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Live Music Bill - please help

GUEST,The Shambles 08 Jan 12 - 06:27 PM
YorkshireYankee 09 Jan 12 - 05:40 PM
GUEST,The Shambles 12 Jan 12 - 11:15 AM
GUEST 16 Jan 12 - 06:41 PM
GUEST,The Shambles 18 Jan 12 - 07:08 AM
GUEST,The Shambles 18 Jan 12 - 07:56 AM
GUEST,The Shambles 19 Jan 12 - 03:55 AM
Richard Bridge 19 Jan 12 - 04:00 AM
GUEST,The Shambles 19 Jan 12 - 04:17 AM
GUEST,The Shambles 19 Jan 12 - 10:09 AM
GUEST,The Shambles 19 Jan 12 - 10:13 AM
GUEST,The Shambles 19 Jan 12 - 05:40 PM
YorkshireYankee 19 Jan 12 - 10:32 PM
GUEST,The Shambles 20 Jan 12 - 05:36 AM
GUEST,The Shambles 20 Jan 12 - 05:40 AM
GUEST,The Shambles 20 Jan 12 - 05:59 AM
GUEST,The Shambles 20 Jan 12 - 11:21 AM
GUEST,The Shambles 20 Jan 12 - 12:19 PM
Mo the caller 20 Jan 12 - 12:32 PM
GUEST,The Shambles 20 Jan 12 - 12:51 PM
ChrisJBrady 20 Jan 12 - 01:28 PM
GUEST,The Shambles 20 Jan 12 - 01:37 PM
YorkshireYankee 20 Jan 12 - 03:14 PM
GUEST,The Shambles 20 Jan 12 - 04:19 PM
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Subject: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 08 Jan 12 - 06:27 PM

The following from Hamish Birchall

Please circulate

Despite its progress so far, the success of the Live Music Bill is not guaranteed:
http://services.parliament.uk/bills/2010-11/livemusichl.html

On 20th January it must be debated again in the House of Commons, a stage known as Report and 3rd Reading. This is in effect the last hurdle. The more MPs that attend and support the Bill, the greater its chances of becoming law.

PLEASE WRITE TO YOUR MP:

Ask them to attend the debate and if necessary vote in favour of a closure motion on the preceding business (to allow time for debate on the Live Music Bill) and, of course, to vote for the Live Music Bill itself.

It is important to write a personal letter, but general points to make include:

The entertainment licence exemptions for live music proposed by the Bill are essential if live music in grassroots venues is to flourish.

The exemptions apply only to performances between 8am and 11pm, and, for amplified live music, to audiences of no more than 200.

The Bill preserves licence review safeguards for residents near pubs and bars.

The Bill is supported not only by the Government and the Opposition, but also by the music industry, performers' unions, arts organisations, and now by the Local Government Association.

If you don't know who your MP is this website enables to identify them using your postcode and email them:www.theyworkforyou.com

Many thanks
Hamish Birchall


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: YorkshireYankee
Date: 09 Jan 12 - 05:40 PM

Here's a blicky: http://www.theyworkforyou.com/

Thanks for the heads-up, Haimish!


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 12 Jan 12 - 11:15 AM

http://kerrymccarthy.wordpress.com/2012/01/10/live-music-bill-this-friday/


Kerry McCarthy MP writes on Live Music Bill report stage and explains some of the pitfalls.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Jan 12 - 06:41 PM

The following from Hamish Birchall

By this Friday afternoon, 20th January, the Live Music Bill could be a historic success - or a historic failure.

It all turns on the number of supportive MPs that attend the debate. A minimum of 100 must be there to ensure that, if necessary, there is a successful 'vote of closure' on debate on the Daylight Saving Bill, which precedes the Live Music Bill.   The Daylight Saving Bill is controversial and there may be MPs intending to 'talk it out'. If that happened the Live Music Bill may not have enough time to be debated and would fail. It might be revived in the next Parliamentary session, but reform could be delayed for months or even years.

Labour MP Kerry McCarthy, who sat on the Live Music Bill during its Committee stage, has already warned of this possibility in her blog:
http://kerrymccarthy.wordpress.com/2012/01/10/live-music-bill-this-friday/

So if you have not already written to your MP, please do so now:

Ask them to attend the debate and if necessary vote in favour of a closure motion on the preceding business (to allow time for debate on the Live Music Bill) and, of course, to vote for the Live Music Bill itself.

