BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Mar 16 - 03:24 PM

Acme....I saw the disruption in Chicago, it looked like fascism to me, demonstrators have the right to demonstrate, not disrupt a legal political rally regardless if whether you support or oppose the views being promoted.
I disregard what happened in Chicago completely and condemn it, as you would quite rightly do if Mrs Clinton's meetings were being hi-jacked.

The black folks I refer to were at peaceful meetings.....not many but enough and some spoke quite forcibly.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Ebbie
Date: 18 Mar 16 - 03:49 PM

ake, when you say: "demonstrators have the right to demonstrate, not disrupt a legal political rally ", do you mean they have the right to show up but not to speak?

Question: When a non-supporter feels that it is imperative to gain the attention of his country in regards to the non-appropriateness of an individual seeking office- and getting perilously close to it - what would you advise that person/group to do? Personally, I think that many of Trump's "supporters" have no idea of what life would be like under his rule.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Mar 16 - 04:20 PM

Akenaton Even your namesake was a renegade populist winning candidate for Pharaoh. I will not condemn or condone your selection but something tells me , you may in the final analysis go for Trump.
In this country the secret ballot is still the norm.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 18 Mar 16 - 04:26 PM

Who said we want change? We want the existing system to work better. We don't want self-centered despots to break things. It is continually suggested that "insiders" and life-long politicians are a problem. Some of them are, but most of them aren't. They are working in public service - just like teachers, librarians, state and federal employees, and more. Trump is clueless as to how government really works. The learning curve is treacherous for an outsider whose main skills are grandstanding and firing people.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,#
Date: 18 Mar 16 - 06:07 PM

Could anyone point me to a single Donald Trump policy? A published and endorsed political platform? For that matter I'd like to see any from Republican candidates.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: frogprince
Date: 18 Mar 16 - 06:25 PM

Here's at least somethin' on candidate positions, including a bunch of the dropouts.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: frogprince
Date: 18 Mar 16 - 06:30 PM

And here's the page I thought I was getting

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: frogprince
Date: 18 Mar 16 - 06:34 PM

There are links for Cruz and Rubio spliced in the rundown on Trump.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,#
Date: 18 Mar 16 - 08:19 PM

Thank you, frogprince.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Mar 16 - 08:25 PM

May I recommend a new novel "Ocean's 88"

It is about a Casino owner that runs for President of the United States.
All the while he is placing Vegas bets on the odds of winning or losing. Meanwhile His casino is so highly leveraged he can not pay the interest. He starts taking his presidential bets and winnings to pay the interest with chips to keep his financial difficulty a secret.

The Vegas gaming board gets wind of this. Read the dramatic twisted conclusion when the future of the UNITED STATES is in the hands of Tony Toenails, Heindrich Rummp and multi national corporate stock owners.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Mar 16 - 08:49 PM

Watch the hijinks ensue when a casino owner running for President bets against himself and says the worst things imaginable to win his bet. But instead he loses billions UNTIL he switches strategy and makes enough money to buy China.

Don't miss 'Ocean's 88' now at Wallgreen's lottery counter.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 12:36 AM

Donuel: "It is about a Casino owner that runs for President of the United States.
All the while he is placing Vegas bets on the odds of winning or losing. Meanwhile His casino is so highly leveraged he can not pay the interest."

While, meanwhile the interest on the 'loans' for printing money, is so highly leveraged we can't pay our national 'debt'.....so they back the two parties, they pay off to make that happen...and the two parties get to promote more debt, and fool people that it's for their own 'good'. When that gets called to the attention of the people, the two parties scream bloody murder...then you get two 'outsider' candidates(Trump and Sanders), who speak to the anger of the people, and the 'establishment' of status quo, do everything to discredit them.
That being said, without those who understand that, favoring either one.

Just an objective observation.

