Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: leeneia Date: 12 Jun 20 - 06:49 PM I thought it would be fun to write down the tune I know, but I can't figure out the timing. 4/4, 3/4, and 6/8 have all hit the rocks. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: leeneia Date: 12 Jun 20 - 11:55 AM Thanks for the explanation, Noreen. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Noreen Date: 11 Jun 20 - 11:46 AM The tune Leeneia sang on Monday was not the one being assumed in the most recent posts. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: The Sandman Date: 10 Jun 20 - 05:17 PM the tune is virtually the same as the blarney roses , so what, lakes is a better song |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: leeneia Date: 10 Jun 20 - 04:03 PM Hi, Joe. The Everglades are one of my favorite places. The Shark Valley is real, but it's very subtle. Nonetheless, it makes a big difference to the amount of water flowing out of Lake Okechobee (sp) to the sea. I've visited the Anhinga Trail a few times and have always seen alligators there. It's nice to be on a boardwalk, and it's nice to know they are hibernating in winter, but if I had a child, I would keep that child right next to me. One day the DH and I were on a trail in a wildlife refuge in Mississippi when we heard a rapid scuttling and a giant splash ahead of us. It must have been an alligator, who sensed us and feared us, but we decided to stay put a good while and let it get well away. They say an alligator will not attack an adult human, but I don't blame the guy in the song for not taking the chance. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: GUEST,jonesnudger Date: 10 Jun 20 - 07:17 AM A fascinating thread. The best recorded version, that I have heard is by the Hothouse Flowers as recorded for the Bring It All Back Home tv series. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: leeneia Date: 10 Jun 20 - 12:36 AM The only tune I know from that list is 'Lily of the West' as sung by Joan Baez, and it's not the same. But the tune could be the same as any of the others, and that's okay. When going public, I prefer a tune that's comfortably PD. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Lighter Date: 09 Jun 20 - 03:17 PM Isn't the tune virtually the same as "The Lily of the West," "Joe Bowers," and "I'm a Good Old Rebel"? Think about it. Lomax's (not Guthrie's) "Buffalo Skinners" tune (aka "Caledonio") sounds to me like a first cousin. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: leeneia Date: 09 Jun 20 - 01:15 PM Thanks for the kind words, Joe. About the subjunctive: "If it wasn't..." would not fit metrically. The singer is trying to charm and reassure the lady. He uses correct grammar to show he's not a ruffian. If you sing this song much, you will realize that the hard American r's are part of its charm. One's voice seems to bounce off them, as if off a trampoline. ================ Cypress trees: there are native crypresses in the American South and in the Northwest. As for the lines about his money and sleeping in the woods, keep in mind that he is a vagrant, a weakling, and a drinker who also happens to have a good heart. Don't take anything he says as gospel as he tries to cadge food and shelter. Fortunately the Creole Girl knows how to deal with his suit. She plays the Fictitious (probably) Boyfriend card. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: GUEST,Martin Ryan Date: 09 Jun 20 - 08:36 AM Last night's version certainly turned the prism a little... Regards |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh Date: 09 Jun 20 - 07:34 AM Yes, exactly; but, though indeed a correct use of subjunctive voice, it's seldom in my experience that people use this in speech, and again in my experience, it's rare in traditional songs/songs in a traditional idiom that this grammatical precision is encountered. I wasn't specifically commending the usage (the expression "effective, if defective, communication" was fashionable in Educational systems here about half a century ago), just noting what seemed a peculiarity. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Nick Date: 09 Jun 20 - 06:38 AM Sorry you were rightfully applauding it. I misread your post. Breezy is a friend if a friend and still going strong. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Nick Date: 09 Jun 20 - 06:36 AM Isn’t that a correct use of a subjunctive form in a conditional statement? |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh Date: 09 Jun 20 - 04:11 AM Just an observation or two about this "refreshed" song; how often in "folksongs" do you encounter such perfect grammar as "if it weren't..." (as distinct from the more common formation in demotic speech, "if it wasn't..."). And, although the impression given is that the singer/narrator is living out in the bayou - isn't the cypress native to the Mediterranean, and transplanted as an ornamental exotic elsewhere? Poetic licence, I suppose, together with a lot of reminiscences of other songs. A song sometimes performed by senior Irish politicians, while "relaxed". |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Joe Offer Date: 09 Jun 20 - 12:46 AM Dick, at the Mudcat Worldwide Singaround today, Leeneia sang an absolutely marvelous rendition of the lyrics she posted above. In the post, she said the song came from a group called the Waffles in Kansas city. This is a song that we've heard so often that it's gone stale, and the version she sang was perfectly wonderful. I can't begin to tell you how wonderful it was to hear it sing it. And it still includes "if it weren't for the alligators," which is my favorite line in the song. I went to Everglades National Park in Florida. If it weren't for the alligators in the middle of the trail, I would have walked a little farther in Shark Valley. Interestingly, there were no sharks, and I could see no valley. I took the tram on that road the second time I visited the park. I saw a venomous cottonmouth snake alongside the road (and lots of alligators), and I'm very glad I was in a tram. Whatever the case, I am glad I went to New Orleans and saw Lake Pontchartrain. Didn't see any alligators there, but I was sure they were nearby. The only places I have seen alligators, were all over Florida, and in the Okefanokee Swamp in Georgia, at the source of the Suwanee River. And whatever the case, Leeneia sang her version of this song wonderfully, and I was so glad I was there to hear it. Hope you can join our singaround next Monday, Dick. You are a wonderful singer, too. -Joe- |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Neil D Date: 08 Jun 20 - 09:47 PM Is the New Basin Canal discussed here better known locally as the Irish Canal? I know that author James Lee Burke in his Dave Robicheaux mysteries always refers to Dave's sidekick, Clete Purcell, as having grown up on the Irish Canal. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: GUEST,Greg F. Date: 08 Jun 20 - 05:23 PM Far more likely that he's referring to money he brought with him from Ireland & hadn't been able to exchange for U.S. dollars. Saith Occam's razor. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: The Sandman Date: 08 Jun 20 - 04:55 PM breezy , if you are still alive, as i have always understood the song foreign money is a reference to confederate money. joe offer, why the refresh? |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Joe Offer Date: 08 Jun 20 - 04:46 PM refresh |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: PoppaGator Date: 18 May 12 - 04:56 PM (1) Equating "Yellow Fever" with malaria: I was relying on my notoriously porous memory and may have used the wrong scientific/medical term for the old colloquial disease-name. My father contracted a disease in the South Pacific during WWII colloquially known even at that late date as "yellow fever"; I thought it was technically known as malaria but may not be remembering accurately. It was definitely a liver ailment which was treatable with penicillin but from which he never fully recovered. (2) "Lake(s)," singular or plural: Current day usage says there is one and only one Lake Pontchartrain, but there are three adjacent lakes which could easily be considered a single "system" or whatever. (3) As far as the song's "Irishness" is concerned, I've just taken that as a given. Have I been wrong about that? In any event, the only important event in the history of the Irish in New Orleans (that is, anywhere near Lake Pontchartrain) is the digging of the New Basin Canal and the attendant loss of many many lives ~ so many, in fact, that Irish immigration to the area came to an immediate halt. Irish-American people in New Orleans fall into two categories: (a) descendants of Irish who immigrated to this area 175 years ago and who generally intermarried/interbred with folks of other nationalities, mostly other Catholic/immigrant groups like Germans, Italians, French, etc., and (b) people like me who moved to N.O. from other parts of the US where most Irish immigrants had settled in the years since the 1830s. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: The Sandman Date: 18 May 12 - 04:38 PM Lake Pontchartrain (play /ˈpɒntʃətreɪn/; French: Lac Pontchartrain, French: [lak pɔ̃ʃaʁtʁɛ̃] ( listen)) is a brackish estuary located in southeastern Louisiana. As an estuary, Pontchartrain is not a true lake. It is, however, part of one the largest wetlands in North America, and the world[1]. It covers an area of 630 square miles (1,600 km2) with an average depth of 12 to 14 feet (3.7 to 4.3 m). Some shipping channels are kept deeper through dredging. It is roughly oval in shape, about 40 miles (64 km) from west to east and 24 miles (39 km) from south to north. In descending order of area, the lake is located in parts of St. Tammany, Orleans, Jefferson, St. John the Baptist, St. Charles, and Tangipahoa parishes. it is one lake not 3 lakes. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: breezy Date: 18 May 12 - 03:47 PM is it possible the 3 lakes are collectively known locally as 'The Lakes ' ? Meanwhile back to the original thread question he went to Jackson by road , but, disillusioned he soon stepped aboard a railroad car and rode back to the lakes. have I got it ? Yea and and while I'm here 'woods' is a convenient generic term and rhymes with 'good' Swamp maybe the more correct term but it dont rhyme with 'good' Even if his money happened to be 'damp'it would still sound odd ! Like some other catters. bazinga ! |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: GUEST Date: 18 May 12 - 02:55 PM Greg - I think that malaria and yellow fever were quite similar diseases caught in similar circumstances. We know they are different dieases now because we're better at diagnosis. Of course, nobody knew in those days that it was those pesky mosquitos that were behind it all. The term malaria just means 'bad air', the kind you get near fetid swamps. Yellow fever was known as vomito negro or the black spit and that was the main difference in symptoms. Both diseases may be known locally as 'swamp fever'. All people knew was that swamps were not healthy places. In 1809 'Walcheren fever' (probably malaria and typhus with a bit of dysentry and typhoid thrown in) killed 4000 men and put many more on the sick list for months. So be careful with all that swamp music you play! |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: The Sandman Date: 18 May 12 - 02:45 PM there is only one lake, it should be lake of, NOT Lakes of Ponchartrain |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Desert Dancer Date: 18 May 12 - 02:41 PM Please note the existance of a prior thread, Origins: Lakes of Ponchartrain, as linked at the top. Also the four versions in the DT, none of which is precisely the currently popular version via Brady-Waterson-McCloskey (which I also learned via the American group, Trapezoid). ~ Becky in Long Beach |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Q (Frank Staplin) Date: 18 May 12 - 02:01 PM Correction- song learned in America. Quoting from Sam Henry, Songs of the People - "Source: Paddy M'Closkey (Carnamenagh, Corkey Co,, Antrim), learned from Frank M'Allister (Carnagall, Corkey Co., Antrim) c. 1905, learned when a woodsman in America." (Published 12 Oct. 1935; Laws H9) (Columns 1923-1939) |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Jim Carroll Date: 18 May 12 - 01:45 PM Sorry, meant to include this information Jim Carroll McCLUSKEY, Paddy Singer and fiddle player. Clough Mills, Co. Antrim. 5.8.53 Aged 73. Lives alone in a one-room' cottage at Lislarin. He was born at Loughgiel, learnt to play the fiddle from his father and used to play at local dances with another fiddler, neighbour John McAfee. Worked in Scotland in early life, returned to Ireland in 1915, and worked there at thatching, pig-killing, etc. until the age of sixty. One of his songs: 'Cruel Ship's Carpenter' is printed in JEFDSS 1956) Section 1. Annie-o: 20031; Apprentice boy: 20032; Cave Hill side: 20033; Cruel ship's carpenter (1): 20032; Henry Connor: 20033; Lakes of Poncetrin: 20031; Maid on shore (l): 20033; Old dun cow: 20032; Trees they do grow high (5): 20031; Trip over the mountain (3): 20033; William and Mary: 20031. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Jim Carroll Date: 18 May 12 - 01:39 PM "....Or even pre-1960?" Mike Waterson almost certainly learned from the BBC recording of Paddy McCluskey made in Antrim in 1953 (collector's note below) - McCluskey was also credited with giving the song to Sam Henry. Jim Carroll LAKES OF PONCETRIN, The Singer: Paddy McCluskey 2.45 20031 Clough Mills, Co. Antrim. 