BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 01:49 PM

", the terrorist group is taking pains to clarify it has no intentions of desisting from trying to wipe Israel off the map."
Arutz Sheva (Hebrew: ערוץ שבע‎) (Channel Seven) is an Israeli media network identifying with Neo-Zionism.
ARUTZ SHEVA
""Maps be fucked" -says Christmas So you freely acknowledge that there is no Two State "solution""
I'm saying no such thing - I'm saying that 'maps of convenience ore not worth the paper they are printed on unless they represent the rights of all concerned to live in their traditional homelands.
"Yet it is only the Jews of Palestine that can be openly threatened with annihilation,"]
In practical terms it is the Palestinians who are actually being annihilated.
"been no new or additional refugee camps created since 1965."
No there haven't, but the stream of refugees is constant.
You've just been given a statement on the refugee situation - along with the link - go and read it
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 01:56 PM

"In practical terms it is the Palestinians who are actually being annihilated."



Another one of Jimmy The Stooge's lies.



Other than by Hamas, the Palestinian civilians are not being "annihilated"

Hamas fighters and their Palestinian civilian shields ARE bring killed.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 01:58 PM

Greggie,

"Bullshit, FKWT."

SOURCE, please.


YOUR saying it is so is not a valid supporting statement.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 02:18 PM

"Another principle in Hamas' concept of struggle is based on exploiting what it perceives as the Israeli and Western mental weaknesses concerning the value of human life. Hamas perceives that Israel is sensitive to incurring its own casualties (soldiers and civilians), as well as inflicting civilian casualties, which Hamas exploits by concealing itself among civilians and targeting Israeli civilians and soldiers alike. Concurrently, Resistance organizations such as Hamas emphasize their desire to die for their cause (shahada), which they present as a Muslim value. Hamas uses these same values to condone sacrificing civilians on the altar of protecting its people and weapons caches. Moreover, Hamas uses Palestinian civilian casualties and suffering to appeal Western moral values, in order to win over public opinion in the Arab world and in the West. "

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/uzi-rabi/israel-hamas-ceasefire_b_5673068.html?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000592

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 02:48 PM

Jim,
No there haven't, but the stream of refugees is constant.
You've just been given a statement on the refugee situation - along with the link - go and read it

Did you provide a link to support your claim that settlements create refugees?
Sorry I can not find it.
Please repeat.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 03:28 PM

Not enough dead Gazans to satisfy Hamas:

Rocket hits near Ashkelon, 2 hours before end of ceasefire

Read more: Rocket hits near Ashkelon, 2 hours before end of ceasefire | The Times of Israel http://www.timesofisrael.com/day-37-london-to-nix-some-arms-sales-to-israel-if-fighting-resumes/#ixzz3AImW8Tn1

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 03:47 PM

Israel Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu lashed out Wednesday at the UN Human Rights Council, accusing it of granting "legitimacy to terror organizations" by investigating Israel for alleged war crimes in Gaza.

"UNHRC gives legitimacy to murderous terror organizations like Hamas and Daash (Islamic State)," he said, accusing the rights body of overlooking "massacres" committed elsewhere in the Middle East in favor of investigating Israel for defending itself against rocket attacks from Gaza.

The UNHRC has selected Prof. William Schabas to head an investigation into Operation Protective Edge. Speaking in a 2013 panel, Schabas clearly revealed his great eagerness to bring about the prosecution of Israel over its actions in Gaza, even if that involved "twisting things and maneuvering" in the international legal arena.

Asked about the possibility of prosecuting Israel for "ecocide" as well, Schabas expressed optimism on gradually enlarging the scope of legal accusations against Israel. "Years ago there were no courts at all," he noted. "When [the term] 'genocide' was invented there was no court at all. There was no court for crimes against humanity, but we have them now. And with a bit of luck and by twisting things and maneuvering we can get them before the courts."

Schabas did not deny Wednesday, in an interview with Israel's Channel 2, that the international community has a double standard regarding Israel's conduct of war.

Channel 2's anchor, Danny Kushmaro, asked Schabas if there is not a double standard involved when that thousands of innocent civilians were killed in Chechnya by the Russians, and by NATO forces in Libya, yet there was "not one international investigation," whereas Israel acted in self defense in Gaza and two investigations have been launched in the course of six years.

"There are a lot of double standards in the international level," answered Schabas. "This is explained by the relative strength of the powers," he added, and noted that some claim there is a double standard in Israel's favor in the UN Security Council, where anti-Israel resolutions are vetoed.

Netanyahu: UN Grants Legitimacy to Terrorists

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 03:50 PM

Can you believe this shit from the UN!

"The United Nations slammed Israel for possibly committing war crimes in its fight against Hamas — and then backed that accusation by suggesting the Jewish nation ought to be sharing its Iron Dome defensive technology with the very terror group it's fighting."

Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/aug/1/un-condemns-israel-us-not-sharing-iron-dome-hamas/#ixzz3AIsYudjb

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 04:56 PM

Gaza City (Palestinian Territories) (AFP) - A 72-hour truce between Israel and Hamas teetered on the brink of collapse Wednesday with a rocket hitting the Jewish state just hours before it expired at midnight.

Shortly before the rocket hit, an official told AFP Israel was willing to extend the lull by another three days as the Palestinians expressed hope they could reach a deal in indirect talks brokered by Egypt.

Israel police and the army said the rocket hit an open area near Gaza's northern border shortly after sirens rang out across the south.

But Hamas, Gaza's Islamist de facto rulers, said its militants were not responsible.

"Hamas denies firing any rockets towards the occupation this evening," spokesman Sami Abu Zuhri said in a statement.

The attack jeopardised the hopes of millions who were banking on Egyptian mediators to clinch an agreement after days of frantic shuttle diplomacy between Israeli and Palestinian delegations.

Without agreement on an extension or a long-term truce, the two sides risk a resumption of the deadly fighting, which has killed more than 1,950 Palestinians and 67 on the Israeli side since July 8.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 05:00 PM

Note Hamas refers to Israel itself as "the occupation."

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 05:54 PM

Associated Press By MOHAMMED DARAGHMEH and TIA GOLDENBERG
4 minutes ago

CAIRO (AP) — Israel and Hamas agreed to extend a temporary cease-fire for five days, Egyptian and Palestinian officials said Wednesday, potentially averting renewed violence and permitting the sides to continue to negotiate a substantive deal to end the war in Gaza.

