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BS: Obamacare = Genocide

Songwronger 20 Mar 13 - 10:43 PM
Don Firth 20 Mar 13 - 10:54 PM
Don Firth 20 Mar 13 - 11:05 PM
Songwronger 20 Mar 13 - 11:13 PM
Rapparee 20 Mar 13 - 11:15 PM
frogprince 20 Mar 13 - 11:16 PM
Songwronger 20 Mar 13 - 11:20 PM
Rapparee 20 Mar 13 - 11:22 PM
frogprince 20 Mar 13 - 11:27 PM
Jack the Sailor 20 Mar 13 - 11:40 PM
Songwronger 21 Mar 13 - 12:33 AM
Songwronger 21 Mar 13 - 12:35 AM
Little Hawk 21 Mar 13 - 12:39 AM
Don Firth 21 Mar 13 - 12:44 AM
Little Hawk 21 Mar 13 - 12:49 AM
Songwronger 21 Mar 13 - 12:53 AM
Songwronger 21 Mar 13 - 12:57 AM
GUEST,Niggardly Bastard 21 Mar 13 - 01:33 AM
Ebbie 21 Mar 13 - 02:45 AM
Richard Bridge 21 Mar 13 - 05:06 AM
Stu 21 Mar 13 - 06:07 AM
Richard Bridge 21 Mar 13 - 06:14 AM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 21 Mar 13 - 06:18 AM
Charmion 21 Mar 13 - 09:35 AM
Jack the Sailor 21 Mar 13 - 01:16 PM
Stringsinger 21 Mar 13 - 01:28 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 21 Mar 13 - 02:07 PM
Little Hawk 21 Mar 13 - 02:32 PM
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Jack the Sailor 21 Mar 13 - 03:24 PM
Sandy Mc Lean 21 Mar 13 - 03:41 PM
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Q (Frank Staplin) 21 Mar 13 - 06:53 PM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 22 Mar 13 - 06:52 AM
GUEST,Niggardly Bastard 22 Mar 13 - 08:17 AM
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GUEST,JTT 22 Mar 13 - 09:27 AM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 22 Mar 13 - 11:01 AM
Stu 22 Mar 13 - 12:57 PM
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Bobert 27 Mar 13 - 12:29 PM
beardedbruce 27 Mar 13 - 12:37 PM
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beardedbruce 27 Mar 13 - 01:43 PM
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Bobert 27 Mar 13 - 07:07 PM
Jack the Sailor 27 Mar 13 - 07:11 PM
GUEST,Niggardly Bastard 27 Mar 13 - 09:40 PM
Don Firth 27 Mar 13 - 10:00 PM
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GUEST,Larry Saidman 27 Mar 13 - 11:02 PM
Don Firth 27 Mar 13 - 11:52 PM
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Songwronger 28 Mar 13 - 12:47 AM
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Ebbie 28 Mar 13 - 02:06 AM
Jack the Sailor 28 Mar 13 - 03:09 AM
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Jack the Sailor 28 Mar 13 - 05:52 AM
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Don(Wyziwyg)T 28 Mar 13 - 07:35 AM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 28 Mar 13 - 07:37 AM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 28 Mar 13 - 07:56 AM
beardedbruce 28 Mar 13 - 08:05 AM
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beardedbruce 28 Mar 13 - 09:37 AM
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GUEST 28 Mar 13 - 12:14 PM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 28 Mar 13 - 02:54 PM
Bobert 28 Mar 13 - 04:34 PM
GUEST 28 Mar 13 - 05:19 PM
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Jack the Sailor 28 Mar 13 - 06:51 PM
Bobert 28 Mar 13 - 06:53 PM
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ollaimh 28 Mar 13 - 08:06 PM
Songwronger 28 Mar 13 - 08:13 PM
Don Firth 28 Mar 13 - 08:21 PM
GUEST 28 Mar 13 - 08:22 PM
Bobert 28 Mar 13 - 08:34 PM
Don Firth 28 Mar 13 - 08:48 PM
GUEST 28 Mar 13 - 10:17 PM
GUEST,TIA 28 Mar 13 - 10:25 PM
GUEST 28 Mar 13 - 10:51 PM
GUEST,TIA 28 Mar 13 - 11:02 PM
Songwronger 28 Mar 13 - 11:06 PM
GUEST 28 Mar 13 - 11:19 PM
Jack the Sailor 28 Mar 13 - 11:51 PM
Jack the Sailor 28 Mar 13 - 11:52 PM
Jack the Sailor 28 Mar 13 - 11:57 PM
GUEST,TIA 29 Mar 13 - 01:13 AM
GUEST,TIA 29 Mar 13 - 01:18 AM
Bobert 29 Mar 13 - 09:10 AM
Greg F. 29 Mar 13 - 09:50 AM
GUEST,Niggardly Bastard 29 Mar 13 - 03:49 PM
Jack the Sailor 29 Mar 13 - 04:54 PM
Don Firth 29 Mar 13 - 06:13 PM
Songwronger 29 Mar 13 - 09:32 PM
Ebbie 29 Mar 13 - 09:34 PM
Don Firth 29 Mar 13 - 09:50 PM
Jack the Sailor 29 Mar 13 - 09:52 PM
GUEST,Niggardly Bastard 30 Mar 13 - 03:03 AM
Jack the Sailor 30 Mar 13 - 01:29 PM
Don Firth 30 Mar 13 - 01:54 PM
Greg F. 30 Mar 13 - 05:23 PM
cujimmy 30 Mar 13 - 06:07 PM
Don Firth 30 Mar 13 - 06:34 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 31 Mar 13 - 01:29 PM
GUEST,Niggardly Bastard 31 Mar 13 - 01:46 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 31 Mar 13 - 01:48 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 31 Mar 13 - 01:49 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 31 Mar 13 - 03:56 PM
Joe Offer 31 Mar 13 - 04:58 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 31 Mar 13 - 05:59 PM
Ebbie 31 Mar 13 - 06:48 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 31 Mar 13 - 08:30 PM
Ebbie 01 Apr 13 - 01:43 AM
Jack the Sailor 01 Apr 13 - 02:03 AM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 01 Apr 13 - 01:28 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 01 Apr 13 - 01:48 PM
Songwronger 06 Jun 13 - 07:05 PM
Songwronger 10 Sep 13 - 11:59 PM
Songwronger 07 Oct 13 - 06:41 PM
Bobert 07 Oct 13 - 07:11 PM
Songwronger 07 Oct 13 - 08:02 PM
Don Firth 07 Oct 13 - 08:26 PM
Bobert 07 Oct 13 - 08:29 PM
Songwronger 07 Oct 13 - 10:38 PM
Don Firth 07 Oct 13 - 11:22 PM
Andrez 07 Oct 13 - 11:46 PM
GUEST 08 Oct 13 - 07:59 PM

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Subject: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 10:43 PM

The U.N.'s Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide went into effect on Jan 12, 1951. The United States signed onto it.

Article 2 of the Convention says that "imposing measures to prevent births within the (national) group" is genocide.

Genocide Convention - Wikipedia

Obamacare attempts to impose measures to prevent births within America by providing contraceptives and abortions.

Hence, Obamacare is genocide.

This is not to say that Obama is the only participant in this act. Obamacare may bear his name, but it is a bi-partisan action. And it was ruled "legal" when a "Bush-appointed conservative" supreme court judge cast the deciding vote in favor.

So, this is both benches of the same team (Democrats and Republicans) jumping into the game to commit genocide.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 10:54 PM

Songwronger, you've exceeded yourself for sheer, blatant, nincompoopery.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 11:05 PM

Providing contraception to those who want it and abortion on demand is advocating genecide!??

Lots of married couples practice birth control. In your estimation, they are all murderers??

UNREAL!!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 11:13 PM

I didn't say anything about murder. Whether contraception and abortion are murder is a different discussion.

My simple point is, the Convention indicates that "imposing measures to prevent births within the (national) group" is classified as genocide. Obamacare imposes measures to prevent births within America. It follows that it is genocide, accordint to the U.N. Convention.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 11:15 PM

Every wet dream wastes millions of sperm. Every menstruation wastes ova.

Jail 'em all!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: frogprince
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 11:16 PM

Oh, and that's by no means all of the picture. If Obama has his way, same-sex marriage will be legalized. Then most Americans will stop having sex with the opposite gender, and there will hardly be any births at all!!!!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 11:20 PM

Well, most people think of genocide as slaughter. The Convention surprised me with the broadness of its definition. Preventing births within a group is genocide. Birth control and abortions prevent births, so technically those are genocidal techniques.

And the U.S. is a signatory to the convention, so it seems that our leaders could be tried for genocide.

Interesting.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 11:22 PM

"Imposing" means being forced to do something; it is not a matter of choice.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: frogprince
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 11:27 PM

Wrongsonger, if you are actually so eff'n stupid that you have no idea of the difference between "allow" and "impose"...
Or if you are so eff'n stupid that you think for a moment that anyone else here is so eff'n stupid as to believe a word of your crap...


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 20 Mar 13 - 11:40 PM

im·pose (m-pz)
v. im·posed, im·pos·ing, im·pos·es
v.tr.
1. To establish or apply as compulsory; levy: impose a tax.
2. To apply or make prevail by or as if by authority: impose a peace settlement. See Synonyms at dictate.
3. To obtrude or force (oneself, for example) on another or others.
4. Printing To arrange (type or plates) on an imposing stone.
5. To offer or circulate fraudulently; pass off: imposed a fraud on consumers.
v.intr.
To take unfair advantage: You are always imposing on their generosity.

Read the fucking dictionary you alarmist ignorant tit. At least read the definitions of the words you intent to use.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 12:33 AM

Obamacare proposes to use tax money to provide contraception and abortions. That is "imposing measures to prevent births within the (national) group." Taxpayers are imposed upon, forced to partipate in a process which reduces the birth rate. Genocide.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 12:35 AM

You guys aren't very bright, are you?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Little Hawk
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 12:39 AM

Aww, heck, this is nothing, man. If you knew what Chongo has planned for when HE gets elected president, your hair would turn white overnight and your testicles would shrivel up, drop off, and fall on the floor like a couple of dessicated little raisins!

Count your blessings, I say. ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 12:44 AM

Songwronger, you have to twist like a pretzel to come to the conclusions you come to.

Not very bright? Bright enough to know that there is a difference between "providing" and "imposing."

Get a grip, man!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Little Hawk
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 12:49 AM

He's drawn forth the usual set of emergency responders, hasn't he, Don? I imagine he feels quite satisfied with the result.

No...wait...Bobert still hasn't shown up.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 12:53 AM

Obamacare imposes a tax in order to reduce the birth rate. Genocide, according to the U.N.

There, that's as simple as I can state it. If I had crayons maybe I could draw pictures that would get through.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 12:57 AM

Yeah, there does seem to be an ObamaTrauma team here. But as I stated earlier, this is a bi-partisan thing. The Repubs are just as guilty as the Dems.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 01:33 AM

I approve Songwronger's message.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Ebbie
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 02:45 AM

I get it: Songwronger's tactic is to state a proposition and then to take one side of it; he doesn't necessarily believe a word of it, he thinks of it as a debate. I think he is trying to get on the High School Sophomore debating team. I doubt that he'll make it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 05:06 AM

I have won trophies for debating, in the past. I find it usually helps to understand what words mean, which Dongplonker plainly does not.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Stu
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 06:07 AM

Wow. The country that wants to put guns in the hands of it's teachers deny free healthcare to those most in need, and attempt to stifle any move towards helping others.

