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BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?

GUEST,catrenne 01 Dec 14 - 10:00 AM
GUEST,Ed 01 Dec 14 - 01:31 PM
GUEST,Derek Schofield 01 Dec 14 - 02:19 PM
GUEST,Rahere 01 Dec 14 - 04:40 PM
GUEST,henryp 01 Dec 14 - 05:30 PM
GUEST,Derek Schofield 01 Dec 14 - 05:32 PM
MoorleyMan 01 Dec 14 - 07:10 PM
GUEST,richheadey 02 Dec 14 - 03:26 AM
Brian Peters 02 Dec 14 - 05:04 AM
Brian Peters 02 Dec 14 - 05:09 AM
Brian Peters 02 Dec 14 - 05:23 AM
Wheatman 02 Dec 14 - 06:04 AM
Brian Peters 02 Dec 14 - 06:07 AM
GUEST,Mr Blue 09 Dec 14 - 12:42 PM
GUEST,Henry Piper of Ottery 09 Dec 14 - 02:45 PM
Steve Gardham 09 Dec 14 - 05:00 PM
GUEST,Derek Schofield 09 Dec 14 - 07:02 PM
Ross Campbell 09 Dec 14 - 09:42 PM
GUEST,Henry Piper of Ottery 10 Dec 14 - 04:31 AM
Steve Gardham 10 Dec 14 - 04:10 PM
Big Al Whittle 10 Dec 14 - 05:22 PM
Steve Gardham 10 Dec 14 - 06:00 PM
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Subject: Scarborough Fair
From: GUEST,catrenne
Date: 01 Dec 14 - 10:00 AM

A friend is asking if anyone knows who is singing the version of Scarborough Fair being used on the drama Michael Palin is starring in on a Sunday Night


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Subject: RE: Scarborough Fair - who sings?
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 01 Dec 14 - 01:31 PM

A quick Google suggests that it's Richard Hutton, recorded in Goathland in 1913.


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Subject: RE: Scarborough Fair - who sings?
From: GUEST,Derek Schofield
Date: 01 Dec 14 - 02:19 PM

Richard Hutton is the singer who sang the song for Cecil Sharp. The first programme in the series had a sheet of music on the piano which was an image of Sharp's field notes. But that's not the person who sings the song in the programme...
Derek


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Subject: RE: Scarborough Fair - who sings?
From: GUEST,Rahere
Date: 01 Dec 14 - 04:40 PM

According to the BBC, it was Hutton, as the storyline turns around him. Courtesy of the VWML, presumably.


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Subject: RE: Scarborough Fair - who sings?
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 01 Dec 14 - 05:30 PM

Unfortunately, Cecil Sharp's record is in his Manuscript Collection at Clare College, Cambridge.

According to the BBC, Remember Me is a three-part contemporary ghost story, set in Yorkshire, rather than a documentary.


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Subject: RE: Scarborough Fair - who sings?
From: GUEST,Derek Schofield
Date: 01 Dec 14 - 05:32 PM

Yes, but Hutton doesn't sing the song in the programme ... there are no archival recordings of him.
The drama is merging fact (there was a Richard Hutton in Goathland who sang the song to Cecil Sharp), and fiction (what the drama is all about). For example: ....

"Tom refuses to be drawn on the significance of Scarborough Fair, but admits that the singer of the song, Richard Hutton, was his wife Dorothea's grandfather."

And yes, the VWML was consulted about this. The image of the field notes will have come from Clare College Cambridge, though it can be seen in The Full English online digital archive. www.vwml.org

Derek


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Subject: RE: Scarborough Fair - who sings?
From: MoorleyMan
Date: 01 Dec 14 - 07:10 PM

Derek S is absolutely right, there is a lot of merging of fact with drama-fiction for the purpose of the storyline.

The singer of the song that backs the start- and end-titles of the programme is not credited anywhere on the transmission or on the programme website, as far as I can ascertain. And I'm not sure that the version she sings is even done to the same tune as the Hutton-collected version.

The waters of Scarborough bay get ever muddier...


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Subject: RE: Scarborough Fair - who sings?
From: GUEST,richheadey
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 03:26 AM

Jodie Comer the actress.


