BS: The Midsomer Murder fox

Subject: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 13 Oct 18 - 04:29 PM

Being somewhat of a masochist, I occasionally watch ITV's "Midsomer Murders"episodes - just for a laugh, you understand. I'm always a sucker for the clichés of detective "soaps", and enjoy many of the silly things that take place.

Mt current fave is any of the night scenes in Midsomer. No matter what time of the night, or what season of the year, the same dog fox barks - in exactly the same way - once or twice. We listen out for it now - in fact, it's our favourite character, more so than any of the regular human players. I hope they never lose the FX tape...

And why is John Nettles always so wheezy and out of breath?

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Jos
Date: 13 Oct 18 - 04:47 PM

Well spotted, but isn't that just another less obvious version of Channel 4 documentaries showing the same snippets of film over and over and over again?
And listeners to 'The Archers' complaining that whenever they heard a cow it as always the SAME cow? (And my mother 60 years ago saying that the living rooms in television plays always had the same picture hanging on the wall.)

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 13 Oct 18 - 04:53 PM

Absolutely, but we still enjoy the fox - bless it!

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 13 Oct 18 - 05:37 PM

Why is he wheezing? The actor is 75.

I'll have to listen for the fox. Turns up in night scenes, you say?

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 13 Oct 18 - 05:44 PM

75 indeed - too old to be a police inspector!

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 04:23 AM

He may be 75 (Now) but he stopped playing the part in 2010.
That doesn't mean that the character he was playing was supposed to be 67.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: fat B****rd
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 05:10 AM

I love Midsomer Murders for it's stock characters. Disgruntled businessman, retired colonel, randy rich wife, randy local tradesman, problem teenager et al.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 05:15 AM

I just go with the flow - the Constant Fox, the silly plots, the ever-present "cliffhanger" dramatic ending, the impossible village names, the out-of-breath policeman, the constantly changing sergeants, Joyce's crappy cooking and myriad hobbies - and, not least, Cully.

I caught the end of a Poirot episode yesterday, while practising the guitar, and grimaced at the awful and inevitable "dénouement", where Hercule gathers the assembled suspects together and, although he knows the culprit perfectly well, proceeds to semi-accuse each one in turn before revealing the real one. What a farce.

Raymond Chandler (educated at Dulwich College) had a few harsh words for Agatha Christie in his book of essays, "Down These Mean Streets", where he ridiculed the typically British genre and compared it unfavourably with the reality of nitty-gritty policing. Chandler's stuff, in its own way, is just as artificial. Both are bed-time reading on my Kindle.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 05:18 AM

Hey Charlie - how are you doing? Have you noticed that Midsomer even has the odd non-white character in it now?

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: DMcG
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 05:19 AM

In a similar theme, as a youngster, myself, brother and sister used to play "spot Sam Kydd". He rarely had a major role - though he has done some - but seemed to have a role as bit-part player in everything. According the his Wikipedia entry "Kydd took part in more than 240 films and 1,000 TV plays and series".

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 05:22 AM

I remember Sam Kydd - always played rather seedy, low-life "common" characters.

Midsomer, of course, seems to have a cadre of favourite actors, who appear regularly in different roles.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: DMcG
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 05:29 AM

I think you are a little harsh on the Poirot endings. While it is certainly artificial, it comes out of the idea you have been reading the book and attempting to work out who the murderer was yourself. So that set scene is basically saying that the theory you came up with why Dr Jones was the murderer is plausible for these reasons but cannot be right because of something you overlooked while reading.   And it does so for all the main suspects.

So it works well, if a bit laboured, when you are actively trying to solve the puzzle yourself. On the other hand if you are not, whether in a book or film form, the artificiality becomes more of a problem.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 05:34 AM

Of course - they have to be considered rather like cryptic crosswords. Though it was quite amusing, in the episode I caught, to hear one of the characters say, "Oh, for God's sake, Poirot, get to the point!"

Quite.

I think it was "The Mysterious Affair at Styles" - the first Poirot novel.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 05:42 AM

...and series for "yoof" the sets always have a bowl of fruit though no fresh fruit ever passes anyone's lips!
RtS

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Senoufou
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 05:46 AM

I've read (and love) nearly all Agatha Christie's books. My shelves are groaning with them. Husband says they keep me quiet at bedtime while he gets to sleep.

I've always thought David Suchet's portrayal of Hercule Poirot to be perfect. And Joan Hickson was the very best ever Miss Marple.

I agree the dénouements are complicated and long drawn-out, but that's for the benefit of the reader/viewer. Christie plays with her readers with red herrings and false turns throughout, and even at the end one is left dangling for ages before All Is Revealed.