I love the US deeply, but I really hope any visiting aliens do not land there and get the impression that we're all quite so lacking in compassion and common sense as a society.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 06:14 AM

I can't figure out why anyone should love the US.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 06:18 AM

""My simple point is, the Convention indicates that "imposing measures to prevent births within the (national) group"!""

You really couldn't pass the entry test for imbecile, could you.

Offering people the choice to use, or not use, contraception and termination is not imposing anything on anybody.

Come back and tell us about genocide when you see troops holding guns to peoples heads and forcing them to use contraceptives, or a new law being enacted to make contraceptive use compulsory.

That's what constitutes imposing measures to prevent birth, and nobody is doing that, especially not Obama.

Ask your shrink to increase the meds man.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Charmion
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 09:35 AM

As a woman, I interpret the provision of contraception and abortion services by government-funded agencies as a measure to increase citizens' ability to build their families to the size of their choice, at the speed that is best for them.

One could say that the Highway Traffic Act is a measure to forbid pedestrians and cyclists to use high-speed controlled-access highways, but that would be to mistake an isolated effect of the law for its intended purpose -- never a good idea.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 01:16 PM

"Wow. The country that wants to put guns in the hands of it's teachers deny free healthcare to those most in need, and attempt to stifle any move towards helping others."

You are as ignorant as the original poster if you think "The Country" wants that. If "The Country" wants those things why is there debate about those things. Why are they elections over them?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Stringsinger
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 01:28 PM

Songwronger, you have misinterpreted "(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;" as having to do with contraception and termination of pregnancy as applied to sperm insemination or latent fetuses. The argument still remains as to what constitutes a "birth". Conception is not the beginning of life as propaganda by anti-Choice people suggest.

What is meant by imposing measures has to do with governmental policies such as practiced in China to not allow certain births to take place and specifically to not allow a woman the right to choose whether to give birth or not.

If it weren't for Obamacare, I might not be here today as it helped me finance a triple bypass operation.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 02:07 PM

By all means, reduce the birth rate by all means possible. Too damn many humans for the earth's capabilities.
If that is genocide, so be it!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Little Hawk
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 02:32 PM

It isn't "the country" that wants whatever our various governments do. The people are the country. It's a little oligarchy of very rich and powerful individuals (mostly men in suits), less than 1% of the population who want what our governments do. It profits them.

The people can't do bloody much about it, because that same little crowd of rich guys owns the major political parties and determines national policy no matter which party gets elected.

They quibble over various details, yes. But they agree on the fundamental basics of war and finance.

You get to choose version A, B, or C of their program when you go to the polls to vote (but in the USA...only A & B). Those versions all sound a bit different, but the differences are strictly cosmetic. That's why Obama sounds liberal...he looks liberal...you'd swear he WAS liberal!...but he conducts strongly conservative fiscal and foreign policy. The Republicans look conservative (and how!)...they sound conservative (if not downright fascist)...when elected they conduct strongly conservative policy.

Heads, the rich win. Tails, the rest of us lose. That's the political game in the early 21st century. The parties exist just to baffle you, keep you divided, and keep you thinking you still have a viable choice when you go to vote.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 03:18 PM

There are thousand of people, not in the oligarchy who fight for such things LH. 20-25% of the country maybe. But not the whole country.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 03:24 PM

thousands


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Sandy Mc Lean
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 03:41 PM

Trolls must be fed! If not and the trolls starve would that not also be genocide?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 06:40 PM

I've seen no argument to refute the fact that Obamacare = genocide.

The imposition of taxes to fund abortions and contraception fits the definition of genocide (see my previous posts).

And I am not in favor of Obamacare. I am in favor of expanding Medicaire to cover all Americans. Obamacare is a big money conduit to private insurance companies. And Obamacare is genocide, according to the U.N.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 21 Mar 13 - 06:53 PM

Sterlization. The answer.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 06:52 AM

""Sterlization. The answer.""

Too late! The OP is already in the gene pool.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 08:17 AM

I think Obamacare is a Republican shit sandwich that we're all going to be force fed.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Stu
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 08:29 AM

"I can't figure out why anyone should love the US"

Because it's a wonderful, diverse country, full of polite, curious, intelligent people that are resourceful and have a refreshingly positive attitude. I can't get on board with the whole gun thing and the fact that there is no safety net to catch people who need help, but there you are. I can't get on board with having a royal family so there you go.

Also, the US has the most incredible palaeontological resources and the people that work on them are fantastic workers and generous with their time and knowledge.

"You are as ignorant as the original poster if you think "The Country" wants that. If "The Country" wants those things why is there debate about those things. Why are they elections over them?

Wow. Are your piles playing up again and making you grouchy? You know full well what I meant.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 09:27 AM

Songwronger, if contraceptives were in the water, if abortion were forced on people who had children, then it would be genocide.
Offering it as a choice to people is not genocide.
Several other posters: calling someone 'stupid' etc for having a different opinion than yours isn't necessarily the best form of conversation.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 11:01 AM

""Several other posters: calling someone 'stupid' etc for having a different opinion than yours isn't necessarily the best form of conversation.""

So, what would you have us call somebody who exhibits stupidity on a regular and consistent basis, and hasn't yet managed to make a single post with any intelligence behind it?

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Stu
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 12:57 PM

Ah, the joys of Mudcat shit-slinging.

People trying to have a conversation only to be derailed by the usual suspects, who appear incapable of accepting any opinions other than their own which are, of course, very highly-regarded (by themselves), erudite and diamond-like in because of their clear, flawless logic.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 01:08 PM

I approve Sugarfoot Jack's message.
Don't namecall.
It makes you look even worse than you really are.
It's a substitute for violence, you know.
A poor one.
Be civil.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 02:41 PM

You ain't seen nothin' yet! Just wait for....ChongoCare.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 02:56 PM

Yes, Jack, there are many people, unfortunately duped by the media and partyline propaganda who DO support oppressive policies that fleece them and reward the governing elite. They simply aren't aware of how they're being fleeced. They're not a majority of "the country", but I'll readily agree that they represent maybe 20-25% of it. The sad thing is that they are unwittingly supporting the very forces who profit by their enslavement. This happens in most other places too. It's an old story.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Stu
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 03:18 PM

LH - but there is a general drift, driven by whomever, towards the mass arming of citizens and there is a fundamental distrust of any government policy that seeks to use taxpayer's money for social projects such as free healthcare. It feels as if the momentum is with the free marketeers and pro-gun lobby and it seems as if reason is fast disappearing into the ether, driven away by the sort of mean-spirited right-wingers who seed fear amongst the population in the most disgusting manner; it's why Gitmo is still open. My US friends are virtually all pro-Obama and the ones who are medical doctors crave an NHS-style health service that would improve the lives of countless Americans.

This isn't a US issue either. Here in the UK the drift to the right and the idealogical battle being waged against the welfare state, the demonisation of the poor and disabled and the marginalisation of any voice not pro-austerity continues apace. In fact, the "country" is throughly miserable at the moment (apart from the toffs and millionaires) as even entrepreneurs are struggling to prise money from the banks to run their businesses. Recessions can offer opportunities for the bold but even this most sacred of right-wing ideals has gone to the wall in the rush to destroy the welfare state and take us back to the misery of the pre-war public health system, which was basically if you can't pay you're fucked.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,jeff
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 03:51 PM

Please, Stringsinger enlighten us as to when 'life' actually begins? Conception? 2 weeks? 3 months? 6 months? 9 months? Birth? After being weaned? 3 years after birth? 5 years? 10 years?

You seem to have an inside track on this. Pray, tell us.

Btw, Obamacare as scarey as it is in nowhere NEAR as scarey as Paul Ryan's ideas. He's an unapolgetic ageist and open proponent of euthanasia.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 06:15 PM

Dead right, Sugarfoot Jack. It's been happening in Canada too...although to a lesser extent. The basic deal is that the richest bastards in the land are padding their own pockets at every else's expense. They get richer. We get poorer.

****

jeff - No one knows for sure when life actually begins...but people have a million different opinions about it. Just ask them. Their opinions are crafted to suit their political stand, generally speaking.

****

Obamacare was a lacklustre betrayal of the liberal hopes of millions of people who voted for him, because it's mostly a big cash windfall for the privately owned health insurance industry. That's NOT what the people who voted for Obama had in mind when they elected him! What the Obama administration really is, is: Republican Lite.

No surprise there. That's what Clinton was too. It tells me that the Oligarchy runs both those parties like puppets on strings and always gets what it wants, no matter which one gets elected. If Obama had any intention of really challenging them, he'd very soon be a dead man, in my opinion.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 06:37 PM

Hear! Hear!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 09:12 PM

The points I'm trying to address here are:
1) The UN has a very precise definition of genocide, and
2) Obamacare = genocide according to that definition.

The UN convention on genocide defines it as, among other things, "imposing measures to prevent births within the (national) group."

Well, I'm being taxed (by Obamacare) in order to provide abortions and contraceptives. A tax is an imposed measure, and the Obamacare tax is being used to prevent births within America. That is genocide, technically speaking.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 10:13 PM

Why, yes...

We should go back to a time when white women of means took those little (wink, wink) vacations south of the border poor people (disproportionately black) died in back room makeshift clinics (if you could even call them that) by people who had little or no medical training...

I'm sure that the wrong-man doesn't recall those days or why Roe V. Wade came about... It was about civil rights and fairness...

I guess that wrongman would be happy having predominantly black women dieing like back then... Thousands every year...

Seems to me that what we had back then was genocide because it targeted black women...

No???

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 10:54 PM

Well, Songwronger, it appears to me that the U.N. didn't think carefully enough about the wording in their definition of genocide. They forgot to word it so as to permit birth control in a nation in connection with what occurs in a tax-related program.

Does this matter?

Why don't you write the people at the U.N. and advise them to get the specific wording changed so that Mr Obama won't be technically violating the complex terms they have set out (by strict legal interpretation of the wording). They probably didn't think of an ordinary tax situation when they were talking about "imposed measure". All taxes, after all, are imposed by the government which passes them, but I doubt that the U.N. had that in mind in regards to a ruling on genocide! ;-) I mean, get serious...!

My real question is...well, no, I have 2 real questions. ;-D

1. Why do you care about this in the first place? It's trivial.

2. And...why are all the furious posters here bothering to react in such an apoplectic manner to what you've said about it?

Because...this is something that doesn't matter. Why should anyone care? It's nitpicking about legal language, not a real problem of any kind.

There are definitely things to object to concerning Obamacare, serious things, but this thing you've brought up is utterly trivial and irrelevant.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 11:08 PM

Wrongman has such a hatred of Obama that there is nothing that Obama could do that wrongman would twist and spin into...

...evilness...

For folks who ain't caught up in Obama hate it sho nuff looks like it this hate is racially motivated...

But when anyone brings up the racial motive the racists scream back, "racist" at the accusers... They want it both ways... They want a free reign to peddle their hate but when called they say the the callers are the real haters, which is a sick and border line mentally ill joke...

What if we had just allowed lynchings to continue for fear of being called racists if we stood up to stop them???

Very strange defense by these people...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 11:20 PM

Okay. So Obamacare is genocide. We all agree on that.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 11:28 PM

No, we don't all agree on that, GUEST...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Mar 13 - 11:29 PM

Naw...that's just way too easy, Bobert.

I very seriously doubt that racism has anything to do with Songwronger's objections to Obama. He just doesn't like Obama's policies, that's all, and he's made it plain enough times that he doesn't like the Republicans one bit either. This isn't your standard "Oh, he's not for MY party so he must be for the other one!" situation here. Nor is it your standard "Oh, he must be against Obama because he's a Black man" thing either.

