BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 10:05 PM

No, I would not like to be rich. I just want enough to get by and to help others.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 09:43 PM

Rich? No, not really. I dreamed about hitting a 50 million lottery a few months back. Other than the good I thought I could do with the money, I figured I'd be broke by now anyway. And I am.

No one deserves wealth, because wealth means someone else's kid goes hungry. To think otherwise is to be a bullshitter. The rich do NOT deserve their wealth, because to keep that wealth they allow others to go without. IMO.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 09:36 PM

Most of the 10% became rich by meeting rich people who liked them and let them into the club...

Very few did it on hard work... Very few...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Sawzaw
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 09:32 PM

Is there anybody here that would not like to be rich?

How did the other 10% get rich?

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 09:20 PM

Historically, the first generation makes the wealth, the second generation keeps what they have, and the third generation squanders it.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 09:15 PM

90% of the current rich were born rich...

If you wanted to be rich you should have picked rich parents...

Your bad...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 08:57 PM

IF someone (Bill Gates is an example) earns their money (and he did -- IBM screwed themselves) and then turns that money to helping others (which Gates has done) then I have no objections.

Yes, you can make money by knowing how to "work" money, such as what Warren Buffet has done. Once again, he has committed himself and his money to helping others.

I attended a talk by Bill Gates' father once. Bill Gates Sr. (the Microsoft founder is William H. Gates III) told of the founding of the Gates Foundation. Seems like Bill 3 decided that you can only use a certain amount of money and after that it's all superfluous...so he founded the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation to use his money to help others; Buffet has made substantial contribution to the Gates Foundation.

Sounds reasonable to me. If you can pay your bills and have enough money to left to live on why not help others?

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 07:41 PM

Splitting hairs, GfinS... Boring night, heh???

BTW, when you delve into Saws Globe Scan folks what you find is that of those 58%, if the US is somewhat typical of other nations, that only 15% "strongly deserve"... So between the strongly against, somewhat against and fors, reality is that 85% aren't all that wild about the rich deserving their wealth...

But, hey, if it makes Saws happy then why would a reasonable and alternate analysis of the data ruin his day...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 07:05 PM

Amos: ""Babies born into wealthy families have earned their eventual inheritance by being born in the right place."


".....being born in the right place.".....Right???.........I find that very interesting that you would consider that 'Right!'......interesting.

Think about it.

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 06:11 PM

What I can never understand is why anybody would want to have more money than they can spend.

Over a certain level, which is way short of the kind of money these fat cats get hold of, it can't be about the money as such - it surely must be about some kind of personality hangup, in which their own sense of some quality that matters to them is dependent on the amount of money they can get hold of. Akin to other addictions such as that of an alcoholic or a junkie. Destructive for the individuals trapped in it, and if anything a lot more damaging to soiety.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Bert
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 04:50 PM

They certainly deserve to pay their taxes on their wealth.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 04:48 PM

Two kinds of criminals these days: Those who have a million and those who want a million.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 03:15 PM

That wanker Bob Diamond turned down a bonus of, wait for it. 20 million quid, how can any one person be worth that ?

The thing that they all have in common is unbounded greed, how much money do they want ? all of it ?

And if you believe that survey you are seriously fucked up.

Dave H

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Stringsinger
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 03:07 PM

There is an American myth that anyone can become wealthy here just by hard work and enterprise. This is what sold Playboy magazines, the aspirations to "make it".

I don't trust this poll by the HP. I think there are a whole lot of 99 percenters
who don't think the rich deserve what they are getting while giving the poor the shaft.
Being American means that everyone pays their fair share of responsibility regardless of their incomes. The CEO's who are sitting on their capital are basically unAmerican, transferring jobs out of the country and not support our institutions. These "rich"
divide our country and buy off the law enforcement agencies who violate our Constitution and try to scare us by supporting nonsense such as the defense authorization act and the patriot act. Those who put that through congress are anything but authentic patriots. They can't be allowed to buy off our government.

We need to regulate them in the tradition of both Roosevelts. We are the government and those reps are our servants, not our masters.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Charley Noble
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 02:49 PM

Put it on the ground,
Spread it all around,
Dig it with a hoe,
It will make your flowers grow!

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 02:32 PM

Well, there's a more important question at this juncture: Does Romney deserve his wealth? To me, $230 million is a chunk of change. Personally, I think he is insolvent and needs the election to re-establish his reputation, whatever that is.

