BS: President Bernie Sanders?

Subject: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Ebbie
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 04:33 PM

Finally, here is something that gives me real hope:

Via Rapparee on FAcebook

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: DMcG
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 04:58 PM

Maybe I just haven't been paying attention, but on the UK side of the pond I haven't heard a mention of him for around three months.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Greg F.
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 05:22 PM

If only I could believe it, Ebbie.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Ebbie
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 05:59 PM

Me to, Greg. We've got to get to work. Seriously.


And DMcG, that may be a lack in the UK reporting- it is certainly not the case here.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Bill D
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 07:00 PM

Everyone can be wrong the first time. Bernie will get lots of support, but if I were a betting man, I'd bet a dollar that he won't win the nomination. He may win a couple of primaries and be influential in pushing the platform...but.... *shrug*.

   I would also bet that if he did get the nomination, the conservatives would have a field day shouting "SOCIALIST" for months.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: akenaton
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 07:07 PM

I'm sure they wont shout "SOCIALIST" at Mrs Clinton.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Amos
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 07:16 PM

I'd support him. He's the most rational man on the scene since Barack Obama.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Ebbie
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 07:41 PM

Me too, Amos.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 08:01 PM

He's not pretty enough on camera. I wish it weren't about looks, but there it is.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 08:59 PM

I think Bernie is FAR more of an honest person than Hillary, by a long shot, and integrity would be a swaying factor for a lot of people, even if they didn't like his politics....that being said, if Hillary runs, I'd have to take Bill Clinton's lead on that one, and go with Monica Lewinsky!

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 10:20 PM

"President Obama is right. ISIS will be destroyed with an international coalition in which Muslim troops on the ground are supported by the United States, United Kingdom, France, Russia and other leading powers. We must learn the lesson of Iraq. American troops should not be engaged in perpetual warfare in the Middle East. Further, as we destroy ISIS, it is essential that we do not allow fear and division to undermine the constitutional rights that make us a free people."

      -Bernie Sanders

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 06 Dec 15 - 10:34 PM

You know, this sounds better with Bernie saying it, than Obama...just a thought..


GfS

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: akenaton
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 06:09 AM

Unfortunately, even if Mr Sanders is sincere(as I think he probably is), he will be no more effective than President Obama.

America is completely split into two sections representing approximately the same interests......and never the twain shall meet.

Think "bad cop/good cop" and you have the idea.
We need people with the guts to fight long standing political prejudices.....we can no longer afford the "worker boss" interminable battle. We will have many years ahead when living standards continue to fall.....we should be preparing now.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 10:48 AM

Bernie is totally 'honest' and would try to do the 'right thing'.... but he has spent most of his energy on one issue-- leveling the playing field for the middle class and fighting corporate greed. All very commendable, but corporations are geared up to combat that, and if he wants to be nominated, he needs to say a LOT more on other issues....soon!

I would not complain if Bernie were elected.... I think he'd learn quickly, but if you think Obama got stonewalled by Republicans, you ain't seen nothin' yet!
I really don't agree with all those who paint Hillary with a broad brush as a "hawk" and as beholding to corporate interests. It's amazing how folks want to 'spin' small differences in policy and attitude into visions of extremism.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,#
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 01:32 PM

President Bernie Sanders.

Has a nice ring to it.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?h
From: GUEST,Frogprince
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 01:40 PM

A consummation devoutly to be wished, to coin a phrase

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: akenaton
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 05:14 PM

Mr Sanders and Mrs Clinton....hmmm I DON'T think so.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Ebbie
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 05:53 PM

My take on this is that we must elect a Democrat this election cycle. The time may again come when I would support a Republican for president but this is not the time. The PeeParty has essentially infiltrated and infected the party so that even those Republicans who normally would choose moderation and compromise do not feel able to do so.

I like Hillary Clinton but her unfavorable rating is so high that if she is elected President many Americans, including Democrats, will distrust and resist her. As for the Right Wing, the killer is that she is a WOMAN. Remember when then-First Lady Clinton presented her health care plan? Among the obstacles, I believe, was her sex. The Right Wing simply does not respect females.

