BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 03:51 PM

Three more "liars" ..................

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 03:48 PM

Dave,
You lie, cheat, change the rules, whinge about how badly you are done by and how nothing is ever your fault.

If I lie quote me, liar.
If I cheat, quote me liar.
If I have changed any rules.... huh? You are losing your tenuous grip on reality now!

"I have posted nothing here that anyone could object to"

You people object to being questioned or disagreed with, but otherwise I post nothing objectionable.
Quote me if I have, liar.

Pfr,
Keith - wot.. me offensive...!!!?????

There is offensive language in some of your anti-Tory rants.

Jim, it was not offensive of those people to give their view based on their intimate knowledge.
It was not offensive for me (and most of the nation,) to believe them.
Why did you not?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 02:55 PM

"That would be offensive.
I would never even imply such shit.
If I did, quote me liar."
Don I do now " believe that all male Pakistani Muslims have a culturally implanted tendency" but only because of the testimony of all those knowledgeable people, and always acknowledging that only a tiny minority succumb.
The minority you refer to succumb to grooming underage girls to have sex - which is what the discussion was about
That is not "implying anything - it is saying it outright
Apologies on a postcard please - I think not!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 02:51 PM

Keith - wot.. me offensive...!!!?????

You clearly mistake tuff luv from one of your few last remaining mudcat mates
who can just about tolerate you,
as 'offensive'...

Consider our posts of the days since you have been back as an 'intervention'...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 02:31 PM

Could I suggest increasing dementia............

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 02:23 PM

On a more serious note, not that I expect a straight answer. How can you in all honesty say "I have posted nothing here that anyone could object to" when it is so blatantly obvious to any interested observer that you have made dozens of posts that many people have voiced their objections too? In other words, your posts have caused people to object. You are not making any sense at all.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 02:16 PM

This is getting tedious again so it is probably about time we wound it up.

I readily admit making deliberately offensive posts and have explained why. I then realised that it was the wrong thing to do and apologised, not because I 'had to' but because I wanted to and it is what normal people do when they know they made a mistake. Yet another Keith alt truth that I find offensive.

The phrase that started "I have posted nothing here that anyone could object to" has quickly become "I have never made an offensive post" in the hope that people would not notice. Because when you realise you have made a mistake you desperately seek for a way out instead of just admitting it. Yet another alt truth that I find offensive. Seems to be Wheatcroft moment there.

Keith, you are not only still digging but you are burying yourself in the mire. What will be next? You never post anything that eminent living historians with a centre display in Waterstone's would find offensive I suspect.

You lie, cheat, change the rules, whinge about how badly you are done by and how nothing is ever your fault. Have you not even had the slightest inclination that you are the only one who thinks this way? Still, like I said, keep digging. Maybe you will go so deep that you will never return.


We can but hope.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 02:05 PM

Are you suggesting that describing Muslims as implanted perverts isn't offensive - whoever said it?

That would be offensive.
I would never even imply such shit.
If I did, quote me liar.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 02:02 PM

" believe that all male Pakistani Muslims have a culturally implanted tendency"
Are you suggesting you didn't say this?

I did say it. I said I believed it " but only because" those people gave it as their view and they were better placed than any of us to know.

Their views were not considered offensive and were widely reported.
It is not offensive to say I believed them.

Why did you not believe them?

Now, have you found an actual offensive post made by me, preferrably not from over 7 years ago!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 01:42 PM

"and you still can not find an offensive post from me."
Are you suggesting that describing Muslims as implanted perverts isn't offensive - whoever said it?
You put it up as your opinion - you are offensive
You said similar of Irish Children and Travellers
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 01:39 PM

"Jim, I said I believed a cultural explanation."
You said
" believe that all male Pakistani Muslims have a culturally implanted tendency"
Are you suggesting you didn't say this?
"I had quoted 5 knowledgeable people who gave that explanation."
You have claimed to have put up quotes of your prominent people making this statement -
You didn't - you lied - you have just said you never made this statement - you lied - you said you have never made an offensive statement - you lied
You could have ended this long ago by putting up quotes of prominent people claiming "implanted tendencies - you never have and you never will
Your postings are a string of permanent lies - and you dare to call the rest of us liars!!!!
You are joke
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 02:23 PM

Jim, I said I believed a cultural explanation.
I had quoted 5 knowledgeable people who gave that explanation.
All 5 were Left Wing.
Three were Labour polticians, two being MPs representing large Pakistani communities, the other being a Pakistani Labour activist given a peerage.
Three of the five were themselves of Pakistani heritage.

My question at the time was what superior knowledge did you have to dismiss their view.

There is nothing offensive in that. Those people's views were widely reported at the time.

So, you had to go back SEVEN YEARS and you still can not find an offensive post from me.

Dave and PFR have made offensive posts on this thread in recent days!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 02:09 PM

"Liar Dave, I have not and would not imply any of those things.
If I did, quote me, liar."
Subject: RE: BS: Muslim prejudice
From: Keith A of Hertford - PM
Date: 13 Feb 11 - 07:10 AM
Don, no one on this thread has claimed any of those things.
Don I do now " believe that all male Pakistani Muslims have a culturally implanted tendency" but only because of the testimony of all those knowledgeable people, and always acknowledging that only a tiny minority succumb.
Do you dismiss all that just because it does not fit your preconceptions, or do you have some powerful evidence to the contrary that you have not shared with us?
"I have never made an offensive post.
If I have, quote me liar."
See above
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 01:53 PM

See what I mean, THREE "liars" in that one.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 01:50 PM

Liar Dave, I have not and would not imply any of those things.
If I did, quote me, liar.

On this thread both you and PFR have made offensive posts.
They contained offensive language.
You had to apologise Dave.

I have never made an offensive post.
If I have, quote me liar.

You have made offensive posts.
I never have.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 12:42 PM

Oh I forgot to add both the victimhood and the me, me, me mentality.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 12:41 PM

"Liar Dave,"
Stop this now Keith
You have habitually filled your posing with lies and distortions - nobody else has
You claim nobody has responded to yo - that is a lie
The fact that yo7u don't like the answers you have been given doesn't men that nobody has answered you
If you want examples of your lying try your serial denial of your "implant" claim
You said it - the you claimed you didn't say it (you doi this regularly)
Then you said you only said it because somebody said it was true (nobody ever has apart from the BNP and other racist organisations)
hen asked to provide an example of somebody saying it you say you already have (you never have because no respectable personality would ever have made such an illegal comment publicly
"keyboard diarrhoea." just about sums up your contributions to this forum
"I have never made any statement about "all Muslims."
See what I mean How many times have I put your quote up and how many times have you gone through the string of justifications I have just described
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 12:41 PM

I think you will find Punkfolkrocker that you are a member of a VERY small club. Like most people on here I am tired of the deceit, the duplicity, the moving of goal posts, the denials, the blaming of other people for things posted and the outright lies that culminate from of of these.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 11:52 AM

The part of me that still regards Keith as 'one of us' - a mudcat mate,
sincererely hopes he is having apropriate medical check ups and treatment...

My mum was put on tablets as soon as dementia was diagnosed,
which may or may not be acting to decrease the severity of gradual decline...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 11:44 AM

The behavour is getting progressively more severe. I honestly believe that serious psychological problems are behind it, in conjuction with worsening dementia.

For example look at the number of times the word liar is used.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 11:37 AM

Keith - I'm sure you're not thick - but I do wonder why you persist in [deliberately..???] misreading what I write about you...???????

One more time - It's gone beyond caring about what you write..

I object to the total quantity and frequency of your repetitious over elongated forum spamming, thread destroying, utterly boring posts...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Show some self respect and self discipline, and stop flooding mudcat with your obsessive unrestrained keyboard diarrhoea...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 11:23 AM

If you were not lying you could quote something, liar.

You implied that British Pakistanis were more liable to rape young girls. I objected to that.
You implied that Labour party members were more likely to be antisemitic. I objected to that.
You implied that Irish schoolchildren were brainwashed to be anti-English. I objected to that.
You implied that Labour party members were more likely to rape women. I objected to that.

Need I go on? I have objected to every single one of those things and more, as have many people. Yet you say "I have posted nothing here that anyone could object to". A blatant lie.

Feel free to carry on digging. I am happy to keep providing the evidence.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 11:22 AM

Keith - no apology for my candour - you are talking shite...

Quote me.

To satisfy your request for a quote, I'd need to copy and paste at least 90% of the sheer unrestrained quantity of your forum spamming posts...

Then post one example.
Make it the very worst I have ever made.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 11:18 AM

Keith - no apology for my candour - you are talking shite...

..and far too much of it...!!!


To satisfy your request for a quote, I'd need to copy and paste at least 90% of the sheer unrestrained quantity of your forum spamming posts...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 11:10 AM

Liar Dave,
You said "I have posted nothing here that anyone could object to"

Yes, and that is true.
If it is not, quote something liar.

I object to most things you post as do many others so I have told no lies.

If you were not lying you could quote something, liar.

Go ahead liar. Quote me and state your objection, liar.

Pfr,
I can.. and have done...

You have provided no quote.
You both object to anyone posting views different to your own, but that does not make my posts objectionable.
If that is not true, quote a post that is.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 10:59 AM

"No. No-one can quote anything objectionable.
If you are not lying, quote something now, liar."

I can.. and have done...

I object to the sheer overwhelming amount and frequency you post...!!!!!!!

Like a spoiled toddler bawling it's eyes out for attention in a long super market checkout queue...

I'm the tired bloke with a single item in my basket wishing the stressed and exhausted mother would stuff a bread roll in it's mouth....

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 10:59 AM

If you are not lying, quote me liar.

You said "I have posted nothing here that anyone could object to"

I object to most things you post as do many others so I have told no lies. You are digging yourself deeper and deeper in the doo.

Seemples.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 10:51 AM

Liar Dave,
Lots of people object to lots of things you post.

No. No-one can quote anything objectionable.
If you are not lying, quote something now, liar.

You just made a ridiculous statement about not posting anything that anyone could object to.

No. That statement was true.
You make yourself ridiculous by making lying claims you can not substantiate with quotes, liar.

You are now living in a Walter Mitty fantasy world where you really believe the things you say

Unlike Mitty, I can substantiate everything.
You can substantiate nothing because your claims are filthy lies.

If you are not lying, quote me liar.

Liar Jim,
I have never made any statement about "all Muslims."
If I have, quote me liar.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 06:40 AM

Wheatcroft - the Border Issue !!!
He only wants someone to talk to- he doesn't care what
"I have said nothing ridiculous "
All Muslims are "culturally implanted" to have underage sex seems ridiculous enough for me!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 06:13 AM

I have posted nothing here that anyone could object to.

Lots of people object to lots of things you post.


I have said nothing ridiculous

You just made a ridiculous statement about not posting anything that anyone could object to.

It's gone well beyond different morality etc. You are now living in a Walter Mitty fantasy world where you really believe the things you say. No one else does.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 05:51 AM

Steve, Wheatcroft was 3 years ago and I did nothing dishonest.
I quoted the disputed passage in full.

On the border issue I linked Dublin and EU together for obvious reasons.
I said only they were threatening a hard border, which was completely true. Our side said not under any circumstances.
You misquoted me again. I said "threatened" not wanted."

Anything on this thread Steve?

Dave,
I have posted nothing here that anyone could object to.
...
I have said nothing ridiculous
Priceless irony with no idea he is doing it.

The truth actually.
That is why you can not produce a single quote.
You lie.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 05:45 AM

He has now abandoned defending his Tory Perve mates and is now happy to talk about himself - I suspect we are the only friends he has
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 05:26 AM

I have posted nothing here that anyone could object to.
...
I have said nothing ridiculous

Priceless irony with no idea he is doing it.

I don't think it is catching, Jim, but more and more people are laughing at him I think we need to keep him since the village idiot position was vacated a few months back ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 05:21 AM

You deliberately misquoted Geoffrey Wheatcroft in order to "strengthen" your case, hoping we wouldn't notice, and have never apologised. Please stop saying that we can never refute what you say. You recently said that only Dublin and the EU wanted a hard border. A fib. Yes we can refute and yes we do refute. Stop being rather vulgar and largely fraudulent.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 22 Mar 18 - 05:07 AM

Dave,
When even the site management have commented on it

Really? When?

I have posted nothing here that anyone could object to.
That is why all your accusations come without quotes.

You can not argue against anything I have actually said, so you lie that I have said things I never have or would.

You resort to ridicule, but I have said nothing ridiculous and you have . Quotes ready if requested.

Oh dear oh dear.
Ha ha ha.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 04:29 PM

He's a self obsessed ultra right wing nutter
Leave him alone -0 it might be catching
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 02:52 PM

You are right of course, Raggy. His last post proves he is marching to a completely different drum. When even the site management have commented on it and he still cannot see it we may as well just ignore him. Trouble is he tends to linger like a bad smell and one cannot help but spray a little bullshit repellent at times :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 02:50 PM

Me, me, me ............... I want some attention !!!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 02:40 PM

Dave, Jim's whopping lies make him a laughing stock.
You all ignoring that elephant in the room makes you all laughing stocks.
Your made up claims of "sordid secrets" make you a laughing stock.

I have made no false claims.
I have accurately reported claims emerging from within your party.
I have said nothing remotely laughable and you can not quote anything of mine to criticise.

You have made utter fools of yourselves over this issue.
I have not put a foot wrong.
If that is not the plain and simple truth, quote me.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 02:18 PM

You're wasting your time Dave.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 01:24 PM

Still don't get it then, laughing stock?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 12:22 PM

PFR, I do not speak for any particular media organ, and when I quote from the media I avoid right wing publications.

I leave you to check my posting rate, but remember I am often replying to several people at once.
When I referred to your "friends" I meant those here who have similar political views, i.e. DTG Jim Steve Rag .

Dave you claimed some people relevant to this thread are "suffering the consequences of trying to hide their sordid little secrets"

No such "sordid secrets" have emerged.
You just make shit up, like Jim's whopping lie that there are "proven cases" of rape and paedophilia against "prime ministers and government high-ups." A blatant and whopping lie but only I objected to it.

All you people do is attack me without actually specifying anything I have really, actually said.
Just made up shit and false accusations.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 11:47 AM

Keith - also.. my 'rants' against tory lies, scandal and corruption are founded on known truth and/or highly plausible rumours..

Unlike so much of the anti labour disinformation & rants that are generated and seeded in the media
by well financed & resourced professional right wing propaganda activists

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 11:38 AM

Keith, you really don't get it do you? I have no intention of engaging at any level with you apart from with utter contempt and you are really beneath even that. Everyone can see what you are trying to do now and you are a laughing stock.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 11:35 AM

Keith - I don't have any friends, I'm unsociable - which makes me pretty lousy as a socialist...

My 'rants' against tories are [obviously ? ] a tongue in cheek parody riposte
countering the 'normal' bigoted hostile anti labour/corbyn bollocks
spewed from your sort's 'normal' media channels...

ie.. I'm taking the piss...!!!!!

btw.. What is your normal average mudcat posting count per day...????

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 11:25 AM

"Don't do it, Jim."
No intention
I really have had enough of this dick's 'Groundhog Day' shenanigans
"two posts per thread per day."
Somewhat over-generous, in my opinion - but maybe you're into S&M
"From Liverpool to Frisco a-roving I went ........."
Do you know the dirty version of this Kenny?
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 11:19 AM

Dave,
If anyone comes up with anything he dislikes it is 'made up shit' yet anything he says is gospel truth.

Ha ha ha.
All you have to do is produce it, but you can't.
It is made up shit.

PFR, your friends post far, far more than I do, and most of what I post is a response to what they post.

Some of your rants against Tories are pure poison.
Do you care how boring and tedious that is to normal people?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Kenny B (inactive)
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 10:31 AM

From Liverpool to Frisco a-roving I went .........

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 10:23 AM

Keith - what you say is problematic enough to say the least..

But my biggest problem with you, is YOU...

You are an extreme bore.

After putting up with it for too many years I am sick of your obsessive needy spamming and hogging of debates.

You bog down and kill off interesting threads with your incessant over repetitive posts demanding attention for yourself.

I dont agree with excluding and banning members,
but I do think you should have a limit imposed on your daily posting count
[if mudcat tech permits]

Eg, no more than one or two posts per thread per day.

You'd definitely be forced to be more concise and self disciplined.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 10:19 AM

Don't do it, Jim. If anyone comes up with anything he dislikes it is 'made up shit' yet anything he says is gospel truth. Typical narcissist. He gets off on it.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 10:09 AM

Dave,
. Those who are not willing to wash their dirty linen in public cannot hide it any longer and, as you have very ably pointed out, are now suffering the consequences of trying to hide their sordid little secrets.

What are you referring to now?
No "sordid secrets" have been revealed to my knowledge. You are making shit up again.

Jim,
Mor denials and more inhumanity
Your poisonous postings.....

More baseless claims about me that you can not substantiate with quotes because they are just more lies.

youe made-up accusations just cover (in this case) the Labour members

I just repeated what Labour insiders themselves have said.

You have denbied serial abuse by politiciacians, ignored cover-ups

I have not. You just lie and lie.
If you are not a filthy liar, quote me doing theses things.

You blame the victims and not the perpetrators -

I have never done that.
More filthy lies from a filthy liar.
If you are not a filthy liar, quote me doing theses things.

You refuse to respond to argument, then dishonestly, claim there has been none (as here)

If that is not a lie, put the argument up again and I promise to respond to it.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 09:19 AM

Mor denials and more inhumanity
Your poisonous postings carefully exclude the greatest perpetrators and youe made-up accusations just cover (in this case) the Labour members
You have denbied serial abuse by politiciacians, ignored cover-ups and "lost" research resukts
You blame the victims and not the perpetrators - you virtually have in every single topic we have argued on and have invented and surrounded yourself with an invisible army to misinterpret and distort so you don't have to take responsibility for your obscene and often illegal claims - "it's not me, somebody else told me it was true" (as here)
You refuse to respond to argument, then dishonestly, claim there has been none (as here)
You are a moral mess on a sordid crusade
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 09:12 AM

Don't bother, Jim. Everyone else understands that any organisation that encourages victims of abuse to come forward will always have a high incidence of open and honest public criticism. Those who are not willing to wash their dirty linen in public cannot hide it any longer and, as you have very ably pointed out, are now suffering the consequences of trying to hide their sordid little secrets. You will never change Keith's views. It is really not worth the time and effort.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 09:08 AM

Jim, I have posted nothing here that any decent person could object to.
If you challenge that, produce a quote.

PFR, I do not share the far left politics of you and your friends.
My posts reflect that, but there is no "poison" in them.
My views are actually mainstream. You will find nothing from me that is not mainstream.
You are the extremists.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 08:34 AM

"Do you not sympathise with those victims of sexual harassment and bullying?"
You seem to be inacpable of distinguishing between "sympathising" and "cynically using" as is your wont
Abused children to besmirch Muslims, a few Traveller criminals to denigrate the entire community, "brainwashed" Irish children to smear the Irish people.
You have even blamed the British electorate for the Government's bribing the DUP
Each time, when challenged, you scurry behind somebody else and blame them for your obnoxiously inhuman views
You have been answered here over and over again and all you can respond with is denials - if you claim otherwise you are lying - as you do frequently
Your message is plain - if the rich and famous do it, then it isn't rape or harassement
Added to which - "Labour bad, Tories, Ukip, the BNP and every other right wing goose-stepper good"
Go find a beer-garden and hold a rally
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 07:41 AM

That is not true though.
You people just say things like that to justify not replying to me, when the fact is that you have no reply.
I have said nothing here that has not been said by Labour insiders.
How can you object to that?
Do you not sympathise with those victims of sexual harassment and bullying?
Should they not be heard? They never would be if it was up to you people.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 07:40 AM

TIME FOR ONE OF THESE, I THINK !
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 05:41 AM

It is you that cannot engage in civil discussion Keith. It was summed up perfectly before

all your contributions below the line these days are agenda-laden pure poison

Everyone knows it and anyone with any sense is no longer falling for it.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 21 Mar 18 - 05:34 AM

Steve, you know I refute those years old false accusations.

