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Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW

greg stephens 08 May 12 - 06:18 AM
Owen Woodson 08 May 12 - 06:28 AM
Owen Woodson 08 May 12 - 07:02 AM
Leadfingers 08 May 12 - 07:09 AM
Bonnie Shaljean 08 May 12 - 07:20 AM
Bonnie Shaljean 08 May 12 - 07:27 AM
Rain Dog 08 May 12 - 08:13 AM
Matthew Edwards 08 May 12 - 12:51 PM
Owen Woodson 08 May 12 - 02:51 PM
Leadfingers 08 May 12 - 07:00 PM
MartinRyan 09 May 12 - 08:00 AM
Dave Hanson 09 May 12 - 10:06 AM
Owen Woodson 09 May 12 - 11:34 AM
greg stephens 09 May 12 - 01:56 PM
The Sandman 09 May 12 - 06:28 PM
Owen Woodson 10 May 12 - 05:53 AM
The Sandman 10 May 12 - 07:53 AM
GUEST,Donal 10 May 12 - 08:43 AM
Rain Dog 11 May 12 - 06:37 AM
GUEST,Damien From Russia 15 May 12 - 09:10 AM
Rain Dog 15 May 12 - 10:18 AM
ChrisJBrady 15 May 12 - 11:56 AM
GUEST 27 Sep 12 - 08:03 AM
Dave Rado 27 Sep 12 - 12:12 PM
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Subject: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: greg stephens
Date: 08 May 12 - 06:18 AM

Shortly starting on Radio 4 (11.30 AM Tuseday May 8). A programme on the early recordings of Irish traditional music. Or at least, that is what I understand the topic to be,I didn't totally catch the trailer


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Owen Woodson
Date: 08 May 12 - 06:28 AM

Hi Greg,

Thanks for that. I didn't know about the programme, but here's the website blurb. As I key this in it's 11-28 and the programme looks extremely interesting. Can't wait.

The First LP in IrelandListen : Next on:
Today, 11:30 on BBC Radio 4
Synopsis
In 1947, the Irish Folklore Commission and the BBC established a scheme to seek out and record folk music and stories throughout Ireland. The project was the idea of Donegal-born BBC producer Brian George and it lasted until 1952.

Field recordings in Cork, Kerry, Donegal and Galway were made by singer, storyteller, piper and broadcaster Seamus Ennis along with Brian George and his colleague Maurice Brown, a features producer from the BBC. Recordings were simultaneously being made in Northern Ireland by Peter Kennedy and Sean O Baoill. In all 1500 performances were preserved.

In early 1951, American folklorist and musicologist Alan Lomax travelled to Ireland on a similar mission, to record '...authentic performers in the isolated places where songs are handed down from generation to generation by word of mouth' and which '...are threatened to be engulfed by the roar of our powerful society.'

Lomax is regarded as one of the great field collectors of the twentieth century: His recordings introduced the world to such talents as Jelly Roll Morton and Leadbelly. With Seamus Ennis as his guide, Lomax visited villages across Ireland, recording singers and musicians.

Lomax and Ennis pooled their unique archive - from their separate 1947 and 1951 field trips - to assemble the very first anthology of Irish traditional music ever to be compiled on an LP - what they described as '...the first systematic mapping of the folk or oral musical tradition.' Filled with accordions, fiddles, pianos, stories and songs, the album would become a template for future musicians, introducing generations to songs which would eventually become standards: I'll Go No More A Rovin', Whiskey In The Jar, She Moves Through The Fair.

Presenter: Colum Sands
Producer: Owen McFadden.

.


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Owen Woodson
Date: 08 May 12 - 07:02 AM

What a fabluous little programme! My head is reeling and jigging and polkaing and slow airing with the flood of memories that little lot brought back.


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Leadfingers
Date: 08 May 12 - 07:09 AM

Very interesting programme .


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 08 May 12 - 07:20 AM

It should be on the iPlayer soon. At the moment the page says the standard "not-available-to-listen-again" but that's usually just temporary until they've had time to get the link up (or that the programme hasn't been broadcast yet):

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01h666r

If that fails, you can go to their programme index page under "F" and scroll down until you come to "The First LP In Ireland" and click on it. (Some other good stuff on the listen-again too).

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/programmes/a-z/by/f


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 08 May 12 - 07:27 AM

Another show on the F page may interest people too: "Folk Song - Art Song" in which the narrator is a classical singer who is looking at different approaches to traditional repertoire, and who is "allowed" to do what.

Eliza Carthy addresses the issue with her usual down-to-earth good sense and wisdom (love that gal...) pointing out, among other things, that the snobbery is certainly not all on one side.


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Rain Dog
Date: 08 May 12 - 08:13 AM

Bonnie there is already a thread on the Folk Song - Art Song programme

Folk Song-Art Song thread


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 08 May 12 - 12:51 PM

What a lovely programme; thanks for pointing it out Greg. There are some wonderful tributes in it to Seamus Ennis in his combined role of performer and collector, and I think it is noticeable that the performances he coaxes out of the singers and musicians he recorded have a warmth and intimacy that makes the listener feel they are sitting in the kitchen with them.