Egyptian mediators had been racing to pin down a long-term cease-fire as a temporary truce was set to expire at midnight. The Israeli military said five rockets were launched at Israel in the hours leading up to the end of the cease-fire.

Egypt's foreign ministry and the head of the Palestinian negotiating team announced the extension. A spokesman for Israel's prime minister had no immediate comment.

The cease-fire extension is meant to grant both sides additional time to negotiate a longer-term truce and a roadmap for the coastal territory.

The lull in violence has also been a welcome reprieve for Israelis and Palestinians living in Gaza. During the temporary cease-fire, Israel halted military operations in the war-battered coastal territory and Gaza militants stopped firing rockets, aside from the ones late Wednesday.

"We have agreed on a cease-fire for five days," said Azzam al-Ahmad, the head of the Palestinian delegation to the Cairo talks. He noted that there had been "significant progress" but that disagreements remained over the wording regarding security arrangements, reconstruction efforts for the Gaza Strip and the permissible fishing area.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 13 Aug 14 - 08:29 PM

On the first day of the ground invasion his battalion of 600 were involved in heavy fighting against the Hamas terrorists. "On a battlefield," he explained, "there is something called a dead zone. It's the territory that is controlled by your enemy and open to their fire. It's difficult to move from one point to another in a dead zone. But in this war," he continued, "we saw Hamas fighters moving through dead zones holding 5-year-old children in front of them as human shields. I am a father. I cannot even begin to understand the mentality of a fighter who would use a child to protect himself. Are these even men?"

He then recounted holding a machine gun. His soldiers had spotted a Hamas rocket about to be launched. He was about to order the soldiers to open fire when suddenly children started walking toward the soldiers right in front of the rocket. "My soldiers are eighteen and they're making life and death decisions, trying to decide, 'Should I allow children in Sderot to be bombed today by not firing on the rocket? But if I fire I may hurt a Palestinian child.'" He told his soldiers to stand down. The rocket was fired.

Read more: Battling dark emotion at the Gaza border | Shmuley Boteach | The Blogs | The Times of Israel http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/battling-dark-emotion-at-the-gaza-border/#ixzz3AK0e07jA

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Teribus
Date: 14 Aug 14 - 03:31 AM

Excuse me Christmas but what is the link between this apparent quote:

"", the terrorist group is taking pains to clarify it has no intentions of desisting from trying to wipe Israel off the map."

AND this:

"Arutz Sheva (Hebrew: ערוץ שבע‎) (Channel Seven) is an Israeli media network identifying with Neo-Zionism.
ARUTZ SHEVA"

I opened the link you supplied and saw no such quote - Was the quote more of your "made-up-shit" Christmas??

"""Maps be fucked" -says Christmas So you freely acknowledge that there is no Two State "solution"" - Teribus

I'm saying no such thing - I'm saying that 'maps of convenience ore not worth the paper they are printed on unless they represent the rights of all concerned to live in their traditional homelands." - pathetic Christmas exercise in wriggling to avoid answering a fairly simple question

Well Christmas the only problem with that is that the Palestinian Authority has conned the UN and useful idiots such as yourself into believing that after an extended and bloody period of 67 years the Palestinians are willing to settle for a "Two State" Solution offering less than the one they rejected in 1937 and in 1947. Looking at things reasonably, rationally and logically if some terrorist twat, or the mouthpiece of some terrorist twat came up to me and said they would settle for a Two State solution my very first response to him would be the question:

"Okay, let's see what you would propose as defining the borders of these two States."

Now for this twat to do that he would have had to have thought about it in conjunction with his fellow terrorist twats and they would have come up with something to show me - if they did indeed want to settle for a Two State solution - IF on the other-hand they did not then these twats would never have bothered charting out a map.

I have asked you to produce the Hamas/Fatah/Palestinian Authority map of THEIR vision of the Two State solution THEY CLAIM they are fighting for - so far nothing - WHY? Because no such map exists, because they are not looking at a Two State solution they are looking at the destruction and annihilation of Israel and the Jewish people - Read the Hamas Charter. It isn't going to happen of course, they (Hamas/Fatah/Palestinian Authority/Hezbollah/Iran) will keep the kettle boiling by launching attacks on Israel - right down until the very last Palestinian in Gaza and the West Bank has been killed.

By the way Christmas what on earth is a "traditional homeland"??? Where is yours for instance, having been born in Liverpool? If you claim elsewhere because of parentage then how far back is one allowed to go? Is there any official definition? Or is it as I suspect only more of your "made-up-shit".

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Teribus
Date: 14 Aug 14 - 07:08 AM

Oh Christmas on this "traditional homeland" "fairy tale" you have thrown into the equation - do you think that if you or I could select the best place for either of us to live then claim it as our "traditional homeland" on the grounds that we have visited/worked/lived there for a period of eighteen months that that would that satisfy your criteria? As far as right of return for an Arab from any Arab country that satisfies the UN's criteria for any Arab to claim right of return to live in Israel, or receive compensation from the State of Israel.

But on the other hand if you happen to be Jewish and if you happen to have been forcibly dispossessed and deported from villages, towns, cities in Arab countries where you and your forefathers have lived for hundreds of years then there is no compensation on offer, no right of return - Just up your street eh Christmas - one law for the goose completely another for the gander - the true two-faced, hypocritical, "socialists" way.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 14 Aug 14 - 07:41 AM

GAZA/JERUSALEM (Reuters) - A renewed truce between Israel and Hamas appeared to be holding on Thursday despite a shaky start, after both sides agreed to give Egyptian-brokered talks more time to try to end the Gaza war.

The Israeli military said Gaza militants breached the truce and fired eight rockets at Israel and that in response, aircraft targeted multiple "rocket launchers and terror sites" across the enclave.

Hamas official Izzat Reshiq denied the Palestinians had breached the truce, and denounced Israel's air strikes as "a violation of the calm".

No casualties were reported in any of the incidents, and hostilities ended by dawn.

A halt in more than a month of fighting, in which 1,945 Palestinians and 67 Israelis have been killed, had been set to expire at midnight on Wednesday. The violence is the deadliest since the two sides fought a three-week war in the winter of 2008-9.

View gallerySenior Hamas official and delegation leader Moussa …
Senior Hamas official and delegation leader Moussa Abu Marzouk (C) and other Palestinian negotiators …
At the last minute, the Palestinians announced in Cairo that the truce was extended by another five days for the sides to work out a long-term ceasefire, mediated by Egypt.

