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BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good

Mrrzy 02 Mar 12 - 12:20 PM
Bill D 02 Mar 12 - 01:56 PM
GUEST,number 6 02 Mar 12 - 02:39 PM
saulgoldie 02 Mar 12 - 02:52 PM
Rapparee 02 Mar 12 - 03:02 PM
ragdall 02 Mar 12 - 03:13 PM
GUEST,pete from seven stars link 02 Mar 12 - 06:52 PM
Rapparee 02 Mar 12 - 07:08 PM
JohnInKansas 02 Mar 12 - 07:53 PM
Crowhugger 02 Mar 12 - 08:27 PM
Rapparee 02 Mar 12 - 09:09 PM
Mrrzy 02 Mar 12 - 10:17 PM
Rapparee 02 Mar 12 - 10:32 PM
Bill D 02 Mar 12 - 10:48 PM
Joybell 03 Mar 12 - 06:10 PM
Mrrzy 03 Mar 12 - 06:47 PM
KT 04 Mar 12 - 02:44 PM
artbrooks 04 Mar 12 - 02:59 PM
JohnInKansas 04 Mar 12 - 04:47 PM
catspaw49 04 Mar 12 - 04:58 PM
Gurney 04 Mar 12 - 06:45 PM
kendall 04 Mar 12 - 09:10 PM
Rapparee 04 Mar 12 - 09:30 PM
Rapparee 04 Mar 12 - 09:31 PM
Mrrzy 05 Mar 12 - 09:13 PM
ranger1 06 Mar 12 - 02:05 PM
Mrrzy 06 Mar 12 - 03:08 PM
Gurney 06 Mar 12 - 03:19 PM
saulgoldie 06 Mar 12 - 03:49 PM
Bert 07 Mar 12 - 03:36 AM
theleveller 07 Mar 12 - 05:29 AM
GUEST,Eliza 07 Mar 12 - 06:21 AM
Gurney 07 Mar 12 - 03:14 PM
Donuel 07 Mar 12 - 10:15 PM
Mrrzy 08 Mar 12 - 11:02 AM
Bee-dubya-ell 08 Mar 12 - 11:07 AM
frogprince 08 Mar 12 - 12:13 PM
Bert 08 Mar 12 - 12:44 PM
Gurney 08 Mar 12 - 03:38 PM
Bert 08 Mar 12 - 04:30 PM
Bill D 08 Mar 12 - 05:54 PM
Bert 08 Mar 12 - 07:01 PM
JohnInKansas 08 Mar 12 - 07:53 PM
Janie 08 Mar 12 - 07:55 PM
Gurney 08 Mar 12 - 10:48 PM
3refs 08 Mar 12 - 11:31 PM
terrier 09 Mar 12 - 09:08 PM
Mrrzy 09 Mar 12 - 09:28 PM
Janie 09 Mar 12 - 09:54 PM

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Subject: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Mrrzy
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 12:20 PM

It was the old stuff - still good thread that made me start this one...

As I declutter I find that, not that I'm a real hoarder, I have a lot of stuff, and now it's not useful anymore:

Paper for my kids' three-ring binders - they have tablets now.

CDs galore - they have mp3s now.

don't even get me started on my records and tapes for music and movies...

Some of it isn't even worth recycling through other families! Man, I used to think I would USE all my stuff!

Anybody want every mysetery by Tony Hillerman or Dick Francis or JA Jance now that I have a Kindle...?

What are YOU finding in your attic that might as well be your grandparents'?


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 01:56 PM

How many VHS and beta tapes do you want?
Or a top-of-the-line slide projector? (no..I don't know where to buy those bulbs for it)
Or an 8mm movie projector?
Or 35mm film developing equipment?
Or a couple hundred National Geographics?

(my wife would probably take the Dick Francis stuff...but I ain't gonna tell her about them...)


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 02:39 PM

"Or 35mm film developing equipment?"

I'll take that !

biLL


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: saulgoldie
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 02:52 PM

DOS-based software. 5.25" diskettes. Inner tubes for auto tires. Meat grinder that mounts on the counter with a suction cup. 4-function calculators.

Saul


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Rapparee
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 03:02 PM

Yellow Stars of David.
Nazi armbands.
KKK robes....


