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Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U

Mr Red 25 Mar 15 - 06:11 AM
GUEST,DaveRo 25 Mar 15 - 07:34 AM
Jack Campin 25 Mar 15 - 11:58 AM
OldPossum 25 Mar 15 - 12:08 PM
Mr Red 25 Mar 15 - 12:55 PM
Mr Red 25 Mar 15 - 01:18 PM
Mr Red 25 Mar 15 - 04:51 PM
GUEST,DaveRo 25 Mar 15 - 05:47 PM
Jack Campin 25 Mar 15 - 08:16 PM
Joe Offer 26 Mar 15 - 12:24 AM
GUEST,DaveRo 26 Mar 15 - 03:07 AM
Jack Campin 26 Mar 15 - 04:37 AM
Mr Red 26 Mar 15 - 05:01 AM
Mr Red 26 Mar 15 - 05:12 AM
Thompson 26 Mar 15 - 05:23 AM
Jack Campin 26 Mar 15 - 05:30 AM
Mr Red 26 Mar 15 - 05:40 AM
GUEST,DaveRo 26 Mar 15 - 05:52 AM
Mr Red 26 Mar 15 - 06:06 AM
GUEST,DaveRo 26 Mar 15 - 06:49 AM
GUEST,DaveRo 26 Mar 15 - 09:06 AM
GUEST,Peter Laban 26 Mar 15 - 09:28 AM
GUEST,leeneia 26 Mar 15 - 09:33 AM
GUEST,DaveRo 26 Mar 15 - 09:54 AM
Bill D 26 Mar 15 - 10:36 AM
Jason Xion Wang 26 Mar 15 - 10:47 AM
Mr Red 26 Mar 15 - 12:14 PM
Mr Red 26 Mar 15 - 12:32 PM
GUEST,DaveRo 26 Mar 15 - 01:00 PM
Mr Red 26 Mar 15 - 02:00 PM
GUEST,DaveRo 26 Mar 15 - 02:31 PM
Bill D 27 Mar 15 - 12:39 PM
Mr Red 28 Mar 15 - 05:40 AM
GUEST,DaveRo 28 Mar 15 - 06:49 AM
Mr Red 29 Mar 15 - 06:24 AM
Jack Campin 29 Mar 15 - 06:43 AM
GUEST,DaveRo 29 Mar 15 - 07:32 AM
Mr Red 29 Mar 15 - 11:00 AM
Mr Red 29 Mar 15 - 11:19 AM
Jack Campin 29 Mar 15 - 02:43 PM
Richard Bridge 30 Mar 15 - 03:25 AM
Mr Red 30 Mar 15 - 03:34 AM
Jack Campin 30 Mar 15 - 03:38 AM
Mr Red 30 Mar 15 - 10:15 AM
GUEST,DaveRo 30 Mar 15 - 11:49 AM
Jack Campin 30 Mar 15 - 12:20 PM
GUEST,DaveRo 31 Mar 15 - 03:30 AM
Jack Campin 31 Mar 15 - 04:01 AM
Mr Red 31 Mar 15 - 12:22 PM
Mr Red 31 Mar 15 - 12:44 PM
Jack Campin 31 Mar 15 - 12:52 PM
GUEST,DaveRo 31 Mar 15 - 01:38 PM
Jack Campin 31 Mar 15 - 02:26 PM
GUEST,DaveRo 31 Mar 15 - 03:30 PM
Jack Campin 31 Mar 15 - 04:25 PM
Jack Campin 01 Apr 15 - 07:14 PM
GUEST,DaveRo 02 Apr 15 - 02:30 AM
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Subject: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 25 Mar 15 - 06:11 AM

I have put a page on my website that will generate the text that prettifies Mudcat text when previewed/posted
It is basic and the effects cannot be combined (yet)
And it also adds a feature that does not seem to be present on the Mudcat blickie generator - if you do not include "http://" it adds it. If there is no "www" it suggests you try first (some sites still need it)

Anyway ( used it to generate these fillips). Let me know wot U thinks . here it is.

http://www.users.waitrose.com/~cresby/various/mudtext.htm

Mr Red


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 25 Mar 15 - 07:34 AM

if you do not include "http://" it adds it
Perhaps check for https:// too?