Do you challenge anything I have posted on this?
If not, why all the abuse?
If you do, identify it for discussion.

Why can you people not engage in civil discussion?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 05:00 PM

I'm trying to help him, Dave. I'm like that tha knows...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 04:43 PM

Steve,you rascal :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 04:33 PM

"No-one has found a single fault in anything I have posted..."

What a rather vulgar and largely fraudulent thing to say, Keith. I know it is because Geoffrey Wheatcroft told me so. I also seem to remember a little porkie about only Dublin and the EU wanting a hard border. And what was that about the soaring pound...? And Nigel Farage never lies...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 02:12 PM

Life really is too short lads
Stop persecuting the afflicted - he'll be blaming Corbyn and the Labour Party for that next - he's exhausted everything else
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 01:26 PM

Keith - ..a bit like haemoroids...

When they shrink and disappear, I so quickly readjust to normal pain free life,
I'm too busy enjoying the breath of fresh sunny air to even think about missing them..

But then they eventually come back with a vengeance....

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 01:22 PM

I seem to recall that 40 conservative MP's had had allegations made against them, as opposed to 4 Labour MP's. Now if 2 more have been added to the Labour ranks it would still seem to be a far bigger problem within the conservative party.

This point has been totally ignored by some.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 01:19 PM

Funny thing is, while Keith was away I hadn't really noticed.. but now he's back, I certainly have...!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 01:16 PM

Really Keith stuff too. See other thread for response.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 01:14 PM

Really weird stuff lads.

Strangely, after all that weirdness, you have not addressed one single point that has been made on the thread subject.

Will you?
Can you?
Clearly, no.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 12:26 PM

"Is that how you see me?"
A screaming meglonmanic killer with an Oedipus complex - that just about sums it up
"I am flattered."
So you should be - that's fairly mild compared to the bad things I attribute to you
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 10:24 AM

I apologise to all, apart from Keith who deserves it, for having to put up with my language above. I shall desist forthwith and restrict myself to non offensive responses. I still have the same views about Keith and his narcissistic personality disorder but you should not all have to put up with my frustration at his devious and malicious ways.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 10:06 AM

You wouldn't know an appropriate analogy if it painted itself blue and sang the appropriate analogy anthem while biting your balls.

Simpering odorous slugfucker

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 10:02 AM

A goblin crashes and burns.
An appropriate analogy indeed Dave.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 09:47 AM

Who has lost Dave?

Gollum won his precious so I guess everyone else lost...

Dribbling ulcerous fuckwit

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 09:42 AM

Dave,
You lose!

Who has lost Dave?
Certainly not me. No-one has found a single fault in anything I have posted, and you are all incapable of challenging any of my actual posts!

Repeating as yet unproven accusations is errant nonsense.

Of course it is not!
If Labour members are making false accusations of sexual misconduct against each other, that is itself an issue.

The accusations are a hard fact.
That is a serious issue for the Party whether they are true or not.

Other parties do not seem to have it to anything like the same extent.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 09:39 AM

Repeating as yet unproven accusations is errant nonsense.

Of course it is not!<.i>

Oh yes it is!

He's behind you!

Blithering crusty bellend.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 09:38 AM

"Jim, your link is to James Cagney in White Heat - Top of the World.

Is that the ego Dave is feeding?
Is that how you see me?
I am flattered."

you sure about that flattery...???

Considering multiple 'rumours' of Cagney serial seducing young male acting hopefuls...?????

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 09:35 AM

Dave,
Repeating as yet unproven accusations is errant nonsense.

Of course it is not!
If Labour members are making false accusations of sexual misconduct against each other, that is itself an issue.

The accusations are a hard fact.
That is a serious issue for the Party whether they are true or not.

Other parties do not seem to have it to anything like the same extent.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 09:33 AM

I think it is more like this.

You lose!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 09:29 AM

Jim, your link is to James Cagney in White Heat - Top of the World.

Is that the ego Dave is feeding?
Is that how you see me?
I am flattered.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 09:29 AM

Repeating as yet unproven accusations is errant nonsense.

Blinkered turdbending monkeywaker

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 09:26 AM

Dave,
There is no counter argument to errant nonsense.

I suppose not, but I have just repeated accusations from within Labour by your fellow Party members.
How is that "errant nonsense?"

Obviously it is not. You just have no reply to it.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 08:50 AM

THIS IS THE EGO YOU ARE FEEDING DAVE
Time for us to roll and go
It's time for us to leave him
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 08:46 AM

There is no counter argument to errant nonsense.

Bollock brained snotgobbler

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 08:39 AM

Another vacuous, random post, and not one offers a counter argument because none of you have one.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 08:28 AM

Goat blowing dipshit

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 08:25 AM

Three more posts, and not one offers a counter argument because none of you have one.

I post hard facts, you lot just trivial abuse.

Lads, lads, lads. Just ignore him.

Yes. Scuttle back into hiding little mice.
The cat is back.

What a pathetic lot you are.
Oh dear oh dear.
Ha ha ha.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 07:06 AM

Not sure what to do for the best as I am no psychiatrist. Reasoning is impossible. The direct approach does not work. Abuse is water of a ducks back as I guess he must have become accustomed to it if he acts like he does here in real life. The inbred llama sucker has a real problem.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 06:47 AM

Leave him lads - this is no longer abour sexual impropriety - just about "Tories good- Labour bad"
Any moron who picks woman who MP who suddenly discovers she has been "bullied" in the past after she has been suspended for her own behaviour cannot be the brightest starfish in the sand-bucket
Let him live with his resentment that he was never invited to the Dolphin Square rape-ups
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 06:40 AM

Go and find yourself a nice rest home.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 06:34 AM

Filthy liar Jim,
Welcome back with your pervy support of the Prominent Perves Keith -

It is a vicious, nasty lie to say I have supported any kind of pervert.
I never have. You are just a vile and filthy liar.

If you are not, find a quote, liar.

Dave,

You know, I think he really believes that I take him seriously.

You do Dave.
You must because I have said nothing that has not been said by your fellow party members.
Your own political comrades Dave.
Do you not take them seriously?

What about Jim's whopping lies.
Do you take him seriously Dave?
You have not uttered a word of criticism, but you must know his claim of proven cases was a whopping lie, as are his false accusations against me.

Steve,
You're sick, Keith.

Just vacuous abuse Steve.
You have not, and can not, challenge anything I have said.
Can you Steve?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 06:07 AM

Lads, lads, lads. Just ignore him. Let him believe he is 'winning' something. Just think of it as care in the community.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 05:58 AM

You're sick, Keith.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 05:53 AM

Welcome back with your pervy support of the Prominent Perves Keith -
I sincerely hope your behaviour wil be treated with the contempt you have earned for it
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 05:52 AM

I see the great whinging wazzock is back.

Ignore him and he might go away. Though I doubt it somehow.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 20 Mar 18 - 05:40 AM

While the cat was away you all came out to play.

Dave,
The more you draw attention to the deceitful activities of this and previous governments, Jim, the more their sympathisers squeal

If you meant me Dave, you lie.
I have not sympathised with or defended anyone.

I have just repeated accusations made by party members, and pointed out Jim's whopping lie that there are proven cases of rape and paedophilia against Prime Ministers and othe government "high ups."

Was that not a whopping lie?
Anyone found a single example yet?

Meanwhile, female Labour Shadow Cabinet Minister Debbie Abrahams claims she has been the victim of a “bullying culture of the worst kind” from the party .

Meanwhile, another Labour shadow minister has been accused of “slapping” the buttocks of a female party member and making offensive sexual remarks about her. A witness told the Financial Times that those present were shocked to have seen Karl Turner, Labour’s transport spokesman, “slap” a woman’s backside as she walked through his constituency office in the summer of 2015.The witnesses have also alleged the MP for Hull East told the woman, who had had a double mastectomy, that she “shouldn’t have got rid of her real tits because they were great”.

Meanwhile, Labour has stepped up its investigations into two MPs accused of sexual harassment.
The cases of Ivan Lewis and Kelvin Hopkins have both been referred to an internal disciplinary committee.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Mar 18 - 09:26 AM

Lovely piece by The Flying Rodent. One particular line is, I believe, particularly relevant here.

Repeating Yourself Isn't The Same As Winning

Enjoy.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Mar 18 - 04:21 PM

:-D

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Mar 18 - 04:03 PM

"What's the point of rhetorical questions..?"
Why do you ask!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Mar 18 - 01:35 PM

What's the point of rhetorical questions..?

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Mar 18 - 01:33 PM

Rhetorical question Raggy!
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 12 Mar 18 - 12:38 PM

No, not at all, not one jot, not one iota.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Mar 18 - 10:54 AM

I agree entirely PFR - I've never suggested anybody should be banned because of extreme opinions - I welcome them, especially when they are rationally put
I draw a line at persistent abuse (we all do it sometimes but there is a limit), but even then the decision is with the moderators
Keith's problem is that there comes a point where he refuses to respond to what is being said and goes into his 'speaking clock' mode, repeating the statement over and over again as if nobody has responded - "stonewalling" in sporting terms
At that point, we need to move on if we are going to continue to share opinions and knowledge
Keith relies on this not happening - then he claims he has "won" something because - he claims - nobody can answer his points - it has always been a regular technique - and he is the only one to make these discussions a matter of win-lose
Then, and oly then will I suggest we stop responding to him - not because I disgree with him but because he then becomes an obstruction
Missing him already - aren't you!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Mar 18 - 10:46 AM

I don't agree. There are times when the whole reputation of the place comes under threat. If you indulge serial bigots and bullies that's precisely what happens.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 12 Mar 18 - 09:51 AM

"I have to say, I've come out of this thread knowing far more about our glorious leaders than when it started - even Buck House - who'd have thought it!!
Who says Keith has no uses?"

Jim - that's precisely why i object to bans and exclusions of our worst adversaries...
We need hardcore antagonists like tezza to keep us motivated in staying better informed, better equipped for fighting back...

If keith is all we have left, then mudcat is poorer for it...?????

[there are maybe 2 or 3 tezza understudies, who try hard, who have so far not been banned from BS, but they are just not in his league...]

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 Mar 18 - 08:08 PM

" sympathisers"
Is there more than one Dave?
Thought this was a one-mane SPP (Save the Prominent Pervs) campaign
I have to say, I've come out of this thread knowing far more about our glorious leaders than when it started - even Buck House - who'd have thought it!!
Who says Keith has no uses?
Jim Caarroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Mar 18 - 03:42 PM

The more you draw attention to the deceitful activities of this and previous governments, Jim, the more their sympathisers squeal. From the amount squealing that is going on I think you are hitting the mark.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Mar 18 - 04:58 AM

YOUR FRIENDS SEEM TO GET EVERYWHERE, DON'T THEY KEITH?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Mar 18 - 04:21 AM

More and more information you continue to ignore Keith - plenty more to go
You are an idiot without a grain of self-respect - I am happy that you continue to humiliate yourself in this way for as long as you feel the need to protect paedofiles because they are prominent politicians
Nice of you to draw attention to yourself on the Brexit thread - the more the merrier, I say
You really have reached sewer-level on this one
Great start to the day - thanks
"Strange, sad man."
I trust you were addressing yourself when you wrote this
At least the Government attempted to cover up their pervs
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Mar 18 - 04:21 AM

You know, I think he really believes that I take him seriously.

Bloated crap butler

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: DMcG
Date: 10 Mar 18 - 04:18 AM

Ok Keith - chat later.

But Tusk's statement did not contradict what I said in (a). And point (b) was more important as I said at the time (though 'significant' might have been a better word.)

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 10 Mar 18 - 03:58 AM

Jim,
I said have put up May's statement that there was possibly a cover-up over the Dolphin Square Paedofile ring

The police found nothing. Just two deluded or deranged people whose stories were shown to be fabrications.
The police had to apologise to the families of the dead and compensate everyone named still living.

Your whole case was just lies.

Dave,
Tossing wang bogle

Strange, sad man.

I am off line for a while.
A blessed relief if you found odds of only six against one too gruelling.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 08:15 PM

"Jim, you have never quoted May suggesting Heath was a paedo."
Now you are deliberately distorting what I said - is there no end to your lying to protect these monsters?
I said have put up May's statement that there was possibly a cover-up over the Dolphin Square Paedofile ring
I asked you to explain that immediately I put it up so you cannot possibly claim it slipped your notice
When a senior minister, especially one who is now Prime Minister, makes such a serious admission about her own Government you can bet she believes there has been a ******* cover-up
Want another missing file involving high-ups and paedophilia?
THERE YOU GO
One of the "missing" files involved a Government advisor you have already been linked to, PETER RIGHTON - SERIAL SEX OFFENDER
Righton'es name has also been linked to the Dolphin Square orgies - yet this particular scandal has nothing to do with that squalid rapefest - another entirely
THATCHER had already made sure none of this information got to the ears of the general public long before the files disappeared but some of the details escaped into the press
THIS IS THE MAN THATCHER PROTECTED
THIS is his own confession
GEOFFREY DICKENS SAW THE REPORT BEFORE IT "DISAPPEARED" and described it as "Explosive"
These are the obscene squalids you are defending - makes you a pervert, I reckon
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 03:51 PM

Tossing wang bogle

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 03:45 PM

Jim, you have never quoted May suggesting Heath was a paedo.

From your own quote,
"But the (police) Operation Conifer report will stop far short of alleging Heath was a paedophile and that will fuel critics who say the exercise is a ‘scandalous’ waste of public money that has besmirched Heath’s character."

Your claims about Dolphin Square were all bollocks. It never happened.
The police had to compensate all the suspects they named.

You lied about "Prime Ministers and Government high-ups."

You whole case was lies.
I did not lie.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 03:02 PM

JAy SUS
Whast a lying plonker
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 02:29 PM

Go fuck yourself Keith - you've had it twice - you know this as this is the first time yo have challenged it despite the fact that that I have asked for clarification numerous times
You always do this - ignore challenges then claim you haven't been challenged
"No. I do not defend anyone."
What!!!!!
You have had the records of these perves put up over and over again and you continue to defend them
Do not ever claim you don't tell lies - you no longer know what truth is
You really do need help
Go away - maybe there is a local paedo ring to keep you occupied = you seem to have embraced it big time
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 01:50 PM

Jim, did you mean this?
the present Prime Minister has suggested that his crimes were possibly covered up

I do not remember her suggesting any such thing.
Quote please.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 01:41 PM

Jim,
So you only defend "high ups"

No. I do not defend anyone.
I was just refuting your lie about "proven cases" of "rape and paedophilia" by "Prime Ministers and government high-ups."

You defend your lie by reporting the antics of some local councillor!

No word on Tessie May the fantasist then?

Huh?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 12:44 PM

Doesn't even know the difference between a Gnome and a Goblin.

Slimy turd captain.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 12:35 PM

... it's also interesting that public boarding school educated tory politicians
adapt so easily to life behind bars in prison........

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 11:31 AM

"Why would I? (He was a councillor. Hardly a "Government high-up"!
Whatea magnificent foot-in-mouth Keith - you really couldn't make it up
So you only defend "high ups"
Didn't doubt it for one minute
"You can not challenge a single word t"
are you joking again
No word on Tessie May the fantasist then?
Didn't doubt that one either
You have hade a one-man stand in defending these perverts and everybody has challanged you
You have not a single supporter here
Mabe it' a fantasists plot
Feckin' eejit
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 11:17 AM

Jim,
how long before Keith begins to defend it?

Why would I?
(He was a councillor. Hardly a "Goverment high-up"!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 11:11 AM

Dave,
Nothing you say will ever change that. Just do as I do and take the piss

Your weird nonsense just makes you irrelevant.

You can not challenge a single word that I have posted, so you are reduced to posting weird phrases, apparently against yoursel ("Goblin?".)
And it is your thread!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 11:08 AM

"Just do as I do and take the piss."
Much better to allow him to take the piss out of himself - and much more satisfying
HOW LONG BEFORE THIS IS PROVED THE WORK OF A FANTASIST? and how long before Keith begins to defend it??
Your starter for ten Keith!!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 11:04 AM

Let's see shall we Keith - what else would the Conservative Telegraph say?

They can not tell lies about the police or legal cases.
I also quoted BBC.

Your quote,
"But the Operation Conifer report will stop far short of alleging Heath was a paedophile and that will fuel critics who say the exercise is a ‘scandalous’ waste of public money that has besmirched Heath’s character."

So, no proven claim of rape or paedophilia against any Prime Minister or government high-ups as you falsely claimed, liar.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 10:57 AM

Jim, you should know by now.

Any dirt about the Tory party = Unproved allegations
Any unproved allegations about the Labour party = The party are rotten

Nothing you say will ever change that. Just do as I do and take the piss.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 10:37 AM

Let's see shall we Keith - what else would the Conservative Telegraph say?
It still does not make one single difference to the fact that, outside of Dolphin Square, each and every one of the people named are serial paedofiles - you have clung onto the Dolphin Square cover-up and ignored their records
I ask again - are THeresa May and the police who have admitted the possibility of a cover up conspiracy theorists - please answer ?
Now will do
You carefully did not ling your quote - you missed a bit
Reports have claimed that police are treating seriously seven of the 40 or so complainants who came forward and that those would have warranted interviewing Heath under caution - had he still been alive. Heath died in 2005 and cannot defend his reputation.
Chief Constable Mike Veale
Chief Constable Mike Veale
But the Operation Conifer report will stop far short of alleging Heath was a paedophile and that will fuel critics who say the exercise is a ‘scandalous’ waste of public money that has besmirched Heath’s character.
Wiltshire Police said: “The Operation Conifer summary closure report will be published on Thursday 5 October 2017. As per our position throughout this investigation, we will not be commenting on any operational detail until such time we publish our report.

“The operational security of the investigation and the anonymity of the people who have come forward remains of paramount importance to Wiltshire Police. It is for that reason that we strongly discourage any speculation concerning any investigation detail and/or outcome.”
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/09/24/fantasist-facing-charges-false-ted-heath-paedophile-claims/
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 09:38 AM

Telegraph,

September 2017 • 10:00pm
The only prosecution expected to arise from the £1.5 million investigation into Sir Edward Heath is of a fantasist accused of wasting police time.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 09:34 AM

Jim, it was all made up.
The police paid compensation to all those accused.
You have made a twat of yourself again.


BBC,
A man who alleged he was the victim of a VIP child abuse ring faces multiple charges relating to the possession of indecent images of children.
The man, known as Nick, claimed a paedophile ring was responsible for murdering three children.
He also said he was systematically abused and tortured by senior politicians and members of the armed forces during the 1970s and 80s.
The claims triggered the abandoned Met Police investigation Operation Midland.
Those he accused included former Conservative politicians Lord Brittan and Harvey Proctor, and Field Marshal Lord Bramall.
After the Met launched Operation Midland in 2014 they held a press conference where a senior detective described Nick's allegations as "credible and true".
In 2015, the Met carried out a series of high-profile dawn raids on the homes of those Nick had accused.
All of them denied his allegations and no evidence whatsoever was found to support Nick's claims.
After the £2.5m investigation was closed, without any charges, the Met apologised for the way they had conducted the inquiry and paid compensation.
A report into Operation Midland, carried out by a retired High Court judge, said the Met had made a series of errors in the investigation and made 25 recommendations on how police should handle similar allegations in the future.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42965637

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 09:19 AM

The Tories have always liked partying as long as nobody sees what they GET UP TO
PARTING AGAIN

Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 08:42 AM

Public schools and boy buggery... seems to be something of a classic traditional combination..