"Israel has accepted the ceasefire extension," said an Israeli official, speaking on condition of anonymity.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Aug 14 - 07:48 AM

"Oh Christmas on this "traditional homeland" "fairy tale" you have thrown into the equation - do you think that if you or I could select the best place for either of us to live then claim it as our "traditional homeland""
Thanks for reitrating the points that all of you have been making - the Palestinians have no place in their own home
Time for another "final solution"- wipe 'em all out eh ?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 14 Aug 14 - 07:52 AM

The Foreign Press Association (FPA) issued an astonishing protest yesterday about "blatant, incessant, forceful and unorthodox" intimidation of journalists in the Gaza Strip by Hamas. "In several cases," they complained, "foreign reporters working in Gaza have been harassed, threatened or questioned over stories." The FPA said this amounted to "denying readers and viewers an objective picture from the ground," adding "we are also aware that Hamas is trying to put in place a 'vetting' procedure that would, in effect, allow for the blacklisting of specific journalists. Such a procedure is vehemently opposed by the FPA." The statement raises a lot of questions. Here is one: why have British broadcasters not mentioned any of this to their viewers?

Hamas manipulated and intimidated the media in Gaza. Why was that kept from us?

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 14 Aug 14 - 08:06 AM

Jimmy boy,

The ARAB PALESTINIAN Homeland was formed in 1922-23 from 77%+ of Mandate Palestine.
TRANSJORDAN.


If the ARAB LEAGUE had not kept the Palestinian refugees in camps, they could have been settled into Arab nations.

The greater number of Jewish refugees from Arab lands WERE settled in Israel and other places.

The Hindu refugees from Pakistan and Bangladesh were settled in India.

The Muslim refugees from India were settled in Pakistan and Bangladesh.


Why do YOU insist that the present Palestinian refugees should be forced to stay in camps RUN BY THE UN, and NOT settled in other Arab nations?
WHY do YOU insist that ONLY the Palestinians should be returned to lands that they left, and give NOTHING to the LARGER number of Jews that were driven out in the same conflict?
WHY do YOU insist that the Palestinans can commit war crimes and NOT be held accountable, while the Israelis WHO THE PALESTINIANS SAY are following the rules of war and giving warnings should be accused of war crimes?


I think the answers are obvious, but let us hear them from YOU.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Teribus
Date: 14 Aug 14 - 08:20 AM

beardedbruce that is just Christmas's application of double standards.

By the way notice no mention at all by our team of "useful idiots" of that harmless Hamas rocket fired into Egypt that killed a 13 year old Egyptian girl.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 14 Aug 14 - 08:29 AM

Palestinian Islamic Scholar Explains Alleged Jewish Control of America

Blatant Jew hatred

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 14 Aug 14 - 11:11 AM

"The Palestinian Ambassador to the U.N. Human Rights Council, Ibrahim Khraishi admitted on a live television interview recently, in a moment of extreme candor, that Hamas are the ones perpetrating war crimes against Israel and not the other way round.

His comments, which were made on a Palestinian Authority TV interview in July and translated by MEMRI, are particularly interesting as the U.N., over the last few days, has put together a panel of so-called experts to compile a report on alleged Israeli war crimes against the Palestinians. The claims arise over Israel's actions during its recent defensive war against Hamas in Gaza, and its response to the launching of thousands of rockets and the digging of dozens of terror tunnels.

For fear of being taken to the International Criminal Court for prosecution, Khraishi advised his interviewer that it was best all round if the issue was not raised with the U.N. In his own words, "each and every" Palestinian missile fired on Israel constitutes "a crime against humanity," while he admitted that Israel "followed the legal procedures" when carrying out retaliatory attacks against Hamas terrorists, who purposely embed themselves within civilian populations.

Even a Hamas spokesman admitted on a TV interview recently that: "The Israelis warned them to evacuate their homes before the bombardment. As for the missiles launched from our side, we never warn anyone about where these missiles are about to fall or about the operations we carry out."

U.N. Watch, an NGO body that monitors the U.N., reported that Ambassador Ibrahim Khraishi wasn't coy in his assertions of Palestinian war crimes. As he said himself:

"I am not a candidate in any Palestinian elections, so I don't need to win popularity among the Palestinians. The missiles that are now being launched against Israel, each and every missile constitutes a crime against humanity, whether it hits or misses, because it is directed at civilian targets."

Khraishi spelled out very clearly the fact that, in his opinion, the Israeli side followed proper war protocol, unlike the terrorist factions occupying Gaza:

"Please note that many of our people in Gaza appeared on TV and said that the Israelis warned them to evacuate their homes before the bombardment. In such a case, if someone is killed, the law considers it a mistake rather than an intentional killing because [the Israelis] followed the legal procedures."

The new U.N. commission, which was just announced, is being headed by well-known anti-Israel genocide expert William Schabas. Undoubtedly, it will make a mockery of the real facts on the ground in the ongoing conflict between the Jewish State and the Palestinians, and will likely echo the previous discredited inquiry chaired by Richard Goldstone.

based on past performance, the U.N. is unlikely to bring Hamas or the Palestinian Authority to task for firing thousands of rockets indiscriminately on Israeli towns and villages. The Hamas policy, which it does not deny, is to purposely fire those rockets from schools and mosques in the hope that Israeli retaliations would cause maximum Palestinian civilian casualties and garner world support against Israel.

The fact that Israel is being taken to task by the U.N. for alleged war crimes in Gaza is absurd, and a disgrace to the United Nations whose whole purpose is supposed to be to champion human rights and not oppress them."

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 14 Aug 14 - 05:26 PM

UNRWA has become a convenient surrogate for terrorist organizations, led by Hamas, which was chosen in successive elections to lead the workers union and the UNRWA teachers union, as the key mentors who influence generations of Palestinian refugee descendants about engaging in 'right of return' through jihad, to Arab villages that existed before 1948.

The Hamas takeover of the UNRWA institutions and UNRWA staff should set off alarms regarding the possibility of funding given by donor countries (primarily the United States) finding its way to financing the salaries of Hamas and Islamic Jihad activists. Beyond the issue of terrorism, UNRWA and the Palestinian leadership assist through their policies in perpetuating the problem and misery of the refugees. The Palestinian leadership has made it clear that the government will not settle the refugees in the settlement areas evacuated by Israel during the 2005 Disengagement, in order to maintain their right "to return."

