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BS: Guns and Cars

GUEST,CS 07 Oct 14 - 03:29 AM
Lighter 07 Oct 14 - 07:36 AM
MGM·Lion 07 Oct 14 - 07:51 AM
Rapparee 07 Oct 14 - 08:12 AM
GUEST,CS 07 Oct 14 - 09:59 AM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 07 Oct 14 - 10:08 AM
Mrrzy 07 Oct 14 - 10:54 AM
olddude 07 Oct 14 - 10:59 AM
Jeri 07 Oct 14 - 11:19 AM
meself 07 Oct 14 - 11:34 AM
Ebbie 07 Oct 14 - 12:01 PM
Wesley S 07 Oct 14 - 01:17 PM
Joe_F 07 Oct 14 - 08:53 PM
Rapparee 07 Oct 14 - 10:30 PM
GUEST 08 Oct 14 - 12:25 AM
GUEST 08 Oct 14 - 12:30 AM
olddude 08 Oct 14 - 12:33 AM
GUEST 08 Oct 14 - 12:43 AM
LadyJean 08 Oct 14 - 12:48 AM
olddude 08 Oct 14 - 12:57 AM
olddude 08 Oct 14 - 12:57 AM
Richard Bridge 08 Oct 14 - 07:31 AM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 08 Oct 14 - 08:20 AM
GUEST,Rahere 08 Oct 14 - 09:08 AM
Rapparee 08 Oct 14 - 09:39 AM
Ebbie 08 Oct 14 - 11:52 AM
olddude 08 Oct 14 - 12:06 PM
Ebbie 08 Oct 14 - 03:55 PM
olddude 08 Oct 14 - 04:09 PM
Ebbie 08 Oct 14 - 04:30 PM
Musket 08 Oct 14 - 04:51 PM
Ebbie 08 Oct 14 - 05:21 PM
Bill D 08 Oct 14 - 06:35 PM
olddude 08 Oct 14 - 07:47 PM
GUEST,CS 09 Oct 14 - 04:26 AM
GUEST 09 Oct 14 - 03:06 PM
GUEST,Troubadour 09 Oct 14 - 03:17 PM
GUEST,sciencegeek 09 Oct 14 - 03:57 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 10 Oct 14 - 12:26 PM
GUEST,Punkfolkrocker 10 Oct 14 - 12:41 PM
olddude 10 Oct 14 - 05:48 PM

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Subject: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 03:29 AM

Serious question, why do guns and cars always feature prominently in all US Sci-Fi series? I'm talking especially about the ones set in the dystopian future after society has crumbled. A future where there are no factories working, no mass transport operating, no oil rigs or refineries functioning, no bullets being produced, no car parts being built. Yet time and time again, our future heroes are inundated with guns, endless bullets, working vehicles, and mysterious supplies of petrol. I love US Sci-fi, I find it fun and engaging, escapist and usually conceptually far stronger than British attempts, but FFS! the guns and cars! Please US Sci-Fi screenwriters, do us a favour and try to break out of the mould, there are more than enough guns and cars in every other genre, try to imagine a more realistic future where guns and cars are redundant and people have to find other ways to address their challenges. Argh! Rant over :D


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Lighter
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 07:36 AM

Without guns and cars, people would just sit around in a post-apocalyptic wasteland bitching and moaning, warning audiences about H-bombs, lethal airborne viruses, and global warming.

With them, they can chase and shoot each other.

Now really, which movie would the masses prefer to see?


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 07:51 AM

VroooooommmmmmVrooooommmmmVroooommmmm

BanggggBangggggg

Another little·green·man bites the Cosmic Dust


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Rapparee
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 08:12 AM

"Hunger Games" uses bows. The Ring Trilogy used almost everything EXCEPT guns.

Nobody asks, though, where the fuel for the cars comes from or the ammunition for the guns. Both take a manufacturing society to supply them...along with the explosives, etc.

Yeah, you could make them at home but it's not a really good idea.

Perhaps someone should make a movie that's REALLY after a social collapse -- years after, when people sit around in huts and bands of sociopaths roam the forests and...wait, that's after the fall of Rome.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 09:59 AM

Exacerly Rapparee, we were watching 'Dominion' last night (near future, society as we know it in pieces, evil angels (yes really)) and the hero is roaring around in a 4x4 killing evil angels with his trusty gun!

Then there's Falling Skies, same deal with aliens instead of evil angels, no manufacturing of any kind, but mysteriously the cars and guns still save the day - and against far superior tech at that.

And don't forget The Walking Dead too, though there is at least the black woman with her kitano sword, I suppose.

