - morning mist rising off the park lawns - and it was good to relive the experience again.

When the weather was foul, I used to get the tube from Queensway to Oxford Circus - 4d in old money in those days!

But, yes, times and cities change. I was in Barcelona about 6 years ago, stayed at an art deco hotel bang in the middle of Ramblas and had a great time. I went back for a short stop, a couple of years ago (en route for Zaragoza), and couldn't believe the increase in tourism and prices in the old haunts. So - everywhere really.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 02 Oct 11 - 02:39 AM

Re Will's 'collection of villages", I posted on this very subject a bit earlier on another thread where the subject had arisen, & copy it here as relevant:~

From: MtheGM Subject: RE: BS: More on transAtlantic distinctions
Date: 02 Oct 11 - 02:11 AM

But re London's 'multiple centres', Gibb: yes, true ~~ London is, like all huge conurbations, a collection of villages. But take one indication of which of these is really the centre: Theatres. Many 'villages' have, or have had, their own single theatre: Golders Green Hippodrome; Theatre Royal, Stratford East; Rainbow Theatre, Finsbury Park; Orpheum, Temple Fortune; The Ashcroft Theatre, Croydon; The Churchill Theatre, Bromley ... But the West End has ~~ how many? never counted; but googling London Theatre Seating Plans produced 45! And the general ambition of any company opening a production in any of these 'village' theatres, as well as in the provinces, is for an impresario to be found who will take it "into the West End".

QED


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Edthefolkie
Date: 02 Oct 11 - 11:16 AM

Tell you what, Portobello Road market is bleedin' expensive these days!


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: ollaimh
Date: 02 Oct 11 - 09:42 PM

london is a great visit. but i never thought i'd see the day when travelling on the tube was gentler in new york than london. i guess oafs like richard bridges are everywhere nowadays


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: ollaimh
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 11:07 AM

complaining about the fecking tourists who bring millions to the uk economy is really the height of british ignorance. i know these louts love to get on their high horse and pretend it's manners to put down |the other| but really guys grow up. when my father was over there saving them from the nazis they would snot on the "ruddy colonials", they love to pretend high moral status and shit on others from high altitudes.

the basil fawlty types are still there like those posting here regularily. how do you basils have the time do you have nothing constructive to do with yo9ur lives, no familys to love or activities to foster?

now most londoners are very nice , although new yorkers are actually nicer now--i've been to both a couple of times in the last five years. how didn that happen?

the working class and lower middle classes in london have mostly left the old forelock tugging behind and treat foreigners well, although it helps a lot to flash the cash. however there are still tose keith's and richards who never seem to tire of pretending to their mopral superiority, and apparantly have no life of their own.

life is short do something constructive rather tan grossing about the tourists, which is really part of grossing about then foreigners.will the empire never die?


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Will Fly
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 12:17 PM

As far as hatred of tourists is concerned, London is miniscule by comparison with Berlin, which is currently one of the most popular capital city destinations in Europe.

There's a formal and concerted movement on the part of Berliners to make life uncomfortable for tourists - stealing cars, keying cars, insulting them, short-changing them, etc.

Guardian article on Berlin and tourism

Here's an extract:

In December, the alternative magazine Interim even called for an anti-tourism campaign. To get rid of these unwanted pests, it urged readers to "steal their mobile phones and wallets as you walk by their cafe tables, burn their cars, smash their hotel windows, drop rubbish, throw stuff at tourist buses".


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 01:31 PM

Olly, how do you know what happened to your father? Time travel?


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 01:32 PM

Bozo. FFS! One does not say "ladies".


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: BTNG
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 02:43 PM

London will survive the tourists, the cars, the whiners, of all stripes, London will live on, no matter what..

Peter Ackroyd's London: East versus West End


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 04:40 PM

I have a theory about the make-up of pedestrians on London's streets after having just returned from there a couple of weeks ago.

Ever person on London's streets is fifteen minutes late to the most important event in their life. Get out of their way or be ploughed under.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 05:24 AM

Reading through most of these threads it does not make me want to visit the 'old smoke' any time soon. There are plenty of other cities that I would rather see and spend my money in.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 01:51 PM

Spanish cities are very interesting and civilised. Madrid, Barcelona and Malaga are three of the nicest. My sister tells me Tallin is wonderful.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 02:00 PM

Barcelona. Love it. One of my very favourite places ~~

~~~ But just read any of the ongoing scare stories about the organised dips and bag-snatchers there...

~M~


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 02:01 PM

Malaga and Barcelona are indeed very nice, Madrid had very high traffic pollution I remember, but last went there in the 1990s so it could be worse now.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 02:04 PM

Sorry, that should of course read 'Tallinn', and I do realise it's in Estonia and not Spain! Actually my sis has recently visited a lot of the Baltic countries and says they're excellent.
MtheGM, I remember Las Ramblas, and the Holy Family Cathedral. Some weird and wonderful architecture. What a pity you have to watch your bag/pockets. Suppose it's the same everywhere now.


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 02:09 PM

Indeed, Eliza. Mind you, have been warned by well-meaning guides & locals every time [several, 1970s onwards] have been to Barcelona: but in fact Valerie & I never had any trouble. Last time I got my pocket picked was on the Paris Metro; previous one was at Jerusalem Bus Station! So there you go...

~M~


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Subject: RE: BS: What has happened to London?
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 03:00 PM

Have to say, I've heard that, due to all the CCTV cameras, the Police are keeping on top of street crime in London. But I've no idea what goes on after dark. Bad things probably! Paris is beset by street children who come up begging and grab your bag. Have done a short study course on Crime in London throughout the ages, and it's amazing how things don't change. Drunkeness, thieves, pickpockets, beggars, congestion (horsedrawn of course!) Any big city is bound to be the same.


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