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 25 Mar 15 - 11:58 AM

Any chance of extending it to format ABC properly? (monospaced with no leading spaces).


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: OldPossum
Date: 25 Mar 15 - 12:08 PM

Very handy. It has a lot of potential.

By the way, are you familiar with Mudcat's own experimental feature?

Still, yours is a nice supplement.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 25 Mar 15 - 12:55 PM

No I wasn't familiar. It probably needs some work but I suggested the http:// wheeze and even wrote the code, but Max never replied. He may have had a lot on his mind at the time.

https:// is something I hadn't considered. But if you need https:// you really should be copying the URL properly.

But Let me think a bit. It will hang on the testing of the link. maybe two links but I don't want to make it too complex.

However testing to avoid adding anything when there is a https:// is necessary (done).

Any other protocols I should test for? eg ftp: mailto: are not really worth looking for.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 25 Mar 15 - 01:18 PM

added underline for good measure and........
BTW if you want fancy accented characters like   Æ   (eg) have a look at my codes generator
(hint click the cell for European accented characters etc or scan with +10 etc)


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 25 Mar 15 - 04:51 PM

Any chance of extending it to format ABC properly? (monospaced with no leading spaces).

I think that requires a monspaced font like Courier (there are others).
Not sure about leading spaces. Please explain.

same URL http://www.users.waitrose.com/~cresby/various/mudtext.htm try it for monospaced.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 25 Mar 15 - 05:47 PM

I wondered what lay behind Jack's question. I found this - look at the latest post:
http://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=137732

The problem seems to be that using PRE on mudcat puts a space at the start of each line. It's because the BR tag generates a following space - and the PRE generates a following BR! These spaces are usually ignored but in a PRE block they will appear.

Apart from fixing mudcat, a workround if you want to copy these ABCs would be to use Privoxy. It can filter html on the fly and could remove the spaces; take a look at 'external-filter' in the documentation.

I could also envisage a 'smart copy' add-on that removes them.

(Apologies for jumping into your thread, Mr Red.)


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 25 Mar 15 - 08:16 PM

I'm not going to require readers of my ABC to hunt for third-party utilities before they can use it. If there isn't an easy way for me to post correct, readable ABC to Mudcat, I'm not doing it.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Joe Offer
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 12:24 AM

Aw, Jack - If you have a problem with format of ABC, we moderators will fix it. Not to worry. Just ask.

Alternatively, I think it will work if you use <font=courier> before and </font> after the ABC stuff, and all will be well.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 03:07 AM

Jack Campin wrote: If there isn't an easy way for me to post correct, readable ABC to Mudcat, I'm not doing it.
Ah. I misunderstood. I thought you were trying to copy it. I agree - you can't expect everyone else to jump though hoops to use your stuff.
Joe Offer wrote: I think it will work if you use <font=courier>...
Or, more generally, <font face=monospace>. Not all systems have courier these days - this Android tablet doesn't.

This should be monospace........


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 04:37 AM

Aw, Jack - If you have a problem with format of ABC, we moderators will fix it. Not to worry. Just ask.

I have. Several times over the last few years. With no result at all.

I simply want the PRE tag not to be misinterpreted the way Mudcat does it. It does NOT mean "display this text monospaced but with a leading space on every line".

    You haven't asked me, Jack, and I'm the music editor. If something doesn't come out right in a post you've made in the music section, let me know by personal message - don't expect moderators to respond to remarks you make in posts. They simply can't read every post.
    -Joe-


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 05:01 AM

I have added a "trim" function that removes leading and trailing spaces on any text you paste into a box. and a few other things.

It is really for the uninitiated and if (like me) you do a lot of these things it is quicker and more accurate to automate these things.

