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BS: News interview for Keith & Bob...
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 08 Apr 18 - 08:05 AM Jim, Keith confirming he is still supporting wartime anti-Semitism I did not, and would never support or even defend anti-Semitism as you, Dave and Steve did with the mural. You claimed, "When the news of the extermination of the Jews reached Britain one Tory Minister described it "the invention of whingeing Yids" was a total lie. No minister said any such thing or called Jews Yids. You lied and I was right to call you on it. Just as I was right to call you a liar when you claimed Momentum had made a statement about anti-Semitism. They never have. You are a liar and you have been doing it here for years. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 08 Apr 18 - 05:46 AM Very telling final statement Since August 2014, the majority of CAA’s activity has been a litany of lies and distortions directed against critics of Israel misrepresented as haters of Jews. As Greenstein says in the supporting text for the petition: “A cursory search of its [CAA’s] archives reveals almost nothing on fascist groups, who are antisemitic holocaust deniers. There are however 21 entries for Jewish Labour MP Gerald Kaufman, who supported the Palestinians, 70 entries for Jeremy Corbyn and 29 for Shami Chakrabarti – all of them hostile.” |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 08 Apr 18 - 05:38 AM I think this tells us a lot about the motives of the Campaign Against Antisemitism. It seems to me that they do more harm than good and there is currently a petition underway to get their charitable status revoked. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Jim Carroll Date: 08 Apr 18 - 04:57 AM I know that Raggy which is why I am not responding but it's still good to see Keith confirming he is still supporting wartime antisemitism even while pretending he is concerned with so-callled Corbyn's Not the brightest button on the SS uniform, is he? Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 08 Apr 18 - 04:42 AM There will be another demonstration against Labour anti-Semitism today, this time outside Labour HQ. Will Labour MPs attend when some experienced abuse or even had to leave constituency meetings afer attending the Parliament Square demo? This is what Labour supporting Daily Mirror says about it, "Hundreds of protesters are set to demonstrate outside Labour headquarters on Sunday against what they say is the party’s failure to tackle anti-Semitism. Activists will call on Labour’s hierarchy to “hold Jeremy Corbyn to account” amid renewed claims he is not doing enough to root out anti-Jewish hate in its ranks. It comes after a Labour MP who attended an earlier protest against anti-Semitism “stormed out” of a meeting of her local party after being heckled by members. The Campaign Against Anti-Semitism, which is organising tomorrow’s rally, is angry its complaint about Mr Corbyn to Labour’s new general secretary, Jennie Formby, was dismissed." |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Raggytash Date: 08 Apr 18 - 04:38 AM Hoops Jim, Hoops. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 08 Apr 18 - 04:34 AM Jim, "When the news of the extermination of the Jews reached Britain one Tory Minister described it "the invention of whingeing Yids". That WAS a lie Jim. You were never able to substantiate that claim because you HAD made it up. You lied then as you lie now about Momentum having made a statement about Tory anti-Semitism. You made that up too. You are a liar. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Jim Carroll Date: 08 Apr 18 - 03:58 AM "By the way: This thread is not supposed to be about you." This thread has never been about me - perhaps you wou;pd like to point out where I have tried to make it so? No? Thought not - rhetorical question! Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Jim Carroll Date: 08 Apr 18 - 01:56 AM "Keith understood it - nobody else had a problem with it It is a blow by blow account of Keith defending wartime British antisemitsim - clearly showing who said what - post by post - each statement is clearly named - blow by blow As far as I am concerned, your refusal to acknowledge that fact by dishonestly claiming not to understand it puts this whole argument - and you - clearly where it should be. This "antisemitism" has nothing to do with attacks on the Jewish people - is has everything to do with defending the behavior of an extremist right-wing Israeli administration slaughtering anybody who gets in their extremist right-wing way - yet more slaughtering yesterday and set to run and run. Your refusal to condemn Keith's antisemitism - even now it has been laid on the line for you - makes you no different than him I put Keith's posting up to see the reaaction of people like you (I have no doubt that Keith's attitude to the fate of the Jewish People has not changed one iota since he first put it up) - your continuing refusal to condemn a defence of wartime antisemitism, certainly