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BS: blood & soil Nazification of America

Greg F. 19 Aug 17 - 09:01 AM
akenaton 19 Aug 17 - 08:50 AM
David Carter (UK) 19 Aug 17 - 07:02 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Aug 17 - 06:33 AM
Teribus 19 Aug 17 - 05:37 AM
Teribus 19 Aug 17 - 05:27 AM
Keith A of Hertford 19 Aug 17 - 04:56 AM
akenaton 19 Aug 17 - 04:11 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Aug 17 - 03:31 AM
Donuel 18 Aug 17 - 08:15 PM
Greg F. 18 Aug 17 - 06:38 PM
Donuel 18 Aug 17 - 04:54 PM
Donuel 18 Aug 17 - 04:39 PM
Donuel 18 Aug 17 - 04:20 PM
Greg F. 18 Aug 17 - 03:57 PM
akenaton 18 Aug 17 - 03:46 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Aug 17 - 03:01 PM
Greg F. 18 Aug 17 - 01:25 PM
Greg F. 18 Aug 17 - 01:16 PM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Aug 17 - 01:13 PM
Donuel 18 Aug 17 - 01:01 PM
Donuel 18 Aug 17 - 12:16 PM
Jim Carroll 18 Aug 17 - 12:04 PM
Greg F. 18 Aug 17 - 11:58 AM
Stilly River Sage 18 Aug 17 - 11:26 AM
akenaton 18 Aug 17 - 11:14 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Aug 17 - 10:46 AM
Raggytash 18 Aug 17 - 10:36 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Aug 17 - 10:34 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Aug 17 - 10:33 AM
Greg F. 18 Aug 17 - 10:33 AM
Greg F. 18 Aug 17 - 10:31 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Aug 17 - 10:27 AM
gillymor 18 Aug 17 - 10:26 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Aug 17 - 10:21 AM
Greg F. 18 Aug 17 - 10:15 AM
Raggytash 18 Aug 17 - 10:14 AM
Jeri 18 Aug 17 - 10:12 AM
gillymor 18 Aug 17 - 10:11 AM
Stu 18 Aug 17 - 10:05 AM
Greg F. 18 Aug 17 - 10:04 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Aug 17 - 09:55 AM
Jeri 18 Aug 17 - 09:55 AM
gillymor 18 Aug 17 - 09:53 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Aug 17 - 09:52 AM
Greg F. 18 Aug 17 - 09:44 AM
Greg F. 18 Aug 17 - 09:42 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Aug 17 - 09:37 AM
Donuel 18 Aug 17 - 09:01 AM
Donuel 18 Aug 17 - 07:56 AM

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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 19 Aug 17 - 09:01 AM

Meanwhile, back to America & its Nazis....


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Aug 17 - 08:50 AM

There are several spellings David, Akknaton, Ikknaton, Akhenaton.

My nom de plume is a deliberate misspelling, as I take no chances with Pharaoh's curses.....:0)

A great mystery and a hugely interesting historical character.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 19 Aug 17 - 07:02 AM

The more usual spelling is Akhenaten (I would hesitate to say correct, as its a translation of an ancient Egyptian name). The Aten (jtn) being the disc of the sun. He may or may not have written the Great Hymn to the Aten, which presaged at least one of the Psalms. In common with many of the nobility of the day, he slept with his sister, which union produced Tutankhamun (originally Tutankhaten).


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Aug 17 - 06:33 AM

Sorry lads - the Irish battle is done and dusted
Want to take it any further go buy a book and get someone to read if for you - or better still, go re-open one of the overlong threads where you told us about stupid Irish and brainwashed children
If I wanted race hate I'd open a BNP site
Don't you racists ever know when to lie down?
Back to the point
An insightful letter in this morning's Irish times on the 'historical value' of the Confederate statues