BTW I rather like the notion of a heading such as: Small Caps Text

And Just For Jack I have added his ABC filter. It wasn't that straight forward. If anyone else wants to play it would be instructive to see how it copes with copied ABC text from other websites.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 05:12 AM

eg ABC text copied, processed and copied/pasted.

X: 1
T: Fiollaigean
Z: Rory Campbell
Z: Jack Campin, http: //www.campin.me.uk/
F: Jack Campin's Nine-Note Tunebook
% last edit 03-02-2013
N: Gaelic satirical song
M: 9/8
L: 1/8
Q: 3/8=100
K: DDor
AAA ADD F2G|AAA ddd dcA|ccc dcA G2c|AGE G2c AGE||
DDD F2c AGE|DDD F2c AGE|DDD F2G A2c|dAA A2G FDD||D3|]


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Thompson
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 05:23 AM

What, no lilac?


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 05:30 AM

That ABC wasn't monospaced, though.

I'm just looking for the formatting that a correctly implemented PRE tag would give you. It can be faked by hand, if you turn off auto line break, put all the BR tags in manually and enclose the result in TT tags. Which is a ridiculous amount of work.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 05:40 AM

lilac?   done. Any other color colour?

X: 1
T: Fiollaigean
Z: Rory Campbell
Z: Jack Campin, http: //www.campin.me.uk/
F: Jack Campin's Nine-Note Tunebook
% last edit 03-02-2013
N: Gaelic satirical song
M: 9/8
L: 1/8
Q: 3/8=100
K: DDor
AAA ADD F2G|AAA ddd dcA|ccc dcA G2c|AGE G2c AGE||
DDD F2c AGE|DDD F2c AGE|DDD F2G A2c|dAA A2G FDD||D3|]


When I understand <PRE> it will be done. If it can.

FWIW I refuse to do font size. It is a bit like shouting/whispering and I don't think Max/Joe/Joeclones would approve. It you know how - your call.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 05:52 AM

PRE is obviously broken.

Just wrapping the ABC above in <font face=monospace> and </font>

X: 1
T: Fiollaigean
Z: Rory Campbell
Z: Jack Campin, http: //www.campin.me.uk/
F: Jack Campin's Nine-Note Tunebook
% last edit 03-02-2013
N: Gaelic satirical song
M: 9/8
L: 1/8
Q: 3/8=100
K: DDor
AAA ADD F2G|AAA ddd dcA|ccc dcA G2c|AGE G2c AGE||
DDD F2c AGE|DDD F2c AGE|DDD F2G A2c|dAA A2G FDD||D3|]


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 06:06 AM

actually there is a problem with copying from the Jack's website which I had to take into account. I doubt his is unique. I leave you to figure it - I had to. There is more than one problemo. And many more than one Browser, and don't even mention versions. I know people who still use IE8! It is all about copying from here and hoping it runs in an ABC player, I suspect.
DaveRo's solution:
X:1
T:Fiollaigean
Z:Rory Campbell
Z:Jack Campin, http://www.campin.me.uk/
F:Jack Campin's Nine-Note Tunebook
% last edit 03-02-2013


N:Gaelic satirical song
M:9/8
L:1/8
Q:3/8=100
K:DDor
AAA ADD F2G|AAA ddd dcA|ccc dcA G2c|AGE G2c AGE||
DDD F2c AGE|DDD F2c AGE|DDD F2G A2c|dAA A2G FDD||D3|]


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 06:49 AM

Jack's quite right - if you use PRE it shouldn't add spaces and should use a monospace font. (Though technically neither is mandatory - the spec says 'may' for both.)

The problem seems to be the way mudcat adds these <BR> tags with spaces after them. I don't know why it does that. (And I think they're invalid anyway in xhtml strict - they should be <BR /> though I doubt if any browser minds.)