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 01:56 AM

I'm still giggling over the comment that in The USA this is an election whilst to the rest of us it's an intelligence test..😂

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Ebbie
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 03:15 AM

:~/ Afraid it is true.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 04:30 AM

".I saw the disruption in Chicago, it looked like fascism to me,"
Describing those who showed their opposition to Trump the way they did as 'fascists' shows an ignorance of what Trump is and is doing and it is deeply insulting to people who care enough to stop him - it is tantamount to saying the same of those who took to the streets of Britain to oppose Mosely and his Blackshirts.
Trump's campaign has been hate-filled, belligerent, devisive and threatening to millions of Americans - much of it verges on open racism.
It would be surprising and a little disappointing if he had not been met with some half-decent opposition, rather than the political waffle we have seen so far - lets hope for more of it.
He is a crude political thug whose debating skills are little more than rabble-rousing and in the unthinkable event of him winning America will end up with a Reagan/Bush/Goldwater/Joe McCarthy all rolled into one, without the dubious skills of his political forbears - a hate-monger at the time when the world desperately needs a peacemaker.
WHAT HIS OWN KIND ARE SAYING   
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 04:47 AM

Jim, you either continue the pretence of "democracy" or you show the evil underbelly of the Capitalist system.
There is no chance that the system will "come clean" about how it really operates.

Systemic change can only come from education of the population, it is too late for the revolution, they are far too well organised.
Education involves the removal of personal financial aspiration as a driver for the economy and society. Without its removal, any nationalised health or education programme is doomed to failure.
That failure is already evident in the NHS and the UK education system, both being abused by those who run them, those who work in them and many of those who use them.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 05:04 AM

"Jim, you either continue the pretence of "democracy""
True democracy is when we all have a voice - the only voice the ordinary people have at the present time is when they take to the streets.
Trump has bought his way to where he is - how democratic is that - if he can run roughshod over 'democracy', why not the man in the street?
"Systemic change can only come from education of the population, "
Utter nonsense - the system that is in need of change controls the machinery of education and the media - no system has ever allowed itself to be replaced without violent offering opposition - civil wars, military and political coups and open repression - all real change has been brought about by violent reaction to all these.
That small groups of people should express their feelings towards this rabble-rousing hate-monger is far from fascism, quite the opposite, and you really should hang your head in shame at such a suggestion - but there again - Trump is from a 'reliable gene pool'.   
It's rather typical that you should blame us all for the failures, weaknesses and problems of the N.H.S. and education, rather than an ailing society which finds them both unprofitable and inconvenient and would be glad to see them put into private hands, just like the good old days.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 05:52 AM

I have to disagree with you Jim. Education is the only sustainable method to change the system. Violence breeds violence.

Have a read about the formation of the Mondragon Co-operative. It is really quite enlightened and started by a catholic priest by all things.

I did a thesis on it years ago, truly fascinating.
Mondragon

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 06:17 AM

"Education is the only sustainable method to change the system"
Then while the education system remains the under the control of the state and the most influential sections of the media dedicates itself to maintaining the status quo, things will either remain the same or deteriorate.
No society has ever introduced significant changes willingly - obtaining national suffrage, votes for women better working conditions - all results of sometimes vioent opposition to peaceful protest.
Steps towards real democracy were brought about as a direct result of two woreld wars, and the really important ones brought in after WW2 by the Labour Government have now virtually been torn to shreds - nationalisation, social housing, free health care for all... all systematically destroyed.
Trump is little more than ailing capitalism digging its heels in to make the result of its own contradictions disappear - a fascist plaster for a gaping wound.
It is significant that nations such as Cuba, China and the former U.S.S.R all introduced massive improvements to their education systems once the changes had been put into place, but that was only made possible by mobilising the uneducated in the first place.
One of the golden rules of all repressive systems is that you don't educate slaves, especially not to improve their lot.
How exactly do you envision education changing anything as things stand at the present?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 06:27 AM

Jim, Read the link and you will see how Jose Maria Arizmendiarrieta educated people to realise the potential of a co-operative structure.

