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BS: Cultural genocide

GUEST 15 Jun 15 - 10:00 PM
Steve Shaw 15 Jun 15 - 08:24 PM
GUEST 15 Jun 15 - 07:17 PM
Steve Shaw 15 Jun 15 - 06:04 PM
Musket 15 Jun 15 - 06:03 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 05:02 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 04:35 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 03:26 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 03:21 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 03:11 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 03:01 PM
Musket 15 Jun 15 - 02:20 PM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 01:58 PM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 11:57 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 11:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 11:37 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 11:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 11:29 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 11:23 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 11:14 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 11:09 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 10:40 AM
GUEST 15 Jun 15 - 10:21 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 10:19 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 10:07 AM
GUEST 15 Jun 15 - 10:03 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 09:44 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 09:42 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 09:20 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 07:17 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 07:15 AM
GUEST 15 Jun 15 - 06:52 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Jun 15 - 05:55 AM
Jim Carroll 15 Jun 15 - 05:55 AM
Dave the Gnome 15 Jun 15 - 05:38 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 05:21 AM
Steve Shaw 15 Jun 15 - 05:08 AM
Keith A of Hertford 15 Jun 15 - 05:00 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Jun 15 - 08:36 PM
Musket 14 Jun 15 - 07:32 PM
Keith A of Hertford 14 Jun 15 - 04:10 PM
Musket 14 Jun 15 - 03:47 PM
Steve Shaw 14 Jun 15 - 03:43 PM
Jim Carroll 14 Jun 15 - 03:37 PM
Steve Shaw 14 Jun 15 - 09:49 AM
Steve Shaw 14 Jun 15 - 09:45 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Jun 15 - 09:26 AM
GUEST 14 Jun 15 - 09:15 AM
Jim Carroll 14 Jun 15 - 09:15 AM
Steve Shaw 14 Jun 15 - 08:44 AM

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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 10:00 PM

Steal someone's land

Fuck off you antisemitic pig.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 08:24 PM

How nice of them. Steal someone's land then go and get all beneficent. So simple. Why didn't I think of it before!   :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 07:17 PM

More evidence of Israel's ethnic cleansing:

"This must have been a trying week for all the people who wrongly believe that Israel's prime minister is an unabashed anti-Arab racist: Over the past few days, Benjamin Netanyahu's government has unveiled not one, but two major initiatives to benefit Israeli Arabs – initiatives that even the far-left Haaretz, which loathes him, deemed "praiseworthy" and even "revolutionary."

Here's how Haaretz's report on the first initiative opens: "For the first time ever, an Israeli government team has documented the extent of the land and housing shortage in Israel's Arab communities and proposed recommendations for ending it."

Though the housing shortage has been one of the Arab community's biggest gripes for decades, no other prime minister in Israel's 67 years of existence has done much about it. But Netanyahu's last government not only advanced the establishment of the first new Arab city in Israel's history, it also created an interministerial task force to draft more comprehensive recommendations, which were presented to his current government this week.

Moreover, as Haaretz noted in a subsequent analysis, these recommendations are nothing less than "a revolution." Inter alia, after decades in which the borders of Arab towns remained unchanged despite a sevenfold increase in population, the new proposal finally recommends expanding these borders to provide Arab communities with more land for residential construction.

The second initiative deals with education. Here, too, the previous Netanyahu government took significant steps, adopting a five-year plan to boost funding for Arab schools by a billion shekels (about $260 million). But many pundits predicted it would be scrapped by the new education minister, Naftali Bennett of the rightist Jewish Home party.

Instead, Bennett not only announced its continuation this week, but added an important new element. All preschools – Jewish and Arab – will henceforth be entitled to a second aide, rather than having only one teacher and one aide for classes of up to 35 children. But in well-off communities, the government will underwrite only 50% of the cost while, in poor communities, it will cover 90%. As a Haaretz analysis noted, most of the poorest communities are Arab, so this decision will give a huge boost to early-childhood education in Arab towns. That prompted the paper, which loathes Bennett as well, to headline its analysis, "Naftali Bennett: Unlikely champion of Arab education."

Israel's 'Hardline' Government Unveils Major Benefits for Israeli Arabs


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 06:04 PM

This is very depressing. Keith is desperately clinging on to some technicality of his own invention. He is ignoring the immorality of what Israel is doing. Which, Keith, is to make life impossible for Palestinians in the areas in which they live but which Israel desires for itself, so that they will be forced out. They will be forced out of the Israel that the Israeli regime aspires to. Keith, you seriously need to address the moral issues here instead of clinging to your ridiculous "from Israel" nonsense. Israel does what it thinks will be accepted in the eyes of the west. If Israel thought it could get away with dumping every Arab on its soil.outside its border, it would. We know it would and you know it would. Kicking Palestinians out of areas Israel wants for settlements, and kicking Bedouins out of the Negev by destroying the villages in which they live, is ethnic cleansing. Ethnic cleansing of Palestinians out of the Israel that Israel wants. Focus on the morality issues, Keith, and leave your technicalities at the door. .