I blame the Mad Max trilogy; while I enjoy the Dieselpunk vibe, a world full of fully functioning guns and cars and where caches of bullets and petrol never seem to run out, in a future where nothing is being made or indeed transported anymore, is a nonsense. It'd just be good to see more writers thinking outside the box and giving us dystopian visions where people engage their knowledge and creativity in order to survive rather than remaining dependent on anachronistic crutches.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 10:08 AM

How well would the Mad Max trilogy have worked with bicycle stunts and chases...???


Having said that, as a life long pedestrian / cyclict / non car owner,
I thoroughly enjoyed "Premium Rush" 2012.

A very exciting road chase thriller pitting a reckless young cycle courier against a corrupt cop

- excellent entertainment !!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Mrrzy
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 10:54 AM

In The Walking Dead there is an issue with fuel for the vehicles, at least. But are all US movies gun- and car-heavy, not just the scifi? Maybe it's that we like driving and shooting? Eats, shoots and commutes?


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: olddude
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 10:59 AM

The kid on znation uses a sling shot with bolts. He can remove a zombie at 100 yards. No scope to dope either and no need to find amm. or reload. The ggirl uses a spiked baseball bat. Me I would op for a samurai sword


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Jeri
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 11:19 AM

I'm blaming Mad Max for the cars/gasoline plot thing. I'm not sure how zombie culture got to be so big. Maybe it has to do with politics.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: meself
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 11:34 AM

It's a guy thing: cars and guns are fun. So are explosions, for that matter. That's about as deep as it goes.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Ebbie
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 12:01 PM

Maybe we need more women writing scripts. I don't mean sacharin (sp?) stories that insist on happy endings but well-rounded depictions of what life would be like in a formerly-civilised world that has to survive reduced expectations.

Come to think of it- a man could do it. :)


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Wesley S
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 01:17 PM

In America the culture dictates that having your own car equals freedom. And we love excess - so our protagonists tend to shoot as many bullets as possible - sometimes without even looking for a target. Just once on the Walking Dead I'd love to see someone say - I'm down to X number of bullets so I need to conserve. And they rarely reload. At least on camera.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Joe_F
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 08:53 PM

Series of *what*?


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Rapparee
Date: 07 Oct 14 - 10:30 PM

In the military it's called "spray and pray."


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 12:25 AM

A large number of Americans know how to work on cars, and Americans buy ammo. There will be plenty of both in a post-apocalyptic world.

If there is a total energy failure tomorrow, 1 million will die within 1 hour. 60% will die within 12 months. 90% will die within 24 months. So that means even MORE cars and guns for the survivors. Like myself. I want one of the new Dodge Hellcats and a trunk full of guns. I'll scare up my own freakin gasoline.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 12:30 AM

http://www.drivesrt.com/2015/challenger-srt-hellcat/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNwDvS8PnmQ


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: olddude
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 12:33 AM

You are my kinda good ole boy. Wanna talk ballistic stuff


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 12:43 AM

The Ghost Gunner. This will be a game changer.

http://www.shtfplan.com/headline-news/ghost-gunner-ar-15-home-printer-hits-the-market-no-serial-number-no-background-check-and-no-waiting-period_10062014


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: LadyJean
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 12:48 AM

Because 18 to 35 year old males love car chases and people being "blown away" in gunfights. And television producere love 18 to 35 year old males.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: olddude
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 12:57 AM

Naw have to have a ma duece for zombies


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: olddude
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 12:57 AM

And a humbee


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 07:31 AM

Scrapyards will provide car parts for quite a long time. Mad Max featured many home-made/modified vehicles. It also featured primitive oil wells and refineries, and methane production from chickenshit (and human shit works too).

Except in the sad mad gun-loving USA, where murder is more acceptable than sex, firearms are going to be relatively rare and ammunition at a premium.

If low-tech flammables can be manufactured, expect flamethrowers.


Why is it done as it is in films? It's a self-perpetuating stream of propaganda that coercion is admirable, and that those who are coerced are sub-human.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 08:20 AM

I watch enough low quality exploitation B movies and big budget sci fi blockbusters
to have developed a very forgiving attitude towards 'suspension of disbelief'...

So I just give a generous dose of benefit of the doubt to any post apocalyptic action genre films and TV shows...

For instance, that never ending supply of bullets ?

I'll just presume a return to pre-industrial-revolution manufacturing methods.

i.e blokes out in their sheds making their own black powder and lead moulded projectiles,
then haphazardly refilling spent bullent casings.

Of which there would be a plentiful supply, at least in post civilisation collapse USA....

Btw I finally got round to wathing "Open Range" last night.
A truly excellent 'naturalistic' cowboy film..
Except for one jarring instant when Kevin Costner manages to get something like 17 continuous shots
without reloading his 1870s pistol....???


