BS: Our Apology

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 05:11 PM

I never tire of repeating this gem from the Reverend Dodgson

"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean—neither more nor less." "The question is," said Alice, "whether you can make words mean so many different things." "The question is," said Humpty Dumpty, "which is to be master—that's all."

I do wish at times though that people would either stick to what words really mean or, if it does not fit, invent one of their own.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: akenaton
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 04:15 PM

Stu, Thank you for that response.

Do you really think that the issue of CLASS inequality is not hugely more important than the issue of homosexual "marriage"?

I heard an interview given by President elect Trump just before or just after his unexpected victory......about the second or third question was regarding his views on "Gay marriage", an issue which affects a very tiny minority of the population....0.004%?.

Class inequality and the wealth gap affects an enormous number of citizens of the UK and the US.....yet it is seldom mentioned.

Real liberals would be promoting real equality within education, housing, wealth.

Someone asked me how I define "liberals" .......fucking hypocrites!...will that do?

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 03:16 PM

Hey Don - Opening line of the thread

To all of our friends living outside of America;

As it addressed to those outside America and as we are America's closest European ally would you not expect most of the comments to come from the UK?

Don't understand the aphorism I'm afraid :-( But it sounds like it should be good :-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 03:12 PM

so many uk comments about Our apology.

aphorism: When debt becomes an embarrassment of riches you can take to the bank, you are becoming just like Trump.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Andrez
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 03:05 PM

How tedious, another thread thats lost its way in acrimony and bitternes. So many words, so little content!

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 02:11 PM

Whatever you need Teribus. I consider all your posts fake news.

Here is a gift, John McCain is perfect.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 01:41 PM

I doubt it is irony, Kevin. This is the Telegraph we are talking about!

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 01:14 PM

Is it possible to have a thread without rancour? Will we ever have a discussion that does not end in being corrupted by ignorance and bloody mindedness? Can peoples passions not be directed against the real issues instead of each other? What is the point of rhetorical questions...

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 01:03 PM

someone who knowingly and deliberately spreads malicious lies about people.
You've just ben caught out lying through yopur teeth - about me and about WW1 soldiers.
You can't respond without insulting people, can you?
Jim Carrill

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 12:46 PM

It is my sad duty to report that Donald J Trump has become lost in mind and temperament. He was the finest example of a lack of character, wisdom and courage while laden with white entitlement, defensiveness and anti- Semitism. He will be missed by everyone that he owed money.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Teribus
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 12:43 PM

Donuel - 6 Nov 16 - 11:19 AM

Irrespective of how you view Akenaton Donuel at least he is not like you - i.e., someone who knowingly and deliberately spreads malicious lies about people.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 12:23 PM

I am not entirely sure what Brexit or sexual orientation have to do with the American presidential election. Nor do I really know what "liberals" are unless it is the neolibralism that I referred to elsewhere. I do not see how the election of Trump, based on the policies he has declared, help to achieve class equality either. Hopefully, like most other politicians, he was misleading the electorate. When he said that many low-paid manual labourers would be deported, 1.6 billion people would be banned from entering the USA on the basis of their religion and women would be reduced to the sexual playthings of rich businessmen it does nothing whatsoever for any equality.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 12:23 PM

"The point children IS reality."
It is a reality we' don't have to accept - let alone welcome, as you have.
If Governments had opposed Hitler, there would have been a lot less dead Jews.
If the world had opposed Assad he wouldn't have been able to massacre his people and we would not be fighting Isis.
Your "pragmatism" is support by appeasement.
Trump is a fascist thug and your friend Farage helped him risde to power - making him a supporter of fascist thuggery
Your bullshit is an indication that you support Trump's policies
Tell us Ake - WHAT IS YOUR HONEST OPINION OF HIS MISOGYNY, HIS RACISM, AND HIS CHOICE OF AN ANTISEMITE AS A POLITICAL PARTNER - FOR OR AGAINST WILL DO?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Stu
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 12:09 PM

" rather than the smokescreen of sexual orientation."

Oh fuck off.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: DMcG
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 12:08 PM

We must ensure good trade deals with other European countries

And that is the heart of the problem. Who gets to define what 'good' looks like?   Just about all of the proponents of Leave had a different set of priorities and trade-offs, and as far as we can tell, those responsible for sorting it still do.

The judges have ruled that Parliament has a say in the definition of 'good', not just the government. That is pretty much all they said.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 12:06 PM

Those are indeed highly probable predictions. But the conclusions you drw from them are open to question.

