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BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?

Raggytash 11 Jan 18 - 08:04 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Jan 18 - 07:49 AM
punkfolkrocker 11 Jan 18 - 07:44 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Jan 18 - 06:31 AM
McGrath of Harlow 08 Jan 18 - 06:27 PM
Dave the Gnome 08 Jan 18 - 05:31 PM
McGrath of Harlow 08 Jan 18 - 05:26 PM
punkfolkrocker 08 Jan 18 - 02:16 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Jan 18 - 01:55 PM
punkfolkrocker 08 Jan 18 - 01:48 PM
punkfolkrocker 08 Jan 18 - 01:46 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Jan 18 - 01:44 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Jan 18 - 01:37 PM
punkfolkrocker 08 Jan 18 - 01:33 PM
Iains 08 Jan 18 - 01:25 PM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Jan 18 - 01:22 PM
punkfolkrocker 08 Jan 18 - 12:41 PM
punkfolkrocker 08 Jan 18 - 12:38 PM
Iains 08 Jan 18 - 12:27 PM
punkfolkrocker 08 Jan 18 - 06:39 AM
Iains 08 Jan 18 - 06:18 AM
punkfolkrocker 08 Jan 18 - 05:06 AM
Keith A of Hertford 08 Jan 18 - 04:48 AM
Iains 07 Jan 18 - 05:10 PM
McGrath of Harlow 07 Jan 18 - 05:08 PM
McGrath of Harlow 07 Jan 18 - 04:45 PM
Mr Red 06 Jan 18 - 11:45 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Jan 18 - 01:27 PM
Greg F. 05 Jan 18 - 11:19 AM
punkfolkrocker 05 Jan 18 - 11:14 AM
Iains 05 Jan 18 - 11:04 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Jan 18 - 10:45 AM
DMcG 05 Jan 18 - 10:44 AM
punkfolkrocker 05 Jan 18 - 10:37 AM
DMcG 05 Jan 18 - 10:05 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Jan 18 - 09:53 AM
Nigel Parsons 05 Jan 18 - 09:50 AM
Dave the Gnome 05 Jan 18 - 09:27 AM
Nigel Parsons 05 Jan 18 - 09:18 AM
Backwoodsman 05 Jan 18 - 05:00 AM
Stanron 05 Jan 18 - 04:59 AM
Iains 05 Jan 18 - 04:28 AM
Mr Red 05 Jan 18 - 03:41 AM
Steve Shaw 04 Jan 18 - 08:23 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Jan 18 - 08:09 PM
Iains 04 Jan 18 - 05:57 PM
Mr Red 04 Jan 18 - 11:48 AM
Dave the Gnome 04 Jan 18 - 09:53 AM
Thompson 04 Jan 18 - 09:52 AM
Thompson 04 Jan 18 - 09:28 AM

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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Raggytash
Date: 11 Jan 18 - 08:04 AM

If it's any conciliation Dave, when I was a teenager a friend of mine went to try and join the RAF.

He was turned down because his father was Polish.

His father had arrived in the UK to join the RAF and served with it for several years.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Jan 18 - 07:49 AM

I am trying another approach. Watch this space :-)

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 11 Jan 18 - 07:44 AM

DTG - As I mentioned in previous threads, when I was 18 my mum revealed my 'true' ancestry on her side,
and I discovered I had a Jewish grandad of Eastern European decent
[ who I would never have any contact with, to avoid family upset ].

All my mum knew was that he was probably born in England,
but his parents came here escaping a pogram.
They might have been Russian or Polish.

History makes such details vague, and ever shifting national borders can become meaningless.

Much later, a few years before she died, my sister became an early recreational internet adopter,
and hooked up with a Jewish family tree network.
So now I know fairly certainly that they were Polish, but....????


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Jan 18 - 06:31 AM

Just heard back that sadly it is not to be. Not sure why yet. Maybe my Russian Grandfather means that my Dad was not actually Polish!

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 06:27 PM

Triple citizenship actually, because you'll still count as a British citizen. But with the same right to live anywhere in Europe that the others will be losing.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 05:31 PM

My application for Polish citizenship is progressing. I have no reason to believe it will not go ahead and if it does I shall be entitled to a Polish, and therefore EU, passport. Dual citizenship. Best of both worlds :-)

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 05:26 PM

But what has changing the colour of your passports got to do with views about Brexit?
EU passports can be any colour under the sun that a nation's government wishes them to be.

Maggie Thatcher's decision in 1988 to change the colour of the British passport to maroon was made before the EU had actually come into existence. No one made her do it. Maybe she liked the colour.

