BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?

Subject: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Maryrrf
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 10:53 AM

So, this 6mm kidney stone that got pushed back into the kidney is still there. As long as it doesn't move I'm okay, but of course that could happen at any time and its rather large to pass on its own. Doctor says I have a choice - leave it and hope it stays put or have lithotripsy, in which they blast the stone with sonar waves and hopefully break it up. That procedure has an 80% chance of success - if it works the stone will break up into small pieces and hopefully pass. Has anybody had this done? If so what was your experience?

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 05:25 PM

Some experiences here Mary. Don't know of anyone with this experience or I'd ask. Hope all goes well.


laser lithotripsy experience

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: gnu
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 05:53 PM

I didn't click the link but it sounds (pun intended) like plan to try... sorry.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 09:47 PM

I don't have any personal experience, but the method, as you described it, has been pretty well accepted and widely used for some time; and apparently it seldom has adverse consequences.

Your doctor is, of course, the one best qualified to make recommendations since (one hopes) (s)he knows your particular situation and condition. If it's a real concern, a second opinion from another qualified doctor would be a good idea. And/or if your current doctor intends to have someone else actually do the procedure, a talk with the one who's going to do it before you agree shouldn't be considered an unreasonable request.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Maryrrf
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 10:05 PM

The doctor said it's up to me and wouldn't make a recommendation one way or another. The urologists I've consulted don't seem to take kidney stones that seriously - I wonder if they ever had one?? I'm still deciding if I will have it done or chicken out..

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 10:45 PM

Pain that stones can bring IS serious... I went to the emergency room with mine. (One doctor 'diagnosed' it by the noises I was making) It is 'likely' that the stone will eventually cause trouble again... perhaps at an inconvenient time. Trying the ultrasound at a time convenient to you might be a wise move.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Neil D
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 10:53 PM

My son has had this done 3-4 times. He is usually a little sore and tired from the meds. A couple times he had slight bruising but no real complaints.

                                    Christina

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: GUEST,999
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 11:07 PM

You were told medical advice. You have sought it and got it. What's to ask?

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Jeri
Date: 07 Mar 12 - 11:26 PM

999, it sounds to me as if the docs are somewhat ambivalent.

I have a friend who had a double auto-transplant because kidney stones blew out his ureters. I know this is extreme, and it took a long time to happen, but kidney stones are serious. If it were me, I'd go with the lithotripsy.

Any possible soreness sounds better than what you'll get from passing a stone.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 02:06 AM

I concur that passing a stone is jolly uncomfortable.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: GUEST,I Don't Know
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 05:22 AM

Go with the lithotripsy, my brother did back in December & only had a little discomfort for a few days.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 08:40 AM

I concur that passing a stone is jolly uncomfortable.

Now, there's the understatement of the year!

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Maryrrf
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 09:50 AM

Thanks for the advice - as I said, the doctor's advice was pretty much "It's up to you whether you want to take a chance that the stone will stay put, or if you want to do lithotripsy". I just wanted to hear some first hand advice.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 10:58 AM

way better than surgery, i am told - they couldn't trips mine, I had polyps instead of litho, but they wanted to.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Ebbie
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 11:20 AM

A friend of mine opted for the lithotripsy (How in the world is that pronounced!). It was successful but he said that for a few days he felt as though he had been beaten.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Maryrrf
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 11:44 AM

Yes they said there would be bruising around the kidney area and of course pain when the fragments of the stone are passed - but not as bad as trying to pass a very large stone would be - and if the stone tries to pass and can't (which is what happened) then you get backup into the kidney and a lot of unpleasantness...

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Becca72
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 01:04 PM

Ebbie - it's pronounced just as it looks, with the emphasis on the LITHO (short I)

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Ebbie
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 02:03 PM

Thanks, Becca!

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Bettynh
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 02:08 PM

I worked as a nurse on a ward that dealt with all sorts of urology. That said, my direct info is 20 years old. At that time, lithotripsy involved sitting in a tub of water (something about transmitting the pulses) and general anesthesia (you absolutely CANNOT BE ALLOWED TO MOVE). From googling around, I see they're using a mini waterbed now, and maybe not so much anesthesia. In any event, passing gravel takes time and is likely to be painful (imagine a marble, now take a hammer to it - the pieces are sharp). The whole process was miserable for a few days, but usually worked well. Open or even scoped surgery for large stones is much, much worse, and kidney damage from infection or blockage can last the rest of your life. It's important to figure out what kind of stones they are and take whatever steps you can to prevent them from re-forming. Mostly, that involves drinking lots of water, all year round (you may see sweat in the summer, but in winter the dew point can be in the single numbers around here, and the air is drier than in most deserts.)

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 08 Mar 12 - 05:56 PM

It's important to figure out what kind of stones they are and take whatever steps you can to prevent them from re-forming. Mostly, that involves drinking lots of water, all year round

And since a lot of stones are made of phosphate accumulated from cola drinks, it is usually not a good idea to take that water in the form of cola.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: gnu
Date: 09 Mar 12 - 03:24 PM

I cut out cheese and salt excepy for my mac&cheese fix once a month or so. Cranberry and lemon juice everyday... but that was on the last thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Maryrrf
Date: 09 Mar 12 - 06:00 PM

They won't know what caused the stone until they analyze it - but just to be safe I've cut way back on tea, which I used to drink a lot of.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: scouse
Date: 10 Mar 12 - 05:18 PM

It's well know the pain is not particularly nice when you have stones and passing them is a bastard.. (an understatement.) Pethidine seems to be the only pain relief that seems to work with these little buggers.. I would whole hartedly agree with earlier comments... go for the lithotripsy.. That's me, 25 years in the gas passing biz!!