Public schools and the British elite establishment & Tory party...

hmmmmmmmmm.....!!!??????

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 08:34 AM

"Standard,
A man who claimed to be the victim of a VIP paedophile ring "
Your latest ploy seems to have underlined the possibility he was telling the truth in the first place Keith
Nice to see you'e backing down.
It is common and confirmed knowlege that victims of Paedophelia are qyuite likely to become prdators themselves if they feel the climes against them were not tealt with fairly
Some victims of clerical abuse have been found to have become abusers themselves
Paedophilic abuse destroys lives - this is what you are defending
Again your April 17th posting has been made invalid by statements mad over eight months later
Please answer this as honestly as you can - do you believe Theresa mMay to be the conspiracy theorist you have described her to be
Are the senior policeman who now says that Heath would possibly have been charged with juvenile rape had he lived the conspiracy theorists you have claimed they are
This has really blown up in your face
You started disgustingly enough by attempting to make that harassment and rape of women a political issue
Now you are defending the filth of British humanity
You certainly will regret all this in the future - right at the top of your CV - "An apologist for Paedofiles"
Happy days certainlt are here again
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 08:09 AM

Snotty brained turdburlar

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 07:27 AM

Standard,
A man who claimed to be the victim of a VIP paedophile ring has himself been charged with offences related to indecent images of children.
The accuser, known only as Nick, sparked the Met Police’s Operation Midland in 2015 after he told officers he had been abused for nine years.
He claimed the VIP ring raped, abused and even murdered young boys, with some of the abuse taking place in Dolphin Square, Westminster.


But the Met's £2.5 million investigation was abandoned in 2016 without a single arrest, despite police raiding the homes of prominent figures including Lord Bramall and the late ex-home secretary Lord Brittan.
After the operation was closed, the Met Police apologised to those who had been falsely accused and paid out compensation.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 07:21 AM

No - he linked him directly with Dolphin Square

Dolphin Square never happened.
Both accusers, Darren and Nick, were prosecuted.

Telegraph,
Robert Mendick, Chief Reporter
21 April 2017 • 2:27pm
A
‘fantasist’ who accused Lord Brittan of child sex abuse sparking a 12-month police investigation is now being prosecuted over false claims he was kidnapped and shot at.
The man was charged after making a series of hoax emergency phone calls to police alleging he was under attack on at least three different occasions from gun-toting gangs.
The accused, known as ‘Darren’ but whose real name cannot be disclosed for legal reasons, had previously claimed he had witnessed two murders committed by a VIP paedophile ring, prompting a police inquiry.

Lord Brittan, who was falsely accused of child sex abuse Credit: John Stillwell/PA
Darren falsely claimed Lord Brittan, the former Home Secretary, was part of the ring that abused children in a flat at Dolphin Square.
The investigation was closed in September 2015 after detectives could find no evidence to support the lurid claims.
But Darren went on to lodge a complaint with the Independent Police Complaints Commission (IPCC) that personal and sensitive details surrounding the case had been leaked to the media, including The Telegraph.
The watchdog launched an investigation into Detective Chief Inspector Paul Settle, the former head of the Metropolitan Police’s paedophile unit, which remains ongoing after more than 15 months - and despite the fact Darren has now been charged over the hoax calls.

DCI Paul Settle
A source said Darren had telephoned police on a number of occasions, claiming he had been kidnapped; attacked by gunmen; ambushed by an armed gang; and also shot at.
A friend of DCI Settle, an experienced detective who had warned against the 'baseless witch hunt' of VIPs such as Lord Brittan, told The Telegraph: “It is disgraceful that Paul Settle is under investigation by the IPCC when the police themselves have charged Darren with effectively being a fantasist for making hoax calls. It is utter madness.”

Harvey Proctor, a former Conservative MP whose life was destroyed after being falsely accused of being a member of the VIP paedophile gang, said: “It is utterly preposterous that Paul Settle is investigated over claims made by the man who has now been charged with being a fantasist.”
Darren had told detectives that he had been present at two possible murders – one of a 15-year-old girl at a flat in Dolphin Square used by senior politicians close to the Palace of Westminster and of a man with Down’s syndrome killed on a private estate in Suffolk with links to the Establishment.
He also alleged the man with Down’s syndrome was tortured to death on the estate when he was tied to two cars. “Both vehicles then slowly reversed and I heard a scream. I think he must have passed out because he made no more sound,” Darren told a now discredited news website Exaro in February 2015. His claims led to six people being interviewed by police under caution.

Dolphin Square
A Telegraph investigation in September 2015 showed how Darren was a deeply troubled witness, who had been jailed for two years in the 1990s for making hoax bomb calls and threats to neighbours. A judge accused him of telling “some pretty whopping lies” while Darren also falsely confessed to the murder of a prostitute in the midst of a high profile police manhunt.
Darren had a troubled youth and had been in foster care for about six months when he was abused by his foster carer. He subsequently won a claim for Government compensation as a victim of crime.

The abuse sparked a bout of heavy drinking that led to him calling police and confessing to crimes he did not commit including the murder of a prostitute in what was seen at the time as a possible 'cry for help’.
Darren’s now discredited allegations about the VIP paedophile gang helped to bolster claims by another apparent fantasist, who can be identified only as Nick, who claimed he had witnessed three other murders.
Nick is now under a separate police investigation for perverting the course of justice.
An IPCC spokesman said of the inquiry into DCI Settle as a result of allegations made by Darren: “The investigation is progressing well.”

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 07:10 AM

"normal mainstream views"
Muslim implants to rape children
Travellers are slaveholders
Irish children are all brainwashed
All Conservative politicians who rape children are victims of "conspiracy theories"
I knew Britain has swung to the right after Brexit but I didb't realiise it had swung quite so far
You live and learn
Mabe a conspiracy theorist for a Prime Minister and a Police force heirarchy has done more damage than I thought!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 06:27 AM

"Spare us more conspiracy theories."
We have a conspiracy theorist for a prim minister then - and a whole loasd of them among the top echelons of the British police force
Very worrying
"No he did not. He said he had affairs with adults."
No - he linked him directly with Dolphin Square
Stop telling lies to protect paedophiles
Keep this up much longer and we'll begin to think that....!!!
I'm grateful for your persisting with this - it's enabled me to reopen the criminal activities of your beloved leaders
Will dig around for some more when I have time
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 06:07 AM

Creepy Shit Dragon

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 06:01 AM

Agreed Pfr.
In the real world, I am just expressing normal mainstream views, but here the extremists dominate.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 05:28 AM

"And it has been six against one."

No... as may be indicative of a health condition which is cause for concern...

..it's rational sense and sanity versus one obstinate willfully perverse obsessive old man.....

If you count 6... that's only a minimum number that have even been bothered opening this thread and posting a response...!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 05:25 AM

Thwe cases were so obviously covered up by the Establishment,

Spare us more conspiracy theories.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 05:22 AM

So, no proven cases as you claimed.
Even the son of one of the accused had indicted his father as a sexual criminal

No he did not. He said he had affairs with adults.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 05:14 AM

Thwe cases were so obviously covered up by the Establishment, even to the point that the Prime Minister has admitted the possibility that as far as the rest of the world is concerned the evidence proves these crimes beyond any reasonable doubt
Even the son of one of the accused had indicted his father as a sexual criminal
If any further confirmation were needed, the disappearance of the report puts the lid on it.
You choose to ignore everything that has been put up by claiming they are MY lies
All this has been in order tp protect the reputation of prominent paedofiles
What kind of individual does that
If "proof" were important to you, you would not have politicised this affair in order to denigrate a party against which no proof existss - only unsubstantiated (so far) accusations
Go protect your paedos - it's all you are fit for
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Mar 18 - 04:33 AM

Jim, "Latest example" was true as were the others.
There are no "proven cases" as you falsely claimed.

And Keith continues to defend the countries most prominent paedofile

No. All I have done is expose some of your lies.

All I have done on this thread is to repeat what Labour people are saying. As Labour supporters you should be applauding me.
As liberals you should join their condemnation of mysogyny and sexual harassment.

And it has been six against one.

Now the thread instigator is reduced to posting weird insults to himself, while Jim claims some kind of victory! ("game set and match"
and "You've lost this one,"

Strange people.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 08:26 AM

"I have not lied."
Yeas you have - you never stop lying
Latest example -
"Yes, based on and now falsified."
TOu have been given examples of historical abuse, you have shown that "seven reliable witnesses" have accused him
You ave been given accounts of senior policemen saying there is a case to answer
You have been given a statement by the Prime Minister that the affair was hushed up
All this and you claim the accusations are based on "the testimony of a fantasist"
That is an obscene lie to defend a probable paedofile
On top of the Heath affair you have continued to defend every other squalid in this sordid bunch of squalids
"I have not lied."
Another lie - one posting ago
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 07:38 AM

Pompous Rectum Waffle

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 07:03 AM

I have not lied.
You have.

No "Prime Minister," Minister or other "Government High-Up" has a "proven" case of "rape" or "paedophilia" against them, as you falsely claimed, liar.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 06:56 AM

How many "proven cases" of your accusations against the Labour Party, by the way?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 06:54 AM

Oh dear Keith - you really have blown your concern for sexual criminality wide open, haven'y you?
Don't ring us - we won't ring you
Do we need to continue to encourage this saddo lads?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 06:26 AM

Idiotic prick goblin

Ha ha ha. At last we know who is being insulted.

Jim,
Not a tabloid claim Keith - a load of police reports

Yes, based on the testimony of a fantasist and now falsified.

Not one single proven case against any prime Minister or Government high-up as you falsely claimed Jim.
It was all bollocks.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 05:56 AM

Is there any truth in the rumour tat you are setting up an organsiation called P.O.P.P.L.E. (Protection of Prominent Paedofiles League")?
I hope all your good work is recognised for its contribution to society
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 05:17 AM

Idiotic prick goblin

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 05:17 AM

Incidentally
Yor link pre-dated three of mine - please try to keep up
Game, set and match
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 05:14 AM

Not a tabloid claim Keith - a load of police reports
You've lost this one, I'm afraid (not)
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 05:14 AM

Not a tabloid claim Keith - a load of police reports
You've lost this one, I'm afraid (not)
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 04:50 AM

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/feb/20/police-chief-hits-out-mail-on-sunday-edward-heath-abuse-claims

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 04:49 AM

Jim,
Guardian Feb 2017,
"Policing was rocked by the fallout from a Scotland Yard inquiry, Operation Midland, into claims establishment figures were involved in child sexual abuse in the 1970s and 1980s.
A report in November 2016 castigated the Metropolitan police for being duped by false claims from a complainant given the name “Nick”. In that case, police chiefs were among the last to realise their inquiry, which wrongly targeted establishment figures, was an error.
Heath died in 2005, aged 89, meaning there can be no trial, making the resolution of the allegations complicated. At the end of their investigation, police are planning a report assessing whether the evidence gathered would have been sufficient to charge him."

That was over a year ago, and no such assessment has been forthcoming.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 04:41 AM

Hairy arsed cockwomble.

Ha ha ha. You have become irrelevant.

Jim, your red quote is of a man saying his back bench MP dad had affairs.
Big deal. No hint of anything non-consensual or concerning children.

You claimed "proven cases" of "rape and paedophilia" by "Prime Ministers and Government high-ups."
That was a lie. There have been none.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Mar 18 - 04:06 AM

The message here appears to be that peadophelia, rape and sexual persecution isn't important if it is carried out by Tories
Tories have a history of their politicians being involved not just in harassment, but serious sex crimes (including possibly torture and murder) - their leadership has a history of hiding and destroying evidence (even the present Prime Minister has admitted that possibility - that's how possible it is)
And the Labour party have a "major problem£ because forty women have complained that Corbyn has "not done enough" to stop sexual harassment in Parliament -!!!!!
Theresa May has consistently supported sex pests until their behaviour has become impossible to excuse
In a way, she has opted out of taking action by suggesting teh victims go to the police
Often the harassment does not reach the level of illegality - you cannot be prosecuted for offering promotion for sex - she stood by Damien Green when he did exactly that
Such people should not hold high office (take your pick on whether that means those who persecute or thoe who defend the persecutor)
If a woman is sexually assaulted or raped the chances of bringing her attacked to justice are minuscule - that's why only a small percentage of women report sexual attacks
Sexual persecution in Parliament should be automatic grounds for dismissal - not passing the problem on to someone else.
And Keith continues to defend the countries most prominent paedofile even though the present Prime Minister has suggested that his crimes were possibly covered up and even though the evedence against him was "lost" by another Government minister, who was a known paedophile himself
Don'cha love the Tory sense of justice?
"It was all a hoax." (unlinked)
CREDIBLE
"HEATH A PAEDO"
"SEVEN CREDIBLE ALLEGED VICTIMS "
BOYS AS YOUNG AS TEN
Not according to the police enquiry last year Keith, but maybe they didn't know him as well as you do!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 03:06 PM

Hairy arsed cockwomble.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 03:04 PM

TOP TORY SAIS DOLPHIN SQARE EVIDENCE "EXPLOSIVE"
The Evidence disappears (You've had the link Keith
MIGHT HAVE BEEN COVER-UP, MAYFLY
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 01:58 PM

Was this the "fantasist you were talking about Keith?
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/jimmy-savile/10978492/My-father-was-a-sexual-predator-like-Jimmy-Savile-says-son-of-former-Tory-MP.html

"'My father was a sexual predator like Jimmy Savile’ says son of former Tory MP
The son of a Conservative MP has built up his own dossier on his father and a wider circle of friends
The son of a former Conservative MP has told The Telegraph he believes his father was a “prolific sexual predator” who he fears might have been linked to an alleged Westminster paedophile ring.
Anthony Atkinson suspects his father David Atkinson’s name may also have been included in a notorious dossier compiled by his fellow Conservative MP Geoffrey Dickens. The dossier, handed to the then Home Secretary Leon Brittan in the 1980s, has subsequently been lost or destroyed.
David Atkinson, according to his son, had a string of young lovers, among them a number of parliamentary assistants, with whom he conducted affairs behind the back of his wife and two children.
Justin Fashanu, the former professional footballer, who had grown up in a children’s home and subsequently committed suicide, had claimed to have had an affair with a married Conservative MP.
The MP is now thought to be Mr Atkinson. Letters from Mr Fashanu to Mr Atkinson, now in possession of his son, suggest the two men, although close, did not consummate their relationship.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 01:56 PM

Jim,
Ther Heath accusations have only just resurfaced

A senior police officer stood outside Heath's house on all the news broadcasts appealing for any victims to come forward.
None have yet been found. It was all a hoax.

Your claim was "proven" cases of rape and paedophilia by "Prime Ministers and Government high-ups."
There has not been one.

Dave,
Gammon Faced Shitfluke.

Do you think your behaviour makes you look good to anyone?

You clearly have nothing to contribute, but why show yourself up?

There are five people putting your case, and only me putting an alternative one, and you can't even cope with that.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 01:39 PM

"They are proven lies. The accuser was a deluded or deranged fantasist and is totally discredited."
No they are not Keith - they all predate Dolphin Square and are accusations of historical abuse
Apart from Dolphin Square, none of tehm have ever been challenged
Ther Heath accusations have only just resurfaced
At no time have any of those who were openly named in the Dolphin Square covered-up affair ever sought legal recompense from either the police or the papers that named them - never
That says what needs to be said
You are now blatantly lying in the face of given evidence
The more you dig into these affairs the more worms you expose
Prince Andrew?????
Certainly by association
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 01:23 PM

Gammon Faced Shitfluke.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 12:53 PM

Dave,
There is a huge difference between addressing a person and addressing the points. Addressing a person usually begins with the persons name.

No. I always name the person then quote their point that I am addressing.

Jim,
"There have been none."Are you claimign that the links I put up to Brittan, Proctor Heath and Boothby are lies then

They are proven lies. The accuser was a deluded or deranged fantasist and is totally discredited.

Steve,
My objection was clearly stated in my post, arse.

You identified no error in my statement, and could not because it was factual.
You also resort to infantile name calling, having nothing better to say.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 12:46 PM

SIXTEEN DEAD CHILDREN?
Your worst nightmare Keith!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 12:42 PM

LYING POLICE OR LYING POLITICIAND AND LYING KEITH?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 12:32 PM

Tops the moron by a mile - don'cha think
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 12:26 PM

That was an oxy too much, Jim ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 12:14 PM

My objection was clearly stated in my post, arse. Don't try to play games with me, please.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 11:21 AM

Jackaroo, I have not claimed any victory.
I thought we were just exchanging views. I am sorry if you feel defeated.
An oxymoron
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 11:01 AM

Another "innocent" Dolphin Square visitor who escaped justice
"PROLIFIC SEXUAL PREDATOR" SAYS SON
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 11:01 AM

Another "innocent" Dolphin Square visitor who escaped justice
"PROLIFIC SEXUAL PREDATOR" SAYS SON
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 10:50 AM

"There have been none."Are you claimign that the links I put up to Brittan, Proctor Heath and Boothby are lies then
If so, say so,
If not, withdraw your accusation and apologise
Brittan was probably responsible for 'disappearing the paedophelia research report
All those who were named and were let off the hook after Dolphin Square were proven predators beforehand - that is wy it is obvious that accusing one of the victims of being a fantasist was a cover-up
Odd that a "fastisisst' should select actual paedophiles to "fantasize"
What you are doing here is trying to make a case for attacking Labour whicle at the same time defending high-up actual sexual criminality
Now - Heath?, Proctor?, Boothby, Napier?, Morrison?, Hayman? Brittan? - were the links all lies
If they are not, then you are
A REMINDER - MORE TO COME
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 10:48 AM

There is a huge difference between addressing a person and addressing the points. Addressing a person usually begins with the persons name. Addressing the points does not. Unless we are speaking a different language...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 10:44 AM

You have continued addressing me long after I have asked you to stop.

I have addressed the points you made.
If you do not want them addressed, PM them to whoever it is you do want to read them.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 10:38 AM

All I have done is expressed my views without abusing anyone.
You clearly disagree with them, but that is no excuse for this nastiness and childish name calling.

You haven't. You have continued addressing me long after I have asked you to stop. That is a perfectly good excuse for the responses you get. When will you get it?

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 10:32 AM

Jim,
Once again you have accused me of lying
"You have to resort to blatant lying to make a case."

Yes.
You said, "proven acts (paedophelia and rape) by Government high ups and Prime ministers."

There have been none.
It was a lie Jim.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 10:29 AM

Dave,
as well as a weasel with worm like tendencies

All I have done is expressed my views without abusing anyone.
You clearly disagree with them, but that is no excuse for this nastiness and childish name calling.

Steve,
"Jews in other parties had no issue with their own parties but joined the condemnation of Labour anti-Semitism..."
You really, really can't see it, can you, Keith?

I can't see anything wrong with that statement of fact.
What is your objection Steve?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 10:25 AM

"He was a Liberal. Never even close to government."
Smith was an MBE and a Member of Parliament - Hounoured by Britain, as was Savile and Harris - how close can you get to the Establishment?
Once again you have accused me of lying
"You have to resort to blatant lying to make a case."
and I have provided the evidence for what I stated
You now respond with excuses for Pedophilia and the rapists and sexual predators who carried it out
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 09:58 AM

"Jews in other parties had no issue with their own parties but joined the condemnation of Labour anti-Semitism..."

