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Smartphones at sessions

Marje 04 Apr 14 - 01:00 PM
GUEST,twerp 04 Apr 14 - 01:15 PM
alex s 04 Apr 14 - 01:17 PM
GUEST,CS 04 Apr 14 - 01:30 PM
Crowhugger 04 Apr 14 - 01:51 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Apr 14 - 02:06 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Apr 14 - 02:07 PM
Jack Campin 04 Apr 14 - 02:09 PM
Bonzo3legs 04 Apr 14 - 02:20 PM
Greg F. 04 Apr 14 - 02:22 PM
GUEST 04 Apr 14 - 03:19 PM
GUEST 04 Apr 14 - 03:19 PM
GUEST 04 Apr 14 - 03:20 PM
Jeri 04 Apr 14 - 03:38 PM
GUEST 04 Apr 14 - 03:58 PM
Stringsinger 04 Apr 14 - 07:19 PM
GUEST 04 Apr 14 - 08:33 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Apr 14 - 08:51 PM
Leadfingers 05 Apr 14 - 06:07 AM
Marje 05 Apr 14 - 06:29 AM
Jack Campin 05 Apr 14 - 08:59 AM
GUEST,Joe 90 05 Apr 14 - 09:10 AM
GUEST 05 Apr 14 - 09:30 AM
Stu 05 Apr 14 - 09:39 AM
GUEST,Kittybriton 05 Apr 14 - 10:40 AM
Jim Carroll 05 Apr 14 - 10:47 AM
Greg F. 05 Apr 14 - 11:23 AM
Jack Campin 05 Apr 14 - 12:23 PM
GUEST 05 Apr 14 - 01:59 PM
GUEST,tapo 05 Apr 14 - 02:06 PM
Greg F. 05 Apr 14 - 02:06 PM
Joe Offer 05 Apr 14 - 03:04 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 14 - 03:39 PM
Greg F. 05 Apr 14 - 05:54 PM
Marje 06 Apr 14 - 04:29 AM
Musket 06 Apr 14 - 04:37 AM
Tattie Bogle 06 Apr 14 - 04:49 AM
Roger the Skiffler 06 Apr 14 - 05:42 AM
Will Fly 06 Apr 14 - 06:23 AM
Acorn4 06 Apr 14 - 04:46 PM
GUEST,Jenny sans cookie 07 Apr 14 - 10:43 AM
Jack Campin 07 Apr 14 - 11:18 AM
GUEST,silas 07 Apr 14 - 12:21 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Apr 14 - 02:43 PM
Jack Campin 07 Apr 14 - 03:04 PM
OlgaJ 07 Apr 14 - 03:28 PM
GUEST 07 Apr 14 - 03:34 PM
treewind 07 Apr 14 - 05:34 PM
Eric the Viking 07 Apr 14 - 06:21 PM
Steve Shaw 07 Apr 14 - 07:03 PM
GUEST 07 Apr 14 - 08:24 PM
Musket 08 Apr 14 - 06:51 AM
Mr Happy 08 Apr 14 - 11:22 AM
Paul Davenport 08 Apr 14 - 11:46 AM
Acorn4 08 Apr 14 - 12:17 PM
GUEST,Roderick Warner 08 Apr 14 - 07:38 PM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 14 - 07:45 PM
GUEST,davemc 09 Apr 14 - 08:25 AM
GUEST 11 Apr 14 - 03:16 AM
Joe Offer 11 Apr 14 - 04:12 AM
Musket 11 Apr 14 - 05:02 AM
GUEST 11 Apr 14 - 08:17 AM
GUEST,Kathy - Guest 12 Apr 14 - 02:50 AM
GUEST,Musket 12 Apr 14 - 03:02 AM
Jeri 12 Apr 14 - 08:14 AM
Steve Shaw 12 Apr 14 - 04:06 PM
GUEST,leeneia 13 Apr 14 - 05:46 AM
Musket 13 Apr 14 - 07:18 AM
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Subject: Smartphones at sessions
From: Marje
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 01:00 PM

Reading through the thread about the use of song books and electronic devices reminded me of a somewhat different issue that is now arising. Some people who attend music and song sessions have their smartphones on, and while others are playing or singing, they sit there twiddling at their phones, reading e-mails, texting or Facebooking.