served my purpose in drawing people like you who use The Jewish People as an excuse for mass murder out of their holes Many, many thanks Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: robomatic Date: 07 Apr 18 - 07:00 PM JC: Wrong Answer. Clean the spittle off your screen and re-read both my posts AND your posts and see which YOU can understand. By the way: This thread is not supposed to be about you. Try to write intelligently about something outside yourself. And maybe leave me out of it and I'll come back to this thread and write about something outside of you (Like my earlier posts). |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: punkfolkrocker Date: 06 Apr 18 - 09:23 PM For sake of brevity and clarity of communication, I think everyone should endeavour to keep each post as concisely to the point as possible... No matter how well meant, some folks do tend to get a bit self indulgent with the length and crammed content of posts they expect the rest of us to try to read and keep up with..... My eyes can only focus on a backlit screen for so long before straining... |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Jim Carroll Date: 06 Apr 18 - 09:04 PM Misunderstood - are you serious You rally have made my nigth Jim carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Jim Carroll Date: 06 Apr 18 - 08:55 PM I put extremely clearly what I thought of Keith's attitude then and now Now you are pleading ignorance You disgust me as much as he does The whole discussion was there worrd for word - not an inch of space for misunderstanding NOW YOU HAVE HAD IT EXPLAINED TO YOU YOU STILL REFUSE TO CONDEMN IT AND ATTEMPT TO PUT IT UP AS SOMETHING I "LIKE". You make me sick but at least you will never be able to accuse me of being ab antisemite again It also makes clear who the antisemitism in this discussion are Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: robomatic Date: 06 Apr 18 - 08:07 PM Jim Carroll: Honestly, I HAVE noticed your posts of anti-semitic lyrics in this and other threads, but perhaps you have not made it as clear as you could what is YOUR part of the post and what is not. When I make the same kind of posts, I try hopefully hard enough to italicize or change indentation or typeface or bold to make it obvious whose words I am quoting for agreement or not and what are my words and what are another thread contributors. Your posts need more curating! A few months ago you made a post quoting an anti-semitic song and I at first believed that was in aid of your point i.e. you enjoyed that song. Otherwise why quote the whole bloody thing? I am now getting the sense that you are trying to go back in time and other threads and dredge up others' arguments to make your detractors look bad. But you are not making that point clear enough for me. I am under the impression that you quote the anti-S songs because you like to and are just using a sneaky way of getting the words in. Please if you can have someone look over your stuff before you press the submit button to make sure you are giving the correct impression. It would be very unfortunate if you are putting out all those words but not making it clear which are yours, which are others, and when which portion was sent. I don't think I have you mis-pegged, but I'd really like you to represent yourself not only honestly (which I think you are trying to do) but competently. For both our sakes. For all our sakes. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Jim Carroll Date: 06 Apr 18 - 07:48 PM "I am sure I am not the only person who would like to know what Jim meant." Not as a reply to Keith but to listen to the roar of protest from Bobad, Bearded Bruce and Roboomatic as they leap to their feet in horror at Keith's antisemitism Don't all leap up altogether lads Keith - true to form, leapt to the defence of his party and claimed that I WAS A LIAR AND I HAD MADE IT UP - IT WAS ILLOGICAL He continued to do so for some time so I put up the information of a wartime organisation made up of Tory MPs, Members of the House of Lords and leading British businessmen. Keith continued to dispute my argument, so I put up some facts: The Right Club In May 1939 Archibald Ramsay, the Tory MP for Peebles and Southern Midlothian, founded a secret society called the Right Club. This was an attempt to unify all the different right-wing groups in Britain. Or in the leader's words of "co-ordinating the work of all the patriotic societies". In his autobiography, The Nameless War, Ramsay argued: "The main object of the Right Club was to oppose and expose the activities of Organized Jewry, in the light of the evidence which came into my possession in 1938. Our first objective was to clear the Conservative Party of Jewish influence, and the character of our membership and meetings were strictly in keeping with this objective." I also put up one of the many poems written by Archibald Ramsey, the founder of the organisation and published in the organisations publication, The Red Book: (11) Anti-Semitic poem distributed by the Right Club in 1939. Land of