BS: Arms dealers in need

Subject: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 17 Nov 17 - 05:16 PM

Just watching 'Children in Need' on the beeb and the thought struck me that a lot of these projects should get government funding, not charity. I think we have our priorities wrong somewhere. Maybe we should spend a huge chunk of the arms budget on helping kids and get the depratment of defense to do a telthon to raise funds to buy arms?

Makes more sense to me anyway :-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Nov 17 - 06:00 PM

I agree. In the fifth richest economy in the world, or whatever we're supposed to be, why should we put looking after the most vulnerable in this "big society" of ours into the lottery of charity? The amount raised tonight could have been provided in a heartbeat by the Queen or Prince BigEars or by any number of non-doms or offshore cheats or big corporations or by anyone else whose philosophy of life is to rip the rest of us off, and they wouldn't have noticed a thing. Or by putting tax up by about a quarter of a pee. But all those King Croesuses are rubbing their hands, looking down on the rest of us indulgently and patronisingly, saying how wonderful it is that the hot-polloi recognise that we're all in this together. Which we are, except for them.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Nov 17 - 06:02 PM

We hoi-polloi are cool, not hot. 😉

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 17 Nov 17 - 06:20 PM

It's too deeply ingrained hard line tory ideology - no taxes and welfare state - benevolent christian charity is all that's required
to succour the deserving needy..

The undeserving can just eff off and die...

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Nov 17 - 06:57 PM

Never mind. Have your sixth glass of cheap red and tune into Beeb Four. We've had Freddie, Joe Cocker, Aretha, Kate Bush, Sir Tom, mo' ... Effit! It's Friday!

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Nov 17 - 07:06 PM

And frickin' bleedin' Nora! Now it's Van the Man at the Eden Project. Jesus, he actually turned up!

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Nov 17 - 07:23 PM

I entered two competitions in 2005 for tickets for Make Poverty History at the Eden Project, the day they did The Big Thing in Hyde Park - and won two tickets in both. Mrs Steve and I used two of them and my daughter and her mate used the other two. It was an amazing event, never to be forgotten. I did have to endure about an hour sitting next to Esther bleedin' Rantzen...

Unfortunately, a bunch of complete twats blew London up a few days later. A couple of weeks after that, Jean Charles de Menezes was gunned down by a twat who'd been instructed by other twats. It was a bad time, and we never did make poverty history. I still have my one-quid wristband.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Joe Offer
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 12:10 AM

Well, thank the Lord Almighty that here in the United States, President Trump takes good care of our arms dealers, after the eight years of suffering the poor dealers went through under that horrible Obama person....

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 04:26 AM

Smiley for Joe :-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 04:37 AM

Pat and I watched distraught an account of what was happening to the Rohingya people
We were horrified to lear that, despite the horrific events Israel has refused to desist from supplying arms to the Burmese military
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: bobad
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 07:27 AM

Who supplies arms to Myanmar

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 08:27 AM

MISSED ONE BOBAD
And again
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: bobad
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 08:50 AM

We all know what kind of people single out Israel for condemnation and refuse to recognize the myriad worse offenders. There's a name for them. And I didn't miss anyone, it seems that you have missed the majority and locked in on the lone......surprise, surprise.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 09:55 AM

"We all know what kind of people single out Israel for condemnation"
WE condemn them all Bobad - including Britain
You defend Israel by pointing to others
Wonder what happened to "never again - not to anybody"
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 10:10 AM

Ate the hundreds of Rabbis in my linked article antisemitic for singling out Israel Bobad?
Now there's a thought!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: bobad
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 10:32 AM

Where Myanmar's weapons come from

China supplies 14 heavy weapons to Myanmar
Russia including the former USSR supplied 8 heavy weapons to Myanmar
The UK supplies 5 heavy weapons to Myanmar
Ukraine supplies 3 heavy weapons to Myanmar
The US supplies 2 heavy weapons to Myanmar
India supplies 2 heavy weapons to Myanmar
France supplies 2 heavy weapons to Myanmar
The former Yugoslavia supplied 2 heavy weapons to Myanmar
Serbia supplies 1 heavy weapon to Myanmar
Brazil supplies 1 heavy weapon to Myanmar
North Korea supplies 1 heavy weapon to Myanmar
South Korea supplies 1 heavy weapon to Myanmar
Sweden supplies 1 heavy weapon to Myanmar
Pakistan supplies 1 heavy weapon to Myanmar
Myanmar supplies 1 heavy weapon to Myanmar
Israel supplies 1 heavy weapon to Myanmar

Yet Carroll singles out only Israel for condemnation - there you have it.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: bobad
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 11:04 AM

Ate [sic] the hundreds of Rabbis in my linked article antisemitic for singling out Israel....

