BS: Russian Vodka

Subject: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 10 Nov 18 - 12:28 PM

A friend brought me a bottle of vodka back from Russia.

I always thought that proper Russian vodka smelled of fish.
But the vodka from Russia just seemed like English vodka. No fish smell.

Has anyone else heard the 'smells of fish' story? I can't recollect where I heard it.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 10 Nov 18 - 12:38 PM

Don't think I've ever knowingly drunk Vodka of any nationality, and I've certainly never heard the 'fish' thing. Sounds fishy to me.

However, when I was a drinker, I was very fond of a drop of Highland Park, or Pusser's Rum. Those definitely don't taste of fish!

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: leeneia
Date: 10 Nov 18 - 02:53 PM

No, Al. I think someone named the wrong liquor or else was teasing. Vodka should not smell like fish. I googled to make sure.

A long time ago, Smirnoff (I think) had an ad campaign which said "It leaves you breathless," implying that if you drink their vodka, people will not smell the alcohol on your breath. But take it from a non-drinker, when someone has been drinking vodka, I can tell by the smell. Apparently what I smell is not the alcohol itself but some other component. The smell seems like a solvent, not like fish.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Iains
Date: 10 Nov 18 - 03:37 PM

Vodka is normally passed through charcoal filters. This makes it virtually tasteless. Having distilled grape residues in the past I have put charcoal filtering to the test. It is very efficient.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 10 Nov 18 - 06:12 PM

Depends.. if it's home made DIY toxic waste vodka...

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Nov 18 - 08:10 PM

The last time I drank vodka was on my 20th birthday in 1971. I drank 3/5 of a bottle, shortly after I'd supped five pints of Tartan bitter. I vaguely remember standing at the top of Warwick Gardens, just up from Earls Court, unable to put one foot in front of the other to make progress. Can't remember much after that at all. I've avoided vodka ever since.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: BobL
Date: 11 Nov 18 - 03:27 AM

The smell of (some) vodka reminds me of the stuff we used to clean computer disks, back in the days before megabytes - isopropyl alcohol. So maybe the vodka just smells of ethanol.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Nov 18 - 03:58 AM

Coming from Polish stock I can confirm that Polish vodka does not smell of fish. I have tried Russian, Swedish and even Vladivar from Varrington as well and none of those have any piscine taint either.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Iains
Date: 11 Nov 18 - 04:06 AM

I was bored so did a little digging. Enjoy.

ABSTRACT We explored in humans concentration-detection functions for the odor of the homologous n-alcohols ethanol, 1-butanol, 1-hexanol, and 1-octanol. These functions serve to establish structure-activity relationships, and reflect the pharmacology of the olfactory sense at the behavioral level. We tested groups of 14 to 17 subjects (half of them females), averaging 31 to 35 years old. An 8-station vapor delivery device (VDD8) presented the stimulus under a three-alternative forced-choice procedure against carbon-filtered air. The VDD8 was built to meet the demands of typical human sniffs in a short-term (<5 s) olfactory detection task, and to accurately control odorant generation, delivery, and stability. Actual stimulus concentration was quantified by gas chromatography before and during testing. The functions obtained were log normally distributed and were accurately modeled by a sigmoid (logistic) function, both at the group and at the individual level. Sensitivity to ethanol was the lowest and to 1-octanol the highest. Functions became steeper with increasing carbon chain length. For all alcohols the concentration detected halfway between chance and perfect detection (threshold) was at the ppb (or nM) level. Females were slightly more sensitive than males. Intersubject variability across participants was between one and two orders of magnitude. The present odor thresholds were lower than many reported in the past but their relative pattern across alcohols paralleled that in our earlier data and in compilation studies. A previously described quantitative structure-activity relationship for odor potency holds promise to model thresholds that, like those obtained here, best reflect the intrinsic sensitivity of human olfaction.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Donuel
Date: 11 Nov 18 - 03:10 PM

A bottle of Stolie already comes from Russia, no need to bring one back.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Rob Naylor
Date: 13 Nov 18 - 04:53 AM

Big Al,

There are hundreds of Russian vodkas, of hugely variable quality and smoothness. I've never detected a fishy smell in any of them.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Rob Naylor
Date: 13 Nov 18 - 04:55 AM

Of course, vodka in Russia is invariably drunk with snacks, which are often dried or smoked fish, which is maybe where the myth originated.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Will Fly
Date: 13 Nov 18 - 05:41 AM

Polish vodka for me every time - Wyborowa Blue Label, or "Bison Brand" with the blade of grass from the Polish forests (where the bison roam) inside the bottle...

