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Thistle of Scotland

Marki 30 Sep 99 - 06:21 PM
katlaughing 01 Oct 99 - 09:03 AM
GUEST 10 Jan 11 - 01:07 AM
GUEST,leeneia 10 Jan 11 - 11:24 AM
Dave MacKenzie 10 Jan 11 - 11:28 AM
GUEST,Auldtimer 10 Jan 11 - 12:10 PM
Taconicus 10 Jan 11 - 12:36 PM
Jack Campin 10 Jan 11 - 01:01 PM
Jack Campin 10 Jan 11 - 01:01 PM
MMario 10 Jan 11 - 01:16 PM
Taconicus 10 Jan 11 - 01:21 PM
Jim McLean 10 Jan 11 - 01:52 PM
Geoff the Duck 10 Jan 11 - 02:58 PM
GUEST,leeneia 10 Jan 11 - 03:37 PM
GUEST,Allan Con 10 Jan 11 - 04:29 PM
Taconicus 10 Jan 11 - 04:42 PM
GUEST,leeneia 10 Jan 11 - 04:44 PM
GUEST,Auldtimer 10 Jan 11 - 04:46 PM
GUEST,Allan Con 10 Jan 11 - 05:01 PM
Gallus Moll 10 Jan 11 - 05:02 PM
Taconicus 10 Jan 11 - 05:25 PM
GUEST,leeneia 11 Jan 11 - 12:33 PM
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Subject: Thistle of Scotland
From: Marki
Date: 30 Sep 99 - 06:21 PM

Has anybody ever heard of a song by this name? (And no, I'm not getting it confused with "Flower of Scotland"!) I have it on a low-budget release from a Canadian artist, and totally love it. I assume it's traditional, but have never been able to find the words to it. I would attempt to write some of the lyrics that I know (or think I know), but as the singer has a really thick brogue, I'm not sure if I've got them right. If anybody had the lyrics or knows of other artists who do this song, (or something that could be the song I'm thinking of), I would really appreciate getting my hands on them. (The lyrics, NOT the person who knows the lyrics! It's been a really long day....) Thanks.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Oct 99 - 09:03 AM

Marki, thanks for asking this. Because of yoour question and my searching for an answer, I found a great site which is made up of hundreds of annotated folk music links! See the thread I just started on it, Good Website...100's of Folk Links, you may be able to find an answer on one of them. And, if you click on the Links, here, you will find a myriad of places to look, too.

Probably, though, someone on here will know what you are looking for and post it as soon as they get a chance to see this thread. Just keep checking, sometimes regular jobs get in the way and it might take a few days.

katlaughing


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 01:07 AM

Its my opinion it should be the Scottish National Anthem, bar none!! No references to old bitter enemies, battles, religion or monarchy .Just love of ones birthplace.

The thistle of Scotland
is eye dear to me.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 11:24 AM

I googled 'Thistle of Scotland' and found the following:

Features - The Rebels - Ceilidh Song Book - 'THE THISTLE O' SCOTLANDO, the Thistle o' scotland was famous of auld, Wi' its toorie sae snod and its bristles sae bauld; Tis the Badge o' my Country, it's aye dear tae me, ...
www.scotsindependent.org/songbook/thistle_scotland.htm

But then I couldn't get the link to open!

If anybody can get to this page, we'd have the words to a fine song.

BTW, I think the word aye (yes) should be ay (forever).


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 11:28 AM

I seem to remember Kenneth McKellar singing it on the White Heather Club.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: GUEST,Auldtimer
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 12:10 PM

No, it is not traditional and 'low-budget' is about the right level for this song. This is a kailyardy, sentimental pie cresh piece nonsence. Purple heather, bonny mountains, bare kneed kilted strappin lads ... a Scotland that never ever existed, and thank goodness too.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: Taconicus
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 12:36 PM

I was going to post a response on this in the wee hours this morning, but then I realized this was a question that was asked by someone in 1999, and the thread was only appearing now because some unidentified GUEST posted a non sequitur opinion, so the question is probably no longer relevant.

The Corries recorded a song some time ago called The Shamrock and the Thistle, but from Leeneia's post it looks like there really is a Thistle o' Scotland song buried out there somewhere, and from Auldtimer's post I imagine it might ought to remain buried. ;-)


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: Jack Campin
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 01:01 PM

That link opens for me:

THE THISTLE O' SCOTLAND
SUAICHEANTAS NA H-ALBA
(As sung by Willie Main)

   O, the Thistle o' Scotland was famous of auld,
   Wi' its toorie sae snod and its bristles sae bauld;
   Tis the Badge o' my Country, it's aye dear tae me,
   and thocht o' them baith brings the licht tae ma e'e.

Its strength and its beauty the storm never harms;
It stan's on its guard like a warrior in arms;
Yet its down is as saft as the gull's on the sea,
And its tassle as bricht as my Jeanie's blue e'e. [Chorus]

O, my country, what wonder yer fame's gane afar;
For yer sons hae been great baith in peace and in war;
While the sang and the tale live they'll aye win respect,
The lads neath the bonnets wi' thistles bedeckt. [Chorus]

Lang syne the invaders cam owre to our shore,
And fiercely our Thistle they scutched and they tore;
When they maist thocht it deid, twas then it up bore,
And it bloomed on their graves quite as strong as before. [Chorus]

My blessings be yours. Is there Scotcsman ava
Wad stan' by and see ony harm on ye fa' ?
Is there gentle or semple wha lives in our land
Wad refuse to drink health to the Thistle sae grand. [Chorus]

I have three issues of the Rebels Ceilidh Songbooks and it isn't in any of them.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: Jack Campin
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 01:01 PM

That link opens for me:

THE THISTLE O' SCOTLAND
SUAICHEANTAS NA H-ALBA
(As sung by Willie Main)

   O, the Thistle o' Scotland was famous of auld,
   Wi' its toorie sae snod and its bristles sae bauld;
   Tis the Badge o' my Country, it's aye dear tae me,
   and thocht o' them baith brings the licht tae ma e'e.