To just jump on that made-to-order line is exactly like the Israelis jumping to the accusation of anti-Semitism whenever someone disagrees with them about anything. It's a cheap shot.

I think Songwronger is beating a completely dead horse in this thread...a pointless dead horse...but I don't think he's doing it for the reasons you suggest at all.

He might be doing it just to piss you off. Or maybe he thinks it actually matters? But how could he?

I think perhaps it's just become his hobby to battle with you and the others who always rise like fish to the very obvious bait he offers. He must enjoy it a good deal, seems to me.

Are you guys all enjoying it too? Do you relish the sense of outrage, and the predictable return to the usual fray? I have to wonder...it looks very much like a symbiotic relationship to me.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 12:56 AM

Little Hawk, I don't know if it's racism or whatever else might be involved, but what tends to "outrage" me is the obviously hate-filled spreading of blatant lies about someone, whether they are well-known, such as a national politician, or an obscure private citizen. I don't enjoy it at all, but I feel that is one's moral responsibility to try to set the record straight.

And I take a pretty dim view of people who get on someone's case when that someone else speaks out against such such lies, and attempts to set the record straight.

I have recently been the target of lies and slanderous attacks from one particular individual right here on Mudcat. A few people have spoken out, standing up for me, and believe me, I really appreciate it.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Little Hawk
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 02:09 AM

I'm not personally attacking Bobert in any way, Don, I'm simply suggesting he might be mistaken assuming racism as a motivator on SW's part. I am suggesting that continually rising to the bait of someone who wants to fight about something is giving them exactly what they want...and succumbing to a sort of predictable, repetitous toxic emotional addiction that justs ends up wasting a lot of everyone's valuable time, makes the day a little worse for all concerned, and changes no one's mind about anything.

No matter how many times you guys fight with Songwronger about Obama, and hurl insults and ridicule, he will still feel exactly as he does, and you will still feel exactly as you do, and you'll continue to grossly stereotype each other at each farthest end of the argument, imagining all kinds of horrible things about one another (many of which are probably way off the mark) and you'll all have wasted another little piece of your valuable lives having a really miserable time together and fucking each other's heads up. It's a stupid way to live a life.

(As I just probably wasted a little piece of mine... even bothering to tell you.)

I have no idea who's been making the slanderous attacks on you lately. I probably already avoided the specific threads on which they've been happening, since the title (or the just first lot of hostile, insult-laden posts) are usually enough to warn me off them right from the getgo.

You notice how many people here NEVER appear on the political threads. Ever wonder why?

This place is childish, Don, when it comes to discussing political subjects. It's a sorry shame to see adult human beings acting as they do on the political threads here and dumping their emotional poison on each other continually.

Mind you, it's not as bad as the Youtube comments...but Youtube is full of teenagers and kids, and they can be excused to some extent for apparently not having developed the slightest notion of how to treat each other decently.

If you want to talk about it further, PM me. This thread is just another damn toxic political waste dump, and I'm dumping it right now. If I could make it and the other political threads vanish off my screen, I would.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 02:15 AM

Prof Boff: "Providing contraception to those who want it and abortion on demand is advocating genecide!??
Lots of married couples practice birth control. In your estimation, they are all murderers??
UNREAL!!"

I'm sure any similarity...between these two won't be figured out by activists! ..it's a Greek to him!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Lizzie Cornish
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 05:00 AM

'Songwronger' - This thread is an insult to all those who ARE facing Genocide.

Only YOU know why you started it, but trust me, you know NOTHING about Genocide, nor the terrible, gut-wrenching fear and trauma suffered by those who have had it visited upon them.

You want to complain about those who inflict Genocide? Then write to President Dilma Rousseff about what she is bringing to the Indigenous Peoples of The Amazon Rainforest, with the Belo Monte Dam...and 60 MORE dams, probably more, also in the Rainforest...

Write to Obama, by ALL means, but write to him about the Genocide which continues against Native Americans to this day!

Write to Stephen Harper too

Write to many of the African leaders...

The Bloody List of Bloodiness is ENDLESS!!

But do NOT DARE try to BELITTLE the Crime of Genocide by starting up such an ignorant thread!

Get a grip, for God's Sake!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 09:20 AM

Fuck me. I agree with the fluffy pink one.

Ding-Dong - LEARN TO READ. What you call "Obamacare" does NOT fall within the UN definition of genocide and only a fool could think it did.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 10:22 AM

Yeah, I agree with Don... I don't see why this guy gets a pass from the "classless and free" gang here... If they spent a little more time in the real world in discussions groups they would see this pattern of racism and Obama-hatred...

Like I have pointed out before: If Obama found a cure for cancer the Obama-haters would accuse him of trying to put doctors out of work..."

Maybe the "classless and free" haven't lived in South and seen just how this all really works... When I read people like wrongman I hear Jim Crow with all of its evilness dripping from it... Maybe the "classless and free" haven't heard and seen what every Southerner has and continues hear... If the "classless and free" don't think that there is a significant number of people who still use the term "nigger" routinely in referring to black people then it might make them a little leery of someone who clearly is eat up with hatred...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Mrrzy
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 12:48 PM

It isn't genocide if you're against everybody...


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 01:22 PM

Precisley Mrzzy.
Misanthropy.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 01:26 PM

I don't get where Obama is "against" anyone... Maybe I'm missing something here???

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 01:39 PM

Sugarfoot,

"Wow. Are your piles playing up again and making you grouchy? You know full well what I meant. "

Yes I do know what you meant. You lazily made your point in a bigoted manner. You wrote an untruth because you couldn't be bothered to take the time to edit yourself. And though you changed tactics you did not thank me for pointing that out. :-)

Please consider how you would feel if the UK was described as country of skinheads moaning and crying into their warm beer over the loss of the Empire.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Stu
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 01:54 PM

My word, you really are a nasty piece of work. Nothing I wrote was bigoted, it was never intended to offend and I resent that accusation deeply. If I offended it was unknowingly and without any intent to do so and I apologise sincerely.

Here in the UK, "the country" is the vernacular expression often used when discussing a general mood in amongst the population. It doesn't imply, in any way, shape or form that everyone shares the same attitude or political opinion. The expression is used on the TV, the radio and by people far more erudite and informed that I will ever be and is not in any way pejorative. You misunderstood; a simple mistake.

Bloody hell, what has this board become?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 01:58 PM

With folk like songwronger, Sugarfoot, you have asked the right question... There hasn't been anyone as obnoxious since Martin Gibson left... Incredible amount of pure USDA Choice racist hate...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 02:07 PM

Sugarfoot Jack,

"Here in the UK, "the country" is the vernacular expression often used when discussing a general mood in amongst the population."

Really? What percent of the population? 100%, 75%, 51%, 25%, 20%?

It is my opinion that a very vocal 20% of less of the population supports those things you were railing against. I am faced with their rantings every day and with my words, deeds and money, I fight against it. Please excuse me for trying to correct you when you try to say that the battle is lost.

I have tried to point out to you that there are small, vocal malcontent groups in the UK who also say nasty things. That does not meant The Country is that way.

As for what this board has become, When and how did you decide it was OK to insult another person's chosen home and expect no feedback?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 02:14 PM

Bobert, I hear you and Songwronger's nonsense irritates me as well. But I feel obligated to defend him here.

I don't think that it is fair at all to compare Songwronger to Martin Gibson. Songwronger has a point of view that, to say the least is extreme and he says a lot of things which I believe, to say the least, are nonsense. But he seems to be pushing a point of view rather than trolling as sport and I have not ever seen him resort to any of the MG staples such as personal attacks, profanity, sexual innuendo and misogyny.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 02:22 PM

"Well, Songwronger, it appears to me that the U.N. didn't think carefully enough about the wording in their definition of genocide."

No, LH, I think the people at the UN know what imposing means in this context and for the sake of trolling, Songwronger is pretending not to know.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 02:36 PM

""But he seems to be pushing a point of view rather than trolling as sport ""

""No, LH, I think the people at the UN know what imposing means in this context and for the sake of trolling, Songwronger is pretending not to know.""

Eight minutes apart and consecutive posts.

Which one do you want us to take as your point of view Jack?

No sarcasm, a genuine inquiry!

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Sugarfoot Jack
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 02:36 PM

You're still not getting it now are you? It was a turn of phrase you are unfamiliar with, nothing more. Obviously our press is not reporting the issue in a balanced manner.

I have insulted no-one's home, and I've apologised if my posts have caused any offence, which apparently you can't take in good grace. As I've said before I love the US and have many good friends there, so at least I know your belligerence isn't a national character trait.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 02:52 PM

DOn,

That he is trolling to push his point of view rather than for its own sake. I'm not saying that that is a reasonable or sensible thing to do. Let me put it this way. He starts with his message and sticks to it. That makes him very different from M.G.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 02:59 PM

I've heard that "turn of phrase" before. To my knowledge, this is the first time I've heard it used to refer to a 20-25% minority. Can I ask you not to do so again with reference to my home and consider that promise to be your apology for giving offense?

If not, its OK, I'm tired of this discussion. I'll just take any offense that you offer from now on as a "turn of phrase" that is not familiar to me.

Cheers!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Sugarfoot Jack
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 04:31 PM

I've already apologised,sincerely and genuinely and I will not be bullied by you because you suffer from a deficit of humility or reason.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 06:26 PM

You didn't apologize directly to me or to America or for what you actually said. You have not said you won't do it again. You have addressed none of my arguments and stooped to insulting the condition of my anus. I'll measure whatever you say from now on by those standards.

LOL!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 07:45 PM

Look, Ding-fucking-Dong - Don Thompson has it right above.

""imposing measures to prevent births within the (national) group" is genocide" - UN definition (assuming, for once, that you are not lying about that).

Imposing measures that ALLOW people freely to take steps to prevent conception, or to prevent births (or not if they don't want to) is NOT within the definition.

GET A FUCKING DICTIONARY.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 07:54 PM

Jack the Sailor. You are acting like a dimshit. Sugarfoot's views about "the country" of the USA precisely follow international news coverage. If you don't worship the gun, get out there and and help impose civilisation, de-frock Colonel Colt, and help to get military armaments out of the hands of nutters (even if your Senate will not). Or are you creaming your pants about the next high-school massacre?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: pdq
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 08:00 PM

This is neither informative nor entertaining, so why do it


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 08:00 PM

Time to end this stupid thread


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 08:06 PM

It was time to end this stupid thread after the 1st post...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 23 Mar 13 - 11:33 PM

Richard, all of the things that you suggest that Americans should do in your post above, be aware that there is a substantial number of us who are, indeed, working very hard toward those ends.

And I agree that this thread should have ended before the first post, which was nothing more than pure hate-mongering.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 12:14 AM

Richard, Use Google, show me that the majority of this country is all those things. The reports and stats are out there. The News reports you choose to watch are not my concern. It is apparent that you are not very discerning.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 03:35 AM

Don Firth, if the views you state to be the norm were so, and were expressed to be so, your democracy would not be backtracking as it is on arms control.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 04:59 AM

Bush wanted to funnel Social Security deductions to Wall Street. A great idea, so he said.
America said no.
Wall Street collapsed.
Obama is going to force us to funnel money that's already been taxed to Wall Street with the lame excuse that it is a tax.
Wall Street is going to become healthy with Obamacare.
And nobody else.
Watch and see.
It's like GWB never left office.
You heard it here first.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 06:36 AM

The best idea for the US's healthcare would be a National Health Service - but we are scrapping ours. The tide is flowing the wrong way. "Obamacare" is the next best option, allowing some healthcare, even if most of the money goes to fat cat profiteers.