Bernie Sanders has an impediment too - many Americans distrust any form of the word 'socialism'. Never mind that Americans already have and enjoy a number of forms of socialism- they are afraid of the word. So Sanders has that challenge to overcome. But he is a man- and many Americans will automatically respect him even if they don't understand his label.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,Olddude
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 07:24 PM

Ain't happening, we will probably end up with Trump. America no longer has brain farts, we have full blown brain shits.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,#
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 07:29 PM

If I voted I'd vote Sanders.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: akenaton
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 07:33 PM

The old saw about "no matter who you vote for the govt always gets in" seems particularly apt when applied to US politics.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,Blue
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 07:37 PM

Hillary has too many unsolved murders linked to her and Bill...look it up google "Clinton Murders".
Also HIllary is too involved in Benghazi...that is, she was using the office of sec of state to sell arms to the enemy during wartime...yes, it is available knowledge, we know the names of the dealers, receivers, the ships they were shipped on thru Turkey to arm Al Quaeda and Isis...we even have the emails documenting the process...
No, just because she is a woman does not forgive treason in color of office.
If Hillary is elected, look for deeper corporate fascism to expand world wide.
Nowhere to run, nowhere to hide!

And paid for by more debt.

Dont believe me, look it up for yourself. This is all published information freely available.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,Olddude
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 08:06 PM

I respect your opinion blue, but I don't think you know her. She and Bill are friends and I know her very well . Don't believe all you read. Yes she has faults like everyone, but you have no idea how much heart they both have.

So far I only see one person with the experience and that is her. But that's what is great about america, the right to choose in an election and vote as you see fit.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 08:17 PM

"...her unfavorable rating is so high that if she is elected President many Americans, including Democrats, will distrust and resist her."

Aww.. Ebbie- "rating"?? I seem to remember that Truman had a high negative rating....until he did some things.


90% of the change from her mostly positive ratings a couple or years ago to these unfavorable ones now are a direct result of Republicans yelling "Benghazi" and "Emails" on every program available. It makes very little difference how many times accusations & insinuations are answered and explained... what many people 'hear' are the accusations-- studying the answers takes time and *gasp*.. thinking.
The #%$@*&&^%$ Republicans have NO one competent to offer, so they throw mud- just as they did at Obama from Day 1! (No...sorry... they throw mud and Gerrymander districts and lie about changing the voting laws.)

Right now, I can't imagine the country as a whole electing Trump or Carson...or...etc., so all best guesses are that either Clinton or Sanders will win. Personally, I can live with voting for either one. If I could push a magic button, there are various others I'd rather see... but they are not running- (probably because Hillary was assumed to be a shoe-in until recently). Who? Oh, I'd vote for Barney Frank in a moment... or Al Franken.. or Ed Markey.. or Sherrod Brown...or...yes.... Joe Biden! And if you want women, I'd trust and have confidence in Diane Feinstein or Tammy Baldwin (though she needs more seasoning & experience)..or even Maria Cantwell of Washington State..though she has no profile right now.... and those are just Senators! (Heck.. I'd rather have Claire McCaskill of Missouri than anyone the Republicans are offering...)

I am just bewildered at this political season. I have watched politics since Eisenhower/Stevenson, and I never thought I'd see such irrelevant CRAP being used as reasoning for voting.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 08:20 PM

and.."This is all published information freely available."
It is published by conspiracy theorists... 'information' is not exactly the word I'd use for incessantly repeated rumors.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 08:25 PM

I've been a Hillary man for a long, long time. I think it's her time, and I hope she'll be elected President. I'm sure she'll do a good job.

But it's true that Hillary has a lot of baggage, mostly not of her own making. The demagogues have been very adept out of making issues out of nonissues, and it has made her appear untrustworthy to many Americans. Even though I think she'll probably win the election easily, that lack of trust will haunt her for her entire term of office. I don't know how she can fix that, and it's just not fair. She did a good job as Secretary of State, and I think that's proof she'd be an excellent President.