He did this in the face of a fascist regime and succeeded. It can be done (and to my mind should be done) without violence.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 07:38 AM

Chicken and egg Jim, how are you going to ensure people act to change the system without educating them that the system 1.needs to be changed and 2.can be changed.

Education to my mind HAS to come first.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 07:42 AM

Just as an aside Jim both my father and I attended WEA classes and learnt a great deal and we both taught WEA classes, my father more than I. Without the WEA I would never have managed to get a University place, I will be eternally grateful for that opportunity.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 08:07 AM

"how are you going to ensure people act to change the system without educating them that the system "
People don't attempt to change things because of intellectual commitment - they do so out of necessity - very much a knee-jerk reaction.
It may take intellectual leadership, but as Lenin said "we are not to be trusted - the answer lies with the workers".
The Russian Revolution was by no means a 'politically thought-out cause' - it was a reaction to the slaughter of WW1 which forced the soldiers to abandon it and simply go home - the politicos had to run to keep up.
Castro and Che took advantage of the fact that Cuba was owned by a tiny handful of families which allowed the country to become "America's open sewer"
The "Long March" in China arose from massive feudal poverty - not text-book intellectualising.
Vietnam was the result of a quarter of a century's warfare with Japan, France and the U.S., not political campaigning.....
Education can produce leaders; it can never produce revolutions.
When people take the situation into their own hands and out of the hands of the politicians (of every shade), that's when genuine change will happen, and it will be the product of zero-contract employment, accelerated homelessness, increasing poverty and recurring economic crises, not text-book learning.
If the left is worth anything it will seek to be part of that.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Mr Red
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 08:26 AM

Amazing, has anyone actually seen the video I offered where the proposition is cooperation rather than what we see right now confrontation?
From the above it would not seem to be the case. Rather revealing!

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 08:30 AM

Voting in a primary is a purely symbolic act as determined by party rules

Voting in a general election is a partially symbolic act.

The factors that can change a popular vote are numerable.

We all have recently seen Corrupt Diebold machines, voter eradication, voter suppression, State election commissions and the Supreme Court change the popular vote.

There are many more tricks of the trade in a general election.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 09:03 AM

Jim, None of the examples you cite have ultimately been successful. I would suggest one of the reasons for this, if not the main reason is that the populace were not educated to accept that an alternative was possible. I say again a prior education is vital for any change to be rewarding to the mass of people.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 09:03 AM

"Amazing, has anyone actually seen the video "
Kept getting "server not found". Mr Red - situation not changed
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 09:07 AM

Bugger ! Delete the NOT after ultimately.

I Must check before submitting
I Must check before submitting
I Must check before submitting
I Must check before submitting
I Must check before submitting
I Must check before submitting

---

Got it! But what a cute reminder to all of us to proof read.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 09:19 AM

"None of the examples you cite have ultimately not been successful"
All of them became successful to a degree - Russia moved from being a massive, semi-feudal mess to a leading industrial nation in a relatively short time, despite a devisive Civil participated in by 14 invading countries, a World War that produced the highest number of fatalities and casualty of all participating nations, a Cold War which forced it to turn in on itself and an appalling misjudgment on its own part in allowing a monster to take over State leadership
It was not the dream taht was flawed but the pursuit of that dream.
China, pretty well the same - a feudal State which has developed into a contender on the world stage - again - in the wrong hands for all sorts of reasons - not the dream.
Cuba is a virtual miracle in managing to survive next door to a hostile leading world power which has virtually blocked trade with the outside world since its inception, despite which, it has kept the U.S. at arms length (after 80 attempts to assassinate its leader).
Notably, education and medical care is top of the agenda in all of these countries.
Once a revolutionary step is taken, there are many factors in making sure that the outcome is a beneficial one, not all of which are within the control of the dreamers.
That is where education comes in.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 12:37 PM

"Once a revolutionary step is taken, there are many factors in making sure that the outcome is a beneficial one, not all of which are within the control of the dreamers.
That is where education comes in.
Jim Carroll "

Wrong, wrong, wrong Jim, after a revolution....that is where "re-education" comes in.......along with all the horrors of imposition.