Improving the conditions of the refugees does not reduce from the demand for return or compensation, as it is maintained for the Palestinian refugees currently living outside the camps (as well as for Jews who were expelled from Arab countries). It seems as though the interests of the Hamas government is to use UNRWA facilities and resources, to prevent the dismantling of the refugee camps, despite the severe distress that leads to extremism, with the plan of returning to Palestine. In a situation such as this, there is no justification for the continued status quo of UNRWA, if the organization sees its entire purpose in maintaining the misery of refugees in the camps, and certainly after the deep involvement of the terrorist organization in the last month has been exposed.

An immediate and independent investigation is required into the infiltration of Palestinian terrorist groups into UNRWA, the use of its facilities for the purpose of terrorist attacks and rocket storage as well as the transfer of UNRWA equipment to be used by Gaza terrorist organizations and last but not least, the indoctrination of the future generations to war and strife.

UNRWA as a Convenient Surrogate for Terrorists Organizations

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 15 Aug 14 - 10:27 AM

So, the truth begins to come out, useful idiots take note:

A Hamas official inadvertently acknowledged on Thursday that the group had strong-armed journalists in Gaza into a reporting style that suited its narrative, keeping many under surveillance and kicking out of the territory those who filmed the launching of rockets at Israel.

Hamas admits intimidating foreign press who reported wrong 'message'

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 15 Aug 14 - 01:23 PM

"The Palestinian Ambassador to the U.N. Human Rights Council, Ibrahim Khraishi admitted on a live television interview recently, in a moment of extreme candor, that Hamas are the ones perpetrating war crimes against Israel and not the other way round."
You havn't provided the link here as you did on the other threar - prhaps because he said no such thing
He actually said that both sides were guilty of war crimes - a head count to the total casualty figures will show which side is in front
Both sides have also been accused of strong-arm tactics as far as reporting the war.
Israel has just got rid of its home-based Human Rights group Bar tSelem for not coming up with the right reports
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 15 Aug 14 - 01:28 PM

Jimmy boy,

YOU STATE:

"You havn't provided the link here as you did on the other threar - prhaps because he said no such thing
He actually said that both sides were guilty of war crimes - a head count to the total casualty figures will show which side is in front
"

YOU can't have it both ways: If you have what he said, YOU HAVE THE LINK- so post it.

If YOU don't have the link, your statement is obviously a lie- HOW COULD YOU KNOW WHAT HE SAID???





And the Palestinian Civilian Casualties are the responsibility of Hamas, both by direct action ( killing dissidents tunnel workers, and with anti-personnel warheads) and by using them as human shields.

So Hamas is FAR in front in the War Crimes race.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Greg F.
Date: 15 Aug 14 - 02:09 PM

g'night, Bullshot. Time for a nap- you're getting cranky again.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 15 Aug 14 - 09:12 PM

CONFIRMED: TOP U.N. OFFICIAL ADMITS HAMAS USES HUMAN SHIELDS. Watch the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CvaZ1a9wW3Y

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 16 Aug 14 - 02:21 AM

"YOU can't have it both ways: If you have what he said, YOU HAVE THE LINK- so post it.
"Hamas are the ones perpetrating war crimes against Israel and not the other way round."
You posted the link on which the Hamas spokesman made his supposed statement - he did not make the statement you claim he did - why on earth should I re-post it
You invented it - you are getting as stupidly dishonest as Keith by lying on what you yourself have put up -
The pressure of responsibility of acting as unpaid spokesman for Israeli atrocities seems to be getting to you - you really are not very good at this, are you?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 16 Aug 14 - 09:53 AM

In a somewhat unorthodox summer camp in the Gaza Strip, children aged between six and 16 picked up AK-47s and engaged in a series of quasi-military drills, including a lively game of "kidnap an Israeli soldier" in the sand dunes of Rafah.

An AFP correspondent listed some of the activities the Islamic Jihad summer camp offers its enrollees: Weapons use, jumping over fire and crawling under barbed wire, all performed to the tune of exploding charges.

Gaza kids play 'kidnap Israeli soldier' in summer camp

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 16 Aug 14 - 10:07 AM

An excellent analysis of Hamas' strategy:

"Sometimes one hears that the Hamas strategy is difficult to understand, appears irrational, is self-defeating, and so forth. After all, they are not going to destroy Israel with their rockets, and every time there the conflict heats up they end up with a huge amount of physical damage to Gaza. But I think the strategy is not so complicated and makes sense."

Hamas strategy revealed (it isn't so complicated)

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 16 Aug 14 - 01:33 PM

This is how Hamas negotiates a cessation of hostilities:

"The Israelis have two choices: accept our demands, or prepare for a war of attrition with us, Hamas senior official Osama Hamdan said, according to Israel Radio."

Read more: Hamas threatens war of attrition if terms not met | The Times of Israel http://www.timesofisrael.com/hamas-threatens-war-of-attrition-if-terms-not-met/#ixzz3AZrcXTYJ

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Greg F.
Date: 16 Aug 14 - 05:14 PM

Mark Levine:Author; Professor, Middle Eastern History, UC Irvine & Center for MES, Lund University

A Dear Jon (Voight) Letter About Gaza and the History of the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict
Posted: 08/15/2014 10:36 pm EDT Updated: 08/15/2014 10:59 pm EDT

Dear Jon Voight,

We write to you as admirers of your work for many years. We are also professors of modern Middle Eastern studies, specializing on the history and contemporary realities of Israel, Zionism and Palestine, and between the two of us, we have written and edited over half a dozen books on the country and the two peoples who are destined -- or doomed, depending on your point of view -- to share it.

We have read your open letter to Javier Bardem, Penelope Cruz and other critics of the latest Israeli bombing and invasion of Gaza, in response to their own open letter condemning Israeli actions during the war. Your passion for defending Israel is clearly as great as your passion for acting. However, behind your passion is a view of Israel's history and current actions that are utterly at odds with the actual history and present-day realities in the country. They are simply dead-wrong, and your belief in them has led you to adopt views that will ultimately -- and at this rate, sooner rather than later -- doom, not defend, Israel. Moreover, while you have laudably said that they or other actors should not face industry sanctions for standing up to Israel, we believe that the intensity of your criticism, coupled with the inaccuracy of the arguments, not only exacerbates the rewriting of the conflict's history in the mainstream media but contributes both to a toxic atmosphere of hatred against Palestinians and to a purported blacklist against them.