"Sir, - Oisin Keogh, who objects to the removal of, as he ' calls them, "symbolic monuments" of confederate leaders and generals, says history matters. If he cares that much about his¬tory, then surely he knows that the vast majority of these monuments were commissioned and financed during the 1920s - a period when the Ku Klux Klan was emerging and infiltrating local I and state government in the I US. These monuments are not symbolic in any way other than highlighting the deep-seated racism and anger over the loss of the war of Confederate sympathisers. People of any ethnic persuasion other than white have to walk past a monument to their oppressor anytime they want to go to a park, or school or any other public place where one of these statues has been erected. It would be akin to a statue of Rommel at Normandy, or Cromwell in Drogheda.
History does matter, and I would suggest that Mr Keogh read some to fully understand that while Washington and Jefferson were slave owners, and nobody is forgetting that, they at least created a declaration that stated "that all men are created equal" and a framework to free slaves. The people who marched in Charlottesville under the pretext of "statue rights" do not believe in that last statement. And if you agree with Donald Trump on this matter, then neither do you. - Yours, etc,
DAVID CONLON"

Another letter points out that the only ones with a real grievance about the removal of the statues are the pigeons
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Teribus
Date: 19 Aug 17 - 05:37 AM

"Home rule was an attempt to make Ireland a Dominion - that was not independence."

Really Jom?

Tell that to thee Canadians, the Australians, the South Africans, the Indians, the Pakistanis, the New Zealanders.

Truth remains Jom had the Irish gone for Home rule and dominion status in 1920 then a fully independent and united Ireland would have come into existence in 1931. Instead seven eedjits in secret and entirely off their own bat opted for the path of violence the gun and solely because of that you are as far away now from an independent united Ireland as you were 103 years ago.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Teribus
Date: 19 Aug 17 - 05:27 AM

"Scotland and Ireland were occupied separate countries with individual cultures"

Really Jom?

Scotland most certainly was an independent country united under one ruler, one church and one legal system. Please tell us all when before the arrival of the Normans the same could ever have been said of Ireland.

As to "occupied" - what work of alternative history did you pluck that from?

IIRC Scotland and England were two separate countries in 1603 when on the death of Queen Elizabeth the First the reigning Scottish King ascended to the Throne of England - no invasion, no battles, no occupation. The two countries remained separate entities until 1707 when the two Parliaments united - no invasion, no battles, no occupation - Scotland still retained her own church and her own legal system.

Also IIRC the Normans were "invited" over to Ireland by one disgruntled Irish "King" who was in dispute with a couple of other Irish "Kings" and required outside help to hang onto his "kingdom". Unfortunately for the disgruntled one the Normans on arrival did what they did best from Ireland all the way east to Aleppo - they held onto any land they fought for, then assimilated with the local population.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 19 Aug 17 - 04:56 AM

Jim,
Ireland has always regarded itself an occupied country and that was admitted by Britain pulling out
British rule was maintained by force of arms for centuries


Not true Jim.
And, the secession of Ireland was agreed before WW1, and Northern Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Cornwall and any other bit is free to secede if they have a majority in favour.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Aug 17 - 04:11 AM

You do love misrepresentation Jim.....Northcliffe appointed Weigall film critic in a Daily Mail which bore no similarity to todays tabloid.

If you think nothing is known about Akhenaton try reading Weigalls book on the subject.
For anyone interested the full WILI for Arthur Weigall is
HERE


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Aug 17 - 03:31 AM

"You obviously know very little Egyptology Jim."
No - course I don't Ache, I'm sure that it's a centuries old myth that the rulers of Egypt were regarded as deities running slave societies.
I visited Egypt several times, took the trip down the Nile, visited the temples, listened to the lectures, and came home and read Budge and Lane and Vercouter... and everything readable I could lay hands on, on the subject that interested me so much (as an amateur enthusiast of archaeology)
I'm sure you're going to put me straight on what I missed (when you have time, of course!!)
Your picture books don't interest me - lots of them for sale on every stall along our trip down the nile
Arthur Edward Pearse Brome Weigall was an amature Egyptologist who became a journalist for the Daily Mail
"In London during World War I Arthur Weigall became a successful set-designer for the London revue stage. An association with film began: he worked with Bannister Merwin, Jack Buchanan, and Phyllis Monkton on the film Her Heritage, and in the 1920s Lord Northcliffe appointed him film critic for the Daily Mail. Later, one of his novels was made into the film Burning Sands by the producer George Melford."
A Daily Mail journalist who includes "lots of pictures" - just where I'd go for reliable information!!
Spiritualists, enthusiasts for slavery, Empire Loyalists and supporters of 'The independent Republic of Rutland' - this thread is becoming over-run by a couple of nutters
Time to return to sanity, I think - back to bck to the Nazification of Trump's America, I think.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 08:15 PM