And meanwhile, back to the topic, how about compulsory education and mental health care so that DingDong could learn how to read or think or even both?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Stu
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 07:57 AM

Apologies everyone for the way the thread has gone, rose to the bait and that was a mistake.

I'll get me coat.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 10:03 AM

Songwronger posts because he cares.
As we all do.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 02:09 PM

Richard, I said, "......there is a substantial number of us who are, indeed, working very hard toward those ends."

This IS true, and being in another country and counting on the news you are fed, you are obviously unaware of this. Be assured that there ARE, INDEED, may people petitioning, writing and phoning their political representatives, and generally working to change the status quo.

Just this morning on the news, I heard that yet another state has passed a law insisting on background checks before purchasing firearms and still another state is passing laws to ban gun shows, requiring that all firearms sales be made only by a legally authorized dealer.

Needless to say, the National Rifle Association (the "gun lobby") is furious.

This doesn't solve the problem by any means, but it's certainly a step in the right direction, with more to come.

It's easy to make judgements from afar, but one runs the risk of being wrong and talking nonsense.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 03:09 PM

It is a political debate and a political battle. That is why it is news. That is why events and positions are rhetorically exaggerated. I do not look out my window and see gun battles or even armed people. Trained and responsible Sheriff's deputies protect all of the schools in this area. Not untrained teachers buying weapons and ammo from the NRA's sponsors. So no I am not "waiting for the next High School massacre."

You Englishmen have a right to express your opinions. But when those opinions are half baked and ill-informed, people closer to the situation are obligated to let you know.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 04:17 PM

Niggardly Bastard...I agree with your last two messages!

GfS

P.S....even though some only post to TRY to persuade common sense to depart further from 'normal' citizens, and have it replaced with stupid political hidden agendas!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 04:27 PM

Still talking to yourself, I see, Niggardly Goofy Guest.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 06:23 PM

This thread is about Obamacare.
Not Gun Control Legislation.
Take your Gun Control posts to the Gun Control Thread.
Obamacare is just another Taxpayer Ripoff.
You'll see.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 06:36 PM

No. This thread is based on a distortion of the word impose which was cleared up long ago.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 06:51 PM

Obamacare is forced taxation, and the taxes go to pay for abortions and contraceptives. "Imposing measures to prevent births within the (national) group" is one of the U.N.'s definitions of genocide.

Obamacare is genocide against the American people. Forced taxation to prevent births.

And some of you are fine with that. But I don't like genocide. In any form. If I supported this type of genocide, then I would have to support the Hitlerian kind. Or can you support soft genocide but not the hard kind? Can you be a little bit pregnant?

Say no to genocide. Say no to Obamacare.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Songwronger
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 06:52 PM

Damned cookie monster.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 06:59 PM

Oh for fuck's sake.

Taxation may be used to fund the availability of contraception, but it does not impose measures to prevent births.

GET AN EDUCATION, IDIOT.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 08:20 PM

Will Obamacare lead to a return of the Eugenics Movement?
Will Amerika develop into The Master Race?
Time will tell.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: pdq
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 08:27 PM

this thread is about as interesting as watching Howard Stern change his smelly gym socks


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 09:08 PM

Full of sound and fury, signifying nothing!
                               --William Shakespeare

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Joe Offer
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 09:19 PM

One would think the real "genocide" is withholding healthcare from the people for ideological reasons.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: pdq
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 09:29 PM

one hunnert


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 09:39 PM

I still see no refutation that Obamacare = Genocide.

1 - Obamacare taxation will be used to pay for birth control.

2 - So, tax = condoms, or tax = abortions.

3 - This tax is being imposed on taxpayers, therefore, abortions are being imposed on taxpayers.

4 - The U.N. says genocide is "imposing measures to prevent births within the (national) group."

I can't make it much simpler.

The original post has a link to a Wikipedia article about the Genocide Convention, by the way. Here it is again:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genocide_Convention

Look at 2 d. "Imposing measures intended to prevent birth within the group." And I haven't even addressed Section 3, which deals with conspiracy, incitement and attempt to commit genocide. The mere act of canvassing for Obamacare was genocide.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Joe Offer
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 09:56 PM

Anonymous poster is Songwronger.

Is it genocide if it's voluntary, Songwronger?

The Obamacare insurance offers contraceptives. I don't believe it pays for abortions, although I suppose some people argue that some contraceptives cause "chemical" abortions. Whatever the case, the program does not require a woman to get any treatment she does not want to get.

That voluntary aspect more-or-less refutes any tiny shred of sanity your contention might have had. But hey, it was insane in the first place.

-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 09:58 PM

Bottom line, wronger???

You could say that Obama is a Kenyan from Mars and guess what???

By your moronic standards no one could prove you wrong...

I mean, when you make the most idiotic statements in the world that have no basis in reality there is nothing that anyone could say that would make you happy,,,

You have a serious personality disorder... Period...

B


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 10:04 PM

I'm willing to pay a little extra in taxes to help people avoid having unwanted children, which adds to their poverty and results in my taxes being raised even further. And unwanted children are often abused, which in itself is to be prevented. It is a bad thing in itself, but it often results in turning the youngster into a juvenile delinquent or badly disturbed adult, and that can have a deleterious effect on society as a whole.

Suck it up, Songwronger! (And take your meds!)

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 10:05 PM

BTW, Joe... Everyone knew GUEST was the wrongman...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 10:11 PM

Ain't no meds in the world, Don, that would help this guy... He has a serous personality disorder bordering on full fledged psychosis...

B~(former social worker working with the mentally ill)


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 10:47 PM

Right. Anyone who oozes hate the way he does just isn't normal. Maybe he was one of those unwanted and subsequently abused children I was talking about.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Larry Saidman
Date: 24 Mar 13 - 11:15 PM

I find it intriguing---and a bit upsetting--- that so many people are unwilling or unable to stick to the points under discussion and instead make personal attacks. To my mind, there's a big difference between saying that a person's argument is illogical, or even 'stupid' (if one wants to be blunt), and saying that the person himself is stupid.

I respect the fact that as I read this thread, Little Hawk consistently kept a clear perspective on that difference.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 12:03 AM

Obamacare imposes birth control on my national group via taxes to be used for contraceptives and chemical abortions. My national group suffers a government-sponsored reduction in birth as a result. It doesn't matter whether women choose to participate or not; the mere fact that the program is imposed on ALL in the group (through taxes) means that the group is being subjected to genocide. According to the U.N. And simple logic.

I'm amazed that you people would support genocide. I know that liberals believe in population reduction and all that, but genocide?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 12:36 AM

Songwronger, Tough. We all pay taxes for things that we'd rather not support. Pull up your socks and get real. It all goes into the mix - pretend you're paying for something you like.

SRS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 11:07 AM

wrongerman doesn't understand the basic meaning of words, kinda like tea party people, and fox news.

however if americans were worried about genocide how about the almost total destruction of the native people up to and including the American support of the genocidal regime of rios mont in Guatemala. the American governments since ww 2 have supported genocide all over the hemisphere, to get cheap resources and land for American corporations.

why would anybody love America? it's the land of liberty!!! the land of refuge from the genocide of the british empire and for those fleeing many other European militarists.

unfortunalely the liberty people have been in opposition for a long time, but hope for this hemisphere depends on their coming back to power and ending the world wide military adventures that only benefit American corporations, and are impoverishing the people.

any onterested should start reading chris hedges.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 11:11 AM

""Songwronger, Tough. We all pay taxes for things that we'd rather not support. Pull up your socks and get real. It all goes into the mix - pretend you're paying for something you like.""

That won't work SRS. There isn't anything he likes. I don't think in 72 years I've come across anybody as consistently negative and pissed off.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 11:13 AM

No, twerp. Whatever your national group, no contraception is imposed on it. It's that simple. Even an amoeba could understand it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 11:31 AM

Good point, Richard... To listen to the wrongman's interpretation here one would come away with mental pictures of birth control nazis going door to door holding women down and forcing birth control pills down their throats???

But that's the way delusional people think... Especially those who are obsessed as wrongman is...

And another good point, GUEST, 11:07... Obama so far has acted like a Boy Scout helping old ladies cross the street compared to the last several presidents who were mighty trigger happy... Yet wrongman couldn't care less about those people because he isn't obsessed with them...

A clinical psychologist's notes on wrongman would read: "Client suffers from Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD)... He also is dealing with personality disorders and should be monitored for violent behaviors resulting from deep seated anger and hostilities"...

BTW, that isn't a personal attack... It is an observation based on years as a social worker dealing primarily with people with mental illness... Wrongman has shown enough behaviors here support the above diagnosis...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Larry Saidman
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 01:01 PM

Bobert, No ethical professional mental health worker (psychologist, psychiatrist, social worker, clinical counsellor, etc.) of any kind would diagnose somebody based on a few posts on a specific topic. You have no idea of songwronger's motivation here, or whether there is any 'obsession' or 'compulsion' for him to make these posts.....or whether he's possibly even doing some kind of 'research study' on his own, or making his own diagnoses depending on how we all respond to him.

We just don't know.

So yes, to make, amidst your anger, some kind of 'diagnosis', in my opinion constitutes a 'personal attack'. (not that I'd ever diagnose you as a 'personal attacker'.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 01:25 PM

Larry - join, use the search function, see all of ding-dong's posts and then you will have some information on which to base YOUR opinion.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 01:37 PM

The fact is a scientific Eugenics Program would reduce healthcare costs dramatically.
I expect it to become part of Obamacare at some point in the distant future.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 01:43 PM

Larry I am sure bobert is making a bobert the Mudcat character mudcat only diagnoses of Songwronger the Mudcat character. Do you remember the movie that "diagnosed" all corporations as psychopaths? like that... If you were to read many of bobert's posts here you will see that they do not fully represent his character, or that of any other functioning adult, outside the forum.

Welcome to the Mudcat Larry. Sorry if you don't like the Mud slinging.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Larry Saidman
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 01:50 PM

Richard, I did read all his posts. It's not that different from attempts many of us made in introductory philosophy/logic courses to use an 'if....then' type of argument, and to see how ridiculous we could find topics to argue about using some form of 'logic' to support them.

In this instance, of course, as has been pointed out, songwronger is making a supposition that anything paid through taxes means that it is 'imposed'. From a logical point of view I could talk about the difference between a measure being 'imposed' and 'supported'.

But a lot of good points have been made trying to refute songwronger's logic......but they either haven't hit home to songwronger, or he's just choosing to remain provocative.

I'm not particularly interested in getting hooked in to disputing this so-called logical argument, because I don't feel it's very important.

Much more important is (a) How we as a group conduct ourselves when we feel frustrated.....can we respond without attacking a person's character?   and (b) The genuine expression of outrage from lizzie cornish about how this thread trivializes a truly serious subject....which is genocide. I think her comment is well worth reading and re-reading.    It's for that reason that I really don't want to enter into this debate.

But I do want to encourage all of us to respond in a respectful and 'human' manner.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 02:07 PM

Yeah,

Larry I tried that approach first when I came to this forum 12 years ago.

Keep this in mind. Some people, just like the confrontation.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 02:50 PM

Larry, when someone stalks you from thread to thread, consistently misquotes and distorts what you've said in your posts in an effort to make you look bad, and attacks YOUR character at every turn—and you simply call him a "liar"—which he has proven himself to be—then is that an unjustified attack on his character?

I deplore the fact that so many of these threads degenerate into partisan slagging matches, but that seems to be the way of the internet these days. Some people simply do not know how to behave in a civilized manner.

