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BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'

beardedbruce 27 Feb 14 - 02:55 PM
Jack the Sailor 27 Feb 14 - 02:58 PM
beardedbruce 27 Feb 14 - 03:06 PM
beardedbruce 27 Feb 14 - 03:12 PM
Greg F. 27 Feb 14 - 03:22 PM
Jim Carroll 27 Feb 14 - 03:30 PM
Jim Carroll 27 Feb 14 - 03:30 PM
Jack the Sailor 27 Feb 14 - 03:38 PM
bobad 27 Feb 14 - 04:08 PM
bobad 27 Feb 14 - 04:22 PM
Jack the Sailor 27 Feb 14 - 04:31 PM
bobad 27 Feb 14 - 04:41 PM
Jack the Sailor 27 Feb 14 - 04:54 PM
bobad 27 Feb 14 - 05:04 PM
bobad 27 Feb 14 - 06:32 PM
Jack the Sailor 27 Feb 14 - 09:43 PM
MGM·Lion 28 Feb 14 - 12:47 AM
Jim Carroll 28 Feb 14 - 03:08 AM
Keith A of Hertford 28 Feb 14 - 03:13 AM
bobad 28 Feb 14 - 06:43 AM
bobad 28 Feb 14 - 07:03 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 08:07 AM
Greg F. 28 Feb 14 - 08:47 AM
Greg F. 28 Feb 14 - 08:56 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 09:18 AM
Greg F. 28 Feb 14 - 09:25 AM
Jack the Sailor 28 Feb 14 - 09:35 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 09:46 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 09:49 AM
Greg F. 28 Feb 14 - 09:51 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 09:54 AM
Greg F. 28 Feb 14 - 10:01 AM
bobad 28 Feb 14 - 10:07 AM
Greg F. 28 Feb 14 - 10:19 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 10:21 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 10:24 AM
Jack the Sailor 28 Feb 14 - 10:28 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 10:34 AM
Greg F. 28 Feb 14 - 10:36 AM
Jack the Sailor 28 Feb 14 - 10:39 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 10:46 AM
Greg F. 28 Feb 14 - 10:53 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 10:54 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 10:57 AM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 12:00 PM
Jack the Sailor 28 Feb 14 - 12:03 PM
Greg F. 28 Feb 14 - 12:23 PM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 12:35 PM
Greg F. 28 Feb 14 - 01:16 PM
beardedbruce 28 Feb 14 - 01:27 PM

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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 02:55 PM

So, GregF,

What you are saying is that it is OK for everybody but the Jews to do it?

Or is it that you ONLY object to Jews doing it?


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 02:58 PM

If a free and fair election were held today in the land that Israel claims. There would be no Israel. Can you claim that about the USA or any of the other countries you mentioned?

Israel does not have the right to turn back the clock to the beginning of colonialism. Palestine in the 2,000's is not America in the 1600's


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 03:06 PM

Jack,

Are you aware of the history of Mandate Palestine?

77% of the "Jewish Homeland" was split off in 1924 or so to form the Kingdom of TransJordan, where Jews were not allowed to settle. This was by the Mandate Power ( GB) . The remainder was to be the new "Jewish Homeland"


Those were the LAST borders accepted by the Arab League. Shouldn't we go back to them?


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 03:12 PM

"If a free and fair election were held today in the land that Israel claims. There would be no Israel. Can you claim that about the USA or any of the other countries you mentioned?"


Iran, China, and probably Russia, at least. The governments would be entirely replaced, and possibly those nations broken up into various ethnic nations.

Indonesia and the Philippines are other possibilities.




I do not that you ignore the rights of the Jewish refugees of 1948 from Arab lands. What about them? Do the rights of 640,000 Arab Muslims exceed the right of 820,000 Arab Jews?


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Greg F.
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 03:22 PM

What you are saying is that it is OK for everybody but the Jews to do it?

No, you made that up.

Or is it that you ONLY object to Jews doing it?

No, you made that up as well.

You need work on your English comprehension sklls, Bruce.

Also, Right, Bruce - "Mommie Mommie, Johnny did it, too!!!"