But I have to admit I like Bernie a lot. To me, he represents the best that America should be - but I'm still not convinced he would be a practical choice. I think the Tea Party would be on him like sharks in a feeding frenzy.

So, I'll stick with Hillary. She's a good, smart woman - and she's tough.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 08:39 PM

Thank you, Joe... that's as good a summary as I've seen.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,Olddude
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 08:55 PM

Did not know you liked her Joe, well if elected I bet I can get you an invite to the white house.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Ebbie
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 09:01 PM

Hey, Dan- I like her too! :)

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,Olddude
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 09:39 PM

I got ya covered ebbie

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,#
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 09:48 PM

"Did not know you liked her Joe, well if elected I bet I can get you an invite to the white house."

Old friend of mine (he died a while back) was invited to the White House to perform. His wife checked one of the ashtrays that were around in the smoking areas of the time. They were made in Hong Kong.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,Olddude
Date: 07 Dec 15 - 10:45 PM

Yup all the great antique stuff is for the big wigs upstairs or in restricted spaces

Downstairs you get Chinese copies from walmart s :)

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 01:12 AM

How do you know Hillary, Dan?

Seems to me that every time she opens her mouth, that woman makes sense. Trouble is, the Tea Party folks have such destructive tactics, that I wonder if anybody can get anything accomplished while they're around.

And at least in my area, the Tea Party people don't seem to be losing any steam.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: akenaton
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 04:27 AM

I'm VERY surprised Joe, how on earth can you say she did a good job in Mr Obama's administration?
What did she achieve, other than push Mr Obama into one of the worst Foreign Affairs decision in recent history.....Libya. Arguably as bad as Bush's decision to attack Iraq.

If you cant stand the sentiments of "Onward Christian Soldiers".....how can you vote for Mrs Clinton?

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 06:42 AM

I really don't want it to matter to us, but it does. Can you PLEASE deliver us a president who won't keep getting us into wars and who doesn't rub everyone in the Middle East (except Israel) up the wrong way? Nice try with Obama but could do better. It would also be very nice if he or she showed a bit of "morl curge" (to quote Dubya) in standing up to the corporations, the pro-Israel lobby and the NRA, to show them once and for all that democracy, not unelected pressure groups, is in charge.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,Olddude
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 07:56 AM

Pm me Joe

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: gillymor
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 08:47 AM

While my politics align more closely with Sanders than any other of the available candidates I see HC as the best option with Martin O'Malley a not so close second (based only on his lack of electability). Mrs. Clinton displays a grasp of the issues that no other candidate possesses, Republican or Democrat, and in those bogus Benghazi hearings she seemed like the only adult in the room.

I agree with Bill that a Sanders administration would bring gridlock to new heights (or depths) and we'd be subjected to Freedom Forum induced impeachment votes at regular intervals on the grounds that he is a socialist and therefore "Unamerican". No Democratic president will be able to accomplish much if the makeup of congress doesn't shift but a Republican president would be a disaster for the present and future generations of the U.S. If the GOP were in a position to pick SCOTUS nominees and sign into law some of the anti-human legislation that comes from this congress you can just about wave goodbye to most of the social programs that alleviate misery and bring at least a modicum of fairness to this society. Anyone using that tired old argument that Republicans and Democrats are all the same has sawdust where their brain was meant to be.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: akenaton
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 08:59 AM

How can anyone ignore the disaster which was Libya?

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Bill D
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 11:28 AM

Nobody is **ignoring** anything... it's just that some folks don't agree with your interpretation(s) of exactly how 'disastrous' it was and the notion that all blame for problems falls on whoever was technically in charge!

