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Hungarian-English translators?

Jack Campin 28 Nov 11 - 12:57 PM
Jim Dixon 28 Nov 11 - 01:34 PM
Jack Campin 28 Nov 11 - 01:51 PM
SylviaN 28 Nov 11 - 02:07 PM
Mysha 28 Nov 11 - 02:19 PM
Dave the Gnome 28 Nov 11 - 02:55 PM
Jack Campin 28 Nov 11 - 04:22 PM
Dave the Gnome 28 Nov 11 - 05:58 PM
Jack Campin 28 Nov 11 - 08:00 PM
Mysha 28 Nov 11 - 08:51 PM
GUEST,Gerry 28 Nov 11 - 09:08 PM
Mrrzy 28 Nov 11 - 10:27 PM
GUEST,Gerry 28 Nov 11 - 10:54 PM
Jack Campin 29 Nov 11 - 08:16 AM
Georgiansilver 29 Nov 11 - 11:19 AM
Mysha 30 Nov 11 - 09:45 AM
Jack Campin 30 Jan 12 - 11:27 AM
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Subject: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 12:57 PM

Anybody here able to translate a short song from Csángó Hungarian into English? (I don't think the Csángó-isms are very difficult).


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 01:34 PM

Google Translate lehet fordítani magyarról angolra, és fordítva.


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 01:51 PM

Google gives up on the first word. I've tried Hungarian with it before and it's one of its worst-served languages - they haven't got the inflectional system anywhere near right, so they regard inflected forms as unknown roots most of the time. And Csángó dialect has inflections that were lost in standard Hungarian 200 years ago.

The song is an unusual version of a common "outlaw ballad", "Elment a madarka".


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: SylviaN
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 02:07 PM

Jack

Our friend, Andy Rouse, has lived in Hungary for over 20 years and teaches at Pecs University. He is also a translator (and a folkie).

I'll PM you with futher details.

Cheers

Sylvia (and Keith)


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Mysha
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 02:19 PM

Hi,

Would you mind posting the lyrics? Be it for inclusion in the database or to give me something from a new (to me) language to play with.

Bye,
                                                                                                                                  Mysha


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 02:55 PM

Didn't Monty Python do one? The only traslation I remember is "My nipples are bursting with delight"!

:D tG


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 04:22 PM

Elment a madárka idegen országba,
Azt üzente vissza, menjek el én oda.

Nem megyek én oda, idegen országba,
Meggyászolom itten feteke ruhába.

Délig fetekébe, délután fejérbe,
Estefelé fogval gyászos öltözerbe.

Gyüjj vissza madárka, üres a galicka,
Mert én adok néked fehér zsemlét enned.

Nem szoktam, nem szoktam fehér zsemlét enni,
Csak szoktam, csak szoktam jó regvel felkelni.

Jó regvel felkelni, harmat vizet enni,
Harmat vizet inni, búza fejet enni.
Harmat vizet inni, jó regvel felkelni.

[Moldavian Csángó ballad. From Etnofon ET-CD 079 (2005), "Nincs Pusztina békerítve", sung by Erszébet László. The tune is in the Nine Note Tune Book on my website.]


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 05:58 PM

Here you go :-)

(Sorry, Jack. Couldn't resist.)

:D


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 08:00 PM

Weird. Google was worse than the Monty Python phrasebook when I tried first, but did a lot better when I pasted the whole thing in.

He went to the bird alien country,
He sent word back, I go on there.

I will not go there, a foreign country,
Itten Meggyászolom feteke clothing.

Fetekébe noon, afternoon, Fejér,
In the evening öltözerbe very sad.

GyĂĽjj bird back, empty galicka,
For I give thee eat white buns.

I do not, I do not eat white bread rolls,
Only I do, but I usually wake up good regvel.

Regvel good to get up, take water from dew,
Dew to drink water, eat wheat heads.
Dew water to drink, good regvel to get up.

I guess "regvel" is Csángó for "reggel", "breakfast" (come to think of it I believe I may have heard that in use). That's all I can guess. It seems to be a lyrical dialogue describing an outlaw's lifestyle, part of a longer story left implicit. Maybe the bird is carrying messages between the outlaw in exile and his lover back home?