You are not a rabbi.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 11:14 AM

So you can only criticise Israel if you are a Rabbi
Think you've painted yourself into a corner here Bobad, don't you?
WHO ELSE BUYS ISREALI WEAPONS
From yet another Antisemitic source

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 11:21 AM

There is an ould rabbi called Carroll
(Though the kippah is not his apparel)
Though Keith tells him "you lose"
With his fair-minded views
He has bobad over a barrel

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 11:27 AM

(Apologies for the poetic licence, Jim...)

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 12:01 PM

It was you wot rote our folk songs, wannit Steve?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 12:20 PM

Sorry, Jim. The first line just popped into my head as soon as I saw bobad's post declaring that you are not a rabbi (I suppose he must have got a degree in The Bleedin' Obvious at the University Of No Shit Sherlock) and I just couldn't stop meself...

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 02:21 PM

How did this become a thread on Israel?

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 02:38 PM

How did this become a thread on Israel?

Because folks couldn't resist engaging an immatrure, ignorant,bigoted, deranged abd ultimately boring troll - I give you Boo-Bo. Or is that Boo-Boo?

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 02:38 PM

Just make fun of bobad and maybe he'll go away, Dave!

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 02:45 PM

"How did this become a thread on Israel?
Because Israel is one of the leading arms dealers wth the fastest drone industry on the planet
As you now know, like Britain, they don't give a toss which fellow-terrorist regime they support with their arms
In the case of Myanmar, they even supply instructors n how to use the ****** stuff
There predecessors would be spinning in their graves if they'd have been given such a luxury as burials
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: bobad
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 02:46 PM

Yep, they all come crawling out of the woodwork like cockroaches......lol!

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 02:48 PM

From: Steve Shaw - PM
Date: 17 Nov 17 - 06:00 PM

I agree. In the fifth richest economy in the world, or whatever we're supposed to be, why should we put looking after the most vulnerable in this "big society" of ours into the lottery of charity? The amount raised tonight could have been provided in a heartbeat by the Queen or Prince BigEars or by any number of non-doms or offshore cheats or big corporations or by anyone else whose philosophy of life is to rip the rest of us off, and they wouldn't have noticed a thing. Or by putting tax up by about a quarter of a pee. But all those King Croesuses are rubbing their hands, looking down on the rest of us indulgently and patronisingly, saying how wonderful it is that the hot-polloi recognise that we're all in this together. Which we are, except for them.

Another comment by Prince dick-head (a.k.a. Steve Shaw).

A quick check online will give details of Her Majesty' wealth as approx. 277 million pounds. Here

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: bobad
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 02:53 PM

World's largest arms exporters 2012-2016 in millions of US dollars

Rank         Supplier         Arms Exp

1          United States         47,169
2          Russia         33,186
3          China                9,132
4          France         8,564
5          Germany         7,946
6          United Kingdom 6,586
7          Spain                3,958
8          Italy                3,823
9          Ukraine         3,677
10          Israel         3,233

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 02:53 PM

Since its inception, Children in Need has raise 890 million pounds.
There is no way that this could have been paid by the Queen.

A little reasonable thought confirms that Steve Shaw is (once again) being a total dick.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: bobad
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 03:59 PM

How did this become a thread on Israel?


Because hating Jews is no longer politically correct.
Hating Israel is the correct way to hate Jews now.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 04:05 PM

Well, I'd suggest that a total dick is someone who posts on completely the wrong thread and then repeats the mistake. And do watch your language. Disagreeing with Nige does not necessarily make one a total dick. Is there such a thing as a partial dick, one wonders? Hang on, I'll just emails Mrs Bobbit...

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 04:09 PM

Oops, I think It's me who's got me threads tangled! Sorry, Nige, but easy on the biggus dickus stuff anyways, old boy! 😂

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 05:01 PM

A silly old bigot called bobad
Showed such one-sided views - what a sad lad -
That the Jews of the world
Abuse at him hurled
Saying SHUT UP, you make us look so bad...

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: bobad
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 06:18 PM

Your poetry, or whatever that's supposed to be, is as lame as your attempts to camouflage your bigotry.........pathetic.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: rich-joy
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 06:41 PM

Going back to the OP, DavetheGnome :
Reminds me of the teatowel/poster many of us had in the 70s :

It will be a great day when our schools get all the money they need, and the Air Force has to hold a cake stall to buy a bomber

Still waiting ..... (but not holding my breath).....

