The Enigma of Nic Jones

Subject: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 16 Sep 13 - 05:59 PM

Just a notification. Finally next Friday (27th) on BBC 4 (TV) The one hour documentary on Nics life will be shown. Well worth a look. 2100-2200 UK time. Don't know how available it will be in the US or Australia, but I'm sure people will be recording it here in the UK!.I'm sure deals can be done!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 18 Sep 13 - 03:51 AM

Also, a repeat Saturday 28th 0200-0300 Same channel.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Will Fly
Date: 18 Sep 13 - 04:01 AM

Thanks for the heads-up, Ralphie.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,nickp at work
Date: 18 Sep 13 - 04:10 AM

I'll be glued to it.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Derek Schofield
Date: 18 Sep 13 - 05:00 AM

The broadcast time is 10pm, not 9pm - according to the Radio Times (which also has a photo and brief preview feature). Apparently the press release says 9pm, but it's 10pm.
Derek

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Sep 13 - 05:16 AM

As it's a beeb programme, should be available on i-player also, if anyone unable to watch actual transmission.

~M~

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 18 Sep 13 - 07:24 AM

FOLK PEEL Sunday 20 October at The Continental, Preston 7.30pm £15.00

Nic Jones and Joseph Jones, Mike Heron with Trembling Bells, Emma Pollock

Part of the Un-Peeled Festival celebrating John Peel Day

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 18 Sep 13 - 07:35 AM

Yes there was a BBC publicity Dept cock Up! Tx time 2200-2300. Just set your timers to record! And there is a repeat of a Live Richard Thompson gig afterwards! Filling up my hard drive as I speak! Thank God for BBC 4. The best channel in the UK.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 18 Sep 13 - 07:51 AM

You got THAT right!! Date is now circled in red. Cheers for the heads-up -

B xx

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Eldergirl
Date: 18 Sep 13 - 09:40 AM

And TGFor i-player as whittlebury is that weekend!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Nigel Paterson
Date: 23 Sep 13 - 07:20 AM

A reminder for your TV watching diaries, 'The Enigma of Nic Jones' is on BBC 4, this Friday (27th Sept.) at 10:00pm. It was trailed by the Beeb this morning (Monday 23rd). Dave Moran & I were interviewed for the film, but what's been used & what was consigned to the 'cutting room floor' remains to be seen! Either way, I shall be glued to the screen this coming Friday,
                                                          Nigel.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle
Date: 23 Sep 13 - 09:03 AM

Glueing yourself to a television is unwise and can damage the flatscreen and invalidate your guarantee.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Nigel Paterson
Date: 23 Sep 13 - 09:11 AM

Al, my 'guarantee' expired years ago! (-;
    By the by, Nic & Joe are on BBC Breakfast tomorrow morning. Rumour has it, about 08:40, but that could be subject to change.
                                                       Nigel.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle
Date: 23 Sep 13 - 09:49 AM

oh well glue away...!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle
Date: 23 Sep 13 - 09:49 AM

oh well glue away...!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Nigel Paterson
Date: 24 Sep 13 - 04:24 AM

You might just catch a brief glimpse of me on Nic's film on Friday.
Don't forget, folks, 10:00pm, Friday 27th Sept. BBC TV 4. Having seen a short section of the film already, I can promise you a wonderful, moving tribute to a great performer, someone I'm also proud to call a good friend.
                                                 Nigel.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 24 Sep 13 - 10:09 AM

I'll be watching or recording depending on how long I stay in the pub:-) Someone had to ask the question so I may as well get it over with.

Why does Nic need an enema?

:D tG

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: pavane
Date: 24 Sep 13 - 03:31 PM

I'll do my best to watch,but the other half may not let me

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Hagman
Date: 25 Sep 13 - 10:04 PM

Speaking of "deals being done", Ralphie - us poor denizens of Oz are refused entry to iPlayer and live Beeb.

Have yet to see this appear on the usual-suspect sites, alas.

By any chance can anyone help out a cobber, one way or another? There are many serious NJ fans down here, and we/they would be most grateful. (We promise to go easy during the upcoming Ashes tour.... ;-)

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Edthefolkie
Date: 26 Sep 13 - 01:25 PM

I thought Nic was pretty irrepressible on BBC Breakfast, what an excellent chap he is. And not particularly enigmatic.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Andrez
Date: 27 Sep 13 - 07:02 AM

Oid loike ter add a request from another Oz catter fer a copy o said TV program. Are dere any kind 'earted chappies er chappettes over dere in de auld sod oo could lend an 'elpin 'and?