You really, really can't see it, can you, Keith? And what this remark also reveals is that you are completely unable to address the point well made by pfr at 07.17 am and ably supported by Jack and Dave. It's a poor do, Keith. From the leafy subururbs of Tory Hertford you are fighting a one-man anti-Labour campaign on Mudcat and nothing but nothing is going to get those blinkers off you.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 09:33 AM

I know many people don't have much truck with the Sun (myself being one of them). However it is a Tory supporting publication so I was somewhat surprised to find the following which was updated on the 8th February this year. I believe it may have been published earlier.


Tory impropriety

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 08:48 AM

Cousin Dave: "See what I mean Jackaroodave? I think your analysis is right. Don't rise to the bait."

If someone wants to come in here embarrassing himself with that weak stuff, it's not my problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 08:39 AM

See what I mean Jackaroodave? I think your analysis is right. Don't rise to the bait.

Fine Keith. You cannot take the hint that I do not want you to address me again. You will not take a direct request to fuck off and stop mithering me. Feel free to carry on proving yourself to be completely unempathetic as well as a weasel with worm like tendencies. If that is the impression you want to give it is no skin off my nose.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 08:37 AM

Keith - if as it seems you have too much free time to occupy yourslf...
why not give the aggro down here in BS a rest,
and instead come upstairs to Music
to unwind and relax with like minded folkie mates for a while...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 08:28 AM

Jackaroo, I have not claimed any victory.
I thought we were just exchanging views. I am sorry if you feel defeated.

Dave TG,
We said the same about the antisemitism claims

Yes. Labour Party Jews complained about anti-Semitism within the party.
Jews in other parties had no issue with their own parties but joined the condemnation of Labour anti-Semitism.
Your case was that did not mean Labour had a particular problem, even though the leadership admitted that it did.

Also Dave, we are all free to address anyone on the forum.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 08:04 AM

TWO excellent posts!

I do think that Keith's strategy is to pursue such a blatantly wrong-headed approach that one of us loses it from sheer exasperation and then to claim victory on a foul.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 07:53 AM

An excellent post PFR. We said the same about the antisemitism claims. In a party where questioning the leadership and making yourself heard is encouraged there will always be this type of protest. In a party where the 'traditional values' of misogyny, racism and class divides prevail it is likely that people will keep their heads below the parapet.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 07:46 AM

btw "That is why I think Labour has a problem"

Well no surprises you are [deliberately..???] misconstruing circustantial evidence
and diseminating untruths about labour yet again..

Far from having a 'particular problem', labour is actually leading the way in addressing problems of abuse in society;
even to the extent of pre-empting remedying any that may or may not exist with labour itself...
Sending out warning signals to any who may think they can join labour and take advantage of it's weaker members...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 07:17 AM

"40+ Labour women MPs write to their leader begging him to do something about it.
A new grassroots movement within Labour to highlight the problem and to fight against it.
Nothing comparable coming from any other party.
That is why I think Labour has a particular problem."

Somone needs to grasp the quite simple basic truth that the kind of women/feminists who are attracted to the labour party
tend to be far more questioning, militant, and argumentative
than in all other mainstream parties...

Of course they will be more demanding and awkward for labour leaders to deal with...

This is good healthy open democratic relationship between grassroots members and leaders..

But unfortunately this does not play too well in tory owned press and media,
desperate to exploit anything they can spin as labour disharmony and division...

Though Keith already well knows this..

No one of his age and intelligence can be that politically naive or dense...????

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 06:43 AM

Keith, when I want your opinion I will ask for it.

Again, no-one needs permission from you to post an opinion.

You don't. Addressing me when I have specifically said I do not want you to is harassment though and you need to stop.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 06:30 AM

Dave TG,
Keith, when I want your opinion I will ask for it.

Again, no-one needs permission from you to post an opinion.

Both Daves,
There has been an outcry from Labour women about misogyny and the abuse of women within the party by party members.

40+ Labour women MPs write to their leader begging him to do something about it.
A new grassroots movement within Labour to highlight the problem and to fight against it.
Nothing comparable coming from any other party.
That is why I think Labour has a particular problem.

Because so many members say so.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 05:49 AM

Keith: "Both Daves, your premise that despite having the same serious problem that Labour women are vocally rebelling against, the feisty women from parties like SNP and Tories are just lying back and thinking of England is laughable."

That is pretty funny, Keith. ;-)

By "feisty women" you mean people like Kemi Badenoch ? When a party trots out its rising star to push back against actual and potential claims of harassment, well, that's pretty much a give-away.

"The idea is ludicrous, I do not believe it,"

Of course you don't, Keith. You have exhaustively documented your inability to understand the phenomenon.

"and it would be laughed out of court."

Court? I'm happy to refer the verdict to the unfolding of events.

Anyway, I guess we're done: Take your self-awarded victory lap.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 05:23 AM

Maybe tory women are still being raised to lie back and think of England,
and not jeopadize their options of catching a rich husband...???????


or for the more progressive moden ambitious tory women:

lie back and think of England,
and not jeopadize their options of winning a well salaried influential job in high position...???????

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 05:14 AM

A good indication of why women in the Tory party are not as forthcoming as others.

A veteran Tory MP has allegedly blamed female journalists for the Westminster sex scandal and described victims of sexual harassment as “wilting flowers”.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 05:04 AM

Keith, when I want your opinion I will ask for it. Until then there is no point discussing anything with you.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 04:57 AM

Jim,
"The disgusting monster Cyril Smith alone has been revealed to have abused children or raped anyone."
I quite agree - I pointed out he did

You agree that he alone abused kids or raped.
He was a Liberal. Never even close to government.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 04:53 AM

Dave, I do not need your permission to post an opinion here, and resorting to personal abuse shows you have no case.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 04:48 AM

You have all the details of Government linked criminal sex offenders
You are the one who is lying unless you are clainignthat
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 11:31 AM
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 12:38 PM
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 01:37 PM
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 01:44 PM
Are all lies
Is that your point

These are not jeust pests - they are criminals who have been protected by the Govenment
"The disgusting monster Cyril Smith alone has been revealed to have abused children or raped anyone."
I quite agree - I pointed out he did
What's your point?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 04:45 AM

Keith, when I want your opinion I will ask for it. Until then there is no point discussing anything with you.

Jackaroodave. I really do recommend that you do not get involved with this person. he is the classic example of a sociopath.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 04:39 AM

Both Daves, your premise that despite having the same serious problem that Labour women are vocally rebelling against, the feisty women from parties like SNP and Tories are just lying back and thinking of England is laughable.

The idea is ludicrous, I do not believe it, and it would be laughed out of court.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Mar 18 - 04:33 AM

Jim,
No comments on the cover up paedos Keith?

It is too ludicrous Jim. The disgusting monster Cyril Smith alone has been revealed to have abused children or raped anyone.

proven acts (paedophelia and rape) by Government high ups and Prime ministers

You have to resort to blatant lying to make a case.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 04:35 PM

Don't fall for it Jackaroodave. You will find the hoops you need to jump through will get lifted higher and higher until they reach a point where you will Not reach, at which point you 'lose'. Please don't let me try to influence you on decisions that are yours alone but, so far, you have had your feet firmly on the ground. Keep them there and you will not trip up. Keep your arguments rooted firmly in the logic you have shown so far and try not to lose your temper. It will be difficult at times but it will be worthwhile.

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 02:30 PM

Keith: "What a very silly comparison.
Uk politicians whatever their party have rather more in common."

I stand corrected and abashed. Let me amend that to accord with your cogent observation:

"Yeah, nothing from within The Official Raving Monster Loony Party, either"

As far as I know. I'm willing to take your correction here as well, Keith.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 02:17 PM

No comments on the cover up paedos Keith?
Thought not
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 01:58 PM

jackaroo.
Yeah, nothing from within the Taliban yet either

What a very silly comparison.
Uk politicians whatever their party have rather more in common.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 01:44 PM

WESTMINSTER PAEDOPHILE DOSSIER LOST !!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 01:37 PM

Another "innocent" Dolphin Square accused
CHARLES NAPIER - SERIAL SEX OFFENDER
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 01:00 PM

Not stealing at all Jackaroodave. Hopefully by putting the same points in different ways the meaning will eventually get through. I'll not hold my breath though :-(

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 12:38 PM

More names of Dolphin Square accused cover-up
PETER HAYMAN - SERIAL SEX OFFENDER
CYRIL SMITH - SERIAL SEX OFFENDER
PETER MORRISON _ SERIAL SEX OFFENDER (Covered up by MI5)

More to come
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 11:45 AM

As the their party attempts to put its own house in order, women Tory luminaries are making the habitual defenses when women speak out about sexual harassment: Puritanism run amok, nothing is fun any more, etc.

I'm shocked, shock . . . . zzzzzzzz.

Rising Star

Old Stager

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 11:31 AM

"Those stories turned out to be one deluded man's fantasies."
n obvious cover-up Keith - two of the main contenders were serial sex offenders

HARVEY PROCTOR
LEON BRITTAN
Two more
EDWARD HEATH
LORD BOOTHBY

Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 11:25 AM

Dave: "I made that point earlier to no avail, Jackaroodave. Following the logic . . . , Saudi Arabia must be a veritable paradise for women and Jews. Never any complaints about misogyny or antisemitism from them... ;-)"

I only steal from the best, Dave. <\(:-) (tip of the hat)

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 11:03 AM

Yeah, nothing from within the Taliban yet either.

I made that point earlier to no avail, Jackaroodave. Following the logic that fewer complaints means there are fewer things to complain about then Saudi Arabia must be a veritable paradise for women and Jews. Never any complaints about misogyny or antisemitism from them... ;-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 10:59 AM

Keith: "Jackaroo,
'By denying that women will keep quiet about abuse and rape,'
I do not. I know they do, but there is no reason to suppose women from any one party are more or less likely too."

Oh, bushwa, Keith. This is me you're talking to, not Little Ned in the Third Reader.

"The complaints are overwhelmingly from within Labour, about Labour."

Yeah, nothing from within the Taliban yet either.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 10:25 AM

Jim,
Sorry - forgot, Heath Brittan and the Dolphin Sqaure crowd wre all secreltly paid-up members of the Labour Party, weren't they?

Those stories turned out to be one deluded man's fantasies.
No truth was found in any of it and he has been charged for the hoax.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/04/21/child-sex-abuse-fantasistis-charged-hoax-claims-kidnapped-held/

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 10:22 AM

Keith - of course you noticed more complaints from within labour....

Labour are all a rabble of effin bolshy militant lefty complainers, moaners, and whingers... stands to reason innit...!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 10:16 AM

"I do not remember doing that Jim,
There you go again
"and they do not exist anyway."
Sorry - forgot, Heath Brittan and the Dolphin Sqaure crowd wre all secreltly paid-up members of the Labour Party, weren't they?
Braindeads of the world unite!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 10:06 AM

Jim,
Keith has now reached the stage of openly defending Top Government paedophiles and rapists

I do not remember doing that Jim, and they do not exist anyway.

Jackaroo,
By denying that women will keep quiet about abuse and rape,

I do not.
I know they do, but there is no reason to suppose women from any one party are more or less likely too.

The complaints are overwhelmingly from within Labour, about Labour.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 09:40 AM

Keith:"I answered your point at the time and again when Dave referred to it. The circumstances of female Labour and Tory politicians are very similar and I would like to know why one should be less likely to complain than the other."

Yes, Keith, they are certainly similar with respect to conditions that make sexual harassment of women likely to occur and unlikely to be reported. They differ in two aspects that most voters think is important: their politics and their membership.

I have to say that when your supporting claim is even less probable than the thesis it supports, your argument is in trouble. No offense, but I just want to grab you by the shoulders, shake you, and holler, "Wake up and look! Look about you!"

You just don't understand how momentous and novel this movement is, or how difficult it has been hitherto for women victims to seek justice. Two years ago there wasn't a Labour Too or Me Too movement ANYWHERE. The most a sapient defender of Tory Exceptionalism can say is, "There isn't a 'Tory Too' movement . . . . yet."

Let's consider three US examples of accused abusers who were nationally famous for decades before their victims risked public scrutiny:

When the Harvey Weinstein scandal hit, there were posts on this very forum that said, basically, "Hey, it's Hollywood, bimbos trading sex who didn't get what they bargained for. We all know how that works, nothing new to see here, let's move on." Then, crablouie, it all blew up in our faces.

Roy Moore, the "10 Commandments Judge," was (barely) defeated in his Alabama senatorial campaign when Leigh Corfman accused him of molesting her when she was 14 years old in 1979 (!) and was echoed by Beverly Young Nelson (16 in 1977 or 78), and Tina Johnson (28 in 1991). A majority of Republican voters still voted for Moore, some stating outright they'd rather be represented by a child molester than a Democrat. Some Republican office holders repudiated Moore, others, including our president, supported him. Had Nelson and Johnson not chimed in to show a pattern, Moore would probably be in the Senate today.

Just in the news the other day, the prosecutor of Bill Cosby, beloved comedian and accused serial rapist, has petitioned the judge in Cosby's re-trial to admit testimony from 19 women among the 60 who claim Cosby raped or molested them in incidents dating back to 1965. These women are unable to bring Cosby to the bar themselves because the statute of limitations on rape had expired by the time they were emboldened enough to speak out against this public icon. Even now, it looks as if there may be no justice for them.

In the light of these examples, I'll just reiterate what I said before, and you are welcome to do the same. "By denying that women will keep quiet about abuse and rape, you simply disqualify yourself from discussing the phenomenon."

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 08:27 AM

Moving on still, as Keith has now reached the stage of openly defending Top Government paedophiles and rapists
Sex has now entered Irish politics again from a different direction
Having wone his case against teh police department, whistle-blower and honest policeman Maurice McCabe is now describing to an enquiry how the Police Authorities instigated hundreds of text messages accusing him of sexually abusing his own children - the orders came from the top
Handy thing sex - if you know how to use it!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 07:09 AM

Here's a very practical idea..

Whenever an individual voluntarily puts his/her name forward for election as a Tory MP...

...arrest them immediately.

They've already narrowed themselves down as persons of interest in unreported or unsolved sex and/or corruption crimes,
thus saving valuable police time and expensive investigations....

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 06:50 AM

Jim,
proven acts (paedophelia and rape) by Government high ups and Prime ministers

Seriously Jim?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 05:34 AM

Now you are openly supporting paedophelia and rape with your silence on proven acts by Government high ups and Prime ministers
Puts your concern for women and children squarely where it belongs
Pity you can't throw in s fw million Muslims, Irish children and Travellers while you're at it
Have a good prey - d'you hear now!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 05:25 AM

Ha, ha, ha.
That encapsulates your contribution to debate on this forum.
Playground abuse and naughty name calling.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 05:04 AM

Only one thing remains to be said I suppose :-)

Fuck off Keith

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 04:49 AM

The sails are furled and my work is done,
Leave her Johnnie...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 04:33 AM

Leave him feller's leave him
Pretend your singing shanties
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 04:29 AM

Dave,
Only because we stopped you. You had a good try.

I did not. you are making shit up now.

Jacjaroo, I answered your point at the time and again when Dave referred to it.

The circumstances of female Labour and Tory politicians are very similar and I would like to know why one should be less likely to complain than the other.

Rag, Dave made this thread about "impropriety," but who cares about impropriety.

Your dossier lists people for indulging in gay group sex and shenanigans with secretaries, and it lists women.
I care about abuse of women and all forms of misogyny.

If it is consensual it is nobody's business but theirs and I don't care if you call it "impropriety."


All of you, forgetting "impropriety," on misogyny and the abuse of women there has been an outcry from within Labour about just that.

40+ women MPs write to their leader begging him to do something about it.
A new grassroots movement within Labour to highlight the problem and to fight against it.
Nothing comparable coming from any other party.
That is why I think Labour has a particular problem.
Because so many members say so.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 04:06 AM

Well said, Jim.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 03:56 AM

Maybe it's time to widen this whole issue and leave our tame Establishment cap-doffer to wallow in his swill
Sexual predation is an aspect of an unequal society, the privileged and powerful preying on the weak and dependent
It first surfaced big-time with the clerical abuse scandals, covered up by the church heirarchy
Then came the Knight of the realm, Sir Jimmy Savile and CBE holder, Rolf Harris revelations, when leading entertainers with access to children and teenagers, were found to be abusing them
Then Cinema and theatre people
Now politicians
The latter has involved those at the top of the tree - even a PRIME MINISTER
All these have been covered up by hose at the top - the heirarchy of the church knew what was happening - some of them were involved.
The media moguls were aware of Savile's behaviour and did nothing to stop him
The 'casting couch' was a running joke in the film industry.
Now, it transpires, Parliamentary privilege was taken for granted as 'boys being boys'
Recently charities and sporting organisations have been brought to public notice
As far as I am concerned, all these are aspects of a rotten system running down
About ******* time (pardon the pun)
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 03:44 AM

Keith: "What have I left unanswered please?"

Urm . . . . the rebuttal of your major premise?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Mar 18 - 02:43 AM

I have not intimated that

Only because we stopped you. You had a good try.

You have not answered the point that there is no special reason why Tory women, say, would keep silent and Labour not.

I did. I agreed with Jackaroodave's analysis.

No more hoops. You have failed to convince anyone that Labour is the party of sexual abuse just as you failed with your antisemitism ploy. About time you stopped digging.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:50 PM

I wasn't going to go here, but I feel that Keith has left us no alternative
THE CONSERVATIVES AT PLAY
HOW THE TORIES DEAL WITH SEX CRIMES
HOW THE TORIES DEAL WITH SEX CRIMES
CONFIRMED AGAIN
2017
2017 AGAIN
£^ sSEX PESTS - "AH< BUT HAVE THEY BREAVCHED MINISTERIAL CODE"
CONFIRMED BY TORY MOUTHPIECE

Perhaps now you will respond to the fact that Labour will have to run to catch up with your party in the Sex pest stakes Keith
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:00 PM

Point very well made. But we're only human...

Sarcasm is as good a way as any of dealing with 'em. Out-and-out dishonesty though, if not confronted, can bring Mudcat into disrepute.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 06:47 PM

My mother has dementia - we are so glad she never learned how to use a computer or the internet.

My sister who passed away several years back,
had mental health problems, was a manipulative self obsessive martyr,
and as far as I could tell, unhealthily out of control on the internet.
If she were still alive, who knows what serious problems she would now be causing on social networks
for anyone who she took a petty dislike to....???

I say this because of my own experience with problematic folks close to me;
my awarenes of mudcat's aging members,
and concern for the well being of certain difficult individuals....

...it's best to not get drawn into pointless conflict with them.
but also not helpful to respond by being hostile and insulting when they exasperate and antagonise us....

.. but i'm no angel.. so occasional sarcasm is ok when fed up reading their nonsense...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 06:05 PM

"None of it has come from me."

We'd like even less than that from now on, please.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 05:22 PM

I realise that MOST people on this forum are of a reasonable intelligence.

How is it that one person can deny that "37 Conservative MP's are the subjects of allegations of sexual impropriety and 4 Labour MP's are subject to the same scrutiny"

That is FACT.

I have said before, recently, that I think this individual is suffering from advancing dementia, his continued behaviour only serves to reinforce this opinion.

Can I suggest that in order to maintain I modicum of reasoned debate we nod kindly and say, yes, yes and basically do not reply to his rambling.

