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BS: Wall Street Protesters...

Related threads:
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GUEST,999 05 Oct 11 - 06:20 PM
Little Hawk 05 Oct 11 - 06:17 PM
Bobert 05 Oct 11 - 06:16 PM
GUEST,999 05 Oct 11 - 06:02 PM
Don Firth 05 Oct 11 - 05:23 PM
Richard Bridge 05 Oct 11 - 04:28 PM
GUEST,petecockermouth 05 Oct 11 - 04:10 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 05 Oct 11 - 01:52 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 05 Oct 11 - 01:36 PM
GUEST,petecockermouth 05 Oct 11 - 01:35 PM
Little Hawk 05 Oct 11 - 01:33 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 05 Oct 11 - 01:32 PM
Richard Bridge 05 Oct 11 - 01:26 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 05 Oct 11 - 01:14 PM
GUEST,999 05 Oct 11 - 09:41 AM
akenaton 05 Oct 11 - 03:11 AM
Richard Bridge 05 Oct 11 - 03:10 AM
akenaton 05 Oct 11 - 03:05 AM
Little Hawk 05 Oct 11 - 12:51 AM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 04 Oct 11 - 11:24 PM
Bobert 04 Oct 11 - 11:17 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 04 Oct 11 - 11:12 PM
GUEST,999 04 Oct 11 - 10:59 PM
Stilly River Sage 04 Oct 11 - 08:12 PM
Bobert 04 Oct 11 - 08:08 PM
Don Firth 04 Oct 11 - 07:55 PM
Little Hawk 04 Oct 11 - 06:58 PM
Stilly River Sage 04 Oct 11 - 06:54 PM
Don Firth 04 Oct 11 - 06:53 PM
Little Hawk 04 Oct 11 - 06:25 PM
gnu 04 Oct 11 - 06:20 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 04 Oct 11 - 05:51 PM
akenaton 04 Oct 11 - 05:42 PM
GUEST,number 6 04 Oct 11 - 05:36 PM
Little Hawk 04 Oct 11 - 05:16 PM
Don Firth 04 Oct 11 - 05:11 PM
GUEST,Chongo Chimp 04 Oct 11 - 04:59 PM
akenaton 04 Oct 11 - 04:29 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 04 Oct 11 - 04:05 PM
akenaton 04 Oct 11 - 03:27 PM
Don Firth 04 Oct 11 - 03:25 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 04 Oct 11 - 03:10 PM
gnu 04 Oct 11 - 02:57 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 04 Oct 11 - 02:15 PM
Bill D 04 Oct 11 - 02:04 PM
Don Firth 04 Oct 11 - 02:03 PM
Richard Bridge 04 Oct 11 - 01:57 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 04 Oct 11 - 01:50 PM
dick greenhaus 04 Oct 11 - 01:48 PM
Stilly River Sage 04 Oct 11 - 11:38 AM

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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 06:20 PM

Great, Bobert. But remember, songs don't stop projectiles or nightsticks.

Course, bangin' one of them sticks against your head would be like taking coal to Newcastle.

You be careful. Y'ain't 20 anymore.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 06:17 PM

La palabra (the word) is "cojones", hombre. You say "cajones" een Mexico and they will laugh! CO-HO-NES!!!

As in...."Breeng me hees cojones!"


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Bobert
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 06:16 PM

Buddy Roemer, former Louisiana governor and current Republican presidential candidate who is being blackballed by the media and the Republican Party has endorsed Occupy Wall Street...

BTW, I will be attending the Charlotte, NC "Occupy Wall Street" assembly this Saturday...

As for the other Repubs dissing the movement??? That's a good thing... It would worry me if they weren't...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 06:02 PM

Good post, Don.

I heard today that various unions are adding their voices to it, but unfortunately some Democrats are also. I hope they are there as people, not Democrats.

I saw the same thing after McCarthy won the first primary in New Hampshire. All of a sudden Kennedy's people saw a safe ride. They hadn't had the cajones to do it first, but they were happy to wait and see what happened with Eugene. That, imo, was simply opportunism. I hope that even if the Dems try to co-opt this, that the protests continue anyway.

ymmv


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Don Firth
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 05:23 PM

The Wall Street protests are only the rumble of thunder off in the distance. The storm is definitely on its way, and, unlike the Tea Party, it is independent of the current corrupt political parties.   CLICKY #1.