People need to grow into a new economic and social system, it has to be explained, the change of mindset to become accepted, the wrongs of the old system illustrated......we are rapidly approaching the stage when people start to look for alternatives to the failed status quo.
Mrs Clinton will never provide these alternatives, promote a vision for the future, or inspire your people.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 12:43 PM

It would have been great if a figure from the left could have been acceptable to the US or UK, but it is too soon, these people(Corbyn and Sanders) must be teachers, not leaders.

To succeed change must come from the right at their pace.

The most important thing is the demolition of the old corrupt 2 Party System.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 01:16 PM

"these people(Corbyn and Sanders) must be teachers, not leaders."
And tread water while jobs become less and less, zero contracts become a commonplace, homelessness accelerates, the NHS deteriorates even further....
Pie in the sky.
Capitalism has now abandoned all pretence of investing for development and is now simple investment for profit.
It suits the investors that the country buys abroad and produces nothing.
The big U.S. crash in of 2008 (depicted in the film, The Big Short') showed that the system was prepared to float the entire American economy on the property market, which, when it crashed, brought down the world markets.
You really don't need to 'educate' people as to what's happening, as with the bankers scandal, they are carrying the can back for corporate greed.
No political group is going to get support from standing by and watching things get worse and then saying "there, I told you so", politics doesn't work like that.
The western world is swinging towards the extreme right, turning the people against each other; immigrants, refugees, "greedy workers" rather than the avaricious and failing system- Trump is at present the figurehead of things too come #It is partonising arrogance to suggest anybody is capable of "educating"
"the demolition of the old corrupt 2 Party System."
What with - a bulldozer - gi'e us a break!!
Any ground the left has ever won has been on the basis of its involvent with the mundane, day-to-day causes - not by arrogantly claiming to be 'teachers'
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 01:56 PM

Jim, you should know that three quarters of our population do not understand or want socialism....how do you sell the idea that most of the middle class, what's left of the working class and the ultra rich are going to be worse off financially under socialism....and there is no pointing denying that fact.
Social services must be paid for, wages and resources. It takes time to convince people that they will never win the lottery, that their high rise kids are not all going to be medical consultants.
That under this system class and money get you to the top and that these poor bastards don't have enough of either to get their mucky boots on the first fuckin' rung of the ladder.

Getting these things through takes time, but continually voting for the "best of the worst" sets us back decades.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 02:59 PM

"Jim, you should know that three quarters of our population do not understand or want socialism."
My point exactly - they will react to the conditions they are forced to endure, just as the Russian soldiers in WW! did, or the Chinese peasants, or the Cubans who were forced to watch while their daughters were forced to 'entertain' the Yankee tourists....
People do not act on ideology - they do so to feed their families, or to stay alive.
Which is why your talk of "education" is nonsense.
Of course the working class would not be worse off under socialism - some people would benefit if things stayed as they were, but more people would lose their jobs and homes, or suffer from the terminally ill health service.....
The bottom rung of your "ladder" has long been out of reach of most people in Britain.
We have not long had a recession, brought on by the greed of the banks; before that it was the U.S. financial market crash - another is predicted shortly.
Britain no longer has a manufacturing industry and even the Tory pundits have said it is beyond the point of salvage.
What on earth is your point - that we place our opes in Donald Trump, Boris Boris Johnson and Ukip maybe!!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: keberoxu
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 03:03 PM

Hugh Laurie, interviewed for the March 21, 2016 issue of TV Guide Magazine [in North America].
Quote:
Trump is absolutely fascinating. I've been trying to discern how, or if, his brain works from his language. I hope that his buildings are better constructed than his sentences....he said [Marco] Rubio was sweating like a dog. He picked the one animal that has no sweat glands. It's just classic Trump.
Actually, I shouldn't even be saying anything about him. I'm English, I'm a visitor, and I'm very grateful to be a visitor, so I ought to mind my manners and shut the f*** up.
Endquote

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 19 Mar 16 - 04:05 PM

Jim,

Unless the general population can be given access to information, unless they are given an education as to what is actually possible if they stand together they will continue to be subjected to the "rules" of those who control the finances of the country.