My last post shows monospace on both my Android tablet and my wife's iPad - I don't know if that has courier. Mine is in san-serif like the rest of the site, which is my default font in Firefox for Android.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 09:06 AM

Mr Red: Now I'm on a machine that does have a courier font and see your post of 05:40 AM in monospace. It wasn't on iPad so I deduce that the iPad doesn't have courier either.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,Peter Laban
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 09:28 AM

For firefox users there is the add-on BBcodeXtra which provides a handy way of inserting, links, image tags etc in a variety of formats.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 09:33 AM

It's a nice thought, Mr. Red, but I have a question:

What will be the effect on the Mudcat's servers if our trolls and twerps use the features to hurl abuse at one another in large, italic, or colored fonts?

Will it waste resources?
Slow things down?


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 09:54 AM

GUEST,Peter Laban wrote: For firefox users there is the add-on BBcodeXtra which provides a handy way of inserting, links, image tags etc in a variety of formats.
Yes - that and TextArea Cache (or Lazarus if you prefer) are essentials for forums.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Bill D
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 10:36 AM

Oh, it won't matter much,Leenia


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jason Xion Wang
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 10:47 AM

This is really cool trick, Bill. How did you do it?


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 12:14 PM

if you use PRE it shouldn't add spaces and should use a monospace font.
Of course if you are talking typed text or clean copy you must be right. Though opinions on text that has come from a specific source that has already stated there are problems with various wheezes that don't work you couldn't be more wrong. I told you there are problems and numerous instances of each.

The clues are in the posts above and - well lets say all you have to do is count the characters. I entreat you to count the letters, now count the characters. There are non-printing characters and they are subtle.
Count the lines and you will not be half way.

My page is not brilliant - it is a work in progress. But it is a lot of sweat along the way.

And maybe there will be a flurry of colours, Max has always struck as a guy who is pleased we love Mudcat. If the mods tell me they don't want it, it can be deleted or reduced.
font sizes. (Unless you know how!)

Knowledge Knows what it Knows, Intelligence Knows when it doesn't.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 12:32 PM

FWIW the Monospace has proved somewhat troublesome, spaces or not to space calls for increasing permutations, doubly so with the "looks like this" section as well as the HTML. I believe it to be fixed. The program does not call for courier alone, it calls for:

  style= font-family: 'Courier New', Courier, mono;    And as I understand it that should cover the ground.

When using CSS I always use fonts like:     font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; 

because Helvetica is an Apple preferrence and Arial is Micro$oft. sans-serif is the default drop-down recommended by DreamWeaver. So I do what I am advised.

And if I could I would consider phones and tabs but I had enough trouble getting iPhones to run MP3, and I don't have an iPhone to ring the changes.
Android, (and Symbian because no-one makes viruses/snoops for it and it has native handwriting - eat yer heart out Android)


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 01:00 PM

Mr Red wrote: The clues are in the posts above and - well lets say all you have to do is count the characters. I entreat you to count the letters, now count the characters. There are non-printing characters and they are subtle.
Too subtle for me. I can't see anything unusual. I don't know where the ABC came from, though, so I haven't looked there. Maybe it's a Windows/Linux thing - this is Linux and I was using Android.

I hope that my contributions to this thread have been helpful to you in building your page. I wanted to tell you what works for me and what doesn't - and courier doesn't, at least not always.

The ABC in your post of 05:40 isn't monospace on my Android or iPad. Maybe if you changed 'mono' to 'monospace' it might be. But why not just forget courier and use 'monospace', then it should be in the same style - sans or serif - as everything else?


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 02:00 PM

try 6:06 that is from the latest iteration. It would be instructive to know if Android can cope. My phone does not run JavaScript locally, Goggle have it locked-down so you use bandwidth to run code. That is how they sell it so well to the phone networks (I am sure), the OS is free after all.

The problem as ever is when you tinker. Spaghetti code. Can you make spaghetti out of jelly (jello)? I do!

and not to be outdone. latest feature
And yes it does take more storage. Let the Gods' Wrath fall down on me.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 02:31 PM

6.06 is in monospace here on Android (sans) and on iPad (serif).