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Mysha
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 08:51 PM

Hm

Doesn't mean much to me yet.

But it would seem to fit better if "regvel" was "morning".

Bye
                                                                  Mysha


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 09:08 PM

I've sent this to a Hungarian friend of mine, but I doubt he's familiar with Csango, so don't count on my coming back with anything useful.


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 10:27 PM

The little bird is who went - here is my so far but I'll ask Mom:

-Away went the little bird to the idegen country
-What they (s/he) wrote back was, would I go there too

-I will not go there, to the idegen country
-(Until I have to wear?) black clothes here {until I am widowed?)

-Noon is darkening, afternoon is going to/becoming somewhere/thing
-As the evening progresses I get sadder and sadder

-Show (Get) yourself back here, little bird, my little (?) is empty
-Because I (was the one who) fed you white buns

-I don't (?), I don't (?) eat white buns
-I only (?), I only (?) wake up (on?) nice morning(s?)

-Wake up on a good morning, drink some dew
-Drink some dew, eat some wheat heads
-Drink some dew, wake up (on a) good morning.

nice song!


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 28 Nov 11 - 10:54 PM

Here's what my friend sent me:

Elment a madárka idegen országba,
The little bird went to a foreign country

Azt üzente vissza, menjek el én oda.
He sent back the message, that I should go there

Nem megyek én oda, idegen országba,
I won't go there, to that foreign country

Meggyászolom itten feteke ruhába.
I will mourn from here in black clothes

Délig fetekébe, délután fejérbe,
In black until noon, in white in the afternoon

Estefelé fogval gyászos öltözerbe.
Toward evening in mourning clothes

Gyüjj vissza madárka, üres a galicka,
Come back little bird, empty is the galicka (don't know this word)

Mert én adok néked fehér zsemlét enned.
For I will give you white buns to eat

Nem szoktam, nem szoktam fehér zsemlét enni,
I usually don't eat white buns

Csak szoktam, csak szoktam jó regvel felkelni.
I usually just wake up in the morning (as you say, regvel may or may not mean the same as in standard Hung.)

Jó regvel felkelni, harmat vizet enni,
Wake up with the good morning, drink the water of the dew.

Harmat vizet inni, búza fejet enni.
Drink water of the dew, eat the head of the wheat

Harmat vizet inni, jó regvel felkelni.
Same as above lines.


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 29 Nov 11 - 08:16 AM

I guess "galicka" must be "nest".

I understand a lot more about this song now. I first heard it sung by local Csángó women at Fundu Racaciuni (Hungarian: Külsőrekecsin) in Romanian Moldavia, where they were hosting a folkcamp for Hungarian folkies. That was the song that really stood out for me - they sang it with tremendous feeling and got the visitors doing it beautifully. I wanted to know what that passion was about.

Külsőrekecsin is a small village half an hour's travel on a dirt road from the nearest town (Bacau/Bakó). Electricity is intermittent and sanitation nonexistent, with no piped water or sewage. The place is mostly kept running by middle-aged and old women, as the men have all gone to Hungary to work; one woman we talked to had not lived with her husband for 17 years. Local transport is still largely by oxcart. They still weave a lot of their own cloth and make their own clotheses from raw materials. The fences are falling to bits and they work with broken hand tools held together with wire and string - no machinery has been repaired since the fall of Communism. And they love the place. It's easy to see why; it's the nearest to a sel-sufficient, sustainable culture I've ever seen, and its traditions go back centuries.

This is a song putting the viewpoint of a woman who wants to stay at home rather than join her outlaw lover in his foreign lifestyle. You can see why it speaks for those women today.


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 29 Nov 11 - 11:19 AM

There ya go folks... which language do you want to translate?


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Mysha
Date: 30 Nov 11 - 09:45 AM

Hi George,

Csángó to Frisian, please.

Thanks,
                                                                Mysha


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Subject: RE: Hungarian-English translators?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 30 Jan 12 - 11:27 AM

I found the tune I heard this sung to on YouTube, but attached to a different text (about which I know nothing). The second song of this set:

Eszter Kovács: three Moldavian songs


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