To suggest that "talk of education is nonsense" is utter bollocks. Unless or until people are educated we will continue to suffer the rule of a minority who control the wealth.

I am afraid it is that sort of argument which sustains the present situation.

Before you do your expected knee-jerk reaction please spend a little time to consider what is being said.

Thank you.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 20 Mar 16 - 03:40 AM

Trump got started from humble beginnings, just the million dollars his father gave him apparently.

Despite incoherent ramblings from the usual suspects, meritocracy is something The USA claims to be proud of but doesn't always exist whilst here in The UK, you can achieve the Stars the limit without any background presuming so. (The ignoble art of blaming everyone else got your own failed existence seems to be in evidence here as usual. If our American friends read what certain muppets are typing, they'd get a very distorted view of us. Bernie would sit rather well in our right wing government whilst you call him left wing.)

Still, I'm with Hugh Lawrie on this one. Although I'm not in The USA at the minute so will mouth off with the rest of them. Let's just hope Clinton will not be hamstrung in the way her predecessor has been.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Mr Red
Date: 20 Mar 16 - 04:03 AM

missing the http://
http://www.ted.com/talks/arthur_brooks_a_conservative_s_plea_let_s_work_together Should work now.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Mar 16 - 04:10 AM

"Unless the general population can be given access to information, unless they are given an education as to what is actually possible if they stand together they will continue to be subjected to the "rules" of those who control the finances of the country."
Talk of "giving the people access to knowledge" implies that knowledge is by an exclusive group of people able to pass it on to the masses - somewhat exclusive, elitist.
I suggest you read something like 'Ten Days That Shook the World'; probably the most important account of revolutionary change ever written (by American reporter, John Reid, who witnessed the October Revolution in Russia - later to be made into a passable film - Reds).
The point that comes over in the book is that nobody had a 'master plan' for changing the world - it was all done by on-the-spot debate and argument.
Nobody has the answers - the Communist experiment failed, so nobody wants to go that way again - the 'great leaders of the past' let the people down by either getting it wrong or selling out.
Whatever changes are needed will have to be sorted out on a suck-it-and-see basis which will be arrived at argument and discussion by people who are experiencing the effects of a society in crisis demanding that what is happening to them stops.
Simple question Raggy - who do you believe has "the knowledge" to educate "the masses" - who are today's keepers of the keys to a better life - where to we go for these 'teachers'?
Who are your great thinkers - mine are all dead or turned out to have clay feet.
We make use of what we have available and trust to our own instincts and knowledge.
Information has never been more available and accessible than it is today - what is needed is a forum to thrash that information out, not intellectual supermen (and women).
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: akenaton
Date: 20 Mar 16 - 06:55 AM

Jim, are you mad?   A socialist revolution would be immediately stamped out with great loss of life....the general public just would not support it.

Raggytash and I don't usually agree, but he is correct that long term thinking is required, to educate and most importantly to separate "liberalism" from socialism.

The two are incompatible.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 20 Mar 16 - 07:11 AM

Err you don't "educate" nonsense, you indoctrinate it. zzzz

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Mar 16 - 07:24 AM

"A socialist revolution would be immediately stamped out with great loss of life."
Ah well, better stick with the slaughter going on in Syria, Gaza, Iraq..... and all the other trouble-spots Capitalism has instigated and be contented with increased unemployment, homelessness and the accelerating gap between haves and have-nots.
The greatest threat to human life and well being in the West at present lies in Europe and the U.S. with a rising threat of Fascism in both.
But as the song says

"So close your eyes, stop your ears,
Close your mouth and never dare;
And if it happens here, they'll never come for you,
Because they'll know you really didn't care"
I still find your hatred of liberalism bizarre to the extreme (laterally)
Please go and buy a dictionary
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Donuel
Date: 20 Mar 16 - 07:35 AM

What is left of the elite Republican party is going to form a 3rd party

They are playing to lose. To defeat Trump they are bringing out their crack suicide troops.