Amd I alone in finding this extremely rude? I'm not talking about people who just happen to be in the pub or sitting in the background, I'm talking about musicians and singers who are at times active participants in the session.

If someone needs to make or receive a text or check for an urgent e-mail, I'd prefer it if they left the gathering and took themselves off into a corner to deal with whatever the matter is. Then they should switch off their gadget and engage properly with the shared experience of the session and with the people around them.

I don't think there's anything that can be done about it except to say here that I HATE this behaviour. Does anyone think it's acceptable?

Marje


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,twerp
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 01:15 PM

Spot on Marje


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: alex s
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 01:17 PM

I couldn't agree more - I had to tell someone to stop using his phone as he was sitting texting right next to....Jez Lowe!


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 01:30 PM

All 'bad behaviours' are acceptable in moderation. Chatting, texting, drumming a bit out of time or whatever. I think it only becomes a real issue when whatever it is genuinely - and consistently - impinges on the enjoyment of other participants.

As for smartphones in particular, I'm not sure why people who feel compelled to continually study their Facebook updates, even bother attending other forms of entertainment at all? At the cinema it's such a drag to have your eyes pulled away from the action by a brightly lit screen sat in front of you. Ugh!


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Crowhugger
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 01:51 PM

I find smartphones bothersome if the room is generally dark. As long as there is no offending sound (please set keying beeps to "off") and the glow isn't in noticeable contrast to the ambient lighting, no problem. For rooms kept darker during performances, it would indeed be lovely if the venue would reserve a few seats or tables at the back for e-fidgeters where the jiggling thumbs and lights won't be a distraction but to each other. I include phone-videorecording as a form of e- fidgeting.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 02:06 PM

I once kept half an eye on the whole second half of an England match on my iPhone. A goal precipitated a quick blast of Match Of The Day. :-) I need to be able to keep in touch when I'm in the pub as we live in a very remote area and we're not spring chickens. There is no phone signal so I rely on the pub's free wifi to pick up messages. No-one objects. Why would they (Well, the footie maybe, as they're all rugby nuts in Cornwall!). Stuff like this isn't going away, so let's live with it.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 02:07 PM

The volume was off during the match, by the way.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Jack Campin
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 02:09 PM

At some sessions, I have mine on the table set to the bus information app so I can tell how long I've got before I have to pack up and go. Anybody offended by that can get stuffed.

I don't feel any need to check on other media but I'm not bothered if other people do it.

I don't mind being filmed either, but NO VIDEO LIGHTS.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 02:20 PM

Not only are our local Town Council Meetings recorded and made available as a podcast on local internet radio - as if anyone is really interested!! Worse still, certain people tweet constantly from local Town Council Meetings like obsessed demons!


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Greg F.
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 02:22 PM

Am I alone in finding this extremely rude?

No, that's the me generation/millenials for ya though. Nobody matters but themselves.

All 'bad behaviours' are acceptable in moderation.

Nonsense. Being a little obnoxious is still being abnoxious.

I don't think there's anything that can be done about it...

Nonsense. Call them on it & Tell them to knock it off as loudly as necessary.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 03:19 PM

l go to a lot of music only sessions and l've never seen this situation arise because all the musicians are involved with what is going on, however sing arounds tend to showcase one person at a time (apart from the odd chorus)and unless they're worth listening to it's all too easy to become distracted.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 03:19 PM

l go to a lot of music only sessions and l've never seen this situation arise because all the musicians are involved with what is going on, however sing arounds tend to showcase one person at a time (apart from the odd chorus)and unless they're worth listening to it's all too easy to become distracted.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 03:20 PM

Dear Advice Columnist,

Every time I hear the word smartphone I think proctology. Is this something I should be ashamed of?

Confused in Des Moines


Dear Confused,

Only insofar as it's simpler to say would you please shove that phone up your!

Advice


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Jeri
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 03:38 PM

I


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 03:58 PM

Oy!