This is also worth a look. A sort of "Manifesto" of those involved in the protests.   CLICKY #2. Click on the arrow to the right of each heading for further details.

This has to have something going for it because it is already being viciously attacked on Right Wing web sites as "Socialism!!" and "This would ruin the country!"

But—measures like this are fundamentally how FDR dug the country out of the Great Depression back in the Thirties. And this, of course, makes the Right Wing barf on their shoes because they've worked all this time to rescind the various measures and regulations that FDR put in place to end the Depression and prevent a recurrence. But the Right Wing wants to do the very same things that brought about the Depression in the first place. And the measure of their success is that they've managed to bring us to our present predicament.

"Those who will not learn from history. . . ."

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 04:28 PM

"Liberal" has different and pretty specific meanings in different contexts.

As to FFS's second attempt at a rational post
1. Agreed. Electoral reform should have been on the agenda last erection but only Kucinich went near it.
2. Yes, Citizens' United is probably wrong. Disclosure is the key, and you haven't got it.
3. Largely agreed. Maybe not all reinstated, but certainly considered for re-application. Funding of those voting for the repeals should be investigated - I suspect fraud and bribery. After the first sentence you wander off into dangerous realms, however.
4. You need a welfare state. What you propose is not enough, but it might be a start. I don't know how to lock it save by amendment of the constitution.
5. Unclear to me
6. Yes.

However, you overlook something even more vital - control of the media. The FCC balance requirement should be reinstated and applied to print and internet media too (excluding nutters like creationists) and there should be controls on concentration of media power - the present media are the reasons so many Americans are morons and vote for moronic things: they have been assiduously trained to be so. It is not the people, it is not the genetics, it is the reservation of decent education for the rich and accurate information for those already privileged.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,petecockermouth
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 04:10 PM

here too there is nothing much to choose between the 2/3 main political parties. both entirely in the pocket of big business, both as likely to support the illegal wars waged in the interests of capitalism. while labour start from the ideal of being on the side of ordinary people their record is shameful, in recent times being 'relaxed' about the wealthy stealing vast amounts from the rest of us while inequality just soars and common decency and solidarity is degraded. the conservatives do not even try to pretend they are working for everyone -they just supervise the acclumation of vast amounts of capital to big business and individuals. evil scum. anyway, i'm off down the pub

peace and love and revolution

pete


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 01:52 PM

Petecockermouth: "...(by the way, liberal(it means easy-going) in the uk is the default political description of most people."

In this country, 'liberal' no longer means that. Instead, they have been swayed and corrupted, to be supportive of the very billionaires that you have spoken of. So, if one 'attacks' the billionaires, but those billionaires SAY they support the programs of this administration, which in turn are promoting the very thing you pointed out, the 'not-so-bright' 'liberal' common folk, think you are attacking THEM!....no matter how obvious it is that they are duped beyond belief!
Here, the Democrats and Republicans support virtually the same thing, depending on who wraps it in whatever given rhetoric, that they can muster public support for.....long enough for them to en-act bullshit on us all!.....only to find out, that it doesn't work...then they blame it on each other!!!!!
We have become a divided nation, over the corrupt practices of their foul agenda!!!...which is total control over every aspect of our lives, and the stripping away of our freedoms!

Does this make sense to you, from your vantage point?

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 01:36 PM

Richard, the connecting reference was linked to the Chinese...as in 'Chinese tacos' and other activities in China, from the corporate Democrats.
Have an apricot.

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,petecockermouth
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 01:35 PM

all the best to the folk raising spirits and hope in the states. here in england we can only watch with horror what happens in your country while sickened by the fact that the entire world economy is run for the benefit of a few billionaires, mostly in your country. any voices raised in protest about this deserve all our thanks and support.(by the way, liberal(it means easy-going) in the uk is the default political description of most people. i live in the north (and the same is true of wales and particularly scotland) and can honestly say i have not had more than half a dozen conversations with any right wing or conservative people (far less republican/t party - i am afraid on this size of the pond sees them as weird, greedy and dangerous) in the last 30 years. most of us can see where our interests lie and instinctively understand that the rich and well-connected are engaged in a class war-stealing from ordinary folk the world over. usually, we just moan but let them get on with it -a fightback is long overdue so we aren't all dragged down by the death throes of the capitalist experiment. to the barricades, citizens!
(p.s. for americans -cockermouth is the name of my town - a town as delightful as it sounds)


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 01:33 PM

That happens to some women after 30....