PM iffen yer can an oi'll take care o' th needs o'local catters.

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 27 Sep 13 - 07:42 AM

I can record it to DVD but I suppose this region will not be playable everywhere.

Dave H

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Andrez
Date: 27 Sep 13 - 08:53 AM

It should be convertable into a number of playable formats Dave if'n ye're willin ter do th initial recordin' it's be much appreciated 'n den oi moight be able ter contact Hagman n send im a copy too.

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Sep 13 - 12:40 PM

I have set it to record but it is at 2200 and not 2100. 2100 is Rock and Roll Britannia so I may watch that too :-)

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 27 Sep 13 - 02:47 PM

No problem Andrez.

Dave H

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 27 Sep 13 - 06:41 PM

Couldn't really get far enough back from the programme to judge its quality. All those old people I knew as young people... And the young people I knew as children ~~ Nic & Julia brought Helen & Joe to lunch with Valerie and me a few weeks before the accident; they only lived three Cambs villages away. Two lovely children, they were.

So I spent the whole programme with moist eyes. And then, right at the end -- there was my darling dead Valerie's name on the Archive photographer credits. And the tears really came. It's 2330 and I'm still tearful.

Sorry. This egotrip probably quite inappropriate. Apologies; but just had to get this down. Mudcatters are my friends in the main & I hope will understand. I will try to comment more rationally when have had time to adjust.

~Michael~

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Paul Burke
Date: 27 Sep 13 - 07:09 PM

Michael: no shame in that, exactly the opposite. You're entitled to special memories of exceptional people, and thanks for sharing them.

But wasn't it lovely to see Nic and Joe singing together. And would Nic's voice have been less wobbly had he not had the accident? He's a few years older than me, and we all start to go a bit reedy about now. Martin Carthy of course has adapted his singing to his voice micro- incrementally over his career, but Nic didn't have that continuity.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: melodeonboy
Date: 27 Sep 13 - 07:13 PM

I can quite understand, Michael. Even as an outsider I found it very moving; it must have been that many times over for you.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Hagman
Date: 27 Sep 13 - 08:01 PM

Many thanks to all Mudcatters out there for offers of an off-air dub. We down here will be most grateful.

I was lucky enough to be at Towersey last year to see the NJ Trio when filming was going on for the doco. Certainly a highlight of my concert-going life. Uncanny how far the apple didn't fall far from the tree - could have sworn it was Nic playing that guitar, albeit backward.

(Dave H. - a DVD made on a home recorder or PC will be Region-free, as far as I know. The Region nonsense was only introduced for commercially-sold products; yet another attempt by media conglomerates to control product. Never had a private pressing that I couldn't play, and most recent players are either region-free or are easily crack able. The only stalwart appears to be Windows and computer drives, who still give you only 6 Region changes, for some reason...

And I for one can easily handle video files in raw format just written to a disc or download service - no great need to author to DVD or whatever)

TIA!

Michael.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 02:48 AM

I recognised the beach.
Is that where he is based now?

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Will Fly
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 03:19 AM

Oddly enough, Nic Jones was someone who almost passed me during his heyday - so the programme was, for me, almost new ground. And I have to confess, I also shed a tear or two. What a lovely family - and isn't his son a great performer! Very moving.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 03:40 AM

Yes - I only knew him by his music and reputation as well, Will. What a brilliant documentary though, regardless of whether you knew Nic before or even if you were not too interested in folk music. It will stay on the Sky box for a long time to come. Wonder if the beeb will do a DVD of it?

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 04:15 AM

Yes.
Thanks for sharing your memories Michael.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,PeterC
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 04:52 AM

Great programme! The only strange thing (to me anyway)was lots about The Halliards, and clips of them, but no mention of the Bandoggs!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 06:15 AM

A very moving documentary which ended upon a triumphal note, both musically and personally for Nic and his hugely supportive family.

I ended my summer holiday early once and returned home just to see a Bandoggs concert. As an extra treat, Nic and Joe will be appearing in the Un-Peeled Festival in Preston next month.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 07:00 AM

its on again Sunday night.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Jim Martin
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 07:10 AM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b03bsrrb

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,GUEST
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 11:39 AM

I loved the programme, but without wishing to reignite well discussed matters, I was surprised there was no mention of the unavailability of Nic's earlier recordings, and the financial hardship this must have caused.