dope and Jewry Land that once was free All the Jew boys praise thee Whilst they plunder thee Poorer still and poorer Grow thy true-born sons Faster still and faster They're sent to feed the guns. Land of Jewish finance Fooled by Jewish lies In press and books and movies While our birthright dies Longer still and longer Is the rope they get But - by the God of battles 'Twill serve to hang them yet. Keith's immediate response was: Keith's respnse Subject: RE: BS: Ireland-What happened? From: Keith A of Hertford - PM Date: 16 Dec 10 - 12:57 PM "When the news of the extermination of the Jews reached Britain one Tory Minister described it "the invention of whingeing Yids"." Who was it? What is your source? Silly songs don't count, or I could post "Who Do You Think You Are Kidding Mr Hitler" as proof to the contrary! He later posted: Subject: RE: BS: Ireland-What happened? From: Keith A of Hertford - PM Date: 18 Dec 10 - 01:16 PM More dishonesty. I did not mention "Dad's Army" at all!! I merely offered an anti Fascist song to match your fascist one, making the point that finding a song is not evidence. Of course I know about a few fascists and anti semites in Britain. I have discussed them on this forum. Name a country that never had any. They were of so little influence here that we took in a hundred thousand Jewish refugees, and went to war with Hitler. Did you not know that? Remember - all this was around the Time Hitler was herding the German Jews into the Ghettos and preparing for their mass extermination. On another thread at a later date I raised the poem again (Keith continued to defend his original statement) As Bobad was involved at his "JEW HATER" best, I asked him what he thought of Keith's comparing virulent antisemitic poetry with a song from Dad's Army - despite numerous requests, Bobad refused to respond and continued his "JEW HATER" trolling It seems to me somewhat odd that two people with as much concern for the Jewish People as they claim should be, in Bobad's case, totally unconcerned at this fascist filth advocating the extermination of Jews (written in 1939) Keith should consider it so "harmless" that he compared it to a song for a sit-coms. I really do believe that this incident puts both Bobad's and Keith's concern for the Jewish people in context - anybody disagree? Any offers - Bobad - Bearded Bruce You've both seen this before - now's your chance I wonder what your response would have been if Corbyn had said what Keith did !! Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: robomatic Date: 06 Apr 18 - 07:30 PM Interesting take again in the New York Times, 'high-level' perspective and not an easy read for either side of the controversy. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: punkfolkrocker Date: 06 Apr 18 - 02:09 PM At this point, it would be useful for some to remind themselves of this traditional highly effective dirty tricks concept... Agent provocateur [no- not the lingerie...] Now, in the internet social media age, these covert methods have evolved in all sorts of devious ways..... |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 06 Apr 18 - 12:22 PM Jim, stay with the program :-) |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 06 Apr 18 - 11:57 AM Jim, These attacks on Labour have intensified since Israel's latest murderous atrocity - coincidence of course!!! If it is not a coincidence, what is it Jim? Where did all those accusations made by Labour people really come from? |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Jim Carroll Date: 06 Apr 18 - 11:33 AM Israel' Facebook interference with British politics is more or less the same as Russia's with the American election and Brexit It's set to get worse now that predator hackers have discovered that there is a market for hacked personal data Ireland is beginning to experience some of this with signs of it being used in the forthcoming abortion referendum They'll be using children next https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/dublin-toy-store-apologises-after-anti-abortion-material-discovered-in-catalogue-1.3450767 Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 06 Apr 18 - 10:58 AM The number of fake Facebook and Twitter accounts is yet to be fully realised but even on what we know now there is ample evidence of tampering with political processes around the globe. I have no doubt that those who wish to see Putin cast as the bad guy will accept that Russia are at least partially responsible for the brexit and Trump votes. Yet if anyone suggests that right wing groups are doing the same those same people will scream about conspiracy theories. Amazing. DtG |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 06 Apr 18 - 07:26 AM Jim, These attacks on Labour have intensified since Israel's latest murderous atrocity - coincidence of course!!! You mean, "These attacks on Labour, by Labour." Do you really believe that Israel has infiltrated the party to that extent? That the mass of complaints are from Israeli agents posing as members? This is conspiracy nut land. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Big Al Whittle Date: 06 Apr 18 - 07:25 AM True Keith...also The FRiend, the magazine of the Quakers is not unsympathetic to the Labour party. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Jim Carroll Date: 06 Apr 18 - 06:31 AM These attacks on Labour have intensified since Israel's latest murderous atrocity - coincidence of course!!! It would be stupid to deny that antisemitsm isn't on the rise again and that some of that hasn't rubbed off on the Labour Party - the use of the Jewish peope as human shields in defence of ongoing ethnic cleansing and constant atrocities has made that inevitable Labour needs to come to terms with that and make sure they don't pick up the Israeli line that is the Jewish people who are responsible for massacres such as that which happened last week A little difficult when criticism of the shooting down of unarmed protesters in now "antisemitic" according to the Israeli regime and its apologists Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 06 Apr 18 - 05:20 AM 500! Well said, Big Al. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Big Al Whittle Date: 06 Apr 18 - 04:51 AM 'Today is a bad news day for Labour.' it may have escaped your attention Keith, but every day is a bad news day for Labour. Mainly due to the news media being owned by bloated capitalists. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Jim Carroll Date: 06 Apr 18 - 04:30 AM Don't feed the troll lads - what he has might be catching Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 06 Apr 18 - 03:57 AM ...or should I say sinking to? |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 06 Apr 18 - 03:52 AM Honestly people, trust me on this. Most of us know the truth. The site management know the truth. It really is not worth rising to. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 06 Apr 18 - 03:40 AM I posted about Jewish Momentum organiser Joshua Garfield. He was interviewed on R4 Today programme this morning with Charlotte Nichols, a Jewish member of the Young Labour group. Asked if they thought Labour anti-Semitism was "a real problem" and if it required "expulsions" they both said "absolutely yes." Yet more proof that I was right all along and you were all wrong. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 06 Apr 18 - 03:20 AM Your case was that the problem was not real, and PFR thought his video proved it. That is why he put my name in the title. I easily proved you all wrong just by quoting senior Labour people. Jim even tried inventing a "Statement" from Momentum that supported your case, but I exposed the lie. That was all you had, so you resorted again to making it personal against me. You are just bad losers. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: punkfolkrocker Date: 06 Apr 18 - 03:08 AM Robo - it's like you've come in and watched a random episode of a long running TV drama series and presumed to know what lead up to it in the previous 6 seasons... ...we're now into an on and off relationship's final straw in the story arc.... |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Jim Carroll Date: 06 Apr 18 - 03:04 AM "Is it okay to say "Jesus Wept!" Why not? You and yours feel free to abuse the beliefs of others - why should you not expect the same ? That particular phrase is not particularly abusive or insulting anyway and - if the character in question ever lived anyway' most of us don't particularly think of him in terms of his Jewishness - rather that the philosophy that he inspired, so using the name cannot be regarded as a slight on any articular people or religion. As for Keith - he is a "Christian" (note the inverted commas, who has made a point of using his religion against that of others - as an attack on the Muslim religion for instance, claiming that his particular brand is being killed off by them - religious warfare that has no place here or anywhere as far as I am concerned Keith, Bobad and Bearded Bruce are there examples of everything that is dangerously intolerant intolerant in today's world. I am an atheist from an Irish Catholic background and I have to say that, after a lifetime surrounded by religion, friends and family particularly, I have never encountered anybody as inhumanly hate-filled as eith and his cronies - Keith is as unchristian towards the weak and persecuted as they come. I have no idea where he fits into the Christianity I was taught while growing up He brings a whole new meaning to the phrase "suffer the little children" when he defends their persecutors and slaughterers, as he does regularly on this forum. Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 06 Apr 18 - 01:38 AM It was in an effort to be friendly, robomatic. I suggest you read the opening posters recent comments before making such judgements. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: robomatic Date: 06 Apr 18 - 12:17 AM This thread was named for Keith and now those who sought to engage with him and Bob are seeking to continue the discussion withOUT them. Is it okay to say "Jesus Wept!" in this case? I really think there's a literary right to use the term here, 'kay? If you can make common cause with dead Jews and accuse the rest of the world of being antisemites, I think I can do the same with another dead Jew. Turnabout and all that. 'Sonly fair! |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Steve Shaw Date: 05 Apr 18 - 08:03 PM Jim, we're ignoring his posts, some of us. Mostly the people he tries to engage with his bollix. Doesn't mean we can't discuss points germane to the thread that he mentions. But we seriously need to talk past him, not at him. It's hard but it's possible. Let's all go for it, Jim, with fortitude. We all know it makes sense. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Jim Carroll Date: 05 Apr 18 - 07:08 PM "Told you, Jim ;-)" Even hsi two mates ahve abandoned him - not because they'r disgusted by his antisemitism , but because he's blown their cover Not totally useless after all Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 05 Apr 18 - 03:36 PM Told you, Jim ;-) |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 05 Apr 18 - 02:33 PM I didn't. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: punkfolkrocker Date: 05 Apr 18 - 01:11 PM "02 Apr 18 - 10:43 AM Keith - I'm not in the mood for your nonsense today. So don't take my silence as tacit agreement to any tripe you continue to post here..." |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 05 Apr 18 - 01:00 PM I was the only one who tried to still be friendly with you and give you another chance.. ...but annoyingly I kept challenging your beliefs and prejudices, and you had no reply. Finally I proved you wrong, so you all have no choice but to withdraw. I am very happy with that. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: punkfolkrocker Date: 05 Apr 18 - 11:40 AM Raggy - in this internet age, that is such an obvious dirty trick to be reasonably suspicious of.. But in this current topsy turvy climate.. just pointing out a conspiracy that is so obviously conspiring right under your nose can get a chap/lady vilified, demonised, suspended, banished to the darkest regions of political oblivion... .. just saying... |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Raggytash Date: 05 Apr 18 - 11:25 AM Not at all surprised by the content of your post at 10.51 Dave, I suggested to another poster earlier that this could easily be the case. Good to have it clearly demonstrated though. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: punkfolkrocker Date: 05 Apr 18 - 10:53 AM Dave - ok, fair enough, I'd clung onto hope until the bitter end, despite being advised by others I was wasting my time and patience. So you as well - It's a shame our hands of friendship were not reciprocated, but ignored and now lost... I can actually be friends with folks I disagree with on quite fundamental beliefs, but I don't have enough patience for folks with damaged personalities and dysfunctional behaviour... That's why I opted out of training to be a social worker back in my 20s..... |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 05 Apr 18 - 10:51 AM Fake social media accounts used to smear Labour supporters & undermine Corbyn |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 05 Apr 18 - 10:31 AM BTW - I have give up singing 'Adieu sweet lovely Nancy' in case it is misinterpreted. :D tG |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 05 Apr 18 - 10:26 AM I was the only one who tried to still be friendly with you Not quite true, PFR. I tried, only to have it used against others. I have tried logic, reason, ridicule and just plain abuse. Non of them work. Isolation is the only thing I can think of now. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: punkfolkrocker Date: 05 Apr 18 - 10:21 AM Keith - [temporarily breaking silence] I was the only one who tried to still be friendly with you and give you another chance.. Over the duration of this thread, that has proven to be futile. You do not want to be an active member of this community, just an abrasion to it...[Return to silent mode]... |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Dave the Gnome Date: 05 Apr 18 - 10:17 AM Spot on PFR. Trouble is, everyone needs to do it to make it work. |
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Subject: RE: BS: News interview for Keith & Bob... From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 05 Apr 18 - 10:08 AM PFR, Obsessive nuisance forum posters require being totally starved of attention... You wrote my name into the title presumably to encourage me to give my views on your OP interview. I gave my views and now you do not like it. Is it because I have shown the interviewee to be wrong and because your case that Labour does not have a serious problem did not stand up to scrutiny? I think so. There is nothing "obsessive" in my contributions, which are mostly just quotes of Labour people supporting my case and demolishing yours. I am only a "nuisance" because none of you can answer, except Jim who makes shit up with all of you supporting him. |