Its strength and its beauty the storm never harms;
It stan's on its guard like a warrior in arms;
Yet its down is as saft as the gull's on the sea,
And its tassle as bricht as my Jeanie's blue e'e. [Chorus]

O, my country, what wonder yer fame's gane afar;
For yer sons hae been great baith in peace and in war;
While the sang and the tale live they'll aye win respect,
The lads neath the bonnets wi' thistles bedeckt. [Chorus]

Lang syne the invaders cam owre to our shore,
And fiercely our Thistle they scutched and they tore;
When they maist thocht it deid, twas then it up bore,
And it bloomed on their graves quite as strong as before. [Chorus]

My blessings be yours. Is there Scotcsman ava
Wad stan' by and see ony harm on ye fa' ?
Is there gentle or semple wha lives in our land
Wad refuse to drink health to the Thistle sae grand. [Chorus]

I have three issues of the Rebels Ceilidh Songbooks and it isn't in any of them.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: MMario
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 01:16 PM

But at the mudcat there is no question too old to answer!


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: Taconicus
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 01:21 PM

In keeping with the recent cinematic 3-D revival craze, I'm constructing a stereo viewer so I can put those two posts by Jack Campin side-by-side and read it in 3-D. ;-)


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: Jim McLean
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 01:52 PM

Jack is correct in as much as the Thistle of Scotland, posted lyrics, does not appear in any edition of the Rebel Ceilidh Song Book.
The link is to a Scotsindependent web page which has confused the gaelic song Foghnan Na H-Alba, translated as the Badge of Scotland, which does appear in the Rebel Ceilidh S/B. However 'fothanna' is Gaelic for thistle. So the English title for the song sung by Donald Campbell printed in the Rebel Ceilidh Song Book is The Thistle of Scotland but an entirely different song as that posted above.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 02:58 PM

Taconicus - my 3-D specs only work if the posting is in red and then duplicated in green.
Quack!
GtD.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 03:37 PM

Thank you for posting, Jack. It looks like Auldtimer criticized the song without even seeing it, because there's nothing in it about heather, mountains or kilts. I'm glad for the chance (thanks to you) to see it for myself.

I like to learn about these sentimental songs because sometimes they have a wonderful melody which I can play on instruments. I may never learn the words at all.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: GUEST,Allan Con
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 04:29 PM

The poster who said it should be the national anthem bar none said it had no mention of old enemies and battles etc. I think the verse about the thistle ending up growing on invader's graves is more than a tad warlike and jingoistic :-)


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: Taconicus
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 04:42 PM

You say that like there's something wrong with being warlike and jingoistic. ;-)


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 04:44 PM

way to go, Taconicus.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: GUEST,Auldtimer
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 04:46 PM

Guest leenia, I know this song only too well, this is the stuff I have grown up with and have tried to live down.

Quote. The lads neath the bonnets wi' thistles bedeckt.

Quote. And its tassle as bricht as my Jeanie's blue e'e.

Quote. It stan's on its guard like a warrior in arms;

Tartainalia tosh, and mostly performed in a mock operatic style,with clasped hands and a faraway look in their tear glinted eye.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: GUEST,Allan Con
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 05:01 PM

You say that like there's something wrong with being warlike and jingoistic. ;-)


If we're going to be warlike then at last we could do it with a good , and a well known, lyric like Scots Wha Hae :-)


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: Gallus Moll
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 05:02 PM

I tend to be with Auldtimer on this one - -there are some contemporary songs that are great, others that somehow just miss the mark, use spellings /pronunciations that grate (heavy on the 'chs' itherrs, mitherrs and Jeanie's blue een etc) - it is a fine line, maybe you have to be Scottish to feel it - -?
- OK, sometimes (occasionally) it is not the fault of the song, but the delivery of the singer(s)!
One of my pet hates was Bonnie Mary o Argyll, partly because I had only ever heard it sung in a drawn-out, over-exaggerated way that made me want either to laugh or kill myself. At summer school I was sent off to learn it and sing it in a different way - a salutary lesson! It still is not part of my repertoire, but it did open my eayes - as did Runrig when they gave us their version of Loch Lomond which for most Scots had become hackneyed.
To get back to Thistle of Scotland - to me it is one of the 'tartan treasures' not a folk song - part of the sentimental, Brigadoon type of image of Scotland (and we are not the only country to suffer from this!) HOWEVER lets not forget that the National Trust for Scotland has just received a bequest from someone in the USA who appears to have had exactly this type of picture of 'the old country' - and it will be put to good use in the new Burns Museum and similar projects so - - ?


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: Taconicus
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 05:25 PM

In any kind of music, the preferred presentation changes with the age (by age I mean the date, not how old it is). Just listen to the (to us) overly bombastic and stylized vocalizations of songs that you'll hear on 78 RPM records from before WWII. Or even more recently, listen to the styles of popular presentations of Scottish and Irish music of the 1950s and 1960s. It all changes with time. And the same goes for the subject material. It's not really a matter of better or worse, it's the age and personal preference.


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Subject: RE: Thistle of Scotland
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 11 Jan 11 - 12:33 PM

I found a video with this song.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NJ7DRVwoQo&feature=related

The tune seems uninspired. I won't be adding it to my repertoire. However, if anybody's leading a pack of Cub Scouts, it would be great tune for Cub Scouts.


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