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 03:30 PM

"No, you made that up"
Hiding behind "The Jews" has become a stock get-out for atrocity apologists such as Bruccie and Boo Boo.
It is deeply Antisemitic to blame "the Jews" for the war crimes and atrocities committed by the Israeli regime - doesn't seem to stop them doing it though
These crimes are ISRAELI not "Jewish" as the Antisemites would have us believe
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 03:30 PM

"No, you made that up"
Hiding behind "The Jews" has become a stock get-out for atrocity apologists such as Bruccie and Boo Boo.
It is deeply Antisemitic to blame "the Jews" for the war crimes and atrocities committed by the Israeli regime - doesn't seem to stop them doing it though
These crimes are ISRAELI not "Jewish" as the Antisemites would have us believe
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 03:38 PM

Bruce,

I don't think that China and Iran would cease to exist if there was a free and fair election. Most of the people within their borders are Chinese and Iranian. Israel is more like Apartheid South Africa. The governing elites are a minority and becoming more so.

BTW, I am not trying to convince you or anyone else of this. It is just my opinion that the Zionist experiment of a pure Jewish homeland has failed. I prefer peace to war.

BDS ended minority rule in South Africa and I believe it will in Palestine as well.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: bobad
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 04:08 PM

"There are a lot of words for how Israel and the people within its claimed borders are governed. Theocratic is partly descriptive and by far the kindest word."

And I guess the fact that it's a blatant lie doesn't matter - just one more lie with which to slander and hate.

"A theocratic government is one that is run by a singular religious group such as Judaism.."

If you are implying that this is representative of Israel's government then that is a fucking ignorant statement.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: bobad
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 04:22 PM

I guess the fact that the "Palestinians" who work for Jewish owned businesses in the west bank oppose BDS and are happy with their jobs and salaries means nothing to the boycotters who are so patronizingly doing what they believe is good for them.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 04:31 PM

"I guess the fact that the "Palestinians" who work for Jewish owned businesses in the west bank oppose BDS and are happy with their jobs and salaries means nothing to the boycotters who are so patronizingly doing what they believe is good for them. "

I suppose that their "happiness" is the reason that they are not allowed to vote in Israeli elections? :-D


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: bobad
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 04:41 PM

"I suppose that their "happiness" is the reason that they are not allowed to vote in Israeli elections?"

Huh???


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 04:54 PM

As I said to Bruce, Bobad. I'm not trying to convince you. I've expressed my opinion on what will happen, I think you have expressed your opinion on my opinion very clearly.

Are we done?


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: bobad
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 05:04 PM

"Before boycotting, they should think of the workers who are going to suffer," says a young man shivering in the pre-dawn darkness in Azzariah, a West Bank town cut off from work opportunities in Jerusalem by the concrete Israeli separation wall. Previously, he earned 20 shekels ($6) a day plucking and cleaning chickens; now he makes nearly 10 times that at SodaStream, which also provides transportation, breakfast, and lunch."

Palestinian workers back Scarlett Johansson's opposition to SodaStream boycott


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: bobad
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 06:32 PM

"It is just my opinion that the Zionist experiment of a pure Jewish homeland has failed."

Another blatant lie. Israel's population is 23% non Jewish who enjoy equal rights under Israel's laws. You do know that professing these kind of lies make you look like an anti-semite don't you?


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Feb 14 - 09:43 PM

I don't want to argue definitions with you Bobad.

BDS of Israel are 'Gathering Weight.'


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 12:47 AM

"Do you think that it would be possible to discuss your differences without the insults?"
.,,.
Very good question, Jack.

Unhappily, the answer would appear to be no, when it comes to potty-mouthed Greg F. I agree with whoever it was above who said he is best treated liked a buzzing mosquito, & with just as much respect. He is IMO the worst current avatar & practitioner of all that makes so many aspects of this forum a hissing & byword to so many who would like to use it for serious discussion.

~M~


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 03:08 AM

"just one more lie with which to slander and hate."
There is no argument that the Israeli regime has committed the crimes that they have.
Despite the fact that they have been protected fro the consequences of them by over 100 U.S. Sabra/Shatila,, chemical weapons on schools and hospitals, expansionism, attempting to starve Palestinians into submission, creating an Apartheid state.... all are a matter of record.
The only defence for their behaviour that has ever been put forward in these arguments is "Israel says they didn't do it" and these crimes against humanity are justified because Israel has a god-given right to occupy Palestine.
The main difference between the pros and antis is that whether these crimes Israelis the majority opinion here, or "Jewish" - the usual suspects.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 03:13 AM


There is no argument that the Israeli regime has committed the crimes that they have.


Of course there is!
You yourself have joined in many such arguments.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: bobad
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 06:43 AM

"I don't want to argue definitions with you Bobad."