5.8.53 (P.K - S.O'B) 'Through swamps and alligators ....' (10 verses) Song describes how amid the dangers of the alligators a handsome Creole girl offers accommodation and faithfully refuses an offer of marriage. The man leaves, saying he will remember her kindness and drink a toast to her on every social occasion. See Sam Henry Collection, 619 for this version noted from the same singer, where the title is given as 'The Lakes of Ponchartrain' (probably more correct), with a note that these lakes are five miles north of New Orleans. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Q (Frank Staplin) Date: 18 May 12 - 01:25 PM The Irish reference in Sam Henry is c. 1905 (see above) and the name of the source is given. Most (if not all) of the articles collected in the book are pre-1940. I know nothing further about the origin. Not found in the older N. Am. references that I have. I have ordered Pound's book (a cheapie at dealers) which has the oldest Am. reference (see previous post, 1922). |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: greg stephens Date: 18 May 12 - 05:50 AM Poppagator suggests that this song was written in Ireland, based on letters sent home by Irish worker(s) on the canal in Louisiana. Well, it's a theory, but is there any actual evidence placing this song in Ireland at the relevant time? General anecdotes suggest the song's recent connection with Ireland came about because Christie Moore learned it from the Yorkshireman Mike Waterson, and via Planxty and Paul Brady etc it became extremely widely known. Can we actually place this version(or anything like it) in Ireland say pre-1900? Or even pre-1960? Also, I am curious Poppagator's equating yellow fever with malaria. They are certainly quite different diseases in British usage, but perhaps the American habit is different? |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: GUEST,hg Date: 18 May 12 - 01:06 AM gators definitely crawl through the woods during mating season. I wouldn't sleep out in the cypress woods during alligator mating season.... |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Q (Frank Staplin) Date: 17 May 12 - 05:26 PM Poppagator's response is as valid as any, and contains useful information on money and construction of the canals, as well as the 'woods', which were gator habitat. Like many 'Folk Songs', only the person who put together his version, can explain his alluions. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: PoppaGator Date: 17 May 12 - 04:38 PM My theory has always been that the song was "written by," or (perhaps more likely) based upon letters sent home to Ireland by, one of the many Irish immigrants who came to New Orleans in the 1830s to work on the construction of the New Basin Canal, which ran from the shore of Lake Pontchartrain south into the heart of the city, to a turning basin near the current-day site of Union Passenger Terminal. This route includes a section of today's Interstate highway 10. This year is the 175th anniversry if the completion of that Canal, and was commemmorated by the Irish Channel St Patrick's Day Marching Club earlier this year, because the construction of the canal is so central to the history of Irish people in New Orleans. The work of digging the canal was perilous because of the near-certainty of contracting "yellow fever" (malaria) in the swampy environment. The Irish immigrants who made up most of the workforce died in great numbers: in fact, mathematically, an individual actually stood a better chance of survival back home in famine-struck rural Ireland than working on the shore of Lake Pontchartrain. Immigrants were hired for the work largely because of the risk of disease ~ local slaveowners refused to put their human property at risk by loaning slaves out to the canal project. Local working-class folks, of course, were also understandably reluctant to hire on. In latter years, we have learned that native Louisianans, whether black or white, slave or free, could have done the work safely enough due to immunity; anyone who had survived childhood in this area was ipso facto safe from the most serious effects of mosquito bites. Conversely, ALL the European immigrants working on the project (mostly, but not exclusively, Irish) were quite vulnerable to deadly disease. New Orleans was the #1 port of embarkation for immigrants from Ireland for several years in the 1830s-40s, the time of the first Great Potato Famine, largely because of the promise of work on the New Basin Canal. Because the deadly effects of Yellow Fever became so well known to the folks left behind, subsequent immigration from Ireland to the US avoided New Orleans "like the plague" (literally!), and concentrated almost exclusively on other US ports, mostly in the northeast (New