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: ragdall
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 03:13 PM

Hey, Saul,
I still use my meat grinder. Not often, but I do use it. They still work every bit as well as they used to.

rags


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: GUEST,pete from seven stars link
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 06:52 PM

is it my imagination or does anyone else think vinyl has a more warm feel to the sound of music than the high tec sound of the CD ?


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Rapparee
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 07:08 PM

You're right, Pete.

I can't think of ANYTHING that's old and no longer good, except maybe for some lettuce in the 'fridge.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 07:53 PM

I've already cleared out all my old 5.25 floppies, and of course all the 3.75" as well, since I don't have a drive that can read them or anything useful that would fit on one; but I REFUSE to get rid of my old DOS manuals, since much of it still works (running under assumed new names) and the old references provide information it's impossible to get from current sources. I have eliminated a good dozen of the paper books by scanning them to PDF files. I haven't found the earliest one or two, but I have fairly good pdf sources from about DOS 3 (both IBM DOS and MS-DOS) & later, if anybody needs a factoid or two.

We made a start on converting old VHS tapes to DVD, and got quite a few done before the only computer we had to run the conversions on went belly up. Unfortunately the cheap converter we were using requires a "real time" transfer (and won't handle movies over 2 hours), so we've got about 600 hours worth of "watching and waiting" to do if/when we get the equipment replaced. Assuming the time factor isn't a problem, the conversion is "cost effective" and the elimination of those bulky tapes is a really big help. Quite a few of the tapes we'd like to save are very difficult to find in other formats - or at all.

The biggest problem with the kinds of old books I really want to keep is they're only useful if you know where to find them when you need them. (I'm hoping it will get a lot easier when they're all on one hard drive.)

John


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Crowhugger
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 08:27 PM

Saul & ragdall, I still use my meat grinder too! It has a threaded clamp, not a suction cup.

Just a year ago my 80-something-year-old uncle and I looked at family slides from the 1960s using a light box designed for the purpose and a hand held magnifying glass. We might've enjoyed a slide projector that day! But I suppose the pix will end up digitized. Odd thing, that, however, since they will probably outlast any digital media.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Rapparee
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 09:09 PM

"New" does not always mean "better." Ask the preservation office at the Library of Congress or any University library...or large public library for that matter. If you REALLY want an earful, ask an archivist.

Believe it or not, magnetized tape can erase itself over time. Here comes the interesting part: preservationists are finding the CDs can also! Vinyl, glass, wax, and similar recordings do not.

As for various floppy discs and zip discs -- Hoh boy! The Library of Congress and the National Archives have spent BIG BUCKS to continue to be able to read these things! When, for instance, was the last time you saw a Dictaphone belt? -- now suppose that something like Mark Twain's last and greatest novel was on one (yeah, yeah, I know).

Humanity has never, ever, totally eliminated a way of storing information (storing, not sending). If you doubt this SCROLL down any page or SCROLL through a reel of microfilm, look at the inscriptions on recent gravestones or the impressions in bricks bought by folks for a memorial. The languages and alphabets may have changed, but those are scrolls, chiseling into stone, and baked clay tablets.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Mrrzy
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 10:17 PM

Heh heh heh I got an old something that ain't seen much use lately but I wouldn't get rid of it...

A *slide* projector! I remember those!


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Rapparee
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 10:32 PM

Heck, we got both an 8mm movie camera AND a projector!


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Mar 12 - 10:48 PM

"35mm film developing equipment?"

I still have a 3 roll stainless steel tank... some clips for hanging film...some containers for B&W chemicals.,,,and some tri-x film...both in canisters and in a large roll...no idea how it lasts..

Got rid of trays and enlarger several years ago


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Joybell
Date: 03 Mar 12 - 06:10 PM

True-love and I both have an old talent that's no longer needed. When we couldn't afford books or records we memorized words and tunes from the live singing of performers or from the radio. Sometimes we could get away with looking through the music books in shops without buying anything. True-love met Art Thieme that way. Art let him loose in the music shop he managed.
Sometimes now it all seems too easy. Not so special. Some of those songs should be special. But I'm talking like an oldster.
Cheers, Joy


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Mrrzy
Date: 03 Mar 12 - 06:47 PM

I'm somehow reminded of those folk songs that used to be sung by old codgers but are now sung by people like us...