R-J


https://www.ipb2016.berlin/b07-workshop-presentation-global-campaign-on-military-spending-gcoms-the-future-of-the-campaign/

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: bobad
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 07:27 PM

Here's another side of the Israel that the haters love to villify and demonize:

Paralysed veteran to stand during Cenotaph parade thanks to Israeli technology

Royal Engineer Chris Baker will have the help of a robotic exoskeleton made with the latest technology from the Jewish state

A British Army veteran seriously wounded in Iraq is set to stand for the national anthem at the upcoming cenotaph parade with the help of a robotic exoskeleton made with Israeli technology.

Chris Baker, 33, a Royal Engineer, suffered permanent damage to his spinal column, when his vehicle in Iraq was hit by a remote-controlled roadside bomb, confining him to a wheelchair.

Jewish businessman and philanthropist Gerald Ronson, a strong supporter of Army and Police veterans causes, heard of the soldier?s situation and paid for the innovative Israeli suit through his family?s foundation.

Baker has dreamt of being able to stand for the national anthem, and this will now occur at the annual Cenotaph remembrance ceremony of the Association of Jewish Ex Servicemen and Women (AJEX) in Whitehall on 19 November.

Thousands of Jewish personnel served in the British army during World War Two or after, and this year?s remembrance parade commemorates 100 years since the battles for Passchendaele and Jerusalem, as well as the 75-year anniversaries of Dieppe and El Alamein.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 07:28 PM

Bobad's bile - don't he sow it! -
Is bigotry, and don't we all know it!
Explains how he acts
He's blind to the facts
And what's worse, he disses a poet!

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: FreddyHeadey
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 09:12 PM

Bobad, thanks for your list 02:53pm
That gives a better overal picture.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: bobad
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 09:13 PM

Standing up against hate is bile to some - their kin can be found amongst neo-nazis and the alt right not to mention the regressive left.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 09:31 PM

Take a chill pill, old boy. You're getting all aerated again!

I feel another poem coming on...

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: bobad
Date: 18 Nov 17 - 09:36 PM

I feel another poem coming on...

A cold shower may give you some relief.😂 😂 😂 😂 😂

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 02:27 AM

..so.. how hilarious would it be if Bob wasn't even the least bit Jewish...??? 😜



..and where would the world be without fanatics...?????

For a start there'd be a massively reduced market for arms dealers and manufacturers...!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 03:21 AM

Please don't allow this troll to close down this thread now that Israel has been exposed as a supplier and traner of ethnic cleansing butchers - that's how he works
It's enough to know that he is the only individual here to have attempted to associate this filthy trade with the Jewish people - the rest of us are quite happy to recognise that the culprits are the Israeli regime who are criticised by Jews throughout the world for their behaviour
Even Bobad is forced to admit that they are part of this trade - his only defence is that there are others as bad as the Israelis ivolved
Leave it there lads
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Iains
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 03:28 AM

"Maybe we should spend a huge chunk of the arms budget on helping kids and get the depratment of defense to do a telthon to raise funds to buy arms?"

Has to be one of the most stupid comments I have seen on mudcat, and there have been a fair number of them.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 04:04 AM

v"Has to be one of the most stupid comments "
Yup - we know what your attitude is to helping the less well off Iains
You were the one who suggested that the victims of Grenfell Tower should be left to sleep in tents rather than allow them use vacant private property in the immediate are - isn't that right?
Any inhuman clown can describe a humane suggestion as "stupid" - most of you do
There's never been a better wake up call indicating it's about time the world recognised the suicidal stupidity of leaving these weapons into the hands of the North Koreans and the Moronic Trump regime   
And now for the Strangelove arguments about coal-mine superiority!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Iains
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 04:20 AM

Jim take your ridiculous bullshit elsewhere you silly little man.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 04:35 AM

"How did this become a thread on Israel?
Because Israel is one of the leading arms dealers wth the fastest drone industry on the planet

It was not started as a thread about Israel or even a thread about arms dealing. Look at the opening post. I'll repeat it here.

Just watching 'Children in Need' on the beeb and the thought struck me that a lot of these projects should get government funding, not charity. I think we have our priorities wrong somewhere. Maybe we should spend a huge chunk of the arms budget on helping kids and get the depratment of defense to do a telthon to raise funds to buy arms?


It is a thread about getting our priorities wrong. I don't know how I can make it any clearer.

If you chose to make it about Israel I suppose that is your prerogative but all that achieves is getting yet another thread closed. Surely, if you want to talk about Israel, you should start your own thread rather than hijack someone else's?