I watched Midsomer Murders for the first time last night, and it seems that John Nettles has retired and someone called Neil Dudgeon has taken his place. (funny name!) Didn't hear the fox though.
But we have our own live fox noises in the village at night.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 05:59 AM

Neil Dudgeon also played George the chauffeur in the "Mrs. Bradley Mysteries> in the late 1990s.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 06:28 AM

I always seem to think after I've watched Midsummer Murders, well that was a load of bollocks. Its the endings - the way all the plots are resolved . you just think - well that was nonsense.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 06:47 AM

Bollocks indeed, Al - but harmless, fun bollocks.

My wife's a fan of the Scandinavian crime soaps - starting with "Wallander" and continuing from there. I'm not interested, preferring the sunny uplands and food of "Inspector Montalbano". Also bollocks, but full of sunshine, sea and sex - as well as arancini!

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Murpholly
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 10:42 AM

Hubby and I always listen for the fox - and the owl hooting too. But our favourite character is Sykes. That dog has more personality than all the humans.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 11:46 AM

Sorry,
Mentions above of Poirot, Miss Marple, and Wallander. My favourite is Lord Peter Wimsey (Dorothy L Sayers). I have most (if not all) of the books, and most (if not all) of the TV versions.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 12:06 PM

As much as the formulaic stories, I find Midsomer Murders to be the repository for both the very early performance today's established actors, and the late-in-career performance of actors way past their prime. Similar to the 1980's and 90's American Murder She Wrote, and I suspect Angela Landsbury had a lot to do with the selection of the older actors who were her early career peers. Her friend Hurd Hatfield turned up several times at the very end of his career, for example.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 12:07 PM

Which do you prefer as Wimsey, Nigel - Ian Carmichael or Edward Petherbridge?

I have all the novels on my Kindle. I think my favourite is "Murder Must Advertise". Dorothy Sayers worked in an ad agency for some years and created a fanous ad campaign called The Mustard Club - analogous to the Whifflets campaign in the novel.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 12:36 PM

Will,
Although I grew up with the Ian Carmichael versions (including audio versions) I prefer the Edward Petherbridge depiction. That may be because his versions covered the (later) tales involving Harriet Vane.
It is just a shame that so much had to be left out of the stories to make them suitable for TV.
I particularly missed the character of Lord St George (Peter's nephew).
Just for the sake of completion, let's not forget Robert Montgomery (father of Elizabeth Montgomery, Samantha in "Bewitched") in the 1940 version of "Busman's Honeymoon"

Cheers

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 12:39 PM

Yes, I prefer the Petherbridge versions as well, in spite of the truncation. I've never seen "Busman's Honeyoon" - I shall look out for it.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 12:55 PM

Best EBay price I can see is here: Haunted Honeymoon although under its US title.

Cheers

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 01:05 PM

I've also got BBC radio dramatisations (With Ian Carmichael) of The Nine Tailors, Whose Body, Five Red Herrings, and Busman's Honeymoon.
Most of which I haven't listened to, I'm waiting to transfer them to a memory stick, or similar to listened to in the car.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: fat B****rd
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 02:07 PM

Hey, Will. I'm fine, thankyou, and I hope you are too.
Yes, more "non-white" folks. Clark Peters in a folk-themed episode !.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 02:31 PM

Its well known, that if you want to know who dunnit in Midsomer Murders, a good way to find out is to go through the actors who are playing the minor characters, and work our who is the most expensive. Any Fox is certainly a good candidate.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: fat B****rd
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 02:56 PM

I'm not up with recent whodunnits but I did enjoy "Spiral" "The Killing" and "The Bridge".
BTW Eliza, Neil Dudgeon was in an earlier Midsomer as......a randy local tradesman!.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Senoufou
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 03:43 PM

Ah I see he played a randy gardener fat B!

I've heard it said that there can't be many residents of Midsomer still alive, the majority having been murdered over the years.

Our village must seem very dull in comparison. We have three different jobbing gardeners who live here, but as far as I know, none of them is randy.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 04:11 PM

remember Columbo, Ellery Queen.

Poirot has the best sets, estates, vehicles, ships, music and costumes.
Midsomer has the best Perry Mason endings and primitive scenes with no continuity or attention to details like an early Bond movie.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 06:46 PM

I haven't seen any of the new Midsomer Murders with Neil Dudgeon. I see that he still has the name of Barnaby, but he is John, not Tom (Nettles' character). It looks like Tom's wife and daughter stepped away at the same time.

Yes, Columbo plays here every weekend evening, a couple of programs at a time, but for all of the years it was on the air they seem to only play the same 2 or 3 dozen repeatedly. Ellery Queen with Jim Hutton was a good one, I don't know if it ended before his death or with his death. A particular favorite of mine is the Nero Wolfe series with Timothy Hutton as Archie Goodwin and Maury Chaykin playing Wolfe. That was only two seasons, and was true ensemble cast, but what a great cast! Many of them are Canadian actors and when they pop up today in new programs I always flashback to the Wolfe series.