We have indeed to work with the new US, in the same sense that we have to work with Putin's Russia, with Iran, and with Zimbabwe. The relationship should be one if cautious courtesy, rather than frieendship. That should be reserved for the peoples of those countries.

As for negotiating our way out of the EU, there can be no logic to the suggestiin that there is any point in keeping our initial negotiating position secret, since as soon as negotiations commence it will be revealed. Our final negotiating position, if that is different, is another matter, since once this is revealed it becomes the starting position.

There might be something to be said in favour of a take-it-or leave it approach to negotiations instead.

And there is a great deal to be said for giving people a chance to say whether they agree with this, if it is in any way different from the total break which appears to be that which seems to be implied by "Brexit is Brexit".

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 11:19 AM

"you children" "We must We must"

you used to be moderately but tolerably ignorant.

Now you are just thoroughly arrogant.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: akenaton
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 11:14 AM

The point children IS reality.

Mr Trump WILL be the US president. We WILL leave the EU.

Is it possible for "liberals" to be pragmatic?

We must find ways of working with the new US administration even if by our stupidity and lack of foresight, we have made that so difficult and embarrassing.

We must ensure
good trade deals with other European countries by keeping our negotiating position secret for the moment, until article 50 is instigated.

We must stop whining because "liberal" ideology is being rejected all over the developed world and work for a society where CLASS inequality is addressed, rather than the smokescreen of sexual orientation.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 10:55 AM

I'd take that as heavy irony, Dave. .(Maybe all this stuff about American politics is affecting you in unexpected ways..)

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 10:12 AM

"Common Sense"
Seems like another term for appeasement to me
Can we assume that, considering the total lack of response to the descriptions of the foul programme Trump won the day on, that is what his supporters here consider to be a fit programme for the most powerful state in the world - is that really what you describe as "common sense" Ake?
Have we misjudged the man?
It really would be useful to know the type of person we are arguing with
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 09:35 AM

I find it difficult to know what to say about anyone who treats anything from the press as being factual. Even less when something from the Telegraph is branded as "Common Sense". Especialy when it contains the line heaped on The Donald's immaculately coiffured head

Not that I have anything against anyone's hairstyle and would not stoop so low as to mention anything about the way anyone looks but such comments just make a meaningless story even more ridiculous.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: akenaton
Date: 16 Nov 16 - 09:21 AM

At last some
Common Sense

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Greg F.
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 03:30 PM

The "morality card"????

We're[sic] it their candidate they would be boldly condemning moralists !

pete, its difficult for me to believe that you are as much of an idiot as you obviously are if you can make that statement, claim to be a Christian, and can then defend a lying, racist, white-supremecist, Islamaphobic, misogynist, sexual predator, corrupt, tax-evading, swindler, multiple divorceé and all around despicable excuse for a human being.

"Christophobe"? I don't hate Christ in the least (seems all in all a good fellow all 'round, unlike Trump), any more than I hate Bugs Bunny, The Tooth Fairy or the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

One thing I DO hate, tho, is a sanctimonious hypocrite.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: DMcG
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 12:32 PM

Not intentionally :)

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 10:54 AM

A bit cheeky changing the wording of what you said, DMcG! 😂

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Stanron
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 09:37 AM

Because I'm from the UK I don't know much about the Electoral College. Is it open to pecuniary persuasion?

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 08:45 AM

The American right generally seems to be keen in the idea that, in regard to to constitutional matters, the intentions of the "founding fathers" ought to determine things.

If the electoral college stopped Trump becoming president, it would be doing what the "founding fathers" intended it to do, overule a choice by the electorate which the electoral college decided was stupid.

Ergo...

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: DMcG
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 08:04 AM

You knew I agree with you more than you thought? I need a stiff drink to sort that one out.

Going back to the thread topic: the electoral college system seems outdated to me as the problems it was designed to solve have changed into others. Nevertheless for them to vote in favour of Hillary even if constitionally possible would be a significant step towards a civil war (or extreme civil unrest) So we can be fairly confident it won't happen.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 07:39 AM

Oh, I think I already knew that. Could be that either you or I (I'm not sayin') is akin to the great Brian Clough. He said that, when dealing with a player who disagrees, "We talk about it for twenty minutes and then we decide I was right."

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: DMcG
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 07:19 AM

I am not sure I have come across Christophobes here myself. Plenty who criticise all religion, of course, and some of those criticise Christianity more than the other religions because they know more about it, or it is more prevalent in their world, or it is pushing some policial or social agenda under the name of Christianity, but no one seems to me to be specialising, as it were. Now in the wider world, yes, people are being killed because they are of one religion sect by members of another, but it has never been exclusively in one direction.