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 01:32 PM

Oh, and there is this:

A few changes I personally would like to see should "We the People" actually get a voice in a land where "corporations are people, my friend" and "money is speech".

1. Public funding of elections.

Take the private and corporate money right out of the equation. Our elected representatives will then be required to work for ALL the American people, and not just for those who have backed and funded their campaigns.

2. Citizens United decision should be revoked.

Corporations are NOT people and money should NOT be entitled to speech, and the 5 Supreme Court judges who supported this corrosive decision should be investigated to see how they or their family members directly benefited from this action.

3. All legislative safeguards that have been dismantled over the last 30 years should be re-examined and exposed to the light of day.

Anti-monopoly legislation and especially Glass-Spiegel (which restricted banks to actual banking practices and prevented them from behaving like drunken sailors at a Las Vegas casino, which we now know was the direct cause of the US and global economic meltdown of 2007) should be updated and reinstated.
We have a total lack of real competition in major areas of our economy, this must be addressed and "too big to fail" eliminated. All legislation that rewards moving American jobs overseas must be revoked and legislation that does the opposite passed. All Free Trade agreements must also be reexamined in the light of saving and recreating American jobs.

4. All monies drained from Social Security and Medicare for other purposes should be refunded and locked in place

Successive governments have siphoned money from these programs to fund other, non productive activities, Engaging in unfunded wars drained much of Social Security, legislation that benefited corporate criminals only, such as Medicare Advantage and Medicare Part D, which were giveaways of taxpayer money to insurance and pharmaceutical corporations, put Medicare in troubled waters (intentionally, to justify eventual privatization). These programs could be put right by a tiny transaction tax on Wall Street trading. Once misappropriated taxpayer funds have been restored to these programs, the accounts should be locked to all purposes except those originally intended.

5. Revoke the Federal Reserve charter.

Our democratically elected government should be responsible for issuing our own legal tender, backed by the "full faith and credit" just as it is now, but without the debt to the bankster gangsters. I would prefer our government, open to oversight and answerable to the people, over a bunch of secretive banksters, with no oversight at all, any day. Could they possibly do worse than a private cabal, that we recently learned, thanks to Sen. Bernie Sanders, had secretly passed out 12 trillion dollars to their international bankster friends, including the Bank of Libya. 12 trillion dollars of unsecured loans, a debt that you and I, the American taxpayer, are on the hook for. Could YOU ever imagine going to your local bank and obtaining an unsecured loan, not likely.

6. Prosecute those responsible.

I believe we still have prosecutors in this country, you have to wonder "why aren't the bankster gangsters who crashed the global economy, and profited obscenely from it, being prosecuted for the demonstrable fraud that they committed?".

Many other good things would naturally follow, for our country and our people, the single, but incredibly difficult act, of prying the corrupting hands of corporate crooks and bankster gangsters, out of our government. A government that was meant to be "Of, By, and For the People", ALL the people, not just the 1% at the top.

We are now at a point where this is doable,not for nothing do polls show that fully 82% of Americans disapprove, 62% of that 82% "strongly disapprove", of the performance of our corrupted congress. (The 14% that approved may suggest just how large a number of Washington lobbyist's are employed by the corporates)"

Hmmm, does that sound 'right wing' or 'left wing'?
Who cares??

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 01:26 PM

Good heavens, I thought it was going to be the first - but then it all went pear-shaped.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 01:14 PM

Little Hawk: "The cat comment was mean, 999, no doubt about it. Other than that, I have no particular bone to pick with GfS....but if I was determined to go on a personal vendetta against this person (with whom I've had some interesting telephone conversations, and therefore probably know a bit better than the rest of you do)...well, THEN I'm sure that the cat comment alone would be sufficient excuse for me to damn GfS for all eternity. (I'm being satirical when I say that...I don't wish to damn anyone for all eternity)"

Why, It was so 'bad' that Bobert had it taken off the thread, about the cat, and re-posted it!!!.....after it was gone!
It was not intended to be 'mean', but rather to bring a wry grin on his face. Apparently, it wasn't taken that way.....but then, neither was:
"General Electric is planning to move its 115-year-old X-ray division from Waukesha , Wis. , to Beijing . In addition to moving the headquarters, the company will invest $2 billion in China and train more than 65 engineers and create six research centers. This is the same GE that made $5.1 billion in the United States last year. but paid no taxes-the same company that employs more people overseas than it does in the united States .