I would say the best post on this thread is by Frederick Douglass via greg.

It has held its truth intact for 150 years.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 06:38 PM

But Truth is priceless. Treasure it.

Only to sentient beings, Don.

That leaves the Trumpistas out of the equation.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 04:54 PM

Ake I was given an ancient Egyptian coin. Years later in college I learned that my coin was movie token for the premiere of 'The Mummy' 193o's.

Early Egyptians had no coins, they were paid in beer and bread.

Sometimes learning the truth destroys the value of what you think you knew or had. But Truth is priceless. Treasure it.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 04:39 PM

I wish my posts were as succinct as the Acme Meme post


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 04:20 PM

Meanwhile back in the British Isles when--- they go and do their Nazi thang, they do it right! they don't just ethnically cleanse they make an entire race EXTINCT like in Tasmania. England rules.

back over to the USA and our weak ass Nazis...

Without the devious Bannon they are going to try and train TRUMP with index cards on American and World history. Republicans tried this with Sarah Palin and failed. The new General Chief of staff might try to give him lessons in empathy, a moral center or even a soul .

Trump has no knowledge. You know what they say about a little Knowledge being a dangerous thing? Believe it or not he could become more dangerous.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 03:57 PM

You obviously know very little Egyptology Jim.


Whareas you, Ache, are a proven Master of Bullshitology.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 03:46 PM

You obviously know very little Egyptology Jim.

I can recommend Arthur Weigall's "Treasury of Ancient Egypt", it should be ideal for you as it is written by an acknowledged expert and has lots of pictures.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 03:01 PM

"Jim, Ireland was not, and Scotland is not an occupied country."
Ireland has always regarded itself an occupied country and that was admitted by Britain pulling out
British rule was maintained by force of arms for centuries
"No. We agreed to Irish home rule before WW1."
Home rule was an attempt to make Ireland a Dominion - that was not independence.
That was betrayed by the British conniving with the Northern Irish loyalists in reneging on an agreed time limit
When that betrayal was discovered, even the compromise Home Rule Bill was rejected and the Home Rule Party disintegrated
We've been here Keith and you and your racist mate were thrashed roundly
"I do suggest that they should be allowed, if a majority want it."Then you are even more stupid than I took you for
No part of a country can ever possibly break off from the main body because "they want it" - utterly stupid
If that was possible, Thatcher would have declared independence for the wealthy South East when she was in power - you live in your own little la-la land.
You totally ignore the brutality and bloodshed shown towards any nation who demanded independence, including to America, who had to go to war to be free of Britain.
India, Kenya and virtually every other African nation, Cyprus, Israel.... all had to resort to force to get self determination.
I reall am not going into your stupid blind alley again - Britain was a brutal colonising power whu ruled countries by foce, bled them dry and destroyed their indigenous cultures
That was what Emipre was about
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 01:25 PM

Mitt Romney has now called upon Twither to apologize to the nation and the world.

Don't be too gleeful about Bannon - the POSOTUS will replace him with someone even worse.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 01:16 PM

Meanwhile, back in the U.S............


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 01:13 PM

Jim, Ireland was not, and Scotland is not an occupied country.
Both were integral parts of one united country for centuries, much longer than the Southern States had been in the Union.

We continued to oppose "self determination" right up to World War one;

No. We agreed to Irish home rule before WW1.