And as a practising Christian there is plenty of stuff being pushed by Christian groups that I find the antithesis of my understanding of the Christian message. So I find myself agreeing with Steve or Greg perhaps more often than they might think.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 06:03 AM

"I thought you were being euphemistic about members of Trump's team!"
What - me - sexist.
Wouldn't be so insulting to my favourite gender.
" don't exactly think that Greg is a "Christophobe,"
These people fave a problem distinguishing between the loving religion that they claim to adhere to but seldom do, and the organisation that has condoned and even facilitated the mess-rape of children in its care
If we had a few more real 'Christians' around the world would be a beter place - mind you, Your Man would almost certainly find himself accused of promoting terrorism and end up on an indefinite holiday in the sun in Guantanamo.
I spent a large part of my life recording real Christians - they left more of an influence on what I am than any church I've been inside of
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 05:28 AM

I don't exactly think that Greg is a "Christophobe," Pete, any more then I am (nice word, by the way!) Can't speak for Greg, but a lot of the things that Jesus allegedly said (or was it a committee...) make a fair amount of sense, though in some other regards he got things arse about face, like telling people that they shouldn't worry about tomorrow, or that they should give all their stuff away, or that they should not only not fight back when they're being beaten to pulp but that they should invite their aggressor to beat them up even more. And we like the story about his miraculously changing water to wine, when we know full well that he actually sneaked out the back door to the offie just like everybody else would have done. An antisemite hates Jews because they are Jews. An Islamophobe hates Muslims because they are Muslims. Christians come in all colours, styles, shapes and sizes so we can't really hate them all as a piece. We can hate what's been done in the name of Christianity, of course. Can't help feeling that Jesus would have been right with us there. You need to invent a different -ophobe name, Pete!

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 04:50 AM

When you said advocates women's genitals into office, Jim, I thought you were being euphemistic about members of Trump's team!

Wonder whether Teribus and co will be calling for an antisemitism enquiry into Trump and his team. After all Keith and Teribus have said about the Labour Party, it would be highly hypocritical not to, wouldn't it?

Once again, the notion that our referendum is precisely equivalent to a presidential election needs to be challenged. In fact, as horse races, both contest were unfair, but for different reasons. In the US it doesn't matter who passes the post first. It's all about how many fences your hooves caught on the way. In the U.K., the two-horse race was set up so that one horse was allowed to run on the flat whereas the other one was forced to jump fences.

Still, in one post Teribus admits that Hillary won the election. I suppose he has to do that in order to defend the referendum result, for which he likes to shout out the absolute numbers. By the same reckoning, Hillary is well home and dry. How can he possibly say otherwise! But in the next post he seems to be clinging to the outrageously-unfair electoral college system as justification for Trump's "victory.". Difficult conundrum, innit!

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 04:16 AM

Whoops - inadvertently deleted a bit - should read:
"who advocates it's ok for men to grab womens' genitals, into office"
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 04:13 AM

"Give people a choice and a means to express it then abide by the result."
The people elected a fascist, misogynist, antisemitic hate-monger who advocates womens' genitals into office - and we should be happy with that?
Your contempt for "the people" has been palpable in the past - lazy, scrounging, no-marks who brought Britain to its knees and should have no say in their lives - now we have two elections that have been won based on xenophobia and race hatred and all of a sudden their word counts for something.
As I said - Germany elected the Nazis into office - mind you, Britain respected that decision until it was too late to do anything about it - and then, yet another bloodbath - this time accompanied by the smell of Zyklon-B.
I remind you again - you were one of those desperately trying to pin antisemitism and misogyny on the Labour Party - now you are rooting for an antisemitic misogynist who tells men it's o.k. to sexually assault women,
Your particular Poad to damascus has been a very short one.
America has elected a Fascist into office, Britain will follow him like the poodle she has always been and Fascist parties throughout the world are taking comfort from this result.
"JOM"
Always a sign that the confidence is on the wane!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Teribus
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 04:09 AM

"Large numbers of votes in strong Clinton territory have yet to be included in the tally. Washington, Oregon, California."

Votes still to be included? Really Shaw?

Washington State - Hillary Clinton 1,221,435; Donald Trump 835,385
Oregon State - Hillary Clinton 934,631; Donald Trump 742,506
California - Hillary Clinton 6,191,799; Donald Trump 3,287,273

Those were the number of votes cast for those two candidates in those three states Shaw so what other votes have to be counted?

