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Folklore: Sigurd and Brynhild

MorwenEdhelwen1 18 Apr 13 - 07:50 PM
MorwenEdhelwen1 19 Apr 13 - 01:35 AM
GUEST,Grishka 19 Apr 13 - 08:19 AM
MorwenEdhelwen1 19 Apr 13 - 08:55 AM
MorwenEdhelwen1 19 Apr 13 - 09:01 AM
MorwenEdhelwen1 19 Apr 13 - 09:02 AM
MorwenEdhelwen1 19 Apr 13 - 09:30 PM
MorwenEdhelwen1 19 Apr 13 - 10:19 PM
GUEST,Grishka 20 Apr 13 - 06:39 AM
MorwenEdhelwen1 20 Apr 13 - 07:33 AM
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Subject: Folklore: Sigurd and Brynhild
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 18 Apr 13 - 07:50 PM

My urban fantasy novel based on the Norse versions of the story of Sigurd and the Nibelungs is going along pretty well. Recently I've been researching versions of the Sigurd legend (including Wagner's operas) in order to find some context for the changes I'm making. For example, Sigurd's mother's death and his upbringing by a dwarf in the woods comes originally from a German version recorded in the Thidrekssaga.

What I'm interested in finding out is the variations on the Sigurd tradition.

For example, just how different is the German Siegfried from the Norse Sigurd? (The Faroese one is radically different from any of the other versions of the story.) Does Sigurd ever bathe in dragon's blood in the Norse versions? Just how supernatural is Brynhild/Brünhild in the German version?


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Subject: RE: Folklore: Sigurd and Brynhild
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 01:35 AM

Refresh.


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Subject: RE: Folklore: Sigurd and Brynhild
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 08:19 AM

I'm afraid you have to read the sources yourself, to get the right idea. (Alternatively, you can read summaries, e.g. on Wikipedia, but don't tell your readers.)

Note that there is not "the German version". What you may be referring to is the Nibelungenlied, a medieval poetic rendering. The written Norse/Icelandic sources are also medieval. The stories are much older, so that they traveled freely in the Germanic-speaking parts of Europe.

The concept of "supernatural" vs. "realistic" in our modern understanding was not known to the authors in question. In the middle ages, historic accounts could well contain passages that most readers recognized as fictional ("legends"), and vice versa. In particular, poetry was always judged by poetic criteria. On the other hand, writers (more so than narrators) sometimes had to be careful not to offend the church by attributing too much "spiritual" power to an obviously non-Christian context.


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Subject: RE: Folklore: Sigurd and Brynhild
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 08:55 AM

@Grishka: I've read the Magnusson and Morris translation of the Volsunga Saga and the Sigurd poems (Reginsmal, Fafnismal, Sigrdrifumal, and Helreith Brynhildar) of the Poetic Edda. (Bellows translation- want to study history at uni and learn to read Old Norse, just so I can read these myths and legends in their original language (I'll search the translation I found anf read the other ones too).

I'm referring to versions; the Nibelungenlied and one found in the Thidrekssaga which has German roots but was written in Norway.


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Subject: RE: Folklore: Sigurd and Brynhild
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 09:01 AM

*two*

*down*


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Subject: RE: Folklore: Sigurd and Brynhild
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 09:02 AM

*and*


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Subject: RE: Folklore: Sigurd and Brynhild
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 09:30 PM


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Subject: RE: Folklore: Sigurd and Brynhild
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 19 Apr 13 - 10:19 PM

William Morris and Eirikr Magnusson translation of The Saga Of The Volsungs.


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Subject: RE: Folklore: Sigurd and Brynhild
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 20 Apr 13 - 06:39 AM

If you read all that, including the link in my message of 19 Apr 13 - 08:19 AM, you will be able to answer your question yourself, whereas I am not so sure about my own memory. Here a summary of the Thidrek.

Such folklore traveled much faster in all directions than we may expect. I guess that a good and successful variant of a story took perhaps one year to travel either way between present-day southern Germany and Norway, two years between Germanic and Romance languages (as in the case of the Arthur stories). In more than six centuries after the assumed first versions, set in present-day Germany and adjacent countries, geographical proximity no longer means faithful preservation.

Poets of all eras of course projected their own poetic vision, and the expectations of their audience and readers, on the pre-existing subject matters.

But with all your reading, you will be an expert yourself, as opposed to me. Do you do languages for your TAFE?


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Subject: RE: Folklore: Sigurd and Brynhild
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 20 Apr 13 - 07:33 AM

Thanks, Grishka. No, but I'm planning to next year at uni.


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