Does anyone know if there was a reason for this? Or did I miss something?

John

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Edthefolkie
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 01:04 PM

I just drank it all in - superb stuff. And Michael, you are entitled to be emotional, it's NOT an ego trip, please don't apologise.

Ashley Hutchings said that he couldn't quite work out what it was about Nic. I can - integrity, taste, technical ability, charisma, and maybe a bit of hypnotism! Well, he always used to take me to another place and it looks like that applies to a lot of other people.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 01:41 PM

I wonder if history will be re-written.
I say that because I am a massive fan of Nic's but I was always disappointed that he didn't go down better! And I saw him lots and lots of times!
Maybe his laid back manner got to the audience and elicited a warm, but not wildly enthusiastic reception that his great talent deserved.
However, this time around, I feel it will be a lot different!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Silas
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 02:14 PM

He always filled our club back before his accident.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 28 Sep 13 - 03:42 PM

Yes, he got a lot of respect and people all said he was marvelous, but I don't remember him "bringing the house down!"
Although, on some of those old live recordings, there does seem to be a very enthusiastic response.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: vectis
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 05:21 AM

I am in New Zealand and can download it easily. Just activate "Expat Shield" before you access the BBC site and it sees you as having a UK isp address.

Simples...

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Andrez
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 05:47 AM

Hi Vectis, can you please clarify where I find the Expat Shield function?

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ian G
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 05:51 AM

It was well done. Arising from it several things struck me; firstly confirming what a treasure Martin Carthy is, secondly isn't there a market for a series here - Bert Jansch, Danny Thompson, Tony Rose, Andy Irvine, Dick Gaughan, Ashley Hutchings, Swarb. etc etc - some sadly not around any more but all significant to the development of the music ? I'm sure people could easily make a list of fifteen, I know I could.
Thirdly, what is it about folk music that the media just doesn't get ? Especially English music ? Seems to me that if you don't stumble upon it like Carthy [and me !] or were born into it, like Eliza, you'll miss out on so much.
By the way, during one of the montages in the programme who else noticed Tony Rose's singing 'Bonny Light Horseman' ? My wife spotted it instantly, it took me a verse and chorus !

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Weasel
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 06:27 AM

Whilst in France I never managed to get Expat Shield to work.

Cheers,

Weasel

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 06:34 AM

There was also a tiny snatch of Bandoggs singing The Tailor in the Teachest, now that was one great band, pity they only made the one record, and only released on vinyl.

Dace H

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 06:36 AM

Jaysus I can't even spell me own name now.

Dave H

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Rev Bayes
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 08:17 AM

The programme definitely suffered from poor resourcing which showed through in the material available and the quality of the editing & narrative (and the research).

However, it's good to see the BBC putting these programs on.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 09:55 AM

'Thirdly, what is it about folk music that the media just doesn't get ? Especially English music ? Seems to me that if you don't stumble upon it like Carthy [and me !] or were born into it, like Eliza, you'll miss out on so much.'

What they DO get and what you don't is that this isn't the folk music of England. The folk music of England isn't a subsection of Martin Carthy's repertoire for when he's not deconstructing Heartbreak Hotel - or some other piece of musical trivia that the rest of the world has come up with.

The folk music of England is the music of the English people - what ever it is, it sounds more like The Beatles that Nic or Martin. I don't go this apothegm of carthy's - just because you're English, it doesn't mean you understand English folk music. yes it bloody does. It's you lot that don't understand.

Having said all that I was truly sorry for Nic, what happened to him . My first paid gig was support to Nic at The Tree Barrels, Ampersand. I saw his gig many times and admired him as wonderful musician. people forget he was a great fiddle player also.