It is important to write a personal letter, but general points to make include:

The entertainment licence exemptions for live music proposed by the Bill are essential if live music in grassroots venues is to flourish.
The exemptions apply only to performances between 8am and 11pm, and, for amplified live music, to audiences of no more than 200.
The Bill preserves licence review safeguards for residents near pubs and bars.
The Bill is supported not only by the Government and the Opposition, but also by the music industry, performers' unions, arts organisations, and now by the Local Government Association.

If you don't know who your MP is this website enables to identify them using your postcode and email them:
www.theyworkforyou.com

Once again, many thanks.
Hamish Birchall


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 07:08 AM

http://www.morningadvertiser.co.uk/General-News/ALMR-urges-MPs-to-back-last-stage-of-Live-Music-Bill

ALMR strategic affairs director Kate Nicholls said: "We are strongly urging MPs to support this Bill in Parliament, as it reaches its final hurdle.

"The potential benefits from the Bill becoming law are vast – both culturally and economically. It will free venues from burdensome red tape and create diversity of service and offer, helping to boost trade and sustain viability.

"More pubs could play a vital part in their community by being able to host young up-and-coming bands and artists, encouraging others to take up a musical instrument."


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 07:56 AM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-16600243

John King comments:
Preview of Friday's proceedings in the House of Commons. Looks like it will be a photo finish for the Live Music Bill...


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 19 Jan 12 - 03:55 AM

http://oliverheald.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/super-friday/

John King comments:
Oliver Heald blogs about the Live Music Bill. The MP for North East Herts has supported the live music licensing reform for a while now and will be attending the vote on Friday.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 19 Jan 12 - 04:00 AM

If it didn't apply to amplified music I'd be all for it.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 19 Jan 12 - 04:17 AM

The Live Music Bill may not be the ideal solution that will keep everyone happy (if there ever could be such a thing) but despite a lot of talk, it is the only change in the law that is actually being proposed to free live music from those who are more suited to dealing with the licensing of street markets and taxis.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 19 Jan 12 - 10:09 AM

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/2010-2012/0260/amend/pbc2601801a.4011-4017.html

Amendments to the Daylight Saving Bill mount up threatening to talk the Live Music & the Local Government Ombudsman Bills out of time.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 19 Jan 12 - 10:13 AM

http://www.musicweek.com/story.asp?sectioncode=1&storycode=1048174&c=1

UK Music tries to round up 100 MPs to vote on a motion of closure for the Daylight Saving Bill.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 19 Jan 12 - 05:40 PM

http://www.xfm.co.uk/news/bill-to-determine-future-of-live-music-to-appear-in-parliament

It's taken almost three years of lobbying for the bill to get this far but despite it being on the agenda in Parliament if less than 100 MPs decide to show up for it it won't be debated and therefore it won't be able to go any further.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: YorkshireYankee
Date: 19 Jan 12 - 10:32 PM

I have just written, and thought I'd post my letter here; if you're having trouble thinking of what to write, please feel free to steal bits of it...

Dear Mr. Blunkett,

My husband and I are writing to ask you to attend today's debate and vote for the Live Music Bill -- and to vote for closure of debate on the Daylight Saving Bill preceding it, should there be a filibuster attempt. Please do your part to prevent that debate -- which promises to accomplish very little -- from suffocating a bill which will accomplish something of immediate and substantial value.

Live music is an important part of both our lives, and we were very worried when the Licencing Act passed in 2003. In the six years since it has come into effect, smaller venues with limited funds have suffered, as have the musicians they feature, thanks to certain provisions -- meant to limit much larger and louder entertainments -- which have unfairly (often ridiculously) restricted the viability of these smaller venues as well as the generally brilliant-but-not-famous musicians (usually acoustic) who depend on playing such venues to earn a (modest) living,

The Live Music Bill should redress some of the unfortunate and unintended consequences of the Licensing Act, without reducing its effectiveness, since:
1) Its exemptions apply only to performances from 8am to 11pm, (and to audiences of no more than 200, if amplified live music is involved).
2) It preserves licence review safeguards for residents near pubs and bars.

As you probably already know, the Live Music Bill is supported by the Government and the Opposition, as well as the music industry, performers' unions, arts organisations, and by the Local Government Association.

