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BS: Mudcatters near fires out west

Janie 12 Aug 15 - 08:51 PM
michaelr 12 Aug 15 - 11:11 PM
Ebbie 12 Aug 15 - 11:28 PM
maeve 13 Aug 15 - 06:56 AM
GUEST,# 13 Aug 15 - 10:22 AM
Megan L 13 Aug 15 - 11:24 AM
Joe Offer 13 Aug 15 - 01:32 PM
Janie 13 Aug 15 - 06:41 PM
Ebbie 13 Aug 15 - 09:18 PM
Janie 13 Aug 15 - 09:54 PM
Bev and Jerry 14 Aug 15 - 12:01 AM
michaelr 14 Aug 15 - 01:53 AM
Rapparee 23 Aug 15 - 10:22 PM
maeve 23 Aug 15 - 10:29 PM
Rapparee 23 Aug 15 - 10:47 PM
Janie 23 Aug 15 - 11:31 PM
GUEST,DrWord 23 Aug 15 - 11:32 PM
Jeri 24 Aug 15 - 09:57 AM
Sandra in Sydney 24 Aug 15 - 10:40 AM
Larry The Radio Guy 24 Aug 15 - 12:10 PM
Megan L 24 Aug 15 - 01:15 PM
Don Firth 24 Aug 15 - 01:43 PM
Rapparee 24 Aug 15 - 03:39 PM
Ebbie 24 Aug 15 - 06:36 PM
gnu 24 Aug 15 - 08:29 PM
gnu 24 Aug 15 - 08:33 PM
Rapparee 24 Aug 15 - 10:53 PM
maeve 27 Aug 15 - 06:17 PM
GUEST,Bert 27 Aug 15 - 11:14 PM
maeve 27 Aug 15 - 11:29 PM
GUEST,Bert 28 Aug 15 - 02:09 AM
Larry The Radio Guy 28 Aug 15 - 03:34 AM
Joe Offer 28 Aug 15 - 05:23 AM
GUEST,# 28 Aug 15 - 05:49 AM
GUEST, ^*^ 28 Aug 15 - 08:41 AM
GUEST,# 28 Aug 15 - 08:53 AM
Janie 28 Aug 15 - 03:13 PM
michaelr 13 Sep 15 - 03:52 PM
Stilly River Sage 13 Sep 15 - 04:18 PM
michaelr 13 Sep 15 - 04:48 PM
michaelr 13 Sep 15 - 05:23 PM
Ebbie 13 Sep 15 - 08:43 PM
maeve 13 Sep 15 - 10:07 PM
Rapparee 13 Sep 15 - 10:41 PM
Joe Offer 14 Sep 15 - 12:22 AM
Vashta Nerada 14 Sep 15 - 01:09 AM
Joe Offer 14 Sep 15 - 02:26 AM
Janie 14 Sep 15 - 05:39 AM
Rapparee 14 Sep 15 - 10:15 AM
michaelr 14 Sep 15 - 05:44 PM

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Subject: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Janie
Date: 12 Aug 15 - 08:51 PM

As the fires rage in several states in the western part of the USA, (and maybe Canada) can't help but stay concerned about Mudcatters who may end up in harm's way as the fire season rages in that terribly drought-stricken part of the continent.

Check in now and then, folks. Let us know that you are OK, if you are at any given point in time, and also let us know if not.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: michaelr
Date: 12 Aug 15 - 11:11 PM

The big fires around here (NorCal) - Rocky and Jerusalem - are in the next county, about 30 - 40 miles northeast, and burning away from my location, luckily in the direction of sparsely populated forest lands. Let's hope the wind doesn't turn.

A big shout-out to the firefighters. Those people are heroes.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Ebbie
Date: 12 Aug 15 - 11:28 PM

It could be that one of those wildfires is closer to Joe Offer.

Joe! Speak up!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: maeve
Date: 13 Aug 15 - 06:56 AM

Joe has posted as recently as this morning, Ebbie:
"Subject: RE: Rise Up Singing Book II: 'Rise Again'
From: Joe Offer - PM
Date: 13 Aug 15 - 04:56 AM "


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: GUEST,#
Date: 13 Aug 15 - 10:22 AM

There are at present over 6,000 forest/wildland fires burning in Canada. That's up about 2,000 from 2014. FYI.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Megan L
Date: 13 Aug 15 - 11:24 AM

Keep safe folks


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Joe Offer
Date: 13 Aug 15 - 01:32 PM

There's a wonderful Website, http://yubanet.com/, that give up-to-date information about fires all over California. We're northeast of Sacramento, and the Lowell Fire was about 15 miles from us and across the Bear River, and it's now 100% contained - still smoldering in spots, but not a danger. It burned 2,304 acres. We have friends in the evacuation area, and they're OK.