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 04:36 AM

Re your OP Dave, if there was a fundraiser for defence spending I would not give.
Likewise for road repairs, refuse collection or railway investment.

I think those things vitally important and underfunded, but should be funded from taxation like defence spending.

Do you think defence is one area of spending that is overfunded?
What current capabilities could we dispense with?
Should we be influenced in any way by Russia steadily increasing expenditure on armaments, or is that just silly?

Re Israel, Jim always tries to raise that subject in a thread if he possibly can.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 05:37 AM

"Re Israel, Jim always tries to raise that subject in a thread if he possibly can."
And you use every opportunity to defend this foul regime
I raised the point because it ties in with the original point on arms
Arms is no longer a question of defence, if it ever has been.
It is a major industry designed to make people rich and as such, it is part of our national economy - that is why no government possessing the present political principles we have come to expect from our politicians, on the contrary, when arms profits fly in through the window, humanity flies out of the door (Israel's sales to a power using arms to ethnically cleanse is a readily on-hand example of that)
I had no intention of making this "about Israel" - those who broke their necks to defend those sales did that.
If we can't discuss in terms of why they exist today, then we are reduced to being a bunch of idealist dreamers
Arms are manufactured and sold for profit, the amount governments spend on them are why people are go short or can't get medical attention.
Those who say we cannot discuss those aspects of the subject are as censorial as the trolls
It really is as simple as that
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 06:00 AM

"Jim take your ridiculous bullshit elsewhere you silly little man."
If you can't behave like an adult, I suggest you should take your aggressive behaviour elsewhere Iains
You have obviously nvere heard of 'Posturers Law'
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 06:19 AM

"Re your OP Dave, if there was a fundraiser for defence spending I would not give.
Likewise for road repairs, refuse collection or railway investment.

I think those things vitally important and underfunded, but should be funded from taxation like defence spending. "

Several things. Charity, as well as frequently being emotional blackmail, is also big business. Sure, a few charities do their damnedest to make sure that the absolute maximum amount raised goes to the cause they claim it does. But many use a puzzlingly-large proportion of their take in meeting "administrative costs," including paying large salaries to their head-office staff. One feature of giving to charity is that, once you've given, it's hard to track precisely what your money's been used for. Mother Teresa raised tens of millions of charity dollars over decades, a huge proportion of which, unbeknownst to her donors, went towards expanding her convents in order to propagate the word of the Lord. In the meantime, hundreds of her charges died of neglect in terrible conditions, lacking even the most basic standards of hygiene and medical provision. Who knew!

Also, many charities use aggressive tactics such as accosting people in the street, cold-calling vulnerable people and rattling tins in your face on both sides of you as you leave the supermarket. And I can't understand why one of the richest economies in the world needs the British Heart Foundation or cancer charities. Seems to me that being indulgent with non-doms and other tax-avoiders and fighting useless bloody wars overseas, including by proxy (which is why we arm unsavoury regimes such as Saudi Arabia and Israel) takes priority over what governments are there to do first and foremost, govern in the interest of ALL their people, and that should include a big safety net for those at the bottom of society.

You're dead right about those things that should be met from taxation, Keith. But your list is rather on the short side.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 06:26 AM

Keith. I shall make it plain once more for your benefit this time.

It is a thread about getting our priorities wrong.

No more, no less. It is my belief the funding for the projects that help children in need should come from government coffers and not from charity.

Jim. Those who say we cannot discuss those aspects of the subject are as censorial as the trolls

I have not said it cannot be discussed. I am just wondering why you want to discuss it on a thread that has sweet FA to do with Israel. I am sure if you invited me to a Folk club and I started singing non-folk songs you would complain. This thread is supposed to be about UK government priorities and I am asking you nicely to take your views about Israel to a more suitable thread.

I would thank everyone to stick to the topic that I intended and have subsequently made abundantly clear.

DtG

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 06:28 AM

Thanks for your last post Steve. Spot on topic and a good example to us all :-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 06:39 AM

I went for balance, Dave. 😉

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 06:42 AM

The only way I can achieve balance is to have a pint of Black Sheep in each hand...

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 06:50 AM

Or a bottle of Morrisons Signature Nero d'Avola in each hand. Sadly, it still isn't back down to five quid, he hinted...