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Musket
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 06:03 PM

This thread is called cultural genocide.

People who exhibit any sense of the word culture will shake their heads in disbelief at the savage views put forward in this thread regarding the Middle East.

Berlin used to have a wall. Perhaps Mossad took some photos of it when abroad assassinating opponents and brought the idea home. Bulldozers with "punishment" written on them provide the rest.

And you know what is most sickening? The appalling comments by Keith A Hole of Hertford and "ashamed to put my name" braidedbeardedbruce to the effect that if you decry Israeli terrorism that you must support Hamas and their own brand of warfare.

Those are the views of apes, not intelligent members of the human race.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 05:02 PM

OK. Jim what did you mean by ethnic cleansing of Palestinians from Israel?

I have asked. Now, Keith, what DO you mean by 'cleansed' anyway? How about giving us an idea WTF you are on about.

I'll not hold my breath for a straight answer.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 04:35 PM

There is no ethnic cleansing of Palestinians from Israel Dave.
Jim made it up.
That is why he has been unable to substantiate his wild assertion.

"What DO you mean by 'cleansed' anyway? How about giving us an idea WTF you are on about."

Why not ask Jim what he meant by it and why he can't produce anything to back up his claim?
Why is all your shit directed at me when all I have done is challenge an accusation we all know is false.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 03:26 PM

Oh, BTW, You have only just said, "I believe that the truth is somewhere between Jim's position and yours."

I said that 10:40AM Mudcat time, less than an hour after I posted the link and before you started rabbiting on about me justifying anything. It's all up there for anyone to confirm.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 03:21 PM

I linked it to your definition of ethnic cleansing. Nothing to do with Jim. He is quite capable of fighting his own battles.

What you mean by Not one single Palestinian has been "cleansed" out of Israel. is what I was talking about. I think having your house demolished illegally is a pretty strong hint that someone does not want you to live there while you seem to believe otherwise. Whether it is 'ethnic cleansing' or not seems to be your only argument and, personally, I do not care what you call it, it is a nasty thing to happen.

What DO you mean by 'cleansed' anyway? How about giving us an idea WTF you are on about.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 03:11 PM

What makes you think I would use house demolition to try and justify Jim's claim?

Because you linked it to "ethnic cleansing" Dave.

Jim claimed, "the Israeli regime is attempting to ethnically cleanse Israel of Palestinians."

It is attempting no such thing.
Not one single Palestinian has been "cleansed" out of Israel.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 03:01 PM

Previously you talked of house demolition has if it justified Jim's claim.

I don't know what you are on Keith but you need to take more water with it. What makes you think I would use house demolition to try and justify Jim's claim? Or have you just made that up? I posted it because it said that house demolition was being used as punishment and I believe it is wrong to punish people because they are of the wrong race.

Why do you "believe that the truth is somewhere between Jim's position and yours?"

Simply because I do not believe anything I read in the press and even less of anything I read on the internet. I also believe that people, in the main, are good and no race of people would want to 'cleanse' another race. There are, however, some people in power who would want that. So the truth lies somewhere between the majority who do not want it and the power mongers who do.

Have you ever thought of making your own mind up on anything rather than trawling through the internet for justifications for your beliefs?


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Musket
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 02:20 PM

Cleansed?

To be fair to Keith, that isn't the correct word in many instances.

"Murdered" by "Israeli state sponsored militants" is somewhat better fitting.

Hey Keith? Those schools and hospitals in Palestine look nice and clean!

Amazing, truly, shockingly and disgustingly amazing...

Still, it just shows that Goebbells had a point. Some daft twats will read it and repeat it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 01:58 PM

You have only just said, "I believe that the truth is somewhere between Jim's position and yours."

Previously you talked of house demolition has if it justified Jim's claim.

Why do you "believe that the truth is somewhere between Jim's position and yours?"

Are you aware of Israel being cleansed of any Palestinians?

No, because there have been none.
Jim's claim is false.
The truth is not somewhere between.
There is no truth at all in Jim's claim.
He made it up.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 11:57 AM

It was against your case. It was not in support of Jim's. I said I believe that the truth is somewhere between Jim's position and yours. I don't support either 'case'. You made that up.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 11:53 AM

There is not a link to you justifying Jim's statement Dave.
That is what I said Dave.

But you did try to justify Jim's statement.

You said, "I guess a few of those who have had their houses demolished would consider themselves cleansed but, as I said, all down to your definition of cleansed."