Perhaps it would be kinder, although I am not, personally, inclined to be.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 05:15 PM

Jim,
Enough Keith - you've vomited yourt hate enough

I have expressed none.
I have only repeated what Labour members are saying about their own party, both on anti-Semitism and misogyny.
None of it has come from me.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 04:54 PM

Rag,
details of complaints he claims have been made within the Labour Party in recent years.

See the letter from over 40 Labour women MPs and the Labour Too report. Both recent.
Plenty there.

Dave.
intimating that only the Labour party suffer from this flaw.
I have not intimated that, and we are all aware of issues in other parties.

You have still not addressed Jackaroodaves excellent points nor my point that if a lack of complaints indicates a lack of anything to complain about does that mean that Women's rights are upheld to a higher standard in countries where the complaints are fewest?

Yes I have.
It is circumstances that lead to womens' silence on this.
They do not differ between the parties.
You have not answered the point that there is no special reason why Tory women, say, would keep silent and Labour not.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 03:27 PM

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-33785352
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mi5-helped-margaret-thatcher-cover-6120006
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 02:52 PM

You are not going to stop are you Keiuth?
You failed at Antisemitiusm
All your article mentions and more have been done by tories - and they were let off
A Tory aid was accused of raping a drunken women - he got off because the defence did not reaveal the wonam's records and she went to the press - he probably raped her - she was drunk so she was "taken advantage of" - he escaped justice on a technicality
"describes being molested in a hotel room by a drunk senior party official"
Happenes regularly in all parties
" lewd comments and sexist attitudes. "
Like the tory who sent his secretary for sex toys and refers to her as "sweet tits"
"a man was harassing me and wouldn’t leave me alone,"
You defeded Damien Green fro doing just this - he offered promotion for sex
Every single example you have dredged up has been happening in Parliament from time immemorial
Tory ministers, top Civil servants and members of the house of Lords were accused of regular orgies involving children at Dolphin Square
EVEN A PRIME MINISTER
UNINVESTGATED CLAIMS
MORE
,font color=red>Later during PMQs May was asked by Labour backbencher Lisa Nandy about concerns that the Conservative whips’ office had stockpiled reports of potentially criminal behaviour by MPs to pressure them into loyalty.

“Can I say to her that three years ago I brought evidence to her in this house that whips had used information about sexual abuse to demand loyalty from MPs,” Nandy said.

“I brought this information to her in this house and I warned her at the time that unless real action was taken we risked repeating those injustices again today. On three occasions I asked her to act and on three occasions she did not.”

Nandy was referring to claims made by a former Tory whip in the 1990s that during the early 1970s the Edward Heath government covered up scandals involving child abuse to pressure MPs.

May replied: “I will say to her that I am very clear that the whips’ office – I hope this goes for all whips’ offices across this house – should make clear to people that where there are any sexual abuse allegations that could be of a criminal nature, people should go to the police.”
Enough Keith - you've vomited yourt hate enough
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 02:47 PM

Someone has always been self pleasuring PFR. The phrase I used was 'wanker' :-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 02:05 PM

is this thread starting to get a bit too steamy...???

Someone's prurient preocupation with the reported details of women's complaints of abuse,
is possibly verging on the self pleasuring....???????

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 02:00 PM

Keith. You only accept that the whole political spectrum have an issue with abuse because we have spent the last few days hammering that fact into you. Had we have not done so we would have been left with your misleading statement "other parties do not have such a problem" intimating that only the Labour party suffer from this flaw. You tried your best to say that you never intended to say that in the first place but this thread, and your past history, indicates to anyone who can read that your credibility is non existent. Little wonder that you defend the alt-truth mongers like Farage when you model yourself on them.

You have still not addressed Jackaroodaves excellent points nor my point that if a lack of complaints indicates a lack of anything to complain about does that mean that Women's rights are upheld to a higher standard in countries where the complaints are fewest?

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 01:46 PM

I wonder if the idiot would care to let the rest of us have details of complaints he claims have been made within the Labour Party in recent years.

I would suggest that he if tries to do so he will fail so I expect a wall of silence of this one.

Should he try to go back decades I will start with the allegations regarding what I am sure will be one of his heroes. None other than Winston Spencer Churchill who it would seem couldn't keep his pecker in his trousers.

Oh how the mighty have fallen.

PS I've got a funeral tomorrow so won't be around. Although I WILL respond to any lies if I can. If not I'm sure I can rely on others here.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 01:44 PM

Rag, New Statesman last week.

When the “Pestminster” scandal hit British politics last October, a group of Labour women set up their own campaign, called LabourToo. The aim was to collect Labour women’s experiences of sexual harassment and abuse in the hope of alerting the party leadership to a problem that had been ignored for too long.

At least four MPs are accused of misconduct – including inappropriate touching, propositioning, trying to take advantage of a drunk teenager, and ignoring a rape complaint.
The report, entitled “#LabourToo: Women’s experiences of sexual harassment, abuse and discrimination in the Labour Party”, tells 43 anonymised stories by party staffers, activists, politicians and candidates at both a national and local level, including reports of rape, groping, lewd comments and sexist attitudes.
One story recounts a rape during the party’s annual conference. “I was raped at [party conference], a man was harassing me and wouldn’t leave me alone,” reads the testimony. “I am no longer a member of the party and this at least in part played a role. I told my region and an MP I trusted. No-one cared.”


Another similar account from a party conference describes being molested in a hotel room by a drunk senior party official. “He pushed me down onto the bed and started to kiss and grope me,” the writer recalls. “I told him no and to stop but he ignored it.”
There are also reports on a local level, with one woman being groped by a “councillor who was very well-known to senior figures in the local Labour Party for being a serial groper of women” while out canvassing: “He would come up behind me and put a hand on my hips or round my waist when feeding back the data, and would always want to put ‘vote Labour’ stickers on women in a way that meant he could touch their breasts.”
Although more than 43 accounts were submitted to the group, some had to be left out for naming perpetrators or for fear of identifying the writer – LabourToo, including its organisers, are anonymous. Its main aim is not to shame the party, but to achieve structural change.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 01:25 PM

ding dong..... sanity calling....

Not content with dead pig heads, those depraved over privileged tories are fucking the entire nation...!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 01:20 PM

Rag,
Those figures are not comparable.
There are more than 4 complaints against Labour MPs over recent years.

The figure 37 is from a dossier about Tory MPs only.
There was no comparable survey to make comparisons with other parties.

No objective comparison has been made by anyone.
There is much more recent research available. Consider that reported to Parliament by Andrea Leadsome which you claimed knowledge of.

I mistakenly thought your 6 month old dossier was the same one.
It is not and your old one has been forgotten by everyone.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 01:11 PM

Jim, what has the number of Labour members got to do with it?

"45 female Labour MPs write to Jeremy Corbyn demanding he does more to stop 'disgusting' abuse from supporters"

"JEREMY CORBYN HAS BEEN ACCUSED BY NEARLY HALF THE FEMALE MPS IN HIS PARTY OF FAILING TO STOP THE "DISGUSTING AND TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE" ABUSE OF WOMEN BY HIS SUPPORTERS."

That is the unvarnished truth and an indisputable fact. Both ways of putting it.

Please keep posting them in huge red capitals.

You are refusing to respond to any other point made

Put them up one at a time and I will.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 01:04 PM

"Let him go, let him go, God help him
Whatever he may be"
Somewhat apposite, given the subject of the song!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 12:41 PM

Gentlemen, I have suggested that he is suffering from some form of dementia and each day the evidence grows stronger.

All I have done today is to use the same report (albeit from a different source) to quote his own figures back to him. I would like to note this fact.

HIS figures are the same as mine which indicate 37 Conservative MP's are the subjects of allegations of sexual impropriety and 4 Labour MP's are subject to the same scrutiny.

Given the numbers of MP's for each party this indicates clearly, unequivitably and without question that more than 1 in 10 Conservative MP's are subject to scrutiny while less than 1 in 60 Labour MP's are so listed.

I cannot speak for anyone else but this would indicate to me that the Conservatives have a much deeper, and posssibly rooted, problem to deal with. Let us hope for the victims of this abuse they succeed in weeding the offenders out.

You will have noticed no doubt that once again someone is trying the move the goalpost. No change there.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 12:29 PM

"It is the truth and thanks for highlighting it again."
For Christs sake Keith The Labour Party had tens of thousands of women members - your own link from the Telegraph mentions a letter by forty five members
Vfont color=red>"45 female Labour MPs write to Jeremy Corbyn demanding he does more to stop 'disgusting' abuse from supporters"
You were asked whether they had a petition to get the opinion of the rest of the membership so you are fully aware of this
You really are insane
You are refusing to respond to any other point made - you continue to use raped and persecuted women to score political points
You are depraved
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 12:17 PM

Jim,,
"JEREMY CORBYN HAS BEEN ACCUSED BY NEARLY HALF THE FEMALE MPS IN HIS PARTY OF FAILING TO STOP THE "DISGUSTING AND TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE" ABUSE OF WOMEN BY HIS SUPPORTERS."
That was a lie

It is the truth and thanks for highlighting it again.
It is the opening sentence of this article.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/22/45-female-labour-mps-write-to-jeremy-corbyn-demanding-he-does-mo/

Rag, your dossier was only on Tory MPs and there is no comparable survey on other parties to compare it with.
The 4 Labour MPs mentioned were unconnected.

Dave,
Well, I don't recall you ever having said that the Tories had the same problem.

1st March
"I had read your Indie piece thanks, and also a Guardian article.
Neither contradict anything I said."

Those pieces were about "Andrea Leadsome investigation that has seen Tory and Labour MPs suspended? " I accepted that fact without question.

Also 1st March, "I have only intimated that there are more accusations of rape within Labour than other parties. "

So however you interpret one statement of mine I have never denied and always accepted that it happens in other parties too. That is so obvious anyway it does not need saying.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 09:56 AM

The figures were also supplied by the idiot himself, or so he says.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 09:54 AM

Bollocks . No-one would would do that

I have just explained I am aware of at least 6 people that did. Your rational answer to that is 'Bollocks'? No real argument so you resort to abuse. Not like you Keith.

I have acknowledged from the start that the Tories do have that particular problem anyway. It is just the scale of the problem under discussion.

Well, I don't recall you ever having said that the Tories had the same problem. In fact your phrase was "other parties do not have such a problem" but, what the heck, you admit that they do now. Apology accepted. Yes, it is indeed a question of scale and as Raggy has pointed out the issue seems to be 6 times as bad with the Tories. I am not convinced that this is right and strongly suspect that the number or abusers, as a percentage, is pretty level across the political spectrum. As it is across all walks of life.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 09:51 AM

"It is just the scale of the problem under discussion." OK, so lets have another look at the figures again.

The Conservatives have 316 Mp's 37 of whom are subject to allegations of sexual impropriety. More than 1 in 10.

Labour have 259 MP's 4 of whom are subject to allegations of sexual impropriety. Less than 1 in 60.

It would seem that the Conservatives have a far bigger problem than than Labour, seemingly at least 6 times greater.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 09:41 AM

"So you now accept that your repeated accusations of lying were false."
I most certainly don't - I mistakenly quoted a later adaptation of your original claim which was (one more time) "JEREMY CORBYN HAS BEEN ACCUSED BY NEARLY HALF THE FEMALE MPS IN HIS PARTY OF FAILING TO STOP THE "DISGUSTING AND TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE" ABUSE OF WOMEN BY HIS SUPPORTERS."
That was a lie - your denial of having said it was a lie and your repetition of it was a lie
You have (as usual ) lied in order to use raped and molested women as a means of denigrating a Party that has historically shown more respect for women than any other party
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 09:30 AM

Rag,
Which clearly shows 4 labour MP's were included, as I suspect does the Times link but it cannot be accessed without subscription.

I do not pay. You can open a free account for a limited number of articles per week.

The 4 Labour MPs were not part of the dossier which only looked at Tory MPs.
The dossier was not just about offences against women as the examples showed, and some of the accusations were against women.

Dave,
BTW - I do not interpret "other parties do not have such a problem" as "other parties have no problem." but as "other parties do not have this particular problem"

Bollocks . No-one would would do that, and I have acknowledged from the start that the Tories do have that particular problem anyway. It is just the scale of the problem under discussion.

Jim,
"It is a fact Jim and I have proved it with media quotes."
A mistake on my part

So you now accept that your repeated accusations of lying were false.
I deserve an apology.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 08:35 AM

"It is a fact Jim and I have proved it with media quotes."
A mistake on my part
You originally claimed that "JEREMY CORBYN HAS BEEN ACCUSED BY NEARLY HALF THE FEMALE MPS IN HIS PARTY OF FAILING TO STOP THE "DISGUSTING AND TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE" ABUSE OF WOMEN BY HIS SUPPORTERS."
The figure may have been 40 MPs - there is no indication that anybody outside Paarliament have complained, there is no indication that these people are "Jeremy Corbyn's supporters" - Labour has been riven with in-fighting since Corbyn came on the scene because of his attempted change of direction.
Antisemitism was proven to have been concocted by Israel as an attempt to undermine his leadership
Of course harassment is a feature in Parliament - as it is in every other walk of society.
Labour women are far more likely to complain than are Tories - they are my their nature far mor militant - the left has always played a mahjor lead in feminism and the Tories have always fought to keep women "in their place" - that i is the nature of left and right politics.
There in no indication anywhere that Labour harassment is any more serious than that of the other Parties - nobody has suggested that that is the case
The worst sexual scandals have been by the priveliged - House of Lords members who have pleaded they are unfit for trial because of theirt mental condition, the Dolphin Sqaure Covver up, the recent Park Lane hotel disclosures, Harvey Proctor, Damien Green...
In every case, their leaders "stood by them" as long as they could
Our very society is tilted to defend the wealthy and powerful from these charges - our justice system is based on "You will get the best defence money can buy"
How many complainants have been bought off on condition that "you don't talk to the press"
Making a political crusade of rape is not only obscene (a type of abuse in itself), it is also ludicrous when these cases touch every part of our society
Can I seriously suggest to all that we stop giving this sick attention-seeker the "oxygen of publicity" that he is seeking
He has lied consistently - first claiming that half Labour women have v=complained, then denying that he said it, then back to the same ludicrous claim
We relly need to stop encouraging this guy from making Mudcat a platform for his hate and bigotry
Jim Caarroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:40 AM

BTW - I do not interpret "other parties do not have such a problem" as "other parties have no problem." but as "other parties do not have this particular problem"

such
s?t?/
determiner, predeterminer, & pronoun
determiner: such; pronoun: such

    1.
    of the type previously mentioned.
    "I have been involved in many such courses"
    2.
    of the type about to be mentioned.
    "there is no such thing as a free lunch"

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:40 AM

Link to my source

Which clearly shows 4 labour MP's were included, as I suspect does the Times link but it cannot be accessed without subscription.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:30 AM

Bollocks Dave.
I do not believe that anyone would interpret "other parties do not have such a problem" as "other parties have no problem."

So, you disbelieve what I say. Fair enough, that is your right. I know it to be true as do the others I asked. Your opinion on that is neither here nor there. The 'respect' that you have gained on this site is a good indication of other peoples opinions of you too.

I am glad you do not believe that Labour party members are more likely to be antisemitic or abusers of women. Next question then. If they are not, how do you account for the alleged greater problem that the Labour party is supposed to have?

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:27 AM

link to source of Rag's story.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/dirty-dossier-accuses-mps-of-harassment-and-sex-in-offices-6f7q8kn8b

The research only considered Tory MPs.

Jackaroo,
I think often the best way to interpret a riposte is to look at what goes unanswered.

What have I left unanswered please?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:23 AM

You know Dave you didn't put enough wriggles in.

Wriggle, wriggle, wriggle and more wriggle.

The FACT remains that more than 1 in ten Conservative MP's have had allegations made against them and the FACT is that less than 1 in sixty Labour MP's have.

Ergo the Conservatives have a problem at least 6 times larger.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:22 AM

Dave,
No-one would interpret "other parties do not have such a problem" as "other parties have no problem."
I did and a straw poll amongst my peers reveals that they did too.

Bollocks Dave.
I do not believe that anyone would interpret "other parties do not have such a problem" as "other parties have no problem."

Are members of the Labour party more likely to be antisemitic and to abuse women than members of any other political party?

No, but there is evidence that Labour has a greater problem.
Much greater in terms of anti-Semitism.

Numerous prominent and senior Labour people and the entire NEC which includes the leadership say that Labour has a serious problem with anti-Semitism.
They do not say that of any other party and only Labour Jews have reported anti-Semitism from their own party.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:18 AM

Raggytash: "Don't know about you Jackaroo but it seems to me that someone is clutching at straws and trying to move the goal posts. Not really addressing the FACT that the Conservative party has a bigger problem as CLEARLY demonstrated by my link."

Yeah, I think often the best way to interpret a riposte is to look at what goes unanswered.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:12 AM

Some points from Rag's story, (originally Dave's and mine) from the original source.
The research quoted only consideed Tory MPs.
The accusation against 4 Labour MPs were made elsewhere.

"It includes claims of sexual misconduct against 37 male and female politicians, including sexual harassment allegations and reported extramarital affairs. More than 25 are alleged to have been “inappropriate with female researchers”."

Examples given,
"A prominent female MP is accused of having extramarital sex with young male researchers. At least two MPs are accused of getting their mistresses pregnant, with one allegedly paying for her to have an abortion. Other MPs have reportedly had sex in their private offices in Westminster while two Conservative politicians are accused of using the services of prostitutes.
The list also alleges that a video is circulating of one Tory backbencher engaged in an extreme sex act with three men."

No suggestion of anything no-consensual.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:04 AM

No-one would interpret "other parties do not have such a problem" as "other parties have no problem."

I did and a straw poll amongst my peers reveals that they did too. Therefore saying 'no-one would' is invalid. I suspect, but cannot give an exact number, that many other people would also interpret it as I did. Whether you phrased in in such a way to be ambiguous on purpose or by accident is known only to you. Given your track record I suspect the former.


Yeh, OK, the rabid antisemitic rapist has an element of poetic license in it but it is not too far from what you are saying. Answer this simple question if you dare.

Are members of the Labour party more likely to be antisemitic and to abuse women than members of any other political party?

A simple yes or no is all that is required.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 07:02 AM

Don't know about you Jackaroo but it seems to me that someone is clutching at straws and trying to move the goal posts.

Not really addressing the FACT that the Conservative party has a bigger problem as CLEARLY demonstrated by my link.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 06:53 AM

Jackaroo,

Thanks. It is a refreshing change to be able to exchange views without being abused, accused of lying and told my words mean something else.

Keith, by denying that women will keep quiet about abuse and rape, you simply disqualify yourself from discussing the phenomenon.

I would not deny it.
It happens because of terrible circumstances.

The circumstances of female Labour and Tory politicians are very similar and I would like to know why one should be less likely to complain than the other.

I think the article posted by Raggytash is sufficient rebuttal

it is a rebuttal of your suggestion that Tory women do not complain.
They clearly do.

However, only Labour women MPs need to write en-masse to complain to their leadership, and there is a "Labour Too" movement but no equivalent for any other party.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 06:52 AM

Isn't it strange Dave that MORE than one in ten Conservative MP's have had allegations made against them yet Labour MP's who have LESS than one in sixty allegations made against them have a bigger problem.

You do the maths for me would you and let me know who has the greater problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 06:39 AM

Dave, no wriggling from me.
I stand by what I said.

You are talking bollocks.
No-one would interpret "other parties do not have such a problem" as "other parties have no problem.

