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Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs
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Subject: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST Date: 02 Feb 13 - 02:00 PM I am looking for British songs and tunes from all ages which reflect ant-monarchist sentiments. Thanks Andrew |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Taconicus Date: 02 Feb 13 - 02:06 PM Look for Scottish songs; you'll find many more. Myriads. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Steve Gardham Date: 02 Feb 13 - 02:14 PM And hundreds of English, Scottish, Irish on the Bodleian Broadside Ballads site. There are of course lots of pro-monarchist as well. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle Date: 02 Feb 13 - 03:24 PM I've written a few https://soundcloud.com/#denise_whittle/well-done-liz I seem to remember Leon Rosselson wrote one about The Queen - it was in Songsmith magazine - nice words. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Leadfingers Date: 02 Feb 13 - 03:42 PM Leon Rosselsson's 'Procreation' was a nice dig at more than one 'Royal Family' ! Procreation , procreation ,there's nothing so Royal as procreation Traditionally we spend our time Perpetuating the Royal Line |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,Ebor_Fiddler (Well-known pedant) Date: 02 Feb 13 - 06:08 PM Yes, but it's hardly a Folk Song is it? However good it does its job, it's a modern song and we nkow who wrote it. Folk songs are "Wee Wee German Laidie" and its like, transmitted through tradition. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,Ebor_Fiddler (Well-known pedant) Date: 02 Feb 13 - 06:09 PM Or even "Lairdie"! |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Allan Conn Date: 02 Feb 13 - 06:54 PM Mind not that the Wee Wee German Lairdie ia an anti-monarchist song. There are plenty of Scottish folk songs supporting one House or the other but as far as older songs go I can't imagine there are that many which are anti-monrachist! |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,Fred McCormick Date: 03 Feb 13 - 06:02 AM Sadly enough, there's not all that many of them around. Here's one however which ought to be in wider circulation. I should warn folks, it's been somewhat altered and trimmed by me but, if I remember right, you can find the original in Pepys' Ballads. It goes to the tune of Greensleeves, BTW. Epithalamium; Or a Wedding Song On the Supposed Marriage of the Supposed Prince of Wales, to the supposed Grandchild of the French King, the Supposed Son Of Louis the 13th, as it was with the consent of his holiness, (or rather his wickedness), the Pope of Rome, Solemnized From Paris to Purgatory the third of the Last Greek Calends 1689. To the Tune of, Lulla by baby, &c. Licensed and Entered According to Order. 1. Pray rub up your Ears, and I'll tell you a thing, The wonder of Subjects, the Wit of a King: Then pray give attention to what I do Sing, Ch; Sing tantara rara rara Boys hey, Boys hey, sing tantara rara rara Boys hey 2. The Young Prince of Wales he went over to France, To fiddle and fence, and learn to Dance; And there he did meet with a Mistress by chance Ch: 3. He spy'd from his Cradle a Princess, that Cry'd, The Dauphin's young Daughter with Swadling Clouts ty'd: And fell in a Passion, as if he would have dy'd. Ch: 4. The Prince to a minute, was half a year old; The Princess a quarter, but bucksome and bold, And both they were willing their Loves to unfold. Ch: 5. Young Innocent mumbl'd, and fumbl'd the Wench; And she sweetly answered, by Smiling, in French: But she with her Rattle his passion did quench. Ch: 6. At last they agreed, and to marriage they went: The day being appointed, mistakes to prevent; And the Turk's Great Defender he gave his Consent. Ch: 7. The Priest he made halt, and joined their Hands; And thus he secur'd them, in Wedlock Bands, Yet neither had Kingdom, nor People, nor Lands. Ch: 8. When both were a Bed, and the Candle put out, And the Bride-groom drew nearer he Shit in his Clout, And the Wedding did end with a Stink and a Rout. Ch: |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,Fred McCormick Date: 03 Feb 13 - 06:05 AM Here's another one, written by Vic Gammon and lifted from Digital Tradition by me. Kings and Queens of England Now Charles II had eleven bastard children And George III went mad And Edward VII they thought was Jack the Ripper But Richard III weren't as bad as Shakespeare thought he was Victoria lay back and thought of England Charles I lost his head Well the best thing about those Kings and Queens of England Is that most of them are dead. Singing Rule Britannia Britannia waives the rules Kings, Queens, Jacks and Knaves and tyrants Cheats and fools. Now William III was a protestant and Dutchman And