BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 08 Dec 12 - 01:26 PM

Well, I may have an accident in my little Fiesta car, I may be attacked in the street, I may fall under a bus, but I still like to go out and would go bonkers if shut in constantly. And I'm only a human!

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Elmore
Date: 08 Dec 12 - 06:04 PM

Eliza

Eliza: would you let your children run wild simply because you enjoy running wild? Respectfully, Elmore.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 08 Dec 12 - 06:09 PM

It is generally a mistake to treat pet animals as human children - although I can see some merit in the converse.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: gnu
Date: 08 Dec 12 - 06:18 PM

"And perhaps in America, there are wild beasts out there that might enjoy a cat sandwich!"

You got birds of prey?

I inspected a NEW (2 months) roof on a large building in Port-aux-Basques, NF. At least thirty cat heads and guess how many paws on the roof? Few small dog heads and paws. Newfies ain't into yappers so much, eh b'y? Cats do a much better job of controlling rats and squirrels and such. Not the indoor cats, mind you.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 09 Dec 12 - 05:02 AM

Heavens, gnu, how awful. I can quite see why those people in USA are a bit wary of letting any pets out. We have small predators such as kestrels and sparrowhawks, but they only take little birds. Golden eagles up in Scotland are quite rare and never seen here in Norfolk.
Elmore, I never had children, but as a child I did 'run wild', but life then was much safer, and we children were never at home in daylight hours. (Perhaps that's why I value freedom so much!) My three Siamese are cuddled up in their basket in the kitchen at this moment, and the counter tops are covered in mud, so they've obviously been out during the night. I see their mate Alfie from next door has been in, as he likes to puke on the floor after eating their leftovers. (He has a gippy tummy) I don't mind any of this, I'm fairly relaxed and just clean it up in a jiffy.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 09 Dec 12 - 09:03 AM

British birds of prey (raptors) - some quite large and readily capable of taking a small cat or a toy dog.

http://raptortrust.org.uk/what-is-a-raptor/british-raptors/

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: greg stephens
Date: 09 Dec 12 - 09:40 AM

Bobert: you want an animal in your house that lives the way you want it to? Get a dog.You want to run an establishment for the benefit of an animal? Get a cat. We have a cat. We do what we are told.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Charmion
Date: 09 Dec 12 - 10:12 AM

Greg Stephens has it right, as I realize anew every time I leap up to provide porter services to the felines. A loud baritone meow from any part of the house brings me on trot for fear that Old Bill will find something fragile to piss on if I don't boost him ontothe bed or the sofa while he's still focussed on the notion of a snooze. How did it come to this?

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 09 Dec 12 - 01:22 PM

I agree Richard, there are some superb, large raptors in Britain, but not anywhere near us in Norfolk!

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Elmore
Date: 09 Dec 12 - 08:39 PM

Eliza: When I was a kid we used to run wild too. These days we have to keep a close watch on our pets and our kids. Sad in a way, but there's no help for it.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 10 Dec 12 - 08:11 AM

We were lucky in those days weren't we Elmore?

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Charmion
Date: 10 Dec 12 - 09:21 AM

I grew up in a village on the Rideau River south of Ottawa, Ontario. Many people remember the 1950s and early '60s as an idyllic time of free-range kids romping in the fields and forests with their friends and the family dog, and I do remember plenty of that in long-ago Manotick. But I also remember plenty of routine hazards, especially the river itself, and Highway 16, which ran through the village, down Main Street past our house, carrying a high volume of commuter traffic and heavy trucks between Ottawa and Prescott, where you took the bridge over the St. Lawrence River to the United States.

Our neighbours the MacEvoys always had a dog, and the dog's name was Happy. Over the 13 years our family lived in the village, the MacEvoys went through about five dogs named Happy. By the time I was a fully sentient being, say circa 1959, Mrs MacEvoy was in the habit of tying the least controllable and most vulnerable members of the family -- Happy the dog and whoever was the youngest kid at the time -- to the tree in front of the house. It never seemed to occur to Mr MacEvoy to build a fence around the yard -- our Dad's solution -- but different strokes do for different folks.

We were cat people (devoted, doting cat people at that), and my parents never managed to keep a cat alive for more than five years until the highway was diverted to bypass the village.

Free-range kids find their own fun, of course. In Manotick, for some reason, that meant a lot of sliding, in summer down the steep banks of the Rideau into the excitingly frothy waters below the dam that powered Watson's grist mill, and in winter just about anywhere a kid with a toboggan could find a slope. The enormous snowbanks thrown up by the highway plows were particularly appealing, and thus one small boy, the younger brother of a classmate, met his doom when he made the tactical error of sliding down the road side of the snowbank, right into the path of a homeward-bound commuter.