So let me get this straight. President Obama appointed GE Chairman Jeff Immelt to head his commission on job creation (job czar). Immelt is supposed to help create jobs. I guess the President forgot to tell him in which country he was supposed to be creating those jobs.


If this doesn't show you the total lack of leadership of this President, I don't know what does. Think about it before you buy a GE product.


It really shows the complete take over of our Democratic government by corporates and bankers. Until we reverse the criminal Supreme Court, Citizens United decision, that holds that corporations are people and money is speech, and fund election campaigns with public money, to stop the corporate and banker crooks from corrupting our elected officials, we will continue to be subjected to policies that serve the best interests of the biggest crooks, rather than the people, of this country.

Just so you know, Justices Kennedy, Roberts, Alito, Scalia and Thomas, were the 5 that held for the decision. Justices Stevens, Ginsburg, Breyer and Sotomayor, held against. This decision allows corporations, even foreign owned multinational corporations, from pouring unlimited, unaccounted, and unattributed monies into our political system to influence voters not just in elections, but also in referendums. They can purchase 100's of millions of dollars worth of commercial advertising to promote a candidate or a bill or destroy a candidate or bill.

If any further rigging were required, the above criminal activity can be combined with the fact that we are increasingly adopting electronic voting machines that have been repeatedly and publicly hacked in demonstrations, in as little as 15 minutes. But since the machines themselves are controlled by corporations, the hacking factor is pretty much redundant. No other democratic country uses them, for this reason. Might be worth considering the factors in play, by which we insist on using them.

In short, big money owns us lock, stock and barrel. And if big money determines slaves overseas should do our jobs, then that's the way it's going to be. But don't worry when Americans get desperate enough to work for SFA(Sweet F**k All); then the corporate assholes might just bring some jobs back here.

(As long as this IS the 'Wall Street Protesters...' thread....

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 09:41 AM

Stilly has class, insight and brains. She does her homework regarding issues. On more than a few occasions I've messaged her over the years to get her take on stuff, and she's been forthright and honest. I don't always see things her way, but I have always respected her view.

'sides, I ain't gonna argue with no one lives through a Texas heatwave. I can think of easier though not faster ways to meet my maker.

#######################################

My hope is that the Democrats don't get their hands on this protest, because it's never had a thing to do with them.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: akenaton
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 03:11 AM

"Stealth Weasel".......:0)


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 03:10 AM

I have never seen a rational post from Fugitive from Sanity, and its posts generally display either absurd disconnects from reality or a total disregard for those who would be harmed by the evils it seems to support.

SRS's recent posts here are however models of good sense.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: akenaton
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 03:05 AM

I would like to agree with you SRS, but I'm afraid that in the real world, the system (Capitalism) rules....everyone and everything is subserviant.

What we are seeing in the West, is a consequence of unregulated Capitalism......BUT, to serve the purposes of the nation, economic growth must be engendered, and expanded.....for ever.

The number one rule in Capitalism, is that we must keep producing and consuming wealth.
The truth is, that the system has become unsustainable, and will remain so until our standard of living has dropped to a level where we are once again globally competitive.

This of course will be unacceptable to us, our children and possibly grandchildren.
There is no way round this state of affairs, other than to completely reform society....and that is the difficult bit.
All our generation can do is make a start on the road by pointing out the terminal faults and contraditions which have become apparent in our present economic system.

The left needs to make a serious attempt to reach out to the coservative majority, both in the US and the UK and forget about the political dogma which has divided us for so long.

And that means stop pushing social policies which make division inevitable.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 12:51 AM

The cat comment was mean, 999, no doubt about it. Other than that, I have no particular bone to pick with GfS....but if I was determined to go on a personal vendetta against this person (with whom I've had some interesting telephone conversations, and therefore probably know a bit better than the rest of you do)...well, THEN I'm sure that the cat comment alone would be sufficient excuse for me to damn GfS for all eternity. (I'm being satirical when I say that...I don't wish to damn anyone for all eternity)

Anyway I'm not on such a vendetta. I know GfS reasonably well outside of this forum, and I know that although Gfs is not a perfect human being...and did make an insensitive remark about Bobert's cat...that is not the whole story and entirety of who GfS is.

GfS is an interesting character, an original thinker, and cannot be easily defined as the stereotypical rightwing monster that people here mistakenly imagine GfS to be. Not by a long shot.