It's not about definitions, it's about lies and abut using them to demonize a people. Shades of "The Protocols". Shame on you.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: bobad
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 07:03 AM

The most recent PSR poll showed that a slim majority of Palestinians would support a two state proposal that Abbas negotiated. It also showed that Palestinians opposed a one state arrangement by a two to one margin. The latest poll of Israelis was released a couple days ago. 63% of Hebrew-speaking Israeli respondents said they would support a negotiated regional peace agreement, even before they were given any details about the hypothetical agreement. When they were given the likely provisons of the Kerry proposal, then the number who said they would support it rose to 76%. Since Netanyahu might have to create a new political party in order to get a government agreeable to the Kerry initiative, the Israelis were asked if they would support Netanyahu if he engaged in that endearvor. 56% of respondents said they would.

IPI group API poll


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 08:07 AM

Still waiting, politely, for an explanation of why Arab Muslims should be given rights that Arab Jews are not ( re refugees)


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 08:47 AM

See above, Bruce RE: Mommy! Mommy! Johnny did it too!!!!!

Shades of "The Protocols". Shame on you.

Equating it to The Protocols of the Elders of Zion? Shame on HIM??


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 08:56 AM

Luv ya too, ~M~


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 09:18 AM

Still waiting, politely, for an explanation of why Arab Muslims should be given rights that Arab Jews are not ( re refugees).


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 09:25 AM

Because it would be a mitzvah worthy of a real mensch?


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 09:35 AM

You are not going to get that explanation from me Bruce. Your question is too loaded with definitions and assumptions which I would have to wade through.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 09:46 AM

Jack,

And the statements of those supporting BDS are NOT "too loaded with definitions and assumptions which (one) would have to wade through."?


So the answer is that we cannot discuss this, but must accept YOU viewpoint without questioning it, while having the opposing viewpoint ignored?

That sound like what GregF is in favor of, but you?


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 09:49 AM

77% of the "Jewish Homeland" was split off in 1924 or so to form the Kingdom of TransJordan, where Jews were not allowed to settle. This was by the Mandate Power ( GB) . The remainder was to be the new "Jewish Homeland"


Those were the LAST borders accepted by the Arab League. Shouldn't we go back to them?


YES or NO


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 09:51 AM

"The Jewish Homeland" as defined how and by whom?


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 09:54 AM

By the treaty ending WW I .

Are you advocating we get rid of it- and eliminate all the OTHER nations defined and created by it? Or is it just the "Jewish Homeland" that you object to?


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:01 AM

Are you advocating we get rid of it- and eliminate all the OTHER nations defined and created by it? Or is it just the "Jewish Homeland" that you object to?

None of the above.

Also, RE: the 1919 definition of "The Jewish Homeland": based on what evidence?


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: bobad
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:07 AM

"Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have also agreed that the Mandatory should be responsible for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 2nd, 1917, by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favor of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people"

The Palestine Mandate


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:19 AM

Thanks, BooBad, but the Balfour Declaration & the League of Nations Mandate do not speak to the definition/delineation of "The Jewish Homeland" by "the treaty ending WWI".

The former DOES contain the following, however:

"...it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine."


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:21 AM

Balfour Declaration, 1917
Conference of San demo, 1920
Treaty of Sevres, 1920
Treaty of Lausanne, 1923
Legue of Nations mandate 1922

In Sept, 1923, 77+% of the Mandate Palestine territory was split off, with Jewish settlement prohibited, to form the ARAB MUSLIM PALESTINIAN HOMELAND. The REMAINING 32+% was to be the "Jewish Homeland" as envisioned in the above treaties.

Feel free to negate the formation of the Jewish Homeland- S LONG AS you also negate the creation of Syria, Lebenon, Jordan,and Iraq, at a minimum.

"
Class A mandates consisted of the former Turkish provinces of Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, and Palestine. These territories were considered sufficiently advanced that their provisional independence was recognized, though they were still subject to Allied administrative control until they were fully able to stand alone. Iraq and Palestine (including modern Jordan and Israel) were assigned to Great Britain, while Turkish-ruled Syria and Lebanon went to France. All Class A mandates had reached full independence by 1949.
Class B mandates consisted of the former German-ruled African colonies of Tanganyika, parts of Togoland and the Cameroons, and Ruanda-Urundi. The Allied powers were directly responsible for the administration of these mandates but were subject to certain controls intended to protect the rights of the mandates' native peoples. Tanganyika (which is now part of Tanzania) was assigned to Britain, while most of the Cameroons and Togoland were assigned to France, and Ruanda-Urundi (now Rwanda and Burundi) went to Belgium.
Class C mandates consisted of various former German-held territories that mandatories subsequently administered as integral parts of their territory: South West Africa (now Namibia, assigned to South Africa), New Guinea (assigned to Australia), Western Samoa (now Samoa, assigned to New Zealand), the islands north of the Equator in the western Pacific (Japan), and Nauru (Australia, with Britain and New Zealand)."