My Polish father-in-law insisted we take an ice-cold tot before Sunday lunch - with "Stolat" (100 years) or "Nasdrowia" (cheers) as the toast - before saying, "Mmm... I think we have another..."

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Nov 18 - 04:01 PM

An excellent tradition, Will. Sounds like something I may take up myself :-) I can't remember having the Wyborowa but I am partial to the Bison grass one and there are more Polski Skleps near hear than you can shake a stick at.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: bobad
Date: 14 Nov 18 - 04:24 PM

Polski Skleps

Polski Sklepy is the correct plural form, pedantically speaking.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Nov 18 - 05:12 PM

I speak neither Polish nor pedantically:-)

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Jack Campin
Date: 15 Nov 18 - 06:50 AM

The Turkish/Greek equivalent of the Russian snacks Rob described is to drink raki/ouzo accompanied by a plate of kokorec, which is grilled chopped intestines sprinkled with chili. And the Icelandic one is to drink their "Black Death" schnapps accompanied by globs of rotted shark.

Then you have the Swedish and Croatian traditions of slamming down spirits infused with large concentrations of chili. There seems to be a common theme to all of these that drinking spirits shouldn't be fun.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Jos
Date: 15 Nov 18 - 08:26 AM

Drinking spirits is medicinal. The tradition in some countries is to drink the local spirit first thing in the morning on an empty stomach - as a cure for worms.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 15 Nov 18 - 08:34 AM

When I stayed with Czech families 20 odd years ago,
some would insist I drank home made Slivovitz with breakfast...

But I did like being able to buy beer with breakfast at train stations...

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 15 Nov 18 - 10:59 AM

When I was still plumbing I had job installing central heating for a local Polish family, The old feller made me tea in the middle of the morning,on the second day, he told me the milkman hadn't been so he put some 120% proof Polish vodka in it instead, bloody wonderful.

Dave H

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: ST
Date: 15 Nov 18 - 04:52 PM

The story probably comes from 1990s when the local market was flooded with lots of phoney drinks, some claimed to be imported but never heard of in the countries of their supposed origin, some claimed to be the "authentic" but apparently just as fake. Most were made out of cheap and dirty cellulosic ethanol, usually stinking of burnt rubber but sometimes even worse.

Another thing that might have been served or sold as "real vodka" and smell of whatever would be home-made distilled, but never ever filtered, alcohol. They typically didn't even pour away the first and the last portions of the liquid; everything was considered good enough as long as it could catch on fire.

I seriously pity whoever brought the story back to the world. Either kind would completely ruin their next day.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Nov 18 - 05:24 AM

It has been seen as such for a long time, Jos. It is no coincidence that the word whisky is derived from the Gaelic 'Uisge Beatha' or 'water of life'. French terms for Brandy include 'Eau de Vie', meaning the same :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Jack Campin
Date: 16 Nov 18 - 07:05 AM

The story probably comes from 1990s when the local market was flooded with lots of phoney drinks, some claimed to be imported but never heard of in the countries of their supposed origin

Scotland owes the French supermarkets a great debt for discovering a whole lot of glens we never knew existed. I imagine they emerged from the mist like Brigadoon when alcohol import duties changed.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: keberoxu
Date: 17 Nov 18 - 11:21 AM

are you sure you weren't thinking of caviar ?

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 17 Nov 18 - 11:33 AM

I used to drink Russian vodka, but I stopped when it started making me want to interfere with US elections on behalf of Republicans.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Donuel
Date: 17 Nov 18 - 11:42 AM

I can't imagine that near 100% grain alcohol can improve with aging as it does with Scotch. https://vinepair.com/wine-blog/14-things-you-didnt-know-about-vodka/

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Nov 18 - 04:09 PM

no, it wasn't caviar. it was definitely vodka, i heard it about.

i'm getting the message though - there's no such thing as fishy vodka. i was misinformed.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Rob Naylor
Date: 19 Nov 18 - 03:52 AM

Of course, Al, if you pootle on down to the Kilmington Farm Shop, you can buy vodka made from milk (whey, actually)...."Black Cow" vodka, West Dorset's finest!