Its proposed exemptions are vital if live music in smaller, local, everyday venues is to flourish in England, and it would be truly shameful if such a sensible, beneficial and well-respected bill were to fail simply because fewer than 100 MPs could be bothered to stay an extra hour or two on a Friday afternoon. I understand you are an unbelievably busy man with very important things to do, but this is one of those (all too rare) times when a small(ish), simple action could have a major impact.

The power to improve the lives of a vast number of "unimportant" people is in your hands today. Please use it well.

Yours sincerely,

Vikki & Iain Fielden


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 20 Jan 12 - 05:36 AM

http://news.bbc.co.uk/democracylive/hi/house_of_commons/newsid_9682000/9682121.stm

Live coverage of the Live Music Bill. The Bill won't be read unless 100 MPs pass a motion of closure on the Daylight Saving Bill.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 20 Jan 12 - 05:40 AM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-16628724

That in turn threatens the widely-supported Live Music Bill - although it is possible to rush a bill through its remaining stages in remarkably little time, if no-one objects


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 20 Jan 12 - 05:59 AM

Its proposed exemptions are vital if live music in smaller, local, everyday venues is to flourish in England, and it would be truly shameful if such a sensible, beneficial and well-respected bill were to fail simply because fewer than 100 MPs could be bothered to stay an extra hour or two on a Friday afternoon

That sums it up well............


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 20 Jan 12 - 11:21 AM

http://www.livemusicforum.co.uk/text/plbulletin19.html

The following from Phil Little.

Friday 20th January 2012 - Live Music Bill passes Report stage

Today Lord Clement Jones' Live Music Bill passed the Report stage in the House of Commons.

Although the live music lobby's target of 100 plus MPs were present, things looked decidedly risky when the debate on the Daylight Saving Bill, the first Bill on the list, occupied the entire session and at 1-30 pm the Live Music Bill looked doomed, with not enough time to be debated.

However, at the end of the session the names of the Bills that have not been dealt with are read out, and, if nobody shouts "Objection !", then the Bill can proceed.

It is unusual for a Bill to proceed without objection at this stage, but, this was the case with the Live Music Bill which was passed in about two seconds. "Even Chope said Aye!" tweeted Kerry McCarthy (Labour MP for Bristol East) who has been quite vocal in supporting the Live Musc Bill.

This is perhaps the most difficult obstacle the Live Music Bill has had to overcome and it is difficult to see how the Bill can fail to becomem law now.

More celebrations ! I hear UK Music are already throwing a party in the Parliament buildings.

Keep Live Music

Phil Little
Live Music Forum


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 20 Jan 12 - 12:19 PM

http://www.morningadvertiser.co.uk/General-News/MPs-vote-in-favour-of-live-music

British Beer & Pub Association chief executive Brigid Simmonds said: "This really is music to our ears. Pubs are where live music begins – and for years, we've been saying that many of the regulations surrounding it are unnecessary – they have prevented publicans from making the most of Britain's pubs as the place where live music acts first get a foothold.

"Well done to MPs for voting this through – let's make it the first of many measures to cut the red tape surrounding pubs."


John King comments:
Royal assent is a formality and is expected when the Bill returns to the Lords next week.

My thanks go to everyone..............................


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: Mo the caller
Date: 20 Jan 12 - 12:32 PM

MPs get it right, for once.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 20 Jan 12 - 12:51 PM

Yes - I'm not too sure if they know they got it right or just what happened. This, as it happens account, is the nearest to an explanation of the quite baffling events of today in the commons.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-16654300

It is technically possible to rush through the report and third reading of the Live Music Bill, if absolutely no-one objects, but it will be tight. Lib Dem Alan Reid has just attempted to drop an amendment he's been pursuing, presumably in order to save a little time, but he's been told it's too late, because MPs are voting on whether or not to vote on it; and if they agree to vote on it, the vote must go ahead.

UPDATE @2.30pm: This is extraordinary! MPs have just spent five hours debating the Daylight Saving Bill and it has run out of time without even getting out of report stage; but the Live Music Bill - which has never been debated on the floor of the Commons at all - has been waved through into law.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: ChrisJBrady
Date: 20 Jan 12 - 01:28 PM

Now to thank all MPs who helped push this through?