He never really introduced his songs. And he sang some songs that other people did in quite a brisk manner, like the Banks of Claudie in a very slow way, it seemed to me. His records were better than the gig - he was a brilliant recording artist.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ian G
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 10:57 AM

Yes Dave, I spotted the Bandoggs fragment too, and they did do just the one great LP. They only got together because they were all on the same label [Leader and Trailer] and were sitting around with no gigs !
So far as Big Al's comments are concerned my reference to Carthy was in respect of his generosity of spirit and humility, not his repertoire, style or 'deconstruction' of anything. It's also 15 years since he recorded Heartbreak Hotel !! Give the guy a break !
I'm puzzled by the 'apothegm' bit, there's a lot of things I don't understand for sure, but I think after 40+ years of performing and listening I am starting to 'get' English folk music a bit. Do you mean 'apotheosis' ? If so, I agree and MC would, too.
Al, I agree with you on Nic's fiddle playing, he had a lovely touch. I don't know what you're trying to say with the other stuff.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 11:06 AM

Well....you say apotheosis, I say halitosis, lets call the whole thing off. Not the place for an undignified squabble. Lets both be glad that Nic is up and strutting his stuff again.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Mr Happy
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 11:10 AM

Jim Martin,

Thanks so much for the link

I'm watching now with much interest & enjoyment

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Vic Smith
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 12:07 PM

Al Whittle wrote:-
"The folk music of England is the music of the English people - what ever it is, it sounds more like The Beatles than Nic or Martin"

Louis Carroll wrote in Alice Through The Looking Glass:-
"When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, 'it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.'

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ian G
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 12:37 PM

Al, I'm delighted Nic is singing again. I hope Joe resists or is able to resist a day job as well because he sounds too good to be an occasional player like what I am these days.
In respect of the Beatles it was George Harrison's playing that inspired me to pick up a guitar in the first place. I wept gently when he passed on.
Also, your breath may stink but I think your rendition of 'Reinstalling Windows' is terrific !
Life's too short for squabbling, who would be your 15 performers from those days to have a TV retrospective ? [Could be a new thread]
I'm off to my music room [shed] to try playing 'Claudy Banks' very slowly, thanks for that one ! IG

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 04:06 PM

Not gonna squabble.

You people have no answer to the fact that most English folk can't stand what you call English folk music. You rant at and abuse anyone who points this rather sad fact out.

Martin Carthy and Nic Jones are great artists. Great artists deserve respect and this isn't the place. I doubt if there is a place where the debate can take place. Yhe people involved are so partisan.

Life is full of strange contradictions. And truth is hard to pin down.

For example Jean Paul Sartre said that the French people were at their most free under the rule of the gestapo - because he said, every choice was made in the presence of death.....that's what he believed and he wrote The Age of Reason trilogy of novels with those beliefs in his mind. Works of genius...some believe.

Great art can be pouduced using ideas that I don't agree with. Look at the Renaissance, all those religious painters - you can appreciate their beauty without being a Christian.

Similarly I think Nic and martind are brilliant - but I don't think its folk music.

No need to squabble - but its my belief. Doesn't have to be yours.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ian G
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 04:27 PM

Wasn't aware I'd ranted at or abused anyone, Al. Simply saying MC is a good bloke. From what close mutual friends have told me Nic is too. Let's leave it there.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 06:02 PM

Not accusing you of that Ian. Its just the sort of thing that happens and I think it would be unbecoming, for it to happen here, when we are all making a thread about someone that we're all glad to see back on the scene.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 06:22 PM

Al, take more water with it :-)

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Eldergirl
Date: 29 Sep 13 - 08:07 PM

What struck me about the programme was, that although Nic was a superb instrumentalist, he was - and still is - more concerned about getting the song across, rather than show-offy arrangements, etc. His version of Little Musgrave trumps all other variants, in my book, and demonstrates what I mean; the guitar just drives along underneath, like a river carrying a barge laden with cargo. More power to him. Great to see him back. And backed by Joe and Belinda, there's teamwork for you.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: treewind
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 04:41 AM

"English folk can't stand what you call English folk music"
I don't want another "what is folk?" argument any more that you do, but I'm not entirely sure that, even in an ideal world, the folk music of a country has be universally popular in that country, and for every definition of "folk" that I've ever heard or read, I can think of lots of people of don't like THAT sort of "folk" music.

"What struck me about the programme was, that although Nic was a superb instrumentalist, he was - and still is - more concerned about getting the song across, rather than show-offy arrangements, etc."

Yes, he said he had to get the guitar part "automatic" so he didn't have to think about that and could concentrate on the song. His playing wasn't meant to sound flashy: as described several times in the program, it was only when another guitarist tried to copy what he did that they discovered it wasn't as easy Nic made it sound.

