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The common and the goose

Related thread:
Tune Req: They hang the man and flog the woman (10)


GUEST,Chris Foster 17 Jan 18 - 04:04 PM
David Carter (UK) 17 Jan 18 - 04:23 PM
Steve Gardham 17 Jan 18 - 05:50 PM
Steve Gardham 17 Jan 18 - 05:52 PM
GUEST,Chris Foster 18 Jan 18 - 09:35 AM
GUEST 18 Jan 18 - 09:36 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Jan 18 - 09:58 AM
GUEST,Mick Pearce 18 Jan 18 - 11:25 AM
KarenJoyce 18 Jan 18 - 11:32 AM
RTim 18 Jan 18 - 12:12 PM
Snuffy 18 Jan 18 - 12:47 PM
FreddyHeadey 18 Jan 18 - 01:10 PM
Steve Gardham 18 Jan 18 - 02:18 PM
Steve Gardham 18 Jan 18 - 03:03 PM
Joe Offer 18 Jan 18 - 03:20 PM
Joe Offer 18 Jan 18 - 03:43 PM
michaelr 19 Jan 18 - 06:35 PM
GUEST,Mick Pearce (MCP) 21 Jan 18 - 10:02 AM
rich-joy 21 Jan 18 - 11:28 PM
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Subject: Looking for a tune
From: GUEST,Chris Foster
Date: 17 Jan 18 - 04:04 PM

I am looking for a tune or tunes for the following set of verses. The poem appears multiple times at least as far back as a Pepys diary entry in 1664. I've heard bits of it quoted many times, but don't recall ever hearing it sung.

The law locks up the man or woman
Who steals the goose from off the common
But leaves the greater villain loose
Who steals the common from off the goose

The law demands that we atone
When we take things we do not own
But leaves the lords and ladies fine
Who take things that are yours and mine

The poor and wretched don't escape
If they conspire the law to break
This must be so but they endure
Those who conspire to make the law

The law locks up the man or woman
Who steals the goose from off the common
And geese will still a common lack
Till they go and steal it back


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 17 Jan 18 - 04:23 PM

A web search turns up a mudcat thread from 13 years ago:

mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=82224

But that doesn't come up with a tune in the end.


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 17 Jan 18 - 05:50 PM

Macrimmon is doing it for me. Nice and slow and pedestrian with short sharp 'lack' and 'back' on the last verse. What a find!


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 17 Jan 18 - 05:52 PM

I ought to add, either unaccompanied or some simple drone.


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: GUEST,Chris Foster
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 09:35 AM


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 09:36 AM

Do you mean Macrimmon's lament Steve?


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 09:58 AM

Does it need a tune?
We've used it as a recited piece in numerous feature evenings
It works fine as a chant as well
MacCrimmon - does it scan without becoming too four-square?
Whatever is chosen, too much ellabouration will reduce its bite
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: GUEST,Mick Pearce
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 11:25 AM

Alan Franks, who sings with Patty Vetta, does a version of this on the album Will under the title The Goose And The Beak. If I have time I'll try and put that tune up later, in the meantime you can see what the sample gives you on amazon:   Will.

Mick


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: KarenJoyce
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 11:32 AM

There is a sung version on a CD by The Claque, information here: The Claque CD

In the CD booklet, Martin Bloomer is credited with setting the lyrics (and adding more words).

According to another web site, the members of The Claque run The Exeter Traditional Music Club (Folk song) at The Royal Oak Inn, Nadderwater (just west of Exeter) and a couple of them can be reached by e-mail, supposedly, from this page: E-mail links here


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: RTim
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 12:12 PM

I am not sure you want this version.............https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mx3wbU-d3Wk

Tim Radford


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Snuffy
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 12:47 PM

If you repeat the 3rd and 4th lines of each verse, then it fits quite well to the hymn tune Melita (a.k.a. Eternal Father strong to save/Navy Hymn).


