BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 17 May 19 - 02:26 AM

What President do you mean Stanron? The President of the European Council and the President of the European Commission are both elected by the European Council which comprises the Heads of State of the Member States. They are elected for fixed terms. Both are accountable to the European Parliament. The Presidency of the Council of the European Union is held by one of the member states, in rotation. In contrast, I have never been able to vote for the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, the Head of the Civil Service, or the Queen. And the last one of those is in office for life. The EU is far more democratic than the UK.

I think that you are confused as to what a President is. It is someone who presides at meetings. When you confuse a presidency with an executive authority, you get a system which really doesn't work very well, as we see in various countries around the world.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 May 19 - 03:32 AM

Parroting out received wisdom is a wonderfully lazy and all too easy thing to do. It's amazing how often critics of the EU such as Stanron betray the fact that they haven't done their homework as to how the EU works, and that's precisely what the Farages of this world depend on.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 May 19 - 03:55 AM

Meanwhile, back to the harsh realities of life!
YouGov / European Election

Brexit Party 35
LIB 16
LAB 15
Green 10
CONs 9
CUKs 5
SNP 3
UKIP 3
Other 3

How high is Brexit Momma? 35% and rising......

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 17 May 19 - 04:21 AM

According to today's Telegraph:

The latest polling average puts Nigel Farage’s Brexit Party ahead of the two major parties, on 30 per cent compared to Labour’s 21 per cent and the Tories’ 12 per cent.


That is around what UKIP were polling before the previous EU elections (one of the polls last time put UKIP on 38%.)

Despite all the noise and bluster, it is looking like Brexit is going to be a fairly straightforward replacement of UKIP last time. After all, even Farage has said the policies are the same.

How that will translate into seats, I will not predict, because it will depend very much on turnout, which I suspect will be higher than normal. How those percentages and the distribution of turnout interact in the end I would not like to guess.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 May 19 - 04:26 AM

Gloating over the numbers supporting this Lemming Leap (somewhat reminiscent of that with the Tommy Robinson petition) in no way alters the fact that Brexit has torn British society to shreds and left the UK virtually leaderless as things stand - that's the reality
Hardly anything to celebrate - I wouldn't have thought it would be something those who claim to love their country would be too pleased about - but it takes all sorts, I suppose !
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 May 19 - 04:48 AM

”By the way does anyone know what the official labour policy on brexit is?”

This was answered last night on"Question Time" and the audience response was prolonged laughter.

To claim Brexit is only a Tory problem is extremely bizarre. But as a poll finds only 13% of Labour voters understand Labour's brexit policy perhaps such outlandish claims attempting to disown it can be understood.
The corresponding figure for brexiteers was 60%.

These figures do not bode well for Labour in the upcoming EU elections which are all about brexit.
Can we assume from the position taken by some posters they will refuse to participate, because it is not their problem, or will they take the inevitable hammering anyway?
The silent majority, believing in democracy, will be speaking with their votes The outcome of the vote will be much more unambiguous than a second referendum. Perhaps we will need to erect tents during polling. To create safe spaces dispensing spoons full of sugar to staunch remainiacs, in order that the unpalatable reality(of losing-again) will go down

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 May 19 - 05:05 AM

As an old bomber pilot said:
You know you are getting close to the target when the flak gets heavier!"

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 17 May 19 - 05:23 AM

As I have a postal vote, I voted two weeks ago. Not disclosing who I voted for, other than to say that it wasn’t the group whose top candidate was the obnoxious, opportunist Annunziata Rees-Mogg.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 May 19 - 05:25 AM

" But as a poll finds only 13% of Labour voters understand Labour's brexit policy "
The country as a whole is totally bemused abot the Tory's Brexit policy and the Party itself are totally unable to agree on how it wishes to leave - or if it does
What a strange comment, given the circumstances
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 May 19 - 06:04 AM

What a strange comment, given the circumstances

Here is a dose of reality from darkest Wales.

https://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/nigel-farages-brexit-party-just-16284407

Who cares about yesterday's parties. They are not even also rans!

Is straw clutching to become an Olympic Sport?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 May 19 - 06:50 AM

Farage is an opportunist fascist who is using the same hate policy that forced Enoch Powell out of the Tory Party
It is depressing that what made Powell an embarrassment is now being used as a step up the fame and fortune ladder - a sign of national deterioration
Jim Caarroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 May 19 - 06:52 AM

Bombs away Skipper!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 17 May 19 - 07:34 AM

Corbyn formally states talks have gone as far as they can.