SUPPORT ROMNEY. BANK OUTSIDE THE USA.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 02:17 PM

Do Tom Cruise or Paul McCartney deserve their wealth?

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Bert
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 01:57 PM

One thing we know is exactly how much wealth a person can attain by earning it. All of us who earn our living with honest toil know that.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 01:48 PM

Depends on whether or not you agree with the premise, that.... Socialism is the politics of envy!

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Greg F.
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 01:22 PM

And then there are those that INHERITED their wealth without having to do jack shit for it - they, of course, should be exempt from having to pay their fair share of taxes on their unearned and undeserved income and wealth, while the poor and the middle class taxpayers get screwed over six ways to sunday..

This may make sense to TeaPublican jackasses, but the logic somehow escapes me.

We're headed back in a bucket to the days of Henry Clay Frick, J.P. Morgan, and John D. Rockefeller, Sr. & ain't got much further to go.

Maybe its some sort of a "living history" kinda thing in these days of marketing "heritage" to get big bucks.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 01:14 PM

I have only two questions about wealth:

1. Was it earned, and earned honestly?
2. What good is being done with it?

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: GUEST,Chongo Chimp
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 01:14 PM

John? LH told me to tell you that it's "whose". Whose, whose, whose. Not who's! "Whose" is the possessive. "Who's" is a contraction that means "who is". Look it up. He cares about that sorta thing a lot fer some reason. ;-D Me, I just spell words any damn way I feel like at the time.

*****


Now here's my comment.

Whether a rich person deserves his wealth or not depends on one thing. How he got it.

Gettin' rich by committin' massive bank fraud or other types of phony money manipulation is not a legitimate way of gainin' yer wealth.

Some rich people do deserve their wealth and others don't, so to quote the 58% of the public as sayin' that "the rich deserve their wealth" is basically a meaningless and pretty dumb statement in the first place, because it seems to pretend that all rich people are the same. They are not!

But it makes a handy sound bite, doesn't it? And dumbasses love handy sound bites. They relieve you of the responsibility of actually thinkin' about what yer talkin' about.

- Chongo

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 01:00 PM

Having responded to a few such "surveys," I can unequivocally state that I have NEVER been allowed to give a CORRECT answer to any question asked, since all such only give you a choice of preselected answers.

I would agree that the rich, for the most part, do deserve to be rewarded.

I would also point out that the poor, who often work harder for less reward, also deserve to be rewarded according to their contribution.

The question has NOTHING to do with the fairness of taxes. It is appropriate that those who receive "reward" too sparse to survive on should pay no taxes.

Those who's rewards are a little better pay a percentage of their rewards to help run the country.

Those who's rewards are even better pay a larger percentage of their rewards.

Those who's rewards are astonishing, pay no more than those at the bottom of the "probably survivable" tax bracket, and in MOST CASES pay much less, or NOTHING.

The survey did not ask how many people believe that the rich deserve special exemptions from paying taxes at least on a par with what the middle class must pay.

John

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: GUEST,Stim
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 12:51 PM

You speak in jest, MarkS, but a lot of people seem to spend most of their lives ruthlessly accumulating a fortune only to turn around and start handing it out for "The Betterment of Mankind". Think of all the statues, memorials, all the charity balls, all of the museums and institutes, all of the foundations with well paid officers, that we'd miss if not for their generosity...

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 12:43 PM

Someone who strikes it rich "deserves" it due to the value of the labor of those in the same field who did not make it?

Who deserves riches is a deep philosophical question. Certainly it is the effort put in by all who try to become wealthy that is the engine of economic growth. That is why we were most prosperous when those who made it were taxed at 90% marginal rates.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: MarkS
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 12:28 PM

If any of y'all are rich and feel you do not deserve it, I can ease your guilty conscience. Just send your wealth to me and all will be well.
Mark

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 12:13 PM

The author of this thread misses an important part of the survey...

The 58% included two groupings

1. Strongly deserve

2. Somewhat deserve (meaning somewhat don't deserve)

What were the actual percentages in those two groupings???

Let's say, for instance, that the strongly deserve category is 10% then the headlines could easily read "10% Say the rich deserve their wealth"... Or could read "90% say the rich either don't deserve their wealth or somewhat don't deserve it"...