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Stringsinger
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 07:19 PM

If, with consideration, a smart phone is used to record a session, I can see how that would be useful to increase repertoire. But texting or reading a document rather than paying attention to what's going on musically and not showing respect for the people who are performing is inexcusable, a practice which is not only rude but socially detrimental and disrespectful of
folk music in general.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 08:33 PM

That's what shandy pots are for, baptising smartphones in. Waste of good beer otherwise.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 08:51 PM

But texting or reading a document rather than paying attention to what's going on musically and not showing respect for the people who are performing is inexcusable

Yebbut what if they suddenly start playing Breton or French-Canadian or bluegrass crap instead of Irish! Surely a bit of texting is excusable in such dire circumstances!


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Leadfingers
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 06:07 AM

It would be a LOT more politeto leave a session if the music is not to your taste than to fart about on a Fartphone when someone is performing


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Marje
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 06:29 AM

Thank you for the responses so far. So (on balance) I'm not going mad or becoming a boring old fart.

I don't expect people to be utterly attentive all the time they're not actually playing or singing - sometimes there are quiet conversations (often music-related) going on during a tune, for example. But at least that is still engaging and bonding with the people who are present in the room, rather than with people and events elsewhere.

Those who defend the habit might like to consider the "What-if-everyone-did-it?" argument. Imagine a session or a club where all those who were not actually playing or singing at any given moment chose to start reading Facebook, checking the football score or texting their friends. We'd lose the whole social cohesion and "crack", and the sense of shared experience that we (presumably) came there to enjoy.

Controlling it, though, is tricky. If it's a club, the MC could try to lay down some rules, but in an open session in a bar there's not much you can do - or is there? I do run a pub session, and am considering, next time I send an e-mail to remind people of the date, suggesting that they refrain from unnecesssary noodling on gadgets. Would that be acceptable to most of you who attend such sessions?

Marje


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Jack Campin
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 08:59 AM

I don't think it happens enough to be worth making offputting rules about.

The people who are most likely to get involved in their phones are also the ones least likely to accept the rules - semi-pro types texting about a gig later in the week.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,Joe 90
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 09:10 AM

So, bearing in mind the usual gradual process of covert intelligence agency security technology
eventually trickling down into specialist gadget shops..

is there not yet a readily available smartphone signal scrambling device,
functional over a localised vicinity - ie. a Pub, or Social Club ????


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 09:30 AM

Oldies can look up forgotten lyrics on their smartphones


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Stu
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 09:39 AM

Can't see the problem myself, and I don't think you can ever stop it.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,Kittybriton
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 10:40 AM

Like Stu I don't think you can hope to stop it, but I do think it's impolite. All I can suggest is give it some thought and see if you can find a way to deter folks from fiddling while you're on stage.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 10:47 AM

I was more than a little depressed to learn that smartphones were being used on a regular basis as an aide-memoir fro singers.
I thought reading from a text was bad enough, but this.... jeeeze
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Greg F.
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 11:23 AM

and I don't think you can ever stop it.

Particulary if folks don't complain!


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Jack Campin
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 12:23 PM

When the whole culture of sessions and singarounds is largely seen by the public as an anorakish hobby of grumpy old moaners, it doesn't help to start laying down the law over trivia and prove them right.

If you want to stop people looking at their phones, up your performance to a level where that's all they want to pay attention to. If your song can't compete with Facebook, the problem is not with Facebook.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 01:59 PM

Where does knitting on stage if you are the singer while the rest of the band play instrumentals come into this ?


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,tapo
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 02:06 PM

Like talking in a session when people are playing, it's quite simply bad manners.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Greg F.
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 02:06 PM

If you want to stop people looking at their phones, up your performance to a level where that's all they want to pay attention to

So its OUR fault that techno-addicted self-absorbed narcissistic clods are techno-addicted self-absorbed narcissistic clods?

Amusing. In a pathetic sort of way.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Joe Offer
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 03:04 PM

I think CS said something above that's worth repeating: All 'bad behaviours' are acceptable in moderation. Chatting, texting, drumming a bit out of time or whatever. I think it only becomes a real issue when whatever it is genuinely - and consistently - impinges on the enjoyment of other participants.

And that's the truth.

My mother-in-law lived with us until she died. In her last couple of years, we had to have a phone with us the few times we were able to go out together, and it was important for us to be able to answer calls or texts immediately. People who have kids may have an even more pressing need to keep in touch.