Let us begin with your opening argument:

They are obviously ignorant of the whole story of Israel's birth, when in 1948 the Jewish people were offered by the UN a portion of the land originally set aside for them in 1921, and the Arab Palestinians were offered the other half. The Arabs rejected the offer, and the Jews accepted, only to be attacked by five surrounding Arab countries committed to driving them into the sea. But the Israelis won. The Arabs tried it again in 1967, and again in 1973, launching a sneak attack on the holiest Jewish holiday. Each time the Jews prevailed but not without great loss of life. And when Israel was not fighting a major war, it was defending itself against terrorist campaigns.

This is the traditional narrative of Israel's birth, part of what Israeli hisitorian Simha Flapan described as the "myths" surrounding Israel in his famous 1987 book The Birth of Israel: Myths and Realities. However, this is a distortion of the actual history, which saw Zionism arrive on the soil of a Palestine that was already in the midst of its own modernization, against which what Israeli sociologist Gershon Shafir describes as a "militant [Zionist] nationalist movement" developed, deploying the "conquest of labor" and then the "conquest of land" to increasingly powerful effect once the British conquered Palestine in 1917.

After three decades of British rule that was legally committed -- through the Balfour Declaration and the Palestine Mandate -- to facilitate the creation of a Jewish "national home" at the expense of fostering Palestinian Arab nationalism, outright civil war became inevitable. When war finally came, the Zionist leadership "accepted" the terms of the 1947 Partition Plan. In reality, they had little intention of actually fulfilling them, and over the next year, through intercommunal conflict and then all-out war, three quarters of a million Palestinians were permanently forced from their homes, and over 500 villages were destroyed.

As for your claims that Israel was attacked by surrounding countries determined to throw it into the sea, this too is belied by the historical record. As Oxford University professors Avi Shlaim and Eugene Rogan demonstrated in their book The War for Palestine, Rewriting the History of 1948, minimal and badly trained and equipped forces were sent; their main goals were to prevent themselves from looking like collaborators and their rival Mufti of Jerusalem from establishing a state, and, where possible, to take whatever territory they could for themselves. Most important here, Jordan -- the one neighbor with an effective, British-run army -- had reached a modus vivendi with the Zionist/Israeli leadership in which it would take over the West Bank and leave Israel the rest of the country. The only exception was Jerusalem, about which the two sides couldn't agree and which therefore became the scene of the worst fighting of the war.

Let's leave aside the fact that you don't mention the 1956 tripartite invasion of Egypt by Israel, France and the UK, which not even Israelis argue was a defensive war. Similar to your description of 1948, your description of 1967 as the "Arab trying again" to destroy Israel is historically inaccurate. There were certainly many threats emanating from Arab capitals in the late spring of 1967, but ultimately it was Israel, not the Arab states, that clearly launched a "sneak attack." The CIA even predicted that Israel could wipe out the combined forces of the surrounding states in roughly five days, which is exactly what happened.

While presented to the world as a war of survival, 1967 was in fact a war of conquest and expansion. How do we know this? Quite simply because that's just what Israel did: It conquered and occupied the West Bank, Gaza, Sinai and the Golan Heights and proceeded to settle them intensively, particularly in the biblical heartland of the West Bank.

Here, Mr. Voight, it is absolutely crucial to understand that if Israel were really afraid to turn over the West Bank to Palestinians for security reasons -- that is, if the occupation were in fact about security -- it could have maintained a military occupation to this day without violating international law. But instead it began a settlement enterprise that came to dominate Israeli political life, eventually placing well over half a million settlers in the West Bank and East Jerusalem, in clear contravention of international law, which expressly forbids transferring civilians from one country into an occupied territory.



Continued Here

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Aug 14 - 08:09 AM

Jimmy boy,

"he did not make the statement you claim he did"

Oh? YOU have to at least show WHAT HE SAID to make this claim.


The burden of proof that your statement is true ( which, based on your history is slim to none) is on YOU- IF HE DID NOT SAY THIS, what did he say? How do you come up with YOUR conclusion that a direct quote is nonexistent- SHOW ME THE TRANSCRIPT OF HIS STATEMENT from a reputable source.

You are known as a liar- why should anyone think this is any different from your other lies?

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Aug 14 - 08:15 AM

The truth about Hamas sometimes emerges from the hidden tunnels in which the terrorist group has concealed it. After numerous appearances by Hamas political leader Khaled Meshaal on CNN television denying that Hamas uses people as human shields to protect its fighters, a Hamas publication found in a tunnel states the opposite.

Among the documents seized by the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) in Gaza is a handbook on urban warfare issued by the Shuja'iya Brigade of the Al-Qassan Brigades of Hamas. It issues instructions to citizens on how to make explosives, on hiding them in places such as television sets and wall mounts, and on planting them in locations that IDF personnel were unlikely to expect.

The handbook recognizes that Israel tries to minimize Palestinian civilian casualties and limits its use of weapons to avoid this. It also realized that information about such casualties and the destruction of civilian facilities increases the hatred of Israel by Palestinians.

Not surprisingly, except perhaps to some in the mass media, Hamas instructs Palestinians to describe their dead always as "innocent civilians," and to refrain from indicating that rockets are being launched from populated civilian areas. No pictures must be shown of rockets fired into Israel from Gaza cities.

A Hamas video directs individuals, "Be sure to humanize the Palestinian suffering."

Many in the "international community" are hesitant to acknowledge the reality of the tactics of Hamas. This was noticeable in the remarks of House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, who informed CNN that the Qataris have "told me over and over again that Hamas is a humanitarian organization."

Unstated is the fact that this information may come from the heroic Hamas leader Khaled Meshaal, who lives and operates in Qatar, not in Gaza. It also ignores the fact that the U.S. administration designated Hamas as a "foreign terrorist organization" in 1997.

The mainstream media persist in viewing acceptance of the Hamas conditions, the end of the Israeli "blockade" of Gaza and of limits on border crossings, and the release of prisoners in Israeli jail as essential for a ceasefire to last. Much sympathy has resulted for an end to the "blockade."