Bogus polling... Any college Stats instructor would point that out right away...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Amos
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 12:03 PM

WHen there is no differentiation between earned wealth, inherited wealth, and Lotto wealth, the results are semantically meaningless, and the question is stupid. Definitions of deserve, rich, and wealth would be a good start.

"Babies born into wealthy families have earned their eventual inheritance by being born in the right place."

"If a dishonest businessman can manage to siphon off several million off the top by falsifying corporate records, he deserves to enjoy that money."

"A man who gets fifty million by buying one winning Lottery ticket has earned his money."

"Luck is just as valid as productive work as a source of value."


I wonder what kind of survey results these nonsensical propositions would get in our hodgepodge society.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 12:01 PM

The articles don't say exactly how the survey was done or the wording of the question(s).

'Deserve' is kind of a slippery word in this context. *I* might agree that most wealthy folks 'have their money legally', and still not agree that they earned it. If a dumb kid inherits $50,000,000 legally, does he 'deserve' it? If a system exists that pays CEOs of banks hundreds of millions legally... do they 'deserve' THAT much?

And what is most people's idea of where 'wealthy' starts?

Let ME design the survey, and we'll have some idea of what people really think.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Penny S.
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 11:53 AM

Was this by any chance a telephone survey? Thus biassing results. No-one asked me. (Though I do have a phone.) The report of the study doesn't mention method. Not at the top, anyway.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: GUEST,Stim
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 11:44 AM

It not surprising that 58% of Americans believe that the rich deserve their money, because the "American Dream" is that anyone can get rich. What is should be surprising is that only 58% believe it. On most examinations, 58% is a very bad score.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 11:20 AM

What America cannot afford is rich people.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 11:18 AM

Yes, indeed they do deserve their wealth. Thing is, they don't deserve the wealth of the working class and other American people. And there as was said by The Bard, is the rub.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Elmore
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 11:04 AM

The rich deserve their money, except the smug, condescending (imo) Willard.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Leadfingers
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 03:12 AM

I have no problem with anyone being 'rich' - My problem is 'The Rich' who misuse their wealth , especially the Tax Evaders .

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 02:59 AM

I guess it boils down to what you count as 'wealth'....some people do not count it as money at all.
I don't!

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: meself
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 01:00 AM

Can't help thinking of Shania Twain's response to an interviewer's question about her wealth (she grew up in poverty): "It's not like I DESERVE all this - NOBODY DESERVES to have this kind of money."

And Neil Young, when the old-timer asked him how a young fellow such as he was at the time was able to afford to buy this big ranch in California: "Well - I'm just lucky, I guess."

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 12:36 AM

Now why would they believe that?

"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie".

The US press and TV have much to answer for.

Government by the rich for the rich.

Dumbass.

Subject: RE: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 12:07 AM

"It ranked number three, with only Australia and Canada having more favorable views toward the rich. In Greece, just nine percent thought so. "

Well Duh!!!

In Canada and Australia the rich pay their taxes. In Greece they don't.

Subject: BS: 58% Say The Rich Deserve Their Wealth
From: Sawzaw
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 12:04 AM

58 Percent Of Americans Believe Rich Deserve Their Wealth
The Huffington Post

A majority of Americans have a favorable view of wealthy individuals and believe that they deserve their fortunes, according to a new poll.

GlobeScan, a market-research firm, released a 23-country study last week showing that 58 percent of U.S. citizens "strongly agree" or "somewhat agree" that the rich deserve their wealth -- a slight increase from a similar survey in 2008.

The findings come at a time when tax cuts for the rich, Mitt Romney's wealth and Occupy Wall Street have all been hot topics in the 2012 campaign cycle.

Growing economic inequality is a real phenomenon. Last year, for example, a study from the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office showed that income distribution had tilted dramatically towards top earners between 1979 and 2007. Another study showed that the richest one percent has disproportionately benefited during the recovery.

The GlobeScan survey does not necessarily contradict previous polls that show Americans think income inequality is a real problem. Earlier this year, the president of the Pew Research Center wrote a New York Times op-ed that explained, "People [in the U.S.] don't necessarily want to take money from the wealthy; they just want a better chance to get rich themselves."

The United States was one of only six countries surveyed where a majority thought the rich deserved their wealth. It ranked number three, with only Australia and Canada having more favorable views toward the rich. In Greece, just nine percent thought so.