York, Boston, Philadelphia, etc.) If this theory is true, the "foreign money" would NOT have been Confederate ~ the canal-building project predated the Civil War by 10-15 years. Still in all: back in the 1830s, there was NOT a uniform monetary system in the US ~ banknotes (paper money) were issued by individual banks, and it may have been difficult to negotiate bills from a New Orleans bank in Mississippi (or even in Jackson, Louisiana). New Orleans was nominally "American" in those days not long after the Louisiana Purchase, but it was still culturally French and Spanish, and multi-lingual; the ten-dollar bills issued by some local banks bore the French word "DIX" for ten ~ many surmise that this is the origin of the terms "Dixie"/"Dixieland." It makes sense that English-speaking Mississippians might consider such currency to be "foreign." Swamps hereabouts are generally fairly densely wooded, mostly with cypress trees. It is not unreasonable that anyone, local or immigrant, might refer to gator habitat as "the woods." |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Q (Frank Staplin) Date: 17 May 12 - 04:26 PM The version in Sam Henry supposedly dates from 1905, it may be a UK rewrite (or is the song originally from the UK?). We don't know what definition of 'Creole' was in the mind of the composer (discussed at length in one of the linked threads). |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Q (Frank Staplin) Date: 17 May 12 - 04:13 PM No one has posted the first printed version, The Creole Girl, in L. Pound, 1922, ABS, 55, pp. 127-128. Nor has the early Lake of Ponchartrain been posted (Gardner/Chickering, see Traditional Ballad Index). Why speculate about the wording of one late version and try to apply that to the whole spectrum of the song? The song was first in print in 1922; have earlier versions been found? Is the song an old one handed down, or the late invention of some unknown writer? [Idle comments on the version in the Flanders volume (DT)] Does the singer use 'wood' to mean what is often called 'bush' ?. Foreign money- what time period is supposed to be represented in the song? Louisiana Terr. used a mixture of money, even into the 19th C., U. S., French, Talers, etc. There is nothing to suggest Civil War times. All hard currencies accepted, but even U.S. paper suspect? A common attitude at times. No clue is offered to the identity of the wanderer except that he might be a wandering artist. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Trevor Thomas Date: 17 May 12 - 08:32 AM Here's my interpretation... The song is written from the point of view of a mercenary soldier, (possibly Irish but I perhaps only think this because of Paul Brady) but certainly non native to the US who was on the losing side in the American Civil War. The line 'my money here's no good' leads me to believe he has been paid in Confederate dollars, which have become worthless. The line where he can gain no credit so curses 'all foreign money' leads me to believe he's not a US national, so to him Confederate dollars and Yankee dollars are all 'foreign money'. Not being native to the area would also explain him worrying about the alligators in the wood. He is either mistaken about the 'gators or does not know the difference between a wood and a swamp. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: BobKnight Date: 16 May 12 - 08:23 PM I prefer, "All strangers there, no friends to me," meaning he knew nobody and therefore had no friends there. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: GUEST,leeneia Date: 16 May 12 - 06:01 PM I don't know, but I do know it is more restrained than the tune in the DT. I'm glad you like the words. I do, too. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: breezy Date: 16 May 12 - 03:39 PM thats a great version and not just because it mentions my name thanks for posting it Is the tune that you know anything like the common tune for the L of P as sung by P Brady? just asking |