And yes, some people do Facebook and other distracting stuff - but there are also many legitimate needs for using phones at sessions.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 03:39 PM

Context is everything. I rest my case.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Greg F.
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 05:54 PM

People who have kids may have an even more pressing need to keep in touch.

And how did hunanity ever manage to survive, raise kids, and care for elderly relatives before cell phones existed?

And 99% of the techno-adddicts on the face of the earth have absolutely NO need for minite-to-minute "communication". They only think they're that important and essential.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Marje
Date: 06 Apr 14 - 04:29 AM

What I'm talking about is the compulsive, repeated checking of e-mails or Facebook and exchanging of texts throughout the evening.

Jack: I'm not talking about being "on stage". I'm talking about a group of musicians and singers sitting around in a bar together to make music. But if I'm attenidng a club with a stage, I'd be delighted if the MC were to suggest that the audience shoud have the courtesy to give the perfomers their full attention. You don't sit in a club and openly read the paper or do the crossword, or get out your laptop, so why is a smartphone any better?

And Joe, as I've said earlier, anyone who has an urgent need to make or answer a call can easily move away into a corner and concentrate on that for as long as it takes. That's not a problem. But if your kids or your elderly relative need to be in contact every five minutes, they really need someone at home with them.

And no, it doesn't happen often - yet - and that's why I am minded to make some comment about it now. Once a few people start to do it regularly, it gets a bit personal for anyone object to it.

Smartphones can be helpful, though: you can get an app to deliver your chosen note, like a pitchpipe. And a metronome app. And - best of all - an app that responds to a note and tells you its pitch. We tried this at an unaccompanied session I go to, and established that the bell that sits on the bar is in G#, so now we can use the bell to find our starting note (does upset the bar staff, though, when we ring it for this purpose!).

Marje


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Musket
Date: 06 Apr 14 - 04:37 AM

Relating to a similar thread... People leafing through books deciding what they are going to sing next whilst you are singing gets my goat. I might just tether it to the back of their car....

My phone did once go off whilst a friend was singing, which was rather embarrassing, as I thought I had switched it to vibrate. There are certain things I have to be 24/7 available for, but there are also ways of being discreet.....

Thinking on, I once said a song had been written in 1959, and at the end of the song some pedantic pillock, in all seriousness rather than fun had looked it up and was so proud of himself when he loudly corrected me. It was 1958.

I tend to run out of goats now and then....


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Tattie Bogle
Date: 06 Apr 14 - 04:49 AM

I agree with Marje. It irritates me no end to see people sitting there Facebooking, texting etc while someone else is singing, plainly not giving the singer even a fraction of their attention (have just made same point on the other thread). It is just plain rude, and I'm becoming a GOW.
If people must have their phones visible to receive important messages, including bus times, family emergencies etc, then if the phone does go off (silently please) move away to answer it, as Marje also suggested.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 06 Apr 14 - 05:42 AM

I see smartphones and tablets now being used as backing tracks, tuners, lyric cribs, set lists all the time at local open mic sessions, as well as cameras. Musicians also use them instead of wristwatches to time sets. For a long time I've noticed the first thing musicians do after coming off stage is switch their phones back on and check for calls (has my agent fixed me that Albert Hall gig?).

RtS
(You don't call, you don't write...)


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Will Fly
Date: 06 Apr 14 - 06:23 AM

I once had a young chap at a session/singaround I run look up a song he obviously had never heard of before on his smartphone. He then proceeded to sing it to a tune of his own devising. It was awful. Everyone there cringed. At the the of the session I spoke quietly to him and said that it wasn't on - he was welcome to the session, but had to have the courtesy to us all of being slightly prepared for it. And that was the end of him.

And that's the only time I've ever had to do that. I accept music folders and music stands at my session - after all its about getting together and making music in a social way, not a performance - but I don't particularly like it. And I hate it at clubs when floor singers get up with music stands or read/play from sheets. It's something I've never done. And my answer, to those who say they have difficulty in memorising words for a club performance, is: Tough. If you're not in a position to perform properly, you shouldn't be doing it. If you were a member of the MCC, you wouldn't expect a god-given right to play if you didn't have the skill. Why should music be any different?