To suggest otherwise is to accept that the Southern counties of England should be allowed to secede from Britan

I do suggest that they should be allowed, if a majority want it.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 01:01 PM

Bannon is fired. GOODBYE WE KNEW YOU TOO WELL.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 12:16 PM

I'd buy a beer for Greg, Gilly and Jeri any day or night.
Port for Steve and Prune juice for Ake. "Juice will not reAke us"

Bannon knows how to weaponize the Culture Warriors, Fox contributors and Nazis expertly and then make it so appealing to Trump's ego it becomes policy.
He is the guy who got any two students to fight in school.

What tomorrow holds may be a cleaner image for Nazis and more clever goons at best, at worst a more dynamic Nazi following implied Presidential orders.


As for Maryland and its white racist statues, the meme is...
"Governor we have a dozen racist statues"
"Really? Hold my beer"
In three hours they were all gone and the Governors beer was not quite flat.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 12:04 PM

"Akhenaton."
The minute amount that is known of Akhenaton s that he beliv himself to be a god - as did all phaeroes Pharaoh and he sysematically wiped out all traces of his rivals religions in order to replace them with his own "establishment"
He was the first Pharaoh to have statues and paintings dedicated to himself.
I've often wondered where you chose the identity you hide behind - a self-obsessed, dictatorial megalomaniac with illusions of divinity who ruled over a brutal slave society seems just about right
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 11:58 AM

Here ya go Ache (and Professor)- by a REAL well-respected historian of the Civil War, JAMES McPHERSON, and not some ignorant Neo-Confederate clown on his blog.

Read and learn.

Fat chance...


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 11:26 AM

Meme one.

Meme 2.

Meme 3.

Just a few of the many making the rounds.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 11:14 AM

Actually Don, you have given an excellent example of the establishment and all its works in Akhenaton.
The man was a rebel who wanted social and political change, the first monotheist in history, a pacifist and artist, a poet and writer.

How the establishment and all their gods must have hated him, even more than the "liberals" hate the President I bet. They destroyed everything the Pharaoh cherished destroyed all the evidence erased his name.....all driven by self interest just like the political establishment of today....the Democrats scheming against their own because they feared him more than DJ...if they couldn't have their shill(Clinton)they thought that the Republicans would dump Trump after the election.

Anyway Akhenaton is now remembered as a visionary and the Egyptian establishment vanished like snow in Summer.

Unity and evolution in place of violence and strife.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:46 AM

"like Irish home rulers and today's Scottish Nationalists?"
A total misrepresentation of history (nothing new there)
Scotland and Ireland were occupied separate countries with individual cultures - part of a now defuncy empire
The Southern States were always a part of America
To suggest otherwise is to accept that the Southern counties of England should be allowed to secede from Britan
An utterly crass idea
Sice to see another mask fall and an arguments about the merits of slavery
"Here in Britain we believe in people's right to self determination."
At the time slavery fell in the US Britain was the richest slave-owning nation in the world - only we called it Empire
We continued to oppose "self determination" right up to World War one; long after the fall of Empire, Britain and other "democracies" still manipulate the former colonies by helping organise coups and deposing and even murdering new leaders who didn't suit
Ireland's struggle for "self determination" from the Empire led to all those leading the demand for "self determination" being secretly tried, refused legal defence and shot out of hand without recourse to appeal
The details of those kangaroo courts still remain a closely guarded secret, a century after they sent so many to their deaths.
Tell us again how Britain "believes in people's right to self determination."
What planet do you people occupy?
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:36 AM

Meanwhile back in America .................


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:34 AM

Greg I was replying to your comment about Coventry and WW2, nothing to do with US history.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:33 AM

http://thirdreichruins.com/memorials.htm

Scroll down to see some of the memorials.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:33 AM

Whoops! Geez, Professor, thought you'd said you were going to shut up? But we all know what your promises are worth, so no surprise.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:31 AM

so I will say no more.

God Be Praised!


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:27 AM

What about that monument in Coventry to "The Brave Men Of The Luftwaffe"?

I can respond to that.
There is none.
Neither are there any memorials in Germany to the brave men of the USAF or RAF.
There are war memorials to the dead of Germany in Germany however, and similarly in Japan.