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:24 AM

"...it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine."

Negated by the 1923 decision by the Mandate Power (Great Britain) to divide the Mandate territory ( In violation of the stated terms of the Mandate) and provide a Muslim ONLY nation in the greater part 9TransJordan) where Jewish settlement was prohibited..


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:28 AM

>>Jack,

And the statements of those supporting BDS are NOT "too loaded with definitions and assumptions which (one) would have to wade through."?


So the answer is that we cannot discuss this, but must accept YOU viewpoint without questioning it, while having the opposing viewpoint ignored?<<<

I'm not defending the statements supporting BDS. I don't even know what they are. It is not a matter of rhetoric for me.

You and I are friends. I have expressed my opinions about the effects of BDS, you have said why you think what I said is wrong. We can just leave it at that.

The reasons for the mass immigration of pan Arab Jews to Israel, are myriad and extremely complex. Suffice it to say that you seem to be saying that the only reason for that migration is that the Jews were forced out of Egypt, or Jordan or Iraq and that they had no place to go. I know that they were recruited by Israel and that there were other factors. Rather than get into that. I prefer to let your challenge stand, unquestioned.

I don't mind discussing the issue as a favor to you. But it has to be with the understanding that I am not trying to change your mind and I am not trying to change yours and that we both know where we stand already.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:34 AM

Jack: "
"The Palestinians and Israelis are the same race. Certainly they are as closely related as Swedes and Spaniards."

Yet the charge of Israel being racist has been put out here without any comment against it.


The Conflict is RELIGIOUS:

On one side you have the Muslims, who have driven out other religions (Bahai, Christian, Jewish)

On the other you have Israel, which

"Religion in Israel is a central feature of the country and plays a major role in shaping Israeli culture and lifestyle, and religion has played a central role in Israel's history. Israel is also the only country in the world where a majority of citizens are Jewish. According to the Israel Central Bureau of Statistics, the population in 2011 was 75.4% Jewish, 20.6% Arab, and 4.1% minority groups.[1] The religious affiliation of the Israeli population[vague] as of 2011 was 75.4% Jewish, 16.9% Muslim, 2.1% Christian, and 1.7% Druze, with the remaining 4.0% not classified by religion.[2]
Israel has no entrenched constitution, but freedom of religion is anchored in law. While the Basic Laws of Israel that serve in place of a constitution define the country as a "Jewish state," these Basic Laws, coupled with Knesset statutes, decisions of the Supreme Court of Israel, and various elements of the common law current in Israel, also protect free practice of religion in the country.[3][4] Legal accommodation of the non-Jewish communities follows the pattern and practice of the Ottoman and British administrations with some important modifications. Israeli law officially recognizes five religions, all belonging to the Abrahamic family of religions: Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Druzeism and the Bahá'í Faith. Furthermore, the law formally recognizes ten separate sects of Christianity: the Roman, Armenian, Maronite, Greek, Syriac, and Chaldean Catholic Churches; the Eastern Orthodox Greek Orthodox Church; the Oriental Orthodox Syriac Orthodox Church; the Armenian Apostolic Church; and Anglicanism.[5] Members of unrecognized religions are free to practice their religion.[3]"





Stringsinger:"Propaganda instead of facts. The UN didn't know they were about to kick out the people who were displaced otherwise they might have reconsidered."

This statement is contrary to reality. Look at 1936 - 1939.

It is a lie.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:36 AM

Negated by the 1923 decision by the Mandate Power...

Negated? How so?

negate the formation of the Jewish Homeland

I'm doing no such thing. I'm asking you how "The Jewish Homeland" per "the treaty ending WW I" was defined & delineated & based on what evidence.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:39 AM

FYI, about the mandate and UN declarations etc. I don't recognize the power of Britain or the UN to give away land that doesn't belong to them or indeed to meddle in the affairs of other states through the use of "declarations." History for the past 65 years, shows that Israelis do not put much store in UN declarations as well.

I do recognize the right and the power of people and countries to buy goods and services from whoever they please. Our carbonator is Primo, not soda stream.

I will never again rent a movie because Scarlett Johanson is the star as long as she supports the Palestinian aparthied. Small things I know, but more effective than mere talk.