That was certainly said in support of his case and against mine.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 11:37 AM

So, where is the link to my justifying Jim's statement then? I am pretty sure I have not done so but I am always willing to be proved wrong.

How long do you think we can keep it up?


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 11:34 AM

Dave, you said, " I believe that some Palestinians are being driven out of Israel as my link shows."

None of your links shows any such thing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 11:29 AM

So, where is the link to my justifying Jim's statement then? I am pretty sure I have not done so but I am always willing to be proved wrong.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 11:23 AM

Dave, you said, " I believe that some Palestinians are being driven out of Israel as my link shows."

None of the links you have provided shows any such thing.

I do not make things up Dave.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 11:14 AM

So then, Keith, where is that link to my justifying Jim's claim? Or did you make that up?


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 11:09 AM

I believe that some Palestinians are being driven out of Israel as my link shows.

Your link does not show that any Palestinians have been driven out of Israel, and none have.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 10:40 AM

If I met you two arguing in a pub I would have you both evicted. Jim says that it is endemic. You say it does not exist. The truth is probably somewhere in between. I believe that some Palestinians are being driven out of Israel as my link shows. You do not accept that as ethnic cleansing. You are constantly redefining generally accepted terms and, as I have often said, it is not possible to discuss anything when you constantly change the goalposts. Absolutely no point continuing.

Tell you what though, seeing as you are playing that game, link us to where I, one of 'the whole pack' I presume, have tried to justify Jim's claim. You made that up...


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 10:21 AM

For an example of not as bas as see the above post.

Please see false analogy fallacy.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 10:19 AM

I must say that your pretense at being the brave little soldier standing against all the forces of evil made me laugh out loud though.

Hardly.
All I have done is keep repeating Jim's ludicrous claim, and enjoyed the spectacle of the whole pack of you trying to justify it.

Jim claimed, "the Israeli regime is attempting to ethnically cleanse Israel of Palestinians."

It is attempting no such thing.
Not one single Palestinian has been "cleansed" out of Israel.

Deny that Dave?
Steve?
Musket?
Greg?
Jim?


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 10:07 AM

For an example of not as bas as see the above post.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 10:03 AM

I guess a few of those who have had their houses demolished would consider themselves cleansed

Um no. For an example of ethnic cleansing please see the dispossession ans expulsion of Jews from Muslim countries in 1948.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 09:44 AM

I must say that your pretense at being the brave little soldier standing against all the forces of evil made me laugh out loud though.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 09:42 AM

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_demolition_in_the_Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian_conflict

I guess a few of those who have had their houses demolished would consider themselves cleansed but, as I said, all down to your definition of cleansed. No point continuing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 09:20 AM

There is no point in you arguing over this, because Jim's claim is obviously false, but you can't help yourselves.

The whole pack together in full cry.
You know you are wrong, but you can not admit it.

"All for one and one for all, the pack right or wrong"

Jim claimed, "the Israeli regime is attempting to ethnically cleanse Israel of Palestinians."

It is attempting no such thing.
Not one single Palestinian has been "cleansed" out of Israel.

Deny that Dave?
Steve?
Musket?
Greg?
Jim?


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 07:17 AM

Which bit of There is no point arguing with Keith did you not understand, Keith?


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 07:15 AM

Dave,
Ethnic cleansing is only ethnic cleansing if it fits his definition.
Completely unfair and untrue.
I have only challenged the specific claim that Jim made because it is false.
You all know it is false.

Jim,
"The quote was faked but not by you"
It was not and you accused me of faking it - I fakeed nothing and never have


I did not accuse you of faking the quote, just of repeating it.
I did accuse you of making up the claim that "the Israeli regime is attempting to ethnically cleanse Israel of Palestinians."

It is not.
Israel has not been "cleansed" of one single Palestinian.
Deny that Steve?


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 06:52 AM

The Palestinian territories....

Can you show us the borders of these so-called "Palestinian" territories and tell us when they became the "Palestinian" territories.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 05:55 AM

"The quote was faked but not by you"
It was not and you accused me of faking it - I fakeed nothing and never have
You are a total disgrace in the amount of time you are prepared to spend defending Is#Israeli atrocities - you have done t for years, each time the Israelis launch into another bout..
You have the facts
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 05:55 AM

"The quote was faked but not by you"
It was not and you accused me of faking it - I fakeed nothing and never have
You are a total disgrace in the amount of time you are prepared to spend defending Is#Israeli atrocities - you have done t for years, each time the Israelis launch into another bout..
You have the facts
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 05:38 AM

I have learned a valuable life lessen recently and I suggest that you have the benefit of my experience to save wasting any more of your time. There is no point arguing with Keith. Ethnic cleansing is only ethnic cleansing if it fits his definition. Historians are only historians if they fit his definition. Racial implants are only racial implants if they fit his definition. See the pattern here?