As Aye,

Phil.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Maryrrf
Date: 30 Mar 12 - 10:28 AM

So, I had lithotripsy last week and experienced almost no discomfort. I went to the doctor today and the stone is gone, the doctor said it was pulverized and that's why I had no pain from stone particles passing. So, it seems that it was successful and painless, and I'm really glad it got rid of that stone.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: bobad
Date: 30 Mar 12 - 10:59 AM

Glad to hear it was successful and relatively painless.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: maeve
Date: 30 Mar 12 - 11:29 AM

I'm so glad for you, Mary!

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 30 Mar 12 - 11:46 AM

Everybody most get UN stoned

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Becca72
Date: 30 Mar 12 - 12:47 PM

Went back and read some posts I'd missed and I swear in my mind, Gnu, you said "I cut the cheese". :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 30 Mar 12 - 07:58 PM

A urologist I saw said one important thing thing was to drink a fair bit - but when I asked him if it had to be water he said beer would do fine. And he was a non-drinking Sikh, so he was what you could call a neutral observer.

I had pretty severe renal colic a couple of years ago, and was expecting to go for lithostripsy for the stones that showed up in scans - but then my cardiac arrest and a quadruple cardiac bypass got in the way, followed by a prostate op (benign).

Fortunately the kidney stones didn't kick up any trouble during all this - but they're still lurking. But another scan showed they've shifted somewhere where lithotripsy wouldn't work, so in a couple of weeks I'm due for an interesting sounding operation in which they insert a telescope, blast the stones with a laser and then haul them out with a kind of grappling iron. Sounds a bit like a Star Trek mission, except they'd use a tractor beam. Still they're only planning to keep me in overnight.

Don't we have fun... I'll report how it goes.

I have a friend who had lithotripsy. Wasn't at all bad he said, and he's happy not to have the stones waiting there like a kind of time bomb.

Renal Colic is said to be worse than childbirth - but I've only heard that from men, so how would we know? Better out than in anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Maryrrf
Date: 30 Mar 12 - 09:08 PM

Good luck Kevin. I've heard about the procedure they'll be doing on you - not as easy as lithotripsy but definitely better than the old fashioned method of cutting into the kidney to extract the stone. Let us know how you get on.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 31 Mar 12 - 05:48 AM

Advice about diet changes is appropriate, since stones frequently reoccur. If possible, you may want to ask the doctor - especially if some stone fragments are retrieved and can be analysed - for advice on which way to go with the changes.

The referencs I have at hand say there are two opposite kinds of stones, one of which is aggravated by an acid body chemistry, and the other getting worse with an alkaline balance.

The frequent advice to drink lots of cranberry juice is because it reduces acidity and drives the body chemistry toward being a little more alkaline. That works if the stones are the "gouty" kind, but may make the other kind worse. In this case the stones are the "urate" (uric acid) sort, and the presence or absence of other "gouty" symptoms (edema? etc) would be an indicator even if the stones themselves can't be checked out. The "urate" stones dissolve if you can drive your body's "acid balance" a little more toward the alkaline side. Family history - whether a near family member or immediate ancestor suffered from "gout" - would be a clue, as well, although you should keep in mind that a generation ago "my feet hurt" was commonly sufficient for a diagnosis of "gout."

For the other kind of stones, also fairly common, shifting things more to the acid side might be better, since the "lime" (calcate) stones are (slightly) acid soluble.

I haven't found many physicians very knowledgeable about - or willing to discuss - the difference since there are drugs to treat either kind and it's easier to just write a scrip; but it won't hurt to ask for diet recommendations. Changing diet to significantly affect the acidity of your body chemistry can be a complex puzzle, but even slight change in the right direction can often be helpful in minimizing recurring stones.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Leadfingers
Date: 31 Mar 12 - 06:40 AM

Glad you have sorted the problem |Mary , and with minimal unpleasantness . Would have been a pain (SORRY) if you had been forced to cancel a Gig or two with Kidney problems .

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 07 May 12 - 07:32 PM

"I'll report how it goes."

And here I am. All went fine. They did it with a general anaesthetic, which suited me fine. I didn't really fancy lying there listening to them working away with their laser beams and dynarod contraption.

And now I'm stone free, and hope to keep it that way. They've still got to yake out a stent that's in there to keep my plumbing happy while it's healing, and at some time they'll be telling me what the stones were made of so I can try to stop them building up again.

As I keep on finding it appropriate to say, and so does everyone I've ever met in hospital, thank God (and Nye Bevan) for the NHS.

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Leadfingers
Date: 07 May 12 - 08:25 PM

Good for you Kevin

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: Maryrrf
Date: 07 May 12 - 09:06 PM

I'm so glad to hear that it went well, Kevin! They did general anaesthetic with my procedure too and I was glad. It feels great to be "unstoned" doesn't it!?

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: PoppaGator
Date: 08 May 12 - 02:10 PM

I had lithotripsy quite a while ago, immersed in a big tank of water under general anesthesthia. Not sure how many years ago that was. I don't remember that any pain was involved at all ~ I certainly felt much better after the procedure than I had beforehand!

A more recent kidney stone attack, in the summer/fall of 2006, led to an appointment for another lithotripsy (as same-day surgery), but I passed the stone the night before. Phew!

Subject: RE: BS: Experiences with lithotripsy ?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 08 May 12 - 04:22 PM

"Everybody must lose stones..."