BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: kendall
Date: 25 Oct 13 - 09:42 AM

Guest was me.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: akenaton
Date: 25 Oct 13 - 09:23 AM

Ed...If you are referring to me in your last post, I am not insulted or "puffy" over people disagreeing with me, that is what this section is all about. We need different points of view to keep this place alive and I welcome civil debate.

You need to look no further back than the thread on respectful behaviour to see the vicious abuse directed towards me.
I remained calm and did not return the abuse, but the debate became sterile as other contributors switched off because of the aggressive behaviour of 3 people.

If people are unable to put up a reasoned and factual argument on any given subject and resort to abuse in order to get the thread closed, these people should be kicked off the forum.

On the subject of homosexual health rates, I keep getting asked the same questions over and over again, often for thousands of posts.....then I am accused of repetition!!
The answers are contained in the CDC and HPA websites and are completely factual.
If people don't like these figures being published, they should direct their aggression to the appropriate health authorities.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: GUEST,His last day "below the Line"
Date: 25 Oct 13 - 07:57 AM

Last Day In The Mines
Dave Dudley

For as long as I can remember, I've worked down in this pit
But today it's all over for this is the day I quit
I'm gonna take my sweet little Ginny and make her my own
We gonna move down in the valley and built ourselves a home
This is the last day in the mines


Well I swing that pick move that shovel and time goes so slow
I can hardly wait for my boss to tell me that it's time to go
Up at the top I know my Ginny is waiting patiently
In just a few minutes I'll be there with her and from the mines be free
This is the last day in the mines

But wait a minute what's that rumble way back in the ground
Good Lord it's a cave in and the rocks are a fallin' all around
Now the timbers are breakin' and the rats are runnin' and I can hardly see
Inside my chest there's a mighty burnin' and my strenght is leavin' me
This is the last day in the mines


Beneath these rocks and timbers and with my strenght all gone
My thoughts turn to Ginny I must leave her all alone
I know they'll try to save me but they gonna be too late
For over that river through that valley I see heaven's gates
This is the last day in the mines
Oh, this is the last day in the mines - this is the last day in the mines

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Oct 13 - 07:32 AM

Rave on

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 25 Oct 13 - 01:32 AM

Last post???..Bobert wishes!.....I think the 'so-called liberals' have just run out of excuses...and hate being pressed to explain the obvious disaster of their agendas, programs and still being able to say that corruption wasn't a factor!!

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: GUEST,Ed T
Date: 24 Oct 13 - 04:01 PM

I would add to your last post Ake, that with some, if other posters disagree with a position or perspective (what they may see as odd) why do some posters get so insulted and "puffy" when they are told so? It is a big mud-world. Is it reasonable to expect everyone to agree with a posters opinion, or to keep quiet if they don"t?

Additionally, some posters expect others to know what they posted in one thread or another the past, rather than summarizing what they refer to in their posts. To me, this is merely being lazy, and, yes, inconsiderate. Who has "the time" to follow, or remember what any one poster has "put up" on a topic (and, possibly in a number of threads) in the past? So, why don't some folks post considerately.....egomania?

IMO, when posts get to be a personal conversation (aka dispute) between two (or a few) posters, the thread (especially those that go far beyond the OP) the thread should be put aside in a "dead issue room". It could be called the "beating a dead horse room".

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: akenaton
Date: 24 Oct 13 - 02:54 PM

I think perhaps, that some members don't take the time to read or digest the posts on threads, before jumping in and attacking other posters.....this often leads to repetition to clarify points for the new aggressive contributor.
Why don't people read properly?.....egomania, they just cant wait to get their views in print or insult and abuse those who have different opinions to them.

I agree with Kendall.....the amount of abuse and name calling in place of reason, has risen dramatically and it is almost impossible to hold a proper discussion here any longer.

I think the moderators are far too lax concerning personal attacks, and its a shame that a great little discussion community should be so effected by 3 or 4 people.
I say, get rid of the abusers, as I said, I can think of only 3 or 4 out of the complete membership who use abusive language.

To be perfectly honest I think they intend to have this section shut down by aggressive behaviour, and hope we don't let them succeed.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 24 Oct 13 - 02:10 PM

Sounds just like real life!! 8-)

Yes, and real life can be annoying enough - no need for us to add to the hardship unnecessarily. Ideally, organization should help us to separate the various styles of discussion to a certain extent. Opinions about the quality of some contributions may differ, but we may at least make a joint effort to counteract repetitive bullshit.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Mr Happy
Date: 24 Oct 13 - 09:03 AM

Interesting contributions are interspersed with repetitive bullshit

Sounds just like real life!! 8-)

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: kendall
Date: 24 Oct 13 - 08:20 AM

Delete the name calling and other nastiness. Simple

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 24 Oct 13 - 06:29 AM

An important point to be made here, is that this is possibly the last chance saloon for many people with either landline connections, or very slow broadband, to make any kind of meaningful contribution.