But two things are pertinent. One is that the blockade was imposed to prevent the import of material, cement as well as arms, that Hamas might use for military purposes. The extraordinary discovery of more than thirty tunnels – a sophisticated military infrastructure that has used thousands of tons of cement – for infiltrating Israel amply shows the problem.

In addition, while the terrorists hide in the tunnels, civilians have been used as human shields to prevent Israeli attacks on mosques, hospitals, and schools.

A second issue relates to the thousands of rockets, the exact number perhaps more than 10,000, that Hamas possesses, and more than 3,500 of which were used in attacks against Israel in the month of July. The question arises: how did Hamas get those rockets, and from whom, if there was a complete blockade?

Apart from these specific issues, the most important gap in much of the commentary on the Gaza situation is the clear statement on the nature of Hamas and the Islamic Jihad (IJ) movement in Palestine – regardless of whether one considers what is supposed to be the "political wing," which is supposed to be a moderate, restraining element, or the military units (namely, the Al-Qassam Brigades and the Al-Quds [Saraya al-Quds] Brigades).

Who is responsible for firing the thousands of rockets, and which group has the main stockpile of weapons?

There is no secret about the objective of these related groups: the destruction of the State of Israel, and the creation of an Islamic state within the borders of the pre-1948 British Mandated Palestine. The secretary general of Islamic Jihad, Ramadan Shallah, has declared that he will never accept the existence of the state of Israel, and that "it is our sacred duty to fight."

The field commander of IJ, the 26-year-old Abu Malek, promotes "the liberation of all Palestine from the sea to the river."

The clue to the intentions of Hamas is given in the Hamas Charter of 1988, a mixture of anti-Semitism and hatred of Israel. Using the Avalon Project translation of the Charter or Covenant, one can discern the stated objectives of Hamas. Only a few selections, sometimes in oblique language, are necessary to understand this.

Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it. Hamas (the Islamic Resistance Movement) strives to raise the banner of Allah over every inch of Palestine. The Day of Judgment will not come about until Muslims fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say, "There is a Jew behind me; come and kill him."

The Hamas Charter gives an answer to all the well-meaning groups and individuals who call for a peace conference. It declares that the land of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf consecrated for future Muslim generations until Judgment Day. Rejecting calls for an international conference to solve the "Palestinian" question, it declares that there is no solution for the Palestinian question except through jihad.

Initiatives, proposals, and international conferences are all a waste of time and are vain endeavors.

The mass media will perhaps be surprised to learn from the Charter that Jews have taken control of the world media, news agencies, publishing houses, and broadcasting stations. Objective historians may be surprised that Jews have stirred revolutions in various parts of the world and were behind the French Revolution, the Communist Revolution, and most others. All this for "sabotaging societies and achieving Zionist interests."

The Charter informs us of future developments. The Zionist plan is limitless. After Palestine, the Zionists aspire to expand from the Nile to the Euphrates. The Islamic Resistance Movement must prevent this, and to leave the "circle of struggle with Zionism is high treason."

The question arises: can members of Hamas, who believe that the "Jews are behind each and every catastrophe on the face of the earth," be genuinely interested in any possible reconciliation with Israel when destruction of the Jewish state is at the core of their concern?

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Aug 14 - 12:58 PM

JERUSALEM (AP) — Israel's Shin Bet security service says it has thwarted a Hamas coup attempt in the West Bank, though it provided few details.

The service says that it arrested more than 90 Hamas operatives in an alleged plot to carry out attacks against Jews and wrest control from Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas.

It says it also confiscated weapons and more than $170,000. It says the plot was orchestrated by a senior Hamas official based in Turkey and that local officials were aware.

Hamas officials had no immediate comment to the claim.

Hamas overtook the Gaza Strip in 2007 from forces loyal to Abbas. It is currently negotiating to Cairo over a cease-fire to formally end the Gaza war.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Aug 14 - 01:56 PM

"The Hamas-run health ministry said 10 people, including nine children under the age of 12, were killed and 46 wounded in the blast at a park in the Shati refugee camp on the outskirts of Gaza City.

Israeli and Palestinian officials are blaming each other for that attack and a separate one, which Gaza officials reported at a nearby hospital outpatient clinic.

"This incident was carried out by Gaza terrorists whose rockets fell short and hit al-Shifa Hospital and the Beach (Shati) camp," said Lt. Col. Peter Lerner, an Israeli army spokesman.

He said the explosion in the park was caused when a rocket launched by Gaza militants misfired. Palestinian police and civil defence said an Israeli missile hit as children were playing on a swing set.
"

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 14 - 10:26 PM

Sources for 18 Aug 14 - 08:15 AM   & 18 Aug 14 - 01:56 PM Cut-N-Pastes, Bullshot - or did you just make'em up as per usual?

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Aug 14 - 04:20 AM

"Oh? YOU have to at least show WHAT HE SAID to make this claim.
Go and listen to what he said on your clip - it's an oral statement with translation
He actually said that both sides had committed war crimes, not, as you claimed, one and not the other
Maybe it's the writing that confused you - perhaps you should get the reader your mates use to read it out for you.
"SHOW ME THE TRANSCRIPT OF HIS STATEMENT from a reputable source."
Its on the film you put up - not a reputable source in your case, I admit
Hirsute prick
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Aug 14 - 04:23 AM

Speaking of reputable sources - much of your information is sourced fromthe extremist Zionist propaganda website 'Gatestone' - you've just treated us to a chunk of it (though you've carefully avoided not linking it.
"The truth about Hamas sometimes emerges from the hidden tunnels"
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Aug 14 - 05:20 AM

Perhaps it's time to remind those who support Israel with claims of "Antisemitism", that Zioist groups like The Gatestone Institute, and the Israeli Administration are the same "extremtst right" that Einstein's letter warned of following the birth of the State of Israel.
It was the extremist right who herded six million Jews to their fate in the gas chambers.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 19 Aug 14 - 06:38 AM

The Gaschambers Gang were a different entity entirely from Gatestone &c.

There isn't only one sort of "extremist right", any more than only one sort of "extremist left" — otherwise Jim wouldn't always be so touchy & evasive when asked which bit of the latter he regards himself as part of. His politics, he always declares, are nobody's biznis but his own; to which I always riposte, that is pretty rich in a discussion of a political matter; & that if anyone accused him of being aligned anywhere but somewhere on the Left he would be mortally offended.

Can you deny any of this, Mr 'MYOB' Carroll?