This is, I think, no surprise to anyone: the only doubt was over who said it first.

According to Peston, it is likely that the next step will be to give a statement on Monday that indicative votes will be held on Wednesday with the aim of reflecting these in in the WAB, taking into account not just whether they pass or not, but the strength of support. And, of course, no firm statement that even ones that pass will find their way into the WAB.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 17 May 19 - 07:56 AM

Other reports on the leaks say the indicative votes may be 5th June. Possible, but as the declared aim is to reflect them in the WAB due to be voted on in the week of the 3rd June, that is tight.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 May 19 - 08:12 AM

Corbyn has pulled Labour out of the Brexit meetings with May
Hope he never caught anything 'Terminally Tory' from her
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 17 May 19 - 08:21 AM

Maybe this country will only come to its senses when it has undergone a decade or to of living inn a real totalitarian state which governs by fear, then people might learn to appreciate what we have, and what the rest of Europe has moved towards and worked hard to maintain. For example in the then Czechoslovakia, under soviet control Verejná bezpecnost (VB) did not hesitate to use violence against individuals who did not toe the state line.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 May 19 - 09:09 AM

"For example in the then Czechoslovakia, under soviet control Verejná bezpecnost"
Free Central and Eastern Europe is a far safer place in the democratic hands of Poisoner Putin and Fascist Viktor Orban (with US backing, of course)
HERE

Well done Populism
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 May 19 - 01:07 PM

Well done Populism

POPULISM noun
    a political approach that strives to appeal to ordinary people who feel that their concerns are disregarded by established elite groups.

As exemplified by the meteoric rise of the brexit party.

The Eurobarometer survey of surveys, which polled 27,973 European citizens between February 19 and March 4, reviewed the trend of support for the bloc across the European Union and made predictions on the likelihood of election of populist parties based on a series of 12 questions – varying from opinions on overall membership of the EU to themes the bloc should focus on.

Based on the responses collected in the poll, the European Parliament forecasted an increase in support for populist parties in Italy, France, Czech Republic and Greece – with a large number of Italian and Greek citizens polled suggesting their country has not benefited from membership of the bloc (45 percent and 40 percent respectively.) The projection was updated in April to also take into account British participation in the EU parliamentary poll.

Anxiety among European Union officials is high, with fears of a Eurosceptic, nationalist surge. The European Commission president Jean-Claude Juncker claimed that the European Union has lost its “libido”.

Mr Juncker acknowledged the expected gains for populist and Eurosceptic parties in Europe-wide elections.

Well done populism indeed!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: peteglasgow
Date: 17 May 19 - 01:25 PM

......or 'hurrah for the blackshirts! to put it more succinctly , mr spode. you cannot be serious

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 17 May 19 - 01:40 PM

True, populism is a political approach that strives to appeal to ordinary people who feel that their concerns are disregarded by established elite groups

Its goal is not to improve their lot.
It goal is not to improve democratic representation.
It's goal is to appeal and thereby gain power. The less a populist says about what they intend to do, the freer their hand should they get power.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 May 19 - 01:55 PM

"The Eurobarometer survey of surveys, which polled 27,973"
From "professional blogger" AURORA BOSOTTI (self description) and published in that font of truth and wisdon, 'The Daily Express'
What else are they going to find with their redsearches
They miss out the effects on victims of hate that 'populism uses as scapegoats of everything that has gone wrong with society - particularly those of different ethnic or national backgrounds
No wonder the quote ewan't identified !
A step up from Guido, I suppose (just)
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 17 May 19 - 02:26 PM

The Eurobarometer survey of surveys, which polled 27,973"
From "professional blogger" AURORA BOSOTTI (self description) and published in that font of truth and wisdon, 'The Daily Express'

I fink the eurobarometer was established in 1974. Each survey consists of approximately 1000 face-to-face interviews per country. Reports are published twice yearly. Reproduction is authorised, except for commercial purposes, provided the source is acknowledged.
Special Eurobarometer reports are based on in-depth thematic studies carried out for various services of the European Commission or other EU Institutions and integrated in the Standard Eurobarometer's polling waves. Reproduction is authorised, except for commercial purposes, provided the source is acknowledged.

once again a stunning example of shoot the messenger because establishing the veracity of the message was too much trouble.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 May 19 - 02:30 AM

Your promotion of Farage - a failed hate merchant seeking a second chance, says everything about the Brave New Britain you are promoting
The shambles that Brexit actually is and the damage it has already done speaks for itself
The fact that you or Stanron or Nigel refuse even to discuss that damage makes you part of it
Populism gave the world Trump and Orban and is in line to giving us LePen - in the past it gave the world the Holocaust, Rwanda and the horrors of 'Former Yugoslavia' - all prejudice driven - like Brexit
Not a Brave New World I would want to pass on to my kids
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 18 May 19 - 04:19 AM

Your promotion of Farage - a failed hate merchant seeking a second chance, says everything about the Brave New Britain you are promoting.