Regardless of what happens as regards membership of the EU, Britain has every right to reverse that colour change. I'd be in favour of there being a blue British passport, just as I'd be happy to see my Irish (and EU) passport go back to being green.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 02:16 PM

Keith - oooh.. you do make us chuckle...

Btw... yes I do, nearly every post of mine is deadly serious and 'sensible'..
below the jokey surface lurks a subtext of pained points of darkest despair at human stupidity and cruelty...

.. and like the best of us.. I also like fart and knob jokes...


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 01:55 PM

PFR, just responding to your ludicrous and insulting,
brexiteers haven't already demanded we all get nationality barcodes and serial numbers tattooed on our forearms...

Have you any sensible point to make?


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 01:48 PM

Keith - now you got that off your chest, please back to passports in this thread..


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 01:46 PM

..oh well that's alright then...
Where do I get the bootboy neck and forhead tattoos, I've already got a shaved head.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 01:44 PM

Below is a review of the outgoing year.
January: Far-Right Leaders Meet in Germany
Leaders of Europe?s far right, including Marine Le Pen of France?s National Front and Geert Wilders of the Dutch Party for Freedom (PVV), convened in Germany?s Koblenz on January 21 under the auspices of Europe of Nations and Freedom (ENF) ?the smallest political group in the European Parliament.
At least 3,000 protested against xenophobia as the meeting took place. Speakers hailed the election of US President Donald Trump and Britain?s Brexit vote as victories for their cause.
Le Pen told attendees: ?In 2016, the Anglo-Saxon world woke up ? In 2017, I am sure that it will be the year of the continental peoples rising up,? she said.

March: Far Right Boost in Hungary, the Netherlands
In Hungary, Janos Ader was reelected as president on March 13.
He is a member of the ruling conservative Fidesz party, which has shifted further right, in part due to a campaign against billionaire investor and philanthropist George Soros, whose Open Society Foundations (OSF) charity advocates for greater acceptance of refugees and migrants.
In the Netherlands, the March 15 general election saw Geert Wilders? PVV party win the second-largest share of votes with more than 13% overall and a five-seat gain on the 2012 election. Mark Rutte, the Dutch prime minister, held on to his role.

May: Le Pen Eyes French Presidency
France?s National Front leader Marine Le Pen made it to the second and final round of the French general election on May 7.
The party took more than 10 million votes ?a record performance? but Emmanuel Macron won with 66%.

September: Alternative for Germany Surges
Germany?s Alternative for Germany (AfD), which promised to ban all mosques and criminalize wearing the veil, emerged as the country?s third biggest political force, winning 12.6% of the popular vote on

September 24.
Angela Merkel?s center-right Christian Democratic Union party secured 33%, down almost 9%from the 2013 ballot.
?Had Merkel scored 3 or 4% more we would all be talking about the end of populism and the new energy of liberal democracy,? Mudde said.

October: Gains in Austria
Austria?s Freedom Party (FPO), led by Heinz-Christian Strache, won 26% of the vote, becoming the third largest party, in the country?s October 15 election.
It entered government in December, forming a coalition with 31-year-old Chancellor Sebastian Kurz and his Austrian People?s Party.
Both parties campaigned for tougher immigration rules and the deportation of asylum seekers.

November: Fascists Join March in Poland
Some 60,000 people, including nationalists and fascists, took part in Warsaw?s Independence March on November 11.
https://financialtribune.com/articles/international/78564/europe-s-far-right-leaning-in-2017


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 01:37 PM

Have a look around Europe and its lurch to the far Right.
Far Right parties on the rise everywhere.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 01:33 PM

If you say so...

There are other views available.....


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Iains
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 01:25 PM

Pfr. I think most who voted for brexit voted to retain freedoms. It is those happy to remain that welcome Orwell's Big Brother and the continued growth of EUania and its concomitant loss of civil liberties and increased surveillance.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 01:22 PM

....which shows your ignorance and contempt for the majority of people in this country.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 12:41 PM

..anyway.. I'm surprised some of the more extreme brexiteers
haven't already demanded we all get nationality barcodes and serial numbers tattooed on our forearms...


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 12:38 PM

permanent overdraft....???
I'm a guitar player.. I was born with one...!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Iains
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 12:27 PM

Pfr. The downside of chips with everything, even RFID chips, is that when cash is totally replaced by electronic transactions, then the sensible person will be forced to exist with a permanent overdraft in case the PTB try to get clever.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 06:39 AM

I think all passports and borders should cease to exist....

But until then I'd prefer a universal smart identity card..

Maybe even a battery powered chip implant under the skin of my arse cheek....