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST,Rahere
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 09:08 AM

Ah, it's making the percussion caps which will sink the refillers.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Rapparee
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 09:39 AM

Pound the spent cartridge casings into arrowheads. With any kind for luck you can re-use arrows.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Ebbie
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 11:52 AM

My little daughter once proclaimed: I"m glad I'm not a boy!

When pressed, she explained, They can get a mustache, you know.

Kind of my thinking right now: I'm glad I'm not a boy.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: olddude
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 12:06 PM

Lol EBBIE yes it's difficult being in our skin


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Ebbie
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 03:55 PM

lol


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: olddude
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 04:09 PM

All we ever think about is how big our guns are aaah bullet kind or other :)


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Ebbie
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 04:30 PM

I read once that if a man responds with "Nothing" when you ask him what he's thinking, believe it. lol


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Musket
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 04:51 PM

Guns are prevalent in most Hollywood scripts due to the odd American idea of government not being able to provide for you so the only way is to have guns / ignore the law / throw your badge at the commissioner etc.

This side of the pond we see it as escapist entertainment. There again, we appear to see fat gypsies getting married as entertainment so best not get too excited eh?

The only science fiction here is when you see American cars managing to go round bends fast.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Ebbie
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 05:21 PM

hohohoho, Musket. :)


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Bill D
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 06:35 PM

I worked in grocery stores from about 12 on, so I never got the message about where guys go to get their gonads wired directly to a device that sends a signal to the accelerator of a car.

I missed out on a lot, I guess... but I almost got killed in a car with a guy who found the secret location early.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: olddude
Date: 08 Oct 14 - 07:47 PM

you forgot the zombies, cause if you shoot at them and miss, us guys can pound our chest and still say, well that guys dead


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 09 Oct 14 - 04:26 AM

I think Wesley has a point above. I'm not a US citizen but looking in from the outside, it does seem that there is a strong cultural identification between cars and guns and the 'idea' of Freedom and Liberty which is of course the great mantra of the US.

Whether it's true or not, that US citizens are the most free on earth is another matter, what's important is that the purchasing and possessing of such objects, tends - or so it appears - to be identified with the *belief* that one is free.

Dystopian future visions often (always?) include a narrative of anarchy versus oppression; freedom fighters liberating themselves from some invasion, or other form of tyranny. I suspect the guns and cars are by virtue of that association - and more particularly from a classically masculine perspective - are possibly intrinsically linked to such a vision, hence their bafflingly anachronistic (to me) ominpresence in such productions.

I say 'classically masculine', as I also think Ebbie may have something here concerning masculine and feminine 'perspectives' say - and though I don't want to get into a discussion about gender - the most apt contrast to the 'guns and cars' meme is one of my favourite books: Margaret Atwood's Handmaid's Tale about how women freedom fighters in an oppressive dystopian future, utilise psychological weapons such as intelligence, sex and secrecy, in the stead of guns and cars.

Any thoughts?


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Oct 14 - 03:06 PM

"I'm blaming Mad Max for the cars/gasoline plot thing."

Actually Jeri, Mad Max 1 was set in a lawless time, but there was still a viable society, with filling stations available and a police force, of which Max was an officer.

Mad Max 2 was based around the battle for an oil well and small refinery, which kind of negates your argument, being self consistent and logical.

Thunderdome would fit into your description to some extent, though the number of vehicles was tiny.

I think there are much better examples.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST,Troubadour
Date: 09 Oct 14 - 03:17 PM

"Lol EBBIE yes it's difficult being in our skin "

Dan's right. It's a hard job, but we have to do it.

After all, without boys, there'd be NO girls either.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 09 Oct 14 - 03:57 PM

while still restricted to written material, the 1631 Ring of Fire series & online projects include both stories and articles dealing with 21st century Americans "relocated" into the 17th century.

very enjoyable & lots of guns & cars & effort to keep 'em coming... LOL


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 10 Oct 14 - 12:26 PM

I enjoyed the old Hawaii 5-0, but the remake series with a second-rate Claude Van Damm type with automatic weapons and another guy who seems stoned is terrible.


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: GUEST,Punkfolkrocker
Date: 10 Oct 14 - 12:41 PM

Probably the best recent unashamedly Bloke's TV show is "Strike Back"

Series 1 - ok, finding it's feet..

series 2 & 3 - yeah, proper blood and guts chases and shoot outs..

Next year's series 4 will be the last....


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Subject: RE: BS: Guns and Cars
From: olddude
Date: 10 Oct 14 - 05:48 PM

Strike back is a decent show for sure I like it


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Mudcat time: 21 April 7:48 PM EDT

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