I heard somewhere that Nic pointed out to another guitarist asking him for advice, that he kept it simple during the verses of a song; it was only between verses that the really tricky stuff came out. Not only because it's easier to concentrate on it when you're not singing at the same time, but more importantly because you don't want to distract from the words.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 06:26 AM

The only thing that I didn't quite get about this program was the "Enigma" bit. It was about a brave man who has overcome extreme adversity with the help and support of his family and friends. There were tragedy and triumph involved - but nothing very enigmatic as far as I could see - did I miss something?

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Noreen
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 09:33 AM

Shimrod, I agree- I don't see the reason for the title at all.

But otherwise, a lovely programme, great to see all the old faces with their memories, adn Nic looking so happy.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: G-Force
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 10:14 AM

I suppose the 'enigma' is that although he's been off the scene for ages he remains popular and 'legendary'. The media do love a legend.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 11:17 AM

I always remember playing Canadeeio in my car whilst waiting at a level crossing - a long wait, when a BMW with windows wound down pulled up beside me out of which the usual reggae at deafening volume came. I turned mine up (!!) and suddenly the reggae stopped, the driver called out "what's that you're playin man?". I told him and showed him the CD cover, and he said "that guitar playing is fantastic, must get the CD"!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 11:34 AM

I don't know about enigma. But one thing that fascinates me is how these singers who have been absent from the folkscene for many years seem to inspire young talented disciples.

I'm thinking of young James Findlay, who seems to live and breathe the spirit of Nic Jones.

Sunjay Brayne, who never saw gerry Lockran or Roger Brooks perform - but seems to have an encylcopaedic knowlege of their works.

And did anyone see that programme made about a year before Davy Graham died - all these rock stars, many of whom I'd never heard of came out of the woodwork paying tribute.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 11:41 AM

BBC 4 - The Enigma of Nic Jones - BBC4 is available on BBC iPlayer. If overseas you need to use ExpatShield or StrongVPN - to set up a UK IP address. Then you can download this programme (without DRM) using get_iplayer

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b03bsrrb/The_Enigma_of_Nic_Jones_Return_of_Britains_Lost_Folk_Hero/

Note that is you download this from the iPlayer page above this will be with DRM and the file will expire in 30 days.

Use get_player instead. Paste this link into the Quick URL field, and then click on Record.

====

Radio 4 FM - The Enigma of Nic Jones. Available on iPlayer. Can be listened to overseas and recorded using Audacity (with Stereo Mix) *without* ExpatShield etc. at:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b037t1rk

Or it can be downloaded from overseas using get_iplayer and this link in the Quick URL field and then clicking on Record

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b037t1rk/In_Search_of_Nic_Jones

====

get_iplayer can be downloaded for free from:

http://www.infradead.org/get_iplayer/html/get_iplayer.html

The web PVM version is good - this will download and install all necessary packages (PC only):

http://www.infradead.org/get_iplayer_win/get_iplayer_setup_latest.exe

Refresh the cache every time before downloading anything.

====

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Howard Jones
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 02:27 PM

Tunesmith comments that he doesn't remember Nic "bringing the house down". My recollection is that very few of the performers at the time brought the house down. The attitude was very respectful of the music and the performers, and we were a bit suspicious of those who played to the gallery and seemed to put themselves above the music. Even the outstanding performers, of whom Nic was undoubtedly one, were received warmly and enthusiastically, but "bringing the house down" was not behaviour which was welcome. Looking back I suspect we took it, and ourselves, all a bit too seriously.

Having just caught up with the programme on iPlayer, I was struck by the quality of the performance. I've heard bits of his comeback performances on the radio, and my reaction had been that while it was lovely that he was back on stage, and the emotional impact of the event went without saying, considered objectively his singing wasn't up to much. Having now seen that performance, my opinion is completely reversed - he still has that wonderful sense of timing and delivery that made his singing so distinctive. Masterful.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Smedley
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 02:47 PM

It was the best music documentary I've seen on TV for years.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 02:56 PM

I'll second that.

Dave H

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Edthefolkie
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 04:11 PM

I'll third that, I emailed Proudfoot Films to say thanks.