The biggest fire, the Rocky Fire, is in Lake County, maybe forty miles west of Sacramento. It burned 69,636 acres, over ten square miles. It's now 95% contained. The Jerusalem Fire, also in Lake County, has burned 23,500 acres and is 33% contained.

There are lots of fires in the northernmost part of California, but they're one or two hundred miles away from the Mudcatters I know in Northern California.

Over the years, a number of Mudcatters have lost their homes to fire. It's a scary thing - but for now, all California Mudcatters seem safe.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Janie
Date: 13 Aug 15 - 06:41 PM

Thanks Joe and michaelr. Hope all stay safe as the fire season wears on. And what you said about the fire fighters, mirchaelr.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Ebbie
Date: 13 Aug 15 - 09:18 PM

I have never been impacted by wildfire but I was visiting my daughter and her family in Escondido when a bad fire was being fought down there. This was the one that did a lot of damage in Laguna Hills then jumped a highway and continued on. It burnt a lot of the vegetation in the San Diego Wild Animal Park.

We stood in my daughter's backyard and watched the smoke and flames over the ridge. I mean it literally- we could actually see leaping flames.

I said that I have never been impacted by wildfire- but I just recalled a scary afternoon at my dad's place some years ago. I happened to be visiting when my brother came in and informed us that a fire was burning up the slope of a hayfield behind the barn.

I spent the next couple of hours with a shovel and a gunny sack beating back flames. Because the field was stubble, the flames weren't high but there was a good breeze blowing and the affected area was wide. My brother had asthma and wasn't able to help directly but he kept dunking the gunny sacks in water and returning them to me.

We got the fire out before it reached the woods but it was touch and go for awhile.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Janie
Date: 13 Aug 15 - 09:54 PM

I hear you, Ebbie. Nothing compared to raging forest fires, but my one experience with putting out a fire made me aware of how a little ignorance has the potential for a huge impact.

Ex-Hubby and I were living in a travel trailer in a little clearing in the woods. Was a drought year in NC, which doesn't compare at all to even typical dry season weather on the west coast. Don't remember what started the fire - probably a spark from a smudge stick or something like that. Dry grass and leaves flamed up. No big deal though we were startled by how quickly it flared and spread. We thought we could beat it out quickly. Except that 1. we were standing downwind from the flames and 2. the bulk of leaf litter and dry woods were upwind. Our efforts to beat out and smother the flames added to the effects of wind in driving the flames forward toward more combustible material. We fortunately realized that in time for one of us to move in front of the fire while the other ran to hook up a hose. Was pretty scary and a close call. I expect/hope that most people who live in drier and chronically fire-prone regions are a bit better informed than were we.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Bev and Jerry
Date: 14 Aug 15 - 12:01 AM

We live in California but there have been no large fires anywhere near us.

However, we live in a pine and oak forest and the pines are dropping like flies - on average about 40% are dead. In some places it's as high as 90%. We have a very small lot and, so far, only one tree has died and it was rather puny. We had it removed to protect a nearby house.

No one around here can remember a time when the forest was so dry. If a fire starts, it will be explosive.

A few weeks ago we had the worst lighting storm we have seen in 55 years in California. It started two trees smoldering. One burst into flames 5 days later and the other nearly two weeks after the storm. Fortunately, firefighters got on both of them (and a third one) really fast and held them to about one acre each.

So far, so good but it can happen at any moment.

Bev and Jerry


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: michaelr
Date: 14 Aug 15 - 01:53 AM

Two words: Defensible space. It means remove all vegetation around your house and outbuildings for as far as your property allows.


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Subject: BS: Fires in the Western US and Canada
From: Rapparee
Date: 23 Aug 15 - 10:22 PM

We've been under air quality alerts for a week now, meaning that I can't really get much done outside. No active fires nearby, but lots of smoky air.

How are the rest of you faring?