I trust you know that I am firmly on the political Left, correct? I have been all my life. This does not blind me to gross stupidity and hypocrisy and lazy thinking and blind prejudice and deep dishonesty when it occurs on the Left which it often does..just as it does on the Right, but wearing a different mask of righteous fury. People on the Left are guilty of lazy thinking too...just like people are on the Right. GfS has criticized George Bush and the Bush administration stringently in the past, as well as criticizing Obama and his administration, and the banks, and the major corporations. No one here even notices when GfS criticizes Bush or various other people on the Right...but y'all go nuts when GfS criticizes Obama or the Democrats. Funny thing about that. People only seem to notice when their own ox is being gored.

GfS is not a perfect human devoid of all "sin", but is also not the awful stereotype Right Wing loonie you imagine. Not in the least. I know this from direct experience, accordingly I don't put the absolute worst possible interpretation on whatever GfS happens to say in some post here....but several of you do. And that is why nothing GfS says will ever satisfy you. You don't want to be satisfied, you just want to prove that GfS is the evil person you've decided you want GfS to be...to justify your state of anger.

That's a closed loop, like a snake eating its own tail, nothing good coms of it, and nothing I can say will change it, and I know that...so (shrug) I just wasted a whole bunch of keystrokes, didn't I?

C'est la vie. At least I got to express myself, and that's about as much as anyone here is ever going to get from indulging in their daily bit of hoo-hah on this forum. So my advice is: don't take it all so damn seriously. It'll only cause you a lot of pointless stress if you do. I'd rather be happy than be (supposedly) "right" at the expense of someone else on the other end on an internet connection.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 11:24 PM

From Ringo Starr:

.."It don't come easy,
You know it don't come easy.

It don't come easy,
You know it don't come easy.

Got to pay your dues if you wanna sing the blues,
And you know it don't come easy.
You don't have to shout or leap about,
You can even play them easy.

Forget about the past and all your sorrows,
The future won't last,
It will soon be over tomorrow...."

Channel it into your next gig!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Bobert
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 11:17 PM

Chinese tacos, GfinS, is an insane and insensitive remark...

Go f yourself...

Bye, again... You really need serious counseling...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 11:12 PM

How can a guy be so 'sensitive' to a cat, and so insensitive to the thousands who are losing their jobs, homes and hope?...and support the one who is expanding wars, fraudulent bailouts, and policies of hardships on this country??
Beats me.
I thought the humor might bring a smile to him...not a nervous breakdown.....but then maybe his cat was a Democrat, too.
GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 10:59 PM

Read GfS's remark on Bobert's cat thread, LH, then come back and sing his praises.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 08:12 PM

There is a great deal of intellectual sympathy with the Wall Street Occupation elsewhere in the country. Will it trickle through to the less acute in the population, those who are victims of Wall Street bankers but who have been convinced or frightened by the GOP into voting for candidates who don't support their best interests, who shill for rich industries and bankers?

SRS


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Bobert
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 08:08 PM

What Don said...

GfinS says that the Fed should be shut down??? That is a very irresponsible and radical position... When I have questioned her about the ramifications of shutting down the Fed or basic economic theory she seems to have no answers... What she does have when asked to back up her positions with facts is one of two defenses... Attack the questioner or post a music video...

I mean, both can be entertaining but neither show much depth of understanding about some rather basic stuff...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Don Firth
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 07:55 PM

Little Hawk, I was talking about GfS's POLITICAL position (or lack thereof).

Yes, he/she says he/she loves music, okay. Jolly good! He/she probably also likes filet mignon, going to movies, ice cream, etc., etc.

Loves the country? Odd way of showing it. PERSUASION is undoubtedly the best political tool, but instead of trying to state a position CLEARLY (which he/she has been asked about repeatedly, but repeatedly dodges the issue), he/she responds to any questions or disagreements with attacks on the questioner, loaded with insults about the questioner's intelligence, knowledge, honesty, and toilet habits.

This is not the way to persuade people of the validity of one's position.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 06:58 PM

Oh, come on, Don. He doesn't hate everything. To say so is just foolish hyperbole. GfS has made it plain in a great many posts that he loves music, and has posted numerous links to music videos of the music he loves.

Or she loves. As the case may be.

It is also clear that she (or he) loves his (or her) country...much as the rest of you do. You just can't agree on what to do about it, that's all. You do agree on some of the problems, but you can't seem to get together on solutions.

Mind you, solutions to a mess this big are almost impossible to even find, so I'm not surprised you can't agree on them.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 06:54 PM

There's a helluva lot of sniping and personal attack muddying the topic of this thread.