Just be glad they're out there on the internet, not living next door to you, or, God forbid, sitting in your living room.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Larry Saidman
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 03:09 PM

I just find, Don, that when somebody does that......and, from this thread, I actually didn't see much personal attacking from songwronger other than his 'baiting' of the so-called 'liberal' (whatever that term means to him).   Some of the more bizarre comments he made really, from my point of view, didn't reflect upon anybody else's character. It was hard to take them too seriously.

I'm just wondering why so often (and I include myself in this) we end up rising to the bait.

The more we defend ourselves....particularly when we start thinking that 'the best defense is a good offence'.......the more we put down our own character.

Songwronger, (and this is my own opinion) seems to be wanting to have some fun with us, and to 'bait' us.   If we want to partake in the fun and debate back, terrific.

But let's not give him more ammunition by showing that we're really not so 'liberal' after all.

I think that this topic of how we respond to these arguments is so near and dear to my heart because I can recall doing exactly the same time of thing, during my university years, to my professors....particularly the ones I judged as 'pompous'.   And the more they got 'worked up', the more victorious I felt.

Hopefully I've matured and don't do that too often....but every once in awhile I know I'm tempted to slip back.   And I invite anybody to call me on it when I do.

-Larry


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 03:55 PM

Songwronger has a history here, and it's a bit indefinite as to whether he truly believes what he posts, or if he's merely a wind-up artist. Whichever he is, he posts a lot of just plain lies.

I personally feel that the blatant misinformation he posts should be countered and the record set straight.

Sometimes it's a bit hard to do that without being accussed of "attacking" him on a personal level.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 04:14 PM

Songwronger is like that nasty little hockey player going into the corners with his quick elbows trying to get you sent to the penalty box :-D


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 04:40 PM

Bottom line, Larry, is that the wrongman is a one-trick pony... He won't post unless it is yet another way of showing his obsessive hatred of Obama... Period...

But don't believe me... Click on his name on any thread and all of his posts will come up and you too can trip down Songwronger's magical mystery tour of a tortured individual...

That, in no way is meant to be a personal attack... Just observation... And, yes, I do have many years working with mentally ill people working beside and along various other folks in mental health...

And Don is correct... We have stalkers here... I have one... He comes and goes but when he is here he is a complete jerk... BTW, he has not been content to just stalk me here but has found other websites where I participate and stalked me there, as well... Once you get one of these folks on you you get to understand what Don and I are talking about...

Nuff said...

B;~)


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 05:05 PM

Frankly, Larry, I don't believe you have read all of ding-dong's 638 posts under his official name.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Larry Saidman
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 05:42 PM

Sorry Richard.. I guess I misunderstood. I just read his posts on this thread.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: wordfella
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 06:31 PM

Not feeding the troll.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 07:31 PM

Obamacare forcibly collects money to be used for birth control. This is "imposing measures to prevent births within the (national) group." I welcome any viable argument against that.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 07:40 PM

Obamacare does not forcibly collect money.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 07:40 PM

Here's the obvious one, wrongman...

Who exactly is going to force anyone to take the birth control pills??? Might of fact, who is going to force women to ask their doctors for them???

Oh, that's right... No one...

This thread and wrongman's thesis is more bogus than $3 bills... Wrongman has created some kind of Tin Foil scenario where Obama is forcing birth control on woman and then gores about going into his pathological defense against something that doesn't exist and never will...

Go find another hobby, man... This is a sick thread and your argument is pathological...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 07:46 PM

This measure does not force people to use birth control if they do not choose to.

It is a matter of their free choice, hence, in no way can a reasonable person consider it to be "imposing genocide."

Another attempt by Songwronger to bad-mouth that uppity—fellow—who, by popular vote, currently occupies the White House.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: frogprince
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 07:50 PM

Maybe we just don't appreciate Songwronger's sense of humor


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 10:41 PM

Bingo!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 11:13 PM

Okay. Three semi-stabs at addressing the issue. Sift out a bunch of self-loathing on the racism issue and what do we have?

1) Obamacare does not forcibly collect money.

Yes it does. The supreme court ruling upholding Obamacare did so by placing it under the taxing authority of the U.S. constitution. Health insurance MUST be purchased, or you will owe a penalty...sorry, a "tax." Said tax to be collected by the internal revenue service. So, Obamacare DOES forcibly collect money.

2) Who exactly is going to force anyone to take the birth control pills??? Might of fact, who is going to force women to ask their doctors for them???

Back-alley abortion imagery may be blinding some of you to what I'm talking about. You see, the government IMPOSES the Obamacare tax on me, and then disburses the money to provode birth control. The U.N. Convention on Genocide says that "imposing measures to prevent births within the (national) group" is genocide. A tax is an imposed measure. And the Obamacare tax is used to prevent births within my national group (America). No one is forcing women to practice birth control under Obamacare; I AM THE ONE BEING IMPOSED UPON, through taxation. You don't have to be a pregnant woman to be imposed upon, merely a member of the national group.

3) This measure does not force people to use birth control if they do not choose to. It is a matter of their free choice, hence, in no way can a reasonable person consider it to be "imposing genocide."

See explanation for # 2.

At any rate, Obamacare is genocide. Not with bullets or coat hangers, but with balance sheets. And you have to address genocide, wherever you see it. It's true that the historical genocides mentioned are more dramatic, but that doesn't mean I shouldn't point out this one.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 11:20 PM

I see the math you are using now.
Then obviously
Obamacare=Genocide
Songwronger=Genocide
Therefor
Songwronger=Obamacare.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 11:49 PM

please stop trying to teach a pig to sing


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 25 Mar 13 - 11:54 PM

If you people find this thread so offensive, why may I ask do you continue to post to it?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 12:18 AM

"please stop trying to teach a pig to sing "

"Never try to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and it annoys the pig." Robert Heinlein quotes (American science-fiction writer,1907-1988). Similar Quotes.

I have time....


"If you people find this thread so offensive, why may I ask do you continue to post to it?"

Because as soon as we stop he will start another one?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Larry Saidman
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 01:35 AM

139 posts on this thread. Hmmm.   Songwronger seems pretty popular!

Oh damn! Now there's 140.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 01:48 AM

Yeah! He's a peach!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 04:42 AM

That STILL does not come anywhere near a logical progression, ding-dong.

First we don't know your "national group".
Second we don't know the "national groups" of the women who might (or might not) choose to avail themselves of contraceptive measures.
Third, since the women have a free choice, nothing relevant PREVENTS them getting pregnant or giving birth. The measure you appear to address, taxation, does nothing of the kind. It merely takes money out of your pocket. Not even the disbursement of the tax revenue ( a quite different thing) prevents births.

You are confused, irrational, and pig-headed.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 05:09 AM

I like Songwronger's threads. We have a similar outlook.
We both know Obama is a puppet and a sellout.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 09:17 AM

""I like Songwronger's threads. We have a similar outlook.
We both know Obama is a puppet and a sellout.
""

So what happened to colour your viewpoint?

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 09:58 AM

"Sellout"???

To whom???

Please elaborate on just who you think is pulling Obama's strings...

Gay Americans???

Soldiers who he is getting out of wars Bush left him???

Americans who don't want to breath bad air or drink poison water???

I mean, it's easy to make (parrot) these mindless statements that the Republican Party's PR firm has put out there but let's get real here...

Where is all this selling out???

Solyndra???

Nope... If you use facts, that wasn't even a sellout... Solyndra first made application for a government backed loan back in 2005...

I mean, let's get real here... Pragmatism ain't selling out... Selling out is taking money and changing an existing policy in exchange...

But Obama got lots of Wall Street $$$ in '08...

Yes, he did... And what did Wall Street get in return??? Not much or they would have given him the big $$$ in '12...

So, let me repeat the question... Just who has Obama sold out to...

Oh, and can you provide details and sources (no right wing blogs, por favor... Real sources...)

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 11:03 AM

He sold us out to Wall Street. Obamacare premiums are going to make Wall Street healthy again.
Or that's the plan.
You'll see.
Otherwise Amerika is going bankrupt.
Which it will likely do anyway.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 03:08 PM

He did??? How did he do that???

He signed Dodd-Frank... Wall Street hates Dodd-Frank...

Every bit of money that was lent to the financial people has been paid back...

Where is the quid pro quo here???

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 05:59 PM

You say it's all been paid back.
Proof?
NDAA.
Sellout.
Obama is just another Clinton.
Who sold us out with NAFTA.
Your problem is believing what you're told and taught.
You think everyone is basically honest and nice, like you.
I wish they were.
They are two faced, bobette.
They lie. They cheat. They steal.
And smile all the while.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 06:21 PM

Proclamations and proof are two different beasts, N.B.

You made the assertion that Obama is selling out to Wall Street... Not me...

Therefore, you should provide your sources... That's the problem when proclaimers proclaim... It's not on me to prove that the money was paid back... It has been reported on the news... You say not so??? Provide your sources...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 06:24 PM

BTW, I am in now way excusing or defending Wall Street here... I am defending Obama's culpability in the melt down and defending his actions at a time when because of the messed up things that Wall Street did our financial system was on the verge of collapsing...

He did what he had to do...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 08:23 PM

Time will tell.
It will be interesting to see how it all plays out.
I think the middle and working class are going to take a beating.
They always do.
It's the Amerikan way.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 26 Mar 13 - 08:44 PM

The fact that the American working class is taking a beating isn't on Obama, N.B.

Let's do a little history here that ain't about Obama:

1. Kill unions... check

2. Consolidate media so only one voice is heard... check

3. Quit teaching kids "critical thinking" skills... check

4. Allow any moron equal time at the microphone (climate change)... check

5. High unemployment and underemployment... check

6. Rig the tax codes to favor the rich... check

7. Rig elections... check

8. Kill campaign finance laws... check

9. Offshore jobs... check

10. Fear, fear and more fear... check

This ain't on Obama, N.B. Nor were the 2 wars that was handed off to him... Nor was the collapsed economy that was handed off to him...

I mean, okay, you hate Obama??? Fine... Hate him... Buy a fucking Obama Voodoo doll and stick pins in it... Stay up all night sticking pins in it... I don't really give a shit...

But don't lie!!!

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 12:45 AM

It's pretty obvious that some of the posters here haven't bothered to read the Convention on the Prevention of Genocide, so here are the articles relevant to my argument:

Article 2 -
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

Article 3 -
The following acts shall be punishable:
(a) Genocide;
(b) Conspiracy to commit genocide;
(c) Direct and public incitement to commit genocide;
(d ) Attempt to commit genocide;
(e) Complicity in genocide.

You cannot do certain things to certain groups of people. National groups included. You cannot impose measures intended to prevent births within the group. Yet we Americans have had birth control imposed on us through the Obamacare tax. Obamacare = genocide.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 01:12 AM

Songwronger, in your hatred for Obama, you're overlooking one rather large flaw in your--um--reasoning(?).

Birth control does not prevent people from having children. And it doesn't "impose." It allows.

It allows people to decide whether they want to have a child at a particular time, or not. This way, they can plan their families and have their children at the most convenient time for them.

In no way does this qualify as "genecide."

Go take a couple of aspirin and get a good night's sleep, there's a good fellow.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 02:18 AM

I don't hate Obama. I'm disappointed in him.
I hate the system that owns him.
I don't want         an Obama Voodoo doll.
I want a Chia Obama.
I think they'll be worth big bucks one day, like Billy Beer.
Ch-Ch-Ch-Chia!!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 04:57 AM

Ding-dong, in the first place your purported rationale does not withstand the previous demonstrations above of its falsity. Secondly, since as far as I know all groups within the USA have equal access to what you term "Obamacare" how do you assert that it victimises any particular group. Third, you just shot yourself in the foot (probably more painful than shooting yourself in the head since obviously there are no brains in there) - no American has had birth control IMPOSED on them. Some may be offered it but even you should be able to see that that is not the same thing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 08:41 AM

The system that "own" Obama seems to be the "American poeple", sans the rich greedy bastards and their minions who hate him...