I said what I said.
The meaning is clear.
You have made yourself foolish.

According to Keefyboy if you are a member of the Labour party you are more likely to be a rabid antisemitic rapist than if you belong to any other political party.

Again you resort to lying about me because your case is rubbish.

Jim,
""Over 40 female Labour MPs have written to party " (a lie)

It is a fact Jim and I have proved it with media quotes.
Please put it in huge red capitals again.

"I said no such thing." (another lie)

Another truth. I had not said what I was accused of saying. You lied.

" "JEREMY CORBYN HAS BEEN ACCUSED BY OF FAILING TO STOP THE "DISGUSTING AND TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE" ABUSE OF WOMEN BY HIS SUPPORTERS." - a lie

A truth Jim. Again please use bigger and redder capitals.

Proof of truth, BBC,
"Over 40 female Labour MPs have written to party leader Jeremy Corbyn urging him to do more to tackle abuse of MPs.
The letter highlighted an "extremely worrying trend of escalating abuse and hostility" towards MPs in recent weeks.
Women were disproportionately affected by these "disgusting and totally unacceptable" incidents, it said.
Leadership rival Owen Smith has accused Mr Corbyn of not doing enough to clamp down on "intolerance and misogyny"
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36864903

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 06:31 AM

Keith: "Your argument requires that women from other parties are being abused and raped but keeping quiet about it. They would not, and as evidence I would point out that a few have made complaints and action has been taken. Labour women complain that they are ignored."

Keith, by denying that women will keep quiet about abuse and rape, you simply disqualify yourself from discussing the phenomenon.

I think the article posted by Raggytash is sufficient rebuttal, but I would add that the Me Too movement and the current news are replete with stories of rape and harassment that occurred years ago and which describe a culture of harassment that existed for decades.

As Jim Carroll pointed out, this culture is endemic where men wield disproportionate power. Time will tell if the British party of tradition and privilege is the world's sole exception.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 06:20 AM

If I have lied, quote me.
""Over 40 female Labour MPs have written to party " (a lie)
"I said no such thing." (another lie)
"It is true." - a complete reversal
" "JEREMY CORBYN HAS BEEN ACCUSED BY OF FAILING TO STOP THE "DISGUSTING AND TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE" ABUSE OF WOMEN BY HIS SUPPORTERS." - a lie
You claimed the telegraph claimed "NEARLY HALF THE FEMALE MPS IN HIS PARTY" complained - in fact the Telegraph claimed that 42 members did - women labour party members number into the 100 thousands - over 100 in parliament (more than double the Conservative women - which says everything about how conservatives regard women) you misquoted the Telegraph - you lied
You have just deliberately misquotes Jackaroo
"Your argument requires that women from other parties are being abused and raped but keeping quiet about it."
What he actually said was that Labour women have a mechanism to complain about abuse - Conservative women have nos such voice - again, you lied
You have lied from start to finish on this question
Will that do for now?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 05:31 AM

According to Keefyboy if you are a member of the Labour party you are more likely to be a rabid antisemitic rapist than if you belong to any other political party. I suppose I should either give up my membership or go and shoot myself now.

By the same logic, because there are very few complaints about the abuse of Women or antisemitism in, say, Pakistan or Saudi Arabia then there must be fewer incidents relating to these in those countries.

Barking mad.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 05:26 AM

The thread is entitled Sexual Impropriety at WESTMINSTER.

When someone can come up with figures from elsewhere it can then, and only then, be considered and discussed. It is pure conjecture at the moment.

What is FACT is that the Conservatives have a far bigger problem than Labour.

Once again someone is seeking to move the goalposts when they have lost an argument. No change there.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 05:23 AM

That is bollocks.
No-one would interpret "not such a problem" as "no problem."

But you did not say "not such a problem" did you. You said "other parties do not have such a problem" - Different thing altogether which I and many others would interpret as the other parties do not have the same problem.

Stop digging and wriggling.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 05:18 AM

Rag, that story is restricted to MPs.
The 43 Labour women MPs and Labour Too are addressing behaviour by all party members.

BI lifted that whole story from the Times.
See the original here,
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/dirty-dossier-accuses-mps-of-harassment-and-sex-in-offices-6f7q8kn8b

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 05:06 AM

It would seem that some people cannot see the truth when it is right in front of them. For example "other parties do not have such a problem"

The Conservatives have 316 Mp's 37 of whom are subject to allegations of sexual impropriety. More than 1 in 10.

Labour have 259 MP's 4 of whom are subject to allegations of sexual impropriety. Less than 1 in 60.

It would seem that the Conservatives have a far bigger problem than than Labour, seemingly at least 6 times greater.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 04:50 AM

Dave,
Interpretation by the rest of the world. "Other parties do not have a problem."

That is bollocks.
No-one would interpret "not such a problem" as "no problem."

You just can not answer what I say so pretend I said something else.

Jim,
Keith
Go stuff your obnoxious and lying tactics

If I have lied, quote me.
Good luck with that, liar.

Jackaroo,
Your argument requires that women from other parties are being abused and raped but keeping quiet about it.
They would not, and as evidence I would point out that a few have made complaints and action has been taken.
Labour women complain that they are ignored.

Rag, Dave posted that story on 28Feb and later gave a link.
It was also in my first BBC link posted on first March.

Try actually reading instead of just sniping from the sidelines.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 03:51 AM

Nice one Jack a definite "wish I'd said that"
I'm look forward to watching The Oscars some time this week with all those lovely 'ladies in black' (including the wonderful Frances McDormand, who prefers to put her anger into words and wear what she likes)
It's about time this anger filtered down to every layer of society
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Mar 18 - 03:45 AM

As the link I placed yesterday seemed to be giving trouble to several people I have copied the article from Business Insider.

Westminster engulfed in growing scandal as nearly 40 MPs, including Cabinet and former Cabinet ministers, are accused of inappropriate behaviour including sexual harassment.
Dossier put together by Westminster researchers accuses MPs of sexual harassment, unwanted advances and extramarital sex with parliamentary staff.
Theresa May and government whips were allegedly aware of allegations made against Conservative MPs.
Four Labour MPs are also accused and the party fears more will emerge.


LONDON — Theresa May is under pressure to explain exactly when she knew about the scale of the growing sexual harassment scandal in Parliament after dozens of Tory MPs were engulfed in allegations of unwanted sexual advances and behaving inappropriately towards members of staff.

A group of Westminster researchers have put together a list of nearly 40 Conservative MPs, including several members of May's Cabinet, who have had allegations made against them over the last five years, according to The Times.

The prime minister has been aware of the allegations, The Times claims, because government whips have been giving her weekly briefings on accusations made against her MPs by Westminster employees. May's spokesperson will this morning face questions from journalists about exactly what the prime minister knew and when.

The scandal is expected to spread over the coming days with at least four Labour MPs also accused of harassing young women who work in Westminster, including two who have at some point served in leader Jeremy Corbyn's shadow Cabinet.


May has written to the House of Commons Speaker, John Bercow, urging him to establish a mediation service for Westminster staff wanting to report the inappropriate behaviour of MPs, the Guardian reports.

The Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority has recommended that a grievance procedure is incorporated in contracts of Westminster employees, providing them with a means of raising concerns and complaints.

However, MPs are technically self-employed, meaning they are not legally obliged to provide this outlet to their employees.

"It does not have the required teeth as contractually an MP does not have to follow the procedure. I do not believe this situation can be tolerated any longer," the prime minister said in a letter to Bercow.

What are MPs accused of?
The dossier, seen by The Times, includes a long list of allegations against 37 serving male and female MPs, including sexual harassment and extramarital affairs. Those named in the list include:

A long-serving Conservative backbencher accused of being "perpetually intoxicated and very inappropriate with women."
A Tory MP who is alleged to have agreed a "non-disclosure" settlement with another MP's researcher.
A current Cabinet minister who is accused of being "handsy at parties" and another minister who has allegedly been nicknamed "Cop-a-feel."
Other allegations include two MPs accused of getting their mistresses pregnant and two Tory MPs accused of using prostitutes. A well-known female MP is alleged to have had affairs with young male researchers. There is also a video in circulation of a Conservative backbencher engaged in an "extreme sex act" with three men, the dossier alleges.

The Guardian reports that rumours are spreading of one Conservative MP who "allegedly takes pictures of young men in compromising positions and uses them to extract sexual favours."

The allegations include mainly Conservative politicians but Labour MPs believe more will emerge within their party.

"We’re not going to be immune from it," Labour MP Lucy Powell said. "It’s the attitudes and the power inequalities, whether it’s Hollywood, the BBC or Westminster."

Westminster figures believe the allegations, plus more that may emerge in the coming days and weeks, could trigger several high-profile resignations and possibly bring the government down.

What MPs have been named?
Two Conservative MPs named in the dossier have already admitted to allegations made against them.

Trade minister Mark Garnier is facing a parliamentary investigation after admitting to asking one his assistants to purchase sex toys for him.

Stephen Crabb, the former work and pensions secretary, apologised over the weekend after admitting sending inappropriate text messages to a 19-year-old woman who had hoped to work in his office. Crabb described the messages as "sexual chatter." Crabb was forced to quit his Cabinet position last year after it emerged that he sent explicit messages to a young woman during the EU referendum campaign.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 03:16 PM

Thank you for providing the cold light of reason in the heat of the current discussion, Jackaroodave. I have tried to put across the same point but not as eloquently on a number of occasions with reference to accusations of a similar type in the past. Hopefully, as you do not have a history of conflict with Keith, your argument may be taken on board.

Sadly, I doubt it but thanks again anyway.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jackaroodave
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 03:05 PM

Keith: "The reason I think other parties do not have such a problem is that A.Their women MPs do not write en-masse to complain like Labour's do, and B. Because there is a "Labour Too" movement but no equivalent for any other party."

Keith, I would draw the exact opposite conclusion from the evidence you provided. If we accept your inference, then by parity of reasoning, present-day, democratic countries with strong feminist movements are the setting for the exponentially greatest frequency of sexual harassment in recorded history.

To take a recent example, in the 90s, when women accused Bill Clinton of sexual harassment there was no groundswell of Democratic women picking up the torches and pitchforks to oppose his nomination--and renomination. Are you going to tell me with a straight face that was because there wasn't any back then?

Protest and ruckus swell not when conditions are worst, but when there is some hope of change. I apologize for repeating a truism, but it seems necessary.

Similarly, in the US, senior legislator John Conyers and Boy-Wonder Senator Al Franken, both Democratic heroes, were forced out by their own party, while Republican intra-party pressure on alleged child abusers and serial wife beaters has been slight, tardy, and reluctant.

The absence of a coordinated protest among Tory women in light of . . . well, reality, is chilling to me, not reassuring.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 01:27 PM

other parties do not have such a problem

Interpretation by Keith "They do have a problem but it is not as bad."

Interpretation by the rest of the world. "Other parties do not have a problem."

Different morality
Different language
Different planet

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 01:19 PM

Let's make this clear
The persecution of women is as old as history itself - it is a social rather than a political phenomenon
It is a practice carried out by MEN of all political persuasions or none at all
THe only political aspect of the act is that used by our own wee jobbie who wishes to score political points for his party he has used Muslims Travellers and Irish children for the same twisted reason
Any political difference lies in the actions of the political parties in ending this practice - Corbyn has attemptedt ot stop it - up to now, May has "stood by her ministers" when the practice has been uncovered - Damien Green the porno liar being a typical example
When an investigation was carried out, the Government watered it down before making it public
The "rising star" the Tory party has made her own position clear - those who have complained are oversensitive prudes- doen't auger well for women in her party
Sexual harassment is part of our unequal society - philosophically he is making the right noises in wanting to make our society a more equal one - hopefully he will continue to do so (hence his unpopularity with the right
Right-wing politics is based on an unequal society - it relies on a subservient population who will allow themselves to be used by the priveleged.   
Keith is fairly typical of teh right - he leaps to teh defence of Poorno-king Greene and is happy to use raped and persecuted women as an election campaign - 'vote for us - the other side are all molesters and rapists'
His behaviour makes him as culpable of the most serious sex pest
Keith
Go stuff your obnoxious and lying tactics up as far as you can
You are sick
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 01:19 PM

Let's make this clear
The persecution of women is as old as history itself - it is a social rather than a political phenomenon
It is a practice carried out by MEN of all political persuasions or none at all
THe only political aspect of the act is that used by our own wee jobbie who wishes to score political points for his party he has used Muslims Travellers and Irish children for the same twisted reason
Any political difference lies in the actions of the political parties in ending this practice - Corbyn has attemptedt ot stop it - up to now, May has "stood by her ministers" when the practice has been uncovered - Damien Green the porno liar being a typical example
When an investigation was carried out, the Government watered it down before making it public
The "rising star" the Tory party has made her own position clear - those who have complained are oversensitive prudes- doen't auger well for women in her party
Sexual harassment is part of our unequal society - philosophically he is making the right noises in wanting to make our society a more equal one - hopefully he will continue to do so (hence his unpopularity with the right
Right-wing politics is based on an unequal society - it relies on a subservient population who will allow themselves to be used by the priveleged.   
Keith is fairly typical of teh right - he leaps to teh defence of Poorno-king Greene and is happy to use raped and persecuted women as an election campaign - 'vote for us - the other side are all molesters and rapists'
His behaviour makes him as culpable of the most serious sex pest
Keith
Go stuff your obnoxious and lying tactics up as far as you can
You are sick
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 01:15 PM

He really is a misguided infantile little person isn't he.

This is despite being shown that I only agreed with Jim's statement:

"Can we leave this feller to sink in his own swill lads, I really don't want to be around when they come for him!!!"

That is there in black and white for all to see and still he continues to try and suggest otherwise.

I really do think he is in the throes of dementia, a dementia that is getting worse by the day.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 12:59 PM

Jim,
Please continue to re-post my factual statements in huge red capitals for me.
It must greatly increase their impact.

And Rag, please continue your support by telling Jim how much you agree.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 12:49 PM

Dave,
It is what you said and it is there for all to see

Yes, and hear it is again.

"I suspect that it is because other parties do not have such a problem, as Labour did not until recent times."

No wriggling from me Dave.
I do indeed suspect that, and I stand by it.

The reason I think other parties do not have such a problem is that

A.Their women MPs do not write en-masse to complain like Labour's do, and

B. Because there is a "Labour Too" movement but no equivalent for any other party.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 12:36 PM

so you pretend I said something else.
despicable.

I am not pretending anything. It is what you said and it is there for all to see. It is you who are being despicabley dishonest and you will just Not stop digging yourself further in.

Not often you see that. Barking mad wrigley worm.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 11:32 AM

I got the same thing Raggy - tried to unblock it but it wouldn't listen - like one of our contributors (time for the drain-rods in the case of the latter)!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 11:32 AM

I got the same thing Raggy - tried to unblock it but it wouldn't listen - like one of our contributors (time for the drain-rods in the case of the latter)!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 11:25 AM

I cannot explain that David, I've just checked it now with no problem. Could I suggest that you try again or look up the article that uk.businessinsider.com under politics.

Cheers

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 10:30 AM

Raggy that link asks me to disable my adblocker, sorry I will not do that for anyone.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 09:01 AM

With regard to the subject matter that some would have us believe is a mainly Labour issue.

Conservative Impropriety????

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 08:58 AM

Moving on
Sexual harassment i Westminster is no different to any other section of society - it is a manifestation of the influential, powerful - or even just strong, wielding their power over those less powerful or weaker
Clerical abuse, Savile, Weinstock.... are all examples of this - abuse to obtain sex - or just to display 'superiority'.
It has always happened in every section of society and today's revelations are a sign that (hopefully) it is coming to an end and women are beginning to assert themselves as equal human beings
Pretending this is anything else is just a sick gamer
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 08:32 AM

Rag and Steve
This has become about this maniac, which is how he works
We really are not qualified to deal with somebody with Keith's problems
If we want to keep this subject, let's move on and leave him to his specialists - anybody who turns child rape, and sexual abuse of women into a politcal campaign no behalf of his party is beyond reason - stay away from him - it might beinfectious
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 08:30 AM

Hi Jim, see what I mean.

You posted "Can we leave this feller to sink in his own swill lads, I really don't want to be around when they come for him!!! Jim Carroll"

I posted "Couldn't agree more Jim" and backed that statement up with "I would suggest that nobody responds to his infantile posts"

Like I suggested dementia.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 08:24 AM

Rag,
For some odd reason Jim, his dementia is conflating what you and I post.

No. When Jim claimed my true statement was a lie, you said, "Couldn't agree more Jim."

So, you clearly did not believe it was true either.
Clearly it was too shocking for you and Jim to believe.
Now you know it is true, you will agree with me that Labour does have a serious problem with how it treats women.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 08:20 AM

Steve.
But when we argue with what you say you pretend you said something else.

Show where I have ever done that.
I never have.

What I said was, "I suspect that it is because other parties do not have such a problem, as Labour did not until recent times."

I do indeed suspect that, and I stand by what I said.

I also said, "JEREMY CORBYN HAS BEEN ACCUSED BY NEARLY HALF THE FEMALE MPS IN HIS PARTY OF FAILING TO STOP THE "DISGUSTING AND TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE" ABUSE OF WOMEN BY HIS SUPPORTERS."

That is a direct quote from the Telegraph, and was widely covered in the media.
It is true. I stand by it.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 08:20 AM

For some odd reason Jim, his dementia is conflating what you and I post.

To date I have mentioned the Andrea Leadsome role, told Dave he was too generous, told Steve how much snow there was in my back garden, mentioned to you he doesn't know the difference between slander and libel, put a reference to an obscure post about the Irish border, cast doubt on his mental capability (losing it) and agreed with you that we should just ignore him. Not once have I given any opinion of the subject matter.

The behaviour of someone with advancing dementia to my mind.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 07:10 AM

But when we argue with what you say you pretend you said something else. We're even in danger of being called obfuscating nitpickers when we put you right. A rather vulgar and largely fraudulent approach, Keith.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 07:06 AM

Dave, you have degenerated into a devious and dishonest man.
You can not argue with what I say so you pretend I said something else.
despicable.

"I suspect that it is because other parties do not have such a problem, as Labour did not until recent times."

I do indeed suspect that, and I stand by it.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 06:58 AM

Jim,
"JEREMY CORBYN HAS BEEN ACCUSED BY NEARLY HALF THE FEMALE MPS IN HIS PARTY OF FAILING TO STOP THE "DISGUSTING AND TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE" ABUSE OF WOMEN BY HIS SUPPORTERS."

That is a direct quote from the Telegraph, and was widely covered in the media.
It is true.

Clearly it was too shocking for you and Rag to believe.
Now you know it is true, you will agree with me that Labour does have a serious problem with how it treats women.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 04:38 AM

MORE TO THE POINT
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 04:28 AM

There's a worm at the bottom of our garden and all that he can do is
Wriggle all day and wriggle all night...

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 03:54 AM

"Jim, that statement is a fact."
You denied ity - now you are lying on both counts
""Over 40 female Labour MPs have written to party "
"NEARLY HALF THE FEMALE MPS IN HIS PARTY"
Utterly and completely pathalogical
Nurse - the screens!!!!!!"
Think this just about finishes this feller - don't you lads?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 03:49 AM

Ok.. I'll confidently state that it's entirely plausible that the tories have a much worse problem than all other parties,
and are the most devious masters of cover ups, closing ranks, and shifting the blame.....

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 03:33 AM

Dave, you have become a devious and dishonest person.
You can not argue with what I say so you pretend I said something else.