The "liberals" are a huge problem, their ideology of evolutionary socialism within the capitalist system is deep rooted, and they are prepared to grasp any straws in the wind to support them.

Ake, the problem in America is that people want all of the services and amenities of an advanced nation (health care, good food, safe drugs, safe roads and bridges, reliable planes, trains, and automobiles, good schools, good teachers, and much more) but they're not willing to pay for it. All of these various state tax revolts and federal GOP attempts to kill agencies and programs are revolting to liberals who understand that everyone has to pay their share, and the government has to lead the way in civil projects using tax dollars. And while mainstream middle class America does pay its taxes, they probably aren't paying as much as they should, and the rich and industry aren't paying any where near their share because of tax loopholes and exceptions, yet they use and impact all of those services and amenities also. The rich ARENT'T making jobs, they're just busy being idle as far as most of the rest of us can tell.

It should be illegal for local politicians to bargain away all tax supports in their communities, offering financial incentives to lure industries to their area. They push the tax burden (for what is now increased demand) onto everyone else to prop up that company, to cover the road and school and hospital taxes industry isn't paying, etc. But many communities do it, hoping that jobs alone and those new taxpayers will be enough to make things alright. It's an absurd way to do business.

The Occupy Wallstreet group may appear disorganized, but the voices we hear are clear, smart, and civil - something lacking in our politics for a long time. They are beginning to be heard as that spontaneous group identifies leaders. Those of you who are dismissing it, and in particular those of you who don't even live in the U.S., yet have such an apparently clear vision of how things should be here, should just sit on it for a while.

More power to them.

SRS


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Don Firth
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 06:53 PM

"As you know, I'm very articulate regarding my position."

Not that I've seen. On ANY of the threads you've posted on, GfS. Other than that you hate Obama's guts. You also hate anything vaguely resembling what you consider to be "liberal" (often displaying that you don't really know what the liberal position IS), yet you claim not to be conservative. You just hate everything.

Yet, several times I (and others) have asked you just where you're coming from and you respond with snotty remarks and insults.

"Ain't nothin' in the middle-of-the-road 'cept a yaller stripe and a dead skunk!!"   --Old folk saying.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 06:25 PM

It was a stealth weasel. You don't see them coming. You don't see them going.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: gnu
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 06:20 PM

"weasel"? Who?


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 05:51 PM

Akenaton, As you know, I'm very articulate regarding my position. That being said, I think that your post, in reply to my question to you, ..well..I don't know if I could have said it better myself!
Thank you! Bravo!..and WELL SAID!

Warmest Regards!

Guest from Sanity


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: akenaton
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 05:42 PM

Well in the last few post we have had a wide selection of wildlife.
A hawk, a gnu, a chimp and a weasel.
and of course Myself and Sanity.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 05:36 PM

"Occupy Wall Street" Unaired Fox Footage

biLL


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 05:16 PM

Because they LIKE monkeys! ;-D That's why.

(reminder, though: chimps are not monkeys)


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Don Firth
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 05:11 PM

GfS.

Ake.

And a monkey!

(Why are readers of this thread smiling?)

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,Chongo Chimp
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 04:59 PM

It's not surprisin' that they don't know what they want, considerin' they been led astray and fed a diet of useless propaganda and misleadin' commercial BS for their entire lives. You take the average human being now, put him in a forest with no cellphone, and he's totally lost. That speaks for itself, don't it? They been completely disempowered by the crazy social conditions they was born in.

- Chongo

p.s. What they really want is peace of mind and a secure sense of bein' in control of and able to manage their own lives adequately. They also want an honest system in place and a fair break for everyone. How they are gonna get all that remains a mystery...they sure as hell ain't gonna get it from Wall Street or from the stiffs in suits that they elected to govern them.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: akenaton
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 04:29 PM

No GfS I think you understand the situation well.

The "liberals" are a huge problem, their ideology of evolutionary socialism within the capitalist system is deep rooted, and they are prepared to grasp any straws in the wind to support them.

The election of Mr Obama was a typical example...a nod towards racial equality, but they failed to take on board that their token black man was steeped in Chicago capitalist politics an turned out to be a very divisive figure.....exactly what was planned by the "string pullers"
Change needs unity and in the USA folks will only unite under the banner of independence and good old fashioned common sense, agrass roots movement like the Tea Party could have been the mixing bowl for unity, but the short sighted dogma bound left branded them terrorists and are now reduced to fighting their battles through idealistic kids and wrinkled hippies.