I'd be happy presenting that to border control petty officials...


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Iains
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 06:18 AM

I think all passports should be rainbow coloured to recognise the LGBT contingent.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 05:06 AM

What's this bollocks doing here in the "passport thread"..
you got a separate brexit thread for that overheated shite throwing....

Or is 'someone' trying to get this one closed down...?????


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Jan 18 - 04:48 AM

Leaving the EU does not have to mean leaving the Single Market

We were told in terms, unequivocally, before the referendum that that was exactly what we were voting for.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Iains
Date: 07 Jan 18 - 05:10 PM

M of H. It is a long hard furrow to plow at times!


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 07 Jan 18 - 05:08 PM

No Nigel, I'm afraid you are wrong. The EU did not exist until the Maastricht Treaty was created in 1993, and by signing it, Margaret Thatcher took us into it, without any kind of public consultation, in the same way that Edward Heath took us into the Common Market. It wasn't until Wilson replaced him that people had a chance to vote on whether to remain, which they did by a very much larger majority than that in the 2016 Brexit referendum.

The distinction is not pedantic. Leaving the EU does not have to mean leaving the Single Market, as is demonstrated by Norway. We did not have an opportunity to vote about doing that, the referendum in 2016 merely indicated a narrow majority (among those voting) for leaving the EU, but indicated nothing about our views on the Single Market.

I voted to Remain, but if I had had an option to vote for leaving the EU but remaining in the Single Market I would very likely have voted for that. I have no doubt that those who voted to leave included some who shared that preference.lm


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 07 Jan 18 - 04:45 PM

"I repeat, for those unable to understand, Margaret Thatcher did not 'take the country into the EU'."


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Mr Red
Date: 06 Jan 18 - 11:45 AM

Preview shows what you have pasted in including any special characters.

That is because it is the Mudcat JavaScript/PHP (while on Mudcat) in conjunction with your "PC/Browser set up" that is in control. Once it stores on Mudcat I have to assume Max has done some encoding/compression and that only allows a limited subset of characters, some of which are emojis.

My point about hashcodes below 255 (=one byte)

But I believe there are many codes above that that Mudcat can use but not all. The thing about 255 is that it covers the accents of most (if not all) Western European fonts.

And as for trying to use the right accented characters - there are times when the meaning is important. And we can all see when a post is not read as meant and someone kicks off on his interpretation (he - because the ladies don't seem to do that). But it is incumbent on the poster to try and help the afflicted. My preference is to at least try (E&OE).


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 01:27 PM

Funnily enough my Russian grandad, as well as being an Orthodox priest, was a great advocate of Esperanto. I never understood why!

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Greg F.
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 11:19 AM

Tonto go Tronto teach Esperanto, Kemosabe.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 11:14 AM

...so, whatever happened to "Esperanto"...!!!???


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Iains
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 11:04 AM

" This is not prescriptive, as we can all do what we like as ever, just a reflection of the way things are going."


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 10:45 AM

It's mostly fine to type foreign words used in English without their accents. Passe is grand, as is cliche. Stress ye not! Papier mache, no accent. Cafe, no accent. You keep accents for proper names, including people's, cities' and countries', and in order to avoid confusion: Brussels pate (not even gonna try...) should have an acute at the end to avoid confusion with bald pate, but no circumflex over the a. This is not prescriptive, as we can all do what we like as ever, just a reflection of the way things are going. One day we'll regard getting all emotional about accents as so passe.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: DMcG
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 10:44 AM

The difficulties of such things might explain in part why there are few Greek, Russian or Arabic posts here!

I posted a bit of maths recently. Getting those characters right was 'an opportunity'...


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 10:37 AM

Funnily enough, though I'm not a xenophobic nationalistic brexiteer,
I can't think of any reason why I would even ever bother trying to type & post French, or any other Euro accents...?????

PFR - failed French O level in 1975.....

Nothing political to do with it,
it's just i've always been shit at learning foreign languages...


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: DMcG
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 10:05 AM

You can't reliably do it that way, I am afraid. You need to use è for è and é for é.

Previewing does not allow for the fact thw characters also need to be stored and retrieved from the database.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 09:53 AM

Told you - special character gremlins at their worst!

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 09:50 AM

Sneaky. I just pasted 'passe' into the reply box, and preview showed it correctly with accent.
I then hit preview a second time and it showed 'Pass?'