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 07:28 AM

"I am just wondering why you want to discuss it on a thread that has sweet FA to do with Israel."
It is about arms and, in my opinion, why they are considered more important than anything else by the 'great and the good' Dave - not Israel
I made my point and was intending to pass on - now, thanks to Bobad, Keith and now you, we are discussing Israel
The position that arms manufacture purchase and sales has become an integral part of the economies of the major powers - Israel's sale to the Burmese regime was an example of how arms sales override even humanitarian considerations and an indication why your original suggestion will never be taken up by the powers that be.
I don't want to discuss Israel further than those points
If you don't want to prod the ants nest please leave it there.
I remind you, as I am often reminding Keith, the suitability of what can be discussed on these threads is (hopefully) left to the participants
Interference with their discretion is little short of an attempt to manipulate and censor
There's already enough people willing to try their hand at that one.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 09:17 AM

Dave,
It is my belief the funding for the projects that help children in need should come from government coffers and not from charity.

We would all like to see government support for our favourite charities, but what should we reduce government spending on to allow it?

You raised the issue of defence spending in your OP so it is reasonable to ask if you would see it cut and the money spent on good causes instead.
May we discuss that? I do not want to be accused of "poisoning" another of your "celebrations."

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 09:32 AM

So you categorise children in need, and presumably a lot of other charity targets, as "good causes." That's precisely the way to institutionalise and legitimise charity instead of making the state face up to its responsibilities. I'd say that good causes are building affordable homes, making tax-avoiders pay their fair share, looking after disabled people, providing care for the elderly, providing universal free nursery places, funding schools properly and protecting the NHS. Of course we ask where the money comes from for all of 'em. Quite right too (so please don't bother, Keith). But separating out children in need, etc., as "good causes" instead of "state responsibilities" is simply invidious.

Let me have a little whimsy. Let's make the defence budget a charity! A good cause! We'd actually have to use the money for DEFENCE! No more proxy poxy useless wars!

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 10:32 AM

When I was 16, my adolescent idealistic dream was for all armamenents factories
to shift their production to affordable high quality guitar amps and synthesisers... oh well...

dream on...


Now if we are targeting other extravagant superfluous Govt spending for cuts...
lets have a closer look at gross wastage on advertising, overpaid parasite consultants, legal fees, public inquiries and committees, high class hospitality, idiotic white elephant vanity projects like garden bridges, etc..etc..

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 10:34 AM

And HS bloody 2.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 04:17 PM

now, thanks to Bobad, Keith and now you, we are discussing Israel

I am specifically saying please do not discuss Israel on this thread, Jim. I have said so in those exact words. The first mention of Israel was by you.

It is about arms and, in my opinion, why they are considered more important than anything else

Then your opinion is wrong. I should know. I started the thread. It is about the UK government's misplaced priorities. Now, once again. please do not start on about Israel again. Thank you.

Keith. The raising of spending on defense was a blatant and obvious vehicle to counterpoint the ridiculous situation of having to rely on charity for our children while lining the pockets of arms dealers. If you think for one minute that anyone would seriously suggest having a fund raiser for them you really do have comprehension difficulties.

I am no position to advise the government or anyone else what to do but if they cannot fund both the defense of the nation and the well being of its most vulnerable members then they have no business being in power.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 05:42 PM

!I am specifically saying please do not discuss Israel on this thread, Jim"
You have no right to make such a demand Dave
The only people who have rights of that sort are the forum fairies who close threads
If I believe Israel to be relevant (as I have gone to some lengths to explain) I have every right to do so.
I have never claimed that anybody other than me raised the question so please do not imply that I have
How dare you make such a demand when it is now you bringing Israel into this discussion, not me?
If anybody attempts to censor what I have to say I will report them - simple as that
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Nov 17 - 08:11 PM

Er, respect, Jim 'n' Dave. We're on the same side innit. Definitely on politics, maybe not quite so eye-to-eye on folk clubs and stuff, but what the.... Just sayin'...😳

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Nov 17 - 02:29 AM

You have no right to make such a demand Dave

I have made no demands. I have made a polite request which you have chosen to ignore. Yes it is the moderators that close threads. I think this one is now overdue. Thanks Jim.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Nov 17 - 06:09 AM

"I have made a polite request which you have chosen to ignore."
I have not ignores it Dave - you Keith and Bobad are the ones who took up a passing comment and ran with it
"I am specifically saying please do not discuss Israel on this thread,"
Doesn't sound like a "request" to me, polite or otherwise
I'll rephrase my statement You have no right to make such a "request"
That is as much censoring an opinion as demanding something
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Nov 17 - 06:28 AM

Whatever, Jim.

D.

Subject: RE: BS: Arms dealers in need
From: Stu
Date: 20 Nov 17 - 06:39 AM

If you keep him on this thread he'll not infect the others. They had a devil of a time above the line with him as he argued about what folk music is (yawn) and it was blissfully quiet down here.

You tell 'em Jim! Educate the buggers!