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Subject: RE: BS: Fires in the Western US and Canada
From: maeve
Date: 23 Aug 15 - 10:29 PM

I believe we've only heard from a couple of folks out there in regard to the fires and smoke: http://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=157903&messages=12#3730192


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Subject: RE: BS: Fires in the Western US and Canada
From: Rapparee
Date: 23 Aug 15 - 10:47 PM

I searched but didn't find anything; if I had I'd have resurrected it. Oh well.

We currently have 771,271 acres actively burning here in Idaho, or about 1,200 square miles (or for you Others, like Canadians, 312,122 hectares -- but Canada has its own fires). That's a lot of smoke, not including the fires in Oregon, Washington, Northern California, and Montana.
    Counterintuitively, our main search engine does not work on recent threads. It has to be indexed occasionally to include recent threads. To find threads, the best tool is the Filter. Threads combined.
    -Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: BS: Fires in the Western US and Canada
From: Janie
Date: 23 Aug 15 - 11:31 PM

Might a mod combine the two threads under this title? Gonna continue to be a long, hard fire season for many Mudcatters in the west, and many of us not living in the western USA and Canada will continue to be concerned for the land and the people in harm's way, and especially for fellow mudcatters. Would be good to have one thread where folks can either check in or inquire.


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Subject: RE: BS: Fires in the Western US and Canada
From: GUEST,DrWord
Date: 23 Aug 15 - 11:32 PM

~295,000 hectares burned in British Columbia since April~ Significant fires in Alberta and Saskatchewan as well
dennis


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Jeri
Date: 24 Aug 15 - 09:57 AM

As near as I can tell, two threads were combined last night, then both were deleted. I don't think that was supposed to happen. This one's back.

Seems like those in the west not getting the fires are getting the smoke. Hope you get rained upon soon. Stay safe.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 24 Aug 15 - 10:40 AM

70 Australian firefighters left here a couple of days ago to help fight these fires.

Some of your firefighters might be here later this year as we are expecting a very bad 15/16 fire season. Fire authorities have been burning off this week in various locations to cut the risk.

sandra


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Larry The Radio Guy
Date: 24 Aug 15 - 12:10 PM

Here in Penticton B.C. we're very much affected by four different fires.....two in Oliver, one in Rock Creek, and one in NOrthern Washington (The Stickpin fire). Even though right now we're not in any specific danger.

We have incredible smoke in the air in Penticton........making it hard for people to go outside (affecting my wife who has suffered from asthma).   A number of homes in the ROck Creek area burned, and Christina Lake is threatened by the Stickpin fire.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Megan L
Date: 24 Aug 15 - 01:15 PM

Larry do what you have to to stay safe


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Don Firth
Date: 24 Aug 15 - 01:43 PM

Smokey haze in the air yesterday in Seattle and the air smelled pretty bad. I haven't been outside yet today, so I don't know how it is.

I have a friend who has a nice big cabin out in the woods in Okenagen County. Some years ago I went up there with him several times. But I'm afraid it's right in the middle of one of the major fire areas.

I haven't seen Mike in several years, so I don't have any way of finding out.

This whole thing is pretty disastrous.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Rapparee
Date: 24 Aug 15 - 03:39 PM

As of right now, Alaska has four fires going, one of which is over 330,00 acres (133,500+ hectares), 15 in Arizona, 37 in California, 3 in Florida (one over 35,000 acres), 27 in Idaho, 1 in Louisiana, 2 in Minnesota, 23 in Montana, 3 in Nevada, 5 in New Mexico, 2 in North Carolina, 19 in Oregon, 1 in Utah, 26 in Washington, and 2 in Wyoming.

The smoke isn't so back at the moment, about 60 on the scale used, with 50 being the upper limit of "OK".


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Ebbie
Date: 24 Aug 15 - 06:36 PM

Most of the fires in Alaska currently are being only monitored rather than fought, since no there are no homes or humans in the vicinity. There are several, though, that have the potential of doing harm.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: gnu
Date: 24 Aug 15 - 08:29 PM

It's horrifying to watch some of the videos. There is one on YT that shows the speed of one in the Okanogan. Truly terrifying.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: gnu
Date: 24 Aug 15 - 08:33 PM

Odd that I should see this thread after just posting a song on another thread about sommat similar from a comedy music perspective. Maybe it might provide a laugh in such a tragic time? I hesitated to post it herein but that never stopped me before so...

Buddy.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Rapparee
Date: 24 Aug 15 - 10:53 PM

When you're on the lines you need humor, Noir or otherwise.