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Subject: RE: Scarborough Fair - who sings?
From: Brian Peters
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 05:04 AM

The researcher for this programme actually came to Mudcat in May 2012 to pick our collective brains, posting as 'mrsfifties' on this thread. I had some correspondence with her after that, and pointed her to Cecil Sharp's notation of the Hutton song on Full English and the article in English Dance & Song, amongst other things.

I haven't seen the programme yet, so can't say how sensitively the stuff's been used but, with all the doom and gloom around Mudcat, it's nice to know we can still be of service to the UK's national broadcaster!


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Subject: RE: Scarborough Fair - who sings?
From: Brian Peters
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 05:09 AM

Would it be an idea to change the thread title to something like "BBC programme featuring 'Scarborough Fair'", to alert people who might be interested?


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: Brian Peters
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 05:23 AM

Thanks, Joe!


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: Wheatman
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 06:04 AM

As I said on FB, I believe extracts from the song and tune have been used to create a spooky situation (like the jaws theme). In my opinion it works, but the story does not seem to relate to the whole text of the song so it's use has been selective. Perhaps the last episode will reveal all, I hope. Good telly though.


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: Brian Peters
Date: 02 Dec 14 - 06:07 AM

It certainly is a spooky sounding tune, though the verses Sharp noted were very incomplete and don't tell much of a story at all.


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: GUEST,Mr Blue
Date: 09 Dec 14 - 12:42 PM

So did anyone actually find out who sung this song in the program?


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: GUEST,Henry Piper of Ottery
Date: 09 Dec 14 - 02:45 PM

The singer of the song in the final credits was Martin Carthy, and he was credited on those credits.


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 09 Dec 14 - 05:00 PM

HP of O. That's strange! If you follow richheadey's 3.26 pointer you'll see it's Jodie Comer actually singing the song. Perhaps she practised with the help of a recording by Martin.

I saw bits and pieces of the 2 episodes and picked up on the song bits and got a rough idea of the plot and the characters. I thought I was watching the last episode on Sunday but apparently there's another? In the first episode I saw Tom had been something of a Frank Kidson and had collected songs in Goathland. He also turned out to be 110 years old. I didn't quite follow that bit! If there is another episode then perhaps some of the mysteries will be revealed.


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: GUEST,Derek Schofield
Date: 09 Dec 14 - 07:02 PM

Last Sunday (7th) was the last episode, three in all. It seems that martin just sang the song at the end of the third episode, though I might be wrong ....
Tom said that he went in search of Richard Hutton in Goathland and then met his granddaughter and fell in love with her. The reason for him looking for Hutton was a bit vague, as was the reason how he knew that the ending of the song would .... I won't spoil it for those who have yet to watch ...
Good television...
Derek


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: Ross Campbell
Date: 09 Dec 14 - 09:42 PM

"Remember Me" BBC iPlayer, Episodes 1, 2 & 3

From today, available for 13, 20 & 27 days respectively.

Ross


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: GUEST,Henry Piper of Ottery
Date: 10 Dec 14 - 04:31 AM

To Clarify:-
Jodie Comer sang during the course of the story, Martin Carthy sang the version over the closing credits of the final episode. I believe Martin also provided the "alternative" tune for his version,


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 10 Dec 14 - 04:10 PM

Somewhere in the second episode the girl actually states that Tom was a folksong collector in his younger days. Would it spoil the plot if somebody explained how he came to be 110 years old? I think that was in the second episode as well. Remarkably robust and sprightly for 110 or was he a ghost as well?

The only version Kidson had from Goathland is Alan Wardill's and that looks to be close to the one Martin gave to Paul Simon. One of the Whitby tunes seems to be the one used in the play.


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 10 Dec 14 - 05:22 PM

'Would it spoil the plot if somebody explained how he came to be 110 years old?'
!a life of drunkeness, debauchery and singing dirty songs!   works for me


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Subject: RE: BBC Program features "Scarborough Fair" - who sings?
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 10 Dec 14 - 06:00 PM

Zounds! That makes me at least 150 then!


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