The closeted actor Raymond Burr played Perry Mason and made it his own. In later years a network tried to renew it with an actor who more resembled the character in the novels and it landed with a dull thud. I only mention Burr's sexuality because back then being gay was undoubtedly a career-breaker, but I read later that he did have a partner and they were together for many years. There was an early rumor going around, long before Google would have sussed it out, that he had a wife and son who died tragically in an auto accident. There were never any romantic episodes for Burr, Paul Drake got all of the action. That apparently wasn't the case in the novels (my Mom was the one who read the books first, this was her view.)

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 07:57 PM

I always liked that Columbo about the IRA - The Conspirators. I believe it was Peter Falk's favourite. To me it represents America's naivety about the paramilitaries in NI. And I quite like that.

I believe the main actor was a New Zealander.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: robomatic
Date: 14 Oct 18 - 10:38 PM

There is a well known death scream effect that crops up everywhere, movies, TV shows, etc. It's called "The Wilhelm Scream "

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Senoufou
Date: 15 Oct 18 - 03:55 AM

My favourite detective novels of all time are Alexander McCall Smith's series about Mma Precious Ramotswe, a lady detective in Botswana.
She's the owner of 'The Number One Ladies' Detective Agency' in Gabarone.

Mma Ramotswe doesn't investigate murders, but as a private detective she solves mysteries, family problems and missing persons etc.

McCall Smith knows Botswana very well and his stories are authentic in their depiction of life in southern Africa.

He writes a new one every year and I'm champing at the bit every time waiting for it to arrive.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Jos
Date: 15 Oct 18 - 04:28 AM

Along with my mother commenting on the picture on the wall in television plays, my grandmother always complained when someone poured tea that the tea was cold (because cold tea makes a louder trickling sound than hot tea).

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 15 Oct 18 - 04:31 AM

My wife's a fan of the "Brokenwood" mysteries which, I believe, are set in new Zealand. I watched one myself and immediately learned how to speak with a New Zealand accent - you take all the syllables pronounced "ed" and say them as "id". And there you have it1 :-)

So, "Brokenwood" becomes "Brokenwid", and "better dead than red" becomes "bitter did than rid". Simples.

With apologies to Vectis and all 'Catters in NZ!

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Senoufou
Date: 15 Oct 18 - 04:37 AM

I'm like your grandmother Jos in that I laugh when a lovely meal is portrayed in a television ad. There's never any steam coming off it, so it's evidently stone cold!
And was the ubiquitous picture on living room walls 'The Green Lady' by any chance?

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Jos
Date: 15 Oct 18 - 05:38 AM

No, it wasn't the Green Lady - probably too many viewers would have recognised a picture that they had on their own wall, and so would have noticed it turning up on different sets. It was just a rather anonymous looking landscape, a field, a few trees, chosen not to be noticed particularly, but to look like many a 1950s living room wall anywhere in the country.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: fat B****rd
Date: 15 Oct 18 - 07:48 AM

And, here's a chestnut, why does nobody ever pour a full cup of tea or coffee on telly?.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Will Fly
Date: 15 Oct 18 - 08:13 AM

And why do they never finish a pint of beer in a pub?

Or stop shaving and wipe the cream off their face when only half shaved?

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Jos
Date: 15 Oct 18 - 09:43 AM

I suspect they don't finish the pint in the pub because it isn't really beer.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 16 Oct 18 - 08:16 AM

When I was an extra in the bar in Crossroads, they filled and refilled my beer glass with real beer.

I was 'man in bar'. In a sense I created that role.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Jos
Date: 16 Oct 18 - 08:27 AM

Big Al, maybe I was wrong (and did you get paid as well?).
But did the actors get real beer?

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Oct 18 - 08:33 AM

My wife is a fan and author of murder mysteries. I even tried to help with concepts but it belongs to her.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: HuwG
Date: 16 Oct 18 - 10:05 AM

My favourite Poirot ending:


I expect you're all wondering why I have gathered you all together in the library ... pardon? Oh! Sorry!    _{I expect you're all wondering why I have gathered you all together in the library.}

With apologies to The News Quiz (BBC2) and Miles Jupp.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 16 Oct 18 - 12:08 PM

Yes, you got paid. It was about £3o. If they did two episodes that day, you got £60.

The actors were very professional. I remember one time they decided Miss Lucy was going to be reconciled with her lover. So they wrote everybody bloody great long speeches which they had 20 minutes to memorise, and very creditably, they did - first take.

Acorn Antiques had nothing on it.

Subject: RE: BS: The Midsomer Murder fox
From: keberoxu
Date: 16 Oct 18 - 05:20 PM

Earlier posts brought up show series-es (plural?)
noted for bringing on actors near the end of their careers
for this or that episode.

I have seen very very little of the television re-working of
"Hamish MacBeth"
(have read a bunch of the books)

What I hear ABOUT the TV series, though, is that
quantities of Scottish actors with solid careers behind them
got work on the, what was it, three years that the series ran.