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: FreddyHeadey
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 01:10 PM

Tune\earworm in my head today would do
The Jolly Miller \ Miller of Dee

https://youtu.be/lT_SQF6EZtM


~~~~~~~~~~~~~
note
the blickifier can't do Mudcat links without you adding
https://
so it looks like ...href="https://mudcat.org...
here's another go at David's link to the old thread
mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=82224


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 02:18 PM

It needs a simple tune. 'Eternal Father' is too powerful and would swamp the words(IMO). Miller of the Dee? Doesn't even fit the words.


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 03:03 PM

Must agree with Jim here. Anything but the simplest of accompaniment will detract from the powerful message. Another alternative which is almost what Jim is saying: around about 1910 there was a vogue for musical monologues, a simple tune playing in the background and the words recited, in time with tune usually.


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Joe Offer
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 03:20 PM

The Union Songs (click) Website has a helpful page on "The Goose and the Common."

Here's the text of that page:

    The Goose and the Common

    Authors unknown - a number of versions©1700s

    The law locks up the man or woman
    Who steals the goose from off the common
    But leaves the greater villain loose
    Who steals the common from off the goose

    The law demands that we atone
    When we take things we do not own
    But leaves the lords and ladies fine
    Who take things that are yours and mine

    The poor and wretched don't escape
    If they conspire the law to break
    This must be so but they endure
    Those who conspire to make the law

    The law locks up the man or woman
    Who steals the goose from off the common
    And geese will still a common lack
    Till they go and steal it back
    [Seventeenth century protest against English enclosures]

    Variations

    They hang the man and flog the woman
    Who steals the goose from off the common
    Yet let the greater villain loose
    That steals the common from the goose

    The law doth punish man or woman
    That steals the goose from off the common
    But lets the greater felon loose
    That steals the common from the goose

    The law locks up the hapless felon
    who steals the goose from off the common
    but lets the greater felon loose
    who steals the common from the goose

    The fault is great in man or woman
    Who steals a goose from off a common
    But what can plead that man's excuse
    Who steals a common from a goose
    [In The Tickler Magazine 1 February 1821]

    Notes

    These protest rhymes from Seventeenth century England remind us that what we today call "privatisation" of common resources is an old story.
    Let's subvert the paradigm, by supporting public institutions like schools, libraries, and parks.

I didn't find any reference to this song in Roud, the Traditional Ballad Index, or the Digital Tradition - but maybe I'm not looking in the right places at these sources.


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Joe Offer
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 03:43 PM

YouTube has one recording of "The Song of the Goose and the Common." It's by Lindsay Cooper. My link probably won't play in the UK, but here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mx3wbU-d3Wk

I didn't find a YouTube recording of the song by The Claque.

Reinhard Zierke has a page on the song at


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: michaelr
Date: 19 Jan 18 - 06:35 PM

That's bizarre!


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: GUEST,Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 21 Jan 18 - 10:02 AM

Here's Alan Frank' adaptation of the song, very short!


X:1
T:The Goose And The Beak
D:Patty Vetta & Alan Franks cd - Will
C:Alan Franks
Z:Mick Pearce
M:6/8
L:1/8
Q:3/8=66
K:E
(EF) |G2 F E2 C |B,3 z (G,B,) |C E2 z
w:The_ law con-demns the man or_ wo-man
(G,B,) |G2 E A3 |z2 G F2 E |F B,2 z2
w:Who_ steals the goose from off the com-mon
B, |B2 A G2 B |AGF- F2
w:And lets the great-er fel-on loose_
B, |(B,E)F G B2 |G2 F E3- |E3 z||
w:Who steals_ the com-mon from the goose_
W:
W:The rambling beak installed in session
W:Is one part ass, nine parts posession.
W:Twelve men and women seldom seek
W:To steal the session from the beak.
W:
W:
W:The law condemns the man or woman
W:Who steals the goose from off the common
W:And lets the greater felon loose
W:Who steals the common from the goose.


Mick


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Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: rich-joy
Date: 21 Jan 18 - 11:28 PM

MCP's link (thanks Mick), on 18 Jan at 11.25am to a short clip of the Franks & Vetta a cappella version (with Charlotte Moore), and notated above,
is (unlike some versions!) quite listenable and singable .....

:))

R-J


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