Face it, Ake... Libya and several other trouble spots around the world are no-win situations! We get damned if we don't DO something... and damned twice if we try. When factions in a country are determined to hate and kill and pick their targets by exacerbating their own cultural/religious bias, there WILL be nasty events. The job of President & Sec. of State is to try to navigate those waters. We cannot just ignore the rest of the world, but parts of the world make it very dangerous to even try to help.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: akenaton
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 12:18 PM

We had two very obvious precedents Bill. Iraq and Egypt
The "Arab Spring" was obviously a sham. As far as I can see, US complicity in the overthrow and subsequent murder of Gaddafi was engineered to show Mrs Clinton as a woman of action as opposed to mr Obama who was rightly reluctant to get involved.

Mr Obama's standing has never been regained since that failed operation. It was a no lose situation for Clinton. If the gamble turned out well, she took the credit, if it went arse up(as it did) the buck stops with the President.

Our prime mover Mr Hague has been swiftly moved to the House of Lords.
Out of sight, out of mind.   He would never survive an election campaign.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Donuel
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 12:26 PM

Like my bumper sticker says

If you liked FDR-You'll love Bernie.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,#
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 12:32 PM

I doubt more than 20% of your countrymen/women would know who FDR was or what he did.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Greg F.
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 01:13 PM

and 50% (at least) of those who think they know who FDR was and what he did have it wrong.

Among Republiccans, the figure is 95%

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 01:55 PM

Gillymor sez: Mrs. Clinton displays a grasp of the issues that no other candidate possesses, Republican or Democrat, and in those bogus Benghazi hearings she seemed like the only adult in the room.

I agree completely.

---

Donuel sez: If you liked FDR-You'll love Bernie.

I liked FDR a lot. And I also have a high opinion of Bernie Sanders.

So whatever happens, I think we'll have an excellent Democratic candidate for President in 2016. The Republicans will most likely nominate a dunce supported by 20 percent of the electorate, so I don't see how the Republicans can win the presidency in 2016.

Congress? Now that's another matter, but I'm still hoping for a Democratic majority in both houses, and I think my hopes are reasonable.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: Bill D
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 10:06 PM

"The "Arab Spring" was obviously a sham. As far as I can see, US complicity in the overthrow and subsequent murder of Gaddafi was engineered to show Mrs Clinton as a woman of action as opposed to mr Obama who was rightly reluctant to get involved."

Ake... you know from reading my posts for years now that I am not one to make harsh statements rashly... but that is BS.

What is obvious about how far you can see is: not very far. That is beyond speculation and verging on character assassination.... "sham"... "engineered by"..... NONSENSE! It ranks up there with the claims that 9/11 was a CIA plot.

....lordy...

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: olddude
Date: 08 Dec 15 - 10:24 PM

I sadly still make harsh statements but trying to be better but ake please keep an open mind and vote your heart. There are lots of people on both sides that have an agenda and it has little to do with truth

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: akenaton
Date: 09 Dec 15 - 04:17 AM

Hmmm, not much information there Bill and how do you explain Mrs Clintons disgraceful and misplaced triumphalism after the murder of Gaddafi?.

It seems to me that some people are more interested in political electability than in any real change in how US politics is run.

Reminds me of the current situation within the UK Labour Party.

They used to call it "divide and rule"
If Mr Sanders is sincere, it will take a decade of patient work and education to give people an understandable alternative to corporate capitalism.
He is in exactly the same position as Mr Corbyn in the UK.

Educated people who REALLY want change, should not be voting for the status quo.

Dan, I understand what you are saying and wish you well.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: gillymor
Date: 09 Dec 15 - 06:44 AM

"Educated people who REALLY want change, should not be voting for the status quo."
According to yourself they should be voting for Sarah Palin.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: akenaton
Date: 09 Dec 15 - 11:38 AM

Sarah Palin is far from the status quo....... but you won't have a clue what I'm talking about. You have to look beyond party politics.

Subject: RE: BS: President Bernie Sanders?
From: GUEST,#
Date: 09 Dec 15 - 11:41 AM

Ake, if Palin didn't have nice tits no one would pay any attention to her at all.