Should the victors of that war go back and tear them down?
That would stir up resentment and hatred too.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: gillymor
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:26 AM

Some foreigners are very well versed in American history but your comment 'As a foreigner I probably will never understand, so I will say no more.' is your first rational contribution to this thread.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:21 AM

Greg,
maintains that George Washington and Thomas Jefferson took up arms against the government of the United States in the cause of Slavery.

No. I maintain that they were slave owners.
If supporting slavery is the issue, Jefferson and Washington have to go too.

" traitors who fought a war,"

Traitors because they wanted to secede, like Irish home rulers and today's Scottish Nationalists?

Here in Britain we believe in people's right to self determination.

I know that the US Civil War is still and emotive and divisive issue over there. As a foreigner I probably will never understand, so I will say no more.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:15 AM

monuments are also a memorial to the huge number of ordinary Americans who fought for "The South"

Ache, What about that monument in Coventry to "The Brave Men Of The Luftwaffe"?


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:14 AM

Succinct Jeri.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Jeri
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:12 AM

The parroting of the "Washington owned slaves" red herring...

Lots of people owned slaves. It was a thing back then. It was a very bad thing. We fought a war because our government wanted to make it illegal, and another group of people didn't think the government should do that, so they wanted to get rid of the government.

Then some assholes in places where that insurrection was strong put up statues to commemorate the people who wanted to destroy the government and keep slavery legal.

And then we tore them down.

The End


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: gillymor
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:11 AM

Some folks around here should get a gander at the kind of hatred
they 're defending, wether they know it or not.

Charlottesville: Race and Terror- Vice News


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Stu
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:05 AM

"Would that include all George Washington statues Steve?"

Did you read gillymor's post Keith, or are you ignoring the arguments that you cannot oppose? Again.

Tiresome trying to debate with folk who don't know how to debate.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 10:04 AM

You thought wrong, Ache, about that screed by Joe Ryan- whoever the hell he's supposed to be. Having been fool enough actually to read it, I can tell you that I've seldom - and possibly ever- seen such a pile of absolute horseshit pretending to be history in a single place.

If you really want to know about Lincoln, may I suggest the excellent works by Ronald White and Doris Kearns Goodwin. There are also some excellent factual biographies of Lee out there written by actual scholars and historians instead of by some ignorant idiot Confederate apologist.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 09:55 AM

If anybody wishes to visit a half-decent Slavery museum, they could do worse than visit the one on the site of the former Liverpool docks, whre generations of slaves were landed and sold
A truely fitting memorial to our past
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Jeri
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 09:55 AM

The primary thing you have to understand is that the Confederacy existed to overthrow the American government.

Trump likes that, as do his hate-filled followers.

Putting up monuments to traitors years after they were defeated is a big old "Fuck You" to America and those who love America. It's a big "we still think you should be slaves" to Blacks. Whatever some people think a symbol means, whatever the meaning is to the greatest number of people is what wins.

I think it's good to put the statues in a museum somewhere and talk about them. They aren't shoved in people's faces all the time, and they aren't considered to be what a town is about.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: gillymor
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 09:53 AM

Keith, the monuments in question, that are coming down and will continue to come down, were erected to traitors who fought a war, which killed hundreds of thousands of Americans, to preserve slavery. Not too difficult to understand unless you've adopted an moron like Trump, with all his racially motivated misdirections, for your history teacher.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 09:52 AM