The US Electoral College follows the declared wishes of the majority vote in each state. As Clinton had already won those states any mythical additional votes that you refer to would make no difference whatsoever.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Teribus
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 03:52 AM

Not so JOM - as far as I am concerned Hillary Clinton got 61,047,207 votes and Trump got 60,375,962 votes which to my mind in a two horse race means that Hillary Clinton won the 2016 US Presidential Election.

Using exactly the same reasoning 17,410,742 voters in the UK voted for the UK to leave the EU and 16,141,241 voters in the UK voted to remain in the EU, which to my mind in a two horse race means that it is the wish of the voters in the UK that the UK leaves the EU.

Give people a choice and a means to express it then abide by the result.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 03:45 AM

Well we'll see won't we, Teribus? Large numbers of votes in strong Clinton territory have yet to be included in the tally. Washington, Oregon, California. She is going to win the popular vote by a margin that is going to look uncomfortable for number-shouters such as your good self.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 03:40 AM

"Ake, once again, you simply confirm that you haven't the faintest idea what the fu*k you're talking about."
I'm afraid he does Steve - hi dream team won the Presidency.
"Well it seems like Shaw is wrong again"
QAnd another ultra-right blusters onto the rostrum.
" You support Corbyn don't you?"
Can't recall Corbyn advocating grabbing womens' genitals whenever it took your fancy
Weren't you in the front line, trying to pin misogyny and antisemitism on the Labour Party not too long ago?
Now you're rooting for a racist, anti-semitic misogynist who advocates sexual assault as acceptable behaviour.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Pete from seven stars link
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 03:35 AM

Of course it bears pointing out that Greg and his ilk will play the morality card when it suits them . We're it their candidate they would be boldly condemning moralists ! And I would question whether trump is racist too. I don't know if his projected policies on emigration are the best thing , but I can see the reasoning behind it . As to islamophobic ! Thus speaks the raving christophobe !

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 03:22 AM

In the interests of fairness I must qualify my previous statement and say that I do not know what sort of policies Trump will implement either so I do not know whether he is simply pandering to populist policies or whether he will implement any of his more extreme promises. Again, I hope not.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 03:17 AM

If anyone is any doubt as to my position regarding any politician, including Jermey Corbyn, I would draw their attention to my previous statement mentioning him. I reservedly support his policies but as he has yet to be in a position to implement any of them I cannot say whether he is of the same ilk as all other politicians. I hope not.

From Date: 11 Nov 16 - 05:48 AM

I know a lot of people will disagree and, if I am honest, I have yet to be convinced myself but Corbyn looks to be the best bet for this type of change in the UK. Sanders looked to be the same in the US and, hopefully, both of those or similar candidates will prove their worth in 4 years time.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Teribus
Date: 15 Nov 16 - 02:56 AM

Steve Shaw - 14 Nov 16 - 11:49 AM

"Well it seems that Hillary has won the popular vote by millions"

Well it seems like Shaw is wrong again - she won the popular vote by less than 1 million (671,246 to be exact). Only 58.1% of the electorate turned out, Clinton got 47.8% of the votes of the 58.1% of the electorate who voted, Trump got 47.3% of the votes of the 58.1% of the electorate who voted. Yet somehow as far as the EU Referendum goes 52% of the 72.1% turn out is not good enough Hypocrite.

"The point is that to discuss the rights and/or wrongs of an unrelated incident from the Vietnam war and the particular actions or non-actions of a senator in that conflict has sweet FA to do with the thread." - Will Fly

Hardly unrelated Will in threads concerning two successive US Presidential elections Donuel has made reference to and accusations of things related to two candidates that have never damn well happened - I am utterly amazed that you have proved unable to join those dots up and make the connection for yourself.

"Dave the Gnome - 14 Nov 16 - 05:52 PM

"I find it almost beyond comprehension that anyone who claims political awareness could be so easily fooled by a politician blatantly pandering to populist policies."

Why Gnome? - You support Corbyn don't you?

"Perhaps then you can explain to me why these supposed "kind, decent people" would support a a racist, white-supremecist, Islamaphobe, misogynist, corrupt, tax-evading, confidence man(Trump University), sexual predator congenital lying sack of garbage." - Greg.F

I would have thought that the answer to that one Greg was obvious. They looked at the alternative candidate and decided that she was worse.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Nov 16 - 11:53 PM

It's taken longer than 6 months. "we want our country back" 10 years ago. The early success of Hitler came with a zero criticism policy.
If you complain about the alt right today you are called alt left. Irrational fascism and racism is older than Genghis Kahn. Older than Cro Magnon and Neanderthal. If might makes right we would have not evolved smaller jaws and larger craniums.