I'd also second Ian G about how great it's be to have more stories in a similar vein. Swarb's is equally inspiring but would definitely have to be shown after the watershed.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Sep 13 - 06:36 PM

Agree it was a wonderful doc. Are you all aware that it was producer Michael Proudfoot who also made that excellent series of hour-long profiles on Eliza Carthy, Kathryn Tickell, Seth Lakeman and Kate Rusby a few years ago that still pop up on Sky from time to time? I've read elsewhere that the Nic film was virtually a labour of love, made on a tiny budget with most of the people working on it for free. I suppose that's the reality if you aren't making programmes about Celebs, but it really shouldn't be so. We should all let the BBC know how much this one was appreciated, so they know, then maybe they'll commission a few more.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: vectis
Date: 01 Oct 13 - 06:20 AM

Andrez try here for a download

expat-shield.en.softonic.com

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Nigel Paterson
Date: 01 Oct 13 - 06:49 AM

I can confirm that 'The Enigma of Nic Jones' was, most definitely, a labour of love.
                                                   Nigel Paterson.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Oct 13 - 05:17 PM

As I think I said earlier - Brilliant stuff. Maybe I said it elsewhere? Never mind - It was anyway, on all fronts I think.

BTW - One of the most useful and interesting threads I have seen in a long time. Thanks Ralphie.

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Andrez
Date: 01 Oct 13 - 07:00 PM

Yay, OK thanks for the info Vectis and info re some other options from Guest, I think, too. Will play around with this info and see how it goes. Looking forward to seeing what everyone else has been talking about re Nic.

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,KP
Date: 02 Oct 13 - 04:40 AM

I was privileged to have seen Nic in his prime in 1980, in a packed folk club in Cambridge. He couldn't 'bring the house down' because the walls were too well propped up by all the people jammed in to see him! Otherwise I remember his reception as being pretty ecstatic...

The programme brought tears to my eyes on several occasions, but the best moment was listening to him singing with his son and how well their voices blended.

The other thing that was really interesting was watching and listening to all the talented young musicians playing his stuff. With all of them (even a certain Mr Simpson) you got the impression 'wow that's difficult' whereas listening to Nic in his prime you just got that total sense of ease about his playing - it was only when you tried to work out or emulate him that you realised how difficult it was/is.

Incidentally, I've never really sorted out what he is doing on the accompaniment of Annachie Gordon - can't even work out the tuning! Anyone got any insight?

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Mike Rogers
Date: 02 Oct 13 - 04:59 AM

Finally caught up with my recording of this programme.
I thought it was one of the best music related programmes I've ever seen.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ronald
Date: 02 Oct 13 - 06:33 AM

Of course most people who know Nic watched the programme, but it would be interesting to know what people who had never heard about him thought of it.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Nigel Paterson
Date: 02 Oct 13 - 11:44 AM

As a result of the film, 'Penguin Eggs' looks like it's heading for the folk charts again (I have this information from two, unimpeachable sources!)

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 03 Oct 13 - 03:25 AM

I dug out my Penguin Eggs CD only to find the case was empty, bugger, no idea where it's gone, I'll have to buy it again.

Dave H

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Oct 13 - 03:05 PM

As far as I can tell, no way to watch in the US....bummer!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,surreysinger sans cookie
Date: 03 Oct 13 - 04:27 PM

Nigel .. ."heading for the folk charts"? It depends which folk charts you're referring to, but if you check Amazon Uk out you will find that it's number 2 (as it has been for a while now) in their folk charts, but in terms of _overall_ CD sales it is currently today at number 34. (Yesterday it was at 24, so it's beginning to slip a little now). Not bad :-)

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: The Sandman
Date: 03 Oct 13 - 04:53 PM

annachie gordon is cgcgcd

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 03 Oct 13 - 08:04 PM

I wonder if you put a fourth string on the 6th whether it would stay in tune.

Buy a variax and amp and have no further pronlems.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Oct 13 - 09:36 PM

Re charts. according to a number of Facebook postings at the time, on Saturday the day after the broadcast Penguin Eggs briefly reached No.4 on Amazon's overall music chart!! Somebody said that Amazon account for more than half of all UK CD sales, so that's an actual hit record. Overnight, after more than 30 years! I hope Nic gets royalties.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,surreysinger sans cookie
Date: 04 Oct 13 - 07:12 AM

It's been in Amazon's charts for 20 days according to their page today and is currently at number 38 (so it's now dropping gently). But it's still ahead of "On Air - Live at the BBC Volume 2" by the Beatles.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 04 Oct 13 - 10:08 AM