What will this 3rd party be called?

LETS NAME IT;

my name for it is The Salamander Party because
It is tiny, almost extinct and slimy.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Mar 16 - 08:06 AM

"Should work now."
Thanks Mr Red - listened to it through yesterday through a convoluted search.
Nice idea based on the fallacy that Capitalism is about actually producing something rathe than just profiting from investment.
It now suits (certainly British) capitalism not to produce anything but to buy from countries whose workers work in appalling conditions for less than substance wages.
The U.S. crash of eight years ago was due entirely to America putting its money into the property market and the only ones who made anything from it were those who gambled on its failure - which it did, bringing the world's economy with it.
The secone major crisis came greedy greedy Bankers pressurising their customers to over-borrow.
Sandwithced in between was the property boom/crash.
That is the modern capitalism your man is suggesting as the saviour of mankind
Old capitalism, for all its faults, was based on creation and building - it gave us the Golden Age of invention, among other miracles.
Now it's just short term, fast buck profiteering - the benevolent entrepreneurialism is long dead, if it ever existed to the extent of being of any lasting value to the whole of society.
A middle-class pipe-dream
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Greg F.
Date: 20 Mar 16 - 09:53 AM

my name for it is The Salamander Party because

That is a gross slander on noble amphibians.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,#
Date: 21 Mar 16 - 01:10 AM

The 'mainstream' media have made clear where they stand. Trump has received 23 times the exposure Sanders has. When all people hear is hate they begin to get used to the sound of it. I hope this type of media is destroyed by what they are doing.

Subject: BS: Trump - server or mod sabotage?
From: GUEST,Richard Bridge on the Intel 4-core running E
Date: 21 Mar 16 - 08:46 AM

Fuck, the bloody post eater did it again. Four times on the trot.

Maybe the thread has been censored out of existence.

It seems that people are not considereing the analyses of the rise in fascism and authoritarianism in the USA.

http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/the_revenge_of_the_lower_classes_and_the_rise_of_american_fascism_20160302#.Vu71ZCp8A2w.face

http://www.vox.com/2016/3/1/11127424/trump-authoritarianism

Subject: RE: BS: Trump - server or mod sabotage?
From: GUEST,#
Date: 21 Mar 16 - 09:05 AM

The problem is that you are trying to do two hot-links in the same post while you're on Mudcat as a guest. This came up a few years back, FYI. That's why your post had such difficulty being accepted.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: GUEST,JeffB
Date: 21 Mar 16 - 10:11 AM

Ake, a lot of people will disagree that liberalism and socialism are incompatible. You mean (I assume) "socialism" in the American sense as a synonym for "communism". No-one in Europe makes that mistake when talking politics, which means there will usually be misunderstandings whenever socialism is mentioned on internet forums.

In the UK we are at least as democratic and liberal as Americans, but our culture includes socialist institutions, such as the National Health Service (at least, we have a remnant of an NHS still surviving for the time being). We also pay welfare for unemployed and disabled people, as do US State governments. Welfare payments are always going to be controversial, but as far as I know, no American mainstream commentator has said that welfare benefits are socialist. They are, of course, but they are acceptable even to Americans.

There are elements of socialism in every liberal Western political culture. Socialism is a spectrum of measures whose use varies from country to country. Communism is a 100% top-down command structure.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump II- The Horror Continues
From: Jeri
Date: 21 Mar 16 - 10:29 AM

Richard, you can log in on any computer, as long as that computer accepts cookies. Then you can post a bunch of links and not have to tell us about your hardware. I know guys like to talk about that stuff, but it takes effort better used to complain about something. 😉