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BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful

GUEST,concerened 21 Mar 13 - 06:53 PM
GUEST,Backwoods man 21 Mar 13 - 04:27 PM
GUEST,Eliza 21 Mar 13 - 04:04 PM
GUEST,Backwoodsman 21 Mar 13 - 12:17 PM
GUEST,concerened 21 Mar 13 - 07:57 AM
SPB-Cooperator 21 Mar 13 - 07:35 AM
SPB-Cooperator 21 Mar 13 - 07:04 AM
GUEST,concerened 21 Mar 13 - 06:18 AM
GUEST,Manuel 20 Mar 13 - 09:27 AM
GUEST,concerened 20 Mar 13 - 08:19 AM
GUEST,concerened 19 Mar 13 - 07:11 PM
GUEST 19 Mar 13 - 06:57 PM
GUEST,concerened 19 Mar 13 - 03:22 PM
GUEST,Eliza 19 Mar 13 - 02:38 PM
GUEST,concerened 19 Mar 13 - 10:32 AM
Richard Bridge 18 Mar 13 - 08:39 AM
GUEST,concerened 18 Mar 13 - 07:44 AM
GUEST,concerened 17 Mar 13 - 08:54 AM
GUEST,Manuel 16 Mar 13 - 05:14 PM
GUEST 16 Mar 13 - 10:39 AM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 16 Mar 13 - 09:38 AM
GUEST,Manuel 15 Mar 13 - 02:34 PM
GUEST,Richard Bridge on the Laptop away 24 Feb 13 - 01:38 PM
SPB-Cooperator 24 Feb 13 - 12:18 PM
GUEST,JTT 24 Feb 13 - 05:45 AM
GUEST,Shimrod 24 Feb 13 - 04:51 AM
MGM·Lion 24 Feb 13 - 04:20 AM
GUEST,Don Wise 24 Feb 13 - 04:13 AM
DMcG 24 Feb 13 - 03:15 AM
MGM·Lion 24 Feb 13 - 02:18 AM
GUEST,Richard Bridge on the Laptop away 23 Feb 13 - 06:56 PM
GUEST,concerened 23 Feb 13 - 04:07 PM
GUEST,concerened 23 Feb 13 - 09:24 AM
GUEST,concerened 22 Feb 13 - 03:56 AM
MGM·Lion 21 Feb 13 - 02:03 PM
GUEST,concerened 21 Feb 13 - 01:50 PM
Megan L 21 Feb 13 - 01:45 PM
GUEST,concerned 21 Feb 13 - 01:22 PM
Megan L 21 Feb 13 - 12:39 PM
GUEST,concerned 21 Feb 13 - 12:34 PM
GUEST,concerened 21 Feb 13 - 08:02 AM
Richard Bridge 21 Feb 13 - 04:49 AM
GUEST,Musket sans cookie 21 Feb 13 - 02:27 AM
GUEST,okie from muskokee 20 Feb 13 - 06:20 AM
GUEST,concerened 19 Feb 13 - 07:46 AM
GUEST,concerned 19 Feb 13 - 07:41 AM
SPB-Cooperator 19 Feb 13 - 07:36 AM
MGM·Lion 19 Feb 13 - 07:10 AM
GUEST,concerned 19 Feb 13 - 06:45 AM
GUEST,Shimrod 18 Feb 13 - 06:32 PM

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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 06:53 PM

Thank you Eliza.Glad you are well.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Backwoods man
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 04:27 PM

Squabbling? Here? Surely not! :0)


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 04:04 PM

I do thank you, Guestconcerned, and Backwoodsman too for your very kind remarks. I missed Mudcat but I was staying in bed and couldn't sit up for long, so without a laptop I couldn't keep in touch. Although I've obviously never met any of the 'regulars' I seem to feel you are all friends, even when things have got a bit heated and vituperative. What with a new Pope, new Archbishop of Canterbury, the Budget and the ghastly weather, we should all have plenty to keep us squabbling for months to come.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Backwoodsman
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 12:17 PM

Welcome back Eliza, hope you're feeling better, and looking forward to reading more from you - the voice of reason and good manners.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 07:57 AM

Doent matter spbs cooperator.. at least you are showing a tither of sense in your post..looks like the list of right thinking people is growing in this thread.

Come on the rest of you..prove me wrong, you have all gone strangely quiet.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 07:35 AM

Oops I just commented on posting made last month!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 07:04 AM

Concerned,

don't forget worker co-operatives, credit unions, community land trusts, etc. before successive governments hijack the bottom up principles for their top-down ends.

Shimrod,

How many claimants are pushed into working in call centres? And is that why increasing numbers of call centres don't seem to care less?