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 19 Aug 14 - 07:24 AM

Jimmy,

YOU know far more than I about Gatestone. I don't go there- I get my pastes from such rabble as AP and Reuters.


SO POST THE LINK YOU CLAIM SAYS WHAT YOU POSTED- I have not seen YOU post any sources, just make unsubstantiated comments.


We KNOW you can lie- Can you show that you are capable of telling the truth?

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 19 Aug 14 - 03:00 PM

Gaza City (Palestinian Territories) (AFP) - Israel and Palestinian militants resumed fire across the Gaza border on Tuesday, sparking panic across the war-torn enclave where residents fled for cover as Israeli aircraft struck.

A military spokeswoman told AFP that two rockets hit southern Israel during the late afternoon and early evening -- several hours before a 24-hour truce was to expire -- and two more were intercepted by missile defences.

Israel ordered its negotiators back from ceasefire talks in Cairo and the military said warplanes hit Gaza. They hit at least 10 targets, according to army radio.

The fighting shattered nine days of relative quiet in the skies over Gaza and cast a dark shadow over Egyptian-mediated efforts to hammer out a longer-term truce.

The chief Palestinian negotiator in Cairo said on Tuesday that no progress had been made.

The Palestinian delegation presented their demands for a truce to Egyptian mediators and were awaiting Israel's response, said the official, Azzam al-Ahmed.

"There has been no progress," he said of Tuesday's talks. "Matters have become more complicated."

The renewal of Israeli strikes spread panic among Gaza residents.

An AFP reporter saw hundreds of Palestinians streaming out of Shejaiya, an eastern area of Gaza City which has been devastated by more than a month of fighting between Israel and the militant Islamist Hamas movement.

More poured out of the Zeitun and Shaaf areas, alarmed by a series of explosions and heading to shelter in UN schools, local witnesses said.

Five Palestinians were wounded, three in the northern area of Beit Lahiya -- two of them children -- and two boys aged six and nine in the southern city of Rafah, the Gaza emergency services spokesman said.

There was no immediate claim of responsibility for firing the rockets, two of which hit near the city of Beersheva, which is home to around 200,000 Israelis.

An Israeli official said the negotiating team had been ordered back from Cairo where Egypt has been pushing for a decisive end to the Gaza bloodshed, which has killed more than 2,000 Palestinians and 67 on the Israeli side.

However, there was no immediate confirmation the team had left.

"The Cairo process was based on the premise of a total ceasefire," another official told AFP. "If Hamas fires rockets, the Cairo process has no basis."

Israel has vowed not to negotiate under fire, and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has warned there would be "a very strong response" to any resumption of rocket attacks.
…
Hamas dismissed his remarks as having "no weight".

- 'Sabotaging the talks' -

In Gaza, Hamas spokesman Sami Abu Zuhri denied the Islamist movement had fired rockets over the border Tuesday, accusing Israel of trying to sabotage the truce talks.

"We don't have any information about firing rockets from Gaza. The Israeli raids are intended to sabotage the negotiations in Cairo," he told AFP.

The talks in Cairo centre on an Egyptian proposal that meets some of the Palestinian demands, such as easing Israel's eight-year blockade on Gaza, but puts off debate on other thorny issues until later.

Although temporary truce agreements have brought relief to millions on both sides of the border, the drawn-out waiting and fear of an all-out resumption of fighting has tested people's patience.

"No one here has any hope," said Riyad Abul Sultan, a father of 10 with thick curly hair, smoking as he sat on a flimsy mattress at a UN school in Gaza.

Amnesty International, meanwhile, renewed its appeal for access to Gaza.

"Valuable time has already been lost and it is essential that human rights organisations are now able to begin the vital job of examining allegations of war crimes," it said.

The Palestinians say agreement over a long-term arrangement in Gaza has been delayed by Israeli foot-dragging over key issues.

Israel wants Gaza demilitarised although the subject does not figure in the Egyptian proposal as seen by AFP.

- Hamas shift -

Hamas had repeatedly warned it would not extend the temporary ceasefire again, pressing for immediate gains that would allow it to claim concessions from Israel after the devastating war, which began on July 8.

Egypt's proposal calls for both sides to immediately cease fire and includes provisions relating to opening the borders to allow for free movement of people, goods and construction materials, as well as a clause on regulating the economic crisis within the impoverished enclave.

But crucially, it postpones discussions on issues such as a port and airport for another month, until "after calm and stability returns," along with talks over exchanging the remains of two Israeli soldiers for the release of Palestinian prisoners.

Meanwhile, Jordan's national carrier confirmed Tuesday it had resumed flights to Tel Aviv after suspending them for a month due to rocket fire near the runway of Israel's main airport.

Royal Jordanian, which operates 20 flights a week to Tel Aviv, said it resumed normal operations on Sunday.

The rocket strike had prompted major US and European airlines to halt flights to Israel for several days in July over safety fears.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 19 Aug 14 - 03:22 PM

The Israeli Defense Forces confirmed today that three rockets were fired from Gaza on Be'er Sheva, one of the largest cities in the south of Israel, just hours before a ceasefire deal was to be signed by both parties in Cairo.

Fortunately, the rockets fell in open areas between Netivot and Be'er Sheva and no injuries or damage were reported. This is the second time Israel has come under fire from Hamas during a supposed quiet period. On Thursday, eight rockets were fired at the Jewish State in defiance of the agreed truce.

Obviously, Israel can't let this breach to their security go unnoticed or unpunished and Prime Minister Netanyahu Benjamin Netanyahu and Defense Minister Moshe Ya'alon have ordered the IDF to respond to the rocket fire.

Reuters reported today that as of this morning, the indirect negotiations in Cairo, between Hamas and Israel, were going well as the sides struggled to hash out a long term deal that would bring permanent quiet to Israel's southern residents as well as the people of Gaza.

Israel announced just before the three rockets were fired today that it had agreed to extend the temporary truce for another 24 hours while the two sides tried to reach an agreement.

In terms of a response to the incessant fire on Israel from Hamas Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, told reporters:

"We are prepared for every scenario. The IDF has made arrangements for a forceful response if the fighting resumes. In the Middle East you need a combination of force and resilience. The IDF has the necessary force, and the 'eternal people' have proved they are not afraid of a winding road. The combination of perseverance and fortitude will help us reach the aim of the operation – security and safety for all Israelis."