Exactly where is this evidence of __________________ (pick your favorite boogie man) pulling his strings and ordering him to do this or that???

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 09:49 AM

Boogie woman.
Hillary Clinton.
Do you recall when he ran against her for president in the 2008 race one of his reasons given to not vote for her was because she voted to go to war in Iraq.
Then when he won he hired her for a top job.
He also promised not to take corporate donations.
He took them anyway.
He has no integrity.
He lies.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 12:29 PM

More proclamations and no sources...

Uh huh...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: beardedbruce
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 12:37 PM

Bobert, Bobert, Bobert...

"Hillary Clinton.
Do you recall when he ran against her for president in the 2008 race one of his reasons given to not vote for her was because she voted to go to war in Iraq."

VERIFIED BY LISTENING TO OBAMA


"Then when he won he hired her for a top job."

VERIFIED BY LISTENING TO OBAMA


"He also promised not to take corporate donations."

VERIFIED BY LISTENING TO OBAMA

"He took them anyway."

VERIFIED BY LOOKING AT THE STATEMENTS BY OBAMA'S CAMPAIGNS


He has no integrity.
He lies.

CONCLUSIONS FROM THE ABOVE DEMONSTRATED FACTS.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 12:43 PM

beardedbruce, beardedbruce, beardedbruce

Using uppercase letters rather than tell us what the heck he is talking about...

He has no credibility.
He does support anything he says.

It's not communication when the thoughts you are having stay in your head.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 12:55 PM

Yes... Just more BB hate & noise...

Normal...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: beardedbruce
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 12:58 PM

Jack,

You are attacking me rather than disputing the facts I present- LOGICAL FALLACY on your part.



Bobert,

You are making unsubstantiated claims,. Address the facts, or admit you don't even bother listening to what is said by me, or by Obama.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 01:21 PM

I approve bruce's message.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: beardedbruce
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 01:43 PM

Bobert:



"Hillary Clinton.
Do you recall when he ran against her for president in the 2008 race one of his reasons given to not vote for her was because she voted to go to war in Iraq."

VERIFIED BY LISTENING TO OBAMA

Do you deny that Obama said this?





"Then when he won he hired her for a top job."

VERIFIED BY LISTENING TO OBAMA

Do you deny that Obama did this?





"He also promised not to take corporate donations."

VERIFIED BY LISTENING TO OBAMA


Do you deny that Obama said this?



"He took them anyway."

VERIFIED BY LOOKING AT THE STATEMENTS BY OBAMA'S CAMPAIGNS

Do you deny that obama's campaigns did take corporate/lobbiest money?




OK, just answer the questions. Are there any points I have made that you deny?

So where is the "hate & noise" except in your own posts??????


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 01:49 PM

Bruce, If there are any facts or arguments related to that post they are still locked up in your head.

I was simply pointing out that you have not made a coherent argument. You may get to the point of being able to correctly say "LOGICAL FALLACY" if you actually ever say something to refute. But even then, uppercase letters will not strengthen your argument.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 01:52 PM

GUEST,Niggardly Bastard,

Allow me to inform you that we have had ditto trolls on this forum before. What you are doing is just more useless noise. You seem harmless. Carry on if you are amusing yourself.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: beardedbruce
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 04:06 PM

"
I was simply pointing out that you have not made a coherent argument. You may get to the point of being able to correctly say "LOGICAL FALLACY" if you actually ever say something to refute. But even then, uppercase letters will not strengthen your argument."





"Hillary Clinton.
Do you recall when he ran against her for president in the 2008 race one of his reasons given to not vote for her was because she voted to go to war in Iraq."

VERIFIED BY LISTENING TO OBAMA

Do you deny that Obama said this?





"Then when he won he hired her for a top job."

VERIFIED BY LISTENING TO OBAMA

Do you deny that Obama did this?





"He also promised not to take corporate donations."

VERIFIED BY LISTENING TO OBAMA


Do you deny that Obama said this?



"He took them anyway."

VERIFIED BY LOOKING AT THE STATEMENTS BY OBAMA'S CAMPAIGNS

Do you deny that Obama's campaigns did take corporate/lobbiest money?




OK, just answer the questions. Are there any points I have made that you deny?


"
Using uppercase letters rather than tell us what the heck he is talking about...

He has no credibility.
He does support anything he says.

It's not communication when the thoughts you are having stay in your head."

OK, PLEASE tell me what your comment is saying- it does not dispute my factual statements, nor does it negate the fact that my post is in response to the claim
"
More proclamations and no sources...
"

I gave facts and sources- What have you contributed to yhe discussion besides unfounded attacks on people that you disagree with?

"Ad Hominum: Translated from the Latin for, "To the man," an ad hominum argument is just that. When an argument starts getting personal and attacks are made against a person, RATHER than to support an argument, that is an ad hominum logical fallacy. In any situation, mudslinging is a poor substitute for a well-reasoned argument.



Read more at Suite101: Logical Fallacy | Suite101 http://suite101.com/article/logical-fallacy-a24506#ixzz2OlxUlgN1
Follow us: @suite101 on Twitter | Suite101 on Facebook"


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 07:07 PM

(((yawn)))

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 07:11 PM

How about a fact or a source? I'd settle for a self-contained expressed thought


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 09:40 PM

Pathetic Jack.
Disagree with someone and they are a troll.
Agree and you start an entire
thread welcoming one individual.
You don't have a leg to stand on with your argument.
But you don't have to.
You're a kneejerk Obama apologist.
Like bobette.
My statements can be substaniated.
Yours are all fluff.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 10:00 PM

I get the distinct impression that GUEST,Niggardly Bastard and GUEST,Guest from Sanity are one and the same person.

Anybody else get that impression?

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 10:32 PM

I don't care to post the definition of genocide again, Mr. Bridge. It's there if you want to read it.

I am a member of the national American group. The Obamacare tax has been imposed on me. The tax money will be used for birth control. Against my wishes. I am the aggrieved party. I have been imposed upon. Obamacare is committing genocide against me and the other members of my national group, according to the U.N. Obamacare is:

(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Larry Saidman
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 11:02 PM

Just a clarification, Mr. Niggardly Bastard. I didn't actually agree with anything that Jack The Sailor had said prior to his posting my 'welcome' post. In fact, I was expressing my disagreement with the tendency to deviate from arguing the point and instead denigrating the person.

And interestingly enough, some of the people that I had the strongest disagreement with in that area ended up giving what I thought were 'delightful' responses on my welcome post.

I thank them.

And I would welcome you to do the same thing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 27 Mar 13 - 11:52 PM

Songwronger, that is one of the most convoluted pieces of "reasoning" that I've ever read, and I've read some real doozeys!!

I still don't see how you get "genocide" out of that! Hitler's shipping of Jews off to the death camps was genocide.

Obamacare is not.

Quite the opposite.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 12:32 AM

We post because we care.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 12:47 AM

Well, that's what genocide means to YOU, Don Firth. The U.N. has a broader definition of it. And under the U.N.'s guidelines, "imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group" is genocide.

The reasoning's not convoluted at all:

a) "Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the (national) group" is genocide, according to the U.N.

b) Obamacare taxes Americans so that birth control can be provided.

c) The tax is forcibly imposed.

That's genocide, and it's wrong.

I haven't attacked Obama in this thread. Obamacare is being imposed with the help of both Democrats and Republicans, and with the help of all four branches of government (the complicit media being the fourth). But the fact that Obama's name is attached to the turd of Obamacare will mark him in history as a genocidalist.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 01:19 AM

Songwronger, Obamacare does NOT IMPOSE birth control on anyone. It is a tax supported health care system, like most civilized countries have, and among other things, it makes birth control available to those who want it.

DO join the rest of the civilized world and try to stop letting your hatred for Obama rot your brain.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Ebbie
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 02:06 AM

"The Obamacare tax has been imposed on me. The tax money will be used for birth control. Against my wishes. I am the aggrieved party. I have been imposed upon. Obamacare is committing genocide against me and the other members of my national group, according to the U.N. Obamacare is:

"(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group."

Damn. You mean that every time you don a condom you are honoring the President's evil plot?

I see why you are so upset- you have to obey, because ya never know who is watching.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 03:09 AM

"Pathetic Jack.
Disagree with someone and they are a troll."

No, my friend, Saying "I agree." to posts that are obviously trolling is trolling.

Using a a name like "GUEST,Niggardly Bastard" unregistered, posting snarky comments to a political thread would get you banned pretty quickly from most forums.

You are a ditto troll. There have been plenty of others. If you are amusing yourself, by all means carry on. Or you can register and talk sensibly. I don't care either way.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 03:16 AM

Can you not get it through your thick head, ding-dong, that while the tax is imposed THAT measure does not (nor is intended to) PREVENT births?

I don't think I've ever seen such wilful stupidity.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 03:25 AM

I am also inclined to think that a "national group" refers to a group within a nation and not the whole of the nation that imposes the measure. But I expect that this is a bit subtle for you, ding-dong.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 05:52 AM

The flights of fancy a man a sets free
When ignoring the dictionary

Don't try to stop his saintly mission
By encumbering him with definition


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 07:31 AM

I was simply pointing out that you have not made a coherent argument. ""You may get to the point of being able to correctly say "LOGICAL FALLACY" if you actually ever say something to refute. But even then, uppercase letters will not strengthen your argument."





"Hillary Clinton.
Do you recall when he ran against her for president in the 2008 race one of his reasons given to not vote for her was because she voted to go to war in Iraq."

VERIFIED BY LISTENING TO OBAMA

Do you deny that Obama said this?
""

That's not how it works BB!

YOU made the claim!........GIVE LINKS TO OBAMA SAYING ALL THOSE THINGS!

If you want to be taken seriously, it's for YOU to prove your argument, not us.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 07:35 AM

""Like bobette.
My statements can be substaniated.
Yours are all fluff.


And so can your use of two or more identities to back yourself up, if you are too dim to alter your style of delivery, be substaniated(sic).

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 07:37 AM

""I get the distinct impression that GUEST,Niggardly Bastard and GUEST,Guest from Sanity are one and the same person.""

With distinct undertones of both Henry Krinkle and Richie Black.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 07:56 AM

""I am a member of the national American group. The Obamacare tax has been imposed on me. The tax money will be used for birth control. Against my wishes.""

I am a member of the national UK group. Income tax has been imposed on me. The tax money will be used for many necessary purposes, including birth control.

Against my wishes? Possibly, but that's what happens when you vote in a government, you get the package and by majority vote you have given them the mandate to decide exactly how and on what, they spend those taxes.

They don't instruct or persuade anybody either to use, or not to use those facilities they fund.

If you don't see the disconnect between paying general taxes and the government doing what it was elected to do, with your mandate as a winning or losing voter, and distributing that money, then you are not as smart as you think you are.

It's the way democracy works, me lad, and if you don't like it, save up and buy yourself an island, because dictatorships are worse.

No genocide here folks, move along now!

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 08:05 AM

Don T

"YOU made the claim!........GIVE LINKS TO OBAMA SAYING ALL THOSE THINGS!

If you want to be taken seriously, it's for YOU to prove your argument, not us.
"


I DID, ASSHOLE!



I stated that I had heard ( on the radio, with my own ears,) his speeches that stated the mentioned items.


I have expressed NO support for either side- But I have made statements of fact that support someone who was being accused falsely of making up information.