Given that The Beatles "On Air" isn't released until November 11th, it's not entirely surprising that sales are a little slow.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 04 Oct 13 - 10:17 AM

Talking of The Beatles, I bet a hundred years from now, Nic's work will be revered more than The Beatles!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Anne Lister
Date: 04 Oct 13 - 05:37 PM

I finally caught up with the programme last night and have had a huge lump in my throat ever since. Profoundly moved at the memories (I will of course always remember the evening we first met at which he asked for a recording of "Icarus", as well as the subsequent meetings and the devastating news of the car crash at the Perform gathering in Manchester) and at the younger generation carrying it forward. Well done to all concerned - and Nigel, if you're reading this, you had me in tears.
As to "bringing the house down" - my memory is that he was, quite simply, regarded as one of the very best. In fact, that button badge saying he was god made me laugh out loud - pretty close!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,surreysinger sans cookie
Date: 04 Oct 13 - 08:09 PM

Guest Ed - no doubt those will be Amazon pre-sales then?

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 05 Oct 13 - 02:09 AM

Of course, what needs to happen is that a DVD should be released with "extras" to make it "a must" for anyone who has already recorded the Tv programme.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Nigel Paterson
Date: 13 Oct 13 - 05:11 AM

Anne, I've sent you a PM.
                                     Nigel xx

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 13 Oct 13 - 07:52 AM

"I've sent you a PM"

What a bizarre thing, announcing to the world that you've sent somebody a personal message but there we go...

For what it's worth, there will be a DVD. Released on November 11th. Click here for details.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 13 Oct 13 - 07:59 AM

My apologies for my stupidity. Click HERE

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Silas
Date: 13 Oct 13 - 08:38 AM

Hi Ed
It's not all that odd sending a message to say you have sent a PM - mudcat does not flag PM's particularly well unless you are looking out for them.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Nigel Paterson
Date: 13 Oct 13 - 12:38 PM

Thank you, Silas.
                         Nigel.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 13 Oct 13 - 03:04 PM

I've ordered the DVD via Amazon. £11 something with super-saver free delivery.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Nigel Paterson
Date: 14 Oct 13 - 09:02 AM

I don't yet know whether Julia Jones will be selling the DVD from Mollie Music. If she does, please buy it from MM, rather than other outlets. Nic & Julia will benefit all the more.
                                                 Nigel.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: pavane
Date: 14 Oct 13 - 09:56 AM

Big Al Whittle: You say that Nic didn't introduce songs, but he certainly did when I recorded him in 1973.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Nigel Paterson
Date: 14 Oct 13 - 12:37 PM

Awaiting a reply from Julia. Please don't bombard her with orders for 'The Enigma of Nic Jones' DVD. She's still working through the orders for 'Penguin Eggs'!
                                                             Nigel.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Hagman
Date: 23 Oct 13 - 03:16 AM

In my hast to obtain the commercial DVD, I placed a pre-order with Proper Music the instant it was announced for a Nov 11 release.

Received the following email on Oct 21:

"Due to issues outside of our control the record label concerned have informed us that the Nic Jones DVD release has now been cancelled and all orders cannot be fulfilled.

Unfortunately, we have had to cancel your order and apologise for any inconvenience caused. We look forward to being able to serve you again very soon."

Any news on reasons for this, anyone? Surely not a last macabre Ghost of D. Bulmer Past... ;-)

Naturally will place subsequent order with Mollie Music when/if it does become available.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Jim Moray
Date: 23 Oct 13 - 08:39 AM

As soon as it went on sale, I emailed Michael Proudfoot (the director of the documentary) to ask what was happening. The DVD company got just ahead of themselves apparently and advertised something that doesn't exist. At the moment, none of the 'bonus features' have even been edited, let alone cleared for release on a DVD. Proudfoot Productions had only discussed the possibility of putting it out and the first they knew was when it was listed as on sale.

It will probably happen, but I'd expect to wait a little longer for everything to actually be edited...