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 06:18 AM

Thank'ee Manual.'tis a pity a few more on this site saw things like you.

Thank you also for responding in a gentlemanly way.

So unlike the rank outsiders like musket and his comrades.

Not forgetting the buffoon leveler.Mind, they do respond, albeit in a muddied thinking way, and not like Eliza who despie me welcoming her back has seen fit to ignore me.

Well, to say I am a tadge hurt would be understating the case.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Manuel
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 09:27 AM

Eliza, that 6.57 pm post yesterday was mine. I inadvertently left out my name. GUEST concerened, kind of you to give me the benefit of the doubt. I'm with you on the err and forgiveness bit.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 08:19 AM

come on you lo!!t were is all your lightning half baked ripostes gone?

has the water got a little to deep for you?


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 19 Mar 13 - 07:11 PM

Well really !Guest"!!!! Knowing how the semi liberal psuedos on here usually slag me off,I dont know whether to take that as a compliment or what.

But Hey!!!! I'm human, I'm good.. lets give you the benefit of the doubt.

To err is but human.... to forgive... .divine.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Mar 13 - 06:57 PM

I was inclined personally to welcome you back but, following the immediately preceding post, anything that I can say in that regard is doomed to be anti-climactic. Do stay well, now!


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 19 Mar 13 - 03:22 PM

Wecome back Eliza!! dont say nothing to contentious though, some quare coves on this 'ere site.

Not all free thinkers like you and I!!

Beware the pale pink thought police!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 19 Mar 13 - 02:38 PM

Hello There Everybody! Thank you for your very kind thoughts about my absence from Mudcat. It wasn't at all due to the comments or the 'bit of a pasting' I got on this thread. I'm quite a tough old thing and wouldn't be upset by some words on a screen. I had a gastroscopy which was a bit traumatising to say the least, and have been a bit 'under the weather' for a week or two. I'm feeling quite a bit better now. If only I'd had a 'laptop' I could have sat up in bed to keep posting, but now I can sit at the computer in the study again. Was very touched by your kindness, Manuel and Don. Looking forward to having my say on the various threads again!


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 19 Mar 13 - 10:32 AM

Well, that is way things are Richard,it is a pretty silly old world we have here.

From your posts you and Shimrod are a coupla of the few Muddys that dont have muddied thinking and are any way near on the right track,

I still live in hope that some of these liberal buffoons with there wishy washy dangerouse thinking, get a grip and do something about the evil shit that is out there.I have no use for any of them, class traitors to a man.

The fact is that capitalism and labour(that is I mean organised labour, not the pink limp pricks of the so called oposition..Tee Fuckin' Hee!!)

have absolutly nothing in common, never had, never will.

AGITATE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


ORGANISE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

EDUCATE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nothing will change unless we do.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 18 Mar 13 - 08:39 AM

Yes concerened, but while you may be a bit silly at times at least you don't think pink and fluffy.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 18 Mar 13 - 07:44 AM

All took your bats home, have you?


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 17 Mar 13 - 08:54 AM

Well Don, the smug thought police have given me a pretty hard time for voicing my thoughts and I aint gone away.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Manuel
Date: 16 Mar 13 - 05:14 PM

Don, that last posting was done by me, of course.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Mar 13 - 10:39 AM

Don, many thanks for the endorsement.Hopefully, it has been seen by Eliza, and, of course, by her numerous other friends.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 16 Mar 13 - 09:38 AM

I second that!

Eliza was given a pretty hard time by one poster recently. I sincerely hope that hasn't put her off.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Manuel
Date: 15 Mar 13 - 02:34 PM

I have not, to my regret, seen a posting by Eliza since her last one to this thread just over a full month ago. I feel sure that I am not the only frequent visitor to this site who misses her always-wise and often-entertaining contributions to Mudcat discussions. Eliza, is it too much to hope that you will soon be back in our noticeably impoverished company?


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Richard Bridge on the Laptop away
Date: 24 Feb 13 - 01:38 PM

The purpose of the workfare programme is not to put people into work. The number of proper jobs into which is has got claimaants is under 2.5% of the climants forced onto the programme. It is to deny people benefits.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 24 Feb 13 - 12:18 PM

One of the conditions of voluntary work is that volunteers, if they are claiming out of work benefits, have to make themselves available for work. It is probably the view of jobcentre plus that if someone wants to get a career as a museum curator, shelf stacking in Poundland is the most appropriate work experience available. Conversely, surely if a museum was interviewing for a paid job, equal opportunities would have to dictate that if someone with years of relevant voluntary work, and someone who has spent a month shelf stacking both apply, the shelf stacker must by law be offered the post as this has been deemed the most relevant experience.