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 20 Jan 12 - 01:37 PM

http://networkedblogs.com/sYfor

.....The devil will be in the detail, and never underestimate the complexities and "transition provisions" yet to be dreamed up to complicate the system and make it more costly...but this is a victory, most notably for that completely indefatigable campaigner on the issue, jazz drummer Hamish Birchall.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: YorkshireYankee
Date: 20 Jan 12 - 03:14 PM

And there was much rejoicing...
Hoorah!


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 20 Jan 12 - 04:19 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-16657152

Separate to the private member's bill, the government is conducting its own review of the Licensing Act.

A consultation paper launched by Tourism Minister John Penrose in September proposed scrapping much of the act.

Mr Penrose called current regulations "a mess" and said licences were being issued "for many events where there is little or no risk of trouble".

Potentially more far-reaching than the private member's bill, his paper looked at relaxing the rules on everything from plays and live music to indoor sports.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 21 Jan 12 - 03:20 AM

Now to thank all MPs who helped push this through?

In the end, all that was required was for 100 MPs to say nothing - a true miracle...................

MPs have yet to debate this ACT! A few MPs may deserve our thanks, especially those who attended at our invitation but most of the work was done in the Lords.

I find it difficult to find much gratitude to the Lib Dem peers, for it was they who gave us the Licensing Act 2003, by voting for it, with the then Labour Govt.

Had the Lib Dem peers continued their opposition and voting - the Bill would have fallen.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Jan 12 - 06:49 AM

The following from Hamish Birchall

The Live Music Bill, co-sponsored by Lord Clement-Jones and Don Foster MP, cleared its last Commons hurdle on Friday (20th Jan).

It is now on the home straight to becoming law. Two minor amendments agreed in Commons Committee must be ratified in the Lords, probably within a fortnight, and dates set for Royal Assent. Implementation will require secondary legislation. A lead-in period of several months is likely to allow time for the live music sections within statutory Licensing Guidance to be rewritten.

The Bill represents a historic shift in the treatment of live music
under the law. The Licensing Act 2003, and many preceding Acts,
embodied a presumption against most performances unless first licensed, on pain of criminal law sanctions. This harsh treatment, dating back more than 250 years, will end for performances within certain hours and to a relatively small audience. The potential risks are already regulated by separate legislation.

While there were and are rational grounds for licensing large events, there is also a puritanical streak in English culture that was amplified by licensing legislation. The enduring puritanism was expressed in often unreasonable objections to even the mildest live music licence applications, with absurd over-regulation and enforcement by many local authorities.

The Bill could easily have been sunk by a combination of tedious
filibustering on Daylight Saving Bill amendments and arcane
Parliamentary procedure. Indeed, it came very close to failing, not
because of insufficient numbers in the House to carry a vote (over 130 MPs), but lack of time.

Debate yesterday started at 9.30am and had to finish by 2.30pm. The end time arrived and MPs were still on the Daylight Saving Bill. Many observers present thought the Live Music Bill had been lost.

Lord Clement-Jones said: 'I was sitting there and I was absolutely,
completely confounded. I had no idea what was happening when the
Daylight Saving Bill was up.'

Then, as one observer in the public gallery put it, 'something weird
happened'.   MP Philip Davies, the last in a succession of honourable members grinding through DSB amendments, suddenly sat down as the Speaker, Nigel Evans, stood up and shouted 'Order, order'. The remaining private members bills titles were read out. Next up was the Live Music Bill.

There followed a short exchange between the Speaker and Don Foster, and the Bill was passed to a loud chorus of 'Ayes', with no objections.
(View on Parliament tv, scroll to 4hrs 55mins:
http://www.parliamentlive.tv/Main/Player.aspx?meetingId=9853 )

The good news flashed quickly around arts and music media:

Jo Dipple, acting chief executive of UK Music, the UK commercial music industry's umbrella body, said: "This is a great day for music. The Live Music Bill will make a real and positive difference to lives of musicians. There is no doubt that the current Licensing Act has created needless layers of bureaucracy - making it complicated and expensive for pubs and other small venues to
host live gigs. The entire industry would like to thank Lord
Clement-Jones and Don Foster MP who have made this change possible."

