The common and the goose

Subject: Looking for a tune
From: GUEST,Chris Foster
Date: 17 Jan 18 - 04:04 PM

I am looking for a tune or tunes for the following set of verses. The poem appears multiple times at least as far back as a Pepys diary entry in 1664. I've heard bits of it quoted many times, but don't recall ever hearing it sung.

The law locks up the man or woman
Who steals the goose from off the common
But leaves the greater villain loose
Who steals the common from off the goose

The law demands that we atone
When we take things we do not own
But leaves the lords and ladies fine
Who take things that are yours and mine

The poor and wretched don't escape
If they conspire the law to break
This must be so but they endure
Those who conspire to make the law

The law locks up the man or woman
Who steals the goose from off the common
And geese will still a common lack
Till they go and steal it back

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 17 Jan 18 - 04:23 PM

A web search turns up a mudcat thread from 13 years ago:

mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=82224

But that doesn't come up with a tune in the end.

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 17 Jan 18 - 05:50 PM

Macrimmon is doing it for me. Nice and slow and pedestrian with short sharp 'lack' and 'back' on the last verse. What a find!

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 17 Jan 18 - 05:52 PM

I ought to add, either unaccompanied or some simple drone.

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: GUEST,Chris Foster
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 09:35 AM

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 09:36 AM

Do you mean Macrimmon's lament Steve?

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 09:58 AM

Does it need a tune?
We've used it as a recited piece in numerous feature evenings
It works fine as a chant as well
MacCrimmon - does it scan without becoming too four-square?
Whatever is chosen, too much ellabouration will reduce its bite
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: GUEST,Mick Pearce
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 11:25 AM

Alan Franks, who sings with Patty Vetta, does a version of this on the album Will under the title The Goose And The Beak. If I have time I'll try and put that tune up later, in the meantime you can see what the sample gives you on amazon:   Will.

Mick

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: KarenJoyce
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 11:32 AM

There is a sung version on a CD by The Claque, information here: The Claque CD

In the CD booklet, Martin Bloomer is credited with setting the lyrics (and adding more words).

According to another web site, the members of The Claque run The Exeter Traditional Music Club (Folk song) at The Royal Oak Inn, Nadderwater (just west of Exeter) and a couple of them can be reached by e-mail, supposedly, from this page: E-mail links here

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: RTim
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 12:12 PM

I am not sure you want this version.............https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mx3wbU-d3Wk

Tim Radford

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Snuffy
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 12:47 PM

If you repeat the 3rd and 4th lines of each verse, then it fits quite well to the hymn tune Melita (a.k.a. Eternal Father strong to save/Navy Hymn).

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: FreddyHeadey
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 01:10 PM