A revolution in America will require a tactical retreat from what is laughingly referred to as "the left".

(Said as one who has marched and sometimes fought on the real left)


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 04:05 PM

So Ake, you being an 'outsider looking in', with no personal agenda at stake, would you say the 'left' is being voluntarily ignorant, and therefore vulnerable to manipulative lies?....or am I off base, here?

I'm open.....

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: akenaton
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 03:27 PM

SRS.....I have a very good friend with dual nationality and an interest in politics.......I know rather more about USA and the national perception than you think.

I think the American (left) would like to see a European/UK social and political model in place.......bad mistake, you have retained individual independence.....you do not see providing for yourself and your family as a penance....you do not believe the world owes you a living.

The American people are truly amazing, they can still show the world the way forward, but not through a trough of socialist/capitalist porage.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Don Firth
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 03:25 PM

Hmm! I thought "Babble-onians" had faded into the mists of history.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 03:10 PM

Don 'The Argumentative Know Nothing': "Everybody's "blind and stupid" except Guest from Sanity.
FROM sanity, indeed!!
Don Firth"

Don, there are a lot of people, other than me, who know what you don't see...or what you are not willing to look at.

Enough said.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: gnu
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 02:57 PM

Q... did ya see the coverage of their chant on Wall Street? "What do we want? We're not really sure! When do we want it? Now!"


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 02:15 PM

Loud sing cuckoo!

Grassroots? Time for fall cleanup.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Bill D
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 02:04 PM

Some cuckoos are extremely hardy and stay around when they find a place that feeds & tolerates them.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Don Firth
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 02:03 PM

Fascinating!

Everybody's "blind and stupid" except Guest from Sanity.

FROM sanity, indeed!!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 01:57 PM

Late in the year for cuckoos, surely.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 01:50 PM

If any of you have seen the 'protester's' demands, then you'd know, that these are lunatics, stirred up by bigger lunatics....but because it is 'fashionable', to be a lunatic, I guess you think it is quite alright....because being a 'FAR left' lunatic is the only way stupid and ugly people can get ANY attention!...otherwise, you'd just ignore them, and call them a name, and withdraw into your own little lunatic world.
The goal is to create unrest, so the corrupt sons of bitches can crack down on people that normally would be pissed off, at 'crackdowns'. This is contrived to cause a problem, so that a 'solution' can be proposed, and forced upon us.(sorta like the 'Fast and Furious' concoction).
How can people be so blind and stupid, too. At least Ray Charles, Stevie Wonder, and Jose Feliciano, we able to develop extraordinary skills, and sensitivities with their blindness....but this other crap, is for the utmost in stupidity!
Lap it up, it's this administration's most effective work!..The answer of course, will be mineral and oil being the standard, for the globalist elite, to trade, and microchips for the populace!....complete with 'termination' micro-processors...and death, if you refuse to take it. Economy should collapse this spring, if all goes as PLANNED!...Hey! Maybe Obama will suspend the elections, and then he can have another chance to extend his 'generosity' for another indeterminate term! ....but wasn't that the point? Then he and his globalist banking buddies will own you all, lock, stock and barrel!.....Oh, wait a minute, you had to sell your barrel to buy water???

GfS
Sounds like fun to me!


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 01:48 PM

I'm certainly not a Tea Partier nor a supporter of Wall Street's activities, but it seems to me that a protest should have specific objectives, and the protesting should be addressed to those who can help achieve those objectives.


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Subject: RE: BS: Wall Street Protesters...
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 04 Oct 11 - 11:38 AM

America isn't one thing, Ake, you're seeing the corporate outwardly propelled face conveyed by mainstream media. If you lived here you'd know that.

GfS, if you recall, the first hits on Sept 11 were on the financial district in New York City. Though they also targeted the Pentagon and the White House, they saw these as equal. I think the NY movement today makes perfect sense.

Songwronger, the Koch brothers are behind the tea party, just like Richard Mellon Scaife was the one behind the Whitewater "scandal" of the Clinton years. He manufactured it.

Etan, keep reporting, please.

One wonders when MoveOn.org will push out more pages helping this OccupyWallStreet group. It's a natural for them, they're covering it, but I don't see much chatter in their social media. They're probably trying to not make this a left-wing movement because it could be off-putting to some supporters, despite the predictions above.

SRS


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