James I was a Scot And George I spoke nothing else but German What a mixed-up, inter-bred lot. And William I was a grasping Norman bastard Believe me, it's no lie. Well there hasn't been an English king of England Since Harold got one in the eye. Chorus Now she was a well-heeled blue-blood Cinderella, Him Prince Charming with big ears, But he has a thing going with the ugly sister So it ended all in tears. So arise now ye ghosts of old Oliver Cromwell, Brave Harrison and Tom Paine. Won't you rid our land of this monstrous carbuncle And bring sunshine after the reign. Chorus Note: "Monstrous carbuncle" was Prince Charles' infamous description of some piece of modern architecture (design for the Tate Gallery extension??) |
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Subject: Lyr Add: CORONATION CORONACH (Thurso Berwick) From: akenaton Date: 03 Feb 13 - 11:12 AM With best wishes... back to C index CORONATION CORONACH—Scottish Breakaway (Words: Thurso Berwick)
O, Scotland hesna got a King, |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Leadfingers Date: 03 Feb 13 - 11:22 AM Now sit back and wait ---Some prat will say "They CANT be folk songs as they are not part of some mystical semi religious oral Tradition ! And to make it even worse , they are entertaining ! Oh Horrors ! |
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Subject: Lyr Add: THE WEE MAGIC STANE (John McEvoy) From: Owen Woodson Date: 03 Feb 13 - 12:40 PM "mystical semi religious oral Tradition"? Oh I dunno. As far as having mystical properties is concerned the Stone of Scone fitted the bill perfectly. Until the lousy rotten cattle raiding, haggis thumping, whisky drinking, claymore wielding Scots (only kidding) had the brass neck (only kidding again) to steal it back from the hated imperious English ruling class, who screwed the populations of 3/4 of the world's surface for every red cent they could get - and then had the sheer damned gall to ram Rule Britannia down everybody's necks. And that time I wasn't kidding. THE WEE MAGIC STANE. John McEvoy Oh the Dean o' Westminster wis a powerful man, He held a' the strings o' the state in his hand. But with a' this great business it flustered him nane, Till some rogues ran away wi' his wee ma-gic stane." cho: Wi' a too-ra-li-oor-a-li-oor-a-li-ay." Noo the stane had great pow'rs that could dae such a thing And withoot it, it seemed, we'd be wantin' a king, So he called in the polis and gave this decree-- "Go an' hunt oot the Stane and return it tae me." So the polis went beetlin' up tae the North They huntit the Clyde and they huntit' the Forth [ie, west & east] But the wild folk up yonder jist kiddit them a' Fur they didnae believe it wis magic at a'. Noo the Provost o' Glesga, Sir Victor by name, Was awfy pit oot when he heard o' the Stane So he offered the statues that staun in the Square [made of stone] That the high churches' masons might mak a few mair. When the Dean o' Westminster wi' this was acquaint, He sent for Sir Victor and made him a saint, "Now it's no use you sending your statues down heah" [English accent] Said the Dean, "But you've given me a jolly good ideah." So he quarried a stane o' the very same stuff An' he dressed it a' up till it looked like enough Then he sent for the Press and announced that the Stane Had been found and returned to Westminster again. When the reivers found oot what Westminster had done, [thieves] They went aboot diggin' up stanes by the ton And fur each wan they feenished they entered the claim That THIS was the true and original stane. Noo the cream o' the joke still remains tae be tellt, Fur the bloke that was turnin' them aff on the belt At the peak o' production was so sorely pressed That the real yin got bunged in alang wi' the rest. So if ever ye come on a stane wi' a ring Jist sit yersel' doon and appoint yersel King Fur there's nane wud be able to challenge yir claim That ye'd croont yersel King on the Destiny Stane. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,Ebor_Fiddler Date: 03 Feb 13 - 02:21 PM Tony Airmstrong Hyphenated Jones He's awfu' wee an' pawkie Ef he hadnae ben the Royal Groom He'd hae ben the royal jockie! |