The new Nazi wears a wary smile. They won't need cattle cars and camps.
An apartheid America is the dream of the KKK, Eugenics and militia-ized white nationalists. Many whites who are by-standers will gladly trade a job or authority for alt right ideology they will drink the kool aid, wear the hat, armband or colored shirt.

Collusion Corruption & Cash aka Trump 'kids' are being given national Security clearances and an all seeing blind trust control of Trump corporations.

888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888
I already see 'good people' being silent about this fascist take over while they claim they don't believe my theories.
888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888

This is a new era, Trump BASHERS will now be sued, or worse.
The media has done such a bang up job so far, how will they react when the select villains are separated from their career like Dan Rather.

Blood lines, ethnic purity, white supremacy are old slave owning terms that are going to make a resurgence. The Constitution was written when these terms were not considered Un American but still rode heavy on the conscience of some founding fathers.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Greg F.
Date: 14 Nov 16 - 09:10 PM

the vehicle to achieve the change

Ake, once again, you simply confirm that you haven't the faintest idea what the fu*k you're talking about.

Which "change" is that? The "change" to a racist, white-supremecist, Islamaphobic, misogynist, sexual predator, corrupt, tax-evading AmeriKKKa?

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Nov 16 - 07:38 PM

"Jim, anyone who claims that Mr Farage is "inarticulate", does not deserve a response."
Her's a fuckinb' joke
His entire policy is based on hate and distrust of a large section of the British population - any moron can do that.
A success - a political leader who ahs lost the seats he gaing, rules over a party based on a policy hate and distrust directed at foreigners, where two of its leading members try to kick the shit out of each other.
It's a crying shame that Charlie Chaplin isn't around any more - he could have reissued The Great Dictator annd baseed it on the last six months in Britain and America.
The one positive thing to come out of this discussion is that it's drawn the closet Fascists out into the open - welcome to daylight Ake.
In my fairly long life, I've experienced vigorous, dishonest and bitterly-fought elections, but I have never - not ever experienced any like these last two - based entirely on hate and xenophobia.
How ******* depressing to see a country I loved degenerate into what it has become in six short months - and will now follow H.M.V. like Nipper did before it
I don't know who the OPs think they are, but they are far, far up the food-cain than people like yourself - they have my respect - you have my utter contempt.
And still the Trumpeters don't attempt to contradict teh piece of detritus that has been elected into The White House - that is what they wanted and that is what they got
Where did I put the aspirin and gin bottle!!
Maybe not - let's stay around and watch the Games.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: akenaton
Date: 14 Nov 16 - 07:23 PM

Sorry Mr McG, on re-reading I see you were actually quoting Mr Moore.

Not really a good idea.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: akenaton
Date: 14 Nov 16 - 07:16 PM

Mr McGrath I am surprised to see you denigrate the electoral college, as you have often been an opponent of "first past the post" on this forum. Do you think that only we are politically mature enough to dispense with this type of electoral system?

The very worst point of the US system is "super delegates" in the primaries and they favoured Mrs Clinton to a considerable extent.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: akenaton
Date: 14 Nov 16 - 07:09 PM

Well Greg....in many cases it appears that Mr Trump is merely the vehicle to achieve the change that the jobless unrepresented people of blue collar America want. That huge section of US society was ignored by the last Democratic administration and suffered the consequences.
When a populist like Mr Sanders appeared on the centre left, he was quickly hog tied by the Party hierarchy, which proved to be another nail in the coffin of so called liberalism......many people decided that it was a sham, a smokescreen to mask the misdeeds of the political establishment. The Corporatists, fronted by the Clinton Dynasty and the Clinton Foundation, supported by money from regimes which export terrorism even to the US.

Subject: RE: BS: Our Apology
From: Greg F.
Date: 14 Nov 16 - 05:56 PM

I have a friend with dual nationality in North Carolina and she says the folks there are almost all supporting Mr Trump and they are kind, decent people.

How nice for you.

Perhaps then you can explain to me why these supposed "kind, decent people" would support a a racist, white-supremecist, Islamaphobe, misogynist, corrupt, tax-evading, confidence man(Trump University), sexual predator congenital lying sack of garbage.

And perhaps you should pose the question to your friend in North Carolina. Let us know what answer she supplies, eh?