Farage promotes the implementation of the majority vote to leave the EU, something the 2 main opposition parties seem determined to thwart.

Mr Juncker acknowledged the expected gains for populist and Eurosceptic parties in Europe-wide elections, and claimed that the European Union has lost its “libido”.

He will need more than free doses of Viagra at the polling booth to sort that problem out!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 May 19 - 02:58 PM

"Farage promotes the implementation of the majority vote to leave the EU,"
That decision to leave was promoted by FARAGE'S RACIST POSTER
Farage is a racist ex-leader of a party that CRASHED IN FLAMES
after proving to the vast majority of the British people that it was not fit to lead a pub crawl, never mind a country
Britain already has enough RACIST SCUM WAITING IN THE WINGS without another
Who the hell cares what someone like yourself with your track record on race cares anyway
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 18 May 19 - 04:03 PM

The only significant thing to be concerned about is the outcome from the ballot box where people can exert their democratic vote.
The outcome of the EU voting in the UK will ably demonstrate the strength of the brexit feeling in the UK and by this time next week we will have the answer.

It is of course necessary to bear in mind the following shock/horror:
Australian Labor Won 54 Polls in a Row, Including Exit Poll, Lost Actual Election

Listening to too much Marr and Mayhem can seriously damage rational thought.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 18 May 19 - 05:27 PM

Yeah, what's up with that?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 May 19 - 06:52 PM

As a maximum every 5 years we, the public of the UK, have the right to vote to change our leadership, which does change should the vote go that way.

On occasions that 5 years is curtailed to 1, 2 3 or 4 years depending on the issues at play.

It does not seem unreasonable given the above that we should have another vote as to whether we should leave the EU.

Much has happened in the past three years and some of us are much more aware of the various issues that may arise from our decision today. Issues that, for the most part, many of us were ignorant of before.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 May 19 - 02:25 AM

"The only significant thing to be concerned about is the outcome from the ballot box where people can exert their democratic vote."
So when the German people elected Hitler or the Hungarians elect Orban, or if the French elect LePen, it doesn't matter what follows
What an ugly outlook on life
Why don't you surprise me ?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 19 May 19 - 02:41 AM

It does not seem unreasonable given the above that we should have another vote as to whether we should leave the EU.

Had the outcome of the referendum have been implemented your request for a second vote might have merit(given a suitable time period elapsing)
However the last vote from June 2016 has yet to be accepted and acted on, so calls for a further vote are an affront to democracy.

The government intransigence has required last minute canvassing for the upcoming EU elections. This was an event that the UK should not have been a participant in, but will give a very clear indicative vote of where people stand on brexit.

Latest polling suggests the Brexit party is still gathering support.
This support is not just from brexiteers but a large contingent of people see the Brexit party as the only one that supports democratic principles. For these fine people principle is far more important than ideology and democracy must be supported.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 19 May 19 - 03:15 AM

So when the German people elected Hitler or the Hungarians elect Orban, or if the French elect LePen, it doesn't matter what follows
I wonder why you omitted the US President TRUMP? Does he not count as he was allegedly put in place by pesky Russian collusion?

How many times has democracy elected a labour government? The ultimate example of Lords of misrule!

I assume from your post you do not believe in the democratic vote, because people might vote the wrong way.

Thank God you are exiled in a place where you can do no damage!People like you are dangerous.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 19 May 19 - 03:30 AM

So when the German people elected Hitler or the Hungarians elect Orban, or if the French elect LePen, it doesn't matter what follows
I wonder why you omitted the US President TRUMP? Does he not count as he was allegedly put in place by pesky Russian collusion?

How many times has democracy elected a labour government? The ultimate example of Lords of misrule!

So which is nearer the 'ultimate' lord of misrule - Hitler or a Labour government? Are you really saying, 'on balance, Labour'? I think you could be accused of anti-Semitism if you do.