For that reason alone, the current text only format is ideal and should remain.

It's all very well for those who, like myself, have multi megabits/sec to demand more modern formats, but many of our members are so far from exchanges that their downloads and uploads work in geological time.

I say "Leave it as it is until it becomes impossible to avoid changing it".

Just my two cents worth! YMMV!

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 24 Oct 13 - 05:48 AM

Right, Joe. I noticed that you or other elves sometimes add epithets like "(UK)" to existing thread titles, which is very useful indeed. My remark was primarily about the "Common Prefix (optional)" selector box; more sophisticated systematics are imaginable but would require changes in the software to take full effect.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Joe Offer
Date: 23 Oct 13 - 10:06 PM

Grishka sez: We have made many suggestions to tweak the existing software and its usage, e.g. with more prefixes.

The default prefix in starting threads, is no prefix at all. BUT - that means you have the option of creating any prefix you want to create. If it's good, other people will follow you. I do this all the time - but nobody follows me....

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Bobert
Date: 23 Oct 13 - 09:17 PM

Nuthin' nasty about this joint... Folks might not get along with everyone (me included) but that generally is their deal and everyone walks around them as if they were radiation pits...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 23 Oct 13 - 07:09 AM

I can't see any great change. It waxes and wanes, and of course when the Mudcat vanishes for a couple of days most of the thread vanish out of sight.

AS for the !Mudcat being 'nastier', I just don't think it's true. Nastiness flares up every now and then, and we all need to keep an eye on what we write when we're engaged in a discussion about something where we have strong feelings. But by internet standards it's generally a pretty even tempered place. And of course the music threads aren't immune from toxicity at times.

Too much decorum can be as bad in its way at times.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Bobert
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 07:17 PM

Here's the deal, people...

The reason for this thread was an observation that each day brought 2 or 3 fewer below-the-line threads until it was like about 8 or 9...

It was fair to throw out a new thread to see if what seemed evident that people just weren't coming here... Look at the people who aren't here... Hey, if enough people just say "screw it" then, hey... There just won't be any threads down here... That is reality...

I mean, look around you... Lotta people have bolted... Lotta...

As for starting new threads??? Hey, that's great and I am glad that this thread has had people stepping to the plate... A couple folks have done just that...

As for the threads being meaningless??? Nah... Everyone has his or her own interests and I'd never criticize anyone for starting a new thread... I might not agree with the thread but I'm not into censorship or a book of rules on what people want to talk about...

That's my story and, as per usual, I'm stickin' to it...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Jeri
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 05:59 PM

AFAIK, Max never intended to switch to some other type of "package". I think he likes his, although the database has been has been changed. (I BELIEVE it's been changed over, but I don't know for sure.)

Part of the problem, I believe, is that the contributions sort of fizzled out. He needs more money, ALWAYS needs more money. Hardware needs to be replaced, even if the software is tweakable.

Opinion: we have more people posting utter crap, starting threads to get attention, and claiming that "more is better" for Mudcat. No, it's not. Fights are still fights, stupid is still stupid (and increasingly, its humorless 'stupid'), and shit is still shit. End of opinion.

If I hadn't just bought a (used) car and wasn't in the process of getting a load of work done on my house, I'd throw a pile of money at Max. THAT'S the sort of help he needs, I think.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 05:58 PM

Interesting contributions are interspersed with repetitive bullshit

You should know...   :-)

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 05:53 PM

Many people in the 'folk movement; have strong political and social viewsendas over and over again, and a large part of the 'folk genre' includes political song.
The BS section is an ideal platform for debate and discussion.

However, as Joe said, personal attacks and name calling detract from meaningful debate, as does 3 or 4 individuals dominating threads with the same arguments again and again. (isn't there a song about again and again?)

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: GUEST,Ed T
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 05:45 PM

What is it all about, Bobert?

One possibility is that Mudcat-Bobert is announcing his own demise...not a likely thing.

Another, is Bobert is announcing he has hatched a plan to either "snuff-out" all contributors (small at this time).It's hard to believe he has the resources, focus or energy to do this task.

A third possibility is he has devised an anti-BS weapon, possibly a virus, to end the BS section?

But, considering the above possibilities, how do we really know that the identity of the "formely-known-as Bobert" has not been suplanted by a force alien and hostile to the "BS reason to exist" - possibly to benefit from such a sketchy move?

Consider that the OP is not much like the Mudcat-Bobert that we have known.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 05:21 PM

Bill, I remember Max announcing (not just suggesting) some other existing software to be used - which does not necessarily, but presumably mean one of those standard packages. That was quite a while ago, much earlier than the 2345 Trojan story and Max's health problem, so I guess the plan was postponed or abandoned.

We have made many suggestions to tweak the existing software and its usage, e.g. with more prefixes. The resonance has always been zero, so I gave up bothering. Joe wrote that the music section takes priority, which of course nobody would argue about, but since he posts BS messages himself, he may not be all that uninterested.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: frogprince
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 05:20 PM

I thought maybe we were being invited to hypothesize what the last B.S. thread, the one that would finally kill off the section, would be. Maybe Songwronger posting "Obamacare = the legalization and promotion of pedophilia".