Tune\earworm in my head today would do
The Jolly Miller \ Miller of Dee

https://youtu.be/lT_SQF6EZtM


~~~~~~~~~~~~~
note
the blickifier can't do Mudcat links without you adding
https://
so it looks like ...href="https://mudcat.org...
here's another go at David's link to the old thread
mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=82224

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 02:18 PM

It needs a simple tune. 'Eternal Father' is too powerful and would swamp the words(IMO). Miller of the Dee? Doesn't even fit the words.

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 03:03 PM

Must agree with Jim here. Anything but the simplest of accompaniment will detract from the powerful message. Another alternative which is almost what Jim is saying: around about 1910 there was a vogue for musical monologues, a simple tune playing in the background and the words recited, in time with tune usually.

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Joe Offer
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 03:20 PM

The Union Songs (click) Website has a helpful page on "The Goose and the Common."

Here's the text of that page:

The Goose and the Common

Authors unknown - a number of versions©1700s

The law locks up the man or woman
Who steals the goose from off the common
But leaves the greater villain loose
Who steals the common from off the goose
The law demands that we atone
When we take things we do not own
But leaves the lords and ladies fine
Who take things that are yours and mine
The poor and wretched don't escape
If they conspire the law to break
This must be so but they endure
Those who conspire to make the law
The law locks up the man or woman
Who steals the goose from off the common
And geese will still a common lack
Till they go and steal it back
[Seventeenth century protest against English enclosures]
Variations
They hang the man and flog the woman
Who steals the goose from off the common
Yet let the greater villain loose
That steals the common from the goose

The law doth punish man or woman
That steals the goose from off the common
But lets the greater felon loose
That steals the common from the goose
The law locks up the hapless felon
who steals the goose from off the common
but lets the greater felon loose
who steals the common from the goose
The fault is great in man or woman
Who steals a goose from off a common
But what can plead that man's excuse
Who steals a common from a goose
[In The Tickler Magazine 1 February 1821]

Notes

These protest rhymes from Seventeenth century England remind us that what we today call "privatisation" of common resources is an old story.
Let's subvert the paradigm, by supporting public institutions like schools, libraries, and parks.

---

I didn't find any reference to this song in Roud, the Traditional Ballad Index, or the Digital Tradition - but maybe I'm not looking in the right places at these sources.

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Joe Offer
Date: 18 Jan 18 - 03:43 PM

YouTube has one recording of "The Song of the Goose and the Common." It's by Lindsay Cooper. My link probably won't play in the UK, but here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mx3wbU-d3Wk

I didn't find a YouTube recording of the song by The Claque.

Reinhard Zierke has a page on the song at

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: michaelr
Date: 19 Jan 18 - 06:35 PM

That's bizarre!

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: GUEST,Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 21 Jan 18 - 10:02 AM

Here's Alan Frank' adaptation of the song, very short!

  X:1
  T:The Goose And The Beak
  D:Patty Vetta & Alan Franks cd - Will
  C:Alan Franks
  Z:Mick Pearce
  M:6/8
  L:1/8
  Q:3/8=66
  K:E
  (EF) |G2 F E2 C |B,3 z (G,B,) |C E2 z
  w:The_ law con-demns the man or_ wo-man
  (G,B,) |G2 E A3 |z2 G F2 E |F B,2 z2
  w:Who_ steals the goose from off the com-mon
  B, |B2 A G2 B |AGF- F2
  w:And lets the great-er fel-on loose_
  B, |(B,E)F G B2 |G2 F E3- |E3 z||
  w:Who steals_ the com-mon from the goose_ 
  W:
  W:The rambling beak installed in session
  W:Is one part ass, nine parts posession.
  W:Twelve men and women seldom seek
  W:To steal the session from the beak.
  W:
  W:
  W:The law condemns the man or woman
  W:Who steals the goose from off the common
  W:And lets the greater felon loose
  W:Who steals the common from the goose.
  

Mick

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: rich-joy
Date: 21 Jan 18 - 11:28 PM

MCP's link (thanks Mick), on 18 Jan at 11.25am to a short clip of the Franks & Vetta a cappella version (with Charlotte Moore), and notated above,
is (unlike some versions!) quite listenable and singable .....

:))

R-J

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Feb 19 - 06:24 AM

I’ve written a musical treatment of Martin Bloomer’s “expanded” version, with the two extra stanzas and the chorus. Trouble is, I’ve been advised that I should register him as co-writer and get permission from his estate before I perform it or record it. Really not sure what’s involved, so I’m a bit stuck right now. Looks as if my very rough acoustic demo on Soundcloud is as far as this will go.

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 23 Feb 19 - 02:16 PM

I can't emphasise too much here (IMO) this is such a powerful short piece of poetry which doesn't need anything adding and despite its great age it is still very relevant.

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: GUEST,Alison Bloomer
Date: 23 Mar 19 - 12:44 PM

I was Martin's wife so if the "guest" above wants to get in touch he/she can. I'll look at sound cloud meanwhile.

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Reinhard
Date: 23 Mar 19 - 02:14 PM

Another recent video: Goose & Common by the Askew Sisters, which is from their forthcoming CD Enclosure.

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 23 Mar 19 - 02:43 PM

Ah, the Askew Sisters, perfection!

Subject: RE: The common and the goose
From: GUEST,Diolch
Date: 06 Feb 23 - 02:17 PM

Hodge droop'd his head, and heav'd a sigh
Then meekly utter'd this reply -
"The crime is small, in man or woman,
Should they a goose steal from a common;
But what can plead that man's excuse
Who steals a common from a goose?"

- from The Cottager by William Hutton, first published 1798