John Smith, Musicians Union General Secretary, added: "We are delighted that the Live Music Bill has finally made it through
Parliament. It is a real achievement for a Private Member's Bill to get through and the MU would like to thank Lord Clement-Jones, Don Foster and all of the other MPs who helped to pass this Bill."
http://www.basca.org.uk/news/live-music-bill-passes-third-reading-and-report-stage/

Links to other press coverage:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-16657152
http://www.thestage.co.uk/news/newsstory.php/34983/live-music-bill-close-to-becoming-law

Heartfelt thanks is certainly due to Lord Clement-Jones, Don Foster, the licensing minister John Penrose, many other MPs and Peers who have tenaciously campaigned within Parliament, especially John Whittingdale, Chair of the Culture Select Committee, also to the civil servants and lawyers who have worked hard behind the scenes on the bill, and indeed to the Coalition government.

But the time is not yet ripe to celebrate. That should be saved for the day the new law comes into effect. And it will take many months, perhaps years, for the full benefit to be realised by musicians, venues and the music loving public.

The sharp decline of small gigs in pubs coincided with reform of
entertainment licensing in 1982, when local authorities were given
powers to set their own fees. These quickly rose by several hundred
percent, and by 2000 the Home Office estimated fewer than 10% of pubs had entertainment licences, although all of them could still have one or two live performers (the 'two in a bar rule').

But even that modest musical provision was abolished by the 2003 Licensing Act, legislation that marks the highwater point of regulation of live music through licensing. It was under this Act that even providing musical instruments became a potential criminal offence unless licensed. This ranges from pub pianos to instruments provided by schools for concerts.

The Live Music Bill does away with that requirement.

One long-time campaigner asked me yesterday what I would do next. I am not against licensing regimes per se. Where there are serious risks to the public, inadequately regulated by separate legislation, prior public consultation may be necessary and proportionate.

To that end, perhaps MPs should be licensed.

ENDS


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 22 Jan 12 - 03:07 PM

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/2010-2012/0241/2012241.pdf

A
B I L L
TO

Amend the Licensing Act 2003 with respect to the performance of live music entertainment; and for connected purposes.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 24 Jan 12 - 07:49 PM

http://www.eveningnews24.co.uk/news/boost_to_norwich_pubs_and_live_music_1_1183885

Norwich publicans celebrate the Live Music Act.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 24 Jan 12 - 08:03 PM

http://services.parliament.uk/bills/2010-11/livemusichl.html

John King comments:
Live Music Bill on the home straight. Consideration of amendments will be Friday 27th Jan. Royal assent can be given on the same day.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 24 Jan 12 - 08:29 PM

http://www.musicweek.com/story.asp?sectioncode=1&storycode=1048239

Chair of the Local Government Association's Culture, Tourism and Sport Board, Cllr Chris White said: "Councils already have a strong track record of working with a wide variety of groups to run events which enrich their local communities. We are fully in favour of making it easier for people to hold concerts, plays and public events and we support the aim of making the process as easy, transparent and free from red tape as possible.

When will the embarrassing Mr White finally resign to enable a person with some remaining credibility to replace him?


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 25 Jan 12 - 08:26 AM

http://www.cambridgenetwork.co.uk/news/article/default.aspx?objid=86669

The Bill, which allows live music to be played in pubs and other small venues without red tape licensing restrictions, has been welcomed by Cambridge MP, Julian Huppert.

"This Bill will bring huge advantages to small venues that are being crippled by unnecessary licensing restrictions," he said. "It means publicans and the organisers of small events held in school and village halls across the city will not have to apply for licenses to play music.

"This simple easing of the present restrictions could mean the difference between a pub surviving or struggling to attract customers in this difficult economic climate.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 25 Jan 12 - 10:52 AM

http://www.nme.com/news/various-artists/61599

UK small venues will be given a big boost by 'Live Music Act', industry expert declares


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 25 Jan 12 - 11:09 AM

""I find it difficult to find much gratitude to the Lib Dem peers, for it was they who gave us the Licensing Act 2003, by voting for it, with the then Labour Govt.

Had the Lib Dem peers continued their opposition and voting - the Bill would have fallen.
""

One has to remember that if the LibDem peers had NOT voted for the 2003 Act, it would have reverted to the "two in a bar" rule which was being narrowly interpreted, and precluding singarounds and sessions by strictly sticking to the "two only per event" concept, backed up by the judiciary.

In a sense they did us a big favour, as we will now presumably be able, in sub 200 capacity venues, to have as many performers as we wish.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 25 Jan 12 - 12:44 PM

In a sense they did us a big favour, as we will now presumably be able, in sub 200 capacity venues, to have as many performers as we wish.