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: KT
Date: 04 Mar 12 - 02:44 PM

Four old notebooks of song lyrics and chords from the days when I was first learning to play guitar....and that was a long time ago. They just resurfaced.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: artbrooks
Date: 04 Mar 12 - 02:59 PM

I'll take the inner tubes - much better than those plastic disks for sledding, and you can float down the river on them in the summer.

But how about tools for adjusting non-sealed bearing bicycle hubs and bottom brackets?


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 04 Mar 12 - 04:47 PM

Rap said a few posts back:

Believe it or not, magnetized tape can erase itself over time. Here comes the interesting part: preservationists are finding the CDs can also! Vinyl, glass, wax, and similar recordings do not.

The questionable part is "Vinyl, glass, wax, and similar recordings do not."

Especially vinyl and wax are "worn" each time information is read from them by the common methods. Archivists have found methods of "optical reading" to minimize the wear, but the remaining critical factor is that there are no materials you can make a recording on that don't spontaneously change dimensions even if left undisturbed in "perfect" storage conditions. This effect is most evident where physical/mechanical dimensions of the medium are where the signals are stored, as with vinyl or wax.

I have a copy of a report from a study done a few decades back on a group of carefully prepared samples of "the most stable materials available," carefully prepared to be "defect free" and very accurately measured before storage in "perfect conditions." The materials tested were ones selected for their better stability for use in making very high precision navigation instruments. Every sample showed easily measurable changes in dimensions after storage for only one year. And the "perfectly made and stored" platinum "meter standard bars" were discarded as references for the standard some years ago because they kept changing lengths.

The older media that many people say last longer are most often those used for analog recording, and small changes are less easily detected in an analog signal. Hence the general agreement that those old records "sound better" when played a few decades later. You cannot determine whether they still sound exactly the same as when they were made, and there is pretty good evidence (and even more opinion) that most of them actually do sound at least "a little different" after every few decades. Any one with much experience with the old recordings will generally agree that they sound different after "many playings," and "wear out" if played too many times.

This isn't an argument that they don't "sound better." It's the little question of whether they sound the same forever that nags.

John


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: catspaw49
Date: 04 Mar 12 - 04:58 PM

Once again the synchronicity of the 'Cat............

Karen and I were having a very similar discussion this morning. No matter how interesting, it also seems a bit sad, ya' know? So Myrrz.......How about a matching set of Dick Francis?


Spaw


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Gurney
Date: 04 Mar 12 - 06:45 PM

Old paperbacks. I tried selling them on TradeMe/(EBay) and it isn't worth the bother. They mostly sold, -the popular authors,- but for miniscule prices and all out of town, with the bother of packing them up, posting them, etc. Not to mention the bother of listing them. Sad.
Sally Army got most of them. Probably threw them away.
Rereading some, but my tastes have changed.

Most of my Dick Francis are hardbacks, annual Christmas presents. That touch of insider knowledge and authenticity made the difference, eh.
Crap binding, though.

I took a bootful of old computer stuff, CRT VDUs, big beige boxes, low-powered memory, cards, Zip drives, down to the electronic recyclers. They send containers of stuff off to somewhere.

I bought a Pentax digital camera just so that I could use my old 35mm Pentax camera's lenses, but I don't, much. Still can't bring myself to throw away that $800 camera, even though I bet the battery isn't available.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: kendall
Date: 04 Mar 12 - 09:10 PM

My collection of Russian post cards.

My ex wife.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Rapparee
Date: 04 Mar 12 - 09:30 PM

My late brother's collection of film cameras, from Minox to wet plate?


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Rapparee
Date: 04 Mar 12 - 09:31 PM

Jik, I stated things badly.

Heat is probably the thing that has destroyed the most old recordings, including those in storage. And you are correct about wear.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Mrrzy
Date: 05 Mar 12 - 09:13 PM

Dick Francis should have written twice as many books, apparently.

No takers on ex-spouses here!

A bunch of Star Trek collectible things, some of those encyclopedias, some trading cards (old trek and next gen), The Physics of Star Trek, and a bunch of ships (but I keep my mugatu and my little Enterprise made out of a diskette when they were the little colored squares!)... some of that should be worth something on e-bay?

Or does that make it no longer no longer good?