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 02:16 PM

The topic of " one of the standard forum software packages" has been mentioned before, but I do not remember Max even suggesting switching.

I, and many others, would hate to see that. I suppose there might be a couple of advantages, but.... we LIKE this one.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: GUEST,kendall
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 02:10 PM

I was being facetious!

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 01:45 PM

The main problem of the BS section is lack of focus in many of the discussion threads. Interesting contributions are interspersed with repetitive bullshit, often ignoring the thread topic.

"Jane's Rainbow" seems to point to a possible solution: separate space for distinct mentalities. OTOH, such megathreads make it very difficult to sustain more than one discussion simultaneously; they are like chats.

If/when Mudcat is switched to one of the standard forum software packages, as announced some time ago by Max, we can have a whole hierarchy of topic groups. Some admins make the mistake to create too many such groupings, or ones that are not named with sufficient precision, possibly overlapping. Otherwise that hierarchy is a good idea, with a few little drawbacks.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 01:22 PM

Facebook is for those who follow their many, many, many... ∞ .,.'friends' all day long- usually on a tablet/smart phone. I, frankly, can't keep up with incessant banter in that format. I MAY comment on a few things, (did yesterday), but then it could be 2 days before I return, due to craft show, flooded basements..etc.

Mudcat...and the BS area... are easy to navigate and have several ways to find & follow discussions.... and I doubt *I* will have any sort of smart phone anytime soon.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 12:36 PM

It's not the same, Kendall. Facebook is in many ways the lowest common denominator that Mudcat isn't.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: kendall
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 12:17 PM

There's always Face book.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Mrrzy
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 12:14 PM

I am ashamed, said the little shrimp in his French accent.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: MartinRyan
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 10:59 AM

Could it be that Bobert is heralding that Mudcat's bullshit section is dying and that there's a trend back to music research?

Oddly, the thought had struck me in recent weeks. At the recent Frank Harte Festival in Dublin, only ONE person spoke to me along the lines of "Mudcat? I don't go there any more - too much nastiness." That's progress... ;>)>

Regards

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: kendall
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 10:20 AM

If you can't stand the heat....

Seems to me that the best way to handle the nastiness is for the clones to delete those posts.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 08:14 AM

Not a cat in hells chance!

Just my opinion of course.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 07:38 AM

Oh, this is the song of the last BS thread
It used to be great fun down here, but now it's mostly dead
And if you post, some asshole's likely to chew off your head
I think I'll turn the 'puter off and play guitar instead

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: maeve
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 07:31 AM

I don't happen to know my friend Bobert's notion for this thread- but kindly remember that the BS section is also host to creative, interesting, positive threads of value, including the following that have mattered to me (many more besides, before, and during the activity in these!):

Jane's Rainbow: for all needing support & comfort , 2013/14 fire season, Australia , Autumn Leaves Decluttered Spaces 2013 ,
BS: The Mother of all BS threads , Mudcat Secret Santa- Xmas 2013 - Join Us! ,
Sunshine Thoughts , Tribulation/ Blessings ... , BS: Old Pocket Watches , the Birdwatching threads, Various queries and cries for help, the humor/humour, the stories, problems and solutions... a whole range of threads that maintained compassion, humor, inventiveness, and good writing.

I appreciate these as much as I appreciate and participate in the music threads.

Thanks, Max. You have made this possible. It matters.

Drifting back to the the OP, now.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Joe Offer
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 07:03 AM

Nobody's killing the BS section, Kendall. It's dying of boredom. The nastiness, got tedious.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: GUEST,kendall
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 06:40 AM

What would be gained by killing the bs section?

I see it like a parody on a song; an addition, not a subtraction.
If you don't like the bs, stay away, don't rob those of us who do like it.
I'm not fond of control freaks.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Pete Jennings
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 06:33 AM

I don't see that the BS is detracting from Above and it's interesting/funny/annoying etc. Let it live on.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Joe Offer
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 06:03 AM

Could it be that Bobert is heralding that Mudcat's bullshit section is dying and that there's a trend back to music research?

Hmmmmm. Sounds interesting to me.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 05:54 AM

Why??

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Oct 13 - 02:38 AM

The "mother" thread will likely be the last.
I will miss all the banter.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: gnu
Date: 21 Oct 13 - 11:08 PM

And yer mother rules. >;-)

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Rapparee
Date: 21 Oct 13 - 08:49 PM

Do you want it to be? No?

I'll start a new one tomorrow. In the meantime, Mother calls you.

Subject: RE: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 21 Oct 13 - 08:01 PM

???

Subject: BS: The Last Below the Line Thread???
From: Bobert
Date: 21 Oct 13 - 07:59 PM

Well, maybe???

B~