Yes but only up to 11pm. When any live music taking place in any venue after this time, will be liable to the max £20,000 fine or 6 months in prison and this in venues that are now able to open to serve alcohol for much longer.

And if the then Bill had fallen - opening times would have also remained.

Perhaps we should look at this quite so narrowly? Sessions may have suffered and may still suffer, because the official mind still does not seem to be able to grasp the concept. But the old legislation did at least enable conventional solo acts and duos to escape the requirement for additional entertainment licensing.

I would like to think that if the whole Act had fallen, the live music issues would have been examined as a result. But who knows? We have what we have now and, with this Govt's own proposals for the reform of Schedule 1, we may obtain even more yet.

My fear is that although the Govt's proposals may go ahead and address non-musical performances, that in order to bring these in to line with the Live Music Bill but in face of opposition from the LGA Group lobby, live music will not gain any further benefit.....

But that is up to us.......


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 25 Jan 12 - 12:51 PM

http://www.bighospitality.co.uk/Venues/Live-Music-Bill-for-pubs-needs-to-be-implemented-sooner-says-BBPA

In this piece of audio BigHospitality talked to Dawn Hopkins, owner of the Norwich Bear Brewing Company and two pubs, and Brigid Simmonds, chief executive of the British Beer and Pub Association (BBPA) who agreed the legislation changes would encourage pubs to apply for music licenses.

Simmonds also called on the Government to speed up the implementation of the law once passed and now consider other areas of deregulation or changes to the Licensing Act 2003 to help struggling pubs.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 25 Jan 12 - 01:07 PM

What should have happened in 2003 was very simple. Unamplified music should have been exempted in otherwise licensed premises.

What should happen now is just as simple - and we are not getting it, and when, inevitably, noise complaints go through the roof we will get something totally shitty back again. This is a poisoned chalice.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 25 Jan 12 - 04:01 PM

Somewhat off topic, but I believe relevant.


http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/6844
is the URL for a petition to the government to get seriously tough with the Pubcos this time.

When I signed this afternoon it had fewer than 2,000 signatures and there is only three weeks left in which to push that over the 100,000 needed for it to be debated.

If we lose many more pubs we won't have any venues left in which to enjoy our new unlicensed music.

Please, all UK Catters, sign it asap.

I have also posted this on Farcebook.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 25 Jan 12 - 08:49 PM

What should happen now is just as simple - and we are not getting it, and when, inevitably, noise complaints go through the roof we will get something totally shitty back again. This is a poisoned chalice.

The reaction against generally sensible alcohol serving hours shows us that there is some danger in this but that does not mean that we have to continue to accept the current over-regulation of live music and the strange and unequal concepts on which it is based.

We may expect a knee-jerk reaction from those who cannot tell the difference between encouraging free expression in music and encouraging noise pollution. We are already seeing this being encouraged by the LGA Group lobby.

But those of us who do know the difference should not encourage the widely accepted concept to be held, that music and noise pollution are one and the same thing and that additional entertainment licensing permission can be of any use in dealing with noise pollution. The only thing acheived by this assumption is the current confusion.

We should also not encourage the concept that complaints about actual noise pollution, whether this emanates from live music or from any other source, are the same as objections that are encouraged to be made during planning and licensing processes about live music and often before a note has been sounded. Often by those who will use anything available - whatever the cost may be.

No one should be subjected to actual measuable noise pollution, from whatever source this may emanate from.

There needs to be no panic. Should there be any increase in actual noise complaints, which are arising from any source and at any time - this should be investigated to establish if this is really reflecting an increase in noise pollution. Then any shortcomings in the abilty of existing anti-noise legislation to deal with noise pollution should be addressed. We could even have a Govt consultation on it.............

What cannot be permitted to happen again is for all live music (whether it is likely to cause noise pollution or not) - to be limited and used as a scapegoat in the vain attempt to placate the very vocal few, who will not be placated by anything anyway and who assume that they have some right to prevent the enjoyment of others and who will grasp any excuse in order to do this.

The main opposition to any further reform comes from the LGA Group lobby who have their own agenda for covering us all in red tape but will also grasp anything which may support their ends, whilst maintaining to be ensuring only the interests of the public.