It's a wrap!


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Bill D
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 12:39 PM

I explained to Mr. Red that I use a little program (Windows only) that I've had for years.

http://www.theill.com/hfc/


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 05:40 AM

Thank Bill - I have it now. I may extend the range or mix of colours on the web page but it does bloat the HTML so don't really want to champion the feature.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 06:49 AM

This link generator may be useful to iPad users because it's much easier to use than the mudcat one. With the mudcat link generator it's hard to select the generated link in order to copy it. (I would say it's practically impossible, but maybe there's a trick to it that I don't know.)

So perhaps add the facility to optionally include the link text, as the mudcat one does.

(It's because the text to be copied occupies its own TD that makes it easy to copy on iPad. Conversely, text that occupies only part of a TD - such as a mudcat forum post - is difficult to select.)


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 29 Mar 15 - 06:24 AM

I was considering options on the link text and opening in another tab. Since you asked - it will be done, maybe tomorrow. I have a local history thingie and a Cajun Dance to attend right now.

Mamou anyone?


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 29 Mar 15 - 06:43 AM

The "Tell Mr Red" link on that page gives a 404.

I could send you a screenshot of what your page looks like on my browser if I had somewhere to email it.

It looks like it could do some good stuff if only it had a button to make it do the conversion. As it is, it has lots of options you can set but no way to actually invoke it.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 29 Mar 15 - 07:32 AM

The "Tell Mr Red" link on that page gives a 404.
Remove '/various' from the link.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 29 Mar 15 - 11:00 AM

MudText latest iteration Link opens in a new tab/window.

The contact form link is generated with old software and needs re-visiting. It is 10-15 years old. I can't remember what it looks like.

Tomorrow. Cajun calls.................


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 29 Mar 15 - 11:19 AM

Link sorted, brute force.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 29 Mar 15 - 02:43 PM

OK, I get it. Does this work?

%% 2. ===============================================================================
% +&S&tick the &M&inr.+
%
% *SETT to your Partner, and cast off; that again. *Cross up one pair, and sett;
% that again. *THREE hands round with the first Woman, as much with the second
% Man. *Lead out at both Sides.
% @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
X: 2
T: Stick the Minister
M: C|
L: 1/8
K: Amin
c |A/c/d dd e2 de |f>gTe>d g/f/e/d/ ce |d/d/d dd e2 ed/e/ |ff g/f/e/d/ T^c>BA: |
f/g/|a>ba>f g>ag>e|f>gf>d g/f/e/d/ cf/g/|aa b/a/g/f/ gg a/g/f/e/|ff g/f/e/d/ T^c>BA: |


Not quite - in BarFly (using Courier) the barlines are vertically aligned, and so are most of the notes beat-for-beat in both parts (so it's immediately obvious that they end the same way and have a paraellism in bars 2 and 6).


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 30 Mar 15 - 03:25 AM

I think this is rather fun!


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 30 Mar 15 - 03:34 AM

Bar Lines fall where the spaces allow. To place them in tabbed positions requires more knowledge. And there is a line feed that gets in the way.

X: 0159
T: Shantruish.
T: Willie's Auld Trews
T: Sean Triubhas Uilleachan
T: Deil Stick the Minister
T: This is No My Ain Hoose
T: This is No My Ain Plaid
M: C
L: 1/8
Q: 1/4=120
I: : : : :
Z: Jack Campin * www.campin.me.uk * 2009
K: E Minor
E|A/A/A AA B2GB|c2 TBA (d/c/B/A/) G
B|A/A/A AA B2GB|c2 TB>A GE E: |
f|eaec dgdB|cc d/c/B/A/ BG G
B|eaec dgdB|c2 TBA GE E: |


Can't find the source text, the above does not match.

setting the bars at tabbed positions can be done, it may take a day. BUT Jack's example has a line feed at a curious position.

Can I assume the the "|"'s are unique to the tune "proper"?