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: ranger1
Date: 06 Mar 12 - 02:05 PM

Star Trek stuff is worth a bundle, especially if it's vintage from the original series.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Mrrzy
Date: 06 Mar 12 - 03:08 PM

Yes, I have the old series trading cards, what a riot.

Also all my old movie books - leonard, halliwell, etc - and we have IMDB now!


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Gurney
Date: 06 Mar 12 - 03:19 PM

Yes, Mrrzy, and Kindle, too.
Dick Francis, in case you are not familiar, was a jump jockey who started writing when he retired, and most of his stories have some remote relationship to horses, sometimes concerning cheating. As I said earlier, an authentic touch.

I can't bring myself to dispose of my old, splitting-apart guitars, either. They hang about, and I sometimes tune them, which doesn't aid longevity.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: saulgoldie
Date: 06 Mar 12 - 03:49 PM

"But how about tools for adjusting non-sealed bearing bicycle hubs and bottom brackets?"

Art, I still have mine. I use them for the hubs on my (several) bicycles. Also tools for headsets and bottom brackets with adjustable bearings.

One tool that I will probably not use again, however, is a screw-type press (made by Park) used to seat cotter pins on cottered cranks. Can't remember the last time I saw a cottered crank.

Saul


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Bert
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 03:36 AM

Old Stuff - No Longer Good. How about traffic lights? Invented in the nineteenth century to control horse drawn traffic.

More recent developments (only half a century old) are traffic circles and alternate merge, which combined, can work wonders.

It is about time we had a twenty first century solution.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: theleveller
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 05:29 AM

Moustaches. You only have to look at Dave Crosby to see how stupid they look today.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 06:21 AM

As children in the forties we used to put old records in hot water to soften them and then form them into plant pots. They had a convenient hole in the bottom for drainage. Then we painted them. Oh dear, who knows what priceless old recordings we wrecked!


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Gurney
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 03:14 PM

Eliza, It may be those weren't so very priceless, but someone at the BBC wiped original video tapes of British comedy, just so that they could re-use the tapes. Lost forever.

We used the oven to turn 78s into plant-pots.

I heard of someone who left a Buffy St.Marie LP on the windowsill, and it sagged. An attempt to iron it flat again smoothed out the grooves, and a try to put those back in with a pin failed. Maybe urban legend?


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Donuel
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 10:15 PM

Please do heed Rapparre's request.

There are some tapes and archives that will never see the light of day unless you remind people with your originals.

For example on VCR tape I have Vice PResident Bush kissing Saddam Hussien at the dictator's palatial birthday party.

CNN won't ever be playing that scene again.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Mrrzy
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 11:02 AM

OK, I also have stemware, and a ton of old dictionaries, which I really enjoy.
I am thinking of Craigslisting in addition to the yard sale that is going to happen next weekend (not this coming one, that's my birthday, but I'm still good, no cracks about that thank you!)...


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 11:07 AM

Traffic lights? Sure, they could be eliminated, but at what expense? Alternatives entail extensive land use, and places with high traffic signal density also have very valuable real estate. Donald Trump isn't going to voluntarily tear down one of his skyscrapers so the city can build a traffic circle.

I've seen traffic signals eliminated in suburban areas by having principal intersecting roads pass over or under one another, but it would be difficult and expensive to do so in a city center.

Anyway, if traffic signal switches are correctly calibrated to a set speed, and if everyone drives that speed, one can drive for miles on a street with a signal at every intersection and never catch a red light.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: frogprince
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 12:13 PM

Ah, yes, traffic circles; what a wonderful idea. Look for a safe opportunity to merge into the circle, then look for your exit from the circle before you have any time to think, while trying not to collide with anyone. Now try it in the dark, on a circle you've never seen before. Definitely a vast improvement over stopping and waiting for your turn for a green light!


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Bert
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 12:44 PM

...very valuable real estate...

Plenty of room out here in Colorado;-)

frogprince, they wouldn't work for you if you think that merging is difficult.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Gurney
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 03:38 PM

Yeah, roundabouts/road islands have their advantages in light to medium traffic densities, but they do rely on drivers being competent and decisive. He who hesitates, waits. Pedestrians have trouble getting past them, too.
I have thought of adding traffic lights to some of the roundabout feeder roads. There's this six-road roundabout near me, extra efficient in the evening rush, infuriatingly slow in the morning rush.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Bert
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 04:30 PM

A roundabout coupled with alternate merge should work fine whatever the traffic.