Democracy is flawed, particularly with a FPTP voting system. One of its flaws is that sometimes power is given to very dangerous people, like those Jim mentioned. Voting for a party with no declared policies increases that risk. Ok, let's imagine the Brexit Party were to be elected with Farage as PM. On day one, he writes to the EU: "That's it, we leave with immediate effect". Done what he was elected to do. His supporters are presumably happy.

Now what does he do from day 2 for the rest of another 5 years? No one has been told yet. And, importantly, his supporters are not even willing to think about it.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 May 19 - 03:32 AM

There you have it Rag - the people's voice is only important when it coincides with his own - elect Farage and your say is important, elect a labour Government and you become "dangerous"
Now wasn't that worth the effort getting him to confess ?
He really isn't very good at this - people who feel the need to threaten and bully never are
Had my fun for the day, I think
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 19 May 19 - 03:34 AM

Just in case anyone thinks otherwise, my saying "democracy is flawed" is not saying "scrap democracy." It is simply recognising that for all its benefits it has flaws.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 May 19 - 04:01 AM

"It is simply recognising that for all its benefits it has flaws"
The populism sch as that being spoute by this clown (manipulated democracy) is an example of just that
which is why extremists such as the present incumbent leap on it as a method to push though policies tht are obviously flawed
Come the time that Brexit fulfils its promise as the stupid move it obviously is, the establishment will have the perfect 'get out of jail free' card - nuffin' to do with us - it was the 'People's Choice'
Parliamentary 'Democracy' has never been democratic and has had its day - nobody takes politicians seriously
Now we are faced with the scummy rabble rousers and hate merchants
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 19 May 19 - 04:30 AM

Anyone enfranchised can vote. Democracy requires that the outcome is respected.
Whether the outcome is positive or negative depends upon the respective person's viewpoint.
No one would conclude the rise of Nazi Germany was a good outcome.

Decisions made by Democratically elected governments are not always good ones.

The Iraqi war was based on mythical weapons of mass destruction, thanks to Blair. THe events surrounding the mysterious death of Dr Kelly tar the labour government of the time with a rather unsavoury brush.

A leaked report from the OPCW tells a very different story to the one given for public consumption concerning the gassing at Douma and justification for the subsequent bombing campaign in Syria.

The 2016 referendum result has still to be implemented because of deliberate stalling by the elected government in direct opposition to the mandate of the people.

It is obvious that democracy has flaws. As yet nothing better has been found as a substitute. Many posting here make it very clear they would blatantly ignore the vote if the outcome did not suit their expectations. A very scary precedent they are advocating! They show the same contempt for the electorate as Parliament. Hence the rise of Brexit.
The majority will prevail - Get used to it!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 19 May 19 - 04:54 AM

”Had the outcome of the referendum have been implemented your request for a second vote might have merit(given a suitable time period elapsing)
However the last vote from June 2016 has yet to be accepted and acted on, so calls for a further vote are an affront to democracy.”

Since the Referendum, it has become patently obvious to all except the most blinkered Right-Wing-Extremist anal-sphincter-lickers, that leaving the EU is far from being the ‘easy’ process that the ‘Leave’ Campaign Echo-Chamber trumpeted it would be, that myriad facts have come to light since the Referendum, and that there will be long-lasting damage caused by leaving - possibly as long as fifty years according to arch-Brexiteer Rees-Mogg.

Only the brain-washed or brain-less would regard the idea of giving the electorate a chance to vote in order to either confirm their original wish, or indicate that, in view of the huge amount of information that has become available since the Referendum, they wish now to change their minds, as being ‘un-democratic’.

They really do need to give their heads a wobble.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 19 May 19 - 07:08 AM

Even the former Brexit-Secretary, David Davis, understands the most basic principle of democracy - that "When a democracy cannot change its mind, it ceases to be a democracy" (his speech in 2012).

What a shame that Brexit supporters in general seem totally unable to grasp even this most simple and basic principle of the democracy they claim to crave.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 19 May 19 - 07:48 AM

Democracy in our country is Parliamentary democracy. And out members of Parliament are obliged to act in their constituents' interests. Not in accordance with a flawed and corrupt referendum.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 May 19 - 08:15 AM

"No one would conclude the rise of Nazi Germany was a good outcome.
You - by claiming that the vote is the be all and end all, said exactly that
Just as the majority voted for Brexit the majority in Germany voted for nazism
It takes a special kind of stupidity to claim that is you vote for Brexit than that decision must be adhered to yet, if you vote Labour, you are "dangerous"
You missed out big time when they handed out joined-up thinking, didn't you

When have they ever done that - and not just "in the constituents interest", by the way - a nationally elected Government is committed to act in the est interests of the country as a whole
What suits the South Eastern "soft underbelly of Britain" may not be i the interests of the impoverished North, as is now evident
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 19 May 19 - 08:49 AM

”Democracy in our country is Parliamentary democracy. And out members of Parliament are obliged to act in their constituents' interests. Not in accordance with a flawed and corrupt referendum.”