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 30 Mar 15 - 03:38 AM

They aren't in tabbed positions - I simply expect a space to be the same width as any other character. In Courier on the Mac, they are. Doesn't &nbsp; do that?


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 30 Mar 15 - 10:15 AM

Hmmmmm
Methinks there is a lot of typing and forgetting.

Some spaces are non-printing characters (whitespace) and some are spaces (that you would recognise).

HTML hides a lot. But just for the time-being - try again and see this sort of thing. Not purr-fect but close. I have the cigar but I ain't lit it yet.

X: 0008
T: Quick Step. 21th. Regt.
M: 2/4
L: 1/8
Q: 1/4=96
I: : : : :
%% D ^F G A B ^c d e ^f g a
Z: Jack Campin * www.campin.me.uk * 2009
K: D
FA      A(G/F/) |BA      A(B/c/) |dA`BG   |FD      D2:     |
df      f(e/d/) |ce      e(d/c/) |d>ef>g  |aA      A2      |
df      f(e/d/) |ce      e(d/c/) |dA`BG   |FD      D2:     |


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 30 Mar 15 - 11:49 AM

A feature of using PRE is not only that it uses a monospace font but that it preserves spaces and linebreaks.

Outside a PRE if you want to preserve spaces, and prevent line-breaks (which will vary with screen size) you need to use &nbsp; (non-breaking space) for all space characters.

This is monospace - coded as my earlier posts. The second line has 3 &nbsp; between each vertical bar:

|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|...|
|   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |   |

On this screen the vertical bars line up, so here at least the &nbsp; has the same width as the monospace dots.

HTH


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 30 Mar 15 - 12:20 PM

Doing that last one myself by hand, the way DaveRo suggests:

X:0008
T:Quick Step. 21th. Regt.
M:2/4
L:1/8
Q:1/4=96
I: :: ::
%% D ^F  G  A  B ^c  d  e ^f  g  a
Z:Jack Campin * www.campin.me.uk * 2009
K:D
FA A(G/F/)|BA A(B/c/)|dA`BG |FD D2:|
df f(e/d/)|ce e(d/c/)|d>ef>g|aA A2 |
df f(e/d/)|ce e(d/c/)|dA`BG |FD D2:|

which to me looks exactly the same as my original.

It plays and displays correctly if I copy it from here.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 31 Mar 15 - 03:30 AM

Jack: An alternative method which you might find useful is to encode the ABC in base64 (there are online encoders) and post a link to that.

Click Quick Step. 21th. Regt.

The code for that is:
<a target=_blank href=data:text/plain;base64,xxxxx where xxxxx is the encoded text and the rest of the link is as usual.

(There might be a mime type for ABC. You might even get it to open in barfly or whatever - not my field!)

Not as nice as having the ABC in the post, IMO, but easy to do and easy to copy.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 31 Mar 15 - 04:01 AM

I had considered doing something like that, in a blog of Tunes That Mudcat Won't Let Me Post - no need for encoding tricks since I only use ASCII for ABC. But the point is usually to have them in the discussion thread where they're immediately visible.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 31 Mar 15 - 12:22 PM

Good luck if you can get it to treat whitespace as spaces, I found a few characters the threw my simple efforts, the result of my best effort is live now

Safari won't cope. IE & FF & Chrome have one anomaly which I am working on. but the leading gaps and bars are in line.


eg
X: 0013
T: The Duke of Gloucesters Quick March.
M: 2/4
L: 1/8
Q: 1/4=88
I: : : : :
%% D ^F G A B ^c d e ^f g a
Z: Jack Campin * www.campin.me.uk * 2009
K: D
A/G/|FAd2|cdeg|(fdcd)                   |(e/d/c/B/) A2   |
     FAd2|cdeg|fd           (c/d/e/c/)  |d2         D  :&
g   |fdfa|eceg|fdfa                     |(e/d/c/B/) A>g  |
     fdfa|eceg|(f/a/)(f/d/) (e/g/)(e/c/)|d2         D  : |