Took a couple of bottles to Russia once. The Moscow Journalists' verdict was "Very nice....bring some more". On Sakhalin, a slightly more robust verdict of "A good vodka for girls to drink, maybe". :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Jack Campin
Date: 19 Nov 18 - 06:14 AM

You've been to Sakhalin?

There was a lively thread on the sci.lang Usenet newsgroup around 1990 where somebody had bought a bottle of spirit in the Soviet Far East labelled (in Cyrillic) "Chugdush". He quoted the text on the label, which was in no language anyone could identify, but there were some hilarious guesses. A lot of the words began "pt-" which I saw much later in a sample of Nivkh. Does that make sense to you?

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: DMcG
Date: 19 Nov 18 - 01:26 PM

The last time I drank vodka (more or less anyway)...

I was a student who had taken a new half bottle in a hip-flask bottle to a dull party. After not very long at the party I took it out again and discovered I had finished it.

It was a very odd feeling to not feel drunk in the slightest but well aware that in half an hour or so I would probably be unable to stand...

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 19 Nov 18 - 01:54 PM

I've been with my mrs since spring 1982,
because of a bottle of vodka in my hall of residence room
after a student party...

Neither of us can remember which day or week that was...

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Rob Naylor
Date: 20 Nov 18 - 09:28 AM

Jack Campin: You've been to Sakhalin?

Many times. I spent at least 3 months a year there from 2012 to 2016, sometimes more. Strangely, I liked it (most expats there "endure" it) and hope to get back there some day (next year's looking possible!). I went out of my way to learn Russian, and not to get caught up in the expat community there, so spent most of my time with Russians. This meant that I got out and about a lot more than most foreigners working there.

The bar staff in my local said, in 2012: "You already speak better Russian, after 3 months, than some of the people who've been here 5 years" which I took as a great compliment. They weren't so impressed with my enthusiastic learning of Russian slang from my "Dirty Russian" book...."You want to watch where you say those things and who to....some of them could get you beaten up if you say them to the wrong person".

I met a few Nivkh up near Nogliki, but they're now a tiny minority (less than 1% of Sakhalin's population). Only about 10% of those speak Nivkh fluently, and I've never seen it written, so can't comment on the vodka bottle. I don't recall a lot of "Pts" in the bit of spoken Nivkh I've heard.

The only Russian I can come up with is if the name was phonetically chyoug dush, rather than chugdush, which would make it "iron shower".

A couple of years ago a woman started at my fitness class in UK. I asked where she was from (as she sounded Russian to me) and she said "Eastern Europe". "Where?"...."Karelia"...."Finnish Karelia or Russian Karelia?". She was astonished that I even knew of Karelia, never mind that it spanned two countries. She said she was from a nomadic family and had spent her youth travelling and herding reindeer. I asked if she was Sami: "not exactly"...."Samoyed then?". Again she was astonished that I even knew the word.

Further talking elicited that she'd been to Sakhalin, too: "so do you have Nivkh relatives?" ....cue complete astonishment....."How the hell do you know about Nivkh people?"

She was a real mix, with indeterminate proportions of Sami, Samoyed and Nivkh ancestry. She only spoke Russian, though, with just the odd few words of various north Russian native languages. I try to rub some of the rust off my Russian on the odd occasion I see her now.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: leeneia
Date: 21 Nov 18 - 05:41 PM

Thanks for the info, Rob. I've heard of the Samoyed dog, but not the people.

Subject: RE: BS: Russian Vodka
From: Donuel
Date: 23 Nov 18 - 02:29 PM

????????? ???? ??????????????? ???????. ????? ?30 ?? 18 ?????? 1996 ?. «? ?????????? ? ???????? ?????? (????????? ??????) ??????????????? ???????», ? ???. ?????? ?483 ?? 2 ??????? 2015 ? «? ???????? ????????? ? ????? (???????? ?????) ??????????????? ???????». ??????? ? ???? ?? ????????? ?????? ???? ?? ??? ???????????? ????????????, ?? ??????????? ?????? 5 ?????? 15 ? ????????? "?" ?????? 22 ? ????? ?????????? ????????????? ????????? ???? ????????????? ????????? ????, ??????? ??????? ? ???????? ???????????? ?? ??????????? ? ???? ???????????? ?????? ?? 06.10.1999 ?184-?? "?? ????? ????????? ??????????? ??????????????? (????????????????) ? ?????????????? ??????? ??????????????? ?????? ????????? ?????????? ?????????". ???????????: "???????? ????",