A public that (up to now) does seem not include those who make and enjoy live music. It is up to us to continue to show otherwise.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 25 Jan 12 - 09:04 PM

One has to remember that if the LibDem peers had NOT voted for the 2003 Act, it would have reverted to the "two in a bar" rule which was being narrowly interpreted, and precluding singarounds and sessions by strictly sticking to the "two only per event" concept, backed up by the judiciary.

We have to remember also that the Lib Dem peers we under the impression that the last minute introduction of Section 177 to the Bill, did give the small-scale events protection that was being lost in scrapping the 'two-in-a-bar' rule.

Sadly, the qualification for this protection was so convoluted that in practice, Section 177 provided no protection at all.

The Live Music Bill is partly a re-working of that original Section 177 and hopefully will provide some protection (at least between 8am and 11pm).


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 26 Jan 12 - 09:06 AM

http://services.parliament.uk/calendar/#!/calendar/Lords/MainChamber/2012/1/27/events.html

John King comments:Consideration of Amendments for Live Music Bill 10:00am tomorrow. Royal Assent may follow in as little as 20 minutes, and the Bill will become an Act - The Live Music Act 2012.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 27 Jan 12 - 08:21 AM

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5jQHw5FLNC52IO7EhUbL2RO-ikYsQ?docId=N0167251327663275442A

A legal change making it easier for live music to be performed in pubs and clubs will challenge a "puritanical streak" in English culture, the House of Lords has heard.

The Live Music Bill, which could be in force in time for the Queen's diamond jubilee and Olympic Games, will cut red tape preventing many small venues in England and Wales from allowing bands to perform


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 27 Jan 12 - 01:33 PM

http://www.thebreaker.co.uk/2012/01/27/curbs-to-be-relaxed-for-live-music-in-pubs/

The Bill covers protects venues with a capacity of less than 200 people. Even authorities are flummoxed by the objective behind this Bill. "The government is ticking off a bureaucratic hurdle from their list, because this Bill will likely benefit village halls and small community spaces only. However, they did not require a licence for hosting musical gigs in the first place. They only required one in the event they served alcohol," says Frank Wenzel, Licensing Manager, Borough of Poole.

An article which manages to miss every point and totally ignores the fact that the Bill has removed Entertainment facilites.

And what Poole's licensing Manager may be quoted on is unclear but what is printed here is rubbish. If it were true - there would have been no need for the Live Music Bill.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 27 Jan 12 - 01:57 PM

The following from Hamish Birchall

What better day than Mozart's birthday for the conclusion of Parliamentary debate on the Live Music Bill.

The two minor amendments agreed in Commons Committee were ratified in
the House of Lords. We now await dates for Royal Assent and implementation.

Speaking to the amendments, Lord Clement-Jones offered his own 'Brit
Awards' to those organisations and individuals who had helped him make
the Bill a success. Lord Colwyn added his thanks and congratulations.
Both expressed the hope that the Bill would be enacted in time for the
Queen's Jubilee and Olympics.

Lord Clement-Jones added: 'At that time there will be suitable
celebrations and performances, I hope, in pubs and clubs up and down the
land.'

Baroness Rawlings responded: 'My Lords, on behalf of the Government, I
would like to add my thanks and congratulations to my noble friend Lord
Clement-Jones on his persistence and for having successfully steered
through this very worthwhile Bill. Regarding the Olympics and Her
Majesty the Queen's Jubilee, it would seem appropriate. I will, of
course, take the wishes of my noble friend Lord Clement-Jones back to
the DCMS.'

Watch on Parliament tv here (it only lasts a few minutes):
http://www.parliamentlive.tv/main/Player.aspx?meetingId=9923

Read in Hansard:
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld/ldtoday/l_01.htm#d2e25

ENDS


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 28 Jan 12 - 08:01 AM

http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/29192

Discussion on the LMB and sessions.


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Subject: RE: Live Music Bill - please help
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 31 Jan 12 - 08:48 AM

http://www.crawleyobserver.co.uk/news/gatwick-news/landlord_welcomes_change_to_music_bill_1_3453707

But some believe relaxing music licensing could cause disturbances.

Crawley MP Henry Smith, who attended the debate, said: "I believe licensing for live music venues of under 200 people between 8-11pm should continue so that the needs of local residents who may be affected can be taken into account as can safety and security concerns of concert-goers.

"It is important that elected councils should be allowed to act in the interests of local people."


It was a good job that Henry Smith MP, who claims to have attended the debate, did not vote. It was so quick, he must have missed it!


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