"NOT SUCH A PROBLEM" DOES NOT MEAN THE SAME AS "NO SUCH PROBLEM"



I said "other parties do not have such a problem,"

I did not say, "other parties have no such problem."

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Mar 18 - 03:25 AM

Jim, that statement is a fact.
It is actually a quote from the Telegraph, but the story was in all the media.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/22/45-female-labour-mps-write-to-jeremy-corbyn-demanding-he-does-mo/

BBC,
"Over 40 female Labour MPs have written to party leader Jeremy Corbyn urging him to do more to tackle abuse of MPs.
The letter highlighted an "extremely worrying trend of escalating abuse and hostility" towards MPs in recent weeks.
Women were disproportionately affected by these "disgusting and totally unacceptable" incidents, it said."
"It continues: "We have also been alarmed to learn that our shadow chancellor and other members of the shadow cabinet have addressed rallies and events in which demonstrations outside MPs' offices and bullying at CLP meetings have been either actively encouraged or quietly condoned."
The letter asks Mr Corbyn to make three pledges including "an unequivocal statement declaring his support for all MPs, particularly women, and clearly condemning campaigning outside MPs' offices, surgeries etc".
It finishes: "Jeremy, this is being done in your name." "
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36864903

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 04:22 PM

Couldn't agree more Jim.

I would suggest that nobody responds to his infantile posts.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 03:00 PM

Can we leave this feller to sink in his own swill lads, I really don't want to be around when they come for him!!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 02:58 PM

"I said no such thing."
JEREMY CORBYN HAS BEEN ACCUSED BY NEARLY HALF THE FEMALE MPS IN HIS PARTY OF FAILING TO STOP THE "DISGUSTING AND TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE" ABUSE OF WOMEN BY HIS SUPPORTERS.
It really is time you sought help Keith
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 01:52 PM

Squirm, squirm, squirm. It is obvious to a blind man on a flying horse what your meaning was. You have been found out in a lie and are now trying to wriggle out of it. Again.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 01:45 PM

Jim,
You said nearl have the women labour Party members have complained you lied again

I said no such thing.
You have made that up or misread my post.

Steve,
Trivial? Ok then, it was an outright trivial lie.

No attempt to deceive so not a lie. I just did not word it as well as I might. I should have prefaced "parties" with "main." Everyone knows Greens and SNP have female leaders but they have played no part in this discussion. It would be a pointless deception.

Dave,
You said other political parties had no such problem and then

I did not. I said I suspected they did not have such a problem.
That means they might have a problem, but not so great.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 11:31 AM

Need of hours? Kindle - Talk sense.

A matter of hours

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 11:27 AM


From: Keith A of Hertford - PM
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 09:43 AM

Dave,
You say other parties do not have the problem,

Lie. I have never said that and it is not my view.
If it is not a lie, quote me.

Ok. Here you go.


From: Keith A of Hertford - PM
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 02:21 PM

Dave,
Why are the members of the other political parties not following suit?

I suspect that it is because other parties do not have such a problem, as Labour did not until recent times.?

Right from the horses mouth. You said other political parties had no such problem and then, a need of hours later you deny ever having said it. You either have a memory issue or a split personality. Or, as we suspected all along, you are just an arsehole.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 10:44 AM

Just to show the extent of sexual harassment in Westminster
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/westminster-sexual-harassment-one-five-report-leaked-mps-lords-staff-a8199401.html
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 10:39 AM

Trivial? Ok then, it was an outright trivial lie. And, going from your past form, I suspect you knew and were trying to get away with it, just as you did with your Wheatcroft fiasco. Thing is, Keith, when you have form it's hard to regain your reputation. You could have posted a correction to what you must have known was a bullshit statement, but you didn't, and, as ever, it was down to someone else to pick you up on it. And when they did they were just nitpicking obfuscators. Disgraceful behaviour.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 10:37 AM

"I did not make the accusations. They were made by female Labour members and they did hit the headlines."
You said nearl have the women labour Party members have complained you lied again - you appear not to be able to stop yourself - get treatment
Nobody said you made them up - who said you did - now you're imagining things
Get help
Sexual harasment is a nationwide phenomenon - only a sicko like yourself would attempt to make capital from it
Not so long ago you were defending a porno hoarding politician - because he was a high up member of the govenment
that is using harassment to gain political points
Now you are making it a Labour problem - this behaviour has been associated with politicianss from all walks of life, including high ranking ministers - even a Prime Minister
Using this t score political points as as bad as when you were using raped children to score Islamophocic ones, or Irish children to denigrate the Irish
Your condition appears to be worstening
Get help
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 10:25 AM

Yes Steve, I was WRONG.

I should have said,
"They are already on their second woman leader, two more than any other major national party."

That is what I meant. I just did not think it necessary to spell out to intelligent people.

I forgot that you people look for any trivial thing to pounce upon because you have no reply to my actual argument.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 10:19 AM

Keith: "They are already on their second woman leader, two more than any other party."

Me: "In fact, UKIP have had a woman leader and the Greens have had two. The SNP have one right now."

Keith: "...to avoid nit-picking from obfuscators I should have specified the 3 main national parties.
SNP is not national. Greens have 1 MP and UKIP none."


You see, Keith, this is the heart of your credibility problem here. You got this plain wrong. It's such a blatant untruth that I can't believe that any sentient being would read it back to themselves before posting it and not realise what a goofball remark it was. The woman leader point, a brainless addendum to the error when you consider the two women in question, simply compounds the outrage. And finally, when challenged over stating a clear falsehood you characterise your challenger as being a nit-picking obfuscator. You were WRONG, Keith, blatantly so, and the challenge is perfectly clear, the very opposite of obfuscation. Disreputable behaviour, Keith, what we've come to expect from you and a great illustration as to why we can't trust a single thing you say.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 10:13 AM

Sorry.

how did make these "accusations" and why hasn't it hit the headlines

I did not make the accusations. They were made by female Labour members and they did hit the headlines.
(Labour Too had to compete with the snow and Brexit though.)
I just reported them.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 10:12 AM

how did make these "accusations" and why hasn't it hit the headlines
I did not make the accusations. They were made by female Labour members and they did hit the headlines.
(Labour Too had to compete with the snow and Brexit though.)
I just reported them.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 09:51 AM

"half the female MPs in his party of failing to stop the "disgusting and totally unacceptable" abuse of women by his supporters."
Up to June last year the Labour Pary had 552,000
For arguments sake, if half of those were women (extremely doubtful) that would be 267000 women protesting about Corbyn -
Did they have a national ballot - did they write to the daily mail.... how did make these "accusations" and why hasn't it hit the headlines - what an opportunity for the bumwipe press who has been gunning for Cirbyn since he appraeed on the scene
ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR MIND - WHAT ARE YOU ON KEITH?
Time someone upped your medication I think
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 09:43 AM

Dave,
You say other parties do not have the problem,

Lie. I have never said that and it is not my view.
If it is not a lie, quote me.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 09:39 AM

Dave,
You say other parties do not have the problem,

Another made up slur. Of course they do, but I suspect Labour has a much more serious problem than any other.

Unlike you Dave, I substantiate my views.


Jeremy Corbyn has been accused by nearly half the female MPs in his party of failing to stop the "disgusting and totally unacceptable" abuse of women by his supporters.
In a letter to the Labour leader, 45 female MPs say his response to the intimidation has been “inadequate” and tell him: “Jeremy, this is being done in your name.”

There has been no such outcry in any other party, and there would have been.

Now we have LabourToo, which is an internal Labour Party pressure group seeking to highlight and combat sexual assaults and discrimination within the party.

Their report has revealed Labour women have been raped, groped and harassed by men within their own party - with one MP alleged to have preyed on a drunken teenager.

They asked politicians, staff, activists and candidates from across the country to share their stories anonymously to create a detailed picture of the extend of the problem.

Their “shocking and distressing” findings, collated over a two-month period late last year, have now been collated and sent to the party’s London headquarters, where senior officials are under pressure to take action.

No other party's women have made such an outcry, and I am sure they would if subjected to the same provocation.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 05:31 AM

It seems to me Dave that someone may be starting to develop some form of dementia. Joined up thinking was never their strong point but recently it seems that their ability to be logical is failing even more. Thrashing about, claiming this that and other, making remarks to people not even in that part of the discussion and losing the plot over quite basic points seems to be ever more prevalent.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 05:31 AM

"Jim, you also now resort to nothing but personal attack. "
And you have always resorting to the persecution of minorities which is why you will never "win" anything
You pollute these discussions with your hatred, intolerance and extremism
Dave has just put you in a nutshell
Jim Caarroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 05:21 AM

Nothing made up at all. You say other parties do not have the problem, therefore rape and abuse only happens in the Labour party. No amount of wriggling will get you out of that one.

I think we have found another Wheatcroft moment, Steve :-)

I may be abusive towards you, Keith, but that is because you deserve it. I can do a lot more if you like as I am better at it than you. All you come up with is 'sad'.

DtG

Oh, and get stuffed you great whingeing wazzock.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Mar 18 - 05:01 AM

Oh fer chrissake. Do try to be serious.

I was being serious, but to avoid nit-picking from obfuscators I should have specified the 3 main national parties.
SNP is not national. Greens have 1 MP and UKIP none.

Dave,
So we have it right from the horses mouth. Only the Labour party have rapists in their midst.

Made up slur. "I suspect that it is because other parties do not have such a problem" does not remotely say that.

I suspect that if rape and abuse were serious issues in other parties, their women would complain as much as Labour women do.

Rag,
Where on earth did this come from, that post must have been MONTHS ago.

It was, but Steve raised the issue and claimed I had lied about it.
Why do you attack me instead of the actual culprit?

Dave,
As I have said before, Keith, someone called you a thick cunt.
I don't agree.
I doubt that you are thick.

More puerile abuse. All a sad case like you can do.

Jim, you also now resort to nothing but personal attack.
As good as an admission of defeat.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 08:25 PM

"I doubt that you are thick."
Me neither - there are plenty of alternatives
The first time I had a major set-to with Keith he was using raped young women to satisfy his Islamophobia.
Later he used Irish children to claim Irish people were brought up to hate Britain
Then there was the excuse that refugees freeing oil wars were infiltrated by terrorists
Next we have the British Muslims who are noted as being Law-abiding who were over-represented in British prisons
More recently it was the British people who were responsible for Theresa May doing a deal with a terrorist linked political Party
Mixed into this are "lying" Jewish nurses and survivors of one of the largest massacres in the latter half of the 20th century (all to protect an extremist, ethnic cleansing regime)
Therne there were the actions of a handful of criminals being used to denigrate the whole TRaveller community
Now we have raped, molested and harassed women being used to promote a political party
I agree that "thick" falls short of a suitable description!
Maybe it's time we really stopped feeding this troll
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 05:41 PM

As I have said before, Keith, someone called you a thick cunt.

I don't agree.

I doubt that you are thick.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 04:38 PM

"Rag, Neither the EU or the Irish Government has EVER threatened a hard border"

Where on earth did this come from, that post must have been MONTHS ago.

I know I should feel real sorry for the very sad little man but for some reason I cannot raise any sort of empathy.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 03:36 PM

"It seems unlikely that Tory women would keep quiet about such things. "
A TORY VIEW OF SEXUAL HARASSMENT
A LESS THAN LIBERAL VIEW !!
You are a dick-head Keith as well as a predator
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 03:27 PM

I suspect that it is because other parties do not have such a problem

So we have it right from the horses mouth. Only the Labour party have rapists in their midst.

Good grief Keith. You are one sick puppy.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 03:06 PM

"It seems unlikely that Tory women would keep quiet about such things. "
Mor bollocking politicizing Keith
It transpires that there is a battle going on over accuations that Theresa May has actually covered up complaints
Shhe certainly supported liar and porn user, Damien Green and MICHAEL FALLON
Stop defending these monsters Keith
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 03:00 PM

"It seems unlikely that Tory women would keep quiet about such things.
Why would they?They are already on their second woman leader, two more than any other party."

Oh fer chrissake. Do try to be serious.

In fact, UKIP have had a woman leader and the Greens have had two. The SNP have one right now. You're so reliable with your facts, Keith. Or vulgar and fraudulent. Take yer pick.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 02:21 PM

Dave,
Why are the members of the other political parties not following suit?

I suspect that it is because other parties do not have such a problem, as Labour did not until recent times.

It seems unlikely that Tory women would keep quiet about such things.
Why would they?They are already on their second woman leader, two more than any other party.

But do Tory women allow themselves to be raped, PFR.

Non-sequitur Dave. Ridiculous suggestion.
The question I put was " are you claiming that Tory women allow themselves to be raped and abused without fuss for the party?"

I thought the meaning plain, but for your simple self I meant allowing it without making a fuss afterwards.

Were PFR and Steve claiming that when they said, "the Labour party has a tradition of being more open to scrutiny" ?
To me that does suggest that it is being kept quiet in other parties.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 01:33 PM

But do Tory women allow themselves to be raped, PFR. These are the things that keefyboy is accusing you of saying. Seems a bit suspect to me but, hey, what do I know?

Have fun on your Mrs's snow day and don't do anything that Keith would do ;-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 01:06 PM

back to snow reports...

We woke up snowed in...

No recycle bins being collected today..
no vehicles are moving on our street...

Worst part is the wife was told not to go to work,
so has spent the afternoon in the living room listening to Max Boyce on alexa..

Given the choice, I'm upstairs in my computer den...

and gladly opt for an occasional dose of mudcat and Keith...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 12:37 PM

"Anyone join me in supporting "Labour Too" a"
And till you target Labour when this is the situation in parliament
At least Labour women are standing up to a situation that is rife in our society
Stop making political captial out of an atrocity Keith - what kind of monster are you
Why aren't you supporting the #Me Too campaing, or is abuse only abuse when Labour does it?
Sicko
Jim Carroll


After #MeToo, Britain investigates sexual harassment of women at work
Lin Taylor
LONDON (Thomson Reuters Foundation) - From unwanted advances to catcalls and abuse, Britain on Tuesday launched a inquiry into sexual harassment of women at work as countless stories of misconduct spread across the working world.
The all-party Women and Equalities Committee said it aims to keep women safe in the workplace, improve handling of complaints and review legal protections for those accused of abuse, such as non-disclosure agreements, which may be used to silence victims.
“Over the past few months there have been widespread reports of women’s appalling experiences of sexual harassment at work,” said committee chair and Conservative politician Maria Miller.
“We need to change workplace culture, keep women safe and provide effective legal remedies,” she said in a statement.“We need to understand whether non-disclosure agreements are being abused by legal experts and employers to cover up wrongdoing.”
Last year, parliament became one of several institutions to become embroiled in a sexual abuse scandal after allegations against Hollywood producer Harvey Weinstein sparked the #MeToo campaign, with people sharing stories of abuse on social media.
Nearly one in five people working in Britain’s parliament were sexually harassed or saw inappropriate behavior in the past year, according to a recent government report which was commissioned after a series of sex scandals at Westminster.
Evidence on workplace harassment can be submitted to the inquiry until March 13, said the committee, which scrutinizes Britain’s gender equality policies and last month launched an investigation into unwanted sexual attention in public places.
Britain’s industrial dispute body ACAS issued advice at the end of 2017 on behaviors that may be construed as harassment, such as unwanted touching, forwarding emails with sexual content or making sexual comments about a colleague’s appearance.
The charity sector has also been hit by reports of abuse, and two major aid groups - Oxfam and Save the Children - revealed they had sacked a combined 38 staff over sexual misconduct in the past year.
Oxfam was battling on Monday to save its British government funding after a newspaper reported sexual misconduct by its staff in Haiti during humanitarian relief operations there following a 2010 earthquake.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 12:33 PM

BTW - this is off the 'Labour Too' website describing who they are and their aims.

1. All of us are Labour Party members, some with many years under our belt.
2. We’ve all held positions of responsibility in the Party and have a deep commitment to its success – we act not out of any misguided sense of factionalism, lack of loyalty or hostility to current or previous leaderships.
3. We are simply interested in letting the light in to the very real experience that women have in the Party day-in day-out so that those in positions of authority have the evidence to take real action.

How the hell can you support them by slagging off the current Labour leadership (see point 2)

Hypocrite.

On the face of it they are a very sincere group with very commendable aims. They are members of the Labour party who want to make sure that nothing like this is ever swept under the carpet as it has been elsewhere. Why are the members of the other political parties not following suit?

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 12:22 PM

Presumably you did not agree.

There is nothing to agree or disagree about. It is his view, no more nor less. He said absolutely nothing about "Tory women allowing themselves to be raped" (I still can't get my head round that one). That was your twisted interpretation. If you want to find out if PFR believes that Tory women allow themselves to be raped then ask him. I would just tell you to go and fuck yourself but he may be more polite.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 11:35 AM

Anyone join me in supporting "Labour Too" and similar pressure groups against misogyny and exploitation?
BBC,
"LabourToo is an internal Labour Party pressure group seeking to highlight and combat sexual assaults and discrimination within the party."

"The LabourToo spokesperson said the level of inexcusable behaviour in the party which had emerged in recent months was "genuinely distressing".
"Sexual harassment, abuse and discrimination is not restricted to the corridors of Westminster, but is taking place at all levels within the Labour Party," they said.
"We need a system that is not open to political bias or interference from the friends and allies of the usually more powerful men whose behaviour causes the problem in the first place." "

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 11:27 AM

Dave,
sorry. I misremembered. It was Steve who agreed PFR's statement.
Presumably you did not agree.
It does not look as though any of you will say what it meant.

Steve you have had the vulgar and fraudulent thing explained to you enough times.
The Dublin thing too. As I posted on 10Dec17,
"I never said that Dublin or EU wanted a hard border, just threatening.
.....
Rag,
Neither the EU or the Irish Government has EVER threatened a hard border.

UK was clear it did not want or need one. It was the EU and Dublin who kept raising the threat of one even though it would be very bad for Ireland. "

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 10:53 AM

the world's gone completely bonkers, and it aint ever going to get any saner...


[though there are still some struggling pockets of resistance...]


btw... i really miss my cheeky winky sticky out tongue emoji..

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 10:26 AM

BTW - I am still struggling with the concept of anyone allowing themselves to be raped. Surely rape is non consensual while allow is another word for consent. Is it another example of that different language that I keep going on about or am I missing something?

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 10:20 AM

Vulgar and fraudulent. That was a false statement you hoped to get away with, which you retracted only when found out. You also told us that Dublin wanted a hard border. Just a couple off the top of my head. *Yawn*

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 10:20 AM

Tory women allow themselves to be raped and abused without fuss for the party?
It means no such thing
Up to now, any womn that has been raped is forced to think twice before they report it because they know that they wil be raped again - this time by the skilled (and extremely expencive) defence councils who will seek to denigrate her again - the more money you have, the better defence council you can afford.
The prcentage of reported rapes are abysmally low and the percent of successful convictions even lower
The Labour party has a far better track record of examining such complaints than does the Tories - go count the number of such cases that have been suppressed - Heath's being one that should have been investigated years ago, as should a whole bundle of others
Keith was an enthusiastic participant in Israel's attempts to smear the Labour Party as "antisemitic"
Labour carried out an enquiry when the smears began - so the smears started to smear the enquiry - Keith included
At teh same time, a leading Muslim in Britain accused the Tory Party of Islmaophobia - an enquiry has yet to be held
The Tories don't like enquiris of any sort - what they can't ignore, they buy off - look how long they took to haul hout the porn horder and sex pest, Damien Greene - and our tame sex pest appeaser still defends him
And these people try to take the political hight ground - a joke!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 10:18 AM

PFR Said that on 01 Mar 18 at 03:26.