You’re absolutely correct, of course, David, and it’s a fact that’s been not to obey their electorate’s wishes, it is to do what they - the MPs - believe is in the best interests of the country as a whole. That is Parliamentary Democracy.

Sadly, that seems to be a concept far too difficult for The Brain-washed and The Brainless to understand.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 19 May 19 - 08:55 AM

I’ll try that again!

You’re absolutely correct, of course, David, and it’s a fact that’s been ignored or misunderstood - probably deliberately - that an MP’s responsibility is not to obey their electorate’s wishes, it is to do what they - the MPs - believe is in the best interests of the country as a whole. That is Parliamentary Democracy.

Sadly, that seems to be a concept far too difficult for The Brain-washed and The Brainless to understand.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 19 May 19 - 11:08 AM

that an MP’s responsibility is not to obey their electorate’s wishes, it is to do what they - the MPs - believe is in the best interests of the country as a whole. That is Parliamentary Democracy.

Seems the electorate have a different take on the matter. When their elected representatives no longer represent them they are discarded.

That is why the local council elections gave both parties a hammering.
The electorate do not like being lied to.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 19 May 19 - 12:01 PM

And again, you indicate your complete ignorance of what Parliamentary Representative Democracy actually is. It is a clearly defined system - no amount of wishful-thinking on the part of Right-Wing Extremists like you, and delusional BrexShit-Bumpkins will make it anything other than what it is.

Give your dopey heads a wobble.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 19 May 19 - 12:17 PM

When insults and bluster replace rational argument I think game, set, match to me(and all those righteous citizens that kicked both tory and labour councilors into touch in the recent elections)
Further proof will come from the EU elections where conservative estimates give the brexit party one third of the seats. We will see then who are the wobble headed, loonies and delusional.

Prepare for disappointment!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 19 May 19 - 12:45 PM

I haven't seen an estimate that gives the Brexit Party one third of the seats. One third of the vote, perhaps, but not seats. Can you provide a link to such an estimate?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 19 May 19 - 12:59 PM

“When insults and bluster replace rational argument I think game, set, match to me”

No bluster from me, simply facts, logic, and rational argument which others are able to understand, but which seem to be far, far beyond your intellect.

And as regards ‘insults’, coming from the most aggressive, abusive, insulting poster on this thread, or any other thread you decide to stink up with your presence (there’s evidence a-plenty on this forum), words like ‘pot’, ‘kettle’, and ‘black’ spring to mind. You’re fooling nobody but yourself.

Give your silly head a wobble.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 19 May 19 - 01:31 PM

Reporting back that the RemainUinted.org website did predict between 22 and 25 seats out of 70 for the Brexit Party, so the estimate *is* out there in the ether. However, as that is based on polling between 1-7 May, there may be a more up to date estimate.

For comparison, Farage and UKIP currently have 22, so getting 22 or below seats could not be claimed as a triumph. One or two more is stretching it to call it a triumph. Over 27 I will allow gloating without demur!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 19 May 19 - 02:13 PM

As the Brexit party was not represented in the local council elections the protest vote went to the LibDems. Poor old Vince thinks the same will happen in the EU election.

Now you can either believe the link below or be swayed by the gruniard
https://www.citynews1130.com/2019/05/12/uk-minister-warns-about-protest-votes-at-eu-elections/

and ideology as a poor substitute for common sense. Where wishful thinking overtakes reality

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/12/european-elections-your-guide-to-the-vote-you-never-expected

I hope TBP sweep the board,but polls are somewhat fickle outside the ballot box

In a week we will know for sure!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 19 May 19 - 02:27 PM

A bit of a dilemma for our Brexiteers it seems.

According to an article in the Guardian/Observer today it would seem that the Queen herself is in favour of the European Union.

So what are they to do, bow and scrape to royalty or brown-nose their political leaders.

Such hard decisions eh!!

Could someone please link to the article.