As to the argument that orchestral players use music, that's a no-brainer. The difference between the skills needed to play a long and complex and probably annotated score - given that most conductors will dictate that the score be played to their interpretation - and the skills needed to perform a couple of floor spot songs - is immense.

Can someone explain to me why, forty and fifty years ago, no-one ever used a music stand or music folders or books or other aide memoires in folk clubs - at least, not in my experience? It just wasn't done. If your response to that is that it's the same population, just forty years older, who've grown geriatric, then my answer is the same. You may like performing as a floor singer in a club, but if you're incapable of doing it properly, then you shouldn't.

Come the day when I'm incapable of playing or singing or performing as I have done over the years, then that's the day I jack it in. I just hope I have the common sense to recognise when that day comes and the guts to apply my own principles to myself!


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Acorn4
Date: 06 Apr 14 - 04:46 PM

"What a clever little chap I am",
Said the zippy little man,
"With this clever little gadget
I'm holding in my hand"

I'd like to tell the world at large,
Being Einstein is a doddle.
It does all my thinking for me
And I've got the latest model!"

Well, let me tell you something,
You're way off beam, my son,
Your 'smart' phone just enables you
More stupid to become.

So, do everyone a favour,
And, just once, for a change,
Switch off your clever gadget
And start to use your brains!


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,Jenny sans cookie
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 10:43 AM

No, we won't ever stop it if no-one has the guts to complain.

And there's no excuse for bad manners - so why put up with it?

I stop singing/playing until the offender desists - try it, it works.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Jack Campin
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 11:18 AM

You might well succeed in stopping it by complaining loudly and rudely enough.

You might also succeed in sending your session down the U-bend of history in the process.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,silas
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 12:21 PM

Oh jenny - if only that worked! I'd get my smartphone out more often if it stopped some of the crappier performers


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 02:43 PM

Heheh. Just what I was thinking.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Jack Campin
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 03:04 PM

You want one with a REALLY BIG screen, and face away from the American Pie perpetrator so he can see you're playing Angry Birds on it. (Or, perhaps, see that you're watching a Don McLean video).


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: OlgaJ
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 03:28 PM

Acorn4

What tune do you use for this? We might pinch it!


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 03:34 PM

Father John Misty has the appropriate smartphone app for ignored performers right here:

http://gallerydaily.com/daily/2013/10/11/collecting-memories-collecting-rocks


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: treewind
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 05:34 PM

When Les Ivall was still the landlord of the John O'Gaunt in Sutton, he didn't like anyone using a mobile phone in his pub. There were several phones nailed to the wooden beam over the bar as a warning to others.

Will Fly - well done! Nobody deserves to take the piss like that and get away with it, and as then, a quiet polite word is often all that's needed. Some people really don't know how to behave and need to be told.

I don't mind people using a smartphone to record tunes, though in some cases where regular sessions are involved it would be nice if they came back to later sessions showing some sign of having learned any of them.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Eric the Viking
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 06:21 PM

I know a couple of people who use their phones to read the lyrics while they are actually playing a song. It doesn't bother me, nor does talking while I am singing or waiting to start. I think it is not possible to expect quietness from people in sessions as they are often held in public bars. There are places where you have to sing over the piped music or the background TV, especially when football is on (why people are so concerned with football is beyond me). I keep my phone on silent with vibrate and very rarely take it out of my pocket during a folk night. I do have to agree with Will Fly as I know several who only ever sing from a book or with the music in front of them (Complete with chord shapes) I find it strange given that they have a repertoire of only several songs which they trot out week after week. I am sure that for the small number of songs they sing, they could learn them off by heart. But you can get gigs in noisy places such as the odd rugby club with a noisy crowd and bar. Then it is just tough and you battle through. If you are able to capture the audience the atmosphere will spread and you can actually get listened to by the majority. There are always likely to be phones going off in public places. A few years ago nobody would have thought about holding a conversation with someone on the phone while sitting having a shit or pee in the bog, but I know it happens.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 07:03 PM

why people are so concerned with football is beyond me

Because Liverpool are top of the table! Tsk...


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 08:24 PM

I have got a use for mine in a session, though - it's got a tuner app on it.