It seems 'three times is the trick'.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 09:27 AM

Preview shows what you have pasted in including any special characters. When you hit submit the special character gremlins take over and you may not got what you previewed.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 09:18 AM

Iains wrote: Most places a construction in MS Word can be polished proofread and then pasted

As it can on Mudcat:
Paste from MS Word into the reply box, then:
Below the reply box click on 'preview' before hitting submit.
You can then see how your post will appear, and make any corrections in the reply box before previewing again.
Only hit submit (without preview) once you are happy with the result.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 05:00 AM

Thanks for that Hash Code Generator Page link, Mr. R. Very useful indeed.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Stanron
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 04:59 AM

Iains wrote: Most places a construction in MS Word can be polished proofread and then pasted

I use a simple text editor and all errors are mine alone, but that's on a desktop using Linux. A lot of problems seem to come from either hand held devices or MS Windows 10.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Iains
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 04:28 AM

Mr Red. Thanks for the link. I am still learning what to place between < and >. Mudcat is the only place I visit that requires such manipulation. Most places a construction in MS Word can be polished proofread and then pasted.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Mr Red
Date: 05 Jan 18 - 03:41 AM

I think hash codes below 255 work. Let us see if the preview mimics with the post.

passé

eg typing pass&#233; see the page that would help

FWIW Iains - I read it, and mentally interpreted as intended.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Jan 18 - 08:23 PM

Oh gosh, I was wrong about 30 Sept '12! But the post I posted on that date at the time of day in question went thus:

"The best instances are those in which the pompous trip up. We had a senior English teacher at one school I taught at who was fond of putting notices on the staff room notice board which were written in unnecessarily-lofty tones. One of her favourite words was "liaise," which she always spelled "liase."

At another school, one of my colleagues (Mr W, who had better remain nameless!) was indignant to find that someone had scrawled "W..... is a bastard" on the wall outside his room, but misspelling his name, missing out a letter. He promptly found a matching pen and inserted the missing letter."

Now perhaps our sorry friend can tell us how that relates to the mean-spirited point he was failing to make in his post. Can't see it meself. Still, it's surprising that sense of humour bypasses are still so easily available on our beleaguered NHS!


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Jan 18 - 08:09 PM

Huh? I didn't post at that time of day on either of those dates (and your post was very confused in any case). Perhaps it's been a long day. I suggest a lie down. Don't let that weasel bite your bollocks, what there is of them. :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Iains
Date: 04 Jan 18 - 05:57 PM

"Simple thing Iains, omit the accent and then you can at least spell the word correctly."

"If you post passe correctly, with the accent, it will be changed even though preview shows it as entered. That is beyond my control."

Or to put it simply for simple minds, If the text changes between preview and submission the fault cannot be either recognised or corrected.

Raggytash you appear to have a comprehension problem.

"I only mentioned it in the first place because of continual sniping at spelling by certain individuals."

Why so coy about the subject? As we both full know, the biggest offender in this regard is your fellow mudrat shaw.
Would you like a few examples?

But he is a bit of a weasel.e.g.
Oct 20, 2017 - Steve Shaw, 30 Sep 12 - 08:17 AM .... I don't care in the least about mistakes in spelling in blogs, fora, personal emails, texts and the like. ..

WHAT A CLOWN!


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Mr Red
Date: 04 Jan 18 - 11:48 AM

We are slowly committing national suicide.

Nah, we will catch man 'flu and decide to go to bed with Honey & Lemon for a while.

When we emerge - science, robots or plebs will have taken up the slack and we will start complaining it is not as good as it was.

Cost? Growth! (or lack of it) - It is already predicted: GDP, wages, food, status.

Unintended consequences? Nah! Unconsidered consequences. Like air-traffic control - who's in charge? And while we work that out there will be a plane crash, there would have been one anyway, but this one will be at the feet of the controlling organisation (or lack of it).


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Jan 18 - 09:53 AM

What's going to be better for Britain outside the EU?

Nothing at all.

What's going to be better for the EU without Britain?

They will not have to put up with Nigel Farage.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Thompson
Date: 04 Jan 18 - 09:52 AM

And Ireland - surely it's obvious that Britain would be far better off without Northern Ireland, "the Irish Question" having dragged out of British politics for hundreds of years and had a huge influence on what happened in Britain.


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Subject: RE: BS: blue passports - political smokescreen?
From: Thompson
Date: 04 Jan 18 - 09:28 AM

Could I repeat my question? What's going to be better for Britain outside the EU?

(What's going to be better for the EU without Britain? Britain in general could be said to have dragged the EU to the right; the British also pushed for the eastern Europeans to be allowed to join - in general a more conservative group (see Hungary… shudder) than the rest of Europe. Will Europe be better without Britain? Hard to say. The people running Europe now are very different from the idealists who started it, dreaming of a Europe without war, trading freely, with shared wealth and fair laws…)


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