"Removing all Confederate statues would be the first step in sending the message that we are no longer honoring white supremacy at a societal level. We've already seen progress in Tampa, Florida, and New Orleans, Louisiana, where Confederate symbols are being "
Absolutely
Washingtom, et al lived in a slave owning/trading society as did the founders of industrial Britain - they bowed to its inevitability as did Britain
Washingtom
"Washington expressed other concerns over slavery's implications for the nation. In 1797, Washington is reported to have told a British guest: "I can clearly foresee that nothing but the rooting out of slavery can perpetuate the existence of our union"
"Jefferson"
"In his writings on American grievances justifying the Revolution, he attacked the British for sponsoring the slave trade to the colonies. In 1778, with Jefferson's leadership, slave importation was banned in Virginia, one of the first jurisdictions worldwide to do so. Jefferson was a lifelong advocate of ending the trade and as president led the effort to criminalize the international slave trade that passed Congress and he signed in 1808, a year after the British did the same thing"
Lincoln
"Lincoln often expressed moral opposition to slavery in public and private.[1] Initially, he expected to bring about the eventual extinction of slavery by stopping its further expansion into any U.S. territory, and by proposing compensated emancipation (an offer Congress applied to Washington, D.C.) in his early presidency. Lincoln stood by the Republican Party's platform of 1860, which stated that slavery should not be allowed to expand into any more territories. He believed that the extension of slavery in new western lands would block "free labor on free soil", and he also wanted a peaceful, enduring end to slavery. As early as the 1850s, Lincoln was politically attacked as an abolitionist, but he did not consider himself one. "
The men who these statues stood for slavery and, as Joe pointed out, are used espectabilise colour prejudice - many were erected to honour just that
The have far more to do with the present thna they do of the past
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 09:44 AM

I see the Professor is channelling Twitler now, and maintains that George Washington and Thomas Jefferson took up arms against the government of the United States in the cause of Slavery.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 09:42 AM

Its long past time these monuments to treason and slavery were removed.

If the Daughters and Sons of the Confederacy (do look up both groups) want to set up a Confederate Theme Park & put them all there so that they can persist in the fantasy of a noble "Lost Cause" and revel in the history of white supremacy, Jim Crow, lynching and all the rest, let them have at it.


"[W]e must not be asked to say that the South was right in the rebellion, or to say the North was wrong. We must not be asked to put no difference between those who fought for the Union and those who fought against it, or between loyalty and treason.

I admit that the South believed it was right, but the nature of things is not changed by belief. The Inquisition was not less a crime against humanity because it was believed right by the Holy Fathers.

[T]he sectional character of this war was merely accidental and its least significant feature. It was a war of ideas, a battle of principles and ideas which united one section and divided the other; a war between the old and new, slavery and freedom, barbarism and civilization; between a government based upon the broadest and grandest declaration of human rights the world ever heard or read, and another pretended government, based upon an open, bold and shocking denial of all rights, except the right of the strongest.

Good, wise, and generous men at the North, is power and out of power, for whose good intentions and patriotism we must all have the highest respect, doubt the wisdom of observing this memorial day, and would have us forget and forgive, strew flowers alike and lovingly, on rebel and on loyal graves. This sentiment is noble and generous, worthy of all honor as such; but it is only a sentiment after all, and must submit to its own rational limitations. There was a right side and a wrong side in the late war, which no sentiment ought to cause us to forget, and while to-day we should have malice toward none, and charity toward all, it is no part of our duty to confound right with wrong, or loyalty with treason."

    - Frederick Douglass, 30 May 1878



The Whole Address is worth reading.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 09:37 AM

Put the statues in a museum dedicated to slavery.

Would that include all George Washington statues Steve?
He had 123 slaves on his estate.
Thomas Jefferson statues would all have to be shut away in slavery museums too. He kept slaves and used at least one of them for sex because she was impregnated by him.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 09:01 AM

If you have ever heard the defensive lies by the conservative Trump apologists you know they are not there to apologize. They are there to defend and preserve the hate and heritage of the KKK and Nazi parallel groups.

Fox News is famous for interviewing the KKK over Ferguson MS and Charlottesville VA. They have legitimatized the Klan POV more than Trump. They claim the Left are the only killers and destructive demonstrators. They have repeated this theme for decades.

Half of the country is entranced by the steady news stream of hate of the villainous left.

Reasonable people do not like lies but with repetition they stop fighting against the lies. Until they too repeat them.


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Subject: RE: BS: blood & soil Nazification of America
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Aug 17 - 07:56 AM

sorry sorry I thought it was talk like Ake day


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