"I don't know what you mean by 'glory,' " Alice said.
Humpty Dumpty smiled contemptuously. "Of course you don't—till I tell you. I meant 'there's a nice knock-down argument for you!' "
"But 'glory' doesn't mean 'a nice knock-down argument'," Alice objected.
"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean—neither more nor less."
"The question is," said Alice, "whether you can make words mean so many different things."
"The question is," said Humpty Dumpty, "which is to be master—that's all."


And to paraphrase someone else, we seem to be in different counties seperated by a common tongue...


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 05:21 AM

I know what ethnic cleansing is thank you Steve.
The charge is specifically, "the Israeli regime is attempting to ethnically cleanse Israel of Palestinians."

Have any been removed already?
If so who, and where to?

Who says that "the Israeli regime is attempting to ethnically cleanse Israel of Palestinians?"

Apart from Jim obviously, and where did he get it from?

He made it up!

You know it is not true, but you go on trying to defend a demonstrably false claim.
Let's clear this one up and discuss some real issues.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 05:08 AM

The Palestinian territories are ever-contracting, the Israeli-usurped areas are ever-expanding. Life for Palestinians is difficult or impossible in those areas. It's clear what the Israeli regime's ultimate aim is, to clear Palestinians out of its most desired and desirable areas. That is ethnic cleansing. Out of the Israel that the regime wants to create. Will that do, Keith, or do you want more time to keep working on your definition?


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Jun 15 - 05:00 AM

The quote was faked but not by you.
You just immediately and unquestioningly believed it, as you people do all the propaganda and lies poured out by enemies of Israel.

I accused you of making up an issue, not a quote.

Why do you claim that West Bank settlements are the same as cleansing Palestinians out of Israel?
Two entirely separate issues, one of which you have made up.


Steve and Musket, do you believe that, "the Israeli regime is attempting to ethnically cleanse Israel of Palestinians."

Why can you find no evidence of it?


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 08:36 PM

"The other issue was that the Israeli regime is attempting to ethnically"
No it wasn't - you are now lying about lying
Your accusation was that I had made up a quote credited to Sharon the Butcher
""The Sharon quote was definitely faked. He never said it"
What wa the quote that was "faked"
You seem totally unable to separate truth from fiction - that is why you still have not produced the actual "made up" quote
You are really squalid - a true representative of the Israeli regime
Just go away - you are now a standing joke with your "historians" and "decent countries" and "implants.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Musket
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 07:32 PM

Ah. Anything Keith either cannot comprehend or doesn't fit his agenda is "made up."

Nothing new here...

Hardly worth the wait really.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 04:10 PM

Steve,
Keith is, dishonestly as ever, trying to set a booby trap by forcing his own very narrow definition of ethnic cleansing,

No.
Jim was quite specific in his accusation.
He claimed "the Israeli regime is attempting to ethnically cleanse Israel of Palestinians."

That is unequivocal.

I take it that you both now admit that the Israeli regime is NOT attempting to ethnically cleanse Israel of Palestinians.

Jim,
"one of which you have made up"
You are lying


I said, "Two entirely separate issues, one of which you have made up."
One issue was the settlements, which I have always acknowledged was an issue.
The other issue was that the Israeli regime is attempting to ethnically cleanse Israel of Palestinians, which you made up.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Musket
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 03:47 PM

Are there any living eminent ethnic cleansing experts still around?

Might be some waiting in cells in The Hague or hiding in Serbia.

I'm sure they will all agree with Keith's definition.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 03:43 PM

Why's that, Jim? Do they refrain from servile works?   :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 03:37 PM

Bit difficult finding "real historians" on a Sunday
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 09:49 AM

"Keith seems to be refusing to say anything on the grounds that it might incriminate him"

Nah, Jim, he'll be tightening up his definition of ethnic cleansing, having checked out all his sources first, in order to exclude everything Israel has ever done to the Palestinians. Sheesh.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 09:45 AM

And Bruce The Distempered trolls again.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 09:26 AM

Whoops – missed a bit

Trócair

Eviction

Amnesty

NEW York Times

NHuman Rights Watch

Aryeh King, settlers leader

Now that's what I call news reporting
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 09:15 AM

A typical dupe comes up with a typical dupe comment....as expected.


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 09:15 AM

"Former al-Jazeera America journalist sues over anti-Israel, pro-Arab bias"
WE'll stick with everything you're ignoring, if you don't mind - that's what passes for news reporting
Do you think the Holcaust Survivors are lying Antisemites?
Keith seems to be refusing to say anything on the grounds that it might incriminate him
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Jun 15 - 08:44 AM

So are you moaning about the articles or about the Times Of Israel, not exactly a neutral publication, eh? :-). I don't know who your "dupes" are but those are not sources I would ever resort to. Try again.


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