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Subject: Lyr Add: CAM YE O'ER FRAE FRANCE From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle Date: 03 Feb 13 - 02:27 PM And of course:- CAM YE O'ER FRAE FRANCE Cam ye o'er frae France? Cam ye down by Lunnon? Saw ye Geordie Whelps And his bonny woman? Were ye at the place Ca'd the Kittle Housie? Saw ye Geordie's grace Riding on a goosie? Geordie he's a man There is little doubt o't; He's done a' he can Wha can do without it? Down there came a blade Linkin' like my lordie; He wad drive a trade At the loom o' Geordie. Though the claith were bad, Blythly may we niffer; Gin we get a wab, It makes little differ. We hae tint our plaid, Bannet, belt and swordie, Ha's and mailins braid -- But we hae a Geordie! Jocky's gane to France, And Montgomery's lady; There they'll learn to dance: Madame, are ye ready? They'll be back belyue Belted, brisk and lordly; Brawly may they thrive To dance a jig wi' Geordie! Hey for Sandy Don! Hey for Cockolorum! Hey for Bobbing John, And his Highland Quorum! Mony a sword and lance Swings at Highland hurdie; How they'll skip and dance O'er the bum o' Geordie! Note: When George I imported his seraglio of impoverished gentlewomen from Germany, he provided the Jacobite songwriters with material for some of their most ribald verses. Madame Kilmansegge, Countess of Platen, is referred to exclusively as "The Sow" in the songs, while the King's favorite mistress, the lean and haggard Madame Schulemburg (afterwards named Duchess of Kendall) was given the name of "The Goose". She is the "goosie" referred to in this song. The "blade" is the Count Koningsmark. "Bobbing John refers to John, Earl of Mar, who was at the time recruiting Highlanders for the Hanoverian cause. "Geordie Whelps" is, of course, George I himself. MJ Lunnon=London; Kittle Housie=Brothel; Linkin=Tripping along; Claith=Cloth; Niffer=Haggle; Gin=If; Wab=Web (or length) of cloth; Tint=Lost; Ha's and Mailins=Houses and Farmlands; Gane=Gone;=Belyve=Quickly; Brawly=Wall; Hurdie=Buttock |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: John MacKenzie Date: 03 Feb 13 - 03:13 PM Victoria we're coming for you soon Victoria, it may be when the moon Is shining on December frost around the flowers of June But we're coming for you soon, Victoria ***************************************************************** Oh Paddy dear and did you hear the awful news they say Princess Margaret and Lord Snowdon They have joined the IRA They're drilling in the mountains to the sound of fife and drums Young Tony's taking snapshots while yon Maggie fires a gun ***************************************************************** The sea o the sea id the graw geal mo chridhe Sp) And long may she roll between England and me It's a sure guarantee that some hour we'll be free Thank christ we're surrounded by water. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Stanron Date: 03 Feb 13 - 03:18 PM Don't overlook 'London bridge is falling down'. The king, forgotten which one, gives the income from London bridge to his wife. She can't see any point in wasting it on maintainance, hence the song. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Jim McLean Date: 04 Feb 13 - 04:51 AM I've written a few: Maggie's Waddin' The Royal Horses Prince Charles The English Royal Family The German Tour The Queen's Speech .... |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Allan Conn Date: 04 Feb 13 - 06:50 AM Mind don't mean to harp on but Cam Ye O'er Frae France isn't really an anti-monarchist song either. It is anti-Hanovarian. There is a difference between disliking who is on the throne to disliking the very idea of there being a throne! |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Nigel Parsons Date: 04 Feb 13 - 07:36 AM Of course, if you're truly after "Anti-monarchist" songs, maybe America (or, more recently, Australia) might prove more fertile soil. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Phil Edwards Date: 04 Feb 13 - 10:00 AM Just out of interest, are there any traditional anti-monarchist songs? Myriads, says Taconicus. Hundreds, says Steve. But all anyone has come up with is one (well-known) Jacobite song and one (obscure) anti-Jacobite one, neither of which is anti-monarchist at all. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,John Foxen Date: 04 Feb 13 - 11:32 AM Does this one count? The bastard king of England |
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Subject: Lyr Add: THE TREE OF LIBERTY (Robert Burns) From: GUEST,Allan Conn Date: 04 Feb 13 - 12:49 PM "The Tree of Liberty" attributed to Burns more than hints at an anti-monarchist view or at least attacks overt monarchial power even if it is specifically talking about France before saying the Tree doesn't exist between Tweed and Thames. Several verses are Heard ye o' the tree o' France, I watna what's the name o't; Around the tree the patriots dance, Weel Europe kens the fame o't. It stands where ance the Bastile stood, A prison built by kings, man, When Superstition's hellish brood Kept France in leading-strings, man. But vicious folk aye hate to see The works o' Virtue thrive, man; The courtly vermin's banned the tree, And grat to see it thrive, man; King Loui' thought to cut it down, When it was unco sma', man For this the watchman cracked his crown, There are also letters from Burns to a Mrs Dunlop, who he fell out with over the issue where he states that he can't sympathise with whining over the execution of certain personages! His views got him in enough bother without specifically attacking the British Crown which may well have seen him arrested. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Phil Edwards Date: 09 Feb 13 - 05:04 PM Any more traditional anti-monarchist songs? |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: freda underhill Date: 10 Feb 13 - 02:14 AM The Old Divide and Rule by Alistair Hulett - trad in style.. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Phil Edwards Date: 10 Feb 13 - 04:24 AM Any more anti-monarchist traditional songs? The first couple of replies suggested there were tons of them. |
