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Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who

DigiTrad:
JOHN BARLEYCORN
JOHN BARLEYCORN (2)
JOHN BARLEYCORN, MY JO
JOHN BARLEYCORN: A BALLAD


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RTim 16 Sep 19 - 04:24 PM
Steve Gardham 16 Sep 19 - 05:08 PM
Reinhard 16 Sep 19 - 05:20 PM
Steve Gardham 16 Sep 19 - 05:21 PM
Steve Gardham 16 Sep 19 - 05:25 PM
Steve Gardham 16 Sep 19 - 05:28 PM
Steve Gardham 16 Sep 19 - 05:30 PM
John P 18 Sep 19 - 02:57 PM
RTim 18 Sep 19 - 03:12 PM
Steve Gardham 18 Sep 19 - 04:12 PM
Black belt caterpillar wrestler 19 Sep 19 - 04:12 AM
GUEST,kenny 19 Sep 19 - 04:51 AM
GUEST,kenny 19 Sep 19 - 04:52 AM
Jim Carroll 19 Sep 19 - 04:56 AM
GUEST,Grishka 19 Sep 19 - 07:10 AM
Lighter 19 Sep 19 - 08:47 AM
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Subject: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: RTim
Date: 16 Sep 19 - 04:24 PM

Below is a version of John Barleycorn as recorded by John Langstaff in 1956 and then latterly by David Coffin on his "Last Trip Home" cd.

Now it says it was collected by Cecil Sharp in 1906...but I can't find from whom....Can anyone tell me - or is it a mishmash of versions that was possibly published by Sharp...??

Thanks - Tim Radford

--------------------------------------------------------------

John Barleycorn – but from whom?

There were three kings come from the west their victory to try
And they had taken a solemn oath John Barleycorn should die

-        Fol the dol the diddy a, Fol the dol the diddy aga wha….

The took a plough and ploughed him in laid clods upon his head
And they have taken a solemn oath John Barleycorn is dead

So there he lay for a full fortnight till the dew on him did fall
Then Barleycorn sprung up again and that surprised them all

There he remained till midsummer and looked both pale and wan
Then Barleycorn he got a beard and so became a man

Then they sent men with scythes so sharp to cut him off at knee
And then poor Johnny Barleycorn they served him barbarously

Oh Barleycorn is the choicest grain that e’er was sown on land
It will do more than any grain by the turning of your hand


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 16 Sep 19 - 05:08 PM

Chorus and probably tune are John Stafford at Bishop's Sutton, Som. 27 Aug 1906. The text is either a compound or perhaps from a broadside.

I'll have look at Sharp's published versions.


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: Reinhard
Date: 16 Sep 19 - 05:20 PM

Cecil Sharp, Folk-Songs from Somerset, Second Edition 1911, page 36/37:

JOHN BARLEYCORN.

SECOND VERSION.

There were three kings came from the West,

Their victory to try ;

And they have t!aken a solemn oath,

John Barleycorn should die.
Fol the dol the didiay,
Fol the dol the di-di-a-ge wo*

2. They took a plough and ploughed him in,
Laid clods upon his head ;

And they have taken a solemn oath,
John Barleycorn is dead.
Fol the dol, etc.

3. So there he lay for a full fortnight,
Till the dew on him did fall :
Then Barleycorn sprung up again,
And that surprised them all,

Fol the dol, etc.

4. There he remained till midsummer.
And looked both pale and wan ;
Then Barleycorn he got a beard,
And so became a man.

Fol the dol, etc.

5. Then they sent men with scythes so sharp,
To cut him off at knee ;

And then poor Johnny Barleycorn,
They served him barbarously.
Fol the dol, etc.

6. O Barleycorn is the choicest grain
That e'er was sown on land ;

It will do more than any grain,

By the turning of your hand.
Fol the dol the didiay,
Fol the dol the di-di-a-ge wo.


And at the end:

No. 90. JOHN BARLEYCORN.

(second version).

Tune sung by Mr. John Stafford at Bishops Sutton.

I have related the circumstances, which led to the collection of this song, in The Musical Times for Jan., 1907. I have found it very difficult to express satisfactorily in musical notation the exact way in which Mr. Stafford sang this song. He dwelt, perhaps, upon the double-dotted notes rather longer than their written value, although not long enough to warrant their being marked with the formal pause. The tune, with its curious refrain, is a very characteristic one and justifies me, I think, in including it in this collection as a second version. I have noted down six different tunes to this same song, in addition to the two printed in these volumes.

Mr. Stafford told me that he heard the song solemnly chanted by some street singers, who passed through his village when he was a child. The song fascinated him and he followed the singers and tried to learn it from them. For several days afterwards he was unable to recall the air, when one day, to his great delight, the tune suddenly came back to him, and since then he has constantly sung it. He gave me the words of the first verse only. The remaining verses in the text have been taken from Bell's Songs of the Peasantry of England.

By way of experiment, I have harmonized this song rather elaborately. Those who prefer a simpler setting can repeat the harmonies of the first verse.


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 16 Sep 19 - 05:21 PM

Verse 1 is mainly Mrs Franks. at Nempnett Thrubwell, 27 Aug, 1906.


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 16 Sep 19 - 05:25 PM

v3 'full fortnight' is Alfred Emery at Othery 4 April, 1908


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 16 Sep 19 - 05:28 PM

v5 closest to Shepherd Haden's version, Bampton, Oxon 1909


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 16 Sep 19 - 05:30 PM

So it's one of Sharp's composite published versions.


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: John P
Date: 18 Sep 19 - 02:57 PM

Darn, you got me all excited thinking The Who had done John Barleycorn . . .


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: RTim
Date: 18 Sep 19 - 03:12 PM

The original post should have said - "Whom" - but there was not enough space on the subject line......

For awhile I have been wanting to run a session on the singing all versions of John Barleycorn possible....that would be fun.

Tim Radford


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 18 Sep 19 - 04:12 PM

Is that all at once, Tim? You'd need at least a year otherwise.


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: Black belt caterpillar wrestler
Date: 19 Sep 19 - 04:12 AM

We sing three versions compressed into one as Caffrey/McGurk/Madge. Nick can give you chapter and verse on where each one came from.

Robin


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: GUEST,kenny
Date: 19 Sep 19 - 04:51 AM

Anybody else getting 3 advertisements above at the end of posts ? I know it's been mentioned elsewhere, but it's the first time I've come across it. Bloody annoying.
It wasn't "The Who" - it was "Traffic" :)

https://youtu.be/pnkHP_v3CYw


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: GUEST,kenny
Date: 19 Sep 19 - 04:52 AM

Hmm. ads have gone away.


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Sep 19 - 04:56 AM

We recorded a fabulous Irish version of this (entitled The Barley Grain) from two elderly brothers in North Clare back in the 70s
It has a nice conclusion where Little Sir John ends up being "pissed against the wall" by a drunkard
I think it can still be heard on the Irish Traditional Music Archive site (sung by either Austin or Michael Flanagan of Luach)
Jim Caarroll


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 19 Sep 19 - 07:10 AM

It must have been the famous scholar Doctor Who, who read it in Sharp's book and then went back in time.


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Subject: RE: Origins: John Barleycorn - But collected from Who
From: Lighter
Date: 19 Sep 19 - 08:47 AM

Michael Flanagan's spirited (couldn't resist) performance is right here:


https://www.itma.ie/digital-library/sound/barley-grain-flanagan

Thanks to all involved in the preservation, collection, and making available this song (and many more).

The air is "The Wearing of the Green."


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