Subject: ADD: Lakes of Pontchartrain (The Waffles?) From: GUEST,leeneia Date: 16 May 12 - 03:20 PM Here's a version I learned from a band called The Waffles in Kansas City. Set in the olden days, when money of all kinds circulated in the U.S., and taverns had hearths ("flaming circles"). No trains. ============= One time I got in trouble, as I've been prone to do. Set out down the river, had to bid this town adieu. Through the swamps and the alligators, I wandered in the cane, till I met a creole girl on the shores of Pontchartrain. My body was shiv'rin as I pounded on her door. Rain was runnin down my neck and fell upon her floor. "I beg your pardon, my fair lady, but my money is no good. If it weren't for the alligators, I would sleep out in the wood." She took me to her mother's house, and they treated me right well. The raven hair in ringlets all around her shoulders fell. And if I tried to paint that beauty, I know it would be in vain, for I became enchanted by the girl from Pontchartrain. By the bayou that did slowly run there outside of her door I would sit and watch her work for many an hour or more. [I am not making this up - leeneia] And the echo of that strange land did rustle in the breeze, and the spell on me grew deeper underneath the cypress trees. One time I called her over and set her on my knee. I begged for her to marry me, but she said, "This cannot be." She said, "I have a true love, and true I must remain, till the day that he returns to me in Pontchartain." So it's good-bye, my fair lady. I'll not see you no more. But I swear I'll not forget the kindness at your door. And around each flaming circle, a glass to you I'll drain. Here's to you, my creole girl on the shores of Pontchartrain. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: breezy Date: 16 May 12 - 02:41 PM sod the money angle. back to the plot i.e. the thread So he went to Jackson, yes ? but didnt stay because he longed to be back at the banks - I said 'sod the money' - of the lake of Pontchartrain and collectively all 3 lakes are known as the 'Lakes' - plural - of Pontetc , would you agree ? thanks for that , its obvious really , Now you can try and explain the 'money angle ', with dates please BTW surely swamps will contain vegetation and trees and would be a highly suitable environment for alligators to inhabit |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: MartinRyan Date: 16 May 12 - 01:24 PM Songwriters are ... and that's before the folk process gets to work! Regards |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: GUEST,Tootler Date: 16 May 12 - 01:08 PM It's a song. Songwriters are |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: GUEST,Lighter Date: 16 May 12 - 12:58 PM Maybe he means Confederate money. "Foreign" scans a lot better. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Uncle Phil Date: 16 May 12 - 12:53 PM make that "the difficult passage up the Mississippi River" |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Uncle Phil Date: 16 May 12 - 12:51 PM The first railroad in New Orleans was built in 1830. It ran between the City of New Orleans (located where the French Quarter is today) and Lake Pontchartrain. Freight and passengers could be routed through Lake Pontchartrain so ships didn't have to make the difficult up the Mississippi River. The route of the railroad is on your map; it is Elysian Fields Blvd in modern New Orleans. In 1838 a canal, built largely Irish immigrants, and ship basin were built to connect New Orleans to Lake Pontchartrain. Look for Canal Street and Basin Street on your map. The first railroad connecting New Orleans to the north and east was built in 1851 and the first railroad to the north and west was built in 1853. Big sections of the interstate highways serving New Orleans are built on raised causeways and bridges. - Phil |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: GUEST,leeneia Date: 16 May 12 - 10:48 AM Les, I'm sure you are aware that folk songs grow and change with time. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: Les from Hull Date: 16 May 12 - 09:17 AM Not a lot of railways in 1803 |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: GUEST,leeneia Date: 16 May 12 - 08:59 AM I see by my atlas that present-day Interstates 55, 59 and 10 all hug the shores of Lake Pontchartrain. What does this tell us? That the ground there is probably the best for building, and that the shores of the lake are an important trade route. No doubt the same applies to railroads, both past and present. |
Subject: RE: Question about Lakes of Pontchartrain song From: MGM·Lion Date: 16 May 12 - 04:40 AM One thing that does exercise me is the reference to the 'foreign money' which he cursed because he could not succeed with it in Jackson, and his telling the Creole girl on first meeting that the money he had brought back with him was "no good" ~~ not, note, that he had none, but that what he had would not pass. Is it at all possible that Louisiana was still using French currency, rather then $US, at the time? If so, presumably this would date the story [and the song?] to some time before the Purchase of 1803. If not, what do these puzzling details mean? ~M~ |
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