Of course you will always get one bozo who won't obey the alternate merge sign. Then there are those for whom the concept of a circle is beyond their comprehension.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Bill D
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 05:54 PM

nawww... a circle is 'a round straight line with a hole in the middle'.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Bert
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 07:01 PM

Thanks Bill, that clarifies the matter.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 07:53 PM

Near my home, about four years ago, someone decided a "circle" was a good idea for a place out in the country where two highways crossed. There are no buildings or other signs of habitation anywhere in the vicinity, and until very recently, no lights.

It's a very sudden surprise when approached on the 70 mph road running E/W, and something of a shock on the 60 mph cross road, when you literally have stand on the brake to get down to the 20 (or 25 if you're brave) mph in the circle. People have requested warning signs to alert people of the need to slow down, but the "authorities(?)" determined that one dim bulb "street light" in the middle was sufficient.

One of those "authorities" must own a salvage yard that benefits from the half-dozen crashes per month since the circle went into operation. I don't know whether any of the frequent crashes have resulted in deaths, but some serious injuries have been reported; and several semis have laid beside the road when they couldn't get slowed quickly enough when the came up on the "surprise."

Boston had lots of circles back in the 50s when I was there, and some of them appeared to be quite old, if the tipping monuments in the center and overgrown used-to-be-flower-pots were any indication. A fairly famous one near one of the apartments I lived in for a while was Kosciuszko circle where there were five streets incoming, each with a street sign to announce the circle, and each with a different spelling of the name.

And a few of those Boston area circles did have signal lights to break the incoming flows. although not that one, in the 50s.

John


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Janie
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 07:55 PM

Old stuff no longer good - several bits of my spine and most of my finger joints:?)


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Gurney
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 10:48 PM

John, there is a standard pictorial road sign for roundabouts in Britain, Oz and NZ, and also I think in all of Europe. Sometimes two, if too many accidents occur.
You must be right about the salvage yard.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: 3refs
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 11:31 PM

I didn't read all of the responses, but I read enough to get the drift. After my Mother passed away at 93 in 2009, my oldest brother took over the abode, and then he died 2 years later in October 2011 My other brother died in Sept 2010. So, items and "things" that go back to my Mother's Grandmother are now in my basement(not the china cabinet though). She was not a hoarder, but there were things that she just didn't want to throw out! Like the receipt for the ambulance that took my father to the hospital when he died in 1963! Pictures of family from the early 1900's that I know and remember many of them well. Much of it is worthless, while some of it is priceless!


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: terrier
Date: 09 Mar 12 - 09:08 PM

Well I've got a lot of happy memories the are not going to be thrown out and all the 'junk' the I've accumulated over the last 60 odd years all has memories attached to it, so that is staying. I found a couple of exposed/undeveloped 35m films in a drawer the other week, I'll probably never know what's on them, but they went straight back into the drawer. Anyone want several hundred computer magazines from the early seventies? I know they're around somewhere and I still keep wondering what to do with that casette tape deck that maybe doesn't work too well. We have so many books here that if I could live my life again, I wouldn't have time to read them, but here they stay. I've even found stuff that I can't remember where it came from or why I kept it at the time, but just in case it was important, that stays as well. Whilst we live in a world of planned obsolescence, the junk we keep is a tenuous hold on reality. It reminds us who we are. That's important.


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Mrrzy
Date: 09 Mar 12 - 09:28 PM

I know what you mean, terrier, but I'm digging out. I've decided to weigh what goes out so I can tell you guys the total - we should start a pool...


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Subject: RE: BS: Old Stuff - No Longer Good
From: Janie
Date: 09 Mar 12 - 09:54 PM

What I notice for myself is that over time I come to terms with letting some things go and keeping others.

Part of the equation for me is "what to keep because it will mean something to my son or nieces and nephews down the road? To what extent will they share the since of connectedness through heritage that I have?

Right now, not much. That may well change as they grow older, but the reality is I had my son late in life. He never knew my grandparents, and grew up three states away from extended family and does not have the strong memories and associations of extended family that experience brings. Much of what I value so much because of the emotional memories will be meaningless to my son, and no longer good except for it's monetary value in terms of my meager estate.


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