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Subject: Lyr Add: QUEEN ELEANOR'S CONFESSION From: Jim Carroll Date: 10 Feb 13 - 04:52 AM "Any more traditional anti-monarchist songs?" Can't lay my hands on it at present, but I have a recording somewhere of MacColl singing the broadside "The Brass Warming Pan", which suggests that the powers-that-be of the time produced a male heir to the throne by slipping one into the queen's bed in the aforementioned vessel. Not necessarily traditional, and probably not singable, but some of the earliest songs on royalty are to be found in Thomas Wright's 'The Political Songs of England - from the reign of John to that of Edward II'. Most are in either Latin or early French, but they come with summaries in English, and all are well annotated. Also worth looking out is 'A Book of Scotish Pasquils (satirical pieces) 1868 (no named author, but it has been attributed to Maidment). Peggy Seeger used to sing a beautiful ballad called "Fair Rosamund" about the seduction of Henry II's mistress Rosamund, who was eventually poisoned Queen Eleanor. From memory: I have a sister, young Clifford, he says, A sister no-one knows.. She has a colour in her cheeks, Like drops of blood in snow, Like drops of blood in snow. She has a waist, a waist, a waist, Like to my silver cane, And I wouldn't for ten thousand pounds King Henry know her name King Henry know her name. The king being up in a bower so high, Hidden close and still, And every word young Clifford spoke, He wrote down in a bill He wrote down in a bill. ..... cant remember verse The first fair line that she looked on, It made her laugh and smile And the second line that she looked on The tears they did run down, The tears they did run down. Cursed be my brother Clifford, Cursed may he be, Why can't he dote on horse or hounds, That he must dote on me? That he must dote on me? My own personal favourite about the gettings-up-to of royalty. QUEEN ELEANOR'S CONFESSION.
Queen Eleanor's sick and she's very, very sick, |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Phil Edwards Date: 10 Feb 13 - 08:07 AM Two fine songs - thanks! I don't know the Brass Warming Pan, but the story is anti-Jacobite rather than anti-monarchist - "down with this King", not "down with kings". I may be wrong (actually I hope I am), but I get the impression there's not very much outright anti-monarchism in tradition. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: MGM·Lion Date: 11 Feb 13 - 06:22 AM Great lover of Queen Eleanor's Confession myself: it's on my You Tube channel. First learned it from Sandy Paton IIRC. Only really false note above is Vic Gammon's about Q Victoria "lying back and thinking of England". That might have been the advice given by their mothers to mid-C19 brides on their wedding eve according to certain dubious folklore, along with the injunction that "much as you may hate it, remember that it has happened to the dear Queen". But it is on trustworthy record, from her own diaries &c, that the Queen herself loved the sex-act and couldn't get enough of it ~~ old Albert was quite some stud from all accounts, and her protracted mourning was largely due to her deprivation & frustration. Whether any of the tales of her subsequently consoling herself with her trusted Highland ghillie John Brown have any basis in fact has of course long been much disputed. ~M~ |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: MGM·Lion Date: 13 Feb 13 - 06:26 AM "Any more anti-monarchist traditional songs? The first couple of replies suggested there were tons of them." ---- Yes ~ but, as has been pointed out, these were not actual anti-monarchist songs, but songs preferring one monarch to another: eg Jacobite, wishing Charles Edward Stuart was king instead of 'Geordie Whelps'; whereas a truly anti-monarchist song would surely be one objecting to any monarch at all, embracing a republican [or such system] pov -- a vital distinction the thread doesn't seem to have fully addressed. Any true traditional examples of this, anyone? ~M~ |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Jim McLean Date: 13 Feb 13 - 06:48 AM Not traditional, M, but one verse from my song about Prince Charles: Our king won't come from London Town Nor yet from Donegal, Nor will he come from Scotland, For we'll have no king at all. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,henryp Date: 13 Feb 13 - 07:10 AM The queen, apparently, has a Slough postcode. Robb Johnson also wrote; God save our gracious queen, long live our noble queen She lives in Slough It's by the motorway, just a stone's throw away From where the refugees all stay She lives in Slough She's just like you and me, with a posher lavatory She lives in Slough Tourists and tyrants know, it's handy for Heathrow She wears a hat and says "Hello" ("What do you do?") She lives in Slough And though she owns Balmoral, and her income's immoral, She lives in Slough And though there's a credit squeeze, and all our wages freeze Who get's another Jubilee? (Paid for you and me) She lives in Slough Alternatively; And though she owns Balmoral, and her income's immoral, She lives in Slough She probably likes the view, and a good sag aloo She probably votes Labour, too She lives in Slough! |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: MGM·Lion Date: 13 Feb 13 - 07:12 AM Ah, yes, indeed, Jim. And well in the Thurso Berwick tradition of "We'll mak oor land republican in a Scottish breakaway." There indeed is true anti-monarchism. But I suspect OP was seeking something rather older, don't you? ~M~ |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Young Buchan Date: 13 Feb 13 - 07:52 AM From my time at the back of school assemblies: All things bright and beautiful; All creatures great and small; All things wise and wonderful: Prince Philip shoots them all. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: MGM·Lion Date: 13 Feb 13 - 08:40 AM Drift ~~ but cannot resist mentioning here my own additional verse to that particularly fulsome hymn ~~ The malarial mosquito The bubonic-carrying rat He must have made the lot of them So what do you think of that! ~M~ |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Phil Edwards Date: 13 Feb 13 - 09:24 AM So basically we've got a) Traditional songs about actual (easily identifiable) kings and queens: not many of them, generally not anti-monarchist or scandalous (e.g. Queen Jane) b) Traditional songs about more or less mythical kings and queens: tons of them, not anti-monarchist but often scandalous (King X and Queen Y shagging around, having people killed on a whim etc) c) Traditional songs slagging off one king but saying that he should be replaced by another king: tons of them, sometimes scandalous, not anti-monarchist d) Modern songs slagging off the monarchy in general: anti-monarchist, scandalous as you like, not traditional. Quoting the OP: I am looking for British songs and tunes from all ages which reflect ant-monarchist sentiments. A: There aren't any from "all ages" - just from this age (more specifically, from the reign of the present queen). |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle Date: 13 Feb 13 - 12:19 PM Be fair Phil. I know real folksingers are always blethering on about the first world war, when they write 'in the tradition'. You can't really expect the rest of us to write songs based on the theme Queen Victoria was a shit even if she were - the people we sing to don't give a bugger. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Snuffy Date: 13 Feb 13 - 12:59 PM Phil doesn't want "QV was a shit" or "Hit the road, Liz" - he's actually complaining about being offered that stuff when what he's really he's looking for is "Off with his head", "Cromwell had the right idea", "I've got a guillotine for you, Louis", "The only good king is a dead one" or even just "All monarchs are bastards" Can't you come up with anything along those lines? |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Jim McLean Date: 13 Feb 13 - 01:21 PM Possibly anti-monarchist songs just weren't possible as the singers/writers would be executed or transported. I do know that a man named McLean (no relative unfortunately) tried to shoot Queen Victoria! |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: MGM·Lion Date: 13 Feb 13 - 01:28 PM Don't think so, Jim. Singing was generally permitted as a let-off-steam outlet to prevent worse in the way of dissent. But certainly "Here's a health unto His Majesty" and "Here's a health to the king and a lasting peace" appear widespread sentiments, rather than the opposite. Even the songs of the American wars of 1776 & 1812 appear to present the sentiment that "Monarchy doesn't suit us Americans" rather than any attacks on the institution of monarchy per se. Can anyone think of any American songs opposed to the actual institution of royalty or kingship in itself? You'd expect some, but no specific example comes to mind. ~M~ |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Jim McLean Date: 13 Feb 13 - 01:36 PM I know Robert Burns was warned he would lose his job as an Exiseman for supporting the French Revolution in verse and had to do a rapid about turn. I can understand sycophantic praise for the establishment would be allowed, nay, encouraged. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: MGM·Lion Date: 13 Feb 13 - 01:56 PM Threats of losing employment as an exciseman ~~ a public office ~~ is not quite the same as the executions or transportations which you suggested in your previous post would be visited on the singers of songs critical of the establishment. Do you know of any actual example of anyone suffering such a penalty for such an offence? Thought not. Any more than anyone can actually turn up the proceedings of an actual serviceman's ever having been court martialled for singing 'MacCafferty' ~~ a familiar example of such canards. ~M~ |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Phil Edwards Date: 13 Feb 13 - 02:55 PM The evidence here does seem to be in line with what Bellamy said about radical traditional songs generally - that for every traditional song saying "how oppressed we are as workers, let's overthrow the boss" there are ten saying "how happy we workers are and here's a health to the boss". Of course, the point isn't that the people writing and singing those songs were right to think that way - just that that is the way they thought. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Jim McLean Date: 13 Feb 13 - 02:56 PM He removed his spectacles with his left hand, and sighed with a slight roll of his eyes heavenward. His piece in the Times had been slightly contradicted by some buffoon. "Thought not," he said to himself. "They know not what they think". He reached for his brandy glass, set his spectacles on the Georgian side table and slipped his snuff box from his elaborately decorated waistcoat. "I wonder why I write for this rag ", he murmured . "The arrogant, ignorant replies are rather tedious". |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: Phil Edwards Date: 13 Feb 13 - 05:35 PM Très drôle, Jim. While we're here, does anyone know any traditional anti-monarchist songs? |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle Date: 14 Feb 13 - 04:36 AM I had thought we had furnished you with traditional and contemporary anti monarchist folksongs. Perhaps you could be more specific. I despise the monarchy and the class system it fronts, but I would not wish to shed the blood of the members of the royal family. I think my songs express that adequately. I think Cam Ye O'er from France, which I also posted was traditional and anti monarchist. I'm not really sure how we have failed to fulfil the brief. be more specific. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,Fred McCormick Date: 14 Feb 13 - 06:09 AM MtheGM. The idea that singing McAfferty was a chargeable offence in the army is probably the army equivalent of an urban myth. But anyone caught singing Kevin Barry, or any other republican song, in Ireland in the days before the Irish Free State treaty, would not have had many polite words to say about canards. |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: MartinRyan Date: 14 Feb 13 - 06:21 AM But anyone caught singing Kevin Barry, or any other republican song, in Ireland in the days before the Irish Free State treaty, would not have had many polite words to say about canards. Interesting thought. The song appears to have first seen the light of day in Scotland, IIRC. I wonder is there any evidence of when it was first heard in Ireland? Not much time between his execution and the Treaty. Regards |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: MartinRyan Date: 14 Feb 13 - 06:21 AM - and apologies for the thread creep! Regards |
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Subject: RE: Anti-Monarchist Folk Songs From: GUEST,Fred McCormick Date: 14 Feb 13 - 07:12 AM Martin, Well, I was generalising, but as far as I know, Kevin Barry was written in Ireland, immediately after his murder. I wonder if you are thinking about Johnny Thompson, the Scots footballer who was killed by a kick to the head in 1931. The song which was written about him was set to the tune of Kevin Barry. In any event, there is plenty of evidence to indicate that the Black and Tans would have dealt viciously with anyone caught singing anything they considered seditious. Note also their lethal proscripition on anyone they caught speaking Irish, and the ban on public assemblies which resulted in the Croke Park massacre. Note also the case of Alexander Somerville, a soldier in the Royal Scots Greys, who received 500 lashes with a cat of nine tails for an act which the authorities considered seditious. Small wonder you don't come across too many anti-monarchist songs. |
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