I don't remember parents being at all casual or accepting of such incidents. In fact, it was about the time Tommy Bracken died that the wee pupils of Manotick Public School first made the acquaintance of Elmer the Safety Elephant. Our fascination with the aforementioned frothy waters of the Rideau River brought the Canadian Red Cross Society into our lives, along with its irritating patron saint of swimming lessons, one Walter Safety. Grudgingly, we learned never to swim alone (who did that?) or to dive headfirst into unknown waters.

Humans and cats learn caution the hard way, through trial and error. Humans are large and reasonably intelligent, and they have the Highway Traffic Act and the Criminal Code on their side; cats not so much. Cats are small and vulnerable, and the first time they encounter a moving car or an interested predator can easily be the last time.

Old Bill is our last outdoor cat. He came to us off the street, having survived an entire winter as a stray, and goes frantic when denied exeat. Rosie, the new cat, is a purebred Siamese who has never felt natural ground under her paws -- and that's just as well. She's not smart enough to avoid the hazards, as Bill obviously is, and she would be both terrified and in grave danger the whole time. And any cat who comes into our lives in future will likewise become an indoor cat if s/he isn't already.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Elmore
Date: 10 Dec 12 - 10:13 AM

Eliza: I feel that we were luckier than kids are today for a number of reasons. Charmion: Our last outdoor cat, Murray, was a really great cat, but used to come home looking like something the cat dragged in (sorry} due to fights, love matches etc. Never again.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: katlaughing
Date: 10 Dec 12 - 01:18 PM

nicely said, Charmion.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: gnu
Date: 10 Dec 12 - 02:04 PM

Nice post, Charmion.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: GUEST,Charmion's brother Andrew
Date: 11 Dec 12 - 11:53 AM

To compound the safety challenges in Manotick, there was an open, unfenced flooded quarry about 100 metres from our house, close enough that a snapping turtle once tried to lay her clutch of eggs in our front yard. Surprisingly, none of our number of free-range kids managed to drown in the quarry.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 11 Dec 12 - 12:02 PM

Thread drift, but we did the most hair-raising and highly dangerous things as children. Our parents never knew, and never asked. We all survived, had enjoyed enormous freedom and learned how to handle dodgy situations. Sigh, how times have changed.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Elmore
Date: 11 Dec 12 - 02:13 PM

Thread drift continued. I was brought up by my great-grandmother in a working class city. I did pretty much what I wanted. On Friday nights we used to go to dances at the Y.M.C.A. We walked home, way across town at 11 p.m. We were about 12 years old. These days you would want an ak-47 to get across town. Glad we moved.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Charmion
Date: 11 Dec 12 - 03:23 PM

Hi, Andrew -- Remember when one of the Scharf girls lost a toe to a snapper? That would have been about 1962 ... She was swimming in the quarry, of course.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: GUEST,Charmion's brother Andrew
Date: 12 Dec 12 - 06:51 PM

Can't say I do, Charmion. I am surprised, given how lore easily spread in the place.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Raptor
Date: 13 Dec 12 - 09:59 AM

As a wild bird lover you can list me as one of the keep the cats indoors people.
Those who let unspayed or unnutered cats outdoors are responsible for thousands of ferel cat deaths each year.
And they claim to be cat lovers. It makes me Sick.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Elmore
Date: 13 Dec 12 - 10:24 AM

Raptor: I totally agree. Used to let the cats out when I was young and stupid.

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Charmion
Date: 13 Dec 12 - 10:29 AM

Until very recently, a surprising number of Canadians thought of cats essentially as disposable animals -- useful in a limited way to people with rodent problems, but otherwise not valued. A good mouser would be tolerated, but just barely. Organized cat fancy is quite a modern phenomenon, and until very recently focussed on exotic types, Siameses and the like, rather than the local rat-bashers.

I think many of our attitudes toward the much-loved moggies in our lives are affected by those centuries of disdain. We assume, first of all, that cats are not trainable. Next, we think of cats as capable enough to take care of themselves to the extent that we just let them out and assume they will be okay.

It isn't just the songbirds and shy woodland creatures who deserve protection -- the cats do, too!

It's nice to see you back on the board, Raptor. How's it goin', eh?

Subject: RE: BS: Cat Issue Advice Needed...
From: Raptor
Date: 13 Dec 12 - 11:37 AM

Great how are you guys?