I also recognize that Zionists, Christian or otherwise also have a right to vote wither their own pocketbooks.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:46 AM

Re: Theocracies

"ALL of (Vatican )City's actual citizens are Catholic as are all the places of worship."


Jack,

"The reasons for the mass immigration of pan Arab Jews to Israel, are myriad and extremely complex. Suffice it to say that you seem to be saying that the only reason for that migration is that the Jews were forced out of Egypt, or Jordan or Iraq and that they had no place to go. I know that they were recruited by Israel and that there were other factors. Rather than get into that. I prefer to let your challenge stand, unquestioned. "

Agreed, but so are the reasons that SOME of the Arab Muslims left Israel- A far larger percentage of Arab Muslims stayed in Israel than the number of Arab Jews who remained in Arab nations


"I don't mind discussing the issue as a favor to you. But it has to be with the understanding that I am not trying to change your mind and I am not trying to change yours and that we both know where we stand already."

I do not expect to change other's minds- most of those who support BDS do not seem willing to discuss reality, and many seem willing to apply their "fairness" standards to ONLY one side of the issue. But when I see a lie- ( statement contrary to reality, known to be false) presented, I will point it out.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:53 AM

do not seem willing to discuss reality, and many seem willing to apply their "fairness" standards to ONLY one side of the issue.

Hmmmm......

Bruce: do look in the mirror & encourage BoBad to do so as well.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:54 AM

Jack,

"FYI, about the mandate and UN declarations etc. I don't recognize the power of Britain or the UN to give away land that doesn't belong to them or indeed to meddle in the affairs of other states through the use of "declarations." History for the past 65 years, shows that Israelis do not put much store in UN declarations as well."

Once the ARABS refused to acknowledge the UN declaration of the state of Israel, AND THE UN STOOD BY WHEN THE ARAB LEAGUE ATTACKED, Israel had no reason to recognize later UN resolutions



"I do recognize the right and the power of people and countries to buy goods and services from whoever they please. Our carbonator is Primo, not soda stream."

I agree- but the selection to boycott ONLY the "Jewish" state, when other nations have done as bad or worse appears to reasonable people to be… anti-Jewish.



"I will never again rent a movie because Scarlett Johanson is the star as long as she supports the Palestinian aparthied. Small things I know, but more effective than mere talk."

Your choice.

"I also recognize that Zionists, Christian or otherwise also have a right to vote wither their own pocketbooks."

Exactly.

But to be consistent, BDS needs to be willing to boycott nations persecuting Jews, Christians, and Ba'hais. So far I have seen no indication of any targets other than Jews.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 10:57 AM

"
"I also recognize that Zionists, Christian or otherwise also have a right to vote wither their own pocketbooks.""

BTW, this would include any efforts by Israel to blockade Gaza and other territories from commerce WITH ISRAEL. correct?

After all , all the Palestinian territories have borders with other nations ( Egypt, Jordan) so Irael should not be forced to finance those who have stated their goals are the destruction of Israel.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 12:00 PM

"I don't recognize the power of Britain or the UN to give away land that doesn't belong to them or indeed to meddle in the affairs of other states through the use of "declarations.""

So the UN does NOT have the right to tell Israel what to do with the West Bank???


It was acquired in a war- JUST as the Allied Powers acquired the lands of the Ottoman Empire and split them up into those countries that you accept all of save Israel.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 12:03 PM

"
BTW, this would include any efforts by Israel to blockade Gaza and other territories from commerce WITH ISRAEL. correct?
"

You seem to be claiming that a boycott of goods and services exported to my country is the same as a military blockade of a concentration camp set up by the country that created that camp.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 12:23 PM

You mean it ain't, Jack?

Tthere ya go again,with "not ... willing to discuss reality, and many seem willing to apply their "fairness" standards to ONLY one side of the issue".

yeah, right.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 12:35 PM

"You seem to be claiming that a boycott of goods and services exported to my country is the same as a military blockade of a concentration camp set up by the country that created that camp."


No, ++I++ am claiming that Gaza and the West Bank have a border with other countries, so Israel is under no obligation to allor transport THROUGH Israel for Palestinian goods in OR out.

Have you any evidence of this "concentration camp " besides Palestinian propaganda?


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 01:16 PM

so Israel is under no obligation

Absolutely true- the Israeli government is under no OBLIGATION to act fairly, morally, justly, or even in accord with the humanitarian precepts of the Torah.


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Subject: RE: BS: BDS of Israel 'Gathering Weight.'
From: beardedbruce
Date: 28 Feb 14 - 01:27 PM

SO?


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