Following logic through sound absurd doesn't it!


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 24 Feb 13 - 05:45 AM

Whew, this thread turned nasty!

It's a great example of two things:

1) Turning people against each other with nasty tropes about people 'exploiting' welfare and 'immigrants taking our jobs' is a successful strategy in stopping people from looking at the inequality;

2) (Despite my lazy Guest-nickname), perhaps it's time for Mudcat to stop people being able to post as GUEST, so that people have to stand over their real identities and opinions.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 24 Feb 13 - 04:51 AM

"Anyone know why they insisted on this change?"

Perhaps the Managing Director of Poundland wears an old school tie, is a member of the right club and contributes to Tory Party coffers - and, hence, becomes eligible for a bit of slave labour?


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 24 Feb 13 - 04:20 AM

I have never quite seen in any case why it was necessary, in the case which gave rise to this controversy and hence this thread, to take the young woman concerned from the voluntary job she was already doing in a museum and forcing her to work in Poundland, instead of just letting her get on with the perfectly respectable and socially useful unpaid job she was voluntarily doing already. Anyone know why they insisted on this change?

~M~


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Don Wise
Date: 24 Feb 13 - 04:13 AM

Leaving the inevitable slanging match to one side one should bear in mind that putting people into jobs is nowadays often outsourced to private companies, the predictable thinking being that they can do 'better' than the job centres. Inevitably all this is tied up with targets to be met......What seems to be happening is that these private companies push people into places like Poundland irrespective of payment, conditions, qualifications, suitability etc. etc. The important thing being that they've met their target and can therefore happily bank a LOT OF MONEY from HMG - and we're talking millions here.
As a once young singer-songwriter once put it (albeit in a different context)- "They're only pawns in a game".


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: DMcG
Date: 24 Feb 13 - 03:15 AM

A serious question, concerned. You wrote:
"It is about time some of you pathetic beige asshole woke up and took to the streets."
Do you genuinely believe your posts on this thread are the best way of persuading us to do that?


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 24 Feb 13 - 02:18 AM

talk to the hand MtheGM, the ears aint listening if that is the best you can do
.,,.
Not the best I can do by any means, Concernedy·Bum, but just about what the fatuity I was responding to was worth. Why would I waste the best I can do on one of your exiguous intellect.

☺〠☺~M~☺〠☺


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Richard Bridge on the Laptop away
Date: 23 Feb 13 - 06:56 PM

A bit late noticing that, eh?


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 23 Feb 13 - 04:07 PM

*when will they ever learn?"


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 23 Feb 13 - 09:24 AM

I see the condems are now undermining the health service.Not privatising as such but not far of.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 22 Feb 13 - 03:56 AM

Yawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwn!talk to the hand MtheGM, the ears aint listening if that is the best you can do.

As I said before go and preach to that other no mark leveller.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 21 Feb 13 - 02:03 PM

"But I thought no, I thought I may get some kind of an intellectual debate going on this site.. but no here we go again. let down by you wet farts again".

.,,.


Much entertained, Mr Concerned, by your concept of what passes for 'intellectual debate'!

~M~


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 21 Feb 13 - 01:50 PM

oooooooooooooooooooer!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: Megan L
Date: 21 Feb 13 - 01:45 PM

Son i grew up in a family fighting against the Glasgow gangs a wee nyaf like you wid feel the wrang end o ma walkin stick. And for your information ya silly wee laddie I am at the moment fighting to retain my invalidity waiting to go to tribuneral so don't gie me yer patronising claptrap.

You want to give me a piece of your mind don't bother its clear you need the little bit you have you want a fight come here and do it face to face not hide behind the internet like a bairn.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerned
Date: 21 Feb 13 - 01:22 PM

Your easily put off arent you Megan pet?

If you dont like it go away and start you own thread.

Mebbe something like." I like knitting egg cosies" or " should I go all the way on the first date?"

This is the real world love, get with it.Or dont worry your pretty little(or otherwise)head about mens matters.

Or meebe get back to Womens Own, or more like Bunty for you.

All that comments like yours do is justify my opinion of you


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: Megan L
Date: 21 Feb 13 - 12:39 PM

Another thread ruined


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerned
Date: 21 Feb 13 - 12:34 PM

Hang on a bit though, musket,

"It's easy to be cynical when the democratic majority don't share your vision".

Whats that about then?.It has never been easy to be cynicsl when the so called majority dont share your vision. Im wish I had a pound for every punch up I have had with so called martyred proleteriat, with their muddied minds and half formed political views. In fairness the views that the gutter media has drip fed them.

But I thought no, I thought I may get some kind of an intellectual debate going on this site.. but no here we go again. let down by you wet farts again.