I only made one post between then and your question "are you claiming that Tory women allow themselves to be raped and abused" on 02 Mar 18 at 03:49 AM. and that was

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome - PM
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 03:40 PM

It's just business as usual in Yorkshire :-)

What beast?

:D

In what way shape or form has your demented little mind converted that into agreement to what was said?

You have lost it big time.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 10:09 AM

Lying shit Jim, everyone already knows what I said in that 2011 post, because you have told us a hundred times in the intervening years.
They also know how I justify it, but I have NEVER said what you accuse me of.

You ascribed to me, in quotes, a statement maligning Muslims.
That was a despicable, slanderous lie.
Those are not my views and I certainly never posted them and never would post such shit.
You are indeed a nasty, lying turd.

Again, if I have ever posted a false statement, QUOTE ME, LIAR!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 10:03 AM

Dave,
What did what mean?

What PFR said and you agreed.

He said, By it's very democratic nature the Labour party has a tradition of being more open to scrutiny
than the far more secretive and perverted scandal prone tories..

I took that to mean that other parties have the same problem but keep quiet about it, suggesting as I said that Tory women allow themselves to be raped and abused without fuss for the party?

If not that, what did it mean?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 09:32 AM

So what did it mean?

What did what mean? PFR's comment? Ask him. WTF are you on about?

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 09:30 AM

Doesn't even comprehend the difference between slander and liable.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 09:29 AM

"That was a despicable, slanderous lie."
You've said thius a hundred toimes and a hundred times I have put up your quote - complete
"Those are not my views"
#Your statement begins, "Don, I now believe..."
Your views, nobody elses - mythical or otherwise - yours
finis
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 08:48 AM

Dave,
You did get it wrong.
What a surprise.

So what did it mean?

PFR,
..at least Keith hasn't got round to blaming labour for the red commie russian snow ....yet.....

I have never blamed Labour for anything.
I have reported complaints about Labour from within Labour.
With your " tradition of being more open to scrutiny" you should welcome that.

Filthy liar Jim, you ascribed to me, in quotes, a statement maligning Muslims.
That was a despicable, slanderous lie.
Those are not my views and I certainly never posted them and never would post such shit.
You are indeed a nasty, lying shit.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 08:34 AM

..at least Keith hasn't got round to blaming labour for the red commie russian snow ....yet.....

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 08:22 AM

"I never have and never would say such a ludicrous and disgusting thing you filthy lying shit."
That is exactly what you said - two labour accusations of rape are far worse than anything else happening
"Dave said
"I have only intimated that there are more accusations of rape within Labour than other parties.
That is only your view, not a fact"
You responded
"It is a fact and I stand by it until someone produces similar accusations from within other parties.
If they were made they would certainly be reported."
Accusations of rape and sexual assault - even pedophilia have been pouring out for even a decade now - many of them have b=centred around politicians, Ministers, members of the House of Lords, High up Civil Servants - priests company direactors, memnbers of the Arts hierarchy ....
To claim that the pitifully few (and as yet unproven) accusations against Labour politicians is in any way significant in the tsunami of revelations is simple politicking on your part a squalid return to your "over-representation" claims about Muslims and Travellers
As far as I am concern, you are preying on the horrific events that are now coming to light - you are as much a sexual predator as are some of those monsters
No genuine human being behaves like that
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 07:37 AM

You did get it wrong.

What a surprise.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 07:04 AM

Lying shit Jim,
Keith - you are lying again - that is exactly what you said

I never have and never would say such a ludicrous and disgusting thing you filthy lying shit.

Dave,
PFR said, and you agreed, By it's very democratic nature the Labour party has a tradition of being more open to scrutiny
than the far more secretive and perverted scandal prone tories..

I took that to mean that other parties have the same problem but keep quiet about it, suggesting as I said that Tory women allow themselves to be raped and abused without fuss for the party?

I am sorry if I got that wrong. What did you both mean?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 04:42 AM

Keith - you are lying again - that is exactly what you said
Srop adding to your list and learn to tell the difference between truth and lies - this is becoming pathological
Finished with this - as you said once - "my work is done here"
As for your obscene use of rape to gain Party Political points, let's get things clear
It is rour right politicians who insist on treating women like second class citizens for the convenience of men
THe vote, equal pay, equal rights in marriage, the right to leave the home and have a say in their and their families - and now, the right to say "no" - all the aims of progressive humanitarians and all violently opposed by right wing administrations - have you been following some of the commemoration programmes on the suffragettes?
THe only reason that women first got the vote in the first place is because they did a deal with the people who were sending a generation of young men to be slaughtered in an Imperial war - until they did they faced humiliation, imprisonment and force-feeding
Our society ahs always been a misogynist one - women being second-class citizens is an essential part of the economy
That's what these exposures of sexual abuse, harassment and rape are all about - women and pointing out what is happening to them and saying "no"
It is typical that people of the right, like you, should use the rape of women to get more right-wing (largely) men in Parliament
Using women as you are here, as political propaganda, is a form of abuse in itself - you are just as much an abuser of women as the rest of these misogynist scumbags
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 04:08 AM

Pfr and Dave, are you claiming that Tory women allow themselves to be raped and abused without fuss for the party?

Huh? Where did that come from? I have claimed no such thing and I am pretty sure PFR did not either.

You really have lost it Keith. BTW - If it is allowed it is consensual. Think about it and then fuck off.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 02 Mar 18 - 03:49 AM

Liar Jim,
"Muslim implants that make them rape chidren -"

Faked quote. I never have and never would say such a ludicrous and disgusting thing.
You compound your filthy lying, liar.

You can not produce a single genuine quote of me making a false statement, because you are just a liar resorting to baseless personal attack when you can not challenge anything I actually say.

Pfr and Dave, are you claiming that Tory women allow themselves to be raped and abused without fuss for the party?
That is a preposterous argument.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 08:25 PM

"Not a single quote yet liar Jim."
You are even lying in public about that
You really can't distinguise betwen truth and fiction any more, can you?
There's a medical description for that
"You suggeted that what was happening in the Labour party was way ahead of anywhere else - two solid accusations!"
""Jim, instaed of making false claims about things said years ago, quote me liar."""
A total lie
""Jim, instaed of making false claims about things said years ago, quote me liar."""
Another
"Muslim implants that make them rape chidren -"
You denied it - a lie
"brainwashed schoolchildren"
You denied it - yuo lied
A Want more?
Respond to these first
Jim Caarroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 05:31 PM

Seven inches? Are you sure we're still talking about snowdrifts here, Raggytash?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 04:08 PM

Yup about 7 inches in mine and I'm in town, what the moors are like ..................... the car hasn't moved in days.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 03:58 PM

We have a whole five-inch snowdrift outside our back door. Anyone for one-upmanship?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 03:55 PM

Re: my broadband thread - I was going to get the train down to install my mum's new router,
but she forbade me to travel in such 'treacherous' conditions...

can't argue with mum...

Though only just a light layer of snow in our town centre back yard so far...

Funny that.. the slightest hint of snow from Russia and it's a Red alert...
This'll keep Mail reasders up all night searching the skies...

Gotta keep an eye out for Ruskie paratroopers in snow white camouflage combat uniform...!!!!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 03:40 PM

It's just business as usual in Yorkshire :-)

What beast?

:D

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 03:38 PM

You've hit the nail on the head there, pfr. Thst should be the end of it but you can bet yer life that a certain arse who posts to these threads will keep gnawing away at it.

By the way, you've got red up your end, have you? We're only amber down yer in Kernow. I'm jealous...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 03:26 PM

By it's very democratic nature the Labour party has a tradition of being more open to scrutiny
than the far more secretive and perverted scandal prone tories...

Which will unfortunately play right into the hands of tories
desperate to seize and capitalise on anything they can publicly exploit as 'Labour Problems'.....

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 03:19 PM

Well done for highlighting my point, Keith. No one but you would have read that statement in context as fact.

Now you can fuck off

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 03:12 PM

Jim,
Youve had a list of your lies Keith

Not a single quote yet liar Jim.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 03:11 PM

Dave,
Only you read them as facts. Normal people understood that they were views.

"it assumes that any savings on imports will be passed on to the consumer. We all know that this never happens."

I have only intimated that there are more accusations of rape within Labour than other parties.
That is only your view, not a fact.

It is a fact and I stand by it until someone produces similar accusations from within other parties.
If they were made they would certainly be reported.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 03:01 PM

"Why is that liar Jim?"
Youve had a list of your lies Keith
You want to open a betting book on Rapists in Britain - try your own Christian Church - streets ahead in numbers and tim they've been at it
"I have only intimated that there are more accusations of rape within Labour than other parties. "
How on earth can you jusy=tify trying to make party political capital on rape?
Sick, sick, sick
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 02:51 PM

Jim, still no quotes of a single false statement.

Why is that liar Jim?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 01:27 PM

"Liar Jim, if I made a false statement,"
I just havve
You want another?
You suggeted that what was happening in the Labour party was way ahead of anywhere else - two solid accusations!
That is a ****** lie
The whole of British and Irish society has been shown as being misogynist - pedophilic priest, rapist comedians, politicians, buisnessmenn holding conventions in the Best hotels, sportsmen, film directors....
We now have an American President who took office having advocated that it is ok to "grab womens' pussies"
Edward Heath, the Dolphin Square rapists,
The mysionogistic o our society is now catching up with us
- and do you welcome that fact - no you do not - you try to make political capital of it
You defend the probable culprits and try to make political capital out of it for your party by pointing to a pitiful few accusations -
You are both dishonest and disgusting
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 12:46 PM

You stated as facts things that were not true.

Only you read them as facts. Normal people understood that they were views.

I have only intimated that there are more accusations of rape within Labour than other parties.

That is only your view, not a fact. We do not know how many accusations have gone unreported and how many have been swept under the carpet. Even if it were true an accusation is merely that. Being accused of a crime is not the same as being found guilty. Come back when the verdicts are in and until then...

...

...

You know what is coming don't you.

...

...

Well. you can wait till next time.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 12:40 PM

Liar Jim, if I made a false statement, QUOTE IT!

Good luck with that, liar.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 12:25 PM

"Jim, if I have made any false statement, quote it."
Yoe have lied and distorted throughout every hhread you've been involved in You want a quote
"Jim, instaed of making false claims about things said years ago, quote me liar.""
None of the things I put up were "false" - you are now proving that by refusing to deny them (any more)
You lied
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 12:25 PM

"but no threat to anyone else

.. but who knows what other young ripe fruit would have been in danger if he had not accidently prematurely expired...??????

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 12:20 PM

Bizarre indeed, but no threat to anyone else.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 12:07 PM

Tories - the traditional party of scandals and sleaze... always good for a laugh..

Stephen David Wyatt Milligan..

..even poor defensless fruit are not safe from tory pervs...!!!

"Milligan's corpse was naked except for a pair of stockings and suspenders, with an electrical flex tied around his neck and a black bin liner over his head,
with an orange segment in his mouth.
The coroner concluded that he had died in the early hours of 7 February.
The pathologists report into Milligan's death discounted the possibility of murder, lending weight to the belief that he died accidentally,
as a result of autoerotic asphyxiation"

...ah... the comedy classics...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 11:54 AM

Jim, if I have made any false statement, quote it.

Dave,
I proffered my opinion on some topics.

You stated as facts things that were not true.

your intimation that there are more rapists in the Labour party

I have only intimated that there are more accusations of rape within Labour than other parties.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 11:24 AM

"
Jim, instaed of making false claims about things said years ago, quote me liar."
You have made disgusting use of everything I said you have and you know it - Musilim impnats that make them rape chidren - Muslims and immigrants with one blow, overepresented Labour politicians who rape far more women than your party, and Irish children who have been brainwashed to hate Britain
Which of these have you not used in your poliitcal crusade Keith   
Mays as well start here
"None of that compares with all the complaints, including of rapes, coming from Labour now.
I'll pull up the "cultural implant bit when you deny it
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 11:01 AM

That was because you made up false statements.
I see you decline to challenge anything I said.

I proffered my opinion on some topics. You disagreed with them. There was no falsehood in any of the statements I made. They were all my honest opinion.

I do challenge your intimation that there are more rapists in the Labour party than anywhere else but as we well know you are dishonest enough to say that this is not what you meant.

There are only two more words left to be said to you and I know that you will decline to comply with that request.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 10:50 AM

Rag,
Dave, don't you find it strange that someone who states his statements are factual does not even know about the Andrea Leadsome part in all this.

She just released results of a survey and made recommendations for a procedure.

Dave,
Keith, you insist that I am 'empty headed'

That was because you made up false statements.
I see you decline to challenge anything I said.

I had read your Indie piece thanks, and also a Guardian article.

Neither contradict anything I said.

Jim, instaed of making false claims about things said years ago, quote me liar.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 08:48 AM

"Do you challenge any of my statements?"
Anybody who uses raped children, harassed and raped women and immigrants to gain party polical points is a sicko - you have done all of these and more
I haven' bothered to mention your "brainwashed schoolchildren" - but it's on the way if you keep this filth up
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 08:29 AM

I like to help the disadvantaged ;-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 08:23 AM

Too generous by half Dave, I wouldn't have done that.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 08:21 AM

Didn't spot that Raggy - thanks.

Here you go Keith

Andrea Leadsom is set to publish new findings into tackling sexual harassment

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 07:57 AM

Keith, you insist that I am 'empty headed' yet chose to pick up on my points and wish to discuss them. In the words of the song, who's the fool now?

Anyway, you know I have only two words to say to you.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Raggytash
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 07:31 AM

Dave, don't you find it strange that someone who states his statements are factual does not even know about the Andrea Leadsome part in all this.

Isn't it good to know they have such a complete grasp of all the information, really gives you faith in what they post, not.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 07:10 AM

Dave,
Apart from any Labour MP who has already been tried by Keith and found guilty of spying while raping the neighbours cat.

I have stated nothing that I have not substantiated Dave.
Do you challenge any of my statements?
I say they are all factual and I challenge and defy you to find fault.

What is this Andrea Leadsome investigation that has seen Tory and Labour MPs suspended?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 06:54 AM

"Is anybody surprised?"
Not really
What does surprise and disgust me is how some people will use the rape and persecution of women as a party-political weapon - "our rapists are not as bad as your rapists"
Mind you, we should be used to that from someone who uses underage sex as a weapon against Muslims and the persecution of Jews as a defence of the mass murder of unarmed refugees (and a stick to beat the opposition)
Funny old world eh?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Hrothgar
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 05:53 AM

"Sexual impropriety at Westminster" is a bit like saying "Money at a bank". Is anybody surprised?

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 04:51 AM

You represent everything evil that has become part of modern life Keith - you have reduced political discussion to smear, prejudice and hate and dishonesty
You now appear to be totally incapable of discussing anything rationally without this tocxic mix and by behaving as you do, you wreck discussions before they even get going
Stop it
If you can't share opinions and ideas without any of this, please let those who can get on with it
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 04:20 AM

"Denied and not upheld."
As have been several of the accusations you have fought tooth and nail to pin on Labour
The man was a liar, which makekes everything ohe has to say on this matter suspect
=He was also happy to call two senior policemen liars which makes him a self-serving shit
He denied the pornography, claiming he knew nothing about it - he is a serial liar andf yu are still defending him - what does that make you?
You even defended a senior politician having this garbage on his computer by saying he hadn't broken the law - I do love your view of how senior politicians should behave !!!
"None of that compares with all the complaints, including of rapes, coming from Labour now. "
Don't be **** stupid Keith - the great and good have been up to their arsees in pornography, rape, paedophelia, the sex trade.... as far back in history as yopu vare to go
As with spying, this has all surfaced because British politics has become unstable, just as antisemitism surfaced when Israel clicked her fingers and spying when Corbyn started saying things the extreme right didn;'t like
You establishmen arse-lickers are a ****** joke
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 04:00 AM

I repeat

a string of MPs from across the political spectrum were suspended or placed under investigation

I also repeat

Let us bear in mind that this is all under investigation and nothing has been proved. As yet no one has been found guilty of anything. Apart from any Labour MP who has already been tried by Keith and found guilty of spying while raping the neighbours cat.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 01 Mar 18 - 03:56 AM

Jim,
And suuggested promotion for sex

Denied and not upheld.

and lied about a computer full of extreme pornography

He lied that the police had not told him, and was rightly sacked for that. The porn was perfectly legal and he denies having even seen it.

None of that compares with all the complaints, including of rapes, coming from Labour now.

Steve,
He's a one-man antI-Labour brainless blunderbuss.

Not anti-Labour, just anti-misogyny.
No other party is generating this kind of concern.
Some months ago 20 female Labour MPs wrote a letter complaining about it.

Labour clearly has a particular problem with both misogyny and anti-semitism, and all since the hard Left became dominant in the party.

BBC,
"Labour activists have submitted a dossier to Jeremy Corbyn detailing claims of harassment, intimidation and abuse "at all levels" in the party.
The 43 anonymised cases in the LabourToo report cover women describing themselves as party staff, activists, politicians and candidates.
They complain of behaviour ranging from inappropriate touching to rape."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43220512

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 04:40 PM

Nothing wrong with honest mistakes and admitting them. If only MPs would do the same!

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Kenny B (inactive)
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 04:15 PM

Were u in two minds re Nine tales

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Iains
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 03:55 PM

That should of course be cat's.
(just to anticipate the typo, spelling, grammar, dictionary police stalkers)

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Iains
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 03:26 PM

Must be a brave man! Cat'a claws are vicious.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 03:25 PM

It was a tom cat at that.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 03:18 PM

Eight Conservative MPs and four from Labour have been named since claims of unwanted sexual behaviour emerged in an investigation into sexual misconduct. Andrea Leadsom is leading a group which includes 10 MPs and two staff members. It was set up after a string of MPs from across the political spectrum were suspended or placed under investigation

Let us bear in mind that this is all under investigation and nothing has been proved. As yet no one has been found guilty of anything. Apart from any Labour MP who has already been tried by Keith and found guilty of spying while raping the neighbours cat.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Kenny B (inactive)
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 03:10 PM

I'm in no way backing up Keiths post Jim but whats wrong with history?
Generally if I read outdated stuff I ignore it with a wry smile

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 02:59 PM

"We have had the case of a Tory who "momentarily" brushed a friend's knee in a pub and texted that she looked nice in a published picture."
And suuggested promotion for sex and lied about a computer full of extreme pornography
And you have a prime minister suxpected of pedophilia nd others caught in the act and Govenment ministers coonsorting with prostitutes connected with Russian spies - not forgetting the Dolphin Square cover up
OLd as history Keith
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Kenny B (inactive)
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 02:58 PM

I hate to bring up the subject of religion again but does nobody stll believe in "let he who is without sin cast the first stone"
I wonder if we will have revelations about errant journalists ie Janet Street Porter to name but a few ( Smiley)

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 02:41 PM

Told you so. He's a one-man antI-Labour brainless blunderbuss.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 02:36 PM

We have had the case of a Tory who "momentarily" brushed a friend's knee in a pub and texted that she looked nice in a published picture.

It hardly compares with all the complaints, including of rapes, coming from Labour now.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 02:10 PM

But seriously. If anything should be non-party political under that thread title, it should be this. But I'm cheerfully predicting that it won't.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 02:06 PM

Other colour puddings are available...

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 01:36 PM

Ignore the troll.

Subject: RE: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Iains
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 01:23 PM

Why is that? I think I will put it back in again. It is far more in context than black puddings.

Subject: BS: Sexual impropriety at Westminster
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Feb 18 - 01:21 PM

Taking this out of the brexit thread.