The air was much clearer this afternoon, but it's forecast to go bad again tomorrow.

Somehow the song "Keep the Home Fires Burning" seems inappropriate.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: maeve
Date: 27 Aug 15 - 06:17 PM

Thinking of y'all in fire and smoke zones...we know something of it.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/08/27/us-usa-wildfires-idUSKCN0QV29Y20150827


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: GUEST,Bert
Date: 27 Aug 15 - 11:14 PM

I am usually the first one to speak out about our current trend to "Blame the Victim" But it beats me why the hell do people build wooden houses in the middle of the forest.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: maeve
Date: 27 Aug 15 - 11:29 PM

Bert- One does not always have a choice.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: GUEST,Bert
Date: 28 Aug 15 - 02:09 AM

I dunno, Someone CHOSE to build wooden houses there. There is a hell of a lot of other places to build. Forest land is usually quite expensive.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Larry The Radio Guy
Date: 28 Aug 15 - 03:34 AM

Bert----If you build near water, you risk floods. If you build in prairie, you risk tornadoes. Near cliffs (above or below)---avalanches or mud slides. Other places....earthquakes.   Pollution (leading to asthma or bronchial infections).

I think it's easy to step outside the forest and see only the trees.   Everything in life is a cost/benefit and we can never predict any of them with any certainty.

So I choose not to judge in most instances.

That being said, Grand Forks, Oliver, and even Kelowna are being threatened with fire behaviour (the latter more related to ashes). And all of us are very affected by the bad air from the fires.   And areas near Oliver and Grand Forks have evacuation alerts.

So it is a scary situation.

Fortunately, they are forecasted rain and cooler weather for the weekend.   We hope that this will change the situation significantly for the better.

We live in a little rented four plex in the middle of Penticton right below an embankment that has lots of trees.   The back is beautiful trees and forest. The front is downtown Penticton.   We always had more cause to fer the latter than the former.   BUt if somebody above us happens to throw out a lighted cigarette---we could be in big trouble.

Fortunatey right now we're confident we'll survive the next couple days, then maybe the rain and cooler weather will lower the risk.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Joe Offer
Date: 28 Aug 15 - 05:23 AM

Well, Bert, there are a lot of trees in the forest to build houses out of, ya know...

The term "wildfire" has become more popular in recent years, rather than "forest fire." It's undergrowth and chaparral that cause the real danger, not the trees. But if there's lots of undergrowth, the trees will burn, too. We had lots of Ponderosa pines burn in the fire across the freeway from us last October - very few homes burned, though. I think there were 6 homes lost. There were 50 homes lost in town about five years ago, in an area where nobody thought there could be a fire. But there was grass and brush surrounding the neighborhood. That caught fire, and the whole neighborhood went up in smoke. Two friends of mine lost their homes.

That being said, I think we'd have lost our home if that fire had been on this side of the freeway last year. We do our best to keep a "defensible space" without having it barren around the house, but I don't think anything would save us if a fire got started here. We live in a farm house built in the 1940s. We have a composition roof, not wood shingles. But it's a wooden house.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: GUEST,#
Date: 28 Aug 15 - 05:49 AM

"But it beats me why the hell do people build wooden houses in the middle of the forest."

Wouldn't matter what people built the houses out of. The heat generated by forest/wildfires will destroy anything inside whatever one builds the structure from.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: GUEST, ^*^
Date: 28 Aug 15 - 08:41 AM

Wildland managers have, over the last 100+ years, made a huge mistake in the management of their forest acreage. They put out all of the fires. Most fires pre government management (see Joe's remark above) would burn the undergrowth and small timber ("dog hair") but the mature trees are left standing in most fire situations when fire regularly passes through removing the understory fuel. Local tribes in western states are often attributed with traditions of burning out the chaparral every few seasons. When you let that fuel build up by continually putting it out after lightning strikes, it's like building a bonfire under the standing timber, and then you see the mature growth crown out when the ground fire is so hot convection ignites the tops of the trees.

The discussion over the last 20 years has been how to clear out that undergrowth without setting off huge fires that destroy the standing timber. Mechanically crawling over all of that acreage is physically impossible if even if it were, would be beyond any budget to practically manage.