The tracks from the original LP can all be found by searching on the Lomax Association for Cultural Equity site, but it seems nicer to listen to the two sides of the LP in their entirety on this blog World Library of Folk and Primitive Music - Ireland. The sequence of the tracks is like a river of gems indeed. The blog also reproduces the original sleeve notes which compare the playing of the Balinakill Ceilidhe Band to "a tree full of blackbirds".

Matthew


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Owen Woodson
Date: 08 May 12 - 02:51 PM

The site which Matthew mentions is called The World's Jukebox . It's an absolute treasure trove of obscure LPs of ethnic music, most of which are available for download.

Normally I get decidedly uptight about people who slap stuff onto the 'net without regard for intellectual property or the laws of copyright. In this case though, all the stuff, including the World Library discs, is way out of catalogue. What's more, because most of these issues belong to the major labels, who presumably have no interest in re-issuing that which does not sell, they are unlikely ever to see the light of day again. Unless some kind soul puts them on the Internet of course.


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Leadfingers
Date: 08 May 12 - 07:00 PM

Listen Again


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: MartinRyan
Date: 09 May 12 - 08:00 AM

Just listening to the replay at the moment. Great program giving an insight into some of the seminal work in collecting Irish music and song.

Regards


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 09 May 12 - 10:06 AM

Very good programme, I especially loved the woman singing Goodnight Irene to Alan Lomax in Gaelic.

Dave H


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Owen Woodson
Date: 09 May 12 - 11:34 AM

Dave H. Kitty Gallagher. I don't think for a moment that it ever existed in Irish before the Weavers made a hit of it.


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: greg stephens
Date: 09 May 12 - 01:56 PM

Yes, I think the Irish Irene was a bit of Lomax cooked up fakery. Unless it was the other way round, he knew the Irish song existed so taught it Leadbelly to invent a bit of musicological fakefolk.


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: The Sandman
Date: 09 May 12 - 06:28 PM

very enjoyable


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Owen Woodson
Date: 10 May 12 - 05:53 AM

No. Leadbelly's uncle also knew the song. There's a discussion on its origins in the Lornell/Wolfe biography of Leadbelly. They reach no absolute conclusions but it's probably safe to assume that it originated as a C19 stage piece.


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: The Sandman
Date: 10 May 12 - 07:53 AM

yes but unlikely it was written in gaelic, so it wouldbe disqualified in Comhaltas singing competitions


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: GUEST,Donal
Date: 10 May 12 - 08:43 AM

I've had the Gaelic version of Goodnight Irene on my computer for years, I never have been able to find the words, probably a one-off for Lomax.


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Rain Dog
Date: 11 May 12 - 06:37 AM

A very enjoyable programme. Thanks to Matthew for the link to the lp


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: GUEST,Damien From Russia
Date: 15 May 12 - 09:10 AM

Damn.. Damned !! Damned !! Damned !! I Missed this show in my Region, far outside the UK.. Maybe Anybody/Someone Recorded this program !?


                           Damien , Saint Petersburg


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Rain Dog
Date: 15 May 12 - 10:18 AM

Have you tried the link posted by Leadfingers at Date: 08 May 12 - 07:00 PM ?

It does still seem to be available to listen to on the BBC site. I think you should be able to listen to it. Good luck


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: ChrisJBrady
Date: 15 May 12 - 11:56 AM

See:

http://www.mediafire.com/?6f7bdmorq35l6


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Sep 12 - 08:03 AM

Hi - on the strength of the BBC documentary I bought the Lomax LP and was disappointed that it didn't include either the Gaelic version of "Goodnight Irene" nor "I'll Go No More A Rovin'" - despite the fact that the BBC's programme notes state:

"Lomax and Ennis pooled their unique archive - from their separate 1947 and 1951 field trips - to assemble the very first anthology of Irish traditional music ever to be compiled on an LP - what they described as '...the first systematic mapping of the folk or oral musical tradition.' Filled with accordions, fiddles, pianos, stories and songs, the album would become a template for future musicians, introducing generations to songs which would eventually become standards: I'll Go No More A Rovin', Whiskey In The Jar, She Moves Through The Fair."

So where did the BBC get its recordings of those two songs from? Clearly not from the Lomax LP. Can anyone shed any light on this?

Dave


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Subject: RE: Irish music BBC Radio 4 NOW
From: Dave Rado
Date: 27 Sep 12 - 12:12 PM

Further to my previous post ("From: Guest", posted 27 Sep 12 - sorry, I forgot to log in), someone has pointed me to a wonderful recording of Kitty Gallagher singing Irene, go dTé Tú Slán (Irene, Goodnight) - here.

Lomax's notes are interesting too - "Early, done for Kitty, Dunloe, Letterkenny over glen, recording Neil O'Boyle & Kitty Gallagher in Central Hotel bedroom, Letterkenny, bitter hard afternoon, done in blizzard, glenties, death, meeting M. Doherty and Haughey, with Mickey Doherty." [Source: Alan Lomax's journal]"

But that still leaves my question about I'll Go No More A Rovin'.


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