It is a pity that actually hearing a person say something is not valid to the liberals here unless they have a web reference, and then they deny any web reference that they disagree with.

Sounds like a bunch of bigots to me.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 09:08 AM

"Part of the reason we send you all these emails is that we don't accept any money from special-interest groups or Washington lobbyists.
"


Want to dispute this site?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 09:15 AM

More than two years after Obama took office vowing to banish "special interests" from his administration, nearly 200 of his biggest donors have landed plum government jobs and advisory posts, won federal contracts worth millions of dollars for their business interests or attended numerous elite White House meetings and social events, an investigation by iWatch News has found.
These "bundlers" raised at least $50,000 — and sometimes more than $500,000 — in campaign donations for Obama's campaign. Many of those in the "Class of 2008" are now being asked to bundle contributions for Obama's reelection, an effort that could cost $1 billion.
As a candidate, Obama spoke passionately about diminishing the clout of moneyed interests. Kicking off his presidential run on Feb. 10, 2007, he blasted "the cynics, the lobbyists, the special interests," who had "turned our government into a game only they can afford to play."
"We're here today to take it back," he said.
But just like other presidential aspirants, Obama relied heavily on megadonors to propel his campaign across the finish line, and many fundraisers have shared in the spoils of victory.
The White House insisted its appointees are eminently qualified. "In filling these posts, the administration looks for the most qualified candidates who represent Americans from all walks of life," White House spokesman Eric Schultz said. "Being a donor does not get you a job in this administration, nor does it preclude you from getting one."
The iWatch News investigation found:
• Overall, 184 of 556, or about one-third of Obama bundlers or their spouses joined the administration in some role. But the percentages are much higher for the big-dollar bundlers. Nearly 80 percent of those who collected more than $500,000 for Obama took "key administration posts," as defined by the White House. More than half the 24 ambassador nominees who were bundlers raised $500,000.
• The big bundlers had broad access to the White House for meetings with top administration officials and glitzy social events. In all, campaign bundlers and their family members account for more than 3,000 White House meetings and visits. Half of them raised $200,000 or more.
• Some Obama bundlers have ties to companies that stand to gain financially from the president's policy agenda, particularly in clean energy and telecommunications, and some already have done so. Level 3 Communications, for instance, snared $13.8 million in stimulus money.


Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0611/56993.html#ixzz2Oq8fgbF6


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 09:20 AM

Obama's Flip-Flops on Money in Politics: A Brief History
by Justin Elliott ProPublica, Jan. 30, 2013, 3 p.m.

When President Obama told supporters that he would morph his campaign into a new nonprofit that would accept unlimited corporate donations, the announcement set off a familiar round of griping from campaign finance reformers.

The creation this month of Organizing for Action, which will promote the president's second-term agenda, appears to be the fourth reversal by Obama on major money-in-politics issues since 2008.

"No big bank or corporation will donate million-dollar checks to OFA without the expectation that it will impact which issues they engage on, and that's very troubling," said Adam Green of the Progressive Change Campaign Committee.

The Washington Post noted that in reorganizing his campaign as a tax-exempt social welfare group, the president is embracing a structure that has been criticized for allowing anonymous money into politics.

Conservatives who've been attacked by the Obama camp for their reliance on such "dark money" groups called out the president's "brazen hypocrisy." Neither the White House nor Organizing for America responded to requests for comment.

Here's a brief history of Obama's other shifts on money-in-politics issues going back to 2008:

Public financing
In November 2007, then-Sen. Barack Obama pledged to take part in the presidential public financing system for the general election, calling himself "a longtime advocate for public financing of campaigns." Under the system, created in the wake of Watergate, a candidate receives taxpayer money ($84 million in 2008) and cannot accept most private donations or spend beyond the amount of the government grant.

Less than a year later, in June 2008, Obama reversed himself and announced he was opting out of the system. He maintained he still supported the system in principle but said it should be reformed.

Obama became the first candidate to decline general election public financing since the creation of the system and went on to raise a then-record $745 million for the cycle. He outspent John McCain, who did accept public money, by four-to-one. Obama's 2008 decision generally takes at least some of the blame from campaign finance observers for killing the system.

Neither Obama nor Mitt Romney accepted public financing in the 2012 race. The Obama campaign raised $782 million for the cycle.

Super PACs
When the U.S. Supreme Court issued its 2010 Citizens United decision, opening the way for the creation of super PACs financed with unlimited corporate or individual money, Obama became the ruling's biggest critic.

"Last week the Supreme Court reversed a century of law that I believe will open the floodgates for special interests u2014 including foreign corporations u2014 to spend without limit in our elections," Obama said in his State of the Union address a few days after the decision. "I don't think American elections should be bankrolled by America's most powerful interests, or worse, by foreign entities."

That criticism turned into a pledge not to use the new funding vehicles. In July 2011, Obama campaign spokesman Ben LaBolt told the Washington Post: "Neither the president nor his campaign staff or aides will fundraise for super PACs. Our campaign will continue to lead the way when it comes to transparency and reform."

Seven months later, the campaign reversed itself and embraced a super PAC founded by former White House aides called Priorities USA Action. "[O]ur campaign has to face the reality of the law as it currently stands," wrote campaign manager Jim Messina in a blog post.

With the blessing of the campaign, top Obama aides, such as then-Chief of Staff Jack Lew and confidantes like Rahm Emanuel, were dispatched to solicit super PAC donations from Democratic millionaires and billionaires. Priorities USA ultimately spent more than $60 million to help re-elect the president.



Is THIS too conservative for you?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 09:25 AM

RE: BB-If you want to be taken seriously...

I don't think anyone does, Don, or will in future.

Problem solved.

(PS: Oh, you nasty bigot, you, picking on poor little BB!)


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 09:37 AM

Another attack from the resident rascist lying scumbag.


Be careful, Don: You may have to get out of the gutter and slowly walk away...


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: frogprince
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 11:04 AM

Has anyone thought that just maybe a thread like this is what you get for attempting to respond to a mindless psychotic rant in the first place?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 12:14 PM

I though the thread was started by Ann Coulter.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 02:54 PM

""I have expressed NO support for either side- But I have made statements of fact that support someone who was being accused falsely of making up information.

It is a pity that actually hearing a person say something is not valid to the liberals here unless they have a web reference, and then they deny any web reference that they disagree with.
""

Your unsupported word would not carry a case in any court of law. Why should you assume that it would be any different here.

Hence I ask for links to those programs, so that I can hear whether your assertions are true.

It's nothing personal. I ask no less of anybody else.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 04:34 PM

"I thought this thread was started by Ann Coulter"...

Who's to know it wasn't...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 05:19 PM

LOL, Bobster.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 06:22 PM

Well, that would certainly explain a lot!

Ann Coulter doesn't have to worry about using birth control. She eats her young.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 06:51 PM

CC


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 06:53 PM

Ahhhh, not to mention that she is so ugly that she'd be hard pressed to find anyone who'd even knock her up with a stolen dick...

And 200...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 06:54 PM

...or 201...

B;~)


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: ollaimh
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 08:06 PM

hey h=joem yeah depriving people of health care comes under the definition of genocide when it fits the other criteria, like a dominant group disenfranchising a minority, and taking their land, removing most civil rights. America has done all this to nastives and black people. and of course supporting arming and funding genocidal regimes throughout the hemisphere, especially Guatemala. but killing ferners or injuns and destroying their children in the goulish residential schools, doesn't count eh joe.   ther church run schoold measnt well--too bad so many died from the deprival of nutrition and health care. hallelujah we're saved


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 08:13 PM

Well, I've shown that Obamacare = genocide. I'll never convince the national socialists here to admit otherwise.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 08:21 PM

1) I am NOT a National Socialist (you have lowered yourself to accusing those who disagree with you of being Nazis).

2) You have NOT proven that Obamacare = genocide.

The only thing you've proven is that you don't know the meaning of the words you are using. AND that you're hatred for Obama has led you to irrationality.

You, sir, are making a complete ass of yourself.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 08:22 PM

I thought you were a national socialist, Songwronger.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 08:34 PM

You haven't proven anything, wrongman, other than the fact that you are delusional...

You have never answered the question that has been asked of you: Is Obama forcing birth control on anyone???

Yes____

No_____

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 08:48 PM

In the 1948 United Nations Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide (CPPCG), Article 2 of this convention defines genocide as "any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such: killing members of the group; causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; and forcibly transferring children of the group to another group."

Obamacare does NONE of these things.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 10:17 PM

TV's done most of that.

Sixty-five years ago the world still had enough propensity for shame to consider it might be found out. The camps from eight years earlier were a scar on the body of nations. Now, we do the same damned thing and don't care.

like a man without a home
like a dog without a bone
like a kid without a phone

lost

As a child I looked at pictures of people dumped in piles, heaps of bones, human cruelty propagated by political philosophies. Years later, when I thought we'd become better as a world, I saw the killing fields, and then yet again the Rwandans mass-murdering other Rwandans and a world doing fuck all about it. Politicians like Clinton 'letting it go'. Good people arguing a few years back that "why should a blow job be a big deal" when bigger things were at stake, and so many of us agreeing.

Fact One: We, the people of this earth, are being exterminated.
Fact two: We, the people of this earth are doing fuck all about it.

We will die happy with no regard for our children. We're way beyond that.

Obama does not equal genocide. We do, and we allow it to happen.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 10:25 PM

Playing the Hitler Card=Knowing you've lost the argument


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 10:51 PM

You mentioned Hitler, TIA, not me.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 11:02 PM

Nice try
Everyone knows you did
You tried to do it with "deniability" but we are not stupid
You lose


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 11:06 PM

See, you liberals are trapped in a cult of personality. You think I'm talking about Obama. I'm not. I'm talking about ObamaCARE. Obamacare is a construct of both parties and all branches of our government. It bears Obama's name, but I am not talking about Obama.

And yes, Obamacare is forcing birth control on me and my national group. Through the use of forced taxes to be spent on birth control, said birth control is being IMPOSED on us as a national group. None of the gibberations I've read here can refute that. The equation remains intact. Obamacare = Genocide.

Goosestep back to school, kids. I know third graders who understand what's under discussion here.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 11:19 PM

TIA, that is a most disgusting thing to say. You win. Hitler never happened. Goodbye.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 11:51 PM

with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group,
with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group,
with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group,
with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group,
with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group,
with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group,
with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group,
with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group,


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 11:52 PM

with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,with intent to destroy,


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Mar 13 - 11:57 PM

with intent to destroy,

Aren't we done here.

Until Mr. Songwronger and NB can prove the "intent to destroy," lease ignore them.

They have wasted enough time already because of their poor reading and comprehension skills. Right?"

Thanks Don Firth for the actual text, not edited by person or person's unnamed.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 29 Mar 13 - 01:13 AM

Hahaha
Okay guest. Now you win. Hitler never happened.
My mother-in-law will be so pleased to learn that.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 29 Mar 13 - 01:18 AM

Guest -
It makes it difficult to have a conversation when people are anonymous.
Songwronger played the Hitler Card.
I was not talking to you (whoever you might be).
I actually totally agree with your 28 Mar 13 - 10:17 PM post.
I have seen it too.
Up close.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 29 Mar 13 - 09:10 AM

This thread is beginning to remind me of a saying from the 60s: "What if they called for a war and no one showed up?"

Yes, it's easy to get sucked into these delusional and mindless hate threads of Songwronger but what makes for 200+ posts are the folks who bother to take it upon themselves to participate in his insanity...

I am also reminded of something that a clinical psychologist once told me, "You can't reason with the insane"...