One of the reasons the old singers didn't have to have the words is that the older ballads tend to be on the long side. You either know it or you don't. But even so, there was always dispute, for example in the Sheffield Carols variations or the Suffolk tradition. There, it was likely to turn to violence - one concertina player was renowned for his ability to play it behind his head, to avoid damage in the brawl in front. Another managed to sing his piece while attempting to remove the bowler hat jammed down over his ears. And in those circumstances, what good will sheet music do you?

On the other hand, I've just done a few sessions with one of the pro bands: they score the lot. What's the difference between an amateur and a pro? Am amateur practices until he gets it right. A pro until he can't get it wrong. The difference is the pro has the dots to refer to to check what's right, the other sort of remembers how it goes. And yes, the seven pieces in the half-hour set came to close on a hundred pages of music, nobody can reasonably be expected to remember that lot. But then again, you couldn't possibly get a hundred pages of music on a smartphone, nor even usably on a tablet.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Musket
Date: 08 Apr 14 - 06:51 AM

Typical scousers. Lowering the sanctity of the league table.......

I haven't done this live yet, but having tried it out a few times at home... For concerts with my PA (as opposed to singarounds / sessions) I have purchased an iRig interface, and with this plugged into the guitar, short lead to my iphone in my pocket and then Bluetooth out to my mixer, (bought a Bluetooth receiver with phono out)

Before long, only we traditional folk bods will still be using smart phones to entertain each other at singarounds.....


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Mr Happy
Date: 08 Apr 14 - 11:22 AM

Why are they called 'Smartphones'?


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Paul Davenport
Date: 08 Apr 14 - 11:46 AM

Thanks Greg F, yes, it might be our age but some values regarding politeness should be timeless.
However, after pushing our failing memories to learn and remember a song, having worked at it and rehearsed it we then sang it out in our local session. A while later we went to the session and, before we could get our mouths open, a young singer sang the song we'd so carefully researched and rehearsed. It seems that the individual had not been texteing during our song's debut performance but had been recording!
Now I have an opinion on this kind of behaviour…in my day you listened carefully to the singer and, over quite a long period the song would insert itself into your brain, oddly, in a highly individual version. But now?…I guess it's no longer my day…?
Paul


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Acorn4
Date: 08 Apr 14 - 12:17 PM

Olga,

No tune it's just a poem - you're welcome to put a tune to it if you want.

DT


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,Roderick Warner
Date: 08 Apr 14 - 07:38 PM

Smartphones... Brilliant invention. When the socially challenged get out their songbooks to drone through a relatively simple song and one doesn't want another drink, they help to pass the time in a more entertaining manner than the drivel being offered.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Apr 14 - 07:45 PM

I use mine to watch telly or read The Guardian (employing the pub wifi) if my mates start playing bluegrass or French-Canadian muck instead of Irish/Scottish/Northumbrian.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,davemc
Date: 09 Apr 14 - 08:25 AM

I enjoy reading whilst the club residents are inflicting their "lets play the same old tired stuff, again, dreadfully" on us while we're waiting for the guest turn to come on. It's the only thing that makes the evening palatable... I'd be happy to get rid of the reading matter if we could just head for the main act without doing penance.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Apr 14 - 03:16 AM

To Marje,

I can understand completely your frustration with people who are rude and cannot refrain from using their smart phone/cell phone while at a venue during a singer's performance.
I think the MC SHOULD DEFINITELY say something about it and ask people to please refrain from using/texting on their Smart phones before the performance starts for the evening. I just cannot understand how people can be so rude - no manners - no respect for the person who is singing.
Yes, you may not enjoy every singer performing or the genre of music they are playing - but I don't understand why a person cannot get up and go into the other room or to their car - or somewhere if they feel compelled to use their smart phone during the time a singer is on the stage. It is so disrespectful and just terrible manners.
It's funny because I was recently reading an article in the newspaper about how people nowadays are rude and manners just don't seem to matter anymore to a lot of people.
For example: I was in the bank and waiting to go to the teller window.
A woman who was ahead of me was waiting and when she reached the teller she continued to talk on her cell phone.
A guy walking down the street just about ran right into me as I was walking. He was texting, texting with his head down as he walked - with no regards to what he was doing because of his continual texting and walking.