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Mr Red
Date: 31 Mar 15 - 12:44 PM

solved one problem and introduced another. But at least the HTML is shorter (used spaces AND no break spaces alternately). HTML renders adjacent spaces as one space.
It was behaving differently online to local. But nearly ther now. eg

K: D
A/G/|FAd2|cdeg|(fdcd)                   |(e/d/c/B/) A2  |
     FAd2|cdeg|fd           (c/d/e/c/)  |d2         D  : |
g   |fdfa|eceg|fdfa                     |(e/d/c/B/) A>g  |
     fdfa|eceg|(f/a/)(f/d/) (e/g/)(e/c/)|d2         D  : |


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 31 Mar 15 - 12:52 PM

Safari on the iPhone displays my last version ok; yours has spaces after the colons and the end of the tune body lines are wrong.

The procedure I used should be scriptable:

- replace every occurrence of a space in the tune with &nbsp;
- add <br> at the end of every line
- enclose the result with <tt> ... </tt>
- post with auto-linebreak off.

I don't see why you should need anything fancier.

I'm seeing the same result on FF 36.0.4 under WinXP as I do on Safari on the iPhone.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 31 Mar 15 - 01:38 PM

MDN recommends CODE instead of TT:
https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Element/tt


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 31 Mar 15 - 02:26 PM

That statement from somebody at Mozilla is just plain moronic.

There must be, at least, tens of millions of pages of HTML out there that use TT and which will never be changed. The point of HTML is that it should be permanent; that's what the DOCTYPE declaration is for. If a browser can't interpret old versions of HTML it's broken.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 31 Mar 15 - 03:30 PM

Jack Campin wrote: That statement from somebody at Mozilla is just plain moronic.
No, it's just advice. Eventually browsers - or browser-like programs like the webview modules in apps - will reduce their bloat by dropping strict html 4 compliance and sticking to elements included in html 5.

Mozilla are just warning you what's likely to go. You're free to ignore the advice, and my guess it that the old teletype tag will work for some years yet (I'd forgotten it existed) but it seems to me to be sensible to maximise the chances of your code being readable in the future.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 31 Mar 15 - 04:25 PM

Is anybody volunteering to rewrite the entire Mudcat archive to keep up with Mozilla's whims?

The sheer bulk of existing old-spec HTML code means they don't have a prayer of imposing this daft idea.

This thread is declared to be XHTML 1.0 Strict - what does that say?


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: Jack Campin
Date: 01 Apr 15 - 07:14 PM

Doing this in the Unix shell (Terminal in MacOS):

echo "<tt>"
sed "s/ /\&nbsp;/g
s/$/<br>/" $1
echo "</tt>"

Put those four lines in a shell script.

Make it executable.

Invoke it on a file of ABC code.

I just tested it on a file containing the following (and
which looks exactly like this in BarFly's text edit panel):

X:2
T:Stick the Minister
M:C|
L:1/8
K:Amin
c   |A/c/d dd e2 de |f>gTe>d g/f/e/d/ ce   |d/d/d dd       e2 ed/e/   |ff g/f/e/d/ T^c>BA:|
f/g/|a>ba>f   g>ag>e|f>gf>d  g/f/e/d/ cf/g/|aa    b/a/g/f/ gg a/g/f/e/|ff g/f/e/d/ T^c>BA:|

Paste into a Mudcat thread with automatic linebreaks off (and preview
on, since any non-ABC in the message will need linebreaks).

The HTML generated by that script looks horrendous.
Don't read it, just paste it.


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Subject: RE: Tech: blickie/bold/italic/colour generator 4 U
From: GUEST,DaveRo
Date: 02 Apr 15 - 02:30 AM

This thread is declared to be XHTML 1.0 Strict - what does that say?
That it has the wrong doctype ;-) But it doesn't matter since it's served as text/html so browsers will treat it as html.

It's reported that Microsoft's new Spartan browser will only handle html5. But there's some sort of fallback to IE for old sites so I'm sure mudcat will be readable for many years.


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