Think I'll just make this my last post here...

Bye...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Greg F.
Date: 29 Mar 13 - 09:50 AM

But much more importantly, does Genocare = Obamacide?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 29 Mar 13 - 03:49 PM

The intent to destroy the middle and working classes has been apparent to me ever since the dark days of Ronald Reagan.
I wish I could be as complacently unaware of these things as you are.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 29 Mar 13 - 04:54 PM

The middle class is in trouble no matter what the government does. It has been shrinking since the 1960's. In the 50's one working man's income could support a middle class family.

The oil shocks under Nixon and Carter and the burden from Vietnam both in terms of taxation and confidence put the middle class under serious stress. Then there was competition from Japan, corporate globalization, Aging baby boomers, decline in interest in science education. Etc, etc...

I think that the Democrats want to do all that is feasible in the modern world economy to protect the middle class. But global factors may lead to diminished returns at this point.

The GOP plans of austerity and providing tax breaks to people who are not spending the added disposable income in this economy and who are investing it elsewhere, and also to decline to invest in infrastructure and education are insane.

I give the Democrats a "D" grade say 60 out of a hundred

I give the GOP less than zero, say minus 30.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 29 Mar 13 - 06:13 PM

Jack's got it about right.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 29 Mar 13 - 09:32 PM

Finally, something we can all agree on. Intent to destroy.

Of course, most of you will blame it on the "other party," but again, Obamacare is a construct of both major parties and all branches of the federal government.

Obama and his predecessors in the oval office have shown an undeniable intent to destroy the nation. As have congress and the supreme court. Obamacare is a continuation of the intentional destruction of America by its lawmakers.

That was easy.

So now we have the fact that birth control has been imposed on America via the Obamacare tax, and the fact that the perpetrators of the tax have demonstrated an intent to destroy the nation. Obamacare still = Genocide.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Ebbie
Date: 29 Mar 13 - 09:34 PM

pppffffttttt


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 29 Mar 13 - 09:50 PM

INSANE!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 29 Mar 13 - 09:52 PM

That's a very progressive hospital you live in Songrwonger, allowing you access to the internet in your condition. Call Nurse Ratchet. She'll give you something to calm you down.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 30 Mar 13 - 03:03 AM

I approve Songwronger's message.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 30 Mar 13 - 01:29 PM

Ditto troll.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 30 Mar 13 - 01:54 PM

If Songwronger genuinely feels like he has a legitimate complaint, why is he whining and moaning here on Mudcat?

Why doesn't he take his complaint directly to the United Nations?

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Greg F.
Date: 30 Mar 13 - 05:23 PM

Kinda like the guy in "Summertime Blues".


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: cujimmy
Date: 30 Mar 13 - 06:07 PM

Here's a wee song which explains things perfectly

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8fheDIG_RA


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 30 Mar 13 - 06:34 PM

From a book review:
The theme of John Brunner's 1969 Hugo Award winning novel, Stand on Zanzibar is overpopulation and its projected consequences. The title refers to an early twentieth-century claim that the world's population could fit onto the Isle of Wight – which has an area of 381 square kilometres (147 sq mi) – if they were all standing upright. Brunner remarked that the growing world population now required a larger island; the 3.5 billion people living in 1968 could stand together on the Isle of Man (area 572 square kilometres (221 sq mi)), while the 7 billion people who he (correctly) projected would be alive in 2010 would need to stand on Zanzibar (area 1,554 square kilometres (600 sq mi)).

Throughout the book, the image of the entire human race standing shoulder-to-shoulder on a small island is a metaphor for an increasingly overcrowded world.
THIS is the world that Songwronger would impose on US!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 31 Mar 13 - 01:29 PM

Now I know I ruffle some feathers, of the phony left from the bogus notion that today's 'so-called liberals' are not really wolves, in sheep's clothing, and really are more fascist than they would ever admit....but:
Looky at what the corporate, 'so-called liberals' have been doing..

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Niggardly Bastard
Date: 31 Mar 13 - 01:46 PM

Obama sell us out again.
Why am I not surprised?
I'm sure our Obama supporters can justify it.
They can justify most anything if they put their pretty little heads to it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 31 Mar 13 - 01:48 PM

They usiually do...by the way, to get this piece of crap passed, this bill is being very quietly slipped into the Democratic Budget proposal!!!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 31 Mar 13 - 01:49 PM

typo..'usually'

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 31 Mar 13 - 03:56 PM

What's the matter??..Nobody wants to touch this one with a ten foot modem???

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Joe Offer
Date: 31 Mar 13 - 04:58 PM

Well, let's see if we can make good use of Songwronger's logic:

He says that giving people the opportunity to obtain contraceptives is genocide.

What about allowing them the opportunity to own guns?

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 31 Mar 13 - 05:59 PM

Here's one for ya', Joe....man is the only species on the planet who uses guns.....AND the only species on the planet who uses money to eat and stay alive!
I suppose when the need for one goes, the other will, too, as long as there will be the manipulators at the top, who just must have a piece of everybody's action!!
Everybody's fighting over the way money is handled....no wonder the manipulators at the top want everyone disarmed!
As for me, I just play music....and type stuff on here!

Regards...and Happy Resurrection Day!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Ebbie
Date: 31 Mar 13 - 06:48 PM

Man may be the only species who uses money for advancement but there are many, many species who use their own form of barter. We are not alone.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 31 Mar 13 - 08:30 PM

Like who???

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Ebbie
Date: 01 Apr 13 - 01:43 AM

Like birds, for instance. Many breeds.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 01 Apr 13 - 02:03 AM

Here ya go Ebbie. Animal Barter.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 01 Apr 13 - 01:28 PM

I thought that rather amusing....but I don't recall seeing monkeys or chimp, (Chongo may be exempt), carrying wallets..and the article said it was don't sometimes for 'boom-boom'....my original statement said, ".....AND the only species on the planet who uses money to eat and stay alive!"

Now, if there were 'pimp-chimps' who controlled the money, or bananas for a fee, maybe they would have a series of high tech clubs to beat down the competition, to enforce the law of banana distribution...then, the competition would need their own set to not be bullied unnecessarily ...then the 'pimp-chimps' would want to take them all away from the peasant chimps....hmmm, sounds familiar, doesn't it???

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 01 Apr 13 - 01:48 PM

Correction, (First paragraph, second line): "....the article said it was don't...", should read, "the article said it was DOESN'T..."

Sorry...

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 06 Jun 13 - 07:05 PM

From the World Socialist Website:

US health reform to slash care, leave millions uninsured

With the full implementation of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (ACA) less than seven months away, mounting evidence demonstrates that the health care reform signed into law by President Barack Obama in 2010 will result in deep cutbacks in medical care, while raising costs for the vast majority of ordinary Americans.

At the same time, millions of the uninsured who were promised health coverage will be left out in the cold altogether. While working families and the poor face an uncertain future as far as their health care is concerned, private insurance companies are gearing up for steep increases in premiums as the medical benefits provided under their policies shrink.

The Obama administration's health care overhaul will also reduce reimbursements to Medicare by more than $700 billion over 10 years, forcing drastic cutbacks to medical services and treatments for millions of American seniors that rely on the government program....

...individuals in about 90 percent of US states would likely face "significant premium increases." Based on responses from 17 insurance companies, the report estimates that individuals purchasing coverage on the individual market could face average premium increases of nearly 100 percent, with potential increases of 400 percent....

All the major players in the overhaul of the health care system—the corporations and health care industry, the Democratic Party and their supporters in the trade unions—have perpetrated what can only be called a conspiracy against the American people. They have attempted to pass off as a reform legislation that will reduce care and benefits and leave millions of people uninsured and impoverished.

Any nominally progressive component of the legislation has been long-since ripped away, leaving behind a contorted patchwork of rules and regulations that serve one main purpose: to slash costs for the government and corporations and boost the profits of the privately owned health care corporations, which already rake in $200 billion a year in profits.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 10 Sep 13 - 11:59 PM

Obamacare is turning America into a land of part-time jobs. People are suffering on account of it. From another forum:

I just received a letter from my job stating that no one will be working more than 30 hours a week.

I normally worked 48-52 hours per week generating 40 hours of regular pay, and 8-12 hours of overtime. Each hour I work averages an ADDITIONAL $11.25 in tips.

This means each week I will now be losing (20)(11.25) + (10)(10.50) + (10)(16.25) dollars per week.

I will now be losing an average of $492.50 per week.

This is nearly $2,000 per month.

Almost $24,000 a year ($23,640)

I can no longer afford my own private healthcare coverage --- thanks to Obamacare.

I will also have to find a second job, and DROP two classes at Stony Brook University.

So now I will make less money, work more hours, and it will take longer to complete my degree.

My life has been ruined by the parasites.

Obamacare just ruined my life.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 07 Oct 13 - 06:41 PM

US budget and debt talks to focus on cutting Social Security, Medicare

...Spokesmen for the Obama administration and congressional Republicans indicated Sunday they were preparing to shift the focus of the ongoing Washington budget and debt discussions to the major entitlement programs, Social Security and Medicare.

Both the Democrats and the Republicans are using the partial shutdown of federal government operations and the looming October 17 deadline for raising the federal debt ceiling, to create a crisis atmosphere to justify cuts that are overwhelmingly opposed by the American people....

...Neither party proposes even the slightest incursion into the wealth of the financial aristocracy. Both of them blame the dismal fiscal projections for the federal budget on "demographic" factors. In other words, working people are living too long, a "problem" which can only be resolved by raising the retirement age or, as a consequence of cuts in healthcare and living standards more generally, engineering a reduction in life expectancy.

http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2013/10/07/budg-o07.html


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 07 Oct 13 - 07:11 PM

((( yawn )))


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 07 Oct 13 - 08:02 PM

Exactly. The details of humanity's extinction bore "liberals." Obama's a fascist working to undo the legacy of FDR and LBJ, and you just wish he'd get it done. Go ahead and kill people off for "the good of the planet" or whatever insane reason you have for justifying fascism.

Obama is working with the Tea Party. Repeat. Obama is working with the Tea Party. They both want the same thing, to reduce retirement incomes and healthcare so that the poor die off.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 07 Oct 13 - 08:26 PM

JAYSUS!!

Nurse, take him back to his padded cell!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Bobert
Date: 07 Oct 13 - 08:29 PM

You have Ronald Reagan to thank for folks like the wrongman, Don... There were times when these delusional mentally ill people were getting treatment where they belonged... No more... They are out bothering sane people...

Oh well???

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Songwronger
Date: 07 Oct 13 - 10:38 PM

Firth and Bobert at their cogent best. The apex of liberal debate.

So, have you geezers done the math yet on Obamacare? You HAVE to buy health insurance now, so what's it going to cost you? Will you be eating dog food this time next year because of the "Affordable Care Act?" I hope so. That Obamadope has put both of you in a sound sleep. You need some dog food and cold water showers in the winter to wake you up.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Don Firth
Date: 07 Oct 13 - 11:22 PM

When that happens, Songwronger, I will apologize.

But until it does, see what you can do about a brain transplant, okay?

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: Andrez
Date: 07 Oct 13 - 11:46 PM

DF and others tempted to engage with the author of this thread. Please do us a favour and simply stop engaging with him and let this waste of a space thread die a sad and unlamented death. Please!

Cheers,

Andre


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Subject: RE: BS: Obamacare = Genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Oct 13 - 07:59 PM

To argue with this waste of space is like playing a violin in front of an Ox.
A recent poll indicates that many people were asked which was better, Obama Care or the Affordable health care act. They all said The affordable care act. SAME THING, STUPID!


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