There are fire retardant foams that can be sprayed on structures to help prevent total destruction. http://www.latimes.com/business/realestate/la-re-fire25nov25-story.html


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: GUEST,#
Date: 28 Aug 15 - 08:53 AM

I mentioned that foam a number of years back on this site. Problem in part is that insurance companies weren't able to offer lower premiums to offset the cost. Perhaps that's changed.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Janie
Date: 28 Aug 15 - 03:13 PM

A friend who lives in central Washington is posting beautiful and terrifying photos on Facebook. Georgeous pictures of hills several miles away, backlit at night by fires raging just below the ridgetops, and a night sky full of dangerous sparks that look like shooting stars.

Continuing to hold all in my thoughts and meditations.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: michaelr
Date: 13 Sep 15 - 03:52 PM

OK, it's getting really bad now. The Valley Fire in Lake County exploded from 400 to 40,000 acres in five hours yesterday, whipped by gusty 20-30mph winds, and forced the evacuation of thousands of residents. Overnight, it burned dozens of homes in Cobb, Middletown and Hidden Lake, as well as the well-known Harbin Hot Springs resort. At this time, we don't know whether the 100+ year old home that was converted into a salon where my wife works part-time is still there. A number of her friends and co-workers have been evacuated, and we know that at least two of them lost their homes.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 13 Sep 15 - 04:18 PM

Stay safe out there.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: michaelr
Date: 13 Sep 15 - 04:48 PM

CalFire now estimates 1,000 homes lost in the Valley fire.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: michaelr
Date: 13 Sep 15 - 05:23 PM

50,000 acres burned in 24 hours. No containment, and it's still spreading.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Ebbie
Date: 13 Sep 15 - 08:43 PM

I am so sorry. And they mentioned last night that the Santa Ana winds will soon begin. September is a cruel month in dry weather.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: maeve
Date: 13 Sep 15 - 10:07 PM

Thinking of michaelr and all in the recent and future path of fire. I remember.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Sep 15 - 10:41 PM

According to the news there are two small fires in Yellowstone NP, which they are watching -- one has been burning since August. There is another small fire in Fremont County, north of here. We've been lucky as there are no large fires nearby. However, the air quality has been pretty bad.

I have relatives-by-marriage in the Shasta-Trinity fires area, and I know what those in California, Washington, and elsewhere are going through.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Joe Offer
Date: 14 Sep 15 - 12:22 AM

Here's a link to the most up-to-date fire reports in Northern California:
It's distressing to see that the Valley Fire in Lake County (not far from Nape) has taken hundreds of structures and has burned 50,000 acres.

The fire that affects us here in Applegate is the Butte Fire in Amador County. It has burned 65,000 acres and taken 214 structures. We're 65 miles away, but we haven't seen the sun for two days because of the smoke. We may not be in danger, but it's spooky outside and very uncomfortable.

I think this is the worst fire season I can remember since I arrived in California in 1970. Last year wasn't a bad season by comparison, but there was a major fire that started a few hundred yards from my home. That's the most directly I've been affected by fire. I hope it never comes that close again.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Vashta Nerada
Date: 14 Sep 15 - 01:09 AM

A fire near your home last year means a lot of built-up fuel was removed. That's an excellent thing for this year and the next several to come.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Joe Offer
Date: 14 Sep 15 - 02:26 AM

Oh, don't worry, Vashta - we have plenty more to burn. We do have some pretty good firebreaks around the house, but I think a big fire would take us anyhow. There's lots of vegetation my wife the gardener won't part with.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Janie
Date: 14 Sep 15 - 05:39 AM

Appreciate y'all taking the time to check in. Can't imagine what it must be like.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: Rapparee
Date: 14 Sep 15 - 10:15 AM

A couple of years ago 64 houses, along with their outbuildings, burned south of town, about seven miles from here. The usual story of dry fuel, high temperatures, and high winds. Many places had "defensible space" and followed all of the recommended anti-wildfire steps, but such a fire can spread faster and hotter than what man proposes. And, of course, you have the usual fools who for whatever reason plant cedars as foliage to cover the basement line, think tumbleweeds are "cute" and leave them stack up, don't believe it can happen to them, etc. etc.

If you'd like to follow the fires, try here. Think of the damage to animals, including cattle and pets, as well as the damage to humans.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcatters near fires out west
From: michaelr
Date: 14 Sep 15 - 05:44 PM

This is our local paper's twitter feed. Lots of mind-blowing photos and video. I've never seen anything like it. Thankfully we're getting a bit of rain today.


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