But no - not a Bulmer issue.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 23 Oct 13 - 11:09 AM

Completely agree with Jim.
Someone has jumped the gun regarding a DVD release. I'm sure it will see the light of day sometime. Knowing that Mr P has several hours of unreleased concert videos of Nic with the trio, and others, including his EFDSS Gold award celebration from Shirley Collins. It would make a suitable companion "Extra" DVD disc, but remember that Michael took on this project as an act of love for Nic and his family. Video editing takes time, and money. So, Wait for an official announcement. Maybe next year sometime.
Well worth waiting for....(And The Late Bulmer and his company isn't involved at all....Thank the Lord)

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Oct 13 - 02:53 PM

Yay, Nic was strolling along the beach at Widemouth Bay in the programme. If I'd known he was there I could (a) have spotted him through me bins from my house, (b) made him a cup o' char!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Hagman
Date: 23 Oct 13 - 07:22 PM

Thanks for clarifying, Jim and Ralphie. I was wondering how a fully-market-ready product could have been scheduled so quickly! Let's hope we get lots of extras when it does happen.

(My DB reference was totally tongue-in-cheek, BTW. Given that from the clips I have managed to see from all the "comeback" shows, Nic hasn't done any material from the Trailer albums, not that any copyright issues would arise if he had. Good to see sales of "Penguin Eggs" accelerating, though...)

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 24 Oct 13 - 08:03 PM

Thanks Hagman. As far as Nics earlier ouvre is concerned. He doesn't find it very relevant to his present life. He's gradually writing new stuff and jolly good it is too!. Maybe the "lost" album situation may be resolved in time. For everyone to hear, A nice big fat Boxed set would be nice!
As far as video is concerned, there really wasn't very much extant from Nic pre-crash, most of which features in the BBC4 doc. I know that Michael shot footage at Warwick, Towersey, and C Sharp House. Which would be great to see.
I trust Mr Proudfoot to make the right decisions (in conjunction with the family)
But as I say, it's unlikely to be anytime soon. He's working on lots of other projects as well (everyone has to make a living!)
The best idea is to pop into the Mollie Music website in the coming months. for more news.
Cheers Ralphie

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Ian Hendrie
Date: 31 Oct 13 - 10:32 AM

I've just had my Amazon order cancelled for the same reason given above.

Hey Ho! I'll just have to wait a little longer. Pity I deleted it from my Sky box though.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Klavdivs
Date: 23 May 14 - 10:40 AM

This documentary is no longer in BBC's iPlayer, and it seems there is no DVD of it available yet. Nor does it seem like anyone has put the BBC doco up on Youtube. o is there any way for thos of us who missed it, to see it now ? btw, I live in Australia.

Thanks

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: FreddyHeadey
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 07:45 PM

The Enigma of Nic Jones
- Return of Britain's Lost Folk Hero
2018 February
(Sunday 25th night) \Monday 26th morning 01:55 GMT
BBC FOUR

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b03bsrrb

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Feb 18 - 09:05 PM

Thank you, Freddy, for flagging that. I'd have missed it otherwise. I'll put you forward for an MBE or summat!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 04:01 PM

Bert Jansch just before. Its a bit late for me, but I will watch both on iPlayer later.

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,CJB
Date: 24 Feb 18 - 05:00 PM

Clickies ...

Nic Jones

Bert Jansch

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Feb 18 - 09:38 AM

I bought one two years ago from Amazon. Still there!

https://www.amazon.com/Enigma-Nic-Jones/dp/B00O3RWLEO

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,CJB
Date: 25 Feb 18 - 09:22 PM

Programmes started a bit early!!!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 26 Feb 18 - 01:55 AM

Youtube-dl will download a nice drm free copy!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,CJB
Date: 26 Feb 18 - 05:38 AM

And get_iplayer !!!!

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Nigel Paterson
Date: 26 Feb 18 - 06:18 AM

Echoing guest above, 'The Enigma of Nic Jones' remains available on Amazon...checked today, 26th Feb. Please resist the temptation of any 'free downloads'. Nic has and never will, receive all royalties due from his albums, an ongoing issue, well documented on MC.
                                        Nigel Paterson (The Halliard).

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: GUEST,CJB
Date: 26 Feb 18 - 06:42 AM

Try Amazon at the link given above!!!

====

Subject: RE: The Enigma of Nic Jones
From: Klavdivs
Date: 23 May 14 - 10:40 AM

This documentary is no longer in BBC's iPlayer, and it seems there is no DVD of it available yet. Nor does it seem like anyone has put the BBC doco up on Youtube. o is there any way for thos of us who missed it, to see it now ? btw, I live in Australia.

Thanks

====