I'm afraid it is only going to get worse but Marje please try your best to address it at a music event you MC. Or perhaps you can have little cards made up - nothing fancy to put on tables asking people to please not use their smart phone/cell phone during the performance.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Joe Offer
Date: 11 Apr 14 - 04:12 AM

Yup.

Using a smartphone at a session, is about as rude as posting in an Internet forum without giving one's name.....

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Musket
Date: 11 Apr 14 - 05:02 AM

Depends if deep down you are proud of what you post...

Using pieces of paper or using a Smartphone - both may be the media you use. I sing without anything but my iPhone does have a list of songs, keys, styles and first lines, so just before I play, you may well see me looking at the screen.

Heres another thing. If it wasn't for my iPhone, I would probably spend at least two hours longer each day at the office. So probably wouldn't make it to a folk club. In my case, I sometimes struggle as it is. Fed up of posting my apologies on a local club's permathread...

Of course, anyone treating a folk club as a train in my presence is liable to waddle towards the gents carefully to uninsert what I have just inserted.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Apr 14 - 08:17 AM

Using a smartphone at a session, is about as rude as posting in an Internet forum without giving one's name.....
On a forum designed to permit anonymous posting its no ruder than using a pseudonym


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,Kathy - Guest
Date: 12 Apr 14 - 02:50 AM

To Mr. Joe Offer:

Before you pass judgment on me - I am brand new to this forum and was really tired when I wrote it. Somehow, I just forgot to put my name on the From box, and went straight to the area to post message. It was not done intentionally. NOT DONE ON PURPOSE. I was just tired at the time.

Kathy

P.S. You are calling me rude before you even know the circumstances.
You are assuming it was intentional or something - it wasn't!

Are you so perfect and never overlooked something or made a mistake because you were tired at the time? Ever?? FROM KATHY


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 12 Apr 14 - 03:02 AM

Mmm. Lessons in humility are normally " below the line. "

To be fair to Joe, when he was a moderator he had to handle lots of anonymous swiping and must have had to trawl IP addresses all day long to keep up and moderate.

The web page does allow non members and does allow you to post without an entry in the name box. Kathy has just found that. My iPad allows me to be logged in but my iPhone doesn't. I have to remember and don't always manage it.

Methinks Joe could have considered adding the word "purposely" to his statement with my wonderful 20:20 hindsight.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Jeri
Date: 12 Apr 14 - 08:14 AM

Joe's still a volunteer, but he chooses to archive things and not deal with messages he thinks shouldn't be here, except to complain and make those complaints the issue. When does THAT become "trolling"? It certainly is more disruptive than people posting without names.

If someone's at a performance, they really shouldn't be using a smart phone, but I assume some people HAVE to be able to receive calls/texts/e-mail, although I'd think the sound should be off and people should take any actual calls outside. The hard part is us not knowing if it's necessary for them, and judging everyone the same. No one can control other people, and it's less frustrating to you and annoying to others to just control what YOU do.

...whether it's getting upset about people using smartphones when you think it's inappropriate, or posting without a name.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Apr 14 - 04:06 PM

Someone farts in our sessions every half hour, on the half hour. Unlike offensive persons with smartphones, s/he can do that without being identified. Bastard.


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 13 Apr 14 - 05:46 AM

"Sure, you can use your phone all you want. Just don't expect to be a real member of the group, and don't ask me for any big favors."


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Subject: RE: Smartphones at sessions
From: Musket
Date: 13 Apr 14 - 07:18 AM

It couldn't be me Steve. Last time I dropped a silent but violent in a lift, I was outed because tears were rolling down my face and desperately stifling the laughter that eventually came as I staggered out of the lift with my two colleagues calling me everything from a pig to a dog.

True story. I was in a punk band when I were a lad, and at a gig (Porterhouse at Retford, we were the support band for The Damned) our drummer decided to let a fart go as he was energetically drumming. To cut a long story short, he followed through. He was only allowed in the van once he had ditched his grots and jeans and was wearing a sheet we used to protect my back line amp...

Their drummer, the legendary Rat Scabies, was impressed.....

Your 30 mins old faithful is nothing to that night. We were only two songs in..


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