I fucked up, I let me guard down.Here you come again, with half baked clever soundin sound bites that you read in the daily mail or the express..or meebe the guardian

I can see you all now down at the pub, pewter tankard in hand, sweater knotted casually round your shoulders going" oh, of course I am liberal with a small l" tossers and cake eaters to a man.

Better red that goddamn dead you prancing parasites.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 21 Feb 13 - 08:02 AM

thankee Comrades..


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 21 Feb 13 - 04:49 AM

Oh, I thought you were the posturing clown he was criticising, Mither.
I largely agree with Mr concerned.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Musket sans cookie
Date: 21 Feb 13 - 02:27 AM

He's too much for me. Mind you, he seems to have Bridge weighed up. Nice seeing someone more rabid Trotskyist than M'Learned Friend.

History shows us though that come the glorious revolution the likes of "concerned" are usually first up against the wall. Nobody is a prophet in their own land. It's easy to be cynical when the democratic majority don't share your vision.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,okie from muskokee
Date: 20 Feb 13 - 06:20 AM

c'mon you'all..keep it going, were are you all with your smart answers?Or is he to much for you?


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerened
Date: 19 Feb 13 - 07:46 AM

Good man Comrade cooperator.

Some one at last with a more than modicum of sense


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerned
Date: 19 Feb 13 - 07:41 AM

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.Thanks your comments M.

However, some times it is only the use of approbrious ephithets that can make people aware of the extent of your anger.

I make no excuse for this.One of the most articulate men I know is Billy Connolly and he swears a bit and for the same reasons that I do.

If you want to make this a general sermon, address your remarks to the rank outsider leveller as well, I have had my ration of patronising today.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 19 Feb 13 - 07:36 AM

FYI I have read Ragged Trousers Philanthropist three times, and given two copies away.

I am actively involved in the coop movement, and employed by a worker cooperative.

I see societies I grew up in, and social values I've lived with being torn apart and it gets me right in the stomach.

Wherever possible I advocate for a more cooperative society which RTP talks about and recognises flaws in both capitalism and municipalism, and calls for common ownership from the bottom-up.

I am worried when tories start trying to own the cooperative agenda with no commitment to the values and principles it stands for.

And know I am not a champagne socialist - life is a struggle for me, but I don't moan about my personal lot, but injustices do make me angry.

I do see that capitalism is unsustainable, but so is a municipal top-down approach to social justice. So what is likely to happen because of this? A number of scenarios:

(1) Those with wealth lording over a dispossessed underclass - whether they live or die being of no concern to them.

(2) Societies ruled by international corporations.

(3) A complete breakdown of the social fabric where the man with the biggest gun rules

(4) Societies take responsibility for their own well being and cooperate with each other - derailing the gravy trains but aiming for the common greater good.


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 19 Feb 13 - 07:10 AM

One can be 'concerned' without being vulgar. Never mind your spelling; but do you really not appreciate the extent to which your modes of expression

VOMIT!!! ...when you aint got your head stuck up your arses? ...these pricks ...get your minds out of neutral and your thumbs out of yer bums?...

are liable to have a counter-productive effect on the force of your arguments? You may recall that no such locutions occur anywhere in the book you recommend, The Ragged Trousered Philanthropists, which manages to make it points all the more cogently thereby. We all realise how strongly you feel on these topics. Seems a pity to spoil a good case with such foolish and otiose intemperance.

~M~


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,concerned
Date: 19 Feb 13 - 06:45 AM

"It is less against them than the other main parties. IT is the least bad option."?

that is exactly the wishy washy, unjoined up thinking that let Hitler come to power.................God, you people really make me want to VOMIT!!!

Was you not born with a brain, dont you read books, or do you wander around blowing bubbles when you aint got your head stuck up your arses?

What really upsets me is that these pricks have got the vote!!! the vote that working folk struggled for years to get.

When are you lot are going to wake up and reallise that this so called Government are the worst we have ever had, with the weakest opposition in the History of the world..

Have none of you read the Ragged Trousered Philanthropists? Read it you intellectual poseurs, it may give some of you some sadly needed ideas of what is wrong.   Then come back and tell me things have changed since that was written.

I will give you an idea what is wrong while you are all goiNg DOHHHHHHHHHHHHH and trying to get your minds out of neutral and your thumbs out of yer bums?

IT IS SIMPLE, THE GODDAMN CAPITALIST SYSTEM..GETTIT?.


And before that smug clown leveller comes back at me..no apologies for the spelling..


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Subject: RE: BS: Compulsory Unpaid Work Found Unlawful
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 18 Feb 13 - 06:32 PM

Hhhhmmm! Yes, do I want to die from TB or smallpox?


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