Under the circumstances, a lasting agreement between Israel and Hamas is looking less likely.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: bobad
Date: 20 Aug 14 - 07:07 AM

The puppet masters behind the terrorists:

Qatar has threatened to expel Hamas politburo chief Khaled Mashaal if the Gaza-based terror organization agrees to the current terms of the ceasefire framework put forth by Egypt.

Read more: Qatar reportedly threatened to expel Mashaal | The Times of Israel http://www.timesofisrael.com/qatar-reportedly-threatened-to-expel-mashaal/#ixzz3AvgGNqVu

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Aug 14 - 07:57 AM

"otherwise Jim wouldn't always be so touchy & evasive when asked which bit of the latter he regards himself as part of"
Not touchy Mike - just not prepared to give people like yourself a diversion tactic to avoid argument.
My politics are immaterial - I belong to nothing, I tend not to vote, I read whatever I can from whatever political quarter
I know this - you are an apologist for Thatcher - Thatcher befriended Pinochet and helped prevented put him on trial for war crimes, while at the same time declaring him to be a champion of democracy - Pinochet overthrew an elected government and tortured and murdered thousands of opponents.
You and yours sneer at opponents of your arguments as being "lefty" - if that is the case, I'll take your word for it and wear the badge with pride.
Bruce the Braindead
"SO POST THE LINK YOU CLAIM SAYS WHAT YOU POSTED"
Sighhhh!
Read what I wrote -
You claimed the Hamas ambassador said that it was Hamas and not Israel who were guilty of war crimes
You posted a link purporting to be him saying it.
The link shows that in fact he said that both bere guilty of committing war crimes
I posted nothing.
If you can't be bothered to follow your own links, piss off.
If this is too difficult for you, please get whoever reads these posts for you to explain them at the same time - it really would help you to follow what is going on.
Still no comment on Israeli death squads
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 20 Aug 14 - 08:04 AM

Jimmy,

YOU said I had NOT posted the link earlier- WHICH LIE DO YOU WANT TO PRESENT?


"From: Jim Carroll - PM
Date: 15 Aug 14 - 01:23 PM

"The Palestinian Ambassador to the U.N. Human Rights Council, Ibrahim Khraishi admitted on a live television interview recently, in a moment of extreme candor, that Hamas are the ones perpetrating war crimes against Israel and not the other way round."
You havn't provided the link here as you did on the other threar - prhaps because he said no such thing
He actually said that both sides were guilty of war crimes - a head count to the total casualty figures will show which side is in front
Both sides have also been accused of strong-arm tactics as far as reporting the war.
Israel has just got rid of its home-based Human Rights group Bar tSelem for not coming up with the right reports
Jim Carroll"


THEN YOU claim he did not say what you claim I did not link to.

Then YOU claim the link YOU WILL NOT GIVE shows something other than what I claim.



SO SHOW THE LINK, YOU LYING BASTARD.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 20 Aug 14 - 08:12 AM

"The Palestinian Ambassador to the U.N. Human Rights Council, Ibrahim Khraishi admitted on a live television interview recently, in a moment of extreme candor, that Hamas are the ones perpetrating war crimes against Israel and not the other way round.

His comments, which were made on a Palestinian Authority TV interview in July and translated by MEMRI, are particularly interesting as the U.N., over the last few days, has put together a panel of so-called experts to compile a report on alleged Israeli war crimes against the Palestinians. The claims arise over Israel's actions during its recent defensive war against Hamas in Gaza, and its response to the launching of thousands of rockets and the digging of dozens of terror tunnels.

For fear of being taken to the International Criminal Court for prosecution, Khraishi advised his interviewer that it was best all round if the issue was not raised with the U.N. In his own words, "each and every" Palestinian missile fired on Israel constitutes "a crime against humanity," while he admitted that Israel "followed the legal procedures" when carrying out retaliatory attacks against Hamas terrorists, who purposely embed themselves within civilian populations.

Even a Hamas spokesman admitted on a TV interview recently that: "The Israelis warned them to evacuate their homes before the bombardment. As for the missiles launched from our side, we never warn anyone about where these missiles are about to fall or about the operations we carry out."

U.N. Watch, an NGO body that monitors the U.N., reported that Ambassador Ibrahim Khraishi wasn't coy in his assertions of Palestinian war crimes. As he said himself:

"I am not a candidate in any Palestinian elections, so I don't need to win popularity among the Palestinians. The missiles that are now being launched against Israel, each and every missile constitutes a crime against humanity, whether it hits or misses, because it is directed at civilian targets."

Khraishi spelled out very clearly the fact that, in his opinion, the Israeli side followed proper war protocol, unlike the terrorist factions occupying Gaza:

"Please note that many of our people in Gaza appeared on TV and said that the Israelis warned them to evacuate their homes before the bombardment. In such a case, if someone is killed, the law considers it a mistake rather than an intentional killing because [the Israelis] followed the legal procedures."

The new U.N. commission, which was just announced, is being headed by well-known anti-Israel genocide expert William Schabas. Undoubtedly, it will make a mockery of the real facts on the ground in the ongoing conflict between the Jewish State and the Palestinians, and will likely echo the previous discredited inquiry chaired by Richard Goldstone.

based on past performance, the U.N. is unlikely to bring Hamas or the Palestinian Authority to task for firing thousands of rockets indiscriminately on Israeli towns and villages. The Hamas policy, which it does not deny, is to purposely fire those rockets from schools and mosques in the hope that Israeli retaliations would cause maximum Palestinian civilian casualties and garner world support against Israel.

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Aug 14 - 10:31 AM

Oh Dear...
AMBASSADORS STATEMENT
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Small hope for Israel/Palestine
From: beardedbruce
Date: 20 Aug 14 - 10:45 AM

Jimmy,

YOU state:

"You claimed the Hamas ambassador said that it was Hamas and not Israel who were guilty of war crimes
You posted a link purporting to be him saying it.
The link shows that in fact he said that both bere guilty of committing war crimes
"

In regards to the rockets that HAMAS launches, he DOES state that the Hamas rockest are ecah war crimes, and the Israeli attack are NOT, since there is warning.

He claims that Israel is guilty of other unspecified war crimes, but on the Hamas rockets and warned Israeli rockets, missiles, and artillery attacks on Gaza he is quite specific that HAMAS AND NOT ISRAEL is guilty of war crimes.